🗽UNITED STATES POLITICS 🦅< Ecce Homo, Or The Fruits Of Reformism Edition🏈 💵Thread for hellish discussion of the Dying Burger Reich and the pedophile Hitlerite-Zionist clique of the American bourgeoisie and its iron grip upon the greatest bigliest country McGod™ ever gave McMan™ on the face of the McEarth™🌭 🍔
>Things are going to continue to happen in the stupidest ways possible that no one really takes seriously, where every single person compulsively reacts with either cynical grifting or useless panic and appealing to a political system of liberal democracy that is entirely dead and irrelevant. things will continue to get gradually worse, more people will lose their jobs and homes, the most destitute and marginalized will be oppressed by state-backed domestic terrorism, but the decay will simply continue and everyone who isn't actively being imprisoned and forced into slavery or outright exterminated will simply ignore it and maintain a cognitive dissonance of believing a civil war is happening while living their lives in a mostly normal fashion. The death of the United States will be slow, painful, and insufferably annoying and stupid. <Death to the scourge of the earth, the destroyer of nations, the father of fascism, the enabler of ethnostates, the treatlerite tyrant, the protector of pedophiles, the exporter of ecocide, the captain of capitalism, the king of coups, the sultan of sanctions, the emir of the embargo, the autocrat of austerity, the doge of deregulation, the baron of busting unions, the prince of privatization, the lord of loan sharks, the patron-saint of proxy wars, the sponsor of settlers, the guarantor of genocides, the invader of islands, the Divided $nakkkes of Amerikkka™ 🛠️ Strike Tracker ⚒️
https://striketracker.ilr.cornell.edu/🇺🇸 Deeds of the Burger Reich 🇺🇸
https://github.com/dessalines/essays/blob/main/us_atrocities.mdhttps://williamblum.org/essays/read/overthrowing-other-peoples-governments-the-master-list📺 Glowie News 📺
(sponsored by the Burger Eagle Freedom Institute (formerly USAID))
• CNN:
https://www.livenewsnow.com/american/cnn-news-usa.html• MSNBC:
https://www.livenewsnow.com/american/msnbc.html• FOX:
https://www.livenewsnow.com/american/fox-news-channel.html• Bloomberg:
https://www.bloomberg.com/live/us🏚️ Local News 🏚️
https://www.50states.com/ce/✊Live Protest Streams✊
https://woke.net/🏝️ Epstein's Client List🏝️
https://epsteinsblackbook.com/🇮🇱 Track Zionazis (apparently ShareBlue backed, gross)🇮🇱
https://www.trackaipac.com/📖Read, Burgga, Read! 📖
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXUFLW8t2sntNn5jQO8vF7ai9x0fna3PVPrevious thread:
>>2567741Remember to filter mass tor baiters, feds, and trolls
Not reporting is bourgeois
Violators will be launched from trebuchet
zohran cucked out
trump cucked out
>>2569004Red-Brown alliance?
>>2569006actually existing centrism
This is the power of maga maoism
>>2569012"chat there's blood in my shit, is this le red brown alliance"
"my brother in christ you have colon cancer"
Holy shit Trump just recited the Shahada on live TV! Truly there is no God but Allah and Muhammad is his prophet!
>"for some reason the press has found this a very interesting meeting"
lol
>FDR mentioned
Rooseveltism anon forever vindicated
What even was the the point of the House of Reps condeming socialism?
>>2569023>Trump:I FOUND THE LOST PORTRAIT OF FDRThis meeting is something
>>2569026lost fdr painting from the VAULTS
Why does mamdani winning this hard cause so much seethe?
>>2569022truth nuke truth nuke truth nuke truth nuke truth nuke truth nuke truth nuke truth nuke
see
>>2568897Graham Platner, Zohran Mamdani, and John Fetterman, all had campaigns managed by Fight Agency, a consultancy firm for the Democratic Party.
https://archive.is/3Y62C >>2569028Jealousy. This was pretty fucking crazy. Nobody can deny he's charming. Trump is acting like they're old friends for real.
>>2569028ikr it's driving them insane LMFAO
>>2569028It's hilarious.
The press wanted a fight.
>>2569028They were itching for some back and forth Trump-Zelensky moments
>>2569038>it's increasingly looking like the ruling class recognizes socdems as a necessary pressure valveare you really just realizing this? succdems have been playing the same game for like 100 years or more
>>2569038>unfortunately it's increasingly looking like the ruling class recognizes socdems as a necessary pressure valveThere is zero chance that they're going to let any sort of social democracy happen.
>>2569047It'll be like how the bourgeoisie allowed socialism in one country, now it's social democracy in one city
>>2569050You a unc.
That's AI bro
Every doomposter is an IDF agent. The fact that they're mind broken by mamdani knocking it out of the park is evidence of it.
This is going to be real fun to watch
>>2569028What was "won" here exactly? the congress voted to condemn socialism and we're about to attack venezuela. What did Madani "get" from this meeting?
The fact that asking these questions gets shutdown with thought-terminating buzzwords should tell you something. What are the real concrete gains.
>>2569056Exactly, even mossad cannot hasbara away the inevitable rising tide of socialism
>>2569057what were you expecting to "win" here? this isn't a paradox game you schizo
>>2569050The attempted mimicry of a camcorder timestamp actually looks more fake than the rest of it. A camcorder time stamp would include the time and not just the date, and I've never seen the apostrophe incldued in the abbreviated year on a camcorder. ('04)
>>2569026It had some subtle insane moments
>>2569004Is this MAGA Communism?
>>2569059it was the other anon who claimed that mamdani is "winning" here and I'm asking what was won. Also I like your consoomerbrained implication that I am somehow saying real life is just like a paradox game because I wondered aloud about the strategies and tactics of an elected official.
>>2569038>So dont expect anything revolutionary folks. the minimal expectation from mamdani is that he will keep ICE out of NY, but from the meeting I got the chilling sensation that he's going to cave to trump.
>>2569059>what were you expecting to "win" here? nothing because i'm not a reformist. i'm investigating the claim that anything was won here.
>>2569057he won a few pats on the arm from trump
I think Mamdani did as good a job as possible. Trump invited him, what was he supposed to do? Snub him? And then I don't know how much a better job he could've done in the oress conference.
>>2569057>MadaniI love how rightoids are unable to spell this guy's name right
>>2569038> and I hopeI remember that feeling
>>2569069no see mamdani was supposed to declare trump an enemy of the people and raise the flag of socialism over the white house with his splinter cell infiltrating the white house and offing trump on live tv. I am a serious person!
>>2569073considering people are still falling for 250 year old tricks like bourgeois reformism, the AI trickery is just a cherry on top
>>2569069You have to remember that the majority of posters here are antisocial retards who think that mamdani should've started shanking trump and declared revolution on live television
zohran status?
>>2569079as well as being unironic, proud pedos. reminder this used to be an 8chan board.
>>2569079>let me introduce a wild strawmanno i don't think he "should have" "shanked" trump on live TV, I'm asking what the working class is "winning" from this meeting and being told, variously, that I am a secret fuentoid, a secret israeli, a secret democrat, a secret republican, a secret bourgeois, a third worldist, a zigger, or whatever other thought terminating strawman accusation can be used to avoid answering a very basic question.
it is too early to make judgements about the drumpf mahmudi meeting, let us sleep on it
>>2569050AI. by that date trump had more hair. also, all the books had their names melting away.
also this:
>>2569060 >>2569086Mao was clearly a class collaborationist social fascist for meeting with Nixon and doing the stuff you're supposed to do in politics instead of stabbing him on the spot with a bayonet
>>2569093i love strawman posting that is indistinguishable from false flag posting
>>2569098muh logical fellatio
>>2569024I mean that's what all the Bernie-aligned candidates have pointed to as their ideal since 2016. It's not a new trope. I harp on "Rooseveltism" for a reason, because it is, nine times out of ten, what an American means when they call themselves a socialist.
>>2569069It went pretty well. If you went back in time 15 years ago and told me the mayor of New York city affirmed his belief in democratic socialism in the White House I'd call you a liar, but it happened
>>2569095looking on flightaware above venezuela looks like a bunch of small private jets and cessna planes, and a ukrainian cargo plane going from Trinidad crossing this no fly zone. seems a little strange.
it's interesting how important is commissioner tisch for trump that he commented and pointed out tisch specifically out of all the things, and makes me wonder if that social media wrestling between mamdani and trump (one calls the other fascist, the other replies that he's a commie that won't help NYC, etc.) was because tisch might have had her position under fire.
well, another I fell for it again medal for the succdems.
>>2569111ok I love seeing john podhoretz having a melty
>>2569112ty flightlog guy, i never have the energy to look at those
Mamdani-Trump meeting going 'well' is to shake up the media cycle which expected a different kind of kayfabe, so that in this moment of confusion, it neither reports on the Epstein files, nor on the Special Military Operation in Venezuela.
>>2569058Even Trump agreed that the anti-socialist resolution was meaningless
>>2569056it's not "doomposting" to acknowledge that the american government openly affirms its hatred of socailism and prepares to attack another country while mamdani hangs out with trump, it's pointing out that to avoid "doom" you, the american working class, have to do more than just rely on reformists like mamdani and soyface at everything they do on camera (remember when people started calling AOC always on camera? well now mamdani is the new AOC)
But folks, it's all about this thing they call central planning. Central planning, that's the big phrase they're saying. They're saying that if you dont plan things, your economy is very bad! These companies, they make billions and billions but they're not giving back. They're being very bad. And that's why we have to do central planning. And we're going to plan things up from the very top folks. That's why it's central. There was a book I read a while ago…what was his name, Karl Marx I think, he said you gotta plan. And folks we'll be doing so much planning you wont believe.
>>2569128These people are losing their fucking minds
Warren on CNN right now glazing Mamdani.
https://www.livenewsnow.com/american/cnn-live-free.htmlI should switch to Fox to see how they're seething.
>>2569139Turd worldist classic.
i see lots of people giving their 2cents about why trump treated mamdani so well, and no one has pointed out that he's a fucking fruit who has a thing for handsome aloof confident guys. he's fucking gay!!!
>>2569142Do you guys think he's sucked Mamdanis cock already?
>>2569144he thought about it at least
>>2569145Well who hasn't?
>>2569141Hes actually using the reductio to show how absurd imperialist dick rider logic is. You crying about third worldism is the exact same noise the dick riders make when leftists say joining millitary or supporting left imperialists is bad
>>2569142>i see lots of people giving their 2cents about why trump treated mamdani so well, and no one has pointed out that he's a fucking fruit who has a thing for handsome aloof confident guys. he's fucking gay!!!I said that to my friend just now. I think he has a thing for Muslim guys.
It's funny too because I remember during the campaign Trump going on about how "Mamdani is totes not hawt." I think he was fighting his urges.
Y'know the fact that someone was posting earlier about Zohran coming down on Zionists using synagogues as a location to encourage immigration to Israeli synagogues but people on here are freaking out that he "supports Genocide" (how?) kinda reinforces the idea that people on the Left care more about maintaining a radical aesthetic drenched in hyperbole than anything real.
You wont find Israelis praising Zohran, they aren't saying "he's one of us", in fact they're deeply frustrated by him, but you'll still get people hyperbolically acting like he supports settlements because… he's talking like a generic public figure? He's not crashing out like anons on here? Trump shook his hand?
Like I think there's a certain personality that reads Marx and Lenin and thinks "being a socialist" means you've got to have some constantly furrowed brow and seem angry all the time.
>>2569020I guess everyone was expecting some kind of big and hilarious confrontation because US politics have been pure WWE or lolcow tier drama for the past few years but this meeting was a return to the boring as hell professional diplomacy and hypocrisy of normal politics.
>>2569150western leftoids are so addicted to losing they cant take even a tiny rhetorical or PR win
I fucking told you Cuckdani would sell our almost immediately.
>>2569152>>2569155I thought you guys said he already betrayed sold out the left before he was even elected.
>>2569075Get your story straight.
>>2569154>"WHAT IS THE WORKING CLASS WINNING BY MAMDANI VISITING TRUMP?!"What is the working class winning from Mamdani making a sandwich? What is it winning from him taking a bus? What is it winning from him watching a movie?
Trump's the President, Mamdani is a mayor, the President asked to meet with a mayor. Mamdani met with the President. And people are tearing their hair out as if Zohran fucked their mother on live television.
>>2569161That's because he did right in front of them you just didn't see it because it was so fast it was one frame there next frame gone. Just like Trump going down on Bubba.
>>2569149Bro uses “Palestinian” as an insult. Wow
>>2569139Who takes this racist sex pest seriously? He’s not as bad as Agent Kochinski but he’s not good
>>2569174>racist>sex pestjust making shit up now
>>2569139leftists when told that hating america isn't a personality
>>2569167He called Biden a Palestinian during the debates lol
>>2569180Most annoying woman ever. I hope Trump ends up falling out with her like he did with Musk.
>>2569161>Trump's the President, Mamdani is a mayor, the President asked to meet with a mayor. Mamdani met with the President. And people are tearing their hair out as if Zohran fucked their mother on live television.i'm not "tearing my hair out" like laura loomer, I'm asking the people who keep saying this meeting specifically was a "big win" what was won, because it is taking place against a backdrop of another imperialist war looming. My god. Some anons are actually keeping their eye on the ball here and other anons put the spectacle at the forefront, and then when we reject the spectacle you say the spectacle is making us tear our hair out.
>>2569185she's a genocidal beast, a much worse crime than being annoying
I would bend over backwards for Mamdani on god why is he so hot. Bet he has a huge cock. I want him to tickle my boyeggs.
>>2569154the "rhetorical PR win" is taking place against a much more relevant backdrop of US amassing forces in Venezuela. How much more time does the US left need winning PR victories before they achieve the substantial goal of getting the US military to stop killing people all over the planet for resources.
>>2569180this whole regime is eating itself alive lol
>>2569186Nothing was won or accomplished by this meeting but it ain't the end of the world and a betrayal either. Both pro-Zohran and anti-Zohran people need to chill.
Trumpers are seething at trump over mamdani lol. Look at comments
https://patriots.win/p/1ARcuUdYKk>>2569194Scroll past the first one go further down
>>2569193I'm not "anti-zohran" like this is a popularity contest for a celebrity, I'm anti-reformism. my anti-reformism has nothing to do with my opinion of zohran as a person but my recognition that the world doesn't have time for the USA to go through another 3 phases of rooseveltism and putting band aids on capitalism's boo boos.
>>2569094I'mma be honest you could probably get quite a few votes on the "kill all congressmen" bit
>>2569194i want material victories of the US military pulling out of the places it attacks, not the immaterial victory of people i don't like seething over a media cycle that will be forgotten in 1 week.
>>2569198
she has a sizeable audience of horny retards, she can survive as a politically homeless influencer
Man there are millions upon millions of working class people who live in places that aren't New York or LA. Really do not care about these cities or the rich yuppies that reside in them. Only reason you hear so much about them is because every failed actor turned leftist youtuber lives in one of them.
"My socdem mayor and orange ᴉuᴉlossnW are buddy buddy, what a vibe!" There will never be revolution in America will there? They must found someone hogtied and executed, not the first time, at an ICE concentration camp. But hey, at least we got to meet with Hitler!
>>2569200Let me enjoy my treats sir
>Pressed on whether he believed Trump was a fascist, Trump interjected before the Mayor elect could answer. “That’s okay, you can just say ‘yes.’ It’s easier than explaining it. I don’t mind.”
dead
>TRUMP showering praise on Mamdani in the White House may throw House Republicans for a loop. The House GOP has signaled their entire 2026 campaign plan is to tie Democrats to Mamdani
everything under heaven is in utter chaos
>>2569215
if the left in the US had any political influence Trump would 100% pretend to be a socialist. he's an opportunist in the purest form possible
>>2569215
Please name a random left wing person he is allied with. If he’s really allied with random people.
>>2569213the situation is excellent
>>2569219>if the left in the US had any political influence Trump would 100% pretend to be a socialist. he's an opportunist in the purest form possibleand many on here would believe it unconditionally and call everyone not falling for it a disguised reactionary or shill or something, because anything in the latest forgettable spectacle that makes the worst people seethe is treated, by certain people, as a real revolutionary development
>>2569169People want to relitigate the collapse of the 2nd international so bad. But when Lenin repudiated Kautsky at least Kautsky actually voted for war credits. He did something fucking stupid, he committed an actual betrayal. This is just whining over rhetoric and aesthetics—it’s hyperbolic nonsense where you’re literally killing babies by just saying the softest shit possible while the dudes actually murdering infants are screaming this soft spoken guy is gonna destroy them all.
Mamdani isn’t a Marxist-Leninist. He never said he was. This is like claiming a fucking pop star “sold out”—pop isn’t indie, it never was.
>>2569217>>2569223hasbara demoralization campaign
>>2569226Are you actually supposing the imperialist dick riders are innocent? That no blood is on their hands
>>2569226You put "sold out" in quotes while nobody ITT has unironically said that. All I see is accusations that
others are saying that. Maybe if you weren't so busy erecting strawmen pre-emptively you'd engage with the actual criticism ITT, which is that the mamdani/meme-donny summit is an irrelevant spectacle while the US prepares to attack venezuela
>>2569013recently made a similar joke to a friend. we're both german and talked about burgers blowing up northstream. i said labour aristocracy and treat economy discourse nonwithstanding it's kinda fucked up what they did to our actually existing bourgeois state.
>>2569224optics actually does matter and it's foolish to believe otherwise given how much of a stupid period of history we're living through where shitposts can decide elections. making fun of reactionary seething will continue, morale will improve
500,000 or more Palestinians have been killed by Israel but Zohran can't even acknowledge that, going with the 61k number that everyone has been using for 2 years. These genocidal ghouls will say anything to get power.
>>2569232Zohran has sold out. To deny this is to have dick up ass. He sold workers and peasants time and time again loke when he called hamas war criminals
>>2569234well after all, the burger empire needs the TRILLIONS of dollars of minerals the dirty donbass separatists are sitting on, and no amount of terrorism, destruction of infrastructure, and using ukrainian people as a human shield is off the table to achieve that goal.
>>2569240You sound very Indian.
>>2569240i don't believe he sold out because he was always a reformist
>>2569243Mamdani is literally Indian and "you sound like race I don't like" is a /pol/ tier non argument.
>>2569226He said he was socialist, which is lie to workers and peasants. He bail out business and dick ride pigs. You are dick rider
>>2569240He was always a Zionist. Always a demsoc. Always an imperialist. Always a politician. This shit is why I would never support the DSA, reform is for imperialists. Revolution is the only way to bring liberation.
>>2569245I mean you sound like someone who physically lives in India and spends their time getting paid pennies to shitpost at the behest of right-wing causes. In this case hasbara demoralizaiton. Probably were spamming shit about Platner a week ago.
>>2569246When people say they are socialist in the USA it 9 times out of 10 means they are Rooseveltist reformists tailing the US democratic party. There is no reason to believe otherwise. That's just what socialist means to burgers.
>>2569252>trust busting>affordability>anti monopoly>rebuild the militaryyep. rooseveltism.
>>2569251>he had an image ready to goToo stupid not to prove my point. All you know how to do is spam, there's no subtlety to it.
Hasbara agents are getting too obvious.
>>2569254oh wow, i "had an image ready to go"
that "proves i'm a shill"
because i "have a talking point ready"
instead of just screeching "america first you stinky indian" like you do.
>>2569226>This is just whining over rhetoric and aesthetics—it’s hyperbolic nonsense >This is like claiming a fucking pop star “sold out”—pop isn’t indie, it never was.ok ChatgptUSAnon
>>2569244They say reformist but he really isnt a reformist. You say you have no expectations therefore you know he is conservative and you stand to gain nothing. So why do they keep rising the dick
>>2569226cpusanon doesn't miss
>>2569254I'm a "hasbara agent" for pointing out that Platner has a blackwater sticker on his fridge and a stepbrother who is AIPAC. I teleported to his house and made all this happen. just like i forced platner to serve 4 tours of duty attacking iraq and afghanistan in the marine corps infantry, just like i forceed platner to work for constellis (blackwater) in 2018, just like i forced platner to get a totenkopf tattoo in croatia and praise azov battalion from his reddit account. just like i forced him to admit he joined the military specifically to "have an adventure" and "kill people"
fuck off dude. your'e actually shilling platner, a democrat backed by the same campaign agency that ran john fetterman's campaign, and saying i'm indian because i point out his stepbrother has aipac ties. actually fuck right off.
>>2569263some anons on here are so deeply reactionary they will use essentialist racial arguments and call you "indian" instead of coming up with a real counter argument when presented with the info that their latest succdem celebrity is a blackwater mercenary with a zionist stepbrother
>>2569050the only thing that prevented me from thinking this is not AI is the improbability of someone taking a photo of the blowjob
The AI is getting too good
We are so fucked
>>2569266what should have thrown you off is that it's 2020 Trump sucking off 1993 Clinton. The age difference is staggering.
>>2569259how am I only just now seeing this site linked on here this goes hard
>>2569226>Mamdani isn’t a Marxist-Leninist.The funny thing is actually is.
People on the left are fucking retarded tho. The right-wingers no full damn well about "hiding power levels" but stupid fucking leftists think anyone that isn't going:
>DEATH TO AMERIKKKAN TREATLERITES! UPHOLD MAO THOUGHT! VIVA LA REVOLUCION!every breath is a sell-out.
Do these idiots think someone can run for American politics and talk about how Marx and Lenin and Mao were like the greatest influences in their life or something. Fucking idiots.
It's really not worth debating any of this shit because their train of thought is so simplistic there is no nuance or anything that can reach them:
>Elections = Booj democracy>If you run for office you = automatic fascist>If you actually win an election = super-duper-triple-plus-fascistSo anyone who tries running for anything is inherently bad and whatever argument they bring up is downstream from that position, so it doesn't matter if you proved them wrong on everything, when Mamdani is inherently bad for running and certainly for winning.
>>2569217>>256922348 shekels deposited in your bank account
>>2569186My comments are more the people acting like it’s a betrayal. I see people snickering at Trump being a Queeny Retard and freaking out his base, any “win” from this is just an image win for Zohran, that’s about it.
>>2569249>“That’s a lie to the workers!”Are we talking actually existing workers or an abstract quality we call “the workers” that one imagines as perfectly read up on theory and revolutionary? Cause I imagine most workers in New York would like the charming Muslim guy talking about making their lives more affordable than people ranting about, I dunno, “the renegade Kautsky”. At present there ain’t a working class demanding a Leninist vanguard in NYC—you go up against Mamdani as he is right now and you just look callously indifferent or insane to them.
>>2569232Remind me what this image represents if not claiming Mamdani “sold out” or “deceived” people in some way.
>>2569009Lemme guess “Hurr actually we aren’t pushing back against people by saying he sold out, we’re attacking the imaginary demographic that thinks he’s gonna make NYC into a commune!” No one thinks that, absolutely no one has ever said on here that they think Mamdani is gonna be the Vanguard of the revolution and if anyone here claims there’s this huge demographic hoping he’ll prompt a revolution they’re lying. He literally just promised free busses and more affordability to New Yorkers. And despite the best efforts of those who claim we should take zero stock in reforming the obvious deficiencies of capitalism in front of us, and ascribing those benefits to “Socialism” however loose the label is applied, it turns out people respond to that a hell if a lot better than just screaming they’re fascists if they want their monthly bills to not risk tossing them on the streets.
>>2569217What’s wrong with acknowledging Israeli civilians didn’t deserve to be killed?
>>2569281Some people here expect mamdani to put on a green bandana and tell reporters he supports Hamas and wants Israel to be nuked. Anything short of that is failure
>>2569278You are zionisms strongest soldier
>>2569150one of these days the western left is going to need to learn that the real movement is not like the Rapture where a revolution spontaneously happens and then we simply achieve communism in one fell swoop. organizing and getting anything real done actually requires patience, consistency, boring hard work, and having to shake hands with people you loathe if your movement gets to the point of having any real political influence. but a lot of people on here have an extremely immature and entitled mindset about these sorts of things that smacks of basement dwelling red chuds who have never done any organizing or read theory (or read too much theory >mao.jpg) and think that we can simply do a revolution immediately right now (but also can't and never will because every single westerner is personally to blame for US imperialism).
but ironically the real movement is probably going to leave behind a lot of so-called communists and socialists in the west because people in places like leftypol are part of a dying breed of leftoid ideologues who do have advanced consciousness nor do they have the capability to ever become a Vanguard. these are people who are only concerned with the aesthetics of communism and have chosen a very specific way to feel morally superior to people instead of actually doing anything whatsoever to indicate that they are serious about the things that they claim to care about.
>>2569277he's not a marxist leninist just because he made some meme tweets, he's a self described democratic socialist who won an election running as a democrat in a bourgeois party on a platform of making transit more affordable. "Oh he's hiding his power level blah blah blah". OK that argument can only take you so far.
>>2569277yeah, i know what scientific socialism is. it was specifically a break with utopian socialism. Engels identified 3 types of utopian socialism: Reactionary socialism, bourgeois socialism, and democratic socialism. Mamdani represents the third type, which communists are open to working with, but not unconditionally.
>>2569284>Some people here expect mamdani to put on a green bandana and tell reporters he supports Hamas and wants Israel to be nuked. Anything short of that is failureNobody here actually says that, this is just a strawman.
>>2569287>one of these days the western left is going to need to learn that the real movement is not like the Rapture where a revolution spontaneously happens and then we simply achieve communism in one fell swoop. I literally say this all the time to people who come in here and say China is imperialist, but I have a little less patience for this line of reasoning when it defends reformism under an empire, rather than realpolitik under AES
>>2569078it's too on the nose that the biggest industry bougies are orbiting towards is a literal tricknology machine
>>2569288People here literally get mad at him for using official numbers of Gaza death toll which Hamas uses. They come up with anything to attack mamdani
>>2569279>Are we talking actually existing workers or an abstract quality we call “the workers” that one imagines as perfectly read up on theory and revolutionary? Cause I imagine most workers in New York would like the charming Muslim guy talking about making their lives more affordable than people ranting about, I dunno, “the renegade Kautsky”. At present there ain’t a working class demanding a Leninist vanguard in NYC—you go up against Mamdani as he is right now and you just look callously indifferent or insane to them.I'm kind of glad that Zohran didn't go for crazy student activist positions or set his promises outside of the scope of what his office can guarantee. Even though I think top-down, state attempts at socialism or socialistic policies are doomed to fail, elected officials can help normalize and popularize socialism further. If it gets a few people to look into socialism and Marxism, think seriously about the political course of action and what to do about it, it's a nice thing. And it helps when the people who represent socialism are charismatic and reasonable for a change
>>2569291
a nuanced argument? in my leftypol?
>>2569150yeah stopped by for the first time in a while and board is STILL absolutely seething about mamdani. extremely embarassing
>>2569292Uh no, I remember what you referring to, and he used numbers 10x lower than the Gaza health ministry, and began specifically by mourning the Israelis, and only got to the (wrong) numbers on the 3rd paragraph. I was the one pointing that out and I was mischaracterized exactly as you are doing right now. Today I am being called an Indian paid shill for pointing out things about Graham Platner. It's a huge uphill battle in this thread to bring any deserved criticism to the latest round of succdem candidates.
>>2569297The Gaza health ministry uses the number of 69,000
>>2569288I don't think I've seen a single person on leftypol, or really in any other similar ideologically leftist space, act like they believe that reformism is a desirable end in itself or that it will be successful. I think the whole point is that it will fail but that it demonstrates that there is a real alternative to liberalism or barbarism and that the only way to win it is by being even more bold and radical than what reformism can achieve. everyone always likes to bring up how the SPD betrayd the KPD but no one ever talks about how part of how the Bolsheviks were able to consolidate so much power was that reformism had failed under the Tsarist regime, but it was also so blatantly corrupt that the energy couldn't be recaptured into reaction. the US is arguably in a very similar position today especially seeing as the Democrats have essentially committed suicide.
>>2569304Hamas are clearly running dogs for western imperialism
>>2569302>I don't think I've seen a single person on leftypol, or really in any other similar ideologically leftist space, act like they believe that reformism is a desirable end in itself or that it will be successful. If this was how the thread started, I wouldn't be complaining. Instead I got called "Indian" for pointing out negative things about Platner, and I got told I was a "turd worldist screeching about killing treatlerites" because I had very mild skepticism and criticism towards the excessive optimism around Mamdani.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1873/01/indifferentism.htm
> “If in the political struggle against the bourgeois state the workers succeed only in extracting concessions, then they are guilty of compromise; and this is contrary to eternal principles. All peaceful movements, such as those in which English and American workers have the bad habit of engaging, are therefore to be despised. Workers must not struggle to establish a legal limit to the working day, because this is to compromise with the masters, who can then only exploit them for ten or twelve hours, instead of fourteen or sixteen. They must not even exert themselves in order legally to prohibit the employment in factories of children under the age of ten, because by such means they do not bring to an end the exploitation of children over ten: they thus commit a new compromise, which stains the purity of the eternal principles.
> “Workers should even less desire that, as happens in the United States of America, the state whose budget is swollen by what is taken from the working class should be obliged to give primary education to the workers' children; for primary education is not complete education. It is better that working men and working women should not be able to read or write or do sums than that they should receive education from a teacher in a school run by the state. It is far better that ignorance and a working day of sixteen hours should debase the working classes than that eternal principles should be violated.
<It cannot be denied that if the apostles of political indifferentism were to express themselves with such clarity, the working class would make short shrift of them and would resent being insulted by these doctrinaire bourgeois and displaced gentlemen, who are so stupid or so naive as to attempt to deny to the working class any real means of struggle. >>2569309>>2569304I got 680,000 from this article
https://arena.org.au/politics-of-counting-gazas-dead/I misremembered my number as being from Gaza health ministry, and I was wrong. That article specifically says Gaza health ministry undercounts because it is strapped for resources and may have an incentive to push for optimism during a very bleak situation.
>>2569311Okay mamdani is using the official numbers. I don't see it as something to go after him for.
>>2569310careful, anons will only read the first two paragraphs and think that is what marx is saying.
>>2569287>waaah waaah the western left they're so bad i'm the only smart one in the room waaah waaah uygha you're american even if your parents come from the most third world country imaginable you're still part of the western left.
>>2569312yeah i'll back off on this. i do think the official numbers, even from hamas, are low, because we know that over 70% of the buildings have been destroyed or damaged and the israelis are blowing people up and starving people faster than the gaza health ministry can do head counts of the dead. And also the gaza health ministry is only capable of counting in tact bodies that are not buried under rubble.
>>2569311the gaza helth ministry actually counts confirmed bodies. All the other numbers are estimates basically, but it stands to reason that they are in the correct ballpark if not undercounted.
>>2569316the gaza health ministry's efforts are very hampered by nonstop sabotage and bombing from the israelis though. it's not like they operate under exactly easy conditions for doing statistics.
>>2569317My point exactly.
>>2569273I mean I think you’ll see a lot of people on here and the online left as a whole genuinely don’t understand “materialism” in any meaningful sense and instead fall back on idealism with red paint. They pretend they’re doing “Marxist analysis” when they’re fundamentally just cynics; and while cynicism about electoral politics is more often right than wrong, it isn’t a substitute for actual analysis.
I mean look now further than how the third worldists on here treat “internationalism”. If they were materialists they’d perhaps understand that internationalism is something you have to build towards, that if you look at the actual conditions on the ground for workers throughout the world international socialism doesn’t hold any kind of hegemony—it’s not an idea that means anything material to people, it doesn’t give some sense of belonging to people the way nationalism does. What is their solution? To just pretend it’s already hegemonic. To condemn people for “failing” to be proper internationalists when they’ve not even planted the seeds of these ideals in people, and then to go further and say the ideals that have at least something resembling a root in material reality must be scorned, to show even the slightest difference to what you can touch over what exists in some platonic paradise is a failure. I’ve used plenty of metaphors for this behavior before: a priest that goes to a pagan land and demands the same hegemonic reverence from the locals as he’s come to expect from his own country, or a stranger giving some ultimatum of “it’s either your friend or me: choose.”
Even a fucking missionary who thinks their God objectively exists and they’re the “one true faith” doesn’t demand deference when converting heathens. He builds schools or hospitals or provides food. You point all this out to the idiots who demand deference and they’ll invoke failure to adhere to proper dogma while catastrophically failing to understand their own doctrine.
>>2569273Well over half a million Palestinians killed. Why did he use the 60k number? Because he's an imperialist too.
Keep thinking you can vote away imperialism. Keep thinking you can debate the fascists. Keep thinking the DSA is anything other than controlled opposition. I would rather die with a gun in my hand than ever work with the DSA.
>>2569320>I mean look now further than how the third worldists on here treat “internationalism”.< here's some random tangent that speaks mostly to a particular pet peeve of minelmfao never change. never change.
>>2569321can you americans just rally under one fucking party that's outside of one attached to the democratic party ? even if it's a fucking trot party or the fucking psl or hell some version of dsa that doesn't have a massive entryist faction would be a significant improvement from something that's looking for the ruling party's approval and not much else
>>2569324Relax my guy, they do. It happens more at the local level but there are some bigger races like the PSL running their own candidate for the 2026 Ohio Senate. Let the rising tide of socialism do its work
tbh I'm fully mentally prepared to watch some of you try to excuse a Mamdani caving to ICE or whatever, as some sort of strategical goal for leftism and anyone not on board is an idealist wearing the aesthetics of radicalism which alienate the salt of the earth
>>2569006>>2569009Idk how this meeting is either of them cucking out? Zohran can't not go to Washington anyway.
>>2569333It's hasbara spam.
>In 1940, Woody Guthrie was in the anti-war phase he entered after the 1939 Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact, during which he wrote songs praising the Soviet invasion of Poland, attacking President Roosevelt's loans to Finland in defense against the Soviets, and ridiculing Lend-Lease aid to the United Kingdom. By 1944, after Germany had invaded the Soviet Union in 1941, Guthrie returned to vigorous support for U.S. involvement in Europe and a more anti-nationalism stance.
zigger american roots go deep
>>2569333yeah i dunno about that framing, i think the worst possible interpretation is that it demonstrates there's grounds for a temporary red-brown alliance (which also happens to be nick fuentes latest pivot) which would help trump attempt to climb back his low numbers. but the meeting itself was really smooth, no one cucked out, everyone got what they wanted out of it.
>>2569336What did Trump actually get out of it politically? All it did was piss his supporters off and make him look weak. The GOP would never do anything close to a "red-brown alliance" lol.
Obviously he enjoyed it socially.
>>2569331winning elections aren't the only aspect to this you need a party that can properly integrate itself into american communities while still upholding all the views of socialism and communism. also most of these parties need to rack in as many members as feasibly possible not just students or terminally online nerds like the ACP
>>2569336The only "red brown alliance" that could really work is a kind of woke national syndicalism. Where you're highly nationalistic and love ye old corporatism, but apply it in a leftist way and be all trans rights are human rights and stuff. That I could see working
>>2569337He IS weak right now, he's ceding ground to prove that he cares about "affordability", which would no doubt help his shit numbers.
>>2569339national syndicalism and syndicalism in itself is just social democracy with extra steps. stop playing kaiserreich.
>>2569340It doesn't matter if he pretends to care if prices are still really bad.
People don't hate him on the economy because of messaging, it's because they're experiencing it directly.
>>2569336Plus it is not as if they met to focu on policy. Sounds like it was a vibe check meeting.
>>2569340 (me)
Also this is the "worst possible interpretation", as I said.
>>2569344He's silently rolling back tariffs, it seems.
>>2569225. The greatest trick ever pulled lol.
>Latest poll: Only 6% of Americans say Jeffrey Epstein did not collaborate with foreign intelligence, while 45% believe he did. Russia and Israel top the list of suspected countries, with Republicans most likely to name Israel and Democrats most likely to name Russia
>>2569322It’s a constellation of attitudes that are born from idealism and a contempt for the working class. Each feeds into each other and creates a culture of do-nothing phrase mongering. And given people are idiotically calling Mamdani a “genocide supporter” because of the same idealistic understanding of anti-imperialism I’d hardly say it’s irrelevant.
>>2569324populist party and the DFL party were a thing iirc
>>2569340he said it himself in the interview. "a lot of ex bernie people voted for me"
the third largest party in Alaska is the Alaskan Independence Party
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaskan_Independence_Party>>2569351>Each feeds into each other and creates a culture of do-nothing phrase mongering.I think americans are perfectly capable of doing nothing by themselves without involving third worldism
>>2569355the real movement is when you posture on the internet about being the most radicool vanguard revolutionary until it simply happens spontaneously without any communists having to do any organizing whatsoever :^)
>>2569359He actually is LMAO.
He's not beating the bisexual allegations.
>>2569359I'm fujoing out rn bros
>>2569350That boils his penis? He should get that checked out
wassup with you stupid motherfuckers
>>2569369Good I hope she kills herself.
>>2569359What do the usual suspects think of Trump's embrace of who he called a communist like a week ago?
>>2569372Patriots are in control
>>2569372Pure cope. Trump looked weak and normalized a socialist mayor (Mamdani) after months of relentless media smearing.
>>2569372Meeting with Trump is less worse than parroting State Department on Cuba to be honest. Not sure the esteemed panelists are right in general.
honestly i think trump likes muslims more than jews on a personal level, with jews its just business, with muslims its like partying on some arab oil sheiks mega yacht
>>2569374>Trump looked weak and normalized a socialist mayor (Mamdani) after months of relentless media smearing.The lesson is you can be literally anything as long as you make Trump gay for you he will be your buddy
>>2569331>strategic use of the democratic party ballot line only in the short termWhen have they ever demonstrated it's just for the "short term?" The fucking ACP has made more progress on building a separate organization than the DSA ever has by running for seats where they can. That is off the table for every DSA member. People like the Chapo guys have sooner declared they would just not vote than to look at a third party. That's how die-hard democrat they are.
The DNC has its own internal censors like the superdelegate system so your uncritical defense of entryism is even more of a lie. I've not seen any DSA people fight against that system, instead it's just all about republicans and anti-Zionism (which they have zero influence over).
Most states are also open primaries, which would let people detach from the DNC without totally losing access to primaries or becoming a spoiler. Opening up the primaries in closed primary states is nowhere on the DSA agenda which proves beyond a doubt that they are just a youth wing of the bourgeois democratic party. You guys are useful idiots.
If they were even 1% honest about that "strategy" they would immediately be running candidates against the DNC in states without a major republican threat, probably through the Greens who have the same platform as Bernie and lots of ballot access compared to the weirder, China-cuck third parties. Instead, they try to frame that they have "no choice" to hide their opportunism.
Anarcho-nihilist (really badass ideology bro) is just an edgy Democrat who supports nothing but statist electoralism within bourgeois institutions. What a fucking shocker.
>>2569387>The fucking ACP has made more progress on building a separate organizationopinion discarded
>>2569387>Anarcho-nihilist (really badass ideology bro)also it's a meme flag you fucking retard lmao
>>2569387DNC crippled superdelegates after 2016, it was one of the few reforms the Bernie wing got from the party.
>>2569380She will seek refugee status in Israel soon.
>>2569397blackpilled jokermoding loomer arc soon
>>2569397god I hope she offs herself it would be so fucking funny
0.001% mourning 99.999% dunks
>>2569393>>2569395what a difference a few years have made. he was so lucid and energetic back then
>>2569399Its funny how many of them fell for it. They thought trump actually cares that mamdani is a socialist, is an immigrant, is Muslim or whatever so they got so motivated. For trump it's all just wwe wrestling then he hugs you backstage. In reality trump probably discussed his hotel business with mamdani and his towers in what he can do for money and mamdani said sure champ you can do that I got your back now you'll defend me? Then trump said thanks let's work together
>>2569360The past ~30 comments in this thread do reveal this.
>trump and mamdani are in love!!!>5D chess!!!!Indistinguishable from trumptards lmao
>>2569336>yeah i dunno about that framing, i think the worst possible interpretation is that it demonstrates there's grounds for a temporary red-brown alliance (which also happens to be nick fuentes latest pivot) which would help trump attempt to climb back his low numbers. but the meeting itself was really smooth, no one cucked out, everyone got what they wanted out of it.>>2569337>What did Trump actually get out of it politically? All it did was piss his supporters off and make him look weak. The GOP would never do anything close to a "red-brown alliance" lol.>Obviously he enjoyed it socially.Don't think in terms of "alliances." Trump is a dickhead big-ego businessman from the 1980s and his whole thing is transactional and situational. He'll trash someone then meet them and be nice and then trash them again later. It doesn't appear consistent but it makes sense if you think about it from the perspective of a big-dick business guy who's after those deals. He'll swing back into attack mode in a few weeks and start threatening Mamdani the communist and NYC again. Just wait.
I've done this when buying a car but from the opposite direction. Like I'll be nice at first but then get angry at the "final" offer and walk out while performatively huffing and puffing in the parking lot to make the salesman chase me and knock a couple hundred bucks off the car. That shit really works because those people are sharks and is an old trick my dad used to do. Try it sometime. Then I'm very nice when he knocks off $500. Trump starts out nasty then gets nice. It's not based on traditional political logic but businessman / real-estate dude logic. It's more episodic by nature, transactional.
Look at how MTG is now a "traitor." She never got it. Like she thinks this relationship was about ideological consistency where everything aligns how they're supposed to rather than her relationship being a tool for a specific purpose. He's the developer and she's a contractor who completed a job, nothing more than that, and right now she's not an asset. Past loyalty means nothing to him, she's entitled to nothing.
How can she help him right now??? That's what matters.
>>2569318Thats a fascist book anyone who reads this is a nazi.
>>2569403I'm sure Trump would more than happily be a modern kind of NEPman if push came to shove.
>>2569372the dsa types are all bragging about it tho
>>2569402>the reaction to mandani trump meeting is the same thing as the normie liberal reaction to this.eh, in here both are the
same, in the sense that mamdani and 'mama bear' represent the same duopoly bipartisanship when it comes to counter trump
>>2569372>>2569412we are yet to see the DSA NY chapter statement.
>>2569413
You really listened to the whole thing and the only part that you heard was "decriminalize sex work." Lol.
>>2569413
don't fucking derail the thread with this shit again
>>2569022Carlin is in the club true, and he pushed as much reddit establishment talking points as he could during his lifetime, it's honestly for the best he died before he would befall to hypocrisy during the modern fuckwash that is post 2016 politics.
>>2569417he kissed the ring
>>2569413
red chud incels will get the wall
>>2569413
under communism all sex will be banned
>>2569413
Book a flight to Pattaya and shut the fuck up.
>>2569421carlin heralded a paradoxical feel good cynicism that pervades liberals as well as apolitical types, people quote him and feel smug while they're drinking their starbucks
>>2569416like the rest was any better? standard entryist crap that has been spouted by dsa types for forever and got us nowhere.
>durr we have a socialist mayor>hurr overton windowyou mean to tell me its a reason to celebrate that people will associate socialism with the demoncratic party's barely social imperialism?
>>2569431>like the rest was any better? standard entryist crap that has been spouted by dsa types for forever and got us nowhere. I love how you retards will say this shit like whatever your sect is has gotten anyone anywhere.
>>2569433
The problem is Dworkin supported Israel so everything she says is questionable.
>>2569432i am in no org but regardless whether all of them combined haven't moved us toward socialism the dsa has moved us in the opposite direction
>>2569436>i am in no org but regardless whether That's why I said sect. I already knew that would be your answer. No org as pure as the one that exists in your head, and for that they must all be condemned.
>>2569433it's a contentious issue on the site, but not really the left in general ime.
<everyone who disagrees with me is an anarchist wrecker!!!1you're a retarded child. the ones arguing against sex work fetishisation on this site are the anarchists. fucking braindead troglodyte left-identitarian.
>>2569434>The problem is Dworkin supported Israel so everything she says is questionable.Jesus christ. what a moron.
These two posts back to back prove why /USApol/ is truly the containment thread we need, even if hated.
>>2569433
dawg I have literally read and have a copy of Pornography (along with Right-Wing Women and Woman Hating also by Dworkin). this isn't the thread to have a nuanced discussion on the problems with contemporary sex work discourse but I will say that invoking Dworkin is really not a gotcha here; she occasionally makes some good points but is generally a really fucking lay theorist who relies on moralizing, and Pornography is one of her worse books.
>>2569438pimping should be punishable by death. buying a person's body by life imprisonment.
>>2569439Fuck off this is not about me but the dsa
MTG and Loomer are out, Zohran is in.
Soon Trump will abolish ICE, cut off all aid to Israel, usher in a dictatorship of the proletariat, and come out as bisexual.
>>2569433
I don't think most people are in favor of prostitution around here, except a few coping balding retards. However, "sex work" (whatever that means) exists in the soyciety we live in. It's better if prostitutes can defend the little civil rights they have than meet hostility from socialist circles.
Also there is no mention of "sex work" in the post you originally quotes about Mamdani so you are derailing retard and you should get some tea instead of seething.
>>2569434>I said that if there was a Jewish state, anyone who wasn't Jewish would be second-class by definition. I said we didn't have a right to do to other people what had been done to us. More than anyone, we knew the bitterness of religious persecution, the stigma that went with being a minority. We should be able to see in advance the inevitable consequences of having a state that put us first; because then others were second and third and fourth. A theocratic state, I said, could never be a fair state—and didn't Jews need a fair state? If Jews had had a fair state wouldn't Jews have been safe from slaughter? Israel could be a beginning: a fair state. But then it couldn't be a Jewish state. The blood of Jews, he said, would be on my hands. He walked out. I don't think he ever spoke to me again.Dworkin
>>2569441>you can not buy consent<stop moralizing i have a right to my nutmany such cases
>>2569448>Also there is no mention of "sex work" in the post you originally quotes about Mamdani so you are derailing retard and you should get some tea instead of seething.In the video I was transcribing he lists off "decriminalizing sex work" in a list of various issues that he thinks are important.
>>2569446MTG just announced her retirement in january
>>2569448he is talking about it here so lurk moar before coming at me →
>>2569355 >>2569442this is why we need hooker-owned cooperatives
>>2569442Are you guys children? How are you this uninformed. "Decriminalizing sex work" just means taking away legal penalties for the hookers. It doesn't mean it is legal to buy a prostitute or be a pimp.
>>2569450not what I said you massive fucking thread derailer faggot. I think all pimps should be shot but I also don't think that moralizing about how the porn industry is heckin evil and comparing women to Jews is an effective way of making an argument against the exploitative nature of sex work. Dworkin is a bad theorist and a Zionist, and collaborating with the far-right to make sex work illegal is literally the main reason why the sex work industry is so uniquely and acutely oppressive.
>>2569453that is insane. sounds to me like the republicans are nipping any opposition to vance in the bud. fuck we are accelerating toward techni feudalism FAST. The paypal mafia won😞
>>2569452Ok, I can understand why "decriminalizing sex work" could be a big deal in NYC, because NYC is NYC, and it would basically end up like Frankfurt with brothels full of Ukrainian and Romanian prostitutes near the banking/business district (and drug addicts like already in America too).
I hope Mamdani rather had the kind of woke policy they had or have in Scandinavia about fining the customer rather than the prostitute.
>>2569461one small problem: everyone thinks a post that doesn't agree with them is a derail
nice lenin crop >>2569449Dworkin later suggested a state for women based on Israels model so as moderate as this quote is, it's not enough of a disowning of it.
>we can get rid of the oldest profession because… we just CAN, OKAY?
reactionaries
>>2569456I guess tbf, there are "decriminalization" models that also don't penalize johns, but the ones that actually exist don't remove the penalties for buying sex.
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
https://xcancel.com/mtgreenee/status/1992037226415554642#m>>2569433
3 women, one CEO Girlboss, one Dworkinite, and one Communist, were arguing over how often moids should change diapers…
"moids should change all diapers" said the girlboss, "to make up for centuries of patriarchy"
"moids should change no diapers" said the Dworkinite, "because men are all rapists, and not to be trusted around children."
"Men should change half the diapers," said the communist, "to hold up their half of the sky."
The Dworkinite and the Girlboss then became angry and killed the Communist for being a dirty centrist.
>>2569456no, that's an assumption on your part.
Entirely depends which end you decriminalise.
>>2569469>le oldest profession!!!11<calling anyone else reactionarieslol. lmao.
>>2569464I'll research it and get back to you, but I am almost certain he is talking about "the Nordic model."
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE IS RESIGNING FROM OFFICE
https://xcancel.com/mtgreenee/status/1992037226415554642#mNuts
>>2569471She was a true believer in Trump and now feels betrayed. Bless her heart. An honest to God rube who got elected to office and saw the true face of the zionist-hitlerite-pedophile-bourgeoisie
>>2569471it really goes to show just how more organized the GOP is
they can oust a critic of dear leader in a matter of days
Democrats could never
>>2569468
>I don't think sex work is inherently different from any other kind of work in its coercive nature and the way people are treated as expendable.
Okay. So when you go to the Job Centre should they be allowed to send you off to the brothel and sanction your unemployment monies if you refuse?
>>2569456genuinely FUCK YOU. i have receipts why decriminalization DOES NOT WORK. i'm to tired to argue with you in my third language now and need to go to sleep. honestly kill yourself though.
https://www.phoenix.de/sendungen/dokumentationen/bordell-deutschland-a-315097.htmlto anyone else, genuinely asking: what could possibly motivate a person to defend the institution of prostitution other than the thiught that their relative wealth and somebody else's destitution ENTITLES then to BUY CONSENT. that's what it really is about, you want to fuck someone that doesn't want to fuck you. that's called RAPE
>>2569468
>I don’t see why you wouldn’t ban getting raped as a job if you allow construction workers (there’s always a chance you might die eh?)
>>2569471Fell for it again and gave up award.
Should have chosen better politics award.
>>2569478the deep state showed her a video of the charlie kirk assasination from an angle that was never seen before.
>>2569487
They do though. Do you think it should be treated the same? Do you think the harms are the same? Would you do it if told to? I don't think so.
>>2569471you gotta at least respect that in a space full of cynical lying snakes she truly really believed in something. wish more of the fascists in the USA were as self aware as her.
>>2569484You can bitch about it all you want, it exists, you can still take a preventive measure without gunning down all the coomers who don't care (your ilk has 0 power right now anyway). Not punishing the prostitute, but punishing the coomer would be a good reform IMHO, then maybe you will have your anti-coomer squad one day.
>>2569486it kinda feels like we're already in a Hitler's last days sort of situation with MAGA if the true believers are started to get ousted like this. Loomer crashing the fuck out and MTG resigning are both good signs imo that the Trump regime is starting to disintegrate and eat itself alive.
>>2569494the male trumpers will stay loyle to capo but the female trumpers are finally broken by the cognitive dissonance
Full MTG resignation letter.
Choice quotes:
>It's all so absurd and completely unserious […] If I am cast aside by MAGA Inc and replaced by Neocons, Big Pharma, Big Tech, Military Industrial War Complex, foreign leaders, and the elite donor class that can't even relate to real Americans, then many common Americans have been cast aside and replaced as well.
>There is no "plan to save the world" or insane 4D chess game being played.
>When the common American people finally realize and understand that the Political Industrial Complex of both parties is ripping this country apart, that not one elected leader like me is able to stop Washington's machine from gradually destroying our country, and instead the reality is that they, common Americans, The People, possess the real power over Washington, then I'll be here by their side to rebuild it.
>>2569320Third worldism is the crux of Marxism-Leninism. Mao created three worlds theory. Third Worldism what differentiates Communists from fake socialist imperialists. So you are wrong
<the industrial workers cannot accomplish their epoch-making mission of emancipating mankind from the yoke of capital and from wars if they confine themselves to their narrow craft, or trade interests, and smugly restrict themselves to attaining an improvement in their own conditions, which may sometimes be tolerable in the petty-bourgeois sense. This is exactly what happens to the “labour aristocracy” of many advanced countries, who constitute the core of the so-called socialist parties of the Second International; they are actually the bitter enemies and betrayers of socialism, petty-bourgeois chauvinists and agents of the bourgeoisie within the working-class movement.https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1920/jun/x01.htm<To tell the workers in the handful of rich countries where life is easier, thanks to imperialist pillage, that they must be afraid of 'too great' impoverishment, is counter-revolutionary. It is the reverse that they should be told. The labour aristocracy that is afraid of sacrifices, afraid of 'too great' impoverishment during the revolutionary struggle, cannot belong to the Party. Otherwise, the dictatorship is impossible, especially in West-European countries.https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1920/jul/x03.htm<The export of capital, one of the most essential economic bases of imperialism, still more completely isolates the rentiers from production and sets the seal of parasitism on the whole country that lives by exploiting the labour of several overseas countries and colonies.https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/imp-hsc/ch08.htm>First, what is the cardinal idea underlying our theses? It is the distinction between oppressed and oppressor nations. Unlike the Second International and bourgeois democracy, we emphasise this distinction. In this age of imperialism, it is particularly important for the proletariat and the Communist International to establish the concrete economic facts and to proceed from concrete realities, not from abstract postulates, in all colonial and national problems.https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1920/jul/x03.htm<300-400 million out of 1,600 are oppressorshttps://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/cw/pdf/lenin-cw-vol-39.pdf >>2569500why are you so obsessed with laura loomer?
>>2569476>he doesn't know what reactionary meansthat dude is right you motherfuckers are children
none of this discourse is new, that other dude (correctly) identified you as children because you're treating this as a novel conversation and not well-worn ground
not knowing the difference between decriminalization and legalization is bare minimum stuff that you guys fail to grasp
this site really has decayed over the past 5 years
>>2569501I won't lie, Bush Jr was far worse than Trump and you have to be retarded or under age to disagree.
>>2569492>a preventive measure Preventing what, exactly?
Does it prevent violence/murders? Does it prevent trafficking? Does it prevent other connected-crime and addiction and so on?
No? So a
preventative measure to prevent what, exactly?!
>>2569506>Is the society you're envisioning one where people are forced into jobs they don't want?It's the fucking society we live in.
>>2569467how about this quote
>I knew the human rights of Palestinians in ordinary life were being violated. Like my daddy, on social issues, the policy questions, I was fine for my kind. These opinions put me into constant friction with the Jewish community, including my family, many friends, and many Jewish feminists. As far as I know, from my own experience, the Jewish community has just recently—like last Tuesday—really faced the facts—the current facts. I will not argue about the twisted history, who did what to whom when. I will not argue about Zionism except to say that it is apparent that I am not a Zionist and never was. But there are social policy questions and then there is the racism that lives in individual hearts and minds as a prejudgment on a whole people. You believe the stereotypes; you believe the worst; you accept a caricature such that members of the group are comic or menacing, always contemptible. I don't believe that American Jews raised as I was are free of this prejudice. We were taught it as children and it has helped the Israeli government justify in our eyes what they have done to the Palestinians. We've been blinded, not just by our need for Israel or our loyalty to Jews but by a deep and real prejudice against Palestinians that amounts to race-hate.she was always a little nutty tho ngl
>>2569455There is one in Tijuana
>>2569456>>2569459How can you be fine with sex work but hate pimps? If you legalize sex work but outlawed trying to sell the sex work then prostitutes would break the law to pimp themselves out anyway.
>>2569468Getting STDs and permanently damaging your reproductive and other internal organs is a big difference from other jobs.
I misread
>>2569508>Damn I'm sorry about whats going on with the Palestinians bro that's fucked up and conflicts with my Jewish feminist identityLike I said she wouldn't have called for the wom-ethno state if she really didn't like Israel enough to disavow it.
>>2569504leftypol has decayed in ways that feel pretty similar to the rest of the internet but it has its own unique niche forms of cognitive decline that are kind of fascinating to watch.
>>2569511Pimps are small business owners. I don't support small businesses
>>2569509
okay? what an asinine point… Why are you talking about prostitution? don't we want to live in a world without prostitution? without capitalism? without crippling drug addiction, untreated homelessness and mental illness?
You should stop talking or thinking about prostitution and simply change society, fuck em it's their problem for existing in this one.
>>2569511>Getting STDs and permanently damaging your reproductive and other internal organs is a big difference from other jobs.OUt of all the harm prostitution causes on the victim this is what you choose?
fuck sake i hate americans.
>>2569484They are dsa types. Dsa is pro prostitution organization
>>2569507I don't know, it discourages coomers to seek and find prostitutes, but doesn't penalize prostitutes who does this only to get a living in a harsh world (instathots and onlyfans bitches are the upper middle-class exception rather than the rule, especially in a city like NYC) it should be of course accompanied by organizational structures helping prostitutes to get tested for STDs, to help elaborate a plan to get out of being pimped and getting a real job and a normie roof over their heads. Social democracy when it works in a nutshell. I know you Americans aren't used to this, but it periodically happened from times to times in history during short bursts, and it's better than your current hell world right now.
>>2569494The thing is that crazies like Loomer and MTG were always expendable. They aided his rise to power in 2015/2016, but now Trump is wedged in firmly with establishment capital and thus he no longer needs that kind of pseudo-grassroots cult support. He has the kind of support from capitalists he didn't have in his first term, he's brought them to heel and has intertwined all his interests with theirs.
If anything true believers are now a hindrance as MTG has proven over the past few weeks, because they are honest in their insanity.
>>2569523
>My view of sex workers being treated as laborers would entitle them to unionize and fight for their rights, have control over their working hours, their health, their rules of doing business, etc.
holy shit you really are retarded. okay. now show me where this has worked and the outcomes are as you envision.
>>2569516Izia Katzmanite mfer
>>2569518
also just like other forms of worker the exploitation is different depending on the scale and scope. a working class hooker with working class clientele is different from a discrete "escort" who has wall street hedge fund guys as clientele. the latter can make ends meet with only one client a month, and make him go to the doctor first and show her paperwork that says he's STD free, etc. the former does not have those resources and does client after client, day after day ,and is at much higher risk for all sorts of issues. even among sex workers there is a hierarchy.
>zohranald trumpdani meeting spectacle
>MTG retiring
>sex work debate #51651651
ok but
venezuela invasion status?
epstein files veto status?
>>2569531>venezuela invasion status?Stalling
>epstein files veto status?Trump signed it now they gotta release it
>>2569532
>I'm wondering if the venezuela invasion will ever actually happen. They've been prepping it for months.
Do they internally really have the option of turning around and going home with their tail between their legs? i don't see it personally. will have to at least be able to spin a win.
>>2569535While I don't know about proclaiming socialism (I don't think this matter that much though really), Bernie Sanders has been to the Oval Office a lot. Don't think Mamdani's politics are different in substance.
>>2569535>he labeled himself something that used to be controversial.because the label has been watered down to mean reformism. your analysis is all superstructure, call me when there's a real difference.
>>2569505the prospect of the Bush family being in control of anything ever again given the stage of blackest reaction we're currently in is legitimately terrifying. the Trump regime would be an entirely ineffectual incompetent joke that would have already folded if it weren't for the fascist police state infrastructure that was built by Dubya
>>2569535I'm pretty happy, it could not have gone better
>>2569517Then the small business ownership shifts to the prostitute directly. Get rid of the specialized role of the pimp then the prostitute just takes up the role. I'm just pointing out it's illogical to be ok with one but hate the other when they are clearly interlinked.
>>2569518Of course we should reduce all work injuries for all employees. But those jobs at least theoretically perform a necessary function to compensate for the costs. Prostitution is medically costly with no social benefits at all.
>>2569520The other guy is talking about idealized vision of prostitution where it is just another job. The danger of STDs and internal organ injures would never be eliminated in such a situation as things like condoms only reduce disease transmission rates but don't eliminate them.
Trump may love the Mamdani meeting because of how much press it's getting, he literally says this towards the end of the meeting.
>>2569196So? Everyone is always going on about how we don't have time for this or that but then they have nothing else to show for it. Besides, we've already gone through this with Bernie and Cortez, what's the difference?
>>2569535>he said wordsOMG!
>>2569553
Sex with a hooker is probably a net negative for everyone most of all the hooker
>>2569555le tired handshake meme
>>2569536I mean they kinda did in Yemen
>>25694712028 is going to be a madhouse four way like 1824,1860,1912.
>>2569557nah it's way more like lassalle and bismarck than like that. because lassalle and bismarck was an internal german affair. it was the old reactionary chancellor coming to terms with the rising popularity of socialism. it resembles that much more closely since this is an internal american affair. whereas those examples are foreign policy.
>>2569446god I wish this was true
>>2569428she looks like she's praying in the thumbnail
crazy how everyone ITT replying to or posting sex work bait is very obviously a moid with strong opinions on something that has very little impact on their lives
>>2569573
poor you, cry moar about it
>>2569569
It's a need, not a right. People can live without sex.
>>2569578have sex
oh wait you can't :^) >>2569573
Lmao i can only laugh
>>2569580neocon betas dominated and humiliated by islamic communism live on national TV
>>2569572>crazy how everyone ITT replying to or posting sex work bait is very obviously a moid with strong opinions on something that has very little impact on their livesUnless it does.
I did what Hasan did when he went to Germany, but I hold no particular feelings on sex work other than it would be a minor dour on opportunities if taken away, but nothing life changing, but if any other men here buy it then they'd have good reason to be so heavily invested. I'd say I find it funny how many of them are clearly guilty of buying these services or else they wouldn't be derailing the thread so bad, but the fact is it isn't funny it actually kind of makes sense.
I don't understand why people are clamoring for sex to be considered a human right, it's really not that big of a deal. If you can't get laid it's probably because you're spending your time posting here.
Easy access to small children for pedophiles is why many men go date or marry single moms. A step dad is statistically about 8.5x as likely to sexually assault the kid in the household as a biological dad, there are studies on it.
1 in 10 girls with a step-father is sexually abused in some form by the step-father in their life vs only 1 in 50 girls by a biological father.
>Nineteen percent of the women who had stepfathers in their childhoods had been sexually abused, compared to only 2 percent of those having biological fathers in their childhoods.https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/prevalence-and-seriousness-incestuous-abuse-stepfathers-vshttps://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/6609753/>>2569586what the fuck are you talking about, the anons who started derailing the thread are the ones posting about how sex work being decriminalized would be a bad thing
>>2569587all these red chud incels are really a catch I can't imagine why women don't voluntarily have sex with them
how is mark levin handling this
>>2569591>what the fuck are you talking about, the anons who started derailing the thread are the ones posting about how sex work being decriminalized would be a bad thingYou said it wouldn't affect them I said they wouldn't be so obsessed if it didn't affect them.
>>2569594I could see it being that they're projecting or overcompensating since that's the MO for men who do stuff like pay for prostitutes that is considered shameful and makes you less of a man, if that's what you're getting at.
>>2569584
>what if we regulate sex work so they aren't working in seedy brothels and instead working in comfy offices with proper security guards?
…Did it work in germany?
>>2569597That guy tried to rape a guy i knew in a theatre.
>>2569596Something like that. More along the lines of just "I don't want it to be taken away."
Personally prostitution is a luxury it is like dubai chocolate, expensive, bad for you in the long run, etc, but still nice to engage in, but ultimately not something to worry about being taken away, but I assume for a lot of people they'd go crazy without it.
>>2569590
>>2569590
I guarantee you paying for sex will do absolutely nothing to make them better, emotionally or otherwise. In fact, it'll probably make them worse. The problem with sex is that its not simple thing to just simply legalize so you always have access to it, it's really a social and psychological issue that has it's roots in how people relate to each other and such. Anons are desperately lonely because today's society is hyper atomized. Legalizing sex work in a society like this will probably be disastrous.
>>2569553The benefit is marginal compared to the costs so society should go out of it's way for it.
>>2569569>how do you suppose we give people sex without hookers? Have them date each other without exchanging money for sex…
>>2569572Things can be objectively correct or incorrect no matter the gender of the person saying it. Standpoint epistemology doesn't work to convince people outside the standpoint you supposedly represent. It's a rhetorical and philosophical dead end.
>>2569591>how sex work being decriminalized would be a bad thingHow about instead of working to decriminalize sex work we work towards literally anything else that will get people out of prostitution all together? Decriminalization doesn't address the problem.
>>2569609until you vote for him
>>25696092036 after two terms in the White House! 🇺🇸🦅🌉
>>2569609>"He who fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss also gazes into you.”He can’t at this point, Trumpism has stained his soul. He is Blue Trump now.
>>2569609Hopefully never, the sooner we can reach the farce stage of history the better, there is nothing more cringe I can think of than taking the term "Pqtriot" seriously like in The Fire Rises thinking you're Queer Team Six carrying out Trumps orders, and the more watered down we make it the better.
>>2569606
it's hard to get accurate data. Germany specifically stopped recording if murdered were prostitutes to 'combat stigma towards prostitution'.
>>2569471today it's one of those days that everything seems to be weird.
>>2569481lmao, my thoughts exactly.
What the fuck is happening
>>2569619it's great isn't it
This might deserve its own thread but…
What current material pressure points in the US can create class consciousness, i have personally found that just describing wage slavery and the circle of the consumerism is a really good gateway towards class consciousness, like literally even when I describe it to petite bourgesisie, they even agree.
>>2569560Based, subway and public transport is fucking expensive and nepobabies like Trump don't get it even if they have lived most of their lives in such a city. Most of it is subsidized by taxes anyway, we pay so they can pay for "revenue protection inspector" bullshit jobs, meanwhile buses are free in the capital of fucking Serbia.
>t. Europoor where a ticket costs 2.20€ in average >>2569623Everyone and their grandmothers know about class exploitation. That's not news, not even to he minimally informed person. The problem is that there's a host of other ideological assumptions and baggage that prevents the average person to go all the way. Only now that the piggies are squeezing too hard do we have chance, but if they are smart and let up we'll lose the ground we gained.
>>2569605>How about instead of working to decriminalize sex work we work towards literally anything else that will get people out of prostitution all together? Decriminalization doesn't address the problem.Anon prostitution is generally a felony in the US. Getting convicted for it will literally ruin your ability to get a normal job. Decriminalizing prostitution and no longer applying felon status to people conviction of solicitation is one of the most substantial changes you could make to allow people in that life to leave it.
Saw one Epstein email earlier today, two associates of his talking to each other. One of them says something along the lines of “I like Bernie, I just wish he wasn’t a goddamn socialist” and the dude saying it is a businessman so I’ve got to wonder what the fuck he likes about Sanders if he disagrees fundamentally with his policy
>>2569637The ZeroHedge crowd love it when politicians talk about pragmatic working class issues, but they want lolbert solutions to "solve" them.
>>2569472This is such a good joke lol
>>2569644Welcome back Otto Strasser.
>>2569623Class consciousness resides in le party. Le Individual, no matter how able, will never be class conscious.
>>2569644Wait if she's resigning, does that mean the seat goes up for re-election? As unlikely as it is, what are the odds some dems can snag the seat given the general frustration with Republicans?
>>2569648The "Trump likes winners" part is all you need. Plus he probably thinks Mamdani is handsome and that's a big plus in Trump's eyes. Shit, if he saw Mamdani's rap videos he might unironically think "Wow, this guy is so cool!"
>>2569648
He likes popular people, he likes AMLO and Putin because they had wide approval margins
>>2569654>He likes popular people, he likes AMLO and Putin because they had wide approval marginsMan he loved Sheinbaum. He was glazing her so fucking hard after their phonecall.
>>2569648
Because they agree on 99% of all issues and the only substantial difference is who they think should be the primary beneficiaries of American imperialism. The only difference between Mamdani and Trump is their definition of the Volk.
>>2569655>>2569656>>2569659I think if you consider yourself a Trump ally he sees you as a sucker. If you’re not an ally but not directly competing against him he wants to be frens.
>>2569630So why didn't they get the normal job in the first place? Decriminalizing prostitution doesn't address the economic or drug issues that drive people to the job it just reduces the cost of being in the industry without fixing anything. That's why libertarians, wannabe madams, petite bourgeois escorts and johns all team up together on this issue.
It's better to keep it a criminal offense to disincentive the activity but still reform laws to address the problems. Having guaranteed jobs programs and training, drug rehab, therapy and making it easier to expunge criminal records of reformed and reintegrated citizens would be better.
>>2569569
Some people are not wanted by anyone and they have to live it im one of them
I had sex with a sex worker before and I wish I could undo that action
Legitimately the crap RFK Jr and the Trump admin are doing to undermine vaccines and public health are more worthy of imprisonment than anything else, in terms of the number of lives impacted. Bringing back measles is worthy of execution.
>>2569667Same. Though I don't really regret it. Lost my virginity to a hooker at 25. Then became a regular and became friends with them for a bit. After a while I came to the conclusion that she didn't really enjoy it but it made her money quick and easy.
But nowadays paying for a hooker doesn't do it for me. It just makes me sad to think we're fucking because I'm paying and not because she's into me.
>>2569664I agree with most of it but why even charge the SWs with a crime why not just have the assistance without the criminalization
>>2569670I feel really guilty that in paying i was a part of something exploitative, it was in a legal brothel in a country in Western Europe and I was so lost at the time but I wish I had a phone to call myself in that moment to talk myself out of that
>>2569664>So why didn't they get the normal job in the first place?Often because they were forced into it from a young age. If you just saddle them with felon status they're absolutely not going to be able to make it out of that life.
>Decriminalizing prostitution doesn't address the economic or drug issues that drive people to the job it just reduces the cost of being in the industry without fixing anything.No longer putting the scarlet letter on someone opens the door to all sorts of employment opportunities.
>That's why libertarians, wannabe madams, petite bourgeois escorts and johns all team up together on this issue.Decriminalizing the prostitutes doesn't mean you have to decriminalize pimping or being a john. Those people just want to fully legalize prostitution which is a different thing altogether.
>It's better to keep it a criminal offense to disincentive the activityuyghur it's literally a marketplace of rape
you are saying make getting raped illegal to disincentivize getting raped
>>2569679What did Zohran praise Trump on?
Only conservatives are malding about it so far with what I have seen.
>>2569680<Well, I actually told the President that, you know, so much of the focus of our campaign has been on the cost of living crisis. And when we asked those New Yorkers who had voted for the president when we saw an increase in his numbers in New York City, that came back to the same issue, cost of living, cost of living, cost of living, and they spoke about the cost of groceries, the cost of rent, the cost of Con Ed the cost of child care. And too often, politicians are looking to lecture to New Yorkers what they should care about, as opposed to listen. And when we spoke to those voters who voted for President Trump, we heard him speak about cost of living, we focus on that same cost of living, and that’s where I am really looking forward to delivering for New Yorkers in partnership with the President on the affordability agenda.
>Trump: We agree on a lot more than I would have thought. … I want him to do a great job, and we’ll help him do a great job. You know, he may have different views, but in many ways, you know, we were discussing when Bernie Sanders was out of the race, I picked up a lot of his votes, and people had no idea, because he was strong on not getting ripped off in trade. And lots of the things that I’ve practiced and been very successful on tariffs, a lot of things Bernie Sanders and I agreed on much more than people thought, and when he was put out of the race, I think quite unfairly, if you want to know the truth, many of the Bernie Sanders voters voted for me, and I felt very comfortable, frankly, in seeing that and saying that, and you know, just turned out to Be a statistical truth. But no, I feel very comfortable. I would be I would feel very, very comfortable being in New York, and I think much more so after the meeting.Here is the full transcript:
https://macenews.com/transcript-president-trump-and-ny-mayor-elect-mamdani-qa-white-house-pool-report/ THERE'S NO DIFFERENCE IN PARTY.
Issue with a lot of self-proclaimed leftists on here is that they're recent converts and haven't actually seriously examined a lot of the underlying thought processes that made them right-wing in the first place. So they end up just regurgitating the same old reactionary drivel but clumsily staple some pseudo-leftist stuff on it to justify it. Same beliefs under a different flag. This is especially noticeable when it comes to hot-button social issues. They don't want to accept that their "past life" of politics was completely worthless so they want to salvage some of it. "Well I was wrong on X and Y but at least I got Z right." No you didn't, you were retarded from top to bottom. There's no adjusting it, you have to throw it out. Sort yourself out.
>>2569548Honestly glow, you’re post have gotten way better. Personal I’ve always imagined prostitution would be replaced with sex clubs and like a hobby porn industry. I don’t think perverts are going away, the goal should be to remove the profit motive from sex in the first place. Not turn people into yeomans of slinging dick and pussy.
>>2569691Could you go give a more in-depth answer if you have the time? I'd like to hear what political positions are just simply assumed but not really examined. Obviously, we're talking about sex work which is an old topic but I'd like to know what's the more theoretically rigerous take.
>magatards happy because mamdani glazed trump
>dsatards happy because trump glazed mamdani
I'm just glad we all had a nice day today and our boys are having fun together :)
Socdems have won
>>2569680Unironically I think MAGA types just like it if you’re polite to them. It’s a really aesthetics first kind of incoherent ideology. I think you see this kind of thing crop up historically from time to time—like Ribbentrop was apparently so charmed by Stalin that after Germany declared war he allegedly said something like “Do apologize to Mr Stalin for me.”
I also think they can understand on a rudimentary level that Zohran is a “populist” too, and I guess game respects game. Like, you ever see Legend of The Galactic Heroes? You get a lot of these sappy moments in the show where people in the two factions both kind of respect their enemy on a personal and professional level, but one guy, Job Truniht (himself kind of a Trump figure) is openly willing to sell his own mother out to get ahead. He ends up more despised than even ostensible enemies cause he’s a self-interested snake. I imagine that’s how the Dems come across to people. They’re snakes, they’ll sell any principle out for power. At least with an enemy in front of you, you can hope for a good game.
>>2569672Criminal is a charged term for most because they associate it with capitalist prison system. If you don't want to use the term then fine. But we still need some designation that says this person broke a social standard and it need to be addressed in some way. Like a mentally ill person who needs to be put into an institution. Maybe they are not "criminals" in the conventional sense but they are forced into an institution to address the illness.
>>2569678>If you just saddle them with felon status they're absolutely not going to be able to make it out of that life.As I already mentioned:
<Having guaranteed jobs programs and training, drug rehab, therapy and making it easier to expunge criminal records of reformed and reintegrated citizens.This is an example off ramp program. I'm sure there are plenty more steps that can be added to make it better or smoother.
>Decriminalizing the prostitutes doesn't mean you have to decriminalize pimping or being a john.Only thing this does is make prostitution cheaper by increasing supply because it no longer has the same cost. If you don't want to use the criminal designation then fine but we still need some legal way to get these women off the streets and out of coercive peoples hands and into the above program.
>uyghur it's literally a marketplace of rapeWhat about Europe and New Zealand? These people are arguing to prostitution into such models. And what about women who sell sex not out of poverty but to get nicer things? There are even observational studies that show female chimps will exchange sex for tastier food than their normal diet. Meaning it's a behavior seen in our relatives that prove it is beyond just poverty. Of course nature doesn't equal good and I want to get rid of it all together not just the poverty fueled version.
>>2569707That's just basic respect and not being a weasel. Manda I has made it clear what his plans are and that he's a socialist. His big win in NYC against the old guard in Cuomo has earned him a ton of respect. His being willing to meet Trump in his home turf earned him points as well no doubt. If he had done some performative BS like refusing to meet Trump or calling him a fascist or whatever, would have led him to being called hysterical.
>>2569707>>2569714I doubt it is an ideological thing. Both Zohran and Trump are similar in that they have influential parents so maybe they have a rich kid vibe. I guess it is Real Life/Internet divide, where people are vicious to each other online but they meet, they are at least amicable if not friendly with one another.
Kind of like how dogs are barking at each other when leashed but unleashed they are more humbled. It also helps that Zohran never made personal attacks on Trump so he can easily survive this meeting with Trump.
honkoid status?
>>2569725Yupp, Fred Trump and Mahmood Mamdani, practically the same person really.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Trump>Born in the Bronx in New York City to German immigrant parents, Trump began working in home construction and sales in the 1920s before heading the real-estate business started by his parents (later known as the Trump Organization).[a] His company rose to success, building and managing single-family houses in Queens, apartments for war workers on the East Coast during World War II, and more than 27,000 apartments in New York overall. Trump was investigated for profiteering by a U.S. Senate committee in 1954 and again by New York State in 1966. Donald Trump became the president of his father's real-estate business in 1971.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmood_Mamdani>Mamdani was one of 23 Ugandan students in the 1963 group of the Kennedy Airlift, a US-funded scholarship program that brought hundreds of East Africans to universities in the United States and Canada between 1959 and 1963.[8][9] Mamdani graduated with a Bachelor of Arts degree from the University of Pittsburgh[2] in 1967.[10]
>He was among the many students in the northern US who made the bus journey south to Montgomery, Alabama, organized by the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee in March 1965 to participate in the civil rights movement. This was during the time of, but distinct from, the Selma to Montgomery marches. He was jailed during the march and was allowed to make a phone call. Mamdani called the Ugandan ambassador in Washington, DC, for assistance. The ambassador asked him why he was "interfering in the internal affairs of a foreign country", to which he responded by saying that this was not an internal affair but a freedom struggle and that they too had gotten their freedom only last year.[11] Soon after, Mamdani learned about Karl Marx's work from an FBI visit.[12]
>He attended the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy of Tufts University and graduated in 1968 with a Master of Arts degree in political science and a Master of Arts degree in law and diplomacy in 1969. He obtained his PhD degree in government from Harvard University in 1974, under the direction of Karl Deutsch.[13] His thesis was titled Politics and Class Formation in Uganda.[14][15]
>Mamdani returned to Uganda in early 1972 and was employed by Makerere University in Kampala as a teaching assistant, at the same time conducting his doctoral research. He and most Asians were expelled later that year by Ugandan dictator Idi Amin because of their ethnicity; Amin intended to "reclaim" businesses and properties. Mamdani left Uganda for a refugee camp in the United Kingdom in early November.[16]
>He left England in mid-1973 after being recruited to the University of Dar es Salaam in Tanzania.[11][17][18] In Dar es Salaam, he completed writing his dissertation. He was active with anti-Amin groups. In 1979, he attended the Moshi Conference as an observer. He returned to Uganda after Amin was overthrown following the Uganda–Tanzania War in 1979.[19] [18] During this period, he was employed as an intern with the All Africa Conference of Churches, an ecumenical Christian alliance based in Nairobi, Kenya, working at the Church of Uganda's Kampala office.[20]
>From 1980 until 1993 he was again employed by Makerere University.[18][20] In 1984, while attending a conference in Dakar, Senegal, he became stateless after his Ugandan citizenship was withdrawn by the government under Milton Obote because of his criticism of its policies.[21] He returned to Dar es Salaam. After Obote was deposed for the second time, Mamdani once again returned to Uganda in June 1986.[9]
>He was the founding director of the Centre for Basic Research (CBR), Uganda's first non-governmental research organisation, where he served from 1987 to 1996.[22][17][23]
>He was also a visiting professor at the University of Durban-Westville in South Africa (January to June 1993), at the Nehru Memorial Museum & Library in New Delhi (January to June in 1995), and at Princeton University (1995–96).[24]
>In 1996, he was appointed the inaugural holder of the AC Jordan chair of African studies at the University of Cape Town,[25] and in early 1997 became head of the Centre for African Studies (CAS).[26] He left after having disagreements with the (mostly white) faculty over the draft of his syllabus for a foundation course on Africa called "Problematising Africa".[27][17] Mamdani, who labelled the present syllabus as "Bantu studies" (in a reference to education of Black people under the apartheid regime)[17] was suspended and eventually resigned.[28] "The Mamdani affair" continues to be referenced in debates about the decolonisation of higher education. He later said that there was no personal bitterness, and he had many enduring relationships from his time there. He said it was about differences in perspective, in particular the structure of the curriculum with regard to the study of South Africa as an African country. He was later (2018) brought back into the fold as a highly-regarded honorary professor.[b][26]
>In 1999, Mamdani was appointed director of the Institute of African Studies at Columbia University, a post he held until 2004.[26] He has continued to teach there ever since (as of 2025).[29]
>He was the director of the Makerere Institute of Social Research (MISR) in Kampala, Uganda, from 2010 until 2022.[30][31][18]
>As of November 2025 he is the Herbert Lehman Professor of Government and a professor of anthropology, political science, and African studies at Columbia University.[18][32]
>He also serves as the chancellor of Kampala International University in Uganda >>2569725>>2569728His mother is some indie director. Probably how he makes these amazingly videos. Of course not the same as Trump's privilege but Zohran is not from a random poor family.
>>2569729(Also something to keep in mind for the anti-immigrant "socialists" who lurked around here)
>>2569730It's prestigious, but I doubt either of them make that much money at all. Being an indie filmmaker and being a college professor usually don't pay that well.
>>2569732Sure I guess the better word for the similarity between them is prestige, not raw wealth.
I guess they haven't found Mamdani's exact NY home yet. I remember they were on that shit with AOC.
https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2025/11/20/donald-trump-zohran-mamdani-meeting-new-york-city-00664147
>Mamdani is a son of the Upper West Side, a neighborhood memorialized in Woody Allen and Nora Ephron movies and long understood as the beating heart of a certain kind of New York culture. If it’s now occupied more by bankers and lawyers, for decades Mamdani’s neighborhood was filled “block for block” with “more celebrated intellectuals than anywhere else in the city,” according to a 1974 New York Times article. People with rent-controlled apartments or a Columbia salary or family money who liked to sit around and debate ideas.
>The family arrived in the neighborhood when Zohran was seven years old, and naturally, his life appears to have been shaped by the milieu. Before going to one of the city’s best public high schools, Mamdani attended Bank Street, a private, progressive school in his neighborhood. The school’s website touts its “developmental-interaction approach,” which recognizes that “authentic growth requires diverse and nurturing opportunities for ongoing social, emotional, and cognitive development.” He had easy access to the kinds of taste-maker institutions that shape culture and determine status; when he was 12, Mamdani was featured in a New York Magazine spread about what kids want for Christmas — books, he said, along with the FIFA 2003 and Sim City 3000 computer games.
<Trump is likewise a New Yorker, and unlike Mamdani, was born in the city. But he was a Queens kid — a wealthy outer-borough resident whose view of Manhattan was shaped from the outside. His upbringing was in some ways much grander than Mamdani’s — he grew up the son of a real estate developer in a 23-room mansion in Jamaica Estates. From his childhood home, though, it takes about 45 minutes by car and an hour by subway to reach midtown Manhattan. He went to private school his whole life, but when he was 13, his father sent him off to a military boarding school upstate, in part because he wouldn’t stop sneaking into Manhattan.
<As an adult, Trump’s clashes with the intellectual elite whose unofficial headquarters were on the Upper West Side became the stuff of legend. As a businessman, he ascended to great heights, building glittery apartments and hotels around Manhattan. But he was routinely mocked by the intelligentsia, most famously called a “short-fingered vulgarian” in Spy magazine.>>2569738First quote is deceptive. Zohran said earlier the agenda was about affordability. They barely talked about ICE and Epstein IIRC.
>>2569383It's zoomer slang like how 420 or 69 was for previous generations but without the drugs or sex. They say it has to do with an old police call 10-67 which means a dead body has been found, which makes sense given its rap origins, but it generally refers to an elation due to the synchronicity of the sequence being said (you could map the frequency of this in the English language with Zipf or Benford) by someone who doesn't know or understand, or can't instantly recognize the reference. My belief is that it is a psychological operation to encourage both gambling and superprediction in the youth by creating the kind of cultural numerological skinner box.
>>2569367SIX SEVEN >>2569749> (you could map the frequency of this in the English language with Zipf or Benford)Wut.
But it's just the new Amogus basically is what you're saying.
>>2569597surprised this bundle of sticks hasn't been fully rehabilitated and invited to the white house yet
>>2569752his murders were too obvious. he should have gotten good.
>>2569750Among us is good example, but it relies on visual artifacts and is harder to track statistically. Of course, among us is an adaptation of the game Mafia, developed at the Moscow State University Psychology Dept as a methodology for psych research.
67 is almost Landian in its linguistic sequentiality, which is interesting given his return. The line meme was only online and was essentially the end of the 'dead baby' joke that had defined the humor of a previous generation, because the joke was no longer funny, the signifier had to be.
>>2569076>I am a serious personincessant neoliberal NPC dialog: "DEEPLY unserious"
>>2569079>declared revolution on live television(my PMC socialist monocle falls into my champagne glass in shock at the idea of proletarian class taking control over the criminal pedophile ruling class)
>>2569150>he "supports Genocide" (how?) https://kalikoba.substack.com/p/annotating-zohran-mamdanis-zionist<Zohran says we must stop “war crimes” and “these atrocities.” Yet the only thing previously described by those terms was the Hamas attack on 10/7…Never are these terms used to describe what the Zionists have done over the last two years, or in the many years before. By beginning and ending the piece with a repetition of these phrases, the focus is shifted once again to the actions of Hamas, the ultimate villain in Zohran’s version of events. "Please explain how its wrong to say Jews are responsible for their holocaust" - CPUSAnon
>>2569760Vile.
And I'll get called an unhinged "turd" worldist
(get it, because brown people = poop!!!! hardy har har) or "zigger"
(get it, because… oh wow it's the same "joke" as the previous one!!! hilarious stuff) if I suggest that maybe this is not an isolated event, but reflective of America, both past and present. In a just state these guys would be shot and rolled into a ditch with zero ceremony or fanfare. Absolutely disgusting vile irredeemable filth that I just KNOW 20-40% of the people even on here "used to" be like during their /pol/ "phase"
>>2569499>Third worldism is the crux of Marxism-Leninism.Lenin's imperial core-periphery dialectics is more nuanced than mere Cold War geopolitics
>>2569538>countries that didn't invade AmericaGraham Platner is not a nazi, in fact he fought for Zionist finance imperialism to destroy any obstacles to Jewish supremacy in the so called "middle east"
>>2569763https://leftypol.org/leftypol/res/2567267.htmlskinhead biker gangs love being mercenary thugs for the IDF in gaza btw
>>2569758See you’re proving your idealism right there, it’s not that Zohran did anything material, it’s that he apparently used the wrong rhetoric which you imagine as having these dire material consequences that you can’t even point to. Again, you’re just engaging in idealism; you think words and ideas move history.
>>2569771not him but the other "team" anons are also doing that, case in point:
>>2569535> Has anyone ever gone into the oval office before and proclaimed themself a socialist before >>2569768I mean I’ve been straightforward with at least a couple coworkers on that topic; showed my party card. I find if you’ve got a decent reputation and just have a calm conversation you can at least get them to see it in a different light.
>>2569768people believe what is convenient for their class to believe. there's no use to try and convince them out of their beliefs while their class remains the same
they'll change their minds when it becomes convenient for them to change their minds, ie when america collapses
>>2569762> if I suggest that maybe this is not an isolated event, but reflective of America, both past and present.That's because not everything bad is unique to America. If you read anything beyond American history you will find that randomly deciding to conquer a neighbor to enslave the women and children happened all over the world long before the USA or even capitalism existed.
>>2569778>That's because not everything bad is unique to AmericaDidn't say that mass tor baiter. you begin by putting words in my mouth and then refute those words. back to the shadows with you.
>If you read anything beyond American history you will find that randomly deciding to conquer a neighbor to enslave the women and children happened all over the world long before the USA or even capitalism existed.wow fascinating, thank you mass tor baiter. i was totally not aware of the slave mode of production. thank you.
fuck you >>2569772Oh for sure that’s idealism, too. Let’s not pretend that walking into the Oval Office and saying “I’m a socialist is all that meaningful. A fun propaganda piece like the image of that Soviet soldier standing in front of the Tsar’s empty throne, but images themselves are not victories unto themselves—though there’s something to be said about morale in a struggle, one wants people to genuinely believe in the possibility of victory so they continue to struggle even as things seem bleak.
So I think the worst that can be said of people celebrating Zohran’s appearance is maybe a kind of naïveté, that’s a far cry from calling him a genocide supporter in my book. The first has the possibility of being mislead, the second decisively declares him to be in the enemy’s camp.
>>2569772>>2569780The platform matters. Why your statements here have magnitudes less impact.
>>2569770I don't think I'd get fired though I could be wrong.
>>2569774I think I'm fairly well-liked. I'll admit I could have brought up the recent merger as a point of contention, maybe I can mention that another time.
>>2569776Let's hope it happens before then.
>>2569781These people are even nuttier than Don Black and his attempt to overthrow Dominica.
>>2569781You're responding to a known fed who thinks he's 'slick' because he can post under the guise of post-irony (i.e. 'haha I named myself after glowies, guys! that means I'm totally not a glowie!') as if this distracts from the fact that he is obviously an actual glowie.
Just ignore the pseud.
>>2569785post it to patriots.win
>>2569786Glownonymous is a name that is attached to anyone using the tor node, not a chosen name.
>>2569789This person in particular is a fed, though.
>>2569707>Unironically I think MAGA types just like it if you’re polite to them.>>2569718>think that is very true. Actually the most MAGA-ist people I know are friendly,ok try being visibly hispanic or black and having a strong accent in their vicinity and watch that suburban friendliness dry up. no matter how friendly you are to them, they will see you as an invader, an outsider, a raper, a pillager, who must be cent to CECOT.
>>2569790I can't tell them apart because most people using the tor node are reactionaries who are ban evading, and maybe a small handful are just privacy concerned people.
new thread lol
>>2569800new thread lol
>>2569800new thread lol
>>2569800new thread lol
>>2569800>>2569797>food pantry has been working out wellerik really out here doing black panthers breakfast program, holy fucking based, i retract making fun of you for the 400 dollar dinner dates
>>2569784>I don't think I'd get fired though I could be wrong.godspeed and good luck
>>2569694the poor ones know it
>>2569668Russia and Ukraine are sad together. :(
>>2569663>I think if you consider yourself a Trump ally he sees you as a sucker. If you’re not an ally but not directly competing against him he wants to be frens.this is true, but only if you're consequential. if you're not consequential he could care less about what happens to you.
>>2569762>Absolutely disgusting vile irredeemable filth that I just KNOW 20-40% of the people even on here "used to" be like during their /pol/ "phase"Maybe nowadays thanks to that retarded Bleaching fetish that got popular over the past 7 years due to retards shilling blacked without realizing their actions have consequences, but back in the day race mixing was looked down upon then and colonialism was viewed as a Jewish scheme, Kyrie Irving posted a few remnants of that.
Anyway though that's irrelevant, as you're right this kind of behavior is reflective of how people were, but in a world where the only people to apologize for their ancestors behavior and feel shame (this is good actually) are white then the push back especially will eventually make people proud of these things again.
Unique IPs: 123