Lately leftists online (such as Logo Daedalus) have been speculating about a possible return to 2010s HR individualist managerial political correctness (a.k.a., woke) in light of Trump’s falling popularity polls over the Epstein files and his failure to rebound the US economy as well as his second administration being overall more fascist and extreme than the first one both rhetorically (see the DHS’s Twitter account which seems to be ran by a wignat) and in practice (e.g., expansion of ICE under the current regime).
Maybe this will age like milk, but personally I don’t think the woke will ever come back, primarily due to the fact that it arose during a period in American history that can’t be replicated in the foreseeable future as well as because it got heavily exhausted to its fullest potential by 2024, something else will form instead but I can’t put my fingers on it. Let me elaborate…
Yes, there may be backlash to Trump in the form of:
- greater tolerance for immigration,
- renewed talk about abolishing ICE (which isn’t actually necessary for border security and overlaps with existing agencies),
- less willingness to tolerate soft white nationalism or openly white-nationalist speech now that the Trump project has made its racial character explicit.
But I don’t think that means a return to the specific ideological package of the 2010s.
The elite liberal factions that promoted “wokeness” as a substitute for social democracy feel politically exhausted. Their compromises — with Trumpism, with Zionism, with capital more broadly — are remembered, and they’ve already pivoted to new projects like “abundance,” technocratic managerialism, or vibes-based productivity politics.
We might see a kind of “safe-edgy” social democracy rhetorically, but I don’t think the elite will allow anything that seriously threatens capital or entrenched interests. So whatever comes next is unlikely to be fully institutional or top-down. If anything, it’ll be more grassroots — and may spill into a harder, older form of class politics once people realise triangulation won’t be permitted to go very far.
Historically, this actually reminds me of Reconstruction and the post-Reconstruction US. Open and legally encoded white supremacy wasn’t just a bottom-up backlash — it was an elite project. And I don’t think today’s elites are going back to the post-1960s model of tightly policing racist expression at their level, even if they still condemn it rhetorically.
I was telling a friend: basically everything liberals tried to suppress the rise of reaction — platform bans, censorship, cancellations — failed. So now what? You can’t really “solve” this without something like outright repression. Gulags to defend the liberal order? Not exactly practical or appealing. Yes, you can cite J.S. Mill or Popper about being “illiberal to protect liberalism,” but it’s unclear anyone will buy it, or that liberal elites are willing to spend the political capital and legitimacy required.
So instead, I think we get something closer to the Latin American model:
Official color-blindness, loud condemnation of racism in theory, combined with deeply racialised everyday life. Elites live in segregated neighbourhoods while preaching anti-racism to foreigners; normies are often quietly or openly racist; everyone pretends this isn’t contradictory.
Israel is (or was) a version of this too. Some limited tolerance for non-Jewish citizens or guest workers, while brutally repressing Palestinians who aren’t citizens (which is most of them). Now that Israel has more openly defined itself as an ethnic state where democracy is secondary, you can see what looks like social cannibalism: racism turning inward, targeting different kinds of Jews and non-Palestinian gentiles.
There are already extreme examples — like reports where Thai migrant farm workers described near-universal sexual abuse, or polling showing majorities supporting stripping non-Jewish citizens of citizenship and deporting them. There’s no real way to spin that into anything other than ethnic cleansing, or at least mass support for it.
Whether Israel could actually carry that project through is another question, given the manpower gap between its economic needs, military ambitions, and the idea of a “pure” ethnostate. But if things escalated internally, I wouldn’t bet on restraint. History suggests reactionary movements don’t stop at their first target.
Anyway — my point isn’t that “wokeness is coming back,” but that the old ideological containers are broken. What replaces them probably won’t be prettier, more coherent, or more stable. It’ll just be different.
Curious what others think — are we heading into something genuinely new, or just remixing old contradictions under new branding?
P.S.: Yes, Trump’s immigration policies are unpopular:
https://www.politico.com/news/2026/04/18/immigration-poll-trump-deportation-campaign-00879549>>2792073>So instead, I think we get something closer to the Latin American model:>Official color-blindness, loud condemnation of racism in theory, combined with deeply racialised everyday life.This is just a repackaged 1990s and 2000s. It ended up imploding into the 2010s and 2020s. The "Latin American" model was tried and failed already. The next model is going to be some weird hybrid but it won't be the Latin model nor Woke completely
>>2792073>This is just a repackaged 1990s and 2000s. It ended up imploding into the 2010s and 2020s. That implosion was caused by Obama taking the wrong side of every racial conflict america had during his presidency more than anything else
But i guess if one guys actions can torpedo the idea then it probably wasn't going to live for too long anyway.
Woke is back baby
>We might see a kind of “safe-edgy” social democracy rhetorically, but I don’t think the elite will allow anything that seriously threatens capital or entrenched interests
Are you implying "woke" was doing this? Because in practice it was just radfem bullshit mixed with insane resentful narcissist brown rambling directed at Da Uhwhite Man, all of it got sublated into Fruit Loop Say BLM.
Woke litteraly collapsed upon itself because they couldnt decide if trans people counted as piece of shit privileged white men or be counted as oppressed minority.
Lolgo is an idiot however.
>>2792073Trump is going to become a toxic brand at the end of his term and the next republican try to turn into a more serious ideological version of trumpism, less populist.
You're going to see a rise of nonwoke environmental class based populism because the USA will start to really see the consequences of climate change, and because oil prices will have exploded, without an actual leading ideological figure, right-wing democrats will align themselves with the rebranded republicans who will use the Trump precedent in order to put in place an actual dictatorship to crack down on the left opposition.
Woke is going to be associated with Trump's era, but he'll be remembered a lot more then woke ever will be.
>>2792097you're a rube if you fall for the radfem posturing and superficial "LGB" aesthetic of TERFist astroturf orgs. some TERFs are radfems, sure (that's what gave us the nice acronym!), but the center of gravity of TERFism is middle aged conservative women, not feminists. there's a reason
Mumsnet is one of the TERFiest websites around and TERF policies are legislated by socially conservative administrations - and it's not because they've all sat down and read Janice Raymond!
>>2792097Woke failed because it concentrated on the smallest of minorities and taking the most maximalist of positions, you can't have a strong popular movement based on making people call non-binary people "they/them" when people struggle economically.
recently i read a substack article called "the genealogy of woke" which covers the history of wokeness, 2010s wokeness is not a new phenomenon, in fact bursts of wokeness have happened before in the past. the late 80s and early 90s, the 60s, and the 20s.
2010s wokeness started because of the 2008 crash, which led to occupy wall street, which failed, and morphed into what we now call woke.
Woke even existed in the pre modern era. except it was by evangelical christians instead of a political thing, the temperance movement, abolition, all christian wokeness
wokeness is a mode of thinking that is as american as apple pie.
the real problem with wokeness is that it never accomplishes anything because it is symbolic, not action oriented, and always, always leads to a reaction. woke people do not improve material conditions or workers rights, they tear down statues and rename schools.
in the 60s the wokeness led to nixon winning by a landslide, 2010s wokeness of course led to trump. this is the real reason woke is stupid, but i think its part of american lefts DNA, it has to be beat out of them or something
its long but give it a read, its pretty good
https://1dimereview.substack.com/p/the-genealogy-of-wokeism-part-1https://1dimereview.substack.com/p/the-evangelical-origins-of-wokeness-239>>2792111I admit that I didn’t read past the introduction, but given how reactionaries like the Irish uberboyo have commented on early Christianity being the Roman empire’s equivalent of wokeness, I think this is the key issues with such analyses:
They tend to forge an ideological construct of wokeness as a consistent phenomenon, forgetting both its transformation from a slogan in the American liberal progressive movement rooted in Ebonics to an American right-wing online pejorative, as well as its origins in the postmodernism movement.
Every attempt to map a genealogy of wokeness into history ends up being just an ideological and selective reading from the author’s point that is no different from either ideological Whig history or nationalistic readings.
So I’m sceptical about the Substack pieces that you linked.
>>2792105This assumes that wokeness started with demands and worked towards becoming a "thing". Allow me to put the opposite case:
The internet makes politics increasingly a personality game. If you're agreeable, neurotic, and open-minded, you will become woke. Whatever real world privations face you aren't as important as the neuroticism: that tells you something is wrong. Even under actually-existing communism, it will tell you something is wrong. So you go looking for the wrong thing, and what fits? Well, some other trait of yours that society discriminates against, obviously. That's where you get into social justice one way or another. It's not wrong to say that society is badly constructed, but you've found a structural cause to a personal problem, which is relaxing.
The maximalist positions then flow from trying to solve the problem, but if the problem was really solved a new problem would show up. Nevertheless, we've got a name for this iterative process of finding and fixing problems: progress!
This phenomenon is also great for the left because ultimately, whether you're trying to explain why girlboss feminism didn't make you feel good, or trying to explain why society is actively getting worse for some groups, the answer conveniently leads back to a higher power. what higher power draws these things together? the economic base - capitalism!
So you become a socialist or communist (Yahoo! What a hundred years of useless left organizers couldn't achieve, Tumblr and Twitter delivered from on-high. Material conditions, baby!)
There is a very, very, very strong correlation between wanting to help those struggling economically and wanting to respect pronouns. The stereotypical HR lib came and went because capitalist firms initially thought they could co-opt and accommodate the string of demands and differentiate their brands (if politics is an identity product, identity products must become political!) only for them to later realize that the demands are never-ending, so now they're trying the stick instead of the carrot. but you can't do that - Trump isn't going to beat society back to the 1990s, he's just selling a much uglier version of politics to people with asshole personalities: low agreeableness, low openness, notably lower neuroticism in aggregate (your confident karens etc) but with some very neurotic individuals of a different type.
The same process again! You're not open minded enough to realize why you, a straight white man with lots of prejudices, feel bad… You're not agreeable enough to smile and nod through the liberal rituals… but you feel terrible because you're neurotic… Why? Well, the Jews, the WEF, the democrats, feminists, transgender people… They did this to you! Kill everyone who isn't you and the pain will stop! (The pain will not stop.)
The beauty of this theory is it also explains the "woke right" (e.g. the current conservative backlash deploys exactly the same tactics as the "woke left"), because the beginning and the end of the phenomenon is a vibe instead of a policy platform.
>>2792111I will admit to having not yet read, but I will put something of a case what you say: You end with Nixon winning in the 1960s, but most of the cultural demands of 1960s liberals and hippies were met. In the UK there's a similar phenomenon in the 1980s: the left lost every single economic battle, but won almost every cultural battle. In such a light, it would seem premature to write off wokeness or to view it as a total failure. Nixon's victory couldn't stop abortion or drug culture, let alone the march to gay acceptance and gay marriage, why should we think Trump's victory will be any more enduring?
The religious connection is a fun one, though: Politics has taken on many of the former functions of religion. It gives you a morality to live by, a community you can trust and distrust, taboos, rituals, a fantastical better life to dream of, and all without any of that old supernatural nonsense.
Both “woke” and libertarian-safe edgy culture were downstream of campus environments at top universities, that’s where the pundits, writers and major media figures largely came from. It required an incredibly stable America and broader Western world to exist, without that stability it collapses almost immediately. The article
>>2792111 touches on this, but it doesn’t go far enough. cause I’d argue that woke culture didn’t really ebb and flow or come in bursts, Instead it was a byproduct of the post–WW2 liberal world landscape. Even the neoconservative and libertarian elements of the right, despite their pretensions still followed fundamental liberal values and upheld them, either knowingly or unconsciously.
>>2792125If you look up the "most racist films or comedies, you'll find that many of the creators were politically liberal who were pushing the boundaries of comedy. Western conservatives as a group, while having their own issues, more often than not did not intend to offend. I recall a comedian who once compared feminists to 'Church ladies we used to make fun of.' Interestingly many of the people who created crass and edgy series like The Man Show and Tosh.0 are now vocal supporters of 'woke' rhetoric, which many people seem to dislike. I don't see this as a contradiction at all, it’s the same type of humor, but now focused exclusively on what are deemed 'oppressor groups.'"
Fundamentally, the man's show brand of masculinity is no different from who we would call "soyboys" today, The difference is just a minor variation in rhetoric and how they frame themselve.
>>2792124you ignore the part where i say that wokeness doesnt accomplish anything beyond the symbolic, thats why it is a cancer.
thats why it isnt communism.
>>2792134the fact you can kiss a guy in public without being lamped or jailed would suggest it has accomplished more than a symbolic victory.
wokeness doesn't have to be communist to achieve the goals it sets itself. that woke has trended towards setting themselves the goal of communism is a good sign!
if you ask me whether i want the last 100 years of western communists (achievements: zilch) pushing communism, or the guys who made it so even republicans pose as pro-gay to be the ones pushing communism, there's no contest in who i'd pick.
though both have an uphill job ahead of them. >>2792138im sure it makes you feel all warm and fuzzy and correct
but woke people are moral police concerned with symbolic and cultural victories, not class.
>>2792140Woke is a post-modernist term at this point. It doesn't mean anything in 2026
>>2792138There were plenty of communists involved in struggling for gay rights/civil rights/etc, check yourself
>>2792145A wishy washy statement that means nothing. You don't even have the guts to imply their support was decisive. Instead of a real reckoning with their inability to organise effectively as communists, you scramble for something else to defend those who failed on their own terms.
>>2792138Socialism in America and the rest of the western world really did get a facelift by progressives adopting it, to an extent. But at the same time, the limits of progressivism make it a hollow socialism, bereft of the critique of political economy that makes it make sense, filled in with cultural signifiers and geopolitical alignment. I'm not going to claim that this is its limit, or that I think being able to have a conversation about it is bad. But there's certainly a contradiction there and a choice to be made between it remaining a signifier or something more than that.
>>2792103Radfems that arent transphobic are contemptible people with a stupid ideology just like transphobic radfems, the controlling crones you described are the telos of radical feminism if anything.
>>2792105"POCs" arent "the smallest of minorities" by definition and were the forefront of Woke so you are incorrect. Trans related topics were a later arrival into wokeness that was controvertial within wokeness itself because of their proximity to white malehood. Fundational Woke was mainly metoo and buzzfeed radical feminism with ascending brown middle class ethnonarcissism, skewing more Asian and Indian than African-American this time around.
Prior to that transgender topics were a Silicon Valley libertarian thing and a policy wonk liberal establishment thing examplified w/ the Virginia trans bathroom debate that had chad normie Roy Cooper stepping in, it only became part of Woke around 2018 or so, and always had a precarious position within the movement.
I remember some old blogpost by Yarvin where he proposed some e-famous trans woman programer at the time to be the techno-priest Brahman of the incoming Yarvinian Regime, Nick Land was pro-trans before he became a lobotomized MAGAboomer, different times.
>>2792124Good posts.
>>2792138I agree. Honestly the cementing of homosexuals as Humans was one of the great victory of woke, sadly it came at the coast of casting transsexuals into the thunder dome in order to sanewash gay rights, faustian bargain and all that. Though they will make it but i can get why some of them felt abandonned fencing for themselves by the progressives, since they pretty much were rugpulled.
the Stop Asian Hate movement collapsing when it was revealed the asian bashings in the USA were overwhelmingly being done by random black people kinda killed wokeism and i don't think it will ever recover from it.
A whole anti-racism movement being stopped in its tracks because the perpetrators were on a higher oppression ladder than the victims made a lot of people stop and think "wtf are we doing here???"
Actually that was North Carolina, not Virginia.
>>2792159Stop Asian Hate was retarded ethnonarcissism stuff to begin with like most of what came from Woke. I am thankful of based antisocial black lumpen for ending it if true.
But in reality it was just the trans debate that imploded woke not black on asian crime. Reactionary think-tanks and billionaires were pretty open about going all in on trans culture war to kill woke because they noticed the radfem and browns hated trans, even Trump, someone who was pro-trans in a normie cosmopolite way alluded to it in his speeches.
The most good willed and late arrival into woke got hit the hardest while it's most fetid subhuman elements got off scot-free and even rebranded as conservagolem influencers for their BRAVE opposition to TRANS.
>>2792140They have put themselves in a position where the next sphere of symbolic, cultural victory is class. Woke young people have a more accurate model of the western working class (themselves! Blue haired baristas!) than the average leftypol poster (invariably pining for a guy who looks and sounds like a prole from 50 years ago, but is actually petit bourgeois, because such a figure is much less alienating than the actually existing proletariat)
The moral police deciding that capitalism is immoral and socialism is moral is a good thing. It does not guarantee the final victory of communism, but it's progress! It's something a competent left could work with!
>>2792073It's insane how no one called you out as a bot. Clanker. Rule of 3gger.
Wokeness was the fat funny caterpillar. What's already here to an extent is the butterfly. Vocal opposition to the ruling class among a majority of the youth on almost every policy. Class-based politics. The destruction of the idea of the middle class. That's the stuff. Doesn't mean anything will actually happen though.
>>2792165I don't think the average leftycel thinks workers are only bearded dudes with wrenches. That's more of a Hazite mental illness
>>2792124I think your first point about politics becoming more about personality then ideas is true, especially in the context of the culture war.
I however, disagree with the idea that this has been beneficial for socialist or communist causes.
While there is a correlation between the woke type and a vague idea of supporting the working class, it's purely lip service.
And I disagree that the conclusion wokism leads to the idea of capitalism being bad, this again is often lip service, but as woke types have no coherent ideology, they cannot explain what the post-capitalism world will look like. And in terms of actions this doesn't corresponds either, the cancelling of random working class men for odd behavior is a good exemple of it, you cannot call yourself in favor of the working class while supporting the weakening of labor laws to fire people you dislike.
They're also inherently exclusive toward white men, see the usage of the term privileged, stripped of its actual class based definition, for them a homeless white man is privileged and a rich black woman is oppressed.
>>2792158It wasn't the best exemple, but wokeness tended to shrink in favor of smaller and smaller groups by an intersectional view. Goes from Black people, to black women to black trans women and so on and on. I think the clearest exemple of that is the new versions of the Pride flag they keep making. You often see rethoric about how black men are the white people of black people. Or the whole 'latinx' drama.
>But I don’t think that means a return to the specific ideological package of the 2010s.
That's because it never existed back then. Reactionary content farms made up a imaginary version of the left to be mad at.
The closest approximation to the retvrn to woke is the death of search engines and centralized social media, which will make access to content farms difficult and unlikely to happen incidentally.
>>2792181>You often see rethoric about how black men are the white people of black people. Or the whole 'latinx' drama.That's twitter. Your sole evidence that woke ever existed is twitter, and your interpretations of vexilology.
>>2792181Your view of woke types seems very dated. The non-demand of today is to organise, mutual aid, all that stuff. Cancellation is almost exclusively used to refer, negatively, to circular firing squads within a group, and "privilege" is all but gone. If anyone ever thought white homeless men were privileged, those days are long gone. Again: it's not a fixed set of ideas, it's a disposition grasping for ideas to explain underlying feelings.
>>2792111>Woke even existed in the pre modern era. except it was by evangelical christians instead of a political thing, the temperance movement, abolition, all christian wokeness … wokeness is a mode of thinking that is as american as apple pie.Haven't read the article (but might check it out) and I agree with this. It's a secularized version of something which goes back to before the country was founded. Harvard was once a religious school founded by people who wanted a government of the godly and they could also define what that was.
>the real problem with wokeness is that it never accomplishes anything because it is symbolic, not action oriented, and always, always leads to a reaction. Or value driven. It does accomplish some things though, it's quite longstanding and many of their goals have been implemented, it's just that what they want to accomplish and what radicals are after are often different things, and it's very rare that the progressives accomplish things on their own initiative without the support of others of different goals involved.
>>2792124>The religious connection is a fun one, though: Politics has taken on many of the former functions of religion. It gives you a morality to live by, a community you can trust and distrust, taboos, rituals, a fantastical better life to dream of, and all without any of that old supernatural nonsense.Will recommend the article "Progressively Losing" by Richard Kline. Written in 2011. He traces Anglo-American progressivism back to English reform communities and contrasts that with radicalism.
<Anglo-American ‘progressivism’ has its origins in Non-Conformist religious reform communities. These date to Lollard times in England c. 1400, before the US was settled, and always had a significant social reformist element beyond within a professed Christian carapace, as it were. Literacy, education, personal liberty, and economic liberalism are all embedded in this worldview, formed as it was between the contesting pressures of a rapacious, French-speaking aristocracy and a crypto-absolutist monarchy with scant regard for the rule of law, while a venal and irreligious church hierarchy provided no relief. England from c. 1350-1500 was a place of intense factions and irruptions of civil war, leaving a distaste for power-seekers and military rebellion. Few of them were rich; it was a proto-bourgeois and petite bourgeois community, but with religious congregants in the lesser nobility giving them communication with power. The suffered erratic but at times severe religious persecution prior to c. 1600, and political disenfranchisement even after that, which much shaped their negative view of state power. There is much more to this subject, which demands a text no one has yet written. This is a social tradition are both fairly well-defined and quite longstanding.
<The first key point is that the tradition of progressive dissent is integrally a religious one. The goal isn’t usually power but ‘truth;’ that those in the right stand up for what is right, and those in the wrong repent. The City on the Hill and all that, but that is the intrinsic value. This is a tradition of ideas, many of them good, many of them implemented—by others, a point to which I’ll return. https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/09/richard-kline-progressively-losing.html What is this utter fucking garbage, some of you are incapable of thinking
>>2792194>The first key point is that the tradition of progressive dissent is integrally a religious one. The goal isn’t usually power but ‘truth;’ that those in the right stand up for what is right, and those in the wrong repent. The City on the Hill and all that, but that is the intrinsic value. This is a tradition of ideas, many of them good, many of them implemented—by others, a point to which I’ll return. This is such horseshit that you've linked it's beyond belief.
>>2792191Go look at any DSA conferance and you'll see exacky what I'm talking about.
>>2792193I've interacted with woke people in my life, they're like that (well with French equivalence) some even tried to cancel me irl, didn't work out tho. But good enough if things are changing in America, but thats most likely because their previous tactics failed.
>>2792196Well that's just like your opinion, man
What do the middle class yuppie academic types push in semi-failed states where everyone is poor and gang violence is common? Crass materialism? That's our future when people can't read or regulate their emotions or solve problems without teacher's help.
>>2792258idk, reopen the schools?
what you're talking about isn't "woke culture" it's just rainbow capitalism, for a brief period between trump 1.0 and trump 2.0 the corporate world thought trumpism was over for good and tried to rebrand themselves as leftist allies, then came trump 2.0 and they slammed on the brakes and backpedaled, but this was all just optics, the actual ideology of the ruling class technocracy was never "woke" it was always far-right dark enlightenment nihilism.
>>2792073Woke never left. The 2010s sucked balls. We are not liberals.
A return of “safe-edgy”? “Color blindness”? No, you are simply outdated. While you’re here thinking regression, dark woke is already sharpening their pikes.
>>2792270
No actually. They are all in process of rejecting the entire system. The current rules of the world are preventing them from receiving what they need, so now they will seek to make new ones instead. Some are already fully aware, some are not, but most of them will arrive at the same destination.
>>2792273Dead by the hands of the inevitable military coup
>>2792274There will not be a military coup. It’s already tearing itself apart. And even if it did, the military does not have the best track record either.
>>2792276The military tearing itself apart is part of what will cause the coup, especially with deranged schizophrenic civilians being unqualified and unable to make any decisions because of the 200 year old constitution. It will be a civil war between the branches of the military depending on what side of the coup they find themselves on.
>>2792278
No point in a freikorp when the communist threat doesn’t exist
>>2792278It shouldn’t, because that’s something else. Something that’s already getting fucked over.
>>2792279>The military tearing itself apart is part of what will cause the coupThem tearing themselves apart is what makes the coup impossible. They would not have the strength to be anything more than a local menace at best.
>especially with deranged schizophrenic civilians being unqualified and unable to make any decisions because of the 200 year old constitutionI am noticing a higher than expected estimation of the military’s capabilities. I would suggest more realistic.
>It will be a civil war between the branches of the militaryAgain with the expectations. Be more realistic.
>>2792099We all know the next GOP ticket:Tucker/Owens.
>>2792288Rivalries between military branches can be much easier contained and cause less gridlock than the two parties trying to outretard each other, the coup is inevitable, a reactionary Carnation revolution.
>>2792298They'll probably try JD vance first, but lose to the dems, and afterwards they'll put in Tucker in my opinion, Anti-Trump Maga will be the next big thing. More likely to actually succed in making a dictatorship and more likely to have an actual coherent vision of things.
>>2792299ICE. The Police. Petite bourgeoisie hate groups.
>>2792303>Rivalries between military branches can be much easier containedVery debatable, and regardless it won’t be contained.
>cause less gridlock than the two parties trying to outretard each other Much of the military is still loyal to the two parties, and will continue to follow their orders. Even when they become too unbearable, many simply become lost rather than rebellious.
>the coup is inevitableThe coup never had a chance to begin with. A chance that has only decreased even more due to the current administration’s actions. As I said earlier, they will splinter into groups, and that will be that for the military.
>>2792073Idk what you're on about OP. Wokness had total victory, even the right are all gay and multicultural now. Someone else said it in the thread but sometimes after nixion the left stopped being able to effect the economic structure and increasingly devoted more to cultural victories. This is for a variety of reason, the democrats going along with McCarthysim, the failures of the new left to capture or create a party outside the democrats. Outsourcing killing unions, the collapse of the soviet union ect ect. But the ruling class is increasingly running out of distractions and scapegoat. As another anon said the HR wokness of the 2010s was not only a backlash to the George Bush era. Where you had to pray to the flag 5 times a day and bless the troops. There was also the 2008 crisis and capital was trying to co-opt and divide the left. I hope you're right that we won't see that again but dont be surprised if they try the ol' cultural switcho with another Obama type figure leading the charge.
logo is an idiot.
>>2792352There is no pendulum swing, that’s not how political progress works. When people say ‘woke is dead,’ what they really mean is objective diffrent, no one is talking about things like CRT or masks anymore. People just don’t seem to care about it now. Even many young feminists, who once tried to create made up terms they thought wouldn’t offend anyone to callout are now openly using slurs against people they dislike without worrying about who it offends.
>>2792610God I haven't thought about a good number of these since I was a teenage chud. Is metokur in the ground yet?
>>2792613still doing streams and like I said he's a liberal now, most of them are
>>2792073— why is everyone responding to a fucking chatgpt post?
>>2792073>Lately leftists onlineNo real life workers care about what happens online
>>2792073>Logo DaedalusThis clown thought MAGA Communism was gonna be the biggest thing. He's just an adjacent ACP mouthpiece.
The future is wokeness + Richard Hanania's elite human capital theory.
Anti-wokes are by and large low autism score, with a handful of smarter people who - because they have to play to a dumb audience - become dumber themselves. (Look at Elon Musk - always a dickhead, but now retarded to boot!)
Wokeness cuts against openly recognising this fact as of yet, but it has much to commend. There is no stronger argument against white nationalism than 15 minutes looking at the bottom dwellers (of all races, amusingly enough) who put their self worth in it.
woke 2.0 is going to be anti-porn, anti-lolicon, and anti-age gap. It's going to suck. Ironically Logo is a part of this with his often contradictory melding of Hudson, Marxism (but really Veblen), and Christianity.
>>2793052>The future is wokeness + Richard Hanania's elite human capital theory.Probably the most likely outcome. Palantir is basically this and so are all the weapon contractors like Raytheon/lockheed. LGBT will probably soften the angles with much less public display of anal fisting parades and drag queen story hour type stunt this time around (not a bad thing) in order to look less degen and more profesional and managerial. Pretty much all non-provincial queers today have ditched lefty-queer sensibilities to adopt cosmopolitan striver mentality and instagram FYP Top Gun looksmaxxing aesthetic.
Reminder that Alex Karp was huge Kamala bidder in 2024, they will reward him and his people in the next dem admin for this.
>>2793469lolgo is a gigantic aging normalfag millenial whose wet dreams are about putting the uppity progressive youth in their place but with based orthobro CCP majik instead of fashwave christpilled majik. All he want his old alt-right friend to think he's cool and cultured by picking on leftists. Just an awful guy all around.
He became completely unsufferable ever since he had a child. I know fatherhood can change a man but i did not become like this when i had kids.
>>2793488hes still so mad that kantbot told him off lmao
>>2792611I never said there was a pendulum swing. Not the point of my post. My point is that absent any ability to organize on economics. The American left became solely about maintaining whatever was left of the new deal and advancing social justice. They won on the culture front while the right has consolidated state power. The right has tried reversing the social gains and freedoms and have seen limited success. But they still have solidified in creating a reactionary culture that has lasting cultural or social impact.
>>2792073I thought woke was gays in movies and blacks on tv
>>2793535
Like what? Stop vagueposting
>>2793590
your melties over jewGODs will never amount to anything
>>2792124>>2792125>>2792127Neither the Tumblr blue hairs nor the libs trying to make up for their racist comedy movies moved to the left nor contributed anything.
>>2792610All these are literal whos none of whom are relevant today.
To a degree I think that wokeness will actually be back in some way, maybe not in the form that you'd find in the HR department though. It would likely be more Artist, Programmer and other white collar job driven in response to the threat against AI, the backstabbing of Blue collar workers against them when they found that a lot of them wanted them to be replaced and the subsequent backlash against AI.
Zoomer men being firmly attached to anti-woke while being lower autism score than millennials, physically weak and political neutered outside of bitching about pet-peeves will make wokeness seem to be more appealing, even if being an annoying scold about it will still be a rather tough sell. Just like how being a protestant christfag doesn't have the sauce in mainstream culture even if it is still the majority of the right in the USA at the very least.
>Leftybritpol fags come into the thread to defend woke
lmao. Literally the shittiest thread and community on this site.
Eitherway Woke will come back in some other form, but yes, for now it's largely on the out, the western left though loves never learning from any mistakes and has fully internalized hyper-individualism and self-branding, so it may be 10 years or 20 years, but insane insufferable woke shit will be back,
>>2795353>LeftybritpolArent you that terf that got bullied out of leftypol for being cringe, you seem obsessed
Bullied? Lmao, the fags in that thread lost every single debate and went crying to the mods who are /tttt/ retards like them. It wasn't just me who got kicked out of that thread, literally anybody who wanted to talk British politics who wasn't some /tttt/ or self hating extremist were by mods as well.
It's literally the shittiest thread on the site with a bunch of pathologically thin skinned antisocial woketards, and completely protected by mods who are on their side. (The biggest irony is they're psychotic misogynists as well. Not a surprise for agps tho)
Shock horror, they show up in this thread with completely obtuse bad faith takes as to why literal HR Corpo wokeism is actually good that always really boils down to a completely vulgar "People who are against woke are often right wing, people who are woke are often left wing, so woke is obviously good".
>>2793469>woke 2.0 is going to be anti pornbased
>anti-loliconbased
>anti-age gapbased
>Anti lolicon
Literally not even been on the radar for a decade now. Lolishit ruining anime was 2005-2015, then Isekai took over.
I'm totally for the scourge of lolishit being purged though. The rare good anime that gets put out, often is ruined by the pedoshit in it.
>Anti age gap
Already in full swing as is the result of this wave of self-victimization/infantlization of woke + Zoomers inability to get their head of Junior high.
This is a pretty disturbing trend honestly for the opposite reason, it's the inability of Zoomers to see themselves as adults capable of making their own decisions and being responsible for their own behaviours.
>Anti porn
Nope, even the mods and jannies on this site are Pro-"Sex work" types and swaths of young women do onlyfans as supplemental income and argue it's not exploitative because they make all the money. Neoliberalism self-commodification has already been completely internalized by Zoomers and swaths of millennials.
I'll believe "woke is dead" when people stop getting banned for going against the sacred cows of social liberalism.
>>2795412Look at any youtube instagram or twitter comment sections. people don't get banned for shit anymore
>>2795406>on the radarBut it has. Literally every single day on ani Twitter, reddit, youtube, someone is arguing about it.
>>2793580Less to do with it being "vibes" and more to do with the term being applicable in multiple contexts that are not necessarily compatible. Socialist space wrecking is not Anita Sarkeesian making videos about boobs in video games being bad is not Hollywood diversity casting is not… you get the idea. The Marxist critique however argues that all these different forms and contexts are driven by the same idpol
impulse, which is not the same as a unified ideology, anymore than Spanish fascism and Nazism being the same ideology, even though they are driven by the same
impulse (the historical function of smashing the working class as a political force).
>>2795353You are brown and a radfem, you are woke. A very fetid itteration of wokeness.
>>2795353>>2795401Instead of seething why don't you engage in good faith with my position that wokeness is basically a
dispositional phenomenon and that your distaste for woke-types, transgender people, and the average /leftybritpol/ poster is, at its material base, a conflict of personalities. I'm happy to say it is, at its root, why I don't care for you!
You ignored my novel point to focus on repeating things you've said before. Being a high-openness novelty-seeking type, I find that far more
triggering than any anti-woke view you could hold, and far far more triggering than the fact you've misrepresented my conclusion.
You could deploy my basic theory to your own ends - go for horseshoe theory and argue that you've got a balanced personality, while both woke-types and rightoids have personality disorders. Argue that the tendency towards higher conscientiousness means that rightoids are more dispositionally suited to the rigors of socialist organizing than libertine woke-types, fudge the numbers on neuroticism to lump in generally-rightoid lumpen with the woke group so we can argue back and forth about the merits of the theory itself, god there's so many things you could do!
But I won't hold my breath. My own theory suggests that you'll just use this as a jumping off point to repeat more things you've already said before, in much the same way as you've already said them before.>>2795486The case that it's a complete disaster for the left has not been made. The western left has been failing for decades and patching over the cracks by valorising losers and stealing valor from foreign socialists. At worst you could say it has continued this trend, at best you could say it's at-least started achieving nothing in new ways. (Be that the "moderately" woke Bernie/Corbyn fads which leftypol would love to situate in opposition to wokeness rather than in opposition to rightism, aligned with wokeness, or in the generally rising popularity of socialism and communism and plunging popularity of capitalism… again, overwhelmingly with people who'd slot into the open-minded, agreeable, neurotic archetype.)
>>2792073>Leftist accounts>Logo DeadalusBro lmao that guy is not a leftist whatsoever (unless you count weird socially conservative guys who think gay people are a psyop but want single payer healthcare as leftist)
and also a MASSIVE faggot
Either way nice post, good question, decent discussion.
>>2795499He is a leftist just a retarded one
>>2795563
very well put, anon
>>2795563
The masses don't really blame communism for their woes, certainly not in the west. Rightoids do, sure, but rightoids have always loved that or an adjacent phenomenon. I cannot, off the top of my head, think of any politicians who came to power primarily off the back of "wokeness" and to whom such a backlash could therefore be attributed. This leads me to suspect we're working with different definitions. You should name some names.
(A separate point would be to always consult detailed breakdowns in voter behaviour. The right have won a lot this decade, sure, but it's mostly been against zombie socdems and liberals who were doomed woke or no woke, with the left utterly irrelevant and interesting voter polarisation by age and gender. That's my starting position. In Britain, for example, the left lost mostly thanks to retirees rather than "workers" abandoning Labour.)
>>2795660There absolutely is a significant segment of boomers that are vehemently anti "woke" in Europe. Orban in Hungary, AfD in Germany, Putin in Russia, etc. owe significant support from these voters. The framing might be different ("they're putting kids on puberty blockers" vs "we must stop the degenerate LGBT from the West") but it is fundamentally the same reactionary fearmongering. Younger people on the other hand aren't as anti "woke" but they can be shockingly "socially conservative" in their own ways, many are altogether lumpenized/rentier class inclined and not interested in politics or otherwise into chauvinist idpol specifically focused on immigration/historical grievances (it actually mirrors Japan from what I know about young people in Japan?) and actually lack interest in American/British internet culture wars. The actual working class save for say France's yellow vests (France has the strongest labor laws in Europe IIRC) is dreadfully atomized and alienated from the going-ons of society.
And yes in Poland, former East Germany, Ukraine, etc. communism is blamed for stagnation and corruption but this predates the "woke" stuff.
I could see dems trying somesort of ᴉuᴉlossnW tier "racism gets in the way of national pride" version of what you describe at 2010s woke, especially considering the fact that they constantly double down on imperialism while being concerned by ethnic sectarianism on the homefront(which I wouldn't be surprised comes from knowledge of how they inflame those conflicts abroad to destabilize countries).
>>2795499to his credit he is a communist.
>>2795705do not read this as endorsement for anything he has ever xosted because its almost all retarded except for the occasional lucid cultural observation
>>2795688Considering how popular conspiracy theories are becoming on the hazbin hotel and left side, I don't think a key feature of 2010's wokeness (That our institutions need to be updated instead of destroyed) will be around, which is why I said that a form of wokeness will be around but not with a lot of it's presumed assumptions. Wokeness back in the obama years was based on the premise of humanity being inherently good while nowadays woke is extremely cynical and nihilistic. I'm not sure how exactly it will manifest but it won't be nearly as nationalistic and CONSIDERABLY more mean than it was back in the day. I can even see libtards fat shaming chuds.
>>2795729it's going to be anti-social yea.
>>2795733Honestly I kind of see the "online libtard left" becoming kind of like Kyle Kylenski and as such alpha/zoomer cusper demographic will probably lean more and more away from the right now that they have a generally charismatic male figure that quite frankly is more handsome than the vast majority of online chuds are and kyle has been getting pretty chubby as of late.
>>2795750Kyle's YouTube channel has been "suppressed" by the algorithm for a long time now, when I still watched him many years ago his subscriber count stayed static, so unless that has changed I don't see him blowing up, man is also just not good at the social media game at all which is a death sentence today.
>>2795757I don't think that really matters that much actually, a voice can echo through a lot of things. His overall vibe and aesthetic will transcend his algorithmic pull.
>>2795729almost like french revolution tier "fuck the vendee fuck the peasants fuck the church cult of reason now" liberalism making a comeback?
I don't like liberal idpol, but I am a disabled, working class trans person. I know that most of the issues in my life stem from my social class, but my family cut me off due to me being trans, and it's more difficult to get hired as a disabled trans person than it was in the 2010s.
There's a noticeable difference in the way people treat me. My ex boyfriend started to domestically abuse me. I ended up homeless again cause I had to leave him. Homelessness services refused to help me. I have no friends anymore, offline or online.
I don't know what the solution is, all I can say is that things are worse for me than they've ever been. Barely holding on this year.
>>2796388And why do Iran and China love "AI slop", o enlightened disciple of Saint Max?
>>2796386I don't know how you associate reddit mods with agreeable and open-minded
>Woke won’t come back
fuck that we need more black and brown trans ceos of color if you disagree youre a nazi chudcel
>>2796597we need black and brown trans ceos to slide their girlcocks in and out of your mouth
>>2796586Because they are just as susceptible to being spooked by anti-intellectualism as anyone. Just because they are in a different country doesn't mean they can't be just as gullible or stupid.
And I can tell you didn't watch the video.
>>2796667Fascism is when anti-intellectualism, AI is anti-intellectual, ergo AI is fascism. Truly profound analysis. Just connect something to fascism and you too can have a Breadtube career.
>>2795729We already have edgy and cynical woke people, just check snark subreddits, left-leaning parts of 4cuck and ResetEra. Or look up what East Euro libs are up to.
>>2792124>So you become a socialist or communistNot really, woke libs turned into Third Worldists and their platform boils down to "KILL WHITEY KKKOLONIZER OOGA BOOGA".
>>2798674These guys started as socialists not as woke lib. I don't like woke libs but we can't pretend all the intellectual ills of the left comes from them.
2015 Woke Libs became engineers at Raytheon or coders at Palantir and are now posting about how LGBT is EHC in Richard Hananias replies.
>>2798684The white ones yes, the "ethno nationalist but Poc so it's good" were always libs, for the simple reason they can't fit in with the other reactionaries
>>2798684I don't think you're right about the first part (most of them are un/underemployed losers, just like everyone else) but be honest: are the small subset you refer to wrong about the second part?
(Well: not so much that
LGBT people are EHC, more that anti-LGBT people are the opposite of EHC…)
>>2795414Youtube still censors the word "retard"
>>2798801Thats pretty funny because it's so easy to fall on actual nazi content.
>>2798829By actual Nazi you mean 1990s conservative?
>>2798860low human capital post.
>>2798860No, the comments in every social media blaming "🧃" for everything including Columbine, Christopher Columbus, Slavery in the US
It's wild some of these people look for jews under their bed before going asleep
>>2798986So you're telling me the censorship is so bad they need to use emojis to bypass it?
>>2798702stop resisting my bbç
In the opposite of this I think that anti-woke will be around for quite a while. There is certainly a sort of hyper repetitive content from the right that I simply call the "Chud hole" or ant-lion politics where a deluge of petty grudges such as ugly people in media, general "cringe" from the left and poor translations are constantly dredged up to keep people who buy into that shit in line. I think the increasingly petty nature of the online left might actually be a good way to counter this because simply "going for the nuts" of the online right by just going no u when it comes to calling them ugly retards might actually wake up some people who are kind of chud curious but aren't fully buying into it yet for whatever reason.
Zoomer men in particular are vain as fuck and juts noticing how ugly Asmongold, Heelvsbabyface is even if they point out Agent Kochinski or some online transsexuals is enough to keep them out of the hole I feel.
>Lately leftists online (such as
who cares. grass yourself.
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