>>2651796British capitalist society is set to degenerate into further conflict, such that the latent development of Fascist rule is present through the backing of Capital to its ever growing extremist political currents in order to maintain the repressive social order of commodity production.
With the subsequent weakening of its rule in the coming period of historical transition, these reactionary elements will be embittered in their confrontation with those social contradictions which begat them; their attempts to consolidate power will be met by the same frustrations that give rise to their antagonists in its more liberal opposition and the reformist left.
The question posed explicitly is what can overcome this national strife; the bourgeois socialists demand economic nationalisation which is to be achieved through the same system of political legitimacy whichactively supports their eradication and works againast them.
The position as a result is clear: revolution. But it must be both decisive and populist, in that it must both decapitate the national rule of the bourgeoisie once and for all, at last its permanent burial, as well as be achieved through a popular overthrow of the weakened system of governance which is to prevail.
The strategy this must take is in proving to those adherents of the bourgeois socialsits that the basis for their entire project is premised on the same rotten foundations by which they make their demands. They seek economic nationalisation, but through a system of bourgeois class rule. On the one hand, these individuals must be radicalised from this position, in realising that it is all or nothing.
On the other it is to be exploitation of the right's weaknesses and internal contradictions which drive them, i.e. the unpopularity of their own economic policies which they must increasingly obscure to their own workers through their system of repressive ideological rule.
In the end, British workers will be forced accept the reality of their circumstances, in that a revolution is inevitable. The social relations of produciton must be reordered as the national economic base in turn is systematically reorganised. Those crises which are not only endemic but existential to the system of production itself threaten in a final sense the continued existence of society.
The question then is what sort of revolution. The socialist answer must be at once first and decisive: it must be a communist one.
>>2651890firm and decisive*
>>2651897*meaty and sensuous
>>2651890marx said that britain can achieve a peaceful and legal revolution, amidst the dickensian conditions of his time. i have no patience for your anti-social wankery that sacrifices politics for activism.
>>2651890Ultimately, with the prevailing system of capitalist rule the total body of society will be forced into a reconciliation with those determinant conditions which face them, primarily as they appear in their political circumstances.
If the British socialists concede and adopt a reformist strategy to power they will be mired in the same bog into which the Parliamentary system is sinking. Conversely, in securing their position they must also achieve through a popular overthrow of this system of governance their victory.
The promulgation stated is one of a political terror. The entire basis for the class rule of the bourgeoisie must be liquidated, along with every type of their supporters: sychophants, opportunists, class traitors.
The absolute stupidity of Your Party is that it believes it can rally behind itself a minority vote in order to achieve a Parliamentary majority by offering the same form of governance which, after 80 years, has presently begun to decline.
It is laughable that they are considered the only serious possibility for socialism within Britain, primarily because they attract like a magnet every would be reformer to their cause who in the end cannot accept the political reality.
>>2651928>marx said that britain can achieve a peaceful and legal revolutionThis is such evident horseshit it is a wonder as to why you wrote it.
>>2651937>horseshitmarx supported reformist movements like the chartists. he didnt support burning down society. i am on marx's side, not this new left maoist bollocks.
>>2651939calling for a violent revolution is peak armchair spectatorship. socialism will come through parliament, sorry to say.
>>2651941The Chartists were violent and their popular uprising was surpressed in 1848; you don't even know your own history.
Likewise, if your demands aren't for revolution what are you even doing on this site.
>>2651955i want a peaceful and legal revolution
you want to kill the country to build a hill out of scraps
>>2651961I wish to shiver my chains and those of others, you wish to continue being a slave.
Remember that in twenty years.
>>2651965you are a slave to senseless passions
join a gym instead of ejaculating your frustrations at us
if capitalism is chaos and socialism is order, be orderly
>>2651974You are literally just sprouting more mindless horseshit, shut the fuck up.
>>2651976go on them, im all ears
whats the plan? make things worse and then when things are really bad, take power?
Humans by our nature are disorderly, illogical, cruel, animal, and barbarian.
We evolved to survive and hunt on the African savannahs, to reproduce as efficiently as possible. That's it. We're an overgrown virus. Order is an irrelevancy, a by-process of conscious minds, an unnecessary complication of sapience, of the unanticipated evolution of emergent higher order thought processes.
Mentally we haven't evolved past our palaeolithic programming.
We do not understand reality. We can't even directly interact with it if we tried. Our meat suits and our brains filter and interpret the data - and they are hardwired to lie to us.
Every day your mind tells itself millions of little lies in order to process the data it receives on the limited energy and hardware available to it.
Our brains fill in the blanks in vision during saccades, only focuses on the centre of the visual field, filters out the background noise, filters out unlikely background data, to sort reorganise and delete memories. Failure leads to the psychoses and schizophrenias of too much data and the inability to prioritise.
What is order? It's an unreachable utopia. It's finding out the light at the end of the tunnel is always retreating from you.
No amount of discipline, no amount of scientific understanding will ever make it real to our consciousnesses. Because evolutionarily speaking it isn't a necessity, it's a hindrance.
It's the chaos of constant change and flux that breeds innovation and new pathways, new developments, better survival, better reproduction.
My point is terms like order are meaningless. Because we are not logical entities. You cannot intellectually rape humans into rationality. You cannot breed maths.
That said, we have to strive against biology to an approximation of logic all the same, because to abandon it is to embrace the barbarity, the idealism, fascism.
Accept order isn't real. And then fight the core of your own biology to achieve it, to build fact, truth, science, materialism, progress.
Kill the palaeolithic hunter gatherer who rides your brain, strangle the life out of him, build a temple to logic and order on his grave.
>>2652066Say what you want it changes nothing.
>>2652064humans are actually naturally kind and intelligent
only a minority of psychopaths rule over us
>>2652061do you also clean your chimney?
>>2652088Kindness isn't the same as being logical. Intelligence isn't the same thing as having consciousness.
>>2652102to me, people are generally good, not generally bad.
the idea that we are inherently evil is superstitious at best, and justifying of violence at worst.
The truth for communists is even bleaker than long-post lad makes out: the truth is that in one sense Labour could fix 80% of the pain with economic and social reforms entirely possible under neoliberalism and bring Britain up to the level of a half-functioning country. Indeed, Reform or the Tories could also take/have taken some of these steps.
In the other sense, not even a revolution could save Britain because path dependency and institutional incompetence runs too deep. One would inevitably find that the middle ranks of the British Republic would be stacked with those who'd reproduce much of the dynamics of the status quo.
Milton Friedman was wrong about a few things, but never more right than when saying: People respond to incentives. Britain, alas, is a nation of bad incentives.
>>2652198as carl menger understood, economic faculty comes from scarcity of resources, which is then the prerequisite for rationalising their allocation. the public sector is simply too rich, because it "spends other peoples money" as mrs thatcher used to say.
>>2652208It's not that it's too rich, it's that it's too closed a system. Fake private firms set up by thatcher buy politicians to keep giving them public money and refrain from changing the regulatory environment in such a way as to bring in competition.
Britain was particularly vulnerable to this flagrant corruption because our primary constitutional defence against it is the idea that Tory aristocrats will be financially comfortable enough from daddy's estate that they'll be good chaps and, while covering up a noncing here or there, they won't put their hands in the till. This is not a theory that survived contact with the 1980s.
>>2652214no, i feel that the liberty of spending inherently causes frivolity, like the obscenity of common luxuries, such as rolex watches. the richer you are, the less rational. plato describes this in part where he says that an ideal leader cannot be paid too heavily or he will be corrupted by the wrong incentive. thats why paying MPs minimum wage will immediately solve political incompetency since so many would immediately quit.
>>2652218How did you find your way to this site
>>2652220sorry?
pay MPs 20 grand a year and things will get better.
agree?
>>2652223I'm talking about quoting the socially backward political ideals of long since dead slave owners on a Marxist imageboard.
Perhaps, comrade, we should abolish wages altogether if we wish for our MPs to do their jobs
>>2652218you're thinking too optimistically. first, in the sense that you're aiming for a sort of rational ideal rather than simply "as bad as other countries", second and more pedantically that unless you control not just their spending but their entire lifestyle, you can just gift them things - and gifts are where our MPs really show how pathetic they are.
In a way I respect Lloyd George selling peerages and using the money to fund only his faction of the liberal party - peerages are stupid and that's a good game if you can play it. industrialists on his side get ermine robes, he gets money, everyone wins. i think Tony Blair is an idiot for trading peerages for
loans that Labour had to pay back (come on man!), and I think that it's simply pathetic that Keir Starmer can be bought off with concert tickets and suits. if keir starmer were selling the country out for millions and tens of millions that would be one thing, but he's being bribed for about the value of his salary! the man in charge of £1,200,000,000,000 of public spending should not be bought for ~£100,000 in suits and concert tickets. his rolex alone should cost more than that!
>>2652246i should clarify that last part to avoid ambiguity: of course, the ideal prime minister does not have a £100,000 rolex. but a prime minister who was at least
good at being corrupt would have such a rolex. in being so small-change in his corruption, you can tell that Starmer isn't even good at
that. we have not elevated a skilled but evil operator, we have elevated a dud, a mark who doesn't know the value of what he's selling. we have elevated a loser who would be out of his depth running a tesco superstore.
Greens latest attempt to win the youth vote
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpv709w9j1xo
<Green Party calls for under-22s to get free bus passes>The Green Party is calling for free bus passes for everyone under the age of 22 in England to make it easier for them to travel for work and education.>>2652264A fact so indisputable it needs to be backed up by surgical modification
>>2652447I agree with this, I remember having to forge bus passes to get into town to work for free on an 'apprenticeship'
>>2652447it's not a terrible idea (they do this in scotland) but i always hate age-gated policies like this. it's bad, but i feel like a time-limited system (e.g. 4 years of free bus travel to use as you please) is better.
mostly because my circumstances were such that i couldn't and wouldn't have taken advantage of free bus travel until 25 at the youngest. yet generally the rule is: free/subsidized for <25 and >60, otherwise fuck you toil more.
railcards, which do admittedly have a 26-30 now, can have me ranting for hours. you think "oh, but it's just sensible price discrimination by age to sell tickets at times when there's less demand to people who statistically have less money" and then you see that the network railcard, the first railcard, was literally just a subsidy for living in london. >>2652447They have this in scotland and it's saved my ass so many times icl
being born in britain is some real kafkaesque rng
thought you were being clever putting all your modifiers into pushing gdp per capita above $20,000 didn't you? thought you were going to get something good, didn't you? you thought you lucked out when you got "native language: english" didn't you?
fuck you, you're gonna wish you'd taken the malay shopkeeper's son you rolled instead of rerolling you dumb fuck
>>2653010Scotland wins again.
England stay stranded
>>2653189>out when you got "native language: english" didn't you?No i knew i fucked chargen as soon as i went and read the regional socio-economic metas, tbh. Just keep playing this stupid game because i cbf to delete.
Ridiculous. Didn't think accent would matter so i just chose the fun quirky one and now on top of hard debuff to basically all social checks it also soft-locks you out of any real progression. stupid fucking nonsense. Starmer sending his most strongly worded tweets in response to the Trump tariffs… Amazing work.
Unique IPs: 16