Think about it. Humans have been around for 300,000 years and didn't have code of law until the last 3,800 during the Bronze Age when Hammurabi ruled Mesopotamia. Before that, humans were animals just like any other. Before the farming revolution of the neolithic period 10,000 to 12,000 years ago, we were all hunter-gatherers. The moment we switched from stones to metal was the moment humanity messed up. When we were cave and hut dwellers, our world was way different. Humans are going outside of their very nature to enslave itself, basically. Laws, religions, all of these are forms of control. We need to stop pretending we are above other animals. We are destroying the world with our bullshit.
No one:
Depwessed NA liberal cognitively prohibited socioculturally from embracing Marxism:
>>2857565>>2857720Yes but there is no turning back really
>>2858035industrial society is so fragile it could easily happen
>>2858060That does not mean we can go back to a "primitivist" lifestyle
>>2858081>>2858060Also, industrial capacity isn't some single organism that lives or dies, even if global and highly mechanized industry fails it won't mean that all industry will just stop existing, workshops have been a thing since forever
>>2858081it means we can collapse into a pre industrial society, which is the main subject of most primitivists.
>>2858086>pre industrial society, How can you go to a pre-industrial society, post-industrial? Even if you are right and all industry stops in a short time, we'll still have mountains of useable tech, infrastructures, educated populations, books,…
how can we go to a pre-industrial world in a world that has been completely overturned by human activity?
i like being vaccinated against measles, actually
>>2858098not really, modern industrial society is dependent on having infrastructure to maintain it in a world that is so interconnected a hard enough economic down turn can end up effecting the entire planet. A strong enough world wide depression can easily cause industry to go into disrepair
>>2858105Ok but that does not mean that there will be no industrial capacities or infrastructure left after, regardless of the exonomic model that comes after. And it surely doesn't mean we can just go back to primitivist lives. (something that seems very ill defined, but that might just be me lacking knowledge about it)
>>28581032016 ass meme goddamn
>>2857565Honestly, I just don't like the idea of having to work 8 hours a day just for the benefit of the few. I wish I could go back to the village and live a solitary life free from other society, other people genuinely scare me. I won't have enough money to achieve this though, but I just hate modern industrial society so much….
>>28581272016 wasn't this horny
>>2858126again the critique made by primitivists isn't that all forms of industry will completely disappear but that complex industrial system of the modern world is fragile and can collapse given a strong enough economy down turn and crisis.
anarcho primitivism is delusional. just because industrial society is unsustainable does not imply a RETVRN to pre-industrial conditions. post-industrial society will be life scarred by an industrial past.
>>2877914no anprim has claims that a collapse of industrial society implies a RETVRN to pre-industrial conditions
>>2858105Funny thing about everyone's favorite post office enthusiast is he didn't advocate many traditional political planks BUT he said everyone should fight for free trade because it made the global economy more interconnected and prone to cascading failures. Neoliberalism is luddite praxis!
>>2858132But in trad societies you don't usually get to live alone. You come from a big family. You know everyone and they know you. Everyone is up in everyone else's business. You'd probably have more personal duties and obligations than you would now.
>>2858103Dunno about that meme don't think there's many female anprims. For some reason they don't want to go back to when society was about strength and male gangs raiding villages and when dying in childbirth was common but in fairness that last bit is just "mother" nature fucking us over yet again.
>destroyed us as a species
<We need to stop pretending we are above other animals. We are destroying the world with our bullshit.
Notice the immanent contradiction. First you espouse an egoist position of species excellence, and then you talk about "the world"; an idle abstraction not suited for an uncivilised savage.
>>2858246That's more like a postciv take, but whatever, I have much similar feelings and thoughts anyway
another teleology thread. we didn't consciously choose a particular path or decide to discover all of our knowledge or develop all of our ideas, all of these developmental milestones like controlling fire and taming animals and cultivating plants and inventing writing systems occurred all over the world across tens of thousands of different isolated tribes/settlements, independently and more or less simultaneously when measured on the evolutionary timescale. so obviously the compulsion to develop these things in ingrained in our biology, there's no way we could have not developed these things, as a species we never chose any path and we never had any agency. agency and consciousness only exist at the small scale of individual humans or small groups of humans; millions or billions of humans is not a conscious agential entity, it is a mindless force of nature, like a swarm of locusts or a tidal wave.
>>2882390there isn't a difference between primitivist and postciv amongst anprims.
>>2882423no one disagrees with this you're not countering any anprim position
1) Humanity is not the same in fact as animal.
2) Ironically, religion actually talks about this.
Most people would not survive without modern medicine.
>>28849901) why?
2) what does that matter?
>every day, demonstrable, ubiquitous phenomena that constitute the real content of our lives are "fake" and "unnatural" somehow
This is the fundamental problem with all anarchist "thought"
society is probably going to be stuck in 1600s industrial conditions, for a while. Of course, not fully like the 1600s, due to the existance of modern technology but yeah….
>>2857565Anarcho-primitivism is not a realistic option in any way not even after nuclear world war. More advanced societies conquer more primitive ones and you cant escape this arms race by wishing technological progress stops.
>We are destroying the world with our bullshit.This planet can only sustain 5-30 million hunter-gatherers. This mode of production is incredibly wasteful when compared to industrial society where more is done with less.
Think about it. Humans have been around for 300,000 years and didn't have code of law until the last 3,800 during the Bronze Age when Hammurabi ruled Mesopotamia. Before that, humans were wild animals just like any other. Before the farming revolution of the neolithic period 10,000 to 12,000 years ago, we were all mere hunter-gatherers. The moment we switched from chaos to order was the moment humanity was transfigured. When we were cave and hut dwellers, our world was way different. Humanity is going along with its very nature to raise itself, basically. Laws, religions, and all of these other social structures are forms of control, forms we are wise enough to establish and transcend. We need to stop pretending we are mere wild animals. We can give new life to the world with our intelligence!
>>2885321The only "elevation" is to humanity living in a global slaughterhouse and labor camp.
>>2885297Are you implying Capitalism is natural?
I love it when this board talks about prehistoric times because it shows how everyone here will use their ignorance to twist the facts into their worldview (which resembles more like astrologythen anything else at this point.)
>>2885346The real is rational, the rational is real.
In order to transform the world, one must understand the real reasons for why it is that way, and how it works.
So I wouldn't say "natural", but capitalism is real and its realness has real reasons and rationale behind it. It's not some aberration in the "natural" state of humanity.
It's easy to see why there's such an uneasy tension between anarchism and eco-fascism.
>>2885312No one is suggesting voluntarily going primitive but that with the interconnectivity of the global economy industrial society can collapse causing a chain reaction across the globe.
>This planet can only sustain 5-30 million hunter-gatherers. This mode of production is incredibly wasteful when compared to industrial society where more is done with less.what constitutes "waste" and why should anyone care?
>>2885350anarchism is proto fascism
>>2885627
no u
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