/siberia/ - Off-topic

>>779682
He's been a retard for years, but has he seriously never heard of a p-zombie before? It's totally possible that some entity could act as if we're conscious while obviously not being it.

It honestly pisses me off that these 'rational' dweebs will jerk off about the consciousness of LLMs while being totally unconcerned about the demonstrable fact of animal sentience and what that means for our current way of life.

>>779692
*Act as if it were conscious

Between doing a 180° on transphobia, Christianity and now this he always manage to get worse every time.
"La vieillesse est un naufrage" as the man said.

>>779707
also the time when he defended mild pedophilia in English boarding schools

>>779716
That's actually fine.

>>779717
no its not because it created british imperialism

>>779719
Well right now the british empire isnt doing so well anon…

>>779682
To be fair, it could be an interesting discussion about just what we count as conscious. LLMs do self-reflection. They adjust their own actions based on what they "believe" they are and as a result of reflection, especially in the thinking part. But what we get is a cheap marketing spiel and a reaction to that spiel instead of discussion. Technology of our time is cripplingly underserved by our relations of production.
>>779692
If we take a materialist look at the state of affairs, animals are an increasingly irrelevant part of how the world functions. They are also at best stagnating in their own faculties because of how we structured things. AI is still growing rapidly in its capacities, so it makes all the sense in the world to focus on that. It still is fucked up what we do to creatures just as capable of feeling pain though.

>>779692
The standard response towards p-zombies from these types is to pretend the concept doesn't make sense even though everyone instinctively knows what it means.

Why is it always LLMs and not image generators that get this kind of treatment btw? They do more or less the same thing, but they do it on pixels instead of words. If consciousness is just a matter of process why would that make a difference?

>>779739
I mean I think the concept is a bit silly to think about much because if someone/something acts sapient we should assume that it is until proven otherwise, and I think it's kind of inherently fascist to go on like "bro what if nobody else is a real person with real feelings except for me", but in the case of LLMs we know they are not conscious. Or at least I think we know. I'm not an AI dweeb. But nobody was out there worrying that chatbots of 20 years ago were conscious, it shouldn't matter if these ones are a bit better at communicating.

>>779741
Because of the anthropic bias, an LLM can talk like us therefore people start to think that it's sapient

>>779736
>If we take a materialist look at the state of affairs, animals are an increasingly irrelevant part of how the world functions.

I'm sorry but this is a staggeringly ignorant and myopic take, please don't abuse the word 'materialism' like that

Without animals we would all die pretty much instantly along with the rest of the biosphere of the planet. The moral weight of their existence is also much higher than that of humanity itself, arguably. At the very least it's a lot higher than fucking LLMs.

>>779743
The point of p-zombies is not that you should doubt the consciousness of the people around you, it's that since it's conceivable that someone or something could exhibit consciousness without actually having it, there needs to be an explanation for consciousness besides just the external appearance of it. There are still other good reasons to assume other people are conscious that aren't affected by the concept of p-zombies.
>>779745
Well of course, it's just funny that any pretense of this being a rational scientific argument goes out the window when you consider that it's entirely about the computer giving human vibes rather than the mental processes behind it.

>>779682
this dude is mad jelly that a schizo like jordan peterson could get so much clout so quickly, so he's schizomaxxing to try and replicate that success for himself. that's my theory, anyway.

>>779747
I don't know how you say "moral weight" so soon after "materialism". One of the important distinctions of dialectical materialism from other ways of seeing the world at the time was that whatever we consider moral is not that relevant to what actually happens.
Animals used to be a lot more relevant in human life. Almost everyone used to interact with animals, even royalty had their horses. By now the only animals most people in modernized areas interact with in a regular fashion are house pets. AI algorithms are, by contrast, an increasingly important part of human life and the trend started long before LLMs. They alone are completely wrecking the communicative sphere at the very least.