/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

I wouldn’t say nearly all communists nor would I compare black nationalism to the ultranationalism of the Nazis.

That said the answer to your question is Sorel’s conception of social myth and perhaps nationalism being a logical extension of tribal impulses that start with the clan/village and extend outwards.

You really think some random brown is gonna have solidarity for some random African is gonna have solidarity with some random European? People hate on each other for having a slightly different dialect or subscribing to a slightly different interpretation of the same god. I’m sorry but international proletarian revolution is never coming.(Chudposting)

>>2843805
There is a difference between nationalism and basic in group preference.

People generally just prefer others who are similar to them then those who are not

National liberation ≠ nationalism

>>2843817
Thats just something ml's made up to cope with being liberals enforcing idpol

>>2843794
A lot of effort went into building nationalism. If you want people to believe in something called internationalism you'd have to build similar institutions where people can actually live and benefit from it.

>>2843794
I think it’s because we haven’t yet made flying a swastika punishable by death.

>>2843794
Not necessarily nationalism as much as patriotism, which I think taps into an innate tribal instinct in humanity. But it doesn’t necessarily have to be nationalism, as seen by how tribal fandoms can be, and those are based on consumer items, as well as the fact in pre-modern history where nations didn’t really exist religion and place of birth and familial lineage often took precedence for people’s identities. Now, tradcons may say nationalism is somehow more “rooted”, but I beg to differ as nationalism can be thought of as a fandom in and of itself or a proto-fandom of sorts because there’s no country with unbroken heritage between past and present. Not India, nor Sumeria, Babylon, the Roman Empire, any number of post-Alexandrine Hellenistic states, the Hand dynasty, the Inca empire, or even the Frankish empire.

So in this sense, the mythos of the nation-state can be deemed as a fictional product made by elites from which a fandom is formed, and modern Macedonia is a case study. Many dismiss it as fake despite the conception of Macedonia dating back to the 19th century. By those same standards, one can dismiss ANY nation-state as “fake” insofar that they’re invented by somebody as opposed to being some organic product.

As for a multiracial proletarian revolution, while a common cultural background is needed, I think history has shown that more than race and ethnicity what trumps it all is a common and shared national experience and a mythos on which to base it. For Cuba, it was the Cuban revolution. For the USSR, it was WW2. For America, it is the civil war + civil rights revolution.

I think time will tell when that will happen for the world.

>>2843864
>taps into an innate tribal instinct in humanity
>>2843805
>Sorel’s conception of social myth
>>2843821
>something ml's made up to cope with being liberals enforcing idpol
How far we've fallen… please read.

I only dabble in it when someone calls my shithole a shithole

>>2843794
Nationalism is taught to people from childhood. Personal identity becomes linked with nationality. Imagining a world without countries/states is foreign for most people.

National symbols, anthem, flag, etc. only reinforce this idea. Japan is an example of a very successful nationalist campaign

>>2843812
The capitalist class, at least to an extent, have international, inter-religious, inter-ethnic solidarity as a class against the working class. Does that mean they never are divided along these lines? No. But when it comes to class struggle they are not divided in their will to crush the workers. As soon as the workers see this, the steps they need to take to beat the capitalists becomes evident.

>>2843794
>Why? Whats so special about it?
Nations are useful to protect private property. Even under global trade. So small capitalists love it.

>>2843812
Doesn't matter what random people anywhere think. Power is what matters.

>>2843794
I suppose much of the structure of the nation-state is prototyped in the structure of imperial colonies. A nation is a colony without a metropole. The frustrated colonial bureaucracy removed their overlords but kept much of the same underlying structure.

It's because of the patriarchy unironically, the feminists are right on this one.

the capitalist class have a stranglehold on the most powerful propaganda apparatus in the world though they wield inefficiently. even so, it is so enormous it drowns out and kills or subsumes any burgeoning class conscious community. through it they redirect class grievances which everyone feels into more base and vulgar struggles (national supremacy, ethnic supremacy).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_consciousness

>Some political analysts have focused on where people's understanding of their interests originates. In an essay entitled "False Consciousness", Michael Parenti challenges the assumption that working-class Americans freely define their interests but then choose, for various reasons, to think and act against those interests. Instead he writes that "the development of one's own interests and political consciousness in general may be stunted or distorted by misinformation, disinformation, and a narrow but highly visible mainstream political agenda that rules out feasible alternatives".[14] Parenti's contention is that ideological confusion is being propagated in the nation's politics and mass media and thereby causes people to misjudge what their real interests are.