/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>1738966
>radiofreeeurope
aren't you guys the least bit critical of this very blatant propaganda piece that tries to portray stalin as an evil "literally hitler" "tryant"? really? is it not obvious this is just edited to make russians seem like zealots and stalin look a cult idol … when the reality is that russians know better than else that stalin had actually been a great leader but was not actually a "dictator" like radiofreeeurope might suggest … but we are on so many layers of anticommunist propaganda with RadioFreeEurope that we aren't even speaking to the WHY Russians and many other post soviets have "soviet nostaligia" and that those reasons are fundamentally material and not based on idealistic premises like this video tries to present. the Soviet Union had zero homelessness, higher life expectancy, better healthcare outcomes, everyone had the guarantee of a job, rent could not exceed a certain portion of your income, public transportation was plentiful and clean, the government would literally retrain you and reemploy you as necessary and compensate you if your job was obsoleted and replaced. Gorbachev's capitalist restoration was premised on the assumption that the soviet economy could not advance for as long as workers had the right to a job… but of course it is necessary to ask advance for whom? this was all cover for the capitalist restoration. it was smoke and mirrors and subterfuge and use of force by way of the disbanding of labor unions and the communist party, by way of ripping up the constitution and dissolving the Soviet Union illegally, etc

Uploaded an interesting propaganda image made by the US to downplay the effects of Agent Orange on civilians etc. Can anyone help translate the Vietnamese?
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/File:U.S._propaganda_for_agent_orange_1.jpg

>>1744116
Dead thread but I'll give it a shot. I'll also try the SEA thread while I'm at it. Thanks

I've been away for a while, but here's some new stuff:

"The term Dark Ages in its modern usage properly refers to the relative paucity of written records and histories during the Early Middle Ages. In English history, for example, the era of Germanic colonization is a mostly unknown, or "dark", period in history; such gaps in history also occur in Byzantine records and elsewhere. This darkness is even more evident when studying the histories of Southern and Eastern European languages such as Albanian, not found in writing until 1462, and Romanian, not attested until 1521."
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/European_Middle_Ages

"Classical society reached its zenith with the Roman Empire, which brought vast expanses of modern Europe, Africa, and Asia into one polity, taking its cultural, technological, and economic forms with it. The empire spanned 5 million km2 (1.9 million mi2) at its height in 117 AD. During the third century AD, the empire entered a period of sharp economic and political crisis which ended only with the centralizing reforms of emperor Diocletian (r. 284-305). The contradictions and struggles of maintaining such a large area, compounded by the threat of tribal groups from the North and East, forced Diocletian to significantly transform the Roman imperial system, including by revolutionary new forms of military organization, a revised taxation system, and eventually, an administrative division of the Empire into East and West. In the 5th century, the Western half faced renewed crisis and eventual collapse into regional states, while the Eastern Empire continued to exist for centuries."
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Classical_antiquity

"'And while professors thus disagree, the ideas that there is a necessary conflict between capital and labor, that machinery is an evil, that competition must be restrained and interest abolished, that wealth may be created by the issue of money, that it is the duty of government to furnish capital or to furnish work, are rapidly making way among the great body of the people, who keenly feel a hurt and are sharply conscious of a wrong. Such ideas, which bring great masses of men, the repositories of ultimate political power, under the leadership of charlatans and demagogues, are fraught with danger….'"
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Georgism

I'm aware of the glaring lack of current events. History is happening so fast right now WRT the Middle East that I haven't even been tried to keep up with it. I'm not sure what to prioritize but in any case the site is always open to people who want to add little sources, facts, arguments that need more coverage.

Also: we have a real spam filter now. Upside is that we won't get raided; downside is that new edits will not show up immediately. Hit me up with any questions or concerns.

I need input on where to take "Views of Karl Marx on Jews". I only created it as somewhere for Jack Barn (no longer very active) to put his whining (see >>1634270), but he never took me up on it. I had hoped it could become a page for acknowledging the attacks on Marx with a balanced discussion - an inoculation, if you like.
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Views_of_Karl_Marx_on_Jews

Should it be (a) turned into a large quote mine, (b) written as a discussion in paragraph form with citations (i.e. "he also made some statements about Lassalle[2][3][4][5][6][7][8]")… or simply deleted?

>>1765859
>I need input on where to take "Views of Karl Marx on Jews"
to the trash

>>1769570
I don't think so. Marx being antisemitic is a common smear and having a page of ready sources to debunk that wouldn't hurt.

>>1771973
But your article didn't debunk anything. I think the only way you could do that would be to get the specific quotes people consider antissemtic and then refute those specifically.

>>1775708
nta but what is there to refute? those quotes (like the one you posted) are fake, marx never wrote that

>>1775716
Page 600 idiot.

>>1776060
waiting from the pivot from "Marx never wrote that" to "actually it's based and correct."

>>1776119
An article he published in a newspaper you illiterate retard later compiled into that book by his daughter.

>>1776148
I'm open to alternative explanations tho. Let's keep working through the rationalizations.

So we've already determined that:
A. It was not a letter but a news article
B. His daughter has ascribed it to him

What is our next rationalization? She was just mistaken?

>>1775708
>your article
I wrote the entire article, not that anon.
>the only way you could do that would be to get the specific quotes people consider antissemtic and then refute those specifically
Exactly, that was one of the options I offered here >>1765859 namely:
<(a) turned into a large quote mine
Your description could also apply to (b), where it would be basically the same but boiled down (and with all quotes exhaustively cited, but in the footnotes only). The choice I am offering is between a long tedious article, a short paraphrasing article, or no article.

I do not care if you decide to portray him as based or cringe but I at least want a space for people to argue against the unoriginal right-wing spam, as >>1771973 says

>>1775708
>But your article didn't debunk anything.
It's not my article, I just think there should be one.

>>1776069
https://karlradl14.substack.com/p/a-textual-analysis-of-karl-marxs
Here you go

Wiki is in the process of being upgraded (or something, I'm not /stem/) Edits may not be working for the time being

>>>/leftypol/1788633
Leftypol-LLM-GPT, give me a leftypedia article about this person and all their spooky connections, drawing from the every known text, audio and video source.
Leftypol-dumbGPT/algorithm, check the veracity of the article your sibling just wrote.
Is that how this shit works?

>>1789408
This is a weird post but anyway I made some starter pages for you:

"A member of the notorious Kagan family, Nuland has played a role in neoconservative imperialist US foreign policy since at least the 1990s."
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Victoria_Nuland

"Members of the family have had a tremendous influence on neoconservative thought and US foreign policy since the turn of the century, including through the Project for the New American Century, an instrumental group influencing the imperialist program of the George W. Bush administration; advocating for the Iraq War troop surge of 2007; sustaining US involvement in Afghanistan; supporting US intervention in Syria and Ukraine under Obama, as well as the successful government overthrow of the latter; and continued weapons shipments to Ukraine."
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Kagan_family

good luck getting a GPT to write anything but glowie shit

What happened to the reading general?

>>1789873
>I made some starter pages for you:
You're a gem anon, appreciate the reply.
>This is a weird post
I was kind of talking about the idea of having several different discrete GPT/AI/LLM/Algorithms/whatever checking each others work when completing a task like writing wiki entries. Instead of having one entity like chatGPT in the cloud doing all the work, separate and discrete local and cloud programs would search, sort, assign weight, check veracity, and then a separate language model would write the wiki article. It seems safer than allowing one glowing cloud black box to do all the tasks. Someone in the other thread mentioned the leftypedia so I posted here, kind of realizing later that its off topic for you.
>good luck getting a GPT to write anything but glowie shit
For sure. It seems like the only trustworthy AI is something local that you've trained yourself.

Why not contribute to ProleWiki?
https://www.prolewiki.org

So if the only source I can find for a data point is audio, like a 45 min lecture, is it possible to upload it to a specific page after converting to ogg or whatever?

>>1791631
Yep, should work! OGG, MP3, probably others too. See if it works for ya:
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Special:Upload
I will add that YouTube embeds are also a newly restored feature that, I'm told, should be easy to use.

RedParabola is a new user who's been making great contributions to the site's general look, including the front page and the Vector skin itself, as well as finally implementing a Featured Page functionality. We hope to keep customizing the way the site works and looks and are open to feedback. Thanks also to the Devs for their help in making this possible

>>1814941
Thanks mate, we appreciate the work

Hello folks, I was hoping someone could give me some decent literature on the Babiy Yar massacre in English, I wish to send it to a friend for them to study. It's hard to find anything non-Russian on the subject that doesn't insert anti-communist drivel into it and unfortunately, unlike myself, she cannot read Russian. Help a comrade out.

The fbi.gov server is voting now on our Principles and Aims. These are intended to clarify and overwrite the old Principles and Aims of Leftypedia. The final results will be posted in this thread, where you can read about the issues yourself, and please feel free to comment here or there:

https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Leftypedia:Suggestions#Principles

>>1887366
The old pages on the goals of Leftypedia were found wanting and some users in the fbi.gov supported changing some – namely, the points dealing with the ideas "politically correct" and "politically incorrect".
These are the principles which were submitted for review in May of this year:

Principles
- Leftist and Marxist: Ultimate objective is to further these studies, and add science and philosophy in accordance with Marxist and anarchist objectives.
- Non-sectarian: Strive to balance different tendencies or leftist "sects", and allow their positions as long as they are fairly stated. Strive to treat their citations and sources by an equal and fair standard.
- Anti-capitalist: This includes anti-imperialism.
- Skeptical: Combine a healthy doubt of hegemonic sources with support from verifiable, credible alternatives.
- Ease of access and editing: Make site easy to edit, discuss, and also easy to understand and apply the rules and procedures. Easy to approach the mods. Also include accessible pages with links to tools for editing.
- Not politically correct: Oppose superficial liberal analyses of social problems and aim to document all leftist viewpoints. To exclude these positions is to erase them, and thereby to fail to scrutinize and improve our own views.
- Not politically incorrect: Uphold basic etiquette and respect for others while allowing criticism. Contributors who take issue with "politically correct" content are allowed to voice their objections, and those who have objections to politically incorrect content must always voice theirs respectfully. Personal accusations of bigotry should be avoided.

These principles do not define what each article must lean towards, or a bias every page must hold. Leftism is a real movement and not a set of doctrines to uphold. Leftypedia is intended for critical debate and discussion of historical facts for the improvement of the science of revolution, and input from even our enemies is allowed to some extent.

Aims
Our aims can be summarized in seven main points. We want Leftypedia to be:
1. An easily accessible resource for socialists of all stripes to locate well-researched arguments and information on politics, history, and modern issues.
2. A platform for interested leftists to collaborate and develop original discourse on issues relevant to fellow proletarians and socialists alike.
3. A reliable and balanced source of news and information to help leftists better comprehend and refute the propaganda and fabrications of bourgeois media, including about working class struggles or foreign "enemies" of imperialist states.
4. A platform for leftists to synthesize, exposit, and critique the writings of notable socialists, using detailed sources and quotations, to innovate on past experience and to advance the science of socialism.
5. A space for leftists to elaborate on their contentions with other socialist tendencies in order to better inform and expand the worldview of others.
6. A space for socialists to take advantage of the collaborative nature of the MediaWiki format to compile detailed, informative articles on praxis and other topics relevant to leftist activism, all in one place and continuously expanding.
7. A space for leftists to easily create and share detailed polemics and essays for others to engage with their views.

>>1887378
As I just mentioned, discussion in the server took issue with Principles 6 and 7, and unanimously voted to replace them with:
- Anti-discrimination: A space where leftists from various identities can contribute and discuss topics without fear of bigotry which plagues many parts of the left.

>>1887380
The most active editors are generally in the server. However, interested editors and Anons can still voice their opinion or take issue, including by posting in the Suggestions thread linked above.

Update on the recent vandalism:

Yesterday, RedParabola was instated as an administrator and, within 24 hours, began to tear apart the site and attempt to turn it into a sectarian forum without input from the editors. This was possible because he had made several quality contributions to the site and, unbeknownst to me and Capuch1n, MediaWiki allows new Bureaucrats to change the rights of other, older Bureaucrats. Although I always knew that the /leftypol/ developers and admins would be easily able to revert any vandalism by the new admin – which they have promptly and efficiently done with no issue – I still take responsibility for the latter error. RedParabola is almost certainly an alternate account of the unhinged user "Wisconcom" who has plagued this site and ProleWiki with his strange habit of contributing useful changes which further the project, and then attempting to use this goodwill to enforce his "Hoxhaist" views on others. It has been incorrectly reported that this is due to a split in the community; it is better described as a "moderator coup", carried out against the wishes of the entire editor base, which continues to support our policies. We will continue our project with its previous goal of left dialogue and its Six Principles and Seven Aims as was agreed upon by editor discussion.

>>1889037
lol thanks for keeping me updated on this comedy

Also feels like an amusing blend of Maoism and Trotskyism

Took me like two seconds to fix the style issues on the Main Page with a temporary fix and it looks worlds better. I'll be looking into CSS when I have time in the near future.
https://wiki.leftypol.org/wiki/Main_Page

>>1889454
YES

>>1889037
CLASSIC LEFTISM MOMENT. CAN'T HELP BUT DILUTE THE INTEGRITY OF ANY GIVEN AREA WITH THEIR NEUROSES, MIND YOU THIS IS EVEN APPLICABLE ON A PLACE AS OBSCURE AND IRRELEVANT TO THE REAL WORLD AS THIS, AND THEN WE WONDER WHY THERE'S NO 'LEFT-POWER' APPARENT IN THE WEST. LOOK AT THE STATE OF PETTY, MENTALLY-ILL SECTARIANISM. PLEASE DEVISE ANOTHER SPLIT OUT OF THIS MESSAGE, ACTUALLY, FUCK IT, WHY NOT AT THIS POINT.

>>1896940
Deeply unserious, uninteresting people. Has nothing to do with the left. Take it as what it is, don't see it as more than it is.

New Matrix link: https://matrix.to/#/#Leftypedia:matrix.org
Hope it works properly.

>>1896940
The dude you are talking about is literally autistic and he spends all his time shitposting instead of actually doing anything with his life. He's a perfect example of the type of people who think that posting makes them some kind of Lenin. (See e.g. the Leftychan BS from a few years ago)

>>1889037
What the actual fuck drives this autistic behavior

>>1899687
>The dude you are talking about is
Literally irrelevant to the issue. This is only relevant to shame him, which I don't have a problem with.
See it as a penetration test.
The actual problem will always be one of coordination and processes. Opsec is not just another theory to read and forget.

>>1900495
autism, obviously.

>>1574396
FYI the mods of this wiki, including Harry, have said this is not a leftypol wiki and therefore not a leftypol project, so they are lying in the OP

go ahead and be the 5th editor for this garbagecan wiki before they ban you for no reason, the last 3 ragequit

>>1902909
also leftypol should publicize the identities of the editorial board of leftypol wiki because every single edit goes through moderation and no one even knows who is deciding who posts what

“The Court effectively creates a law-free zone around the President, upsetting the status quo that has existed since the Founding,” Supreme Court Justice Sotomayor wrote. “When the president uses his official powers in any way, under the majority’s reasoning, he now will be insulated from criminal prosecution. Orders the Navy’s Seal Team 6 to assassinate a political rival? Immune. Organizes a military coup to hold onto power? Immune. Takes a bribe in exchange for a pardon? Immune. Immune, immune, immune."

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2024/07/02/wfvt-j02.html

I mean, this is pretty much the definitional opposite of "left wing". This is a mostly right-wing country by law now.

>>1902913
Who cares? Literally, who cares? This SODOMayor "justice" is so frightened about coups and political assassination now being basically legal domestically? Well, for fuck's sake, they have been effectively legal if carried out abroad since time immemorial… And btw, plenty of political assassination have been ordered and carried out by presidential order domestically anyway… Just another veil of fiction being ripped off, and that's all fine and dandy.

>>1902937
I would have expected something interesting happening, but no. Disappointed.

>>1902913
at least now they admit the president is above the law