No.11465[Last 50 Posts]
Well it's another day of /pol/fags raiding. Given the increased attention our board has gotten I figured I should write up a critique of /pol/; both the "arguments" it makes on here as well as its ideology in general. Maybe some /pol/lyps read it and take it to heart, most likely they wont. This is just an open post anyone can comment on. I'm slightly hungover, so forgive me if this comes across as a bit incoherent.
/pol/'s ideological problem
/pol/ is ostensibly a "fascist" board. Though its far removed from the fascism of yesteryear. Whereas Italian Fascism at least had an intellectual and philosophical component to justify itself, whereas it could elaborate on some basic tenets (even though it would contradict all of them at some point) Nazism had no such thing: just an incoherent conspiracy.
What both Fascism in its Italian and Nazi forms had—that /pol/ certainly lacks—is collective discipline. Most of the early blackshirts were veterans of WWI. The success and organizational power of the fascist movement could be attributed to the work of these veterans who, to their credit, actually were fairly efficient at what they do.
>What was the base of classical fascism?
<Veterans and the economically devastated middle class.
>What is the base of modern fascism?
<An economically devastated middle-class.
All /pol/ is home to is the socially maladroit children of middle income earners. Well, and Boomers screaming at the world as the last synapses in their brain burn out. Of course there may be a few exceptions here and there (and its obvious /pol/ anons like to LARP as the exception to the rule) but for the most part the same people are attracted to /pol/: The children who sat alone on the playground. The incel seething at some happy couple in a coffee shop. The kind of person who thinks they're one life coach grifter away from finding real happiness.
Everything /pol/ does is directed by their class position as the children of middle income earners, as asocial loners with serious self-esteem issues. If they do have a career, its likely as a contractor or some white collar worker that is isolated from or in direct confrontation with other workers. Either way, it leads to /pol/ being collectively impotent.
Comrade Stalin once taught that Anarchism is a strain of liberalism, in that it sought the total liberation of the individual. I believe that Fascism, by contrast, promises the total tyranny of the individual: a way for maladjusted individuals to exercise violence upon others to satisfy their libidinal urges. Every Fascist wants to be a king in their own right, what this usually means is that where Fascists attempt to organize in the modern day, their orgs fall apart due to infighting and backstabbing.
/pol/ can tout campaigns such as placing "Its Okay To Be White" posters on college campuses, but at the end of the day these are individual actions and can only affect individual change. The Fascist violence of today is individual violence: its the fascist murdering groups of school children. Its the fascist gunning down peaceful churchgoers. The only "change" /pol/ can manifest is individual psychos throwing deadly temper tantrums and rallying more people against itself.
>inb4 "but we memed Trump into the White House"
No. The Republican Party did. Oh sure, the enthusiasm you guys showed for Trump helped, but if he'd done anything but run Republican he would've fallen on his face. You were accessories to his victory, not the deciding factor.
Which brings me to my final point: you've all been useful stooges for right-wing parties. What was your overall strategy? Well, to use the only power left to you (voting and whining) to put people who say the right things in office, then you act shocked that they pursue an agenda that's compromised by the status quo. Nevermind that you don't have any infrastructure outside of mainstream right-wing political parties. Nevermind that you have no policies other than impotent rage at everything around you. You approach politics like a kite approaches the wind: you let it blow you around and pray you go in the "right" direction.
/pol/'s tired arguments
If any board encounters /pol/ they usually trot out the same arguments again and again.
<"Are you afraid of debating us? Why do you ban us? Why do you not let us discuss race theory? It's because you can't respond to it, isn't it?"
I'll be perfectly frank: /pol/ is a cancer. That cancer is what killed 4chan.
Wherever "discussion" that leaves the door open to White Nationalists happens, they flock to it like a moth to a flame. Usually because they're despised and insta-banned everywhere else. The idea that /pol/ was a "containment" board is laughable. It was a fucking lighthouse for fascists, and soon began to leak into other boards. It was /pol/, not moot and not reddit, that killed 4chan. As your board grew, you began leaking onto other boards: /v/, /co/, /tv/, and so on.
You weren't changing peoples minds. You were pushing the oldfags out with your excessive faggotry. It was always "uyghuruyghuruyghuruyghur", constantly, and while the chans had always been known for edgie humor, at least /b/ could change things up now and again. Your entire board's culture is dedicated to seething about all the sex blacks and Jews are taking away from you. You'll constantly shit up /v/ by bitching about "woke devs", you'll shit on /tv/ shows for having some interracial couple (and for being unable to get the image of a black man pounding a white woman out of your head.) You made 4chan, as a whole, a far less entertaining place.
You're cancer. The internet is better off without you.
<"Lefties oppose Capitalism. Yet they do things international firms like. Curious."
Whenever /pol/ tries to claim that the far-right are the real anti-establishment heroes, they'll always trot out some example of Leftists being opposed to harsh-immigration laws and Rightists being in favor of them, with big firms usually siding with the Left. Somehow this is supposed to imply that Leftists are the footsoldiers of Capitalism. Let's consider the following points, however:
>Leftist support for immigration devolves to not brutalizing immigrant laborers with the long arm of the state.
>The Right never offers an immigration proposal that would punish firms that hire foreign/illegal labor, only punish the laborers.
>Corporate support for immigration amounts to profit-seeking at worst, lip-service at best.
The fact is large corporations support immigration because it allows them to pay a lower wage. You're not a revolutionary for recognizing that. However instead of taking the common sense position that the corporations themselves should be punished for driving wages down, you always seem to wind up on the side of brutalizing the immigrants.
And do you know what? Megacorps love our current immigration policy perfectly well! Harsh penalties for "illegal" immigration means you can hire people at a sub-minimum wage, avoid paying them benefits, and at any time you can use the threat of police violence to keep your workers in line! You'll suffer none of the consequences if it turns out you utilize an entirely immigrant-based workforce, instead you're rewarded for it with additional profits.
All the Left wants is for our fellow workers to be treated as human beings, rather than as subjects of a totalitarian regime.
<"Generic Holocaust Denialism, FBI Crime Stats, Bell Curve Nonsense."
There's a saying that /pol/ would be wise to learn: "It takes ten minutes to debunk a ten-second lie."
You can throw all the graphs, stats, and empirical evidence you want out there, /pol/, but the fact remains that all of these things can be faked (and quite often /pol/ shares completely manufactured quotes) or misinterpreted. Shit, if you're as autistic as most of us here, it could be easy enough to convince people the earth is hollow.
That "normies" can't respond to your evidence isn't because of the power of the evidence itself. Its because literally no one things about race and racism as much as /pol/. Normal people don't spend their day meticulously combing through "Justice for Germans" and hearing "both sides." To expect that of them is ridiculous. You can create the appearance of having an empirical ideology while being as far from correct as possible. When you have a view beforehand and look for evidence afterwards, you can remarkably find a lot of it.
<"What about an alliance?"
An Alliance between fucking what? Boards? The fact is the jannies just clean up the shit around here, they don't direct us. Much as yours don't direct you. Any "Alliance" would just be a degree of courtesy between individuals on here, and it'd be just as politically impotent as either of our boards.
The only "Alliance" with actual political power between far-left and far-right would be an alliance between parties: which you largely don't have and we largely want nothing to do with.
I mean, who on the Left would actually want to ally with you guys? The CPUSA? Yeah no, we have older comrades who remember your lot shooting union workers for the "crime" of wanting a higher wage. The PSL? While we have our differences, they aren't going to throw their lot in with the fucking Nazis. Trots? Shit, I'd like to think they're better than that.
An Alliance to do what? You expect us to march side by side at protests? Us carrying the red flag of Socialism and you carrying the Swastika? What'll happen the next time some cop inevitably guns down a black person and you start howling "uyghur had it coming!"?
No alliance with Fascists.
/pol/ is a cancer on everything it touches and mistakes annoyance for wit.
QUICK someone post gore or something to derail the thread so I feel better about my beliefs that /pol/ indoctrinated me with because I'm a young impressionable loser.
they do read,but90% of it is either larp,romanticized western history or ""philosophy"",the other 10% is inciting manifesto.
Based old screencap.
All a reading list like that could accomplish is giving someone a really schizophrenic political education.
Also I'm not seeing much from Italian fascists in that list. Where's the doctrine of Fascism?
Honestly, the Nazis were the more incompetent fascist movement, so I'm at least glad to see they continue to be an albatross around /pol/'s neck.
Whoever came up with it seems really gay for Rothbard.
What happened to the leftypol reading list?
We really need to revive the reading sticky.
I like how the chart doesn't include guenon's criticisms on christianity
Second this. Jannies you know what to do
Metropolis is not leftist, beyond the superficial glance in its themes it's fundamentally fascist, which is probably also why it was literally Hitler's favorite movie. I say this as someone who got cucked by watching it, expecting a dope socialist movie.
Kill yourself class collaborationist
less angry, more scarry.
Yeah I don't know how you can watch metropolis the whole way through and not see the inherent class collaboration message there. I think at one point Goebbels unsuccessfully approached Fritz Lang to try and get him to produce a film like the Battleship Potemkin but glorifying the Nazi cause
Didn’t Lang leave the country after Goebbels tried to recruit him to do propaganda for the NSDAP?
Battleship Potemkin is honestly still great and everyone should watch it. It completely changed how I look at movies.
It's one of the best anon…still one of the best. Damn Eisenstein was a visionary
Absolutely, I have a large interest in everything having to do with the 1917/18-1939 period and Soviet films from that time were among the best works to come out of the period.
Don't be mad I posted some papa joe, anon. It's just some humour
I kind of want to make a thread in /hobby/ or something about BP and its parallels with Shin Godzilla
I would post some more, but it's always "unknown file extension". Dammit
check if they're saved as .heic/.webp (even if the filename is .png/jpg, open it in paint and try "save as" and that sometimes reveals that the filename is a lie.)
Some of the worst propaganda are made by people who don't realize they're making propaganda. Whether the director himself was a card-carrying nazi or not isn't really relevant.
They are saved as webp. I don't know how to change it desu
am I out of touch or is this a crypto-leftist chart?
>>11507>Hayek, Rothbard, Rand, Niall Ferguson, Bell Curve, Lectures on the Holocaust, Debating the Holocaust, Hobbes, Mises, etc.
No it's not crypto leftist.
The leftist books on that list are probably for 'debunking' purposes. Although some are admittedly strange, like Battle Cry Of Freedom (ACW book written by a fairly leftleaning author) and Homage to Catalonia.
Good effortpost OP but you forgot to mention how much stormfags astroturfed 4chan and /pol/ around 2012-2015.
I figured it was irrelevant, /pol/ and stormfront are practically one in the same at this point. All /pol/ did was essentially act as a beacon for these faggots to kill off 4chan.
based CPUSA Anon
Interesting. Wondered why this board is so dead.>/pol/ is fascist
That's an oversimplification. >that leaves the door open to White Nationalists happens, they flock to it like a moth to a flame
When a poor man asks for alms, and all shut him out but one, what will that poor man do?>their class position as the children of middle income earners, as asocial loners with serious self-esteem issues
Probably, but it isn't much different from the people here. >a way for maladjusted individuals to exercise violence upon others to satisfy their libidinal urges
It all comes back to sex with lefties doesn't it? When everything is a penis, this says more about them than /pol/.>You weren't changing peoples minds
They changed mine. It seems unfathomable to some that one may go from typical commie or just far left beliefs in general over to the generalized majority of /pol/. >Generic Holocaust Denialism, FBI Crime Stats, Bell Curve Nonsense.
I appreciate how this paragraph offers nothing to the contrary, only suggesting that /pol/ is erroneous because you said so.>It takes ten minutes to debunk a ten-second lie
Your ten second lie is defeated with a meme. It takes lefties ten minutes to debunk a ten-second meme because they're incompetent.>Its because literally no one things about race and racism as much as /pol/
Not sure. May be true. It's certainly an issue worthy of being broadcast and taught in schools and universities constantly. >mistakes annoyance for wit
Enlighten me lefties. What makes you come here? I came here out of curiosity. No activity on the rest of the threads, and this one said /pol/ so I went 'aha! this should be interesting'
I see this regularly. /pol/ is more active than almost all other boards, and certainly more active than here. What do you mean they killed 4chan?
No. Do you have anything else?
At least a third of those are bots
What makes you say that?
You typed so many words just to say “no u.”
>>11515>Enlighten me lefties. What makes you come here?
Only non redditized leftoid space. Only arguments on /pol/ worth entertaining are hereditary "race-realist" ones but that era of /pol/ is over. It's a boomer place full of nonsequitor "I'm a retarded based chad, you're an ugly cuck" meme spam.
>>11515>That's an oversimplification.
yeh you're also a bunch of boomer libs>When a poor man
but you're all rich kids>It all comes back to sex with lefties doesn't it? When everything is a penis, this says more about them than /pol/.http://understandingworldreligions.com/classic%20works/Goodrick-%20Clarke%20Occult%20Roots%20of%20Nazism.pdf
Press f3, type "sexo-racist gnosis"
>They changed mine.
(((they))) yes indeed >>11468
What makes me come here? Memes and news
Good, maybe finally I'll stop wasting time online if I don't.
You didn't read it. If you did, you should try reading again, but slowly.>>11524>only non redditized leftoid space
That's fair. Disagree with the rest>but you're all rich kids
So /pol/ is rich, middle class, and poor at the same time? Odd. I was using a metaphor though. >(((they)))
Yes, the jews have shown me the light of the israeli lobby…>memes and news
Fair enough I guess.
That link just takes me to a whole book. The search pulls up a bunch of assertions of a sexo-racist gnosis, without delving into any sort of meaning. If it's hidden deep in the book, I do not have time to read it at the moment.
Why are those threads the only threads you visit? Twitter screencaps, is coffee good for you, and other sorts of spam means someone cares enough to go do that. Whether it's favorable or not, I would call it alive.
I reread it. Again, you might as well have written no u.
>>11515>It all comes back to sex with lefties doesn't it? When everything is a penis, this says more about them than /pol/.<N-no u
Anon, you can't go less then a single thread on /pol/ without something being mentioned relating to sex in some way, and its dishonest to state differently. Look on this catalog, and count the number of threads relating to sex. Now go to /pol/, and count the number there. I count about 11 or 12 on the catalog, 5 about sex directly and about 6 regarding woman and sex, with your regular porn spam inbetween.
>>11529>Why are those threads the only threads you visit? Twitter screencaps, is coffee good for you, and other sorts of spam means someone cares enough to go do that. Whether it's favorable or not, I would call it alive.<Turning your imageboard into the imageboard equivalent of twitter is "alive"
I'd rather go back to having discussions with the schizos of 8/pol/ or the neets on /fascist/ then use 4/pol/. If just having pph is what is considered "alive", then you may as well call boomer Facebook groups "alive".
answer my posts you glowing polyp bitch
You're convinced spam threads form the consensus of ideas? Why?>>11530
I'm sorry for your reading ability. >>11532
Cemeteries are typically quiet.
>>11534>I’m sorry for your reading ability
I’m sorry for your parents.
I did. forgot the post number >>11528
You're not though. Why do you go on the internet just to tell lies
killed the spirit of 4chan and shat up the site with underage newfags and boomers who repeat the same stupid shit
I genuinely am, though. They’re probably trash, but they deserve better than you.
>>11528>So /pol/ is rich, middle class, and poor at the same time?
no rich and middle class
>Yes, the jews have shown me the light of the israeli lobby…
(((they))) being various intelligence agencies, zionist outlets and other far right and media influences, I gave you an article, >>11468
comment on it. It contains proof your entire "movement" glows to high heaven, and it always has.
>>11534>You're convinced spam threads form the consensus of ideas? Why?
Beucase "spam" is practically the status quo. >Cemeteries are typically quiet
I'd rather have an imageboard with a moderate pph in which discussion can happen without the thread hitting the limit after about an hour then one in which threads either fill up rapidly with low effort posts or get slid off entirely.
<you will never be with a woman.
You will never be a real man
Thanks, don't know why you felt the need to clarify though, are you not one?
Yeah, killed the spirit makes more sense. I agree mostly, spirit is still there albeit heavily damaged. Lot of trash to sift through, but I would argue someone cares enough about its existence to post trash in the first place. That whole annoyance v wit thing in the OP.>>11540>rich and middle class
My point was you can't honestly believe the general population there is from a particular class and not all of them. >comment on it
I can promise you I'll read it. I can not promise you I will read the 4 hours of reading material you guys just gave me before I have to go. >movement
There is no movement. >>11541>status quo
Fair, as I said, there's trash to sift through. Think about who would put trash there and why, coupled with the activity. >I'd rather have an imageboard with a moderate pph
Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries
This is literally all projection, you're a midvit masquerading as an intellectual. Lmao then you strawman everything with your completely brainwashed idiotic take.
Fact is these "fascists" are growing all over the western world, truth is these "fascists" are only suffering a temporary setback due to censorship. All over the western world left wing parties are dying. You've let your major parties become kidnapped by corrupt oligarchs, yet you're so thickheaded that all you can think about is Trump. You're losing Europe and libtards won in the USA, now they will continue fucking USA up even more, do even more unjust wars waste even more and it will all be associated with the left.
Hell the american left even failed with force the vote because most are corrupt globalist mouthpieces, he renegged on literally every single progressive promise, you're not getting healthcare, you're not getting a minimum wage, you're not getting student debt forgiveness. Biden is even building border walls.
You live in a fantasy land of delusions you concocted for yourself, truth is the social conservative right/third wave movements will continue to grow. They will do so because libtards are the real racists, because they are completely hypocritical and will continue to drive people into their arms. This will only escalate and censorship can only slow it down.
Hell even your delusional take on the kohlface meme displays your utter lack of originality and understanding of chan culture, it's literally a joke right wingers on kohlchan made themselves, it doesn't reflect reality, we all know the surveys which display right wingers have more sex, are less mentally ill and are more attractive, there is absolutely no reason not to assume the same is true of right wing contra left wing channers. Also make your own OC or atleast shoop out the "kohlface" from the meme, jesus christ does none of you know how to use even paint?
Also chopping your dick off and changing gender just not to stay a virgin is pretty sad tbh desu.
Holy shit get a life tldr
>>11548>ohh let me post one of few exceptions and what is one of the most isolated countries in the world.
Ignore you know most of Europe, pretty much all other anglo countries except Canada(although right is growing there too) etc etc…
You will never be white
How’d your latest rally go? Has one even been successful since charlotttesville or has it just been flop after flop, with some Q boomers thrown in for comedy effect?
by 2070 it will be the only habitable country in the world.
>>11551>all Anglo countries
You mean all those countries which are in terminal decline? Wonder if these things could be related…
Why is Goldwater on there. He’s Jewish and the other books are like Holocaust denial shit.
>>11560>48 laws of power>animal farm>1984>The Prince>The Communist Manifesto>How to win friends and influence people>holocaust denial
I was exaggerating. It’s just a little uncanny to see someone recommend did 6 million really die and Goldwater. Also Rothbard too. If ur gonna be against Jews go all out don’t have ur favorite Jews.
>>11551>all other anglo countries except Canada(although right is growing there too)
The right is growing amongst the elderly and Anglo countries are getting increasingly old. That's literally it. Go check who elected Trump. Go check the UK elections. Pretty sure Corbyn won every working group in 2017, right up to the 65s and still lost, that's how utterly undead the UK is.
There is no hope for the right in these countries. OAP's aren't gonna storm the halls of government on their mobility scooters. The only thing it can accomplish is winning the ballot box, which achieves at best a preservation of the status quo. Deciding the window dressing of the slow economic, demographic and ecological decline of the west.
Are you sure that YOU aren't the retarded one instead?
After reading the whole thread and having posted on 4chan the last 16 years of my life you people need to stop smelling your own farts, taking the internet seriously, getting turned into lolcows and get a fucking life and a job regardless of how you feel about the system that takes you off either taxpayer dime or your parents' cash.
We have jobs and lives lurk more
I refuse to believe anyone so up their ass like I've seen in this thread has adequate real life experience to come to the conclusion they're investment here is positive like shitposting or actually holds sway over the realities of others anymore than a troll does.
I'm around brown people all day and they're fine.
Maybe you're just the asshole.
I haven't posted anything particularly hostile yet and I've racked up 9 Chinese soyjak memes. I might be rude but holy shit, you people exhume no fun allowed. I don't get the point of this place other than to suck eachother off and get raided every now and then from the looks of it.
>>11525>but you're all rich kids
Kek. My parents went bankrupt, after already being poor to begin with. My mom is in a wheelchair from her MS. I was a lefty until 2015. I wore a CCCP t shirt and voted for Trudeau. My favorite genre was hip hop and my parents were explicitly anti racist. It wasn't until he bailed on everything he promised that I found /pol/ and slowly shifted to the right.
Now? I made $24k last month, and I'm set to make even more this month. Whh? I embraced the tenants of fascism.
Arbeit. Macht. Frei.
Keep projecting though, all your shortcomings and failures are your own fault.
>>11571>Now? I made $24k last month
It wont bring your mums legs back, cope.
>>11571>I wore a CCCP t shirt and voted for Trudeau
you weren't a lefty, you were a delusional little shit. why the fuck didn't you vote NDP.
Very persuasive, I definitely don't want to gas you now.>>11574
Because I didn't want harper to win re election. NDP is throwing your vote away.
Si tu croyais que Macron était un gauchiste, l´idiote fut toi.
>>11571>I wore a CCCP t shirt and voted for Trudeau
lol, fucking lmfao
'Member when you guys made a small handful of images and came to pol only to get btfo so hard by one aussie posting more fresh content than you had to raid with that this place shut down for a day?
People who have never even been on 4chan 'member.
>>11575>NDP is throwing your vote away.
you are the human embodiment why Canada will always be little America and the worst country of the old Commonwealth. when you were a liberal you were a stupid liberal, and when you were a rightoid you were the most american rightoid it is possible to be. shameful, shameful, shameful display.
I don't speak frog>>11577
Booj? Failson? You'll have to speak in normal English this is my first time on bunkerchan. If you're implying the son of a low income family is bourgeoisie Im at a loss. I grew up in a rented duplex sharing a bedroom with two siblings. Now I own my own business and pay my staff $75/hour.
Canada is a shit country because our population growth is explicitly driven by importing 3rd world street shitters to work at our tim Hortons because we don't want to pay white teenagers more than $10/hour
So you do conflate the middle class with the rich elites just because they own a business?
>>11546>western world >left wing parties
Fucking where lol.
What's your business? That pay rate is higher than a lot of junior software developers on the West Coast. Pardon me if i'm skeptical.
Yeah, I started it from the ground up. I was never born into wealth. I saved money, I lost $25k, which was my life savings, the first time I started my own business and had to go back to my old job begging for a part time position. Now I net that much a month.
You can do it too, if you work hard enough.
You don't honestly believe him do you?
>>11580<'Member when you guys made a small handful of images and came to pol only to get btfo so hard by one aussie posting more fresh content than you had to raid with that this place shut down for a day?
This isn't Bunkerchan>>11582>claims to have been a commie before becoming fascist (read: went from radlib to racist lib)>doesn't even understand simple class terms
I run a commercial mortgage, insurance and corporate tax planing business. I have two part time employees who I pay $75hr because it means they get work done exceptionally well as I'm paying more than 2x what they would get anywhere else.
But it is. You just pissed off the rest of the boards that aren't politics related to the point they had to distance themselves from you. I was here when people begged you fuckers not to draw attention to bunkerchan and began talking about getting rid of you.
>>11585>the middle class with the rich elites just because they own a business>middle class
Anon, petit-bourgeoisie are still bourgeoisie in regards to their economic relations, and are bourgeoisie proper in the making. "Middle class" (as defined by liberals like you) is a completely meaningless term that literally every person seems to think they are.
Do you believe this is an argument or a strong hot take that turns to a hill to die on? Please explain why someone who came from nothing then obtained business ownership is the same as a trust fund kid.
If you're going to play pretend you could at least pretend to not be a parasite
>>11592>private sector bureaucrat is reactionary
Your politics make sense but still, no one will believe you without proof.
So basically you have to work for someone else to not be a bourgeoisie? Is it explicitly a function of being an employee?
Literally anyone can start a business.
Big porkies, piglets, both go “oink”, don’t they? >>11595>What are property relations?
>>11598>your labor on behalf of another's business is bad and complicit>hiring willing laborers to work for you is bad and complicit
0 sum game from what I can tell, just wants reality to change.
I help people make more money and get taxed less and get financing for expanding their businesses.>>11597
Proof? What do you want? My website? My biz banking statements?
So what book have you read
Why can't you explain yourself in a basic straightforward manner? What might that gell me about you? So far it seems if you own a business that's a bad thing in one huge broad stroke that makes me want to have a stroke.
I can start a business selling pictures of my asshole, that doesn’t mean I’m gonna be able to make a living off it or it won’t go under after five years or less.
>>11601>My biz banking statements?
>>11598>Literally anyone can start a business
Provided they have the capital necessary. You can't just leave that out, idiot.
Is it a meme around here to start throwing books at eachother until someone backs down instead of demonstrating you can explain your beliefs and reasoning in your own words and a convincing manner to other people?
Sorry I'm not going to post something you can commit fraud in my name with>>11606
Yeah, and anyone can get capital. I lost my life savings trying to start my first business, went back to washing dishes.
The homepage is still bunkerchan.xyz>>11602
Is it a meme around here to start throwing books at eachother until someone backs down instead of demonstrating you can explain your beliefs and reasoning in your own words and a convincing manner to other people?>>11609>>11606
Nobody raided you fag. You guys literally just did it to yourselves by avenue of halfchan anons fishing for (you)'s, and then you decided to have a meltdown and spam cp and gore. And when that failed to get the response you wanted, you tried falseflagging as anons and screencapping the posts. Even when anons called you faggots out, you would still try and cope by leaving out any of the replies. >>11593
Stop being such a newfag. Bunkerchan split from .org months before the /pol/face meme was even a thing, and the split had nothing to do with the raid, but rather mod drama and Space_.
Define “willing.” These things don’t just exist in the abstract.
>>11610>The homepage is still bunkerchan.xyz
It literally isn't, read the url.
i would not purchase insurance from a business which isn't sufficiently skilled at avoiding disaster to redact the doxable info from a bank statement.
(well, maybe i would if i was planning to do some kind of insurance fraud, but i'd have to plan it out first.)
Im asking for clarification >>11604
Then it wouldn't be a very good business would it?
I technically owned a business at 14 fixing computers. I get that's not the point you're trying to make but I think you are willfully ignorant to the argument you can come from nothing and become a business owner, as is typical with franchises and small-town businesses.
But it is, anon. Type in bunkerchan.xyz then try to navigate back to this thread without touching the address bar again.
So do you prefer books with pictures like comics or what
Cool. Entertaining this fairy tale still, do you think that you’re typical of all people who start businesses? Or that it ain’t possible for your biz to go down in 5 years or so?
>>11617>Website redirects, so it’s the same place
The absolute state.
me, a freedman: don't feel so bad about being a slave - i mean look at me, i worked hard and was affranchised! now i own 16 slaves of my own! when you grow up you'll see that the system was fine, you just needed to work harder.
A failing business seems like something a prospecting business owner would be well aware of. Do you feel smart?
The typical business startup fails in the first 90 days.
I guess I'm still here because I'm in denial the attitude behind those angry people that keep coming back to the place they hate are actually like this here.
If you don't have employees but own your own business as a necessary legal fiction then you're more an artisan than bourgeois or petty bourgeois.
I could also easily edit ANY bank statement to make it look like I was earning 100's of thousands of dollars a month. I could easily use a clients bank statement as well, and larp that I'm making millions. Either way I'm not going to do either from my phone>>11614
80% of businesses fail in a couple of years. The key is to keep working and not just give up because you failed.
Arbeit. Macht. Frei.
You can always go for easy tweets with minimal effort on Twitter but I guess that doesn't make you feel special?
What book have you read
did you actually quote the posts in the wrong order
are you fucking high
This UI fucking blows and keeps kicking that to the top. Sucks for phone posting. I did it too but worse.
>>11634>Sucks for phone posting.
use the app
Looks like I did, due to the poor functioning of this website. How come racist incels can make a better image board than the enlightened individuals who come here?
Not high though, I quit that to help me focus.
Given the pervasive arrogance and condescending dismissal of an entire "class", it offers a surprising amount of insight on how boards like /pol/ coalesced in the first place.
What book have you read
I literally recognized that most businesses fail. My own business had failed, I had to go crying back to beg to wash dishes again to make rent. But once again, Arbeit Macht Frei.
>>11622>a site that seeks to combat extremism
Fuck off newfag, that was d0llars's shilling, not us.
Do you like books or are you more of a podcast kind of guy
I'm just a tourist and I was interested a little but after browsing several threads it just seems like this place TRIES to be antipol and anti idpol but holy shit I don't think I've ever seen anything so far up its own ass and so devoid of humor and fun.
Meant to quote both
Do you think we exist to simp for you and not because there were people from /pol/ on 8chan or whenever who didn’t get tired of your shit?
Extreme Ownership by Jocko Willink, it's a worthwhile exploration on understanding the principles behind successful leadership strategies.
>>11648>one name brings heat>still keep it as a functional homepage url
Are you responsible for this shit UI because you seem to be getting a little upset about stuff that seems like the technical side of the site.
Do you prefer dc or marvel, or are you one of those fags reading Chinese picture books
You're embracing defeatism. And you wonder why you are poor and discontent. Its sad really.
>>11643>Arbeit Macht Frei
except it literally doesn't. what you are advocating is not that Arbeit Macht Frei, but that das Kapital Macht Frei
(das Kapital the concept of money-capital, not the book.)
>>11653>implying I read
Only to keep up on local building codes to keep doing what I love.
Yet I had no capital. I was born poor. My parents owned no property or assets, and lived paycheck to paycheck, going bankrupt from not being able to pay the bills. How did I free myself from that?>>11659
Yes you've posted that 3 times now, does it make you feel better about not being successful?
Lurk more you fag. Bunkerchan redirects here now because bunkerchan fucking died the day before that shitty article was published. Now we're stuck with the consequences of d0llars's shitty ploy at "rejuvenating" his site.
After reviewing some of the content, I've honestly come to the conclusion that this site is a unironic lefty-pol: one that openly promotes Communistic ideals while serving as an echo chamber for members of the far left.
>>11665>being proud of being functionally illiterate
>>11664>get the app>for a site that has radical activist transhumanists in positions of power
No thanks man. This place doesn't seem to promote conversations. If I post genuinely seeking one on pol I tend to get at least something but here I've gone through 10 tabs and no actual conversations have even taken off.
I don't trust Hitler's interpretations of his opponents' societies nor do I trust a communist mass murderer.
>>11667>I'm only poor because no one can do what you did and you only did what you did because you got lucky and this Wikipedia article proves it!
I guarantee you I have worked more hours than you have.
You should read more
>>11661>Yet I had no capital
You have-and-had/obtained capital, what you lack is an understanding of what "capital" means, or perhaps of chronology itself.
I think people really underestimate this effect. I found alt right influence on my life to be overwhelmingly positive. I saved up money. I got out of my parents house. I started working out and eating healthier.
Had to drop the Jewish stuff just for sanity’s sake but I’m still glad I found the nazis on the internet. They made my life better.
That's because /pol/ is willing to engage in an actual conversation based on the merits of your ideas. Nothing's truly taboo, and if you're searching for answers, you'll find a wealth to choose from.
It's been less than an hour and I've already witnessed more vitriol and scorn from leftypol than /pol/. While one may be an absolute clusterfuck of content, this is a typical hivemind that attacks anyone going against it's confirmation bias.
>>11669>being proud of reading a small mountain of trash so you can say 'dude trust me my beliefs are superior just read this series of books on it and it'll start to make sense'. That to me is the glorified equivalent of 'dude just watch 7 hours of YouTube videos and then it'll all make sense'.
Something I've noticed in particular so far is that despite a core part of showing you understand your beliefs is to be able to state them in a simple manner that a layman can understand. I've yet to see it.
Steinbeck and Hemingway are personal favorites, but I'm open to suggestions.
>>11672>When you read self-help books with a side of nazi, but credit the nazi for your success
What are you, Mike Cernovich?
>>11661>Yet I had no capital. I was born poor. My parents owned no property or assets, and lived paycheck to paycheck, going bankrupt from not being able to pay the bills. How did I free myself from that?
And? Our analysis of what defines a capitalist isn't an emotional one, you just are or aren't. If a person who is capitalist wants to turn class traitor, thats all fine and great, but that doesn't negate the overall analysis made about capitalism itself. >>11665>implying keeping an open mind and taking the stance of allowing the most liberties and freedoms we can without infringing upon others' abilities to succeed within the system society decided on isn't based
This isn't any capitalist society I've ever heard of, or really how most societies operate in from a practical political perspective.
I figure since I'm mildly in favor of society as it stands I'd be getting called whatever the bunkerchan equivalent of glown*gger is.
>>11679>being proud of being functionally illiterate
>>11679>Something I've noticed in particular so far is that despite a core part of showing you understand your beliefs is to be able to state them in a simple manner that a layman can understand. I've yet to see it.
You. Are. Not. Smartest. Person. Ever.
You. Need. To. Consult. Past. Work. On. Idea.
Other. Smart. People. Exist. And. Have. Existed.
Read. Book. Faggot.
Yeah man, sorry we have too many words here and don't spam wojaks all the time and yell uyghur transhumanist faggot>>11679>Something I've noticed in particular so far is that despite a core part of showing you understand your beliefs is to be able to state them in a simple manner that a layman can understand. I've yet to see it.
My belief is that you should acquaint your head with the pavement and stop wasting air, illiterate cuck.
>>11680>steinbeck>while being this much of a class cuck
lol better and better
>>11682>we define capitalists Objectively>yes we disagree with them>no, that does not mean we are anything less than objective>our feelings have no influence on how we communicate or the paradigms we define things by>that's why to begin an argument we often have to establish definitions
At least in my experiences it seems to go this way.
What will we gain from discussing it with you? What can we possibly say that we wouldn’t have heard before? And what could we possibly say that you'd understand?
But anon Ive seen more wojaks posted directly at me in this last half hour under the pretext I'm a boogieman than I've seen all month.
So you don't really care about convincing other people who don't agree with you or are just curious about what you believe when you can lord superiority over them and not actually say anything to substantiate your stance while still somehow managing to flex?
>>11693>"explain your beliefs please?">They don't>They get mad instead
Do you ever talk about these things in real life or just keep it all on text?
there are people who don't agree who can ask intelligent questions and are worth discussing the matter with even if you're never going to convince them of your stance. you are not one of those people.
I don't really understand the class warfare narrative, it comes off as a misguided attempt to cause division among the low/middle/upper middle American demographics, while accomplishing nothing to further anyone's personal wealth or prosperity.
To hell with class warfare, everyone should recognize that they're responsible for their own livelihoods and not beholden to whatever bracket of wealth they were born into.
I understand this and I still fail to understand what makes it inherently exploitive when the alternative is having no income or expecting it to be a given.
Can someone just reply BBC to the /pol/ fags? I'm about to get groceries so I cant
I have seen no such conversation between opposing opinions in the first two pages of the board so far.
Pretty much how I feel. I think people are just angry and when you're on a splinter of a splinter that evolved out of drama there's potential for some big anger.
We've had literal 500+ debate threads, we even have a thread in the catalog which got up to around 300 post in the last week. It goes nowhere, eventually you end up with either the /pol/yp spamming or anons talking in circles because of a fundamental disagreement on the legitimacy of one crucial component.
So I got capital. How did I do it? I worked hard and saved money. Anyone can do that.>>11677
100%, except the jew part. I deal with jews all day long and they are the most ruthless, scummy and unkind people on the planet. 2nd to only the Chinese.>>11681
Never read any self help books>>11682
Im not a capitalist. I'm a fascist. The only reason I am even in the business that I am in is because it is profitable and I need capital to be able to raise many happy, healthy children and help them overcome this disgusting capitalist, socialist world. The jew world order will erode one day, but if I live in it I am doomed to participate. I would rather emancipate myself than emaciate myself.
No matter which age you live in, hard work will improve your life's circumstances.
Shit sucks but this seems to be what's here on threads in general not just debate ones. It reminds me of high-school debates where people just get hung up on one thing then self destruct and all productivity that could have been gained or a position leveraged just turns into "my shit smells much better than yours and my cock is bigger".
>>11706>Im not a capitalist. I'm a fascist.
This leads me to believe you like Evola, no?
>>11706>How did I do it?
The less you eat, drink and read books; the less you go to the theatre, the dance hall, the public house; the less you think, love, theorize, sing, paint, fence, etc., the more you save-the greater becomes your treasure which neither moths nor dust will devour-your capital. The less you are, the more you have; the less you express your own life, the greater is your alienated life-the greater is the store of your estranged being
>>11699>I don't really understand the class warfare narrative, it comes off as a misguided attempt to cause division among the low/middle/upper middle American demographics, while accomplishing nothing to further anyone's personal wealth or prosperity.>To hell with class warfare, everyone should recognize that they're responsible for their own livelihoods and not beholden to whatever bracket of wealth they were born into.
You retard, were not talking about your arbitrary liberal definitions of "class" here, we are talking about class as defined by ones relation to production and the mechanisms of capitalism as a whole.
wait they were saying retarded? I thought they were saying "Lets get it started in here"
How can you read "Grapes of Wrath" and not understand class warfare?
Alright so we're still taking about class just in such a way we can throw shade at the upper middle class just like they're a top 1%'er?
I think it was an alternate version of the song. "let's get it started" might have been censorship to make the song more appealing. Or maybe the "retarded" version was meant for one of those 2000s parody movies.
>>11706>Im not a capitalist. I'm a fascist. The only reason I am even in the business that I am in is because it is profitable and I need capital to be able to raise many happy, healthy children and help them overcome this disgusting capitalist, socialist world. The jew world order will erode one day, but if I live in it I am doomed to participate. I would rather emancipate myself than emaciate myself.
Anon, you are a capitalist. Being a "fascist" doesn't make you not a capitalist, if anything it just makes you more so. Your system and this system is system doomed to crisis, whatever way you slice it. >No matter which age you live in, hard work will improve your life's circumstances
Where did I state I was against hard work? Hard work is fine, and people should be made to work as workers. Including you.
>>11677>I started working out and eating healthier.
Worth noting that I yell at the young ones here about this etc and was yelling the same thing at the young ones back before the ancient board split between /leftypol/ and /pol/
fwiw I was always communist lefty/pol/ never a Nazi
Also now that you've gotten the basics covered have a read through Stalin's shortcourse https://archive.org/details/historycpsushortcourse
Both comrade Xi and Mao studied it diligently and they became the most powerful men on earth
>>11715>cult of personality >also obsessed with bbc
Never read any, to be frank. The lightning and the Sun is probably the most liberating book I've read.>>11710
You don't have to abstain from enjoyment to be successful. Right now I'm about to head for a walk down the beach followed by beers and Gelato with my wife and our dog. Every morning I work out and once a week or so I even play some vidya.
It is originally "retarded", meaning fucked up, and the radio version is "get it started"
>>11706> No matter which age you live in, hard work will improve your life's circumstances.
lol> The only reason I am even in the business that I am in is because it is profitable and I need capita
What business are you in, and while a pedantic point money != capital stop using the two interchangeably it makes you look stupid.
>>11714>Alright so we're still taking about class just in such a way we can throw shade at the upper middle class just like they're a top 1%'er?
No, we are talking about class in a way not defined arbitrarily by the number in a person's account, but by a person's relation to production and the mechanisms of capitalism.
One's relation to production for society has absolutely nothing to do with class, unless you're discussing Communism and not Capitalism.>>11714
That seems to be the case based on this post's lengthy preamble. Disparaging the upper middle class comes off as an envious and fruitless endeavor; every American has the ability to achieve an "upper middle class" income within their lifetimes, but holding them in contempt for the success accomplishes nothing.
The majority of Americans are already within the global 1% of earners, it's something to be humbled by rather than resentful towards. There's nothing wrong with highlighting class inequities, unless you're end-state is to eradicate the system entirely.
>>11721>No matter which age you live in, hard work will improve your life's circumstances.>lol
How can you even argue this? Every commie i know shows up to a 9-5 job, barely works, and comes home to a messy house to order skip the dishes. They are communists because they are fundamentally lazy under achievers.
As mentioned earlier my business is commercial lending, insurance and corporate tax planning.
>>11724>One's relation to production for society has absolutely nothing to do with class, unless you're discussing Communism and not Capitalism.
Did you know marx footnotes the shit out of Adam Smith? He was talking about capitalism, buddy.
think you two meant to reply to someone else
Now imagine you hold different beliefs and someone just said the last 3 things you've said to us, to you. Does it sound like now the business owner you actually have the means to become if you're dirt poor and have nothing when you were raised up has been conflated with the elites that usually fuck things up through lobbying and abusing how detached a CEO like Bezos is from his workers as compared to a franchise owner or small business owner?
You're right, my mistake.
I can’r speak for anyone else, but I’m not.
Empirically speaking, “debates” do not change opinions. At least not of the people debating. There’s better praxis that people can do, although talking about praxis on an imageboard is laughable.
And besides that, who the fuck do you think you are? The resources are available if you want to educate yourself and not just shitpost. Just crack open “Capital.”
Can you repeat this but in english?
I’ll check it out. Also the alt right got me reading books.
What do you think of the national social Democrats from Vietnam? They seem like a really good political party but I’m just not that familiar with what they actually believe.
>>11725> Every commie i know
How do you know they’re commies, anon?
Have you heard of the phrase “my boss makes a dollar…”
Your anecdotes are worthless anon, and we have to first define what you mean by commie since it's clear you have low verbal iq and struggle with proper definitions.
Also it's ironic you are spending your sunday shitposting on a board that doesn't want you here while complaining about lazy workers.
Because they are loud about it. I'm talking about explicit communists who share Stalin memes on Facebook and unironically yell at people to read marx. Not every under achiever is a communist.
I disagree with this take for the very reason it dismisses criticism and ends on a footnote of 'read a book uygha' which is about as spineless as it comes. I believe people who arent truly at their core disagreeable and ignorant remain open to the arguments and positions presented before them then evolve around it even if the arguments and positions are contributed in an environment where the goal is to win, such as a court.>>11731
Imagine you don't have the definition of class you hold in your head right now.
Imagine your only sense of relativity has come from the reality around you.
Imagine now you hear because of the mechanisms of capitalism and production, the gas station owner down the street is just as detached and exploiting of his employees as Amazon, Walmart, Target, etc.
Does it seem like you have been presented a convincing argument or one that amounts to "How dare you seek to elevate yourself"?
Every fascist I know doesn't have a job and lies online about how they make bank trading shitcoins.
Debates can easily sway opinions if you can provide enough evidence to leave an audience doubting their own beliefs.
Hardcore leftists have changed my perspective on wealth in America through debates. Originally I was a strong proponent of Rand and Objectivism, through compelling argument they proved many of the top 1% manipulate legislation to entrap citizens into a down-spiral of cyclical debt, while enriching themselves through fraudulent methods. Wall Street stands as grand testament to regulatory corruption.
I'm willing to listen to the merits of anyone's argument, as long as they abstain from absolutism and extremism. Unfortunately /pol/ is one of the rare outlets in which politically incorrect ideas can flourish as they would normally be vehemently censored on virtually any other platform.
>>11734>it's clear you have low verbal iq
When I'm examining literal communists who espouse communism and marx, its not semantic.
Explain police and your landlord.
>>11740>Doesn’t have a job
Did we stutter?
Most people don't open espouse fascism because its not socially permitted. You can put a commie flag on your jewbook profile picture and not get banned
So you don't actually know these commies you mentioned, and this is just a larp.
My landlord is a Biden voter. Good point with the cops, but I don't know any.
The specific people I am thinking of are ex co workers who I have on my jewbook, but generally any commie I meet is similar.
>>11738>as long as they abstain from absolutism and extremism
t. Liberal who thinks his position is something thats neutral, objective and not something thats inculcated into him since birth by a society meant to reflect the values of the individuals that control it.
Any fascist you've met exclusively online is more than likely a Larp.
I've known 2 self-professed "fascists" in person. They were both health nuts, that held an inflexible contempt for obesity.
Yeah makes sense. You're a self described fascist I've only met online also larping as a business owner. Only true thing you've posted so far.
>debates don't change people's minds
This just means you're shit at debating son I recommend Aristotle's Rhetoric, some Nargarjuna, some Mo (his turn of phrase "It's not that I don't like the sound of the drums" is a mmasterful rhetorical move) and to listen to an audio reading of the first chapter of Marx's Capital to improve your skills in this area
You're thinking of me, for some reason your shitty politics board doesn't have IDs.
Definitely not neutral. Objective within reason. To believe anyone is a collection of societal values is as fatally flawed as Skinner's tabula rasa perspective.
the based department was overmanned that day
>he likes ids
I’m reading through capital. The idea of comparing value to the concept of the weight of a sugarloaf was honestly mind blowing for me.
If you think a book written by a man whos never worked in his life and was funded by a rich factory owner is convincing, you are a very highly suggestible person
Sure you’re not, anon, sure you’re not.
It sounds like it's pretty reductionist but I'm beginning to see a theme tied to it.
Don't tell him you know your history. He'll start reflecting and stop posting soon as the sense of false superiority gets crushed.
He was a journalist and labor organizer but I know you will retroactively decide that's not work, so instead just read a book or Kys.
Get a room, you two
>>11724>One's relation to production for society has absolutely nothing to do with class, unless you're discussing Communism and not Capitalism.
Where the fuck do you think you are? Yes, we are advocating for communism.>That seems to be the case based on this post's lengthy preamble. Disparaging the upper middle class comes off as an envious and fruitless endeavor; every American has the ability to achieve an "upper middle class" income within their lifetimes, but holding them in contempt for the success accomplishes nothing. >The majority of Americans are already within the global 1% of earners, it's something to be humbled by rather than resentful towards. There's nothing wrong with highlighting class inequities, unless you're end-state is to eradicate the system entirely.
This isn't about income or envy you pseud, its about relations to production. An engineer who makes $100,000 a year is still very much a prole.
>>11762>ran a newspaper
That he got funded by his rich friends that he defrauded lol>organized labour union
So a jew being jewy and not working but finding a way for others to pay for him to sit around and do nothing
Thanks for filling me in that he was self-employed, anon. Sounds like he has a very honest and unbiased take on agreeing to offer a service and your time in exchange for something through a mutual agreement.
every single person in this thread is being way too abrasive, maybe the americans should go to sleep
>>11766>lefty memes>textwalls you're expected to take at face value>probably just an excerpt from a book or Wikipedia
Jesus christ its real…
I missed that note, anon actually said marx worked but only by implying he was a petite bourgeoisie.
>>11771>expected to take at face value
Why is reading too much to ask on a politics forum?
>>11732>What do you think of the national social Democrats from Vietnam? They seem like a really good political party but I’m just not that familiar with what they actually believe.
No idea first time I've ever heard of then there's a south east asia general where you can ask the locals if you want a definitive response
Shit I didn't care enough about the discrepancy to realize it but you're right. Good fucking god.
You don’t have to take Marx’s word for the things he’s written. They’re literally grounded in classical economics and anthropology to an extent as well.
Marx and Engels weren’t just political theorists, they were pioneers of the field of Social Science.
>>11766>Where the fuck do you think you are? Yes, we are advocating for communism.
First time here, I try to abstain from calling every lefty a Communist off the bat.>An engineer who makes $100,000 a year is still very much a prole.
An industrial wage earners who, possessing neither capital nor production means, earns their living by selling their labor to achieve a satisfactory income to achieve prosperity for their family is the fundamental core of the American Dream.
Because trickery is required to promote it
He was keenly aware that his field was contingent on the rest of society, and cared about the vast majority who labored under employment in worse circumstances. The same can't be said for the asspained burgers in this thread who can't read. >>11772
Are all journalists self employed? Also being self employed doesn't mean petit bourgeois, it's an artisan in Marxist terminology.
No they weren't. They have no bearing on sociology nor social psychology.
It seems grounded in ideology and repeatedly fails due to no fault of its own when put to the test.
>>11728>Now imagine you hold different beliefs and someone just said the last 3 things you've said to us, to you. Does it sound like now the business owner you actually have the means to become if you're dirt poor and have nothing when you were raised up has been conflated with the elites that usually fuck things up through lobbying and abusing how detached a CEO like Bezos is from his workers as compared to a franchise owner or small business owner?
That's an emotional argument, not an argument based on analyzing the system in its totality. How did CEO's like Bezos even become a possibility? In what way does ownership of production relate to the value created by the worker? You are making points based on trying to make me fell "bad" or "good" regarding a circumstance, but that doesn't change the economic relations themselves and how the workers labour power is exploited to create surplus value for the capitalist.
>>11779>reading is kike trickery
I wish this was the first time a nazi has made this argument, but it's not
It's almost as bad as being told you're subconsciously biased against certain ethnicity due to "Institutional / Systemic Racism"
Are you claiming your arguments are entirely detached from emotion? I think you don't live by your principles or don't care about having effective messaging because it took you all that time to ultimately simply not just agree to disagree but do a mental flip on why everything is perfectly conductive and the argument is in fact strong, I'm just being emotional and so is anyone else who doesn't see eye to eye with your argument.
Is this supposed to be a gothca?
>>11780>Are all journalists self employed? Also being self employed doesn't mean petit bourgeois, it's an artisan in Marxist terminology.
Either way he stated his newspaper by literally defrauding his friends. He actively spent his life pursuing NOT working. He was a parasite, like all jews are.
More of an agreement that decrying knowledge as a meaningless pursuit is typically espoused by the worst ideological zealots.
>>11736>Does it seem like you have been presented a convincing argument or one that amounts to "How dare you seek to elevate yourself"?
Is his argument true or false? Whether its convincing or makes me feels distressed doesn't matter. Is what he is stating true? How is critiquing the system itself a statement condemning people to destitution? If anything, communists are asking people to elevate themselves, but in a consequential way.
And where did you get the idea that anyone itt fits your strawman?
I really don't want to be that guy posting "cope" so I will instead say I think we disagree on a fundamental level that will leave us in one of those debate thread cycles until one of us gets it through our head we just have very very different principles and beliefs from them.
How do you defraud someone who agrees with you and voluntarily contributes to your work?
You fail to understand that you redefine class in a way nobody cares about because it has no bearing on their reality then state it in such a way you have identified 'little people' and angry ants as being your enemy because they are driven to participate in society as it stands.
Not a single argument against the theory itself it seems.
>>11790>sociologists have not always agreed about its relevance
ok. Thanks for letting me know.
>>11771>probably just an excerpt from a book or Wikipedia
No, its just typed. Can you not read?
O hai explain to me why the USA education system is so garbage?>>11717
←- also me
To give you a sense of the calibre of the response I'm expecting since it's my day off work and you amuse me
>>11778>An industrial wage earners who, possessing neither capital nor production means, earns their living by selling their labor to achieve a satisfactory income to achieve prosperity for their family is the fundamental core of the American Dream.
How is this an argument? Why should I care for the "American" dream?
>>11797>say something that comes across as fundamentally retarded from being so far detached from reality and into your personal beliefs doesn't seem reasonable>Explain why but without coming off as a fartsniffer>"heh all adhoms I see"
I think I see a theme and it's very disappointing.
Honestly, you're right. There's no point wasting time on a dead board debating fucking Communism.
Sick burn now leave the board
My theory is work sets you free. Your theory is gibs me dat fo free.
It doesn't take an intellectual to figure out who will have the more successful life
There are lots of reasons, but it started out as a way to standardize people, and teach them how to function in factories, since that was where everyone worked. It was a factory to produce factory workers. Not applicable to today. Then there's desegregation and common core, modern problems of which is a whole other story
I think it's garbage because it teaches memorization and jumping through hoops rather than critical thinking, so you wind up with academics that create their own definitions then to actually argue with the broader community at large has to scream about their own meaning of words and beliefs to even get past setting the stage to make an argument.
>hmm, today I am 16 and I want to debate the validity of marxism
"He who does not work will not eat">t. some guy
>>11786>Are you claiming your arguments are entirely detached from emotion? I think you don't live by your principles or don't care about having effective messaging because it took you all that time to ultimately simply not just agree to disagree but do a mental flip on why everything is perfectly conductive and the argument is in fact strong, I'm just being emotional and so is anyone else who doesn't see eye to eye with your argument.
Well, you haven't provided any actual concrete argument against Marx in this thread, you've just given hypotheticals like "Oh, but what would you think if you weren't a Marxist?" or "X person lived this life, is it really right to say he's Y?". So yeah, your arguments are emotional.
>>11806>My theory is work sets you free. Your theory is gibs me dat fo free.
One has to work to build fully automated luxury space communism before we get star trek level free shit for all lad
>>11810>When all you aspire for in communism to be able to eat but you starve to death anyway
>>11796>You fail to understand that you redefine class in a way nobody cares about because it has no bearing on their reality then state it in such a way you have identified 'little people' and angry ants as being your enemy because they are driven to participate in society as it stands.
How does it have no bearing in regards to reality? Its an objective economic relation.
Gee maybe it's because I'm arguing with you and your fundamental ideas that you've deriven from the writing of someone else and now biblethump. I wonder why you don't engage in a manner that even attempts to come across as genuine.
Paul the apostle. Also John Smith.
I don't think you know what objective is and if you do I think you're so far up your own beliefs with zero regard or consideration to anything contradictory to such an extent how you convey yourself no longer registers in your donkeybrains.
What kind of fascist reads Stephen Jay Gould?
The one who wants to debunk it I'm guessing.
there’s even Thomas Paine. No way a leftist didn’t make this chart
>>11806>My theory is work sets you free.
do you ever reflect on the fact that you're using a slogan most commonly associated with concentration camps, which had no intention of letting the people within them go free?
Its the most fundamental principal of fascism. The harder you work, the more prosperous you are. The more people that work harder, the more prosperous we all are.
It's the polar opposite of communism which is to make everyone equal. You can only make people equal by bringing everyone down to a common denominator. You can't make everyone run a 9 second 100m. But you can make everyone roll across in a wheelchair.
>>11802>say something that comes across as fundamentally retarded from being so far detached from reality and into your personal beliefs doesn't seem reasonable>Explain why but without coming off as a fartsniffer
You didn't do this though, you just agreed with another anon that Marx was a certain way, and thus he's not to be taken seriously. Which would be a laughable assertion for a whole slew of philosophers and economists. Make an actual argument.
>>11822>never came to understand what they really mean by DA JOOS
Lol I'm saving this one
>>11806>Your theory is gibs me dat fo free.
Who said this?
>>11817>engage with the "arguments" that have been explained hundreds of times already>DEBATE ME
Read a fucking book already, your anti-intellectualism is legitimately disturbing.
Everyone should dig ditches with spoons, they'll be more prosperous because it's harder to dig a ditch with a spoon than machinery. Working hard == gooder.
Correct. I believe someone with a history of self-employment and writing propagandist pieces is a very poor person to form your modern opinion of the workforce around regardless of which name you'd like to bring to the table that can be accurately described in such a way. Reminder I don't read but Bakunin would be ashamed.
>>11826>Communism is about making people equal
Somebody hasn’t read critique of the gotha program.
According to capitalism, the lazier workers are worth more, because they exert less labor.
Therefore, they make the same as someone who works hard.
Clearly, capitalism will set us free.
>>11830>people who can't state their beliefs in a simple concise manner are intellectuals>those who are pulling teeth to get someone to do that then engaging are anti-intellectual
This is your brain on social bubble communism.
Since when does hard work = inefficient work?
your name drop makes no sense. bakunin was a fucking aristocrat.> Reminder I don't read
yea we figured
>>11826>Its the most fundamental principal of fascism. The harder you work, the more prosperous you are. The more people that work harder, the more prosperous we all are.
But that's not how any fascist economy worked at all. In fact, most fascist economies had wages for workers reduce overall while major business were provided state subsidy. >It's the polar opposite of communism which is to make everyone equal. You can only make people equal by bringing everyone down to a common denominator. You can't make everyone run a 9 second 100m. But you can make everyone roll across in a wheelchair.
Communism isn't about making people equal, and Marx decries the concept of egalitarianism inn Critique of the Gotha Program, as well as Engels in his letters. Can you even name me a single socialist state which mandated people be made "equal" in all things?
>>11837>Bakunin would be ashamed
It's almost as if stroking some sad sadists' egos brought them out of the woodwork with the whole not reading thing.
>>11832>If I attack the author it’ll destroy their ideas without me having to understand what those ideas were
Marx didn’t pull his critique of capital out of the air. It’s based fundamentally upon assessing the classical economics of Ricardo and Smith, with a little bit of Aristotle as well. As for the dialectical method that he used, it was an inversion of the one made by Hegel.
Do you believe your interpretation to be objective and free of emotion too?
>>11832>Correct. I believe someone with a history of self-employment and writing propagandist pieces is a very poor person to form your modern opinion of the workforce around regardless of which name you'd like to bring to the table that can be accurately described in such a way. Reminder I don't read but Bakunin would be ashamed.
But you didn't actually argue against the economic analysis itself, you just character attacked Marx (not even accurately I might add). A large number of economists at the time survived on other forms of income besides employment like inheritance, its not an argument.
"Most fascist economies"
But Hitler Germany was the most prosperous nation i the world that took the entire British empire, Soviet empire and American empire to stop it. If wages dropped by dollar values tripled what does that imply about standards of living? Virtually everyone in nazi Germany OWNED a home
tankie flag delivers the good webms as usual
>>11844>Nazis conveniently forgetting about all their allies and thinking that the Reich went at it alone.
Can I see some citations for your statistics?
I disagree with his interpretation of how a system that he personally felt exploited by is inherently and in an organized, widespread, oppressive manner exploiting all within the system short of those with capital. I believe capitalism is a strong enough system and meritocracy that you have the opportunity to leave behind more in life than you began with and offer a better run to your progenies.
Still not quite sure what you believe beyond work bad, employers bad, trust government to allocate it right because 'the workers' are going to have an elected body that is less equal than the rest as every instance of it in practice demonstrates. It also seems like Communism is weak and vulnerable to outside subversion since it often falls to no fault of its own.
Regardless though, you convey yourself in a manner that alienates the average Joe and worker that wants to keep their head down and lead a good life. It's like you kneecap yourself before the race.
1. wages stagnated under the Nazis
2. Germany has never been a nation with high home ownership rates.
>>11835>"heh you must be able to explain difficult concepts in five words for my simple mind to understand, while I constantly barrage you with generic anti-communist arguments that have been answered already elsewhere, which I would find out if I bothered to read a book."
Wake up retard, Germany was in decline since 1933. They were rationing food since 1938. British and french were already limiting both grain and machinery exports, and Germany was HUNGRY. They took over France, and french agrarian production collapsed to 20% of pre-war production, because Britain stopped supplying machinery. The only time nazis lifted rationing was after 1942 harvests they stole from Ukraine.
Now when someone else gives their opinion and starts namedropping seemingly to pull an academic flex what makes them less convincing than you other than you believing they not only believe the wrong thing but fundamentally misunderstand things your preferred authors have defined?
>>11844>But Hitler Germany was the most prosperous nation i the world
Lol no. Literally had to stave off starvation by requesting grain imports from the Soviets. >that took the entire British empire, Soviet empire and American empire to stop it.
With the entirety of the Axis on its side, which allowed it to outnumber the Soviets in the vast majority of battles during the offensive into the USSR. Declaring war on the USSR while in the middle of war against Britain and France isn't exactly a badge of honor either anon. >Virtually everyone in nazi Germany OWNED a home
So did everyone in the USSR after industrialization and reconstruction you fag.
Is online fash still a thing? The MAGA magic is gone. We're in covid world now, and the fash aren't going to stop what is essentially a fascist lockdown, because fascists always suck up to power.
Anon, it's basic knowledge a sign of intelligence and grasping concepts is the ability to state their beliefs in a concise and easy to understand manner. I'm beginning to really lean into the farthuffing being prevalent around here from seeing many conversations on this board thrown into a brick wall seemingly deliberately introduced to try to shut down conversation.
this term was coined by a man who believed it was a bad thing that would lead to a society (much like the one we live in, funnily enough) lead by a gang of self-appointed meritocrats who would define "merit" in line with their own narrow educational preferences and who would be insatiably greedy and selfish, since they were told that they owed their position not to their father or to luck, but to their own overabundance of merit. (and as an equal and opposite opposing force, the suffering of those at the bottom is also justifiable. they are, after all, by definition people with no merit!)
>wants to """"debate"""" communism
>doesnt even know essential history
>doesnt even know essential philosophical figures or movements
While that is true, to the layman and average person who isn't politically invested what does that matter when to them you're saying you shouldn't earn from the merit of your actions and effort while also arguing in favor of communism? What have you done to yourself through how you conveyed yourself?
We’re not an org. If you wanna know how communists do praxis, it’s by going outside and actually organizing action.
>>11860>pragmatism is when you sperg out for 200 posts and refusing to read long blocks of text
You killed 4chan.
There's nothing more ideological than the 'common sense
' of the masses. At least smart fascists read Nietzsche.
We’re not interested in wasting energy with a debatefag who won’t even bother to do a cliffnotes reading on the opposition.
Not the person you're responding to but this specter or abstraction of "the average person" is a ridiculous mirage. Either argue for something or not, don't pretend play like your the arbiter of what a normie is.
If you want to argue the present system is meritorious, or that a different system that is actually meritorious is desirable, argue as such. You are here, so you are not "average" and we don't expect "average" people to show up and autistically argue in this thread for hours.
>>11848>I disagree with his interpretation of how a system that he personally felt exploited by is inherently and in an organized, widespread, oppressive manner exploiting all within the system short of those with capital.
But it does, purely by the numbers.>Still not quite sure what you believe beyond work bad, employers bad, trust government to allocate it right because 'the workers' are going to have an elected body that is less equal than the rest as every instance of it in practice demonstrates.
Who said work bad? You keep making this assertion. And why have employers when you can just have computer based central planning? And again, socialism isn't about equality, I don't understand where you get this idea. Its not about everyone being the same in "hierarchy".>It also seems like Communism is weak and vulnerable to outside subversion since it often falls to no fault of its own.
Revolutionary governments were fine when they were as voracious and aggressive as their opposition, and only faltered when they came to believe that there was time to wait.
>>11859>you're saying you shouldn't earn from the merit of your actions and effort
1. Look at China and the amount of private businesses they have, heck, they even allowed billionaires. How's that "shouldn't earn from the merit of your actions"?
2. Capitalists are parasites, landlords are parasites, stock market players are parasites. Go to average Joe and ask him what he thinks of those people, try to persuade him that capitalist or landlord work as hard as Joe does and get laughed right in your face
Where do I get my bricks at the local BLM protest so we can stick it to the man while blacks take the flak?>>11862
No, I post like this here because I thought I would get discussion unlike 4chan where you piss into the sea of piss and have a giggle.>>11863
Notice how I did not mention it but you did. Beyond that, I don't think common sense is an argument to make when I can instead ask you what practical purpose your ideology presents to people who seek to live by their own merits and stick to their own lane? Why might that tie into the system remaining vastly ideological rather than practiced?
>>11571> I wore a CCCP t shirt and voted for Trudeau.
Thanks anon I actually laughed out loud.
Go to average Joe with a career. You'll get mad at what they have and fail to realize your system seeks to tear down the little people who have built themselves up in order to stick it to the rich and powerful. Give them one instance of the new people not ultimately treating those they promised utopia to winding up treating those people as a disposable casualty of the state.
That's a lot of words to say you're simply retarded. Take a nice trip down an open elevator shaft.
it is often better to convince people to hate their smug meritocrat overlords and see appeals to "meritocracy" for what they are than it is to convince them of the merits of communism.
(not as part of any ingenious long-term communist scheme to overthrow the meritocracy, but instead because of the relative position of the two ideas - there are already plenty of communists for the level of organization they are at, what communists need is not recruitment but structure - meanwhile, far too few people know about the history and structure of the meritocracy.)
If you want to know about fascist economics, you're living in them. That's what neoliberalism is, fascist economics, and China claiming that it's socialist because they use the word "People's" a lot doesn't make it anything other than the same shit in most of the world - workers in barracks and power in the hands of an oligarchy. It won't be long until the political system matches the economic system.
>>11868>No, I post like this here because I thought I would get discussion unlike 4chan where you piss into the sea of piss and have a giggle.
Yeah.. This board is pretty fast as far as spin offs go, but still much slower than 4chan.
Seriously, people will have month long debates with pages of text and sources and pdf sources. https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1913/mar/x01.htm
This is a pretty short introductory text on what most people refer to when we say communism.
Please note: there is nothing about ethnic struggle or cultural marxism or any of that crap
>>11866>Why have the human dynamic to forming contracts when you can be micromanaged by the government's DeepMind?
I just keep finding more to disagree with on a humanities level.
I'm saying your pragmatism is nothing more than ideology, which is perfectly summed up in scales covering your eyes statements like: > people who seek to live by their own merits and stick to their own lane
as if such a thing is possible
All memes aside I did a fair amount of reading in my 20s and I forgot most of it but what I recall overall was that it was a system that waves an agreeable banner while offering the state a massive amount of power to micromanage the lives of the little people. With people tending to be pretty shitty, giving them more power to micromanage seems to be the root of the downfall over and over again. The board may also be quite slow because population is very low.
You don’t. You make molotovs at home. Or better yet, bring a shield or water bottles for yourself and others. If you have extra goggles or gas masks or protective gear, hand those out to your fellow protesters. Bring a first aid kit and know how to use it.
I don't think I'm purely ideology when you're the one insisting the pragmatism of others and what they feel to be practical down to the very definitions of class defined to them over their lifespan participating in class and then accusing people who don't see eye to eye with your arguments which are pure of emotional influence and implied bias as being emotional. I'm sorry.
>>11868>Notice how I did not mention it but you did. Beyond that, I don't think common sense is an argument to make when I can instead ask you what practical purpose your ideology presents to people who seek to live by their own merits and stick to their own lane? Why might that tie into the system remaining vastly ideological rather than practiced?
You practically mentioned it in all your arguments by constantly referring to how our points may be received. The point of superseding capitalism is that it is the only consequential option available, as any other option is inevitable crisis and the maintaining of the contradictions of the system until either its breakdown results in revolution or the mutual ruin of the classes. The rate of profit is not an infinitely propped up thing, it will continue to fall. And if that's not a good enough reason, then at the very least people can act to reclaim the time taken from them by the mechanisms of the system.
like hideo kojima made an entire game recently ruthlessly mocking and humbling any clown that believes tey are truly independent. Or you know pick any film or art movement in the 20th century and you'll see the same critique show up again and again. Your pragmatism is the sewer run off of a capitalist system ardently propped up by its most feckless neophytes.>>11880
What happened to forming 'concise and simple' arguments, because this is meaningless.
>>11878>communism is when the government does stuff>muh human nature>communism always fails>the free market will decide best
Yeah, you read ancap literature, amazing, we are all very impressed. Surely nobody has ever considered these ingenious arguments before.
What do I achieve by participating in something whose mere presence makes bystanders board up windows and leave, after which the community itself enters economic stagnation from the volatility driving away businesses and scumbag businesses that ultimately don't feel the pain while the community and homegrown establishments rot?
If I was racist I guess at least I get to make BLM look like they're destroying towns I guess.
>>11871<me telling you that no, we do not want to exproriate average Joe's wealth, quite the opposite really>you telling me that I should go to the average Joe and tell him that I want to exproriate his wealth
How often did your mother dropped you head-first onto the ground?
Can you provide documentation of instances where this happening?
>>11882>getting into my semantics with me but engaging in good faith makes you look bad
You forgot to post a chud.
>>11876>I just keep finding more to disagree with on a humanities level.
Why would I want continual periods of crisis and collapse when you could have stability and sustainability? What good are "contracts" (which doesn't even describe the actual relations of the economy) when they result in the decomposition of the dynamic you talk about?
Not documentation, catamite.
>>11886>me telling you to how you convey yourself to someone who doesn't share the same opinions as you matters<you implying no such thing is happening at all and if it were to it is not even worth paying mind to or questioning
Were you born with your head up your ass or was it a nurture and nature thing?
>>11891>lawyers that focus on bailing out protestors didn't happen>the vast majority of BLM protests were peaceful though the ones people traveled afar to turn to flames>bricks show up before riots kick off
Good thing none of this is readily available right?
So, you do agree that average Joe hates your fascist guts? My claim is that average Joe is my ally, and I specifically stated that I WILL NOT expropriate average Joe's wealth, only porky's.
To recap> when cornered you become needlessly wordy and anxious> your pragmatism is propaganda and made fun of by nearly every art movement in history
Please finish high school before trying to debate anyone again
Literally still major economic hubs. The actual places economically suffering aren't anywhere near such places, its in the dried up hinterlands with abandoned strip malls and food deserts.
What the former sounds like is communism as proven by it in practice while stability and individual merit comes hand in hand from capitalism. Yeah, people will exploit the system. I challenge you to find one people won't. This system however, has become the gold standard for stability and the means to elevate your state of being.
Can you document the major economic depression caused by the (very based) riots, you illiterate corpse?
>>11897>by it in practice while stability and individual merit comes hand in hand from capitalism
Compare China and USA. Seethe.
Do you speak russian?
Are you projecting? When you guys get cornered you start throwing out adhoms while simultaneously shunning other people for their own. From the get-go I've been engaging in good faith though while feigning inferiority and also mentioning I've been on 4chan a long time. Look at all the egos it brought out of the woodwork whose opinions are truly objective.
Can you draw an inference whendozems of thousands of jobs leave a city and have no intent to come back despite it being an economic hub? I'm leaning towards yes but you will pretend not to be because instead of concede on anything basic you're invincible and infallible.
>>11902> whendozems of thousands of jobs leave a city and have no intent to come back despite it being an economic hub?
Again, documentation please.
So many businesses around where I lived also closed down, but that’s because of the pandemic.
And I'm not Russian so the government doesn't take 85%+ of my wages.>>11899
But I'm not Chinese so I don't live in a system where I can't even say mean things about my government online lest they strip my opportunity and human rights away in an irl shadowban.
>>11897>What the former sounds like is communism as proven by it in practice while stability and individual merit comes hand in hand from capitalism. Yeah, people will exploit the system. I challenge you to find one people won't. This system however, has become the gold standard for stability and the means to elevate your state of being.
This system literally runs into crisis every decade, with said crises decreasing in their distance from one another as time moves forward. In what way was individual merit not rewarded in the USSR as well? You keep talking about "elevation", but "elevation" in what context? As a worker in society elevating his community and himself, or as someone ripping into his own community to stay afloat?
Are you telling me there are no press releases from major establishments such as Target that announced withdrawal expressly because of how the riots were handled and have no intent to move back in?
A tangent but did you know small first generation business owners are not only the largest portion of uninsured businesses, but that insurance doesn't cover civil unrest?
>>11725>As mentioned earlier my business is commercial lending, insurance and corporate tax planning
fucking lmao @ the concept of you doing work. Send another email you lazy fucking parasite, or better yet go get a real job
А я говорю по-русски. Go ask the Russians how they feel about capitalism and, regarding the ones who lived through it, how they felt about the Union.
Is the USSR still around? How about the other soviet iteration? Cambodians? The closest thing to communism still functioning today is the last widely known tyrannical and isolationist regime with poor technology in relation to the rest of the modern world.
>>11901>Are you projecting? When you guys get cornered you start throwing out adhoms while simultaneously shunning other people for their own. From the get-go I've been engaging in good faith though while feigning inferiority and also mentioning I've been on 4chan a long time. Look at all the egos it brought out of the woodwork whose opinions are truly objective.
You did none of this. You literally refused to actually address the arguments put forward, and instead offered up hypotheticals about the reception of certain points by working people. And you brought up ad homs way before anyone here did.
Putin said "The heartless do not miss the soviet union. The brainless wish to see it again".
mfw this is good-faith posting to a pol user
I’m asking you to find them for me. To do the actual work of confirming your assertions.
As for those businesses? Fuck’em. They’d otherwise either get bought out/outcompeted by bigger ones or become the bigger ones themselves. At least the former’ll proletarianize.
I tried to tell you where communication breakdown like what happens in debate threads might be occurring especially if you ever actually tried expressing your beliefs to someone irl. I think I understand why I see a lot of 'you can't talk about your beliefs irl' throughout the board because people who are that socially maladapted and possibly actually autistic really shouldn't and it can't go anywhere good.
>>11911>"ask the Russians">quotes one rich man from Russia
Sounds about the level of intellectual rigor from a moronic insurance leech. Once again you should go get a real job, you ignorant and lazy little niglet
Putin, the guy who buddies up with oil oligarchs and has a palace in Crimea. Sure he doesn’t miss the union.
>>11906>Are you telling me there are no press releases from major establishments such as Target that announced withdrawal expressly because of how the riots were handled and have no intent to move back in?
Then they'll just get replaced by a company who seizes the opportunity to establish themselves in the area, and obtain the unrealized profits in what is an economic hud. >A tangent but did you know small first generation business owners are not only the largest portion of uninsured businesses, but that insurance doesn't cover civil unrest?
And? By the merits of your system, they should be readily replaced by other competitive small business owners with capital. Always be ready to work, right?
Guess its better than it used to he.>>11914
You're setting arbitrary guidelines to argue within when we've already established we have such a massive difference in our fundamental beliefs that we will never see eye to eye. Why do you think I might just stand stand ground instead of moving into your semantics game?
>>11919> when we've already established we have such a massive difference in our fundamental beliefs that we will never see eye to eye.
And yet you persist. You don’t have any actual evidence, do you?
>>11904>But I'm not Chinese so I don't live in a system where I can't even say mean things about my government online lest they strip my opportunity and human rights away in an irl shadowban.
China has highspeed rails, 60% of all world's highspeed rail. Obama in 2010 has tried to build some, and NONE was built yet. Trump tried to reimport LD screen production back to America, where is it? Same will happen to semiconductors. China will build her own space station by 2022, it already sent up there the core module.
>>11909>Is the USSR still around? How about the other soviet iteration?
It not being around doesn't change the escalating crises of capitalism. In my view, the USSR's issue was that it didn't go nearly far enough in centralizing production once prior forms of algorithm had run their course. >DPRK>Tyrannical
Lol. Sometimes I wish the DPRK were the "monstrous" regime liberals make it out to be.
This is an imageboard anon, grow a thicker skin. No one going to try and convince people in this style outside, because this "style" isn't about being convincing, its about being frank about ones views. I'm not here to sell you something or flavor my words in a certain way, I'm here to state my views and pursue what I see as the truth.
Let me take a step back. I don't post on pol and I don't particularly care about politics but in my brief brushes with people from this board they have promised more good faith conversation than is had on 4chan, or they're posting some really stupid inflammatory shit.
I'm trying to genuinely engage in conversation strictly from my viewpoint of really not caring about ideology of politics so much as how they work in practice and around me. I'm seeing a common theme where people here 'sniff their own farts' in the sense what might be a rather radical take to the wider populace is pushed and normalized through whataboutisms that despite not liking common sense arguments when made against you or even alluded to (suspicious), you will turn right around and make them in your own favor. Those are flimsy principles to be ignored because theyre so far into ideology they will literally and not figuratively have any impact on a stable society short of it becoming destabilized.
I don't care about you asking me to invest 40 hours into what you believe for it all to click.
I don't care you flaunt your big wrinkly brain with namedrops.
I don't care you promise me a unicorn.
I don't care you call me names because that's a good way to agree to disagree.
But I wanted to pick your brains for your beliefs and it seems like soon as you got a hint of your words being able to imply other beliefs you hold things got really nasty. If I learned anything from this it's that this was not the promised land instead of another idpol heavy subreddit minus the upvotes.
I frankly believe these beliefs people espouse regarding a system that regularly fails are retarded, to be frank.
>>11919>Guess its better than it used to he.
The USSR literally didn't have an income tax around the time of Brezhnev, it didn't need one.
In west bengal the communist party brought land reform and electricity. When anti sikh riots broke out in 1984, armed cadres protected sikh neighborhoods and prevented any sectarian violence from breaking out.
>>11926>I frankly believe these beliefs people espouse regarding a system that regularly fails are retarded, to be frank.
And yet, you're a fascist.
are you talking about capitalism?
Tell me what else I am. Describe your boogieman.
Don't wanna seem inflammatory but this place is just like every other chan, sorry man. That's what you get.
Generally the better way to go about it is to state your own arguments then have people argue against them, rather than ask them for a model of the world. People on the internet are too lazy for that shit and if they weren't you would read the theory you want to know about, even if you vehemently disagree with it by googling "Marxist theory" or going to Marxists.org.
No, the one that blames capitalism for its faults and casually ignores the inner corruption and malpractice.
I'm normally a giant fucking cunt but I'm really trying to put myself out there to get other people to put themselves out there. No worries fren.
>>11933>the problem is the people not the system!!
This is peak liberal thinking. If you don't change the economic system but only remove the businessmen you don't like, other assholes will simply take their place. The very nature of capital and the commodity fetishism it brings will always creates exploiters and exploited.
>>11925>you will turn right around and make them in your own favor.
Where? >Those are flimsy principles to be ignored because theyre so far into ideology they will literally and not figuratively have any impact on a stable society short of it becoming destabilized.
Stop talking as if you're making a documentary you pretentious uyghur. >idpol heavy subreddit minus the upvotes.
Where was the idpol you fag?
Plus what people seem to miss or get angry at when they realized it is that I'm looking for what THEY believe from Marx and all their other life experiences. What made them this way? What thoughts keep them this way?
Use ctrl+f dude Jesus Christ.
>>11931>Tell me what else I am. Describe your boogieman.
Was it not you who was describing himself as a fascist earlier?
I'd say the same for you because you seem to believe a system where the government has more power under the premise of it in fact bringing power to the worker is going to work out as it has been demonstrably repeatedly.
Then stop storing me in your head. You say I'm a fascist when I'm about as far from it as it gets and just not sharing your same beliefs.
Okay simply look at how well communist movements have done, the state of Kerela in India is the most prosperous state while being ruled by communists.
Birth rate (per 1,000 population)
Death rate (per 1,000 population)
Infant mortality rate (per 1,000 population)
Maternal mortality ratio (per lakh live births) * 2009
Total Fertility rate (per woman)
Couple Protection rate (%)
Life expectancy at birth (Male)
Life expectancy at birth (Female)
Life expectancy at birth (Average)
>>11465>Whenever /pol/ tries to claim that the far-right are the real anti-establishment heroes, they'll always trot out some example of Leftists being opposed to harsh-immigration laws
No it's way more than that. You guys are the left wing of capital, and the western left is fundamentally fishhooking in its ideology now that globalization caused a confrontation between liberalism and populism
You guys want to on the one hand say populism and nationalism is petty bourgeois, so it reproduces capitalism.
But you reproduce it and liberalism as progressive again so long it is universalizing and leading to the conditions for class struggle or the left.
You do this so long as there is a middle class that obstructs class consciousness, which imperialism creates anyway.
Thus the race class synthesis in the settler colonial thesis. The issue isn't the reproduction of capitalism, ira basically who does so as part of the bourgeois democratic revolution still being progressive
But does this not conclude with rationalizing imperialism as progressive like Marx did?
This all seems to be why leninists and anarchists are in crisis while demsocs and such grow.
So how can you blame people who are populists because they have no stake in the reproduction of capitalism the left and liberals want? How can you call that reactionary when there is no revolutionary alternative?
No anon, fucking where? In what way was this discussion anything like an idpol filled subreddit? 90% of this discussion has been primarily about the definition of class and the system itself, not identity.
Remember this post 20 years from now. Think about how you're gonna feel then, right now.
>>11937> I'm looking for what THEY believe from Marx and all their other life experiences. What made them this way? What thoughts keep them this way?
God, what fucking liberal brain bullshit is this? You think that this is because of our feelings and experiences?
We recognize our downward mobility, the instability and dysfunction of our political and economic system and its general active hostility to people. Our economy is a case study of the red queen effect.
"common sense" arguments are tedious and boring. if you wanted to actually talk about how things work in practice you'd be in an entirely different thread talking about china or cybersocialism or the fact that sphere starmer has now consumed all of hounslow.
your attempts to engage in conversation have fallen short largely because they don't raise anything of any particular interest to the userbase here. you haven't raised any interesting theoretical questions, historical moments, or anything that's particularly pleasing to explain, and people have responded with a level of disinterest as a result.
it is as though you've come into a statisticians convention just to argue about how you think the monty hall problem is bullshit because it runs counter to common sense. for about 5 minutes the statisticians will have fun trying to explain to you how counter-intuitively, it isn't bullshit, that they've done simulations and everything, and that statistics is a wonderful and fascinating field - and when you say that you're still not convinced they'll get bored and start telling you that the next time they flip a fair coin they're going to try and ping your eye out with it. except, of course, this is an imageboard so your eyes will be targeted not only for your own uninteresting questions, but even if you merely remind people of other uninteresting questioners in the past. people do not come to imageboards or to conventions to be bored. (well, maybe statisticians do.)
and as an outsider you will no doubt think "well of course you'd write this extended insult towards me, you're one of the people here who just wants to circlejerk", but let me let you in on a secret: i use this flag in part to tempt posters who i will find boring into revealing themselves before i make the mistake of talking to them in good faith. and as you can perhaps also tell, explaining to you why you have had such bad luck is something that interests me far more than many of the other things you have raised.
Well I can't speak for everyone, but as a Marxist, I mainly came to this theory over a long process of 'radicalization'. First I was an unconscious liberal social democrat techie type with a Electrical Engineering degree. But I was highly conscious of systemic and environmental issues, as well as frustrated with planned obsolence.
Over time that led me to a position of understanding that capitalism demands constant expansion, constant production of "exchange values", in order to be maintained. As that is the case, this has major environmental implications. Through Jevon's paradox, improvements in efficiency cannot necessarily lead to diminishments in total emissions.
Thus we need to theorize a system, and advocate for a system, which demands a transcendence to the permanent closed loop of investment to yield profits, of constant growth. Or if there is growth as society demands, growth within ecological limits.
There are many approaches to this, some Marxist, many not. And not every Marxist places ecology in the greatest of esteems as I do.
>>11944>parliamentary system of representative democracy
I knew you were too smart to be a socdem. Now I can be less embarassex about you being one of my favorite posters on this board.
Do you see any irony in your words, one who is objective and free of emotions, O paradigm of pure judgement?
It’s a shame they didn’t last in West Bengal.
The cult of personality either follows the same definitions unique to the platform or they are treated in a hostile manner.
>>11954>communist party relevance >/= communism
Is this the cope?
That… is not idpol
I demand a commie response
Do you think governments have less power under capitalism or something? The government IS capitalism, it wouldn't even exist without them. >bringing power to the worker is going to work out as it has been demonstrably repeatedly.
To begin with, in every socialist state workers undoubtedly had more power than in their previous states, especially in Russia and China.
Feel free to give your own interpretation to refuse conceding or even the slightest acknowledgement this place isn't free of clique rhetoric. The beautiful thing is people outside this triple digit visitors worth of traffic board care as much as I do.
Yes, I do. I think under communism leadership has proven itself to have the freedom to singlehandedly destroy their own nations repeatedly and instances of success are not only a stretch to qualify as communism but a safe haven from acknowledging a shit system that repeatedly shits itself and blames the dog.
The communist parties are literally governing the state.
>>11961>Saying that this bard has an internal culture and can sometimes be insular is the same as idpol.
Go to /edu/ if you wanna learn something.
Capitalism is still keeping it all afloat. What's your point? "Look at the hats, I favor them"?
>>11964>insular>wrongthink is established>definitions have their own meaning detached from the wider pool at large
Did we just get a reverse “not real communism?”
i have never pretended to be free of emotions. on the contrary my post is about an emotion: boredom.
(this without even having to read into whether some desiccated calculating machine of pure reason would write an extended tangent of mixed metaphors mainly as a vehicle for a few half jokes.)
the only irony, as i see it, is that you managed to reply to my good faith explanation with the kind of reply that justifies not giving you a good faith explanation. fortunately >>11952
had a much better reply :)
by that measure Venezuela's failure is only due to capitalism.
If thats the cope, yes. A communist party running a society that functions through capitalism sure isn't real communism. It might be if the current status quo loses an election though.
>>11600>bad and complicit>>11925>good faith conversation
Then quit needling people over semantics and injecting your own emotional reactions to technical terms. In communist discourse Bourgeoisie means someone who owns the means of production. Figure out what those variables mean in your own words and substitute it in whenever you hear it instead of jerking back to your feelings about that group. We aren't trying to over ride or change the universal definition of class, its just a pointer for the relationship to the means of production. The reason we aren't using your definition is because thats not what we are talking about.
I'm the uninformed one anon, but that sounds very reductionist. Should we instead talk about communism collapsing to no fault of its own but purely capitalist pressure from those damn capital hoarding capitalists?
Anon, I have now gone through every page of this board and regardless of how I presented an opposing viewpoint from the current state of the catalog and threads I went through, it would have made no difference.
>>11956>The cult of personality either follows the same definitions unique to the platform or they are treated in a hostile manner.
That's every imageboard. Lurk more.
Lol enjoy being irrelevant.
Define “running through capitalism.”
Never mind that india’s a federated state, shouldn’t communist controlling the government have ruined Kerala?
A communist named Jyoti Basu from West Bengal damn near became prime minister in 1997. What could’ve been.
>>11962>communism leadership has proven itself to have the freedom to singlehandedly destroy their own nations repeatedly
The USSR suffered 2 colossal wars and still transitioned from semi-feudal state to nuclear superpower. You call that a failure? lmao.>a shit system that repeatedly shits itself and blames the dog.
You keep saying this despite socialism having improved the conditions of people in almost every case. Only occurrence I can think where this didn't happen is the Khmer Rouge.
What? Vuvuzuela was the same a Socialist government atop a capitalist system and even now you refuse to apply the standard you applied to Kerala in this case.
Not an argument. Are you running out of steam? Perhaps you should go take a nap.
Use enough brainpower to pass an 8th grade quiz that asks the same question. I anticipate the mental gymnastics eagerly.>>11977
Yeah I do. Because it fucking failed and never came back and is viewed as a historical mistake and tragedy against those subjected to it. 2 more weeks and capitalism will all break down.
>>11975>Wanting to have mainstream traction
Great way to ruin an imageboard tbh. Just look at modern halfchan compared to halfchan a decade ago.
>>11982>Using specific words to describe specific entities in a technical manner is a cult
Can you tell me what is validity and reliability?
A purely objective and not at all emotional argument.
Again, outside of the topic of capitalism, that's more or less most altchans and imageboards.
>>11986>Saying they miss it is an emotional argument not a statement of fact that can be proven or disproven
I shiggy diggy
Validity is how accurate something is and whether it to be true of not. Reliability is what people heres' bullshit filters are not.
Hey, you were the one who stated "is viewed as a historical mistake and tragedy against those subjected to it."
>>11988>They miss it>this is purely logical
You’re the one who made the assertion. I’m asking for clarification.
Could it be that you’re just spewing shit reflexively?
A lot of people miss Nazi Germany too.
>>11980>Because it fucking failed and never came back and is viewed as a historical mistake and tragedy against those subjected to it.
That doesn't really explain how it failed, considering everything it achieved under those conditions. It's hard to call it a failure.
Does it matter? It failed. Cambodia failed too. China's communism is literally the global powerhouse of capitalist pressure.
Maybe 5% of Germans at most, not exactly a lot.
Whether or not it’s logical for them to miss it (according to a burger piece of shit) can be debated.
What’s an objective statement of fact is that they do miss it, and don’t consider it a travesty per your words.
They still miss it though. Is it a retarded argument? Yeah. Good thing that isn't mutually exclusive for the same principle which luckily you can nitpick something else over to avoid acknowledging.
Do they though? More then 75% percent?
A burger? The only instance of people missing Nazi Germany I personally know is that documentary where two old people threw on a marching song and sung along with it.
We’re talking about the union, bitch.
If your criteria for a failed state is that it doesn't exist anymore then 99% of the mightiest states in history have failed since they all ceased to exist. And impoverished, ruined states today can count as successes since they still exist.
I don't know man, what's the arbitrary % of Russians that miss communism? Should be equal.
Yes, they have. If they could not maintain their state and no longer exist their success was momentary and their failure eternal.
>>11998>Say a lot of people miss Nazi Germany >Person responds by stating that not a lot miss it <W-well, its a retarded argument anyway
You were the first one to bring up peoples view of said states anons
Certainly but let's drill down a little further why do these two respective populations miss there's systems?
Wat? But that doesn't help you at all, even pol pot must be having that amount of support. But a huge portion of Russians miss the USSR a majority.
About 75% according to the last poll.
Incorrect. Other anon began to base the whole of his argument upon an ambiguous amount of Russians saying they miss the USSR. I'm just making the same argument with a new coat of paint.
75% of those polled that answered or 75% of all Russians that were expected to give an answer? Why might even people who miss nazi Germany say 'no, Nazi bad if interviewed?
>>12011>people miss something>therefore it was good
God damn I have to spoonfeed it to you.
>>12010>Incorrect. Other anon began to base the whole of his argument upon an ambiguous amount of Russians saying they miss the USSR. I'm just making the same argument with a new coat of paint.
No, you were actually the one to bring this up to begin with by stating "is viewed as a historical mistake and tragedy against those subjected to it", after which I responded by showing that most "subjected" to it don't see it as a mistake.
>>12014>some Russians polled missed it
I got owned and epicly refuted.
No, that they don’t consider what came before a bad thing.
Who’s arguing based on emotion now?
What stops me from pulling out any poll of any subject I wish and letting my confirmation be ride it off into the sunset? Clearly nothing, but why might you still not want to do that?
>>11999>i think the right-wing populism is like imperialism and capitalism turning on itself
I think so too. But I think liberals represent imperialism here, not us
How come that means we are reactionary but viet cong were based natlib struggle
I guess I am despite your argument revolving around how people who got polled about something you feel strongly about feel when I'm trying to express why the logic behind it is really not smart.
If most of them had suffered greatly under socialism I doubt this high percentage of Russians (more than half
) would have this opinion that the Soviet era wasn't bad.
>>12012>75% of those polled that answered
Of course its 75% of those polled, you can only get an answer from those you poll. That's how polls work, you use a certain sample size and you ask them to fill out your poll. https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2020/03/24/75-of-russians-say-soviet-era-was-greatest-time-in-countrys-history-poll-a69735
>>12022>more than half>a fucking poll>missing the point beside that this hard
I hope you're only pretending, holy fuck.
I got a day off work so meyou might be able to get away with it for the rest if the week until saturday if I sort out my shifts
There's more than one of you so I doubt you understand fundamentally why your argument relying upon how people felt about something in some random poll can be used to accurately judge history.
You idiot, people are not going to look back fondly on a regime that mistreats them, it's as simple as that.
Anon, what do you not understand that you were the first to claim that most viewed it as a historical mistake and a tragedy? Just take the L lol.
Ok, put it out? Put out contradictory data and that can be used for conversation?
For example, only 28% of russians want to return to the same path the union was following. Which isn’t necessarily an argument because there was serious problems with how the union was run in the 1980s, but that does not in itself constitute a problem with communismTM.
Anyways, we should all do a Cockshott and work towards a new socialism.
Not the guy you're responding to, who's we? Are you Syrian, Jordan, Lebanese, etc?
That communism is gone doesn't mean it's never coming back, as capitalism is not going to be eternal. Take republics for example, before the 19th century they had been an utter failure. Would you call them failures now?
>>12026>why your argument relying upon how people felt about something in some random poll can be used to accurately judge history.
. Also, the majority of polls fluctuate between 65% and 75%.
>>12029>waaaah why aren't you playing by my arbitrary rules>waaaah humor me humor me
Lol no way fag
But the fucking 90% of Germans do not look back fondly at Nazis /Pol/ is simply the exception to the rule!
I suppose I don't see much of a real difference – in material terms – between Trump and a U.S. government led by Democrats. It's the same regime. The CPC's standing committee doesn't see a practical difference, just differences in tactics.
This is the part where if I resort to your tactics I go find a poll that favors any stupid shit I say and despite it being common sense most people don't enjoy living under systems that abuse them this poll says the group of people they interviewed in fact miss it, regardless of if they experienced it or have any historical literacy regarding it and are some 20 year old in a shithole country that because of the lingering power structures of communism sees their country as ruled by corruption.
>>12037>look at the poll
Jesus christ. No wonder you people spam cope.
>>12021>I guess I am despite your argument revolving around how people who got polled about something you feel strongly about feel when I'm trying to express why the logic behind it is really not smart.
This is your argument:>Because it fucking failed and never came back and is viewed as a historical mistake and tragedy against those subjected to it.If most of the people who were "subjected to" socialism are saying that it wasn't bad and a lot of them actually say they miss those times, then your baseless "argument" is fucking wrong.
How fucking retarded must you be to think your pathetic excuse of an argument is not based on feelings too? And worse, it's based on your
feelings, not those of the people you claim to know the opinion of.
Ok then, find a fucking poll where a majority of Germans miss the Reich and it has a good amount of respondents.
The issue arises when you conflate a poll to mean the whole of a society (or 75%) is with you despite pollings you disagree with over any particular subject being a dime a dozen both in and outside of your favor depending on how you prime the Google search.
Just take the L son, it's not your fault. The USA's education system has failed you just as it fails all who enter its maw
What additional social complications would arise from putting your name on a list of nazi sympathizers? The EU will go after 90 year old people to let em rot in jail.
Anon, take the fucking L. You said the people subjected to socialism saw it as a tragedy and a mistake, polling shows the vast majority don't see it that way. You can debate why they see it that way, but they very much don't see it as either of the things you mentioned.
>>12046>Anonymous polling collects your name
>>12045>a fucking poll>leaning that hard into it>being so desperate
I think I'm starting to like the cope meme
Why don't you try to have at least one coherent thought per post anon. We can't read your mind.>>12040>despite it being common sense
Like arguing with a child.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question
>>12044>despite pollings you disagree with over any particular subject being a dime a dozen both in and outside of your favor depending on how you prime the Google search.
If that were true, you could find a Russian poll that showed that the average ex-Soviet citizen "viewed socialism as a historical mistake and tragedy against themselves" right this instant. Go and find one, and then we'll take your "argument" seriously.
I see an adhom but do you know what you call the latter half?>>12048>hey do you miss nazi Germany?>people should feel zero anxiety or wariness giving an honest 'yes' when that in itself lands you in court
I'm from pol>>12038>It's the same regime. The CPC's standing committee doesn't see a practical difference, just differences in tactics
Really? Can rightoid nationalist populists join the anti imperialist bloc of nations?
Why are reactionaries obsessed with aesthetics?
But anon, I'd never base my actual argument around a poll and how people feel about something that caused multiple famines the bread lines just couldn't keep people alive through.
A random ass poll from a year ago on how nostalgic boomers feel about the good ol times is comedy.
When you don't have much you need to start clutching at straws.
>>12053>I see an adhom
It's not ad-hominem. I'm not saying you're begging the question because you're a childish dimwit. I'm saying you're begging the question AND you're a childish dimwit.>but do you know what you call the latter half?
Latter half of what?
Once again:>>12040> We can't read your mind.
Because there's nothing of substance otherwise. Although even then most of it was stolen either from leftists or traditional architecture/artwork
>>12054>No, you represent its "true face," without any blinders or masks
How can we be its true face while being part of the nation state that capital is supposed to ultimately supersede? This commie shit is confusing af
But boomers even in America are correct, the 1960's were a golden age although unsustainable and discriminatory. Their instincts are correct and the majority of boomers were white.
You can't draw an inference because you're probably actually autistic. If youre lucky anyways.
I'm not sure what you believe. I don't know what right-wing populism is. All I hear from them is that America should dominate the world and crush competitors. But that's also what Joe Biden says. What's the difference?
>>12058>But anon, I'd never base my actual argument around a poll and how people feel about something that caused multiple famines the bread lines just couldn't keep people alive through.
Is English not your first language Mr. FBI man?
I've learned a lot from you anon and none of it has made me particularly encouraged that leftypol is up to anything good when they're like a cult but an angry one.
>>12063>How can we be its true face while being part of the nation state that capital is supposed to ultimately supersede? This commie shit is confusing af
You misunderstand the initial point then. The point is that liberals will speak around their intended goals and obfuscate the actual capital relations at play. You on the other hand will just say it blatantly, without any masking.
>>12058>But anon, I'd never base my actual argument around a poll and how people feel about something that caused multiple famines the bread lines just couldn't keep people alive through.
Ahh, and this is where we get to the classic part where you admit to base your twisted opinion on the Soviet Union on>muh hololdomor>muh bread lines
If they were so bad and caused by the socialist system then why have so many former Soviet citizens stated multiple times before and after the fall of the Soviet Union that they were alright or better back then?
>>12067>I can't interpret a basic sentence that fits in a tweet>that means you're stupid
Sometimes it's better to not post at all than make yourself sound retarded. Find me a poll that says otherwise and I'll believe you.
What part of that was an answer and refutation and what part was acknowledgement and deflection?
>>12065>You can't draw an inference because you're probably actually autistic. If youre lucky anyways.
Well can you help an autist out? Latter half of what? I know writing a complete sentence without grammatical errors is a challenge for you.
Go threaten the liberals deep interests on a structural level in a real way and observe how they start talking and behaving
You'll see it
My point is that people are smarter then what you think, the nostalgia for 1960's America and the USSR is mostly a rational judgement. Do you think millennials are going to be nostalgic?
>>12071>Sometimes it's better to not post at all than make yourself sound retarded.
You know it, yet you keep doing it.>I can't interpret a basic sentence that fits in a tweet>that means you're stupid
Your syntax and grammar are completely fucked guy.
You're beyond help anon. I tried to explain a bit of what I think is happening and even one of the locals said hundreds of debate threads all end in what sounds like semantics. This is your shithole, you stay here and away from greener pastures and keep on doing you.
Grasping at straws and mad cuz bad.
We don’t base our arguments around a poll. We base it on objective achievements with a healthy dose of historical context.https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2430906/
I really hope you're pretending to be retarded.
>>12058>I'd never base my actual argument around a poll and how people feel about something
This all started here >>11980
. Did you or did you not state this?
It seems like everything came down to a poll then it got bandwagon'd onto because nobody else could come up with any other original bait.
You are not here to engage in good faith at all
Yeah I did. I also asked questions about the pol when I shouldn't have entertained it because at its base level the emotions free objective argument came down to how a percentage of the local population feel about their golden days.
I put a scientific study up, dude. One that’s pretty modest as well.
Anon I'm not gone. If you want to feel like you have influence or sway you should probably get a life and do something meaningful with the capital it presents you.
srry didn't mean to tag you I meant to tag the fed flag
>>12088>I put a scientific study up, dude. One that’s pretty modest as well.
He doesn't want scientific study, he wants common sense. Give him some common sense anon.>>12040>This is the part where if I resort to your tactics I go find a poll that favors any stupid shit I say and despite it being common sense
>>12089>Anon I'm not gone. If you want to feel like you have influence or sway you should probably get a life and do something meaningful with the capital it presents you.
The lack of self-awareness is astounding.
You sure your reading comprehension is alright?
Exactly. I think this is a chatbot or he just started learning English and is overly confident.
I mean languages are hard. I should know, I speak 4.
>>12093>visit leftypol once>people expect you to download an app for a working UI>people here take the internet so serious one aussie shut the board down for a day>be today>see article on v about this place>'hey those are the people who radicalized Tarrant'>find way to bunkerchan.xyz>scroll catalog>troll some threads>get informed by local about how debate threads go>slowly witness the quality of the board>witness the infighting>witness the dog piling>witness the ostracization of different opinions in such a different manner than I've seen on brief glances through pol
Holy shit you're retarded if you're not ESL.
You mean you have something to extrapolate a desired take out of then apply it where structural integrity is needed?
>>12103>You mean you have something to extrapolate a desired take out of then apply it where structural integrity is needed?
Why don't you resd the study and tell us exactly why it's bullshit?
This is what we call a dialogue…
I don't know the exact % of transhumanists that off themselves but I get the feeling this place if they're truly synonymous with it raises that high score
r/Stupidpol is the place for you
There is no one angrier in this thread than you lmao.>>12071
You can't write coherently when you're this angry. You've written several posts that barely make sense. To avoid confusion and ambiguity, you should phrase your ideas correctly and use proper punctuation. But of course you don't care if people understand you or not because when they don't, you have an excuse to try to make fun of them, because that's all you have. Truly pathetic>>12072
At first you claimed that the USSR was seen as a tragedy and blah blah blah. By whom? By that 75% of "nostalgic boomers" you say are not thinking rationally even though they lived in the Soviet Union and you didn't? Or by the blatant liars who made that shit up?
Just admit you don't have proof and we do, and move on.
>>12100>people here take the internet so serious one aussie shut the board down for a day
Imagine believing this myth. Literally just one fag tooting his own horn, and everyone on /pol/ just believed him.>hey those are the people who radicalized Tarrant
That was 8/pol/, not us.
>>12106>I don't know the exact % of transhumanists that off themselves but I get the feeling this place if they're truly synonymous with it raises that high score
Hah. He's already resorting to "you will never be a woman" posting. Like clockwork. At least you tried anon/chatbot.
Nah. If I hadn't made it through the catalog I might have but ultimately I'm gonna guess it's exactly as I described. People post something like that to Substantiate their views here then it gets into a game of throwing them back and forth while insisting its all that is needed to build an argument and dismantle the opposition. People on pol don't even go this far
Pretty modest confirmation of socialist countries having better quality of life compared to capitalist countries of similar development. You could even make an argument that only capitalism allows for the development for better health outcomes. You know, if you weren’t a pseud.
Why would I make the argument when it's dreaded "common sense"? I get the feeling hating common sense while simultaneously trying to make bad arguments through personalized common sense stances has something to do with intuition making you understand common sense is what they lack.
but anon, you failed to consider vuvuzela stalin iphone holodomor common sense human nature 100 billion dead from starvation. Checkmate!!
Friendly reminder a quick ctrl f on any of that reveals who started throwing it around as a position to leverage their argument from.
I feel like if you tried to tackle shorter sentences first it would help you learn to write a coherent sentence.
I'm sorry anon, you need to surpass my 5 year old niece in English comprehension. She can read tweets just fine.
Unfortunately for you, everyone else has closed this thread for good. Nobody will be doing any investigative work on this shit show LOL
>>12119>implying I care about some other audience
Holy fuck the projection on a board that probably has less than 500 concurrent users
>>12111>People on pol don't even go this far
Having a discussion in which people argue their points by posting the relevant information?
But you do care. You just said anyone could see who started it, making your shirt flinging somehow justified
No, conversations where people talk at rather than with eachother and begin to flail about over why their sources are best sources even if it's a poll.
Either way you haven't even addressed the scientific studies.
No, I don't. You misunderstand me posting something antagonistic in a polite tone as sharing the same investment in this splinter of a splinter.
Per-capita GDP in Hitler's Germany compared to the U.K. and U.S. would've been equivalent to South Africa or Iran today.
And you're not making sense again
I bet you're used to spamming a thread to bump limit because you merely don't understand what they're saying
Nor do I intend to feed into an endless loop of fartsniffing and whatsboutisms. Good thing you already got me though right? Remember, I don't read anything.
I am very sorry you seem to be literally autistic anon.
Why does the US have the worst healthcare outcomes in the developed word despite having one of, if not the highest levels of healthcare spending?
You're worse then the fascists here at least they outright dismiss any disagreeing source as jewish,
Probably partially because of the DEA and the cost of operation gradually inflating things to the point you can fly to south Korea, get world class surgery then fly back for less than the cost of the same work in America. I fail to see where this extrapolation was intended to go.
why is rittenhouse, a kid protecting someone else's shitty gas station, considered a hero?
Are reactionaries really that allergic to theory?
>>12123>No, conversations where people talk at rather than with eachother
That's called defending your views anon. You're not going to talk "with" someone when trying to show what you see as issues in their analysis of things, especially when they then defend that analysis. >begin to flail about over why their sources are best sources even if it's a poll.
Holy shit anon, you started this. You were the one to make a certain claim, anons refuted it, then you tried to say that polls can't prove anything in regards to the topic, even though its the only thing that could be used in regards to the topic (Russian opinion of socialism).
They seem to do it a lot less frequently and entirely unironically than happens here, sadly.
Once again agree to disagree. I believe talking at people gives them a solid indication your omly interested in yourself and likely disagreeable. Listening to eachother offers the opportunity to build up rather than treat it like a debate because the only thing you've got going for you is being undefeated low traffic debate champion.
What? anyway I guess this convo is over.
What did he mean by this?
What did he intend to convey by this?
They seem to genuinely shrug off and gasligjt people less often. An appreciation for honesty and being genuine that seems absent here might be it. I really hope for your sake the trolling and baiting here is all from pol but from the dates it doesn't look like the toxicity rolled in recently.
That having high levels of development and money for that matter doesn’t automatically mean good outcomes and that basic forms of “socialist” public policy like those pertaining to healthcare, literacy, education and what not are relatively low cost with major effects.
People can pick up on when you're a willfully ignorant cunt easier than you can put forward the facade of giving a damn about an opposing viewpoint to better deliver your own.
oh wow you are actually retarded
do you really not know how to evaluate polls for accuracy or do you think polls are a jewish trick and people just pay for results they want?
Lurk more faggot.
Do you really think that because you're shit worldview isn't tolerated makes us dishonest?
Make a thread about a topic, and I guarantee you'll get quite a few retards trying to engage you in good faith.
Apparently the debate standard on /pol/ is so low, that posting material evidence is now "gaslighting" which is a meaningless buzzword.
>>12143>what % of Russians were polled?>are you misconstruing the results?
Met with radio silence. Show me a poll that you're not retarded.
Do you know what scientific polling is anon?
No. I think your shit worldview that is so shit it only thrives in low population corners of the internet that jerk eachother off and immediately off puts anyone from the outside that looks in.
Yes anon. Tell me how that one is.
But anon, I don't post on pol. Describe your boogieman to me and show me on the doll where he touched you. Was it in your head?
>>12150>Yes anon. Tell me how that one is.
I don't think you do if you're asking about percentage of the population polled. Here, let me educate you:https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/howcan-a-poll-of-only-100/How can a poll of only 1,004 Americans represent 260 million people with only a 3 percent margin of error?
>>12149>No. I think your shit worldview that is so shit it only thrives in low population corners of the internet that jerk eachother off and immediately off puts anyone from the outside that looks in.
this is a given, this is an imageboard after all
However, when I look at /SIG/ on 4/pol/ all I see is trad wallpapers and muh jooos.
There is no reading, no theory, and it really is a stretch to call /pol/ a board for politics.
>>12100>>'hey those are the people who radicalized Tarrant'
No, we were practically the only board on 8ch who actively opposed the right wing ideas of the rest of the site.>>people here take the internet so serious one aussie shut the board down for a day
The site never went down during the raid, at most they turned CloudFlare DDoS protection on so that you had to solve some captchas to access the site every 10 minutes or so. The normal threads were mostly fine and most of the raid posts were contained in a couple of threads, the gore spam threads that were created were immediately deleted. The "aussie who shut the board down", who no doubt took the internet more seriously than all of us combined, was an assblasted /pol/oid making retarded false flag posts so that he could screenshot them and post on /pol/ as proof of his epic victory against those damn gommie drannies who made fun of me with a wojak edit, as shown here >>12109
If you want to see for yourself:https://archive.vn/A9QAq#926235http://archive.md/WAj2B#925897
Lemme remind you that this all happened because /pol/cels, who think an internet culture war and aesthetics are what matter the most in the world, were offended by a single fucking picture made in MS Paint, and you believed their version of the events instead of seeing through their bullshit as anyone smarter than them would.
>>12147>what % of Russians were polled?
Do you know how sample sizes work? Did you ever take a fucking statistic class? The size of the sample matters less then ensuring random selection and repeated testing.
>>12152>find poll that takes a portion of the populace>insist it represent them all accurately
But let's get meta and back to something I've even seen mentioned about lefties and polls>relying on a poll in the absence of concrete evidence>using a poll about a long past regime that killed millions of people and had bread line famines to insist the system was a good one
>>12151>i don't post on pol
Bandwagon aboard. Not like that hasn't backfired.
I just did the math for you on that figure they gave in the Scientific American headline.
That's 0.000384615384615%>>12156>find poll that takes a portion of the populace>insist it represent them all accurately
So you literally don't know what scientific polling is.
I come from /an/ and /diy/. This board is deader than the mecha one and this is a good day for it I imagine. Each time you guys accuse me of being le boogieman I really don't know of you're that retarded or just trying to bait that hard.
The poster is either trolling or braindead.
>>12156>relying on a poll in the absence of concrete evidence
We were debating what former citizens of The USSR's opinion of The USSR is. What would be your methodology for getting concrete evidence of their opinion if polling is a non-starter for you?
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commies never learn
so you're just a generic cuckservative
I do, but you're trying to make it out as I don't because I doubt the validity of an opinion poll from a highly corrupt nation and regardless of that I doubt the validity of the poll contributing to the argument communism was good regardless of all other details because some people miss it.
Show me on the doll where the internet nazi hurt you.
>>12165>I do, but you're trying to make it out as I don't
No dude, you really don't. Read this article:>>12152
>>12156>relying on a poll in the absence of concrete evidence>using a poll about a long past regime that killed millions of people and had bread line famines to insist the system was a good one
Do we have to go back to you original post? This was about your statement on people views, not anything else.
In any case, you have 0 sources.
What do we have? Other than those polls you say mean nothing (without anynthing to back up that claim than your own mental gymnastics), we have scientific studies, statistics and history.
You are the only one here who's talking "at" others instead of "with", you refuse to engage in an honest discussion because you're mad about having been proven wrong early on.
Why would the corrupt nation in question, Putin's Russia, want to fake an opinion poll like this?
You'd think he'd fake it the opposite way, right?
they do a poll every couple years on several questions
look for yourselfhttps://www.levada.ru/en/tag/the-ussr/https://www.levada.ru/en/2019/08/07/the-soviet-union/>This survey was carried out May 24–29, 2019 with a representative sample of all Russian urban and rural residents. The sample comprised 1616 people age 18 or older from 137 localities in 50 regions of the Russian Federation. The survey was conducted as a personal interview in respondents’ homes. The answer distribution is presented as percentages of the number of participants along with data from previous surveys.
>The statistical error of these studies for a selection of 1600 people (with a probability of 0.95) does not exceed:
>3.4% for indicators around 50%>2.9% for indicators around 25%/75%>2.0% for indicators around 10%/90%>1.5% for indicators around 5%/95%
>In May 2019, the Levada Center repeated it’s list of assessments (14 in total) from the project “the Soviet person.” The respondents could choose an answer from the survey card if they corresponded with their ideas about the
Perhaps you were. I was debating an opinion poll does not erase famine, mismanagement, systemic oppression or collapse.
yeah, you type in prayer like mottos.
Definitely a zionist.
He called you a cuckservative, not a Nazi. Pocket your victim mentality for a second.
And once again, you didn't address this:>>12134> You were the one to make a certain claim, anons refuted it, then you tried to say that polls can't prove anything in regards to the topic, even though its the only thing that could be used in regards to the topic (Russian opinion of socialism).
It shows the people under neocon/neolib rule prefer the good ole days of bread lines and commie blocks
>>12172>Perhaps you were. I was debating an opinion poll does not erase famine, mismanagement, systemic oppression or collapse.
No you said the poll was incorrect. You said that those percentages of the population don't hold that opinion because YOUR
"common sense" would indicate they hold a different opinion on a society they lived in based on your understanding of how life was like in that society based on your supposed superior understanding of what life was like there and how people would feel about it.
>>12178>i don't post on /pol/>references /pol/ screenshots
I sure didn't because much like your opinion theirs doesn't matter in any pragmatic way that has a tangible effect on reality and that's how it stays until we're all dead.
>>12172>>12175>Trying to misrepresent the initial argument to try and worm your way out of what was stated
You said something, people provided evidence on the contrary. This was never about "Russians miss communism, therefore its good". It was a response to your initial point on people seeing it as a mistake and tragedy.
heres the latest onehttps://www.levada.ru/2020/03/24/struktura-i-vosproizvodstvo-pamyati-o-sovetskom-soyuze/
anon says>>12009>>12009>75% according to the last poll
Which is probably quoting moscow timeshttps://www.themoscowtimes.com/2020/03/24/75-of-russians-say-soviet-era-was-greatest-time-in-countrys-history-poll-a69735
if you scroll down in the poll you see
<THERE IS AN OPINION THAT "THE SOVIET ERA WAS THE BEST TIME IN THE HISTORY OF OUR COUNTRY, WITH A HIGH LEVEL OF WELFARE AND OPPORTUNITIES FOR ORDINARY CITIZENS." >To what extent do you personally agree or disagree with this judgment? (one answer)
>February 2020>Definitely agree37>Rather agree38>Rather disagree13>Definitely disagreefive>I am at a loss to answer6
37 + 38 = 75>>12012
>75% of those polled that answered or 75% of all Russians that were expected to give an answer? Why might even people who miss nazi Germany say 'no, Nazi bad if interviewed?
>The poll held on 20 - 26 February 2020 on a representative nationwide sample of urban and rural population capacity 1614 people at the age of 18 years and older in 137 populated points, 50 subjects of the Russian Federation. The research is carried out at the respondent's home using the personal interview method . The distribution of answers is given as a percentage of the total number of respondents, along with data from previous polls.
Maybe if you fucking faggots kept to the appropriate boards people like me wouldn't have any chip on our shoulder for off-topic invaders that post absolute garbage like you.
>>12175>Russians miss communism so communism good.
And other communist state nations. Communism must be doing something right.
I reject your narrative
Refer to the OP, it explains everything (aside from stormfront)
>>12178>when this board exists because it couldn't handle bants on 4chan or 8chan
This board originates from 8chan, not halfchan. And this specific site didn't come into existence because of "bants", but because 8chan fucking died and got replaced by FedKun.
>>12179>No you said the poll was incorrect. You said that those percentages of the population don't hold that opinion because YOUR "common sense" would indicate they hold a different opinion on a society they lived in based on your understanding of how life was like in that society based on your supposed superior understanding of what life was like there and how people would feel about it.
You're giving me your brain worms. Apologies for repeating myself.>>12181>I sure didn't because much like your opinion theirs doesn't matter in any pragmatic way that has a tangible effect on reality and that's how it stays until we're all dead.
So now you're conceding the poll is accurate, but you're saying it doesn't matter.
Yes anon, I began to argue its incorrect in the sense it is not as objective and infallible as you make it out to be because I moved with the goalposts away from the poll having no tangible effect on reality or meaningful argument to make that will ever see itself empowered and made real.
>>12178>>when this board exists because it couldn't handle bants on 4chan or 8chan
This is like saying /pol/ exists because it can't handle bants in real life.
The answer to both is censorship forcing movement. Most mods and jannies on /pol/ ban communist theory.
Yeah sure. I'll concede the poll is accurate. You won't concede the poll doesn't matter and is a poor hill to die on. You get your ego stroked, I get to know you're other there ineffectual and unwilling to adjust your rhetoric to become more effective.
What is a common synonym for "vote"?
/pol/ is for Politically Incorrect. Stalin and /pol/ Pot are on topic. Hell, Stalin purged the Jews before Hitler could.
>>12191>pol can't handle banks in real life
A literal cope for your home board being born of not even being able to handle these pussies ' that can't banter irl's own weak bants.
Nice reading comprehension bro
ITT: One anon tries to avoid taking the L for a single point he made, rather then admit he was wrong in that assertion and move to another argument.
>>12196>grasping at straws this hard
As the meme says, I just wanted to play videogames. You spergs just want to shit up every board regardless of if they're the people you hate most that actually care about the topic this board cares about most. Go figure you radicalized people who just want your low effort shit gone.
>calls sources gaslighting
>proceeds to attempt at gaslighting
>only gas lights himself
sad. many such cases.
This sentence makes no sense. Work on your bots sentence structure.
Can't tell if sophisticated bot or typical intransigence and smug ignorance of cuckservative burgers. Anyways this thread is fucking insane and is somehow still going on hours later.
Engineer here. Noted. Will have it run overnight to adapt.
>Anons sentence structure is moving closer towards "Has Anyone Really Been Far Even as Decided to Use Even Go Want to do Look More Like? " -tier arrangement
Drunk or bot?
Show me on the doll where the boogieman invaded you.
Go digging in a mass grave.
>>12211>the phrase "go back to /pol/" has more mentions then leftypol in any context
I just wanted to watch cartoons. :^)
>>12214>boogieman invaded you
To the bot runner, try and remove the term invaded. X invaded you can give it away depending on context.
My first exposure was on gif. I was in some of those secret pol discords posted on 8ch so I pieced one and one together.
I just wanted to discuss chess without /pol/yps shitting up threads about jews
Bot? What bot? People think bots are real? That's crazy.
>>12207>Leftists radicalizing a guy to shoot up a mosque
Sounds totally legit
I think it is trying to spell bourgeoisie
>>12181>much like your opinion theirs doesn't matter in any pragmatic way that has a tangible effect on reality and that's how it stays until we're all dead.
Ok, so now you're admitting that your assertion that "socialism is seen as a historical mistake and a tragedy" is wrong, yes? Because, using this logic, there's absolutely no way to prove that what people think about it one way or another is objective or reflects reality. The only way you could prove such a thing would be by asking the people who experienced socialism.
Therefore, you can no longer use the claim that "socialism is seen as a historical mistake and a tragedy" as "proof" that "socialism bad".Unless,
of course, you're not basing your claim on what ex-Soviets think, but on what imperialist sources have fabricated. If so, that's a whole another problem.
Sadly. The endgoal was to get more pol posters to rise up and do some dumb shit which would hopefully end in censorship from news picking up on the notorious gunman 4chan. The end result was the gayest manifesto that came off as a mom rapping about veggies to try and get her kids to eat it up. Schizo threads are still routinely posted with stale links that weave a narrative.
Only read the first sentence. Sure I meant whatever you think I meant with no errors or deliberate misinterpretations.
Show me on the doll where the commie touched you. Everything will be fine.
Can you respond to >>12141
>>12226>its ur fault a racist cracker committed a mini genocide
Take pride in your work, glowie
>>12226>Sadly. The endgoal was to get more pol posters to rise up and do some dumb shit which would hopefully end in censorship from news picking up on the notorious gunman 4chan. The end result was the gayest manifesto that came off as a mom rapping about veggies to try and get her kids to eat it up. Schizo threads are still routinely posted with stale links that weave a narrative.
I wasn't sure what to draw from it and I really don't have enough hands on with it to form an opinion, I just know our Healthcare industry is one of the most busted in the entire world.>>12230
But anon, I advocated infiltrating those groups to feed info to the glowies.
>>12231>Rent free>all these people accusing me of being their boogieman
you will feed info to the glowies while they commit the crime anyways. just like with the kiwi and the guy in austria
>>12233>all these people accusing me of being their boogieman
I will regardless. I know I've made a difference because I put one of you pedophiles in my local county jail for being the one incidence of violence during a BLM rally here.
I guess IDs do have their merit. Take a scroll through.
4chan was better moderated when there were commies and not just liberals and fascists in the mod team.
Also read the OP and stop believing /pol/.>>12178
/pol/ literally banned communists forcing them to migrate to other site. You're a fucking retarded newfag.
>>12226>Posts regularly on 8/pol/ >Posts manifesto on 8/pol/ >Celebrated by 8/pol/ >Never uses /leftypol/ >But apparently it was all /leftypol/ acting in regards to 4chan
So you can say it’s common sense that capitalist countries have the potential for higher development that leads to higher quality of life indicators, but nobody knows why the country whose healthcare system has the most money flowing through it has the worst health outcomes compared to its other developed peers.
Very cool, but I didn't ask.
You like Biden?
>>12238>pol literally banned communists
What Based reality do you come from and how did you get here?
Seriously, next time you "see one", ask them about LTV. They're just false flags for fun.
I don't like presidential candidates and I don't trust any of those Fulkerson. Bush Sr was okay and Trump was funny. I really don't like Biden because I feel like we elected Grandpa Warhawk.
Schadenfreude at actual criminals is its own enrichment.
>>12245>I don't trust any of those Fulkerson
I bet he thinks every israeli flag is actually a jew
/pol/ jannies will delete threads or prevent them from bumping. Sometimes they'll ban as well, but that's usually after the thread is deleted.
Recalibrating logarithms and backtracking the problem.
>>12236> put one of you pedophiles in my local county jail for being the one incidence of violence during a BLM rally here
Is this supposed to make us respect you?
I fucking hate these things but this is one of the few I actually have saved.
I would honestly be impressed, because 8/pol/ was schizo central. Any "astroturfing" would be noise on top of noise on top of glow operations.
No. It's supposed to make you mad and remind you that opsec brings guilt by association.
That's precisely what it was. Producing noise to drown out reason and exacerbate the schizos is part of ROLCON.
>>12259>Producing noise to drown out reason and exacerbate the schizos is part of ROLCON.
And how would /leftypol/ have time to do this when we were dealing with our own issues at the time in regards to the mods and board policy?
You literally spammed them across non-pol boards. If you didn't want people who have no mind or attention for you or your bullsjit to get pissed at you and begin trying to infiltrate and fuck you over for the hell of it then post where you belong.
Honestly its just the same as when you go twice forward in a pickup truck.
It's the fuckjng internet and a random board. Sometimes it's really best just not to reply, anon.
Well they don't exactly tell you what you are supposed to hoard during a plague.
I suck cock
I Left The Microwave On For 70 Years Last Night girl had so much silicon in her you could run doom on her titties
>>12262>You literally spammed them across non-pol boards. If you didn't want people who have no mind or attention for you or your bullsjit to get pissed at you and begin trying to infiltrate and fuck you over for the hell of it then post where you belong.
We didn't spam shit. Why would we be spamming stuff on halfchan? /qa/ and /s4s/ uyghurs fishing (you)'s is not the same as doing stuff.
I don’t think you know what that word means, anon. Especially if you imply it brings guilt by association.
You spammed it to such an extent to distance the other boards from the damage leftypol had singlehandedly invoked with one failed raid the site's url completely changed.
Bad opsec means a pool full of people who are compiant.
I actually live near Santa Monica, if you want any restaurant recommendations for tomorrow night. It would be too late to book one now.
Who are what now? How does bad opsec make people compliant? How does bad opsec make them obey something or another?
Be sure to tell my phone provider all about how you did that.
>>12273>You spammed it to such an extent to distance the other boards from the damage leftypol had singlehandedly invoked with one failed raid the site's url completely changed.
But it didn't, and we didn't spam or raid anything. Bunkerchan and .org were already seperate as well, and the redirect happened yesterday.
Tell them yourself. Linguistic forensics.
The sensation of pushing crows through narrow slots is exquisite.
Lol don't do that to him he can't read.
Depending on the crime if you're a compliant bystander you are legally culpable and your asshole is also capable of being buttered up by being cohesive when dealing with the feds which I am not, I just think it's the most appropriate one.
Tell it to my ass. You can eat it and also suck my dick.
I prefer parakeets.
The bots are conversing.
bruh if you're claiming that you don't post (or spend a significant amount of time) on /pol/, stop acting like you know more about it than us. You can't seriously believe all that shit about "/pol/ is right again" when they're the ones obviously shitting up every other board, right? These pictures are years old, the reason why everyone hates that board is that they've been trying to infect the whole site for years and they've succeeded, and you didn't even notice, now you're starting to believe them.https://archive.is/DadgHhttps://desuarchive.org/q/thread/284599/http://web.archive.org/web/20210320044847/https://leftypol.org/leftypol/res/125003.html
Like other people said, next time you see one of "us" trying to start shit in a non-politics board, ask them about LTV.>>12242
It was worse back then, but yes, if you're a genuine communist who's really advocating for communism or criticizing fascism/conservatism from a leftist perspective, they'll censor you and possibly also ban you. Obvious shitposts made by obvious /pol/cels pretending to be communist stereotypes just so others can attack a strawman don't get that treatment. Besides, the origin of /leftypol/ was mostly /lit/, so you're double-wrong.>>12215>I have no proof
Good to know.
I told you I'd let them adapt.
They targeted gamers. Gamers. They targeted gamers. Gamers. We're a group of people who will sit for hours, days, even weeks on end performing some of the hardest, most mentally demanding tasks. Over, and over, and over all for nothing more than a little digital token saying we did.
We'll punish our selfs doing things others would consider torture, because we think it's fun.We'll spend most if not all of our free time min maxing the stats of a fictional character all to draw out a single extra point of damage per second.
Many of us have made careers out of doing just these things: slogging through the grind, all day, the same quests over and over, hundreds of times to the point where we know evety little detail such that some have attained such gamer nirvana that they can literally play these games blindfolded.
Do these people have any idea how many controllers have been smashed, systems over heated, disks and carts destroyed 8n frustration? All to latter be referred to as bragging rights?
These people honestly think this is a battle they can win? They take our media? We're already building a new one without them. They take our devs? Gamers aren't shy about throwing their money else where, or even making the games our selves. They think calling us racist, mysoginistic, rape apologists is going to change us? We've been called worse things by prepubescent 10 year olds with a shitty head set. They picked a fight against a group that's already grown desensitized to their strategies and methods. Who enjoy the battle of attrition they've threatened us with. Who take it as a challange when they tell us we no longer matter. Our obsession with proving we can after being told we can't is so deeply ingrained from years of dealing with big brothers/sisters and friends laughing at how pathetic we used to be that proving you people wrong has become a very real need; a honed reflex.
Gamers are competative, hard core, by nature. We love a challange. The worst thing you did in all of this was to challange us. You're not special, you're not original, you're not the first; this is just another boss fight.
A broken clock is right twice a day and it seems to apply to here too. Generally I only get my dose of politics from C-Span so very seldom and very situational.
>>12284> your asshole is also capable of being buttered up by being cohesive when dealing with the feds
“Cohesive?” I genuinely don’t understand>which I am not, I just think it's the most appropriate one.
That’s a suspiciously specific denial. It would make a lot of sense, though.
Doug Funnie = Short for Funkenstein
Skeeter Valentine = Originally Valenstein
Patty Mayonaise = Originally Mayo
Everyone character on that show is a crypto Jew.
What does being a compliant bystander have to do with opsec? Do you think they’re in on it, anon?
Is that what the glowie flag is about? You wanting so hard to be a cop?
Sorry turned off my flag for a second.>>12288
Whole show takes place on an """"operating system""""". Only one non-kiked OS.
You're talking to bots anon.
Alright, imma go archive this thread now, then. I hadn't had this much fun since the October raid.
its openly christian
>call it a day and go to sleep
>a thread with 30 replies, now has over 800 replies
Leftypol took some bait again, innit?