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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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The essence of Grift is to create a problem that exists but doesn't need to exist, and to repeatedly sell a whackamole solution to it that doesn't get at the root cause of the problem.

My favorite 2 are law enforcement and drug rehab.
Drug rehab doesn't actually remove addictive substances from society, it just charges people exorbitant fees to "Recover" no drug rehab center actually has a long term financial interest in seeing drug addiction permanently eradicated.

Law enforcement officials often cause or exacerbate crime by being military occupiers of urban communities they don't even live in. Crime takes the form of resistance against the police, and the police view the population they "enforce the laws" against as disobedient animals. A cop loves nothing more than to plant drugs on a homeless person and use that as a pretext for arresting them, or to bait a person into illegal behavior through provocation, as a pretext for arresting them. Pig stations get more budgets based on the arrests they make and tickets they give, so there is a direct incentive for them to create more crime to get more budget, even if it means creating crime that would otherwise not exist. Crime is a byproduct of policing also because capital hungers for prison labor, which comes more cheaply and with less legal protections than the standard "free" working class population.

Find me a single "soft on crime" socialist countyr in history. Crime reduces when you put criminals in prison for a long time.

The capitalist class deliberately let's crime fester to create divisions and distrust among proles, and to make them vote for right wing politicians who claim to be hard on crime (they never truly are).

99% of the victims of the parasitic lumpenproles are proles and other lumpen. "Soft on crime" is an anti working class policy.

>>2936528
Working class is a meaningless buzzword at this point

>>2936545
When faced with a dissenting viewpoint you can't argue against you decide to deny reality/Marxism itself. Typical behavior from your kind.

my favorite genre of leftist are the ones who declare that all crime is the product of capitalism and under communism we will simply have no police, prisons or laws

but if you ask them how supply chains will work under communism well sorry, that's "utopian"

File: 1792615914205-1.png (636.59 KB, 672x456, ClipboardImage.png)

>The state will be able to wither away completely when society adopts the rule: “From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", i.e., when people have become so accustomed to observing the fundamental rules of social intercourse and when their labor has become so productive that they will voluntarily work according to their ability. “The narrow horizon of bourgeois law", which compels one to calculate with the heartlessness of a Shylock whether one has not worked half an hour more than anybody else–this narrow horizon will then be left behind. There will then be no need for society, in distributing the products, to regulate the quantity to be received by each; each will take freely “according to his needs".

>From the bourgeois point of view, it is easy to declare that such a social order is “sheer utopia” and to sneer at the socialists for promising everyone the right to receive from society, without any control over the labor of the individual citizen, any quantity of truffles, cars, pianos, etc. Even to this day, most bourgeois “savants” confine themselves to sneering in this way, thereby betraying both their ignorance and their selfish defence of capitalism.


>Ignorance–for it has never entered the head of any socialist to “promise” that the higher phase of the development of communism will arrive; as for the greatest socialists’ forecast that it will arrive, it presupposes not the present ordinary run of people, who, like the seminary students in Pomyalovsky’s stories,[2] are capable of damaging the stocks of public wealth “just for fun", and of demanding the impossible.


People of the higher phase are just built different.

>>2936528
>Find me a single "soft on crime" socialist countyr in history.
All of them. Socialist countries have historically practiced rehabilitative solutions to crime, as they were based on Marxist theory which said that crime was a product of conditions imposed by capitalism.
>Crime reduces when you put criminals in prison for a long time.
Every single study points to the fact that harsh punishment does not reduce crime and it only incentivizes recidivism especially when you don't provide rehabilitation for criminals for re-entry into normal society, such as the USA.
>The capitalist class deliberately let's crime fester to create divisions and distrust among proles, and to make them vote for right wing politicians who claim to be hard on crime (they never truly are).
The capitalist class are themselves composed of criminals who make the laws and who operate for-profit prison systems. They do not let crime "fester", they are the source of all crimes and create laws that shield themselves and their friends while putting working class people effectively into decades and lifelong slavery in prisons, often for victimless crimes. This is what OP refers to as the "grift".
>99% of the victims of the parasitic lumpenproles are proles and other lumpen. "Soft on crime" is an anti working class policy.
There are more ordinary working class people that suffer under militarized law-enforcement than are victims of low-level criminals. Every criminal that belongs to any kind of organized crime group ultimately takes orders from someone in the capitalist class. "Soft on crime" and "Hard on crime" are ultimately both completely empty phrases because all it means is whether you want a totalitarian police state or not. Your entire post is reactionary nonsense.

File: 1792617166630-9.png (775.39 KB, 1200x1200, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2936574
>Socialist countries have historically practiced rehabilitative solutions to crime, as they were based on Marxist theory which said that crime was a product of conditions imposed by capitalism.
Such as?

>Major Retentionist Regions & Countries

>Led globally by China (which executes thousands annually as a state secret), Iran, North Korea, Viet Nam, Singapore, and Afghanistan

>>2936577
>which executes thousands annually as a state secret
That's actually the US, but okay.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_the_Soviet_Union

>Capital punishment in the Soviet Union was a legal penalty for most of the country's existence. The claimed legal basis for capital punishment was Article 22 of the Fundamental Principles of Criminal Legislation, which stated that the death penalty was permitted "as an exceptional measure of punishment, until its complete abolition".[1]


>According to Western estimates, in the early 1980s Soviet courts passed around 2,000 death sentences every year, of which two-thirds were commuted to prison terms.[2] A 1991 Helsinki Watch report stated that in January of that year the Soviet Union for the first time published capital punishment data. It was disclosed that, in 1990, 445 individuals were given the death sentence, 195 people were executed and 29 death sentences were commuted. Execution took the form of a gunshot to the back of the head.[3] The death penalty was not applied to minors or pregnant women


>During the Second All-Russian Congress of Soviets of Workers' and Soldiers' Deputies in November 1917, the government of Soviet Russia decreed the abolition of the death penalty. In February 1918, the death penalty was reinstated. Hangings and shootings were very extensively employed by the Bolsheviks as part of their Red Terror.[5]


>The first person to be sentenced to death by a Soviet court was Alexey Schastny, Admiral of the Baltic Fleet, on 21 June 1918.[2] Conditional death sentences were also delivered in the early 1920s.[4] Decrees issued in 1922, 1923 and 1933, repealed in 1959, provided police with the right to carry out summary executions.[4] Capital punishment was abolished on 26 May 1947, but reinstated in 1950.[6] Capital punishment was extended to cases of aggravated murder in 1954

>>2936578
Whatever the number, it's not a secret that they execute people.

>While China does not publish overall national totals, it does occasionally publicize high-profile individual cases in state media to serve as public deterrents (e.g., severe corruption, major drug trafficking, or violent high-profile crimes):


<Amnesty International's Database: When Amnesty monitored publicly available Chinese news reports and court databases (such as China Judgements Online), they documented hundreds of individual death penalty cases in public records. However, researchers noted that thousands of execution records are deliberately omitted or scrubbed from public court databases.


<Consequently, if you strictly count only the individual cases publicly disclosed or reported in Chinese state news media and accessible court notices, the verified minimum count ranges in the low hundreds per year, though human rights groups emphasize that this reflects a small fraction of the actual total.

>>2936559
What the fuck are you talking about? Of course there can be no police, prisons, or (bourgeois) laws under communism. The state and all of its organs will cease to exist.

>>2936577
>Such as?
Yugoslavia, East Germany, Cuba, and yes even China's system is better than the USAs and shows lower rates of recidivism and better outcomes because they focus on rehabilitation and they don't have for profit prison systems. Your whining about capital punishment has nothing to do with the differences between capitalist criminal justice systems and socialist ones, which is obvious because you didn't even bother to address any of the other points. The USA has more criminals in prison than any other country on Earth and it hasn't seemed to solve its crime problems at all, contrary to your claims. You're a reactionary masquerading as a leftist.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/225595158_A_critical_review_of_past_studies_on_China's_corrections_and_recidivism
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/238431762_Social_Control_and_Recidivism_in_China

>>2936591
>Your whining about capital punishment has nothing to do with the differences between capitalist criminal justice systems and socialist ones,
How did I whine about it? How does it not have to do with anything? Capital punishment is the very opposite of the idea of rehabilitation. Most of the world has banned it yet most of the AES countries still have it.

>>2936593
Unless you can prove that AES countries all kill people or lock them up for decades for minor crimes like they do in America then your point proves nothing and OP stands correct in stating that the American criminal justice system is a grift and fosters a system that encourages criminal behavior for these purposes. The fact is that the vast majority of criminals went through rehabilitative processes in Socialist countries, they didn't just shoot them all for littering or doing drugs. Even in China they only execute people for things like large-scale drug trafficking or high-level embezzlement, and they often suspend sentences for capital punishment.

>>2936602
Why does it have to be compared to the US specifically? What about all the other capitalist countries that have abolished the death penalty?

>Unless you can prove that AES countries all kill

https://www.British Broadcasting Corporation.com/news/articles/cqjk4lwddz0o
Eleven people sentenced to death in Vietnam drug trafficking case

>>2936606
>Why does it have to be compared to the US specifically? What about all the other capitalist countries that have abolished the death penalty?
Because OP was talking specifically about the US. Even if they didn't mention it specifically, it's obvious. I don't really know why you want to bring up those other countries that have abolished the death penalty because it's not helping your case, in fact it's doing the exact opposite. All those countries that are "soft on crime" across the board have better criminal justice outcomes and less recidivism. I think China and Vietnam should abolish the death penalty but it doesn't mean that they're as bad as the American police state.

Also, you didn't even read what I said. Vietnam executed 11 people out of 227 people involved in one of the country's biggest drug trafficking cases. That is a very big difference from being "hard on crime" and putting random people away for decades for a few ounces of weed like we do in America, or preying on poverty stricken areas and aggressively policing them and having the entire local court system shoot people and put innocent people away for life because they match a description so that they can appear to be "tough on crime".

>>2936528
>Find me a single "soft on crime" socialist countyr in history.
there aren't any socialist countries, there are only capitalist countries with red flags
>Crime reduces when you put criminals in prison for a long time.
amerikkka puts more and more people in jail yet crime keeps going up there. why? because they don't take care of the root causes. anyway people get criminalized in the first place as an excuse to throw them in jail. criminal is just a category that the state creates to designate certain people as targets. every communist revolutionary was a criminal in the eyes of the bourgeois state. according to you the solution to socialist revolutionaries is to put them in jail for a long time.
>The capitalist class deliberately let's crime fester
they define what crime is in the first place, and they define communist revolution as a crime.
> to create divisions and distrust among proles, and to make them vote for right wing politicians who claim to be hard on crime (they never truly are).
the truly criminal class is in power and defines what crime is. when proles say "crime" they typically mean "the behavior of the ruling class" when the ruling class says "crime" they typically mean "the behavior of the unruly proles". Let's not confuse the prescriptive with the descriptive. Currently, in capitalist society, crime means the latter, because of who the ruling class is. Nevertheless prisons and cops don't make crime go down, any more than firefighters reduce the number of fires that start. firefighters can only put out fires once they start. Who actually has the power to reduce the number of fires that start in the first place? The people who understand the root cause of fires starting.
>99% of the victims of the parasitic lumpenproles are proles and other lumpen. "Soft on crime" is an anti working class policy.
under what mode of production

>>2936545
terrible reply to a terrible post. you should be interrogating the category of crime, not the category of working class.

>>2936559
made up a guy to get mad at instead of replying to the content of the OP award


>>2936528
You are wrong. Being "tough on crime" is incompatible with the theory of scientific socialism, because the state does not stand above social classes; rather, it is an instrument used by one social class to oppress another. For a communist revolution to overthrow the bourgeois state and establish the dictatorship of the proletariat, actions deemed "crimes" by the bourgeois state will be necessary—and such state repression would inevitably be directed against communists and workers. Therefore, the bourgeois state must never be granted the power to repress. Instead, the militias of the workers' self-defense committees must employ whatever force is required to consolidate the supremacy of the proletariat and suppress counter-revolutionaries, liberals, reactionaries, lackeys of imperialism, opportunists, and those who advocate for class conciliation—while also preparing for the re-education of enemies to encourage their surrender and demoralization.

The state is an instrument through which one class oppresses another, because a class-based society is characterized by irreconcilable antagonisms between property owners—both against one another and against those who lack property—which inevitably lead to conflict. For this reason, an entity separate from and alienated from this society emerges to provide a certain hypocritical “order” that maintains the ruling classes in power within a class-based society.

The industrial reserve army is necessary for capitalists to intensify the exploitation of workers; otherwise, instability and a decline in profit rates will occur, hindering the accumulation of capital in a capitalist system within a bourgeois state.

The state is not a neutral entity and it cannot have any opportunity to subdue the workers. Scientific socialism and revolutionary socialism are incompatible with any demand to empower the bourgeois state to repress the workers and take away their independence so that the proletarian class cannot organize, arm itself, and seize power to disarm the bourgeois class and its agents.

I will begin with excerpts from the political program of Marx and Engels that demonstrate this position and outline some points regarding how to combat the problem of the industrial reserve army of workers:

<4. Universal arming of the people. In future armies shall at the same time be workers’ armies so that the armed forces will not only consume, as in the past, but produce even more than it costs to maintain them.


<Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels March, 1848, Demands of the Communist Party in Germany


https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/03/24.htm

<(ii) Gradual expropriation of landowners, industrialists, railroad magnates and shipowners, partly through competition by state industry, partly directly through compensation in the form of bonds.


<(iii) Confiscation of the possessions of all emigrants and rebels against the majority of the people.


<(iv) Organization of labor or employment of proletarians on publicly owned land, in factories and workshops, with competition among the workers being abolished and with the factory owners, in so far as they still exist, being obliged to pay the same high wages as those paid by the state.


<(v) An equal obligation on all members of society to work until such time as private property has been completely abolished. Formation of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.


<(vi) Centralization of money and credit in the hands of the state through a national bank with state capital, and the suppression of all private banks and bankers.


<Frederick Engels, 1847, The Principles of Communism


https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm

<The French socialist workers, in adopting as the aim of their efforts the political and economic expropriation of the capitalist class and the return to community of all the means of production, have decided, as a means of organization and struggle, to enter the elections with the following immediate demands:


<A. Political Section

<1. Abolition of all laws over the press, meetings and associations and above all the law against the International Working Men's Association. Removal of the livret, [6] that administrative control over the working class, and of all the articles of the Code [7] establishing the inferiority of the worker in relation to the boss, and of woman in relation to man;
[…]
<3. Suppression of the public debt;
<4. Abolition of standing armies and the general arming of the people;
<5. The Commune to be master of its administration and its police.

<B. Economic Section


<1. One rest day each week or legal ban on employers imposing work more than six days out of seven. - Legal reduction of the working day to eight hours for adults. - A ban on children under fourteen years working in private workshops; and, between fourteen and sixteen years, reduction of the working day from eight to six hours;

<2. Protective supervision of apprentices by the workers' organizations;
<3. Legal minimum wage, determined each year according to the local price of food, by a workers' statistical commission;
<4. Legal prohibition of bosses employing foreign workers at a wage less than that of French workers;
<5. Equal pay for equal work, for workers of both sexes;
<6. Scientific and professional instruction of all children, with their maintenance the responsibility of society, represented by the state and the Commune;
<7. Responsibility of society for the old and the disabled;
<8. Prohibition of all interference by employers in the administration of workers' friendly societies, provident societies, etc., which are returned to the exclusive control of the workers;
<9. Responsibility of the bosses in the matter of accidents, guaranteed by a security paid by the employer into the workers' funds, and in proportion to the number of workers employed and the danger that the industry presents;
<10. Intervention by the workers in the special regulations of the various workshops; an end to the right usurped by the bosses to impose any penalty on their workers in the form of fines or withholding of wages (decree by the Commune of 27 April 1871);
<11. Annulment of all the contracts that have alienated public property (banks, railways, mines, etc.), and the exploitation of all state-owned workshops to be entrusted to the workers who work there;
<12. Abolition of all indirect taxes and transformation of all direct taxes into a progressive tax on incomes over 3,000 francs. Suppression of all inheritance on a collateral line [8] and of all direct inheritance over 20,000 francs.

<Editorial Notes

[…]
<6. The 'livret' was a certificate which a worker was legally obliged to present when taking up a new job, confirming that his debts and obligations to his previous employer had been discharged. The practice was finally abolished in 1890.
<7. The Code Napoleon, the French law.

<Karl Marx and Jules Guesde, 1880, The Programme of the Parti Ouvrier

https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1880/05/parti-ouvrier.htm

I will add another quote that proves my point in practice with Lenin:

<The party of the proletariat cannot rest content with a bourgeois parliamentary democratic republic, which throughout the world preserves and strives to perpetuate the monarchist instruments for the oppression of the masses, namely, the police, the standing army, and the privileged bureaucracy.


<The party fights for a more democratic workers’ and peasants’ republic, in which the police and the standing army will be abolished and replaced by the universally armed people, by a people’s militia; all officials will be not only elective, but also subject to recall at any time upon the demand of a majority of the electors; all officials, without exception, will be paid at a rate not exceeding the average wage of a competent worker; parliamentary representative institutions will be gradually replaced by Soviets of people’s representatives (from various classes and professions, or from various localities), functioning as both legislative and executive bodies.


[…]
<11) Judges and other officials, both civil and military, to be elected by the people with the right to recall any of them at any time by decision of a majority of their electors.

<12) The police and standing army to be replaced by the universally armed people; workers and other employees to receive regular wages from the capitalists for the time devoted to public service in the people’s militia.

[…]
<As a basic condition for the democratisation of our country’s national economy, the Russian Social-Democratic Labour Party demands the abolition of all indirect taxes and the establishment of a progressive tax on incomes and inheritances.

<The high level of development of capitalism already achieved in banking and in the trustified branches of industry, on the one hand, and the economic disruption caused by the imperialist war, everywhere evoking a demand for state and public control of the production and distribution of all staple products, on the other, induce the Party to demand the nationalisation of the banks, syndicates (trusts), etc.


<To safeguard the working class from physical and moral deterioration, and develop its ability to carry on the struggle for emancipation, the Party demands:


<1) An eight-hour working day for all wage-workers, including a break of not less than one hour for meals where work is continuous. In dangerous and unhealthy industries the working day to be reduced to from four to six hours.


<2) A statutory weekly uninterrupted rest period of not less than forty-two hours for all wage-workers of both sexes in all branches of the national economy.


<3) Complete prohibition of overtime work.


<4) Prohibition of night-work (from 8 p.m. to 6 a.m.)in all branches of the national economy except in cases where it is absolutely necessary for technical reasons endorsed by the labour organisations—provided, however, that night-work does not exceed four hours.


<5) Prohibition of the employment of children of school age (under sixteen), restriction of the working day of adolescents (from sixteen to twenty) to four hours, and prohibition of the employment of adolescents on night-work in unhealthy industries and mines.


<6) Prohibition of female labour in all branches of industry injurious to women’s health; prohibition of night work for women; women to be released from work eight weeks before and eight weeks after child-birth without loss of pay and with free medical and medicinal aid.


<7) Establishment of nurseries for infants and young children and rooms for nursing mothers at all factories and other enterprises where women are employed; nursing mothers to be allowed recesses of at least half-hour duration at intervals of not more than three hours; such mothers to receive nursing benefit and their working day to be reduced to six hours.


<8) Full social insurance of workers:


<a) for all forms of wage-labour;


<b) for all forms of disablement, namely, sickness, injury, infirmity, old age, occupational disease, child-birth, widowhood, orphanhood, and also unemployment, etc.


<c) all insurance institutions to be administered entirely by the insured themselves;


<d) the cost of insurance to be borne by the capitalists;


<e) free medical and medicinal aid under the control of self-governing sick benefit societies, the management bodies of which are to be elected by the workers.


<9) The establishment of a labour inspectorate elected by the workers’ organisations and covering all enterprises employing hired labour, as well as domestic servants; women inspectors to be appointed in enterprises where female labour is employed.


<10) Sanitary laws to be enacted for improving hygienic conditions and protecting the life and health of workers in all enterprises where hired labour is employed; questions of hygiene to be handled by the sanitary inspectorate elected by the workers’ organisations.


<11) Housing laws to be enacted and a housing inspectorate elected by the workers’ organisations to be instituted for the purpose of sanitary inspection of dwelling houses. However, only by abolishing private property in land and building cheap and hygienic dwellings can the housing problem be solved.


<12) Industrial courts to be established in all branches of the national economy.


<13) Labour exchanges to be established for the proper organisation of work-finding facilities. These labour ex changes must be proletarian class organisations (organised on a non-parity basis), and must be closely associated with the trade unions and other working-class organisations and financed by the communal self-governing bodies.


<V. I. Lenin, 1917, Materials Relating to the Revision of the Party Programme

https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/reviprog/ch04.htm

>remove addictive substances from society
dumbest shit i've ever heard

>>2936528
>rime reduces when you put criminals in prison for a long time.
source?


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