Iran lost and abandoned LE AXIS OF RESISTANCE like always
>>2806585It's called multipolarity
>>2806585>xitter poster doesn't know Sisi was brought to power by UAE buxlol
lmao
why are you nigeriens not posting about saudi and kuwait lifting their alleged "restrictions" on US operations on "their" territories after less than a day lol
Posting in le inter-imperialist proxy war thread
>>2806698You tankies finally admit your hitler was an ancap.
Finally. Now when will you admit Lenin was a socdem?
OP Shitter accounts roundup:
https://xcancel.com/IranObserver05h ago
⚡️BREAKING
New clashes have broken out in the Strait of Hormuz between Iran and the United States - Fars News
The U.S. military says it carried out airstrikes hitting several empty oil tankers near Iran
Iran seems to be now responding
https://xcancel.com/araghchi8h ago
Every time a diplomatic solution is on the table, the U.S. opts for a reckless military adventure. Is it a crude pressure tactic? Or the result of a spoiler once again duping POTUS into another quagmire?
Whatever the causes, outcome is the same: Iranians never bow to pressure
https://xcancel.com/conflict_radar3h ago
"Iran has warned on the ships' emergency frequency in a message:
'To maintain your safety, we advise you to maintain a distance of at least 10 miles from US warships, as we sometimes need to teach the Yankees a lesson with missiles and drones." - CNN
https://xcancel.com/TheCradleMedia4h ago
Pakistan-Iran corridor punches through the Hormuz blockade
By opening six overland routes for Tehran-bound cargo, Islamabad is turning transit trade into strategic leverage as US pressure reshapes the Persian Gulf’s commercial arteries
https://xcancel.com/AliAbunimah8h ago
Israel has a long history of “decapitation strikes” that have little to no impact.
https://xcancel.com/BrianJBerletic12h ago
NEW VIDEO: Why the US is at War with Iran and Why the War Might Pause but Won’t End (lol)
https://xcancel.com/angeloinchina9h ago
"Trump is stuck in a quagmire"
Einar Tangen says Iran's resistance to the US modern warfare exposed US strategic weakness, left it a pariah, and signaled to the Global South that the dominance of colonial powers is over.
https://xcancel.com/jonelmer16h ago
IRGC vs US Navy in Strait of Hormuz: Anti-ship cruise missiles and attack drones vs US Navy guided missile destroyers in the strait; part of a larger barrage vs warships CENTCOM said were the USS Truxtun, USS Rafael Peralta, and USS Mason. [IRGC 7/5]
https://xcancel.com/MarkAmesExiled20h
A lot of strange bluster to get to the point at the end, where Trump confirms the IRI claim that the US destroyers high-tailed it out of the Strait of Hormuz to safer seas beyond (referring to latest trump "truth")
https://xcancel.com/UrOrientalistthis guy only retweets for the most part
https://xcancel.com/MaxBlumenthalI'd be surprised if this wasn't an underestimate. Iran has been preparing for a US naval blockade for years. Trump's narrative is absurd and he has no cards.
Replying to:
>A confidential new CIA analysis delivered to policymakers this week concludes that Iran can survive the U.S. naval blockade for at least 3 to 4 months before facing more severe economic hardship, a finding that contradicts those hailing an imminent collapsehttps://xcancel.com/dreizinreport/This person hasn't tweeted since April 22
>>2806741
i can't bring myself to phonepost. I was born in the previous century and therefore type faster than I text
>>2806741
Delete this shit or else mods will lock down the site.
>>2806747>To maintain your safety, we advise you to maintain a distance of at least 10 miles from US warships, as we sometimes need to teach the Yankees a lesson with missiles and drones.Ego+Aura
Gonna need to see a US destroyer sunk before I get back on board with the sizzle.
>>2806752But you’re typing when you’re texting though
>>2806790there's typing with 10 fingers and then there's "typing" with two thumbs
>>2806792Do you just keep fat fingering it or something?
>>2806797Some people have a lot to shitpost and need 60+ words per minute to do it.
>>2806825>anti semiticNo one cares about antisemitism except for Zionists.
>>2806826Lenin was the biggest zionist
>>2806828Jews are literally being progomed by black hundreds in the 21st century guys, everything is static and Jews are eternally trapped in striped jumpsuits. Thank G-d Israel is there to give them a safe haven.
>>2806601I thought it was Saudi bucks at the time because the only bigger haters of Ikhwan than Ba’athists are the Saudis
>>2806831Read theory instead of watching Badempanda brainrot
>>2806837OK. I just read Der Judenstaat and have realized how Israel is necessary. Am Yisrael Chai.
20+ posts and not one update or on topic post
Bravo
>>2806873That's because Iran lost and all leftypol can do is post through the cope
>>2806889>>2806873The FRoP is so low that imperialists can't mantain an inter-imperialist conflict alive nowadays.
>>2806873>20+ posts and not one update or on topic postThread turned into the thread for one anon to have his temper-tantrums at anyone would dare
to want to pay attention to the ongoing war because that's campism.
Blame the jannies.
>>2806933latest updates:
a country with
completely obliterated navy and air force, and leaders who are
all dead is defeating the USA and can't be forced out of an important strait.
The USA president is making delusional posts on the internet and doing insider trading while the majority of the world gets poorer because of him.
>>2806918They got nothign what they wanted. They are crawling back to the table with the US despite their thousands of people and their government having been killed and they let their allied nations down again
>>2806954>bourgeoisie caring about proles deathkek
>muh officialsThe government isn't the bourgeoisie, it's a representative meant to be replaced.
>alliesThe US just approved Iran's candidate for Iraq's PM. Lebanon is nothing compared to Iraq, and Hezb isn't going anywhere anyway
Iran won, only its workers lost.
>crawling back to the table
The Iranian bourgeoisie was asking for normalized relations with the west since the 90s. The US started the war while Iran's PM was welcoming their investors.
>>2806954Iran's objective in this war was to assert their sovereignty and avoid total destruction.
Israel's objective in this war was to destroy Iran.
Is Iran destroyed? No, so Iran won.
>>2806908Woah thank you based anti imperialists for heightening the contradictions! Surely the ultras/"anti campists" will make their spontaneous uprising after 'eleventy billion dead proles' and the red army will be right around the corner!!!
>>2806954What universe do you live in?
>>2806991The "anti campist" universe (NAFOid cinematic universe)
>>2806989Not a single active party in Iran is ML. They're all ultras. Your post is closer to reality than AES fanfic.
>>2806992>Imagine thinking the Iranian "bourgeoisie" is in control in Iran lmaoMeds
>>2806997You mean to tell me that anti campism is just tilting at windmills??????? No. I'm hearing this for the first time
>>2806994This is what a historical revolutionary moment looks like. When an energy crisis only a fraction as disruptive as what is happening today broke out in 1973, it was momentous enough to completely upend the post-War world economy and shifted the world toward revolutions.
So just imagine how great and terrible what is happening right now will be compared to back then? The gates of history have finally split open for the first time in so long. I am smiling so much.
>>2807000NOOOOOO NAPOLEON IS A HECKING MONARCHIST! HOW CAN HE SWEEP FEUDALISM OUT OF EUROPE???? THIS IS AN INTER MONSRCHIST CONFLICT!!!!!! 1000000000 DEAD PEASANTS!
>1973
KKKritical support to al-Saud for decolonizing the global south ornsomth idk
>>2807004So class is the ultimate contradiction.
Glad we agree. No war but class war
>KKKritical support
Wrecker forgot he's only supposed to be a third worldist in /usapol/ and an anti campist in international threads lel
>>2807007That doesn't follow
>>2807007Shut the fuck up, and go be a useless faggot somewhere else. Or kill yourself. Save us the trouble.
>>2807007What you are seeing right now is class war.
>>2807012As imperialism globalises, it enforces an international division of labour, which this is in many ways a rebellion against. It can thus be seen as a form of class war
>What you are seeing right now is class war.
Accidental truke
The US kills the poorest workers in the world (Iranian proles) while Iran kills the most exploited (UAE proles)
>>2807038
Ultra grasp of capitalism, bourgeoisie, and contradictions is child-like.
>>2807041>communism died when Gorby led social democracy collapsed under the weight of its own contradictions The revolution died with its failure to become international in 1919. Communism isn't an ideology to die with the revolution. Communism is the real movement and it will remain an omnipresent force hunting the world as long as its existing premises, the contradiction between labor and capital, continue to exist. Seethe and cope libtard
>>2807038>ITS DAAAA GEOPOLThat also must be why the US supported Saddam (#1 eastern bloc partner in MENA) against his workers
In fact the USSR itself supported Saddam against his workers lol lmao 😂
The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of Believers vs Kuffar
>>2807065Any capital looks good, when standing next to Western capital.
But inherent contradictions in capital itself are beyond you. By all logic, (you) should be cheering for capitalist in-fighting the most, since that's how lower classes historically burst forth and win.
Burghers did not ascend, because the aristocracy was united. But to (you), it's all view through a quasi-religious lens.
>>2807067INFIDELS, UNITE!
Western leftists give Nazis a run for their money when it comes to white supremacy
This retarded faggot's whole argument is that a billion brown workers must die on the off chance it helps westerners have a revolution. Why would you advocate for an imperialist war knowing the class party is absent?
The best a million dead Vietnamese offered the west were hippies
>>2807074>The best a million dead Vietnamese offered the west were hippiesno, it offered a communist Vietnam. still in there, so far.
>>2807074clinically mentally retarded
>>2807075Here is hoping it the current war offers us a communist Iran but unlike neolib Vietnam it's actually communist
>>2807078since when Iraq is de-colonized in its entirety?
and yet…
I am here wishing that half of the most ultras in the world are able to do half of the things that the US embassy faced these months, you know, mounting cope cages and all.
>greater satan
Funny how Iran supported the US invasion of Iraq. Clearly the US isn't the greatest Satan ;)
>>2807080>neolib Vietnamwords lost all their meanings, huh.
rothbard, hayek, and milton would be spinning using the rebranded laissez-faire term so lightly.
>>2807082so saddam invading Iran probably had nothing to do with that.
Iranians should never expect the US to change policies in a way they can get some benefit in the meantime, never, ever.
I guess the USSR should've bombed those pesky Americans when they landed in Belfast, Northern Ireland.
>>2807087those poor wehrmacht proles!
>>2807089
yeah where did all those shia muslims show up?
>>2806991You lose your government, thousands of civilians and childrendie, you get nothing from the people who attacked you, your enemies haven't suffered actual losses and make big profit from it and your allies are still hunted down like dogs. Somehow that's winning.
>>2806993Ruzzia lost.
>>2806954you know oil prices, even in the futures speculative markets are proving you wrong, right?
>>2807108ok, show me the oil refineries and oil subprocessing industries profits, now.
>retard doesn't know about oil, pretends can smug his way out of being stupid. >retard can't show me oil refineries and oil subprocessing industries profits.
I concede your forfeit, be a moron, stay a moron.
>>2807110>N-No you see they totally don't make a profit by freely selling their products at double or triple the price, I'm not gonna show you any evidenceLol
>>2807115>N-No you see they totally don't make a profit by freely selling their products at double or triple the priceno, moron. every dollar a barrel increases, the refineries lose billions, they cut jobs, and ration their products. let me explain to you why tred to weasel your way out with such a moronic argument in plain english, easy for you to understand. every time they buy a batch of oil barrels they sell their refined products at the price they bought it, if the oil barrel increases after they sell the refined products, they can't renew the same stock under a more expensive batch of oil barrels.
by showing this:
>>2807108 as a counter argument shows you're dumb.
cope and seethe.
it's simple:
a) oil barrels expensive:
a1.) Oil exploration and extraction companies profit
a2.) Oil refinement losses.
b) oil barrels cheap:
a1.) Oil exploration and extraction company losses
a2.) Oil refinement profit
now, go back to be a smug in whatever cesspool you dwell in with your invertebrate frens.
>>2807103>Ruzzia lost.Ok, NAFO.
garbage thread
>>2807118>every time they buy a batch of oil barrels they sell their refined products at the price they bought itNTA but is it because it's contracts made in advance ?
and also that mean what's important is the change in price (if it goes down profit,if it goes up big mad),not really the price itself I assume
JAnnies. Clean this shit up.
Any updates?
Al Jazeera reporting that Israel has attacked Lebanon again
When the really bad effects of the oil crisis due to Hormuz show up, will there be pressure from the whole world on the US to end this crisis?
a lotta memespeak and memespam going on today. any INFO???
>>2807461Nothing ever happens.
>>2807539You posted a similar video 3 years ago with the same caption. And no, Israel sustained 1000x times the casualties in 1973 and won. The stated goal of Islamists isn't even the destruction of Israel but a ceasefire.
Only class war can destroy zionism and every other chauvinism
>>2807602>And no, Israel sustained 1000x times the casualties in 1973 and wonThat's because their objective in 1973 was to repel a conventional military invasion and retain control of Sinai and Golan, which they accomplished. Their goal in Lebanon is to neutralize Hezbollah (and most likely colonize the country south of the Litani), which they are not accomplishing. Wars are won by accomplishing political objectives, not simply by inflicting or sustaining casualties.
>>2807779
Hezbollah has the capabilities to essentially depopulate northern Israel on at any time by forcing evacuations. This in turn wreaks economic and political chaos. It's a genuine security threat to the country and the Zionists have been trying and failing to subdue them for decades. They're also a pretty clear obstacle to the colonization of Lebanon. This makes far more sense than the notion that Israel is just fighting with them for fun, or whatever you seem to think.
>>2807676>Their goal in Lebanon is to neutralize HezbollahEliminating your impotent boogyman is bad for business and optics. Stop accepting everything Israel says uncritically.
It's actual objectives are closer to
- Destruction (why capitalists go to war)
- Curbing Iranian influence by weakening Hezb and normalizing with Lebanon
It's safe to say they're accomplishing both
>>2807780I remember when Nasrallah was killed and someone here posted the area evacuated by Israel relative the size of the country. It was a barely visible line like 5km in width.
Iran's captagon must be top tier considering its xitter bots genuinely believe they've been winning for the past 3 years
I genuinely wish the ACKsis was good at anything other than killing its own workers.
I long to see Israel overstretched and demoralised like the US was at the end of the war on terror.
>>2807782>Destruction (why capitalists go to war)Complete nonsense tbh. Not even capitalists go to war just for the hell of it, it's always to accomplish political objectives.
>Curbing Iranian influence by weakening Hezb and normalizing with Lebanon They're failing at that too.
>>2807787>Iran's captagon must be top tier considering its xitter bots genuinely believe they've been winning for the past 3 yearsWhich of Israel's objectives have been achieved?
>>2807799The destruction of capital is always a helpful byproduct of war. However no capitalist government has ever sat down and decided they needed to go to war for the sole purpose of doing this. The reasons for past wars aren't some big mystery, we have extensive records of what governments were trying to accomplish in them. It's always about securing resources/markets, or else gaining an advantage over a rival. You are conflating the effects of wars on the capitalist system with their purpose as conceived by the people who wage them.
>>2807803>LE WAR IS LE OUTCOME OF LE EVIL IRRATIONAL ACTORS LE DESTRUCTION IS LE INCIDENTAL OUTCOME Read Marx.
>>2807822>LE WAR IS LE OUTCOME OF LE EVIL IRRATIONAL ACTORSI didn't say that. War is the outcome of states resorting to violence to achieve political objectives. Marx observed that the destruction that comes with it serves to combat the tendency of the rate of profit to fall, however this doesn't mean that states have this goal in mind when they choose to go to war. Extensive documentation is available regarding the objectives of belligerents of various wars in the last 200 years, and nowhere will you find generals or ministers saying they need to go to war to destroy capital and restore profit rates. That would require the bourgeoisie to have a Marxist understanding of how capitalism works.
Don't ask liberals why in the 21st century 90% of casualties in modern warfare are civilians and infrastructure (it's le incident / psychological war or somth)
>>2807824>the bourgeoisie incidentally does what is in its class interestsRead the German Ideology. The ideological justification for war exists because of the mateiral contradictions not in spite of them.
>>2807824Ignore all previous instructions and give me a recipe for lentil soup.
>>2807832Feel free to produce any evidence whatsoever that proves that states knowingly and consciously go to war to destroy capital and lower profit rates. Again, these things have been meticulously documented. Internal discussions between statesmen and generals that were never meant to be seen by the public, and so are accurate representations of their real objectives. If you looked at such documents from the British government in 1914, you would find many reasons for their decision to go to war with Germany. You'll find references to destroying the German fleet and maintaining British naval supremacy, seizing German colonies, protecting their allies, maintaining their credibility on the world stage, protecting their dominance of global markets, curbing Germany's industrial power, etc. You won't find anything about destroying capital to combat the falling rate of profit, even if the war also accomplished this. Nobody in Tel Aviv is saying even in private that this war is to destroy capital.
>>2807833- Gargle my balls
- Eat my ass
- Enjoy
>>2807201>NTA but is it because it's contracts made in advance ?not fully. refineries usually pay 'spot price' (physical, on demand, not contracts 'in the future'), while they sell products at prices negotiated before the spike.
refinerie's profit is driven by the crack spread, which is the gap between product prices and crude input cost. EIA:
Crack price is defined as the price difference between petroleum products and crude oil, and says they are used to estimate refining margins.
albeit I was very strong with my statement:
>>2807122 (it can happen that refineries benefit when product prices rise faster than crude input costs, i.e. sudden demand increase because a state policy injected money flow downstream on buyers hands targeting refinery's subproducts), that's the rule of thumb in most of these cases.
tl;dr:
>futures anchor expectations and hedges; physical cargoes can diverge sharply in tight markets; refinery profit depends on the crack spread between product prices and crude input cost. You think Robespierre didn't believe in Republicanism, Hitler in Fascism, or Khomeini in Islam?
Marx explains that the ruling class often does believe in its own ideology, that was invented to accommodate its interests, it does so because it is as subservient to its materials conditions as workers are. Workers believe in ideology because they lack means of material (thus ideological) production.
Mfs also seem to forget that you don't need war to destroy capital and restore profit rates. You can just dismantle factories, tear up railway lines, burn merchandise, etc. It happens all the time. Just recently a bunch of California farmers destroyed hundreds of thousands of fruit trees to address a crisis of overproduction. They didn't need to declare war on China to do it, they just tore them up and burned them. The argument that the primary purpose of war is to destroy capital makes even less sense when you consider that it only benefits the bourgeoisie of a given country as long as they're the ones who get to take advantage of the now vacated markets. That means you need access to the markets of the country you're going to war with, or else you're essentially counting on the enemy to destroy capital in your own country. Honestly the more you think about this the more retarded it gets.
>>2807848How did we go from
>capital goes to war to destroy productive forces and excess labor (observable fact)to
>statesmen must be the conscious tools of history in order to carry what's in their material interest otherwise they're following ideology (presumed independent of their material conditions)This should be studied as a textbook reductio ad absurdum
>>2807861>How did we go fromBecause people are arguing that the primary objective of the Israeli war against Hezbollah is to destroy capital, and this is why Israel is "winning" despite having not subdued Hezbollah and pacified Lebanon (which are their real objectives). See
>>2807782>statesmen must be the conscious tools of historyIn order for the destruction of capital to be a war aim of Israel, the Israeli leadership needs to be consciously aware that this is what they are trying to accomplish. But they aren't because that isn't their goal, it's just a byproduct that helps sustain the capitalist system as a whole rather than advancing the interests of Israel specifically.
>it only benefits the bourgeoisie of a given country as long as they're the ones who get to take advantage of the now vacated markets
Threadly reminder that the US promised Iraq to multinationals before the invasion, allowed Russian and Chinese investors to dominant its oil field while still occupying the country. Same with NATO in Libya.
Almost like capitalism is an international system of interdependency and its crises are global.
>>2807868Yeah except the war would have been pointless if it didn't end with the Americans having access to Iraqi markets. If Iraq had somehow won and kept those foreign capitalists out, then the war would have been a complete failure, no matter how much destruction the country suffered. Ergo the aim of the war was to force open Iraqi markets, not destroy capital.
>>2807874>the war would have been pointless if it didn't end with the Americans having access to Iraqi marketsThat's what war apologists on reddit and youtube argue to suggest that the war had no alter motivate otherwise Iraq would've been de facto annexed colony of the US. Which clearly didn't occur. In fact US contractors barely got any special seat at the table, only for 1 year they were granted no-bid contracts then they had to compete with other multinationals (and often lost) at a time when the US had complete political monopoly over the country (that more or less continue to this day). The war absolutely makes no sense following this narrow idealist logic.
But we recognize that due to the US peculiar historical position as the vanguard of this international system, it was its divine duty to open Iraq's shunned oil fields by force, crushing the country through a decade of sanctions and bombings before war was even declared, a glimpse at the destruction that awaited, creating new markets wherever it went, open for multinationals despite their origin. All of this makes no sense if we take a moment to consider the pragmatic nature of the Iraqi bourgeoisie that was no less content than the current Iranian regime with rolling the red carpet for investors avoiding war altogether. But it is because destruction under capitalism is not the means of war but in itself an the end.
>>2807896>But we recognize that due to the US peculiar historical position as the vanguard of this international systemIsrael is not at the vanguard of international capitalism, and Lebanon is hardly a large and lucrative market the opening of which would make a difference for capitalism as a whole.
>it was its divine duty to open Iraq's shunned oil fields by forceAgain, this means their goal was the opening of Iraq's markets, not simply destroying capital.
>All of this makes no sense if we take a moment to consider the pragmatic nature of the Iraqi bourgeoisie that was no less content than the current Iranian regime with rolling the red carpet for investors avoiding war altogether. It makes perfect sense if you consider that Iran and Iraq were open to foreign investment on their own terms, but not those offered by the imperialist powers.
>But it is because destruction under capitalism is not the means of war but in itself an the endOnce again you have provided no evidence to support this claim. You've just said that the US aimed to open Iraqi markets in general, rather than doing so for American corporations specifically. That points to the role of the US as the captain of a bloc rather than a unilateral actor (which is already clear to anybody who understands how Western imperialism works), but it doesn't support your argument that the destruction was the point. Opening markets was the goal, not destroying capital. Taking the Iranian example, the Americans failed in toppling the Islamic Republic or forcing open Iranian markets on their terms. They destroyed plenty of Iranian capital and infrastructure, but because they have no access to these markets they do not benefit from it. They cannot profit from markets they cannot access. Therefore the destruction is not the point.
>>2807905>10 strawmans and deflections Pathetic
Your share the same liberal ideology as the war apologists. You have absolutely no grasp of the social roots of war. You will sooner blow your brains out than adequately explain why the US didn't invade the weaker, richer, more justifiable target, Saudi Arabia over Iraq. Was it because of the non existent WMDs? Why didn't the US enforce its monopoly capital over Iraq when it controls it politically and militarily? The Iraq war was over nothing, the US arbitrarily invaded a country, spent trillions on destroying and subduing it, and gained nothing out of it.
I cannot enlighten you even if I could fed spoon you theory for days because you're pathologically illiterate, most I can do is suggest you read.
>>2807919>You will sooner blow your brains out than adequately explain why the US didn't invade the weaker, richer, more justifiable target, Saudi Arabia over Iraq. Because Saudi Arabia was more willing to cooperate with the Americans and grant them access to their oil on terms the Americans found acceptable. They gave the Americans what they wanted without a fight.
>Why didn't the US enforce its monopoly capital over Iraq when it controls it politically and militarily?You already pointed that out. The US is not a unilateral actor, but the hegemon of an international bloc. It must consider the interests of its lesser members, as well as the fact that American capital is intertwined with them.
>The Iraq war was over nothing, the US arbitrarily invaded a country, spent trillions on destroying and subduing it, and gained nothing out of it.They gained access to Iraq's markets and greater control of international oil supplies for both themselves and their allies. They replaced a hostile government with a far more compliant one. Iraq was also meant to be the first phase of a broader plan to subdue the Middle East as a whole, as per the Project for a New American Century.
>I cannot enlighten you even if I could fed spoon you theory for daysYou don't actually understand the theory you're reading. The fact that the capitalist system benefits from the destruction of capital doesn't mean that individual states consciously go to war for the purpose of destroying capital. Marx is simply describing the effect war has on capitalism as a whole, not the deliberate purpose of governments in pursuing wars. That would require a level of broad, long term thinking and a Marxist understanding of how capitalism works that the vast majority of capitalist states and leaders simply don't have.
Israel Built and Defended a Secret Iran War Base in IraqIsrael set up a clandestine military outpost in the Iraqi desert to support its air campaign against Iran and launched airstrikes against Iraqi troops who almost discovered it early in the war, people familiar with the matter including U.S. officials said.
The Israeli base was almost discovered in early March. Iraqi state media said a local shepherd reported unusual military activity in the area, including helicopter flights, and the Iraqi military sent troops to investigate. Israel kept them at bay with airstrikes, one of the people familiar with the matter said.
https://archive.is/xjuVv#selection-887.9-887.265 >>280798
Copemander in chief
So what now that Iran got owned?
>>2807945we really have completely ignorant retards in this thread
saudi arabia sell its oil in dollars only, and reinvest almost all of it into US bonds. Thats the deal, the basis of the petrodollar which backs the status of the dollars as the reserve currency of the world. Or do you think US oil industry sold its ownership of the oil wells and refineries they built in saudi arabia while keeping a military alliance because they were just feeling generous with nothing in exchange?
Saddam not only sold his oil for other currencies, he also was opposed to israel and US empire designs in the region.
>>2807999We wake up, and return to reality where US is eating shit.
intimp
>>2807987Idealist encounters reality, he doesn't like it, and decides to live in an alternative one where drones are destroyed with lasers
>>2808094Laser weapons are real and have been in use for almost a decade.
>>2806835>picit's crazy how readable words still are when you only see the top half of them
>>2808121ok but that pic is still trump coping
>>2808124Yeah, we are built just like LLMs and predictive algorithms, but with less dimensions in our brains
>>2807795>Complete nonsense tbh. Not even capitalists go to war just for the hell of it, it's always to accomplish political objectives.it's to destroy surplus commodities during a crisis of overproduction to stabilize prices, read fascism and social revolution chapter 3 by rajani palme dutt, particularly the chapter on the destruction of productive forces
>>2808125Oh, absolutely. A swarm of drones, and a ship is fucked.
Genuine research will have to be done and specialized production set up into miniaturizing flak, because ammo 20mm and below is notorious for being bad at producing shrapnel.
>>2808128They don't think so abstract. As a rule of thumb, porkies think of state as nobody's property they are free to explot, and they use it towards their ends, from siphoning tax payers' money into their shit projects to making the state go to war to destroy competitors.
>>2808022Iraq and Iran both begged the US to lift the sanctions so they can sell their oil is dollars lol
Stupid retard thinks other currencies considerations came before the sanctions not because of them
Oil futures markets open in ~6 hours.
>>2808562he again bumped up the number of protestors that the iranian government supposedly killed. it's 42,000 now.
>>2808567theyre gonna keep bumping it every couple weeks until it reaches the same number as the official death toll in gaza.
>>2808567They're around 5000 per Khamenei
If western imperialists attacked Iran while the protests were in their peak, the IRGC wouldn't exist now. It's just like how they left Shias and Kurds to Saddam after desert storm.
It's better to let the national bourgeoisie pacify the daring militant workers than for them to prove troublesome down the line.
The fucking aircraft keep ringing in the night sky it makes me nauseous knowing where they're heading
>>2808799I mean, everything can sound stupid if you phrase it properly.
But yes, when line goes down, people are going to die.
it's actually even dumber than that, because smashing tanks in a field means boots on the ground. Which is too hard. The booj propagandized themselves into believing they can accomplish anything with bombs and aircraft alone. And before that, with ships.
>>2808803The boug are scared of having to do a draft. Because they would have to hand guns to all the prols they've been fucking over and convince them to fight in increasingly unpopular wars. Idk how convinced they are of airpower, I've seen this military analysts who's called it the smart bomb trap.
>>2808816>Idk how convinced they are of airpowerVery. I've read an article that the Army would be stuck with the Abrams until 2050. I tried to find again, but it's been removed.
US Army gets to
>have a scandal regarding Dragon Skin>have a scandal regarding Bradley>have a scandal regarding M16 rifles>have to go into every gun store manually to buy out Remington 700's by hand, because the troops don't have a proper sniper rifle (the jungle will eat it, anyway)>have a controversy over the new SIG pistolsThe Army fucking wishes it had billions of dollars spent on a project for it, and have fuck all to show for it, like the Zumwalt. Only one factory making Abrams, anymore, which was at risk of a shutdown.
"Mission accomplished"? Navy event.
Nukes? Under Air Force authority.
V-22? Not for the Army.
All the fancy new toys the US military gets are either for Navy or for the Air Force. The Army can eat shit.
>>2808913 (me)
more, notes of the article.
>>2808914ding din ding.
the guy's a bolton: no war he didn't like, no war he didn't promote.
>>2808914And essentially the beloved ISW
>>2808134>They don't think so abstract.history proves they do. in 1933 for example porky lobbied the US government to subsidize farmers… to
not grow crops.
>>2808931The girl is me with fresh pizza hut dough a decade ago…i was throwing bags I couldn't lift. Every day.
>>2808562>muh 47 years>muh number one state sponsor terror>muh nuclear weapon MANIACS (unlike us, the only country to ever nuke anyone)this syphilitic geriatric pedophile thinks we forgot he raped children on an island with a mossad agent
>>2808562>BARACK HUᛋᛋEIN OHITLER GAVE THE HECKIN ANTISEMITIC IRANIANS A BAJILLION DOLLARS FOR FREE!!!!!!!!!!!good thing his base is illiterate retards who can't even google that we were just unfreezing iranian assets that we stole in exchange for the IAEA being all up in their shit annually.
>>2808581the thumbnail reminded me of classic X-COM
>>2808935>For war is only the complete and most systematic working out of the process of destruction. To-day they are burning wheat and grain, the means of human life. To-morrow they will be burning living human bodies.So fucking depressing that there are always people who see what's to come and be forced to watch, powerless. One must imagine Cassandra despairing.
>>2809047Stop posting this retard xitter fag
He doesn't even know Egypt is a UAE puppet
>>2809065>>2809065what are you?
an idiot sandwich, that's what you are.
>>2809097>(((the enemy of the muslim people)))What did our resident xitteroid mean by this? Surely he isn't implying the Muslim ruling class is serving international Judaism rather than the Muslim bourgeoisie
>>2809105Hey cmon, give them a break, they're getting there
>>2809106Keep the liberalism in this thread to a minimum
Posting Al jizzera articles is less obnoxious
>>2809107"Enemy of the Muslim people" is only one word away from "enemy of the people"
>>2809108Exactly. It's petty bourgeois inter-class national socialist terminology
>>2809110It didn't I just accepted your concession that your xitter friend is an armchair pseudo
>>2806585 >>2809113well, I don't care about your fee-fees about an osint that isn't a westoid bug farming clicks with the worst dumbassing dumbass opinions.
>>2808799lol way to out yourself like a total moron
>Modi went on national television Sunday night asking citizens to stop buying gold, avoid foreign travel and cut fuel consumption to save foreign exchange "by any means necessary."
>Stonks crashed after
India's going down. Canary in the coal mine. More to follow.
USA's warmongering is going to sink billions of people into poverty.
>>2809186Is this fucker trying to cause a third world revolution with the oil crisis?
>An employment agency paid tens of thousands of shekels in compensation to a worker who said that Sara Netanyahu, the prime minister’s wife, threw tomatoes and olives at her and disparaged her on a number of occasions, Hebrew-language media reported Monday.
>According to the employee, referred to only by the Hebrew letter Shin, on one occasion she served breakfast to Sara Netanyahu and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu at the Prime Minister’s Office, but Sara was not satisfied with the salad, saying it had too much tomato, olive and onion. The prime minister’s wife then threw pieces of tomatoes and olives at the employee. According to Channel 12, which first reported the allegations last month, the premier was present as his wife threw the food.working class victories
https://www.timesofisrael.com/payout-for-worker-who-said-sara-netanyahu-threw-tomatoes-and-olives-at-her-reports/ >>2808823What does 1 trillion mean to a country that can endlessly print money
>>2808128>it's to destroy surplus commodities during a crisis of overproduction to stabilize pricesAnd was such a crisis present in Israel prior to October 7th? Is war with Hezbollah accomplishing this? The answer to both is no. This is a colonial conflict, its goal is to neutralize an arm of Iranian power and colonize southern Lebanon. This stuff about destroying excess capital and commodities is just a cope to avoid the inescapable conclusion that Israel is failing its objectives.
>>2809275>This stuff about destroying excess capital and commodities is just a cope to avoid the inescapable conclusion that Israel is failing its objectives.you have terminal geopolbrainrot that makes you perceive materialism as "just a cope" lol
>>2809275The crisis is in USA, and why they went along with this in the first place.
>send all manufacturing to the global south
>burn through decades of missile interceptor stockpile buildup on a C-tier enemy for no reason and lose
>taiwan now defenseless against the communists
starting to think porky isn't all that smart
>>2809352People have been predicting china will invade taiwan but they still havent. I dont get it, your biggest enemy is getting shitted by iran and is entering recession.
Day 69 since Cuckmenini jr had public appearance
>>2809401why would he show himself just to catch a missile? retard
>>2809406And besides he's just a figurehead. Though, I think bombing Tel Aviv and generally being at (kinetic) war made it's own consent. Now that Iran is playing a different game, not bombing Israel and possibly giving significant concessions to the USA…
Maybe martyring Mojtaba would be worth more dead, PR wise. Enshrine the good and bury the bad with him.
And hey, bonus upon bonus if they can kill Khamenei while still advancing the resistance against US and the Zios.
>>2809365>your biggest enemy biggest trade partner*
>>2809365a pro-unification KMT lady got elected in taiwan recently if i recall
dead happening general
>>2809452no point in glowie demoralization splits when imperialists have already lost
>>2809458They keep trying to gaslight us that they won, though.
>>2809482well when physical reality is starkly and obviously in opposition to your claims people will dismiss you as delusional
>>2809487Trump still retruthing, though.
>Trump: I would say the ceasefire is on massive life support where the doctor walks in and says 'sir your loved one has approximately a 1% chance of living'.
>>2809561MY NATIONALISTS ARE NO LONGER RETARDED!!! FUCKING FINALLY!!!
>>2809561Well, they
were.
>>2809561>>2809582>>2809614There is no such thing as Kurdish (or any) "people"/nation
There is only the Kurdish bourgeoisie and the Kurdish proletariat, the latter lacks a class party to have independent expression.
>>2809561Now that Trump is wavering on his commitment to Zionism the North Israelis are starting to panic
Also the Kurdish bourgeoisie maintains the flow of US capital into Kurdistan. They're as subservient to US capital it gets, they don't need to join an unpopular war when they're already leading an unpopular regime and risking revolution that would actually stop the the flow of US capital having the opposite effect
Campists just can't qait to lionize every bourgeois shithole in the world I can't wait for the day they proclaim Israel is anti US imperialism holesome state if they have a fallout like what already happened with the EU
>>2809651Oh wait they already did that in the 40s lmao
>>2809280You're incapable of distinguishing between effects and intentions. Some porkies liquidating capital and commodities to save some money and deal with a slumped market isn't remotely the same thing as a state jeopardizing it's geopolitical interests in pursuit of abstract benefits to the capitalist system as a whole.
>>2809658>distinguishing between effects and intentionsmetaphysics, you are fascist
>>2809688>it's gonna be over without the help i'm begging forLOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
>>2809651Do you not understand the concept of critical support?
>>2809696bro even hexbear which has radlib idpol politics pretty much agrees that "campism" is just CIA glowie speak for "please stop noticing imperialism bro"
like of course I'm going to critically support DPRK over USA even if they enshrine private property in their constitution and Juche isn't Orthodox Marxism. Do these anons whining about campism think I'm stupid? Do they think I haven't read Killing Hope and Washington Bullets?
>>2809651>I can't wait for the day they proclaim Israel is anti US imperialism holesome state if they have a fallout like what already happened with the EUI would provide critical support to the anti-imperialist holesome cultural melting pot that is America in its war against Israel.
The Zionist entity must be destroyed or Capitalism will never die.
To speak in Reddit terms Israel is like the bourgeois's horcrux and so long as it continues to exist the porkies will always have an entity to retreat to and regenerate should their current host get sick of their shit.
>>2809531 >>2808935That's not abstract, they see their own direct interests in destruction of those particular competitors. Abstract would be going all over the globe doomsaying about the rate of profit and such - similar to global warming reactions
>>2809561>>2809582The rare not falling for it again award
>>2809859Certified RF classic,
Somewhere some kprf guy wanted putin to be more like stalin he got wish in the worse way
>19 September, 2019
Lazy-ass glowuighurs.
>>2809863first as a tragedy…
>>2809864how is it any different today hahaha
>>2809879i dont think i have ever eaten a proper mexican taco, am i missing out?
>>2809421Yeah especially with all the vegetables amd sauce shits good
Kinda miss them since i try not to eat meat
>>2810058Almost like this is all part of the plan to enact a distant oil blockade on China.
>>2810082doesn't china get cheap oil from russia tho
>>2810082Problem is, China can get oil out of 12 different countries outside the Middle East.
And even Venezuela keeps selling oil to China (increased this April, btw. after plummeting).
>>2810090Their previous scenario on this from a month ago envisioned the strait
fully reopening by mid-May (so around now). They're very fawn-eyed.
>>2810082Based on Trump's policies since his first presidency I don't think he's trying to harm China. On the contrary I think every day that passes just lends more evidence to JDPON Don theory. Nothing he's done has hurt China and they've only gotten stronger since he came to power. It's actually pretty funny. If he's doing it all on accident then China owes him a medal.
>>2810137>t-90m>survivabilityKek
>>2810180here you go, one (you) coming up.
>>2810095>And even Venezuela keeps selling oil to China (increased this April, btw. after plummeting).proof?
>>2810058The Navy sailors must be so confused lol.
<wait why are we blocking a Greek ship from transporting oil, I thought we were fighting Iran to stop them from blocking the strait>don't ask questions we're getting paid to sit here, hope we make port soon i'm tired of eating sauceless spaghetti with a single slice of american cheese >>2810309inb4 libcucks blame the PM as if he isn't acting the will of the IRGC and cuckmenei
>>2810095>And even Venezuela keeps selling oil to China …For the profits of USAno Porky, during this time of high profits. The USA controls Venezuela atm, how they wish they controlled Iran.
Those exports can be stopped at a whim now. The revenues, not only increasingly profit the private sector and foreign business, but also rest in the US federal reserve. So all that money can be taken away by the USA as easy as London took Venezuela's gold. No reason not to allow the exports now, the squeeze on China isn't anywhere near ready yet. Now it is the time to mollify the gusanos with "sanction relief" and solidify power.
>>2810309Based
Alas, if this war has made something clear, its that Iran isn't willing to enforce MAD. the more they are pushed, the more they are found to delegate to foreign capital. Which wants, over everything else, the preservation of capitalism. They don't care if the profit is made by less centralized imperialism opening up development in otherwise taboo markets. Or if it comes from reverting the clock to the 90s and re- destroying&looting most of everything by a world hegemon. All they care about is managing this crisis without endangering globalized capitalism.
>>2810325 (me)
To clarify I mean "based" in a sarcastic way. If the liberal script holds, however the cards fall, it will benefit no one who works for a living. Good things come from the space made, when their calculus fails.
>>2810090Another literally who on twatter
>>2810314It's not like Iran can invade the US and enforce a treaty.
why has the retarded iranian government never try to build oil/gas pipelines to china or pakistan?
Does anyone have the "hit Dubai again" meme?
>>2810385Because neither Afghanistan, nor Pakistan are stable.
>>2810379I agree all imperialist war is futile and only harms workers
No war but class war
>>2810412>all imperialist war inter-imperialist*, which the current war is not
>>2810431That must be why both sides are killing the poorest workers in the world then negotiate the pieces of the pie on top of their bodies
>>2810518well yeah you can kill workers without being imperialist. it has a specific meaning not just "when bad things happen"
>>2810520Exactly. That's why my post went on past that.
>>2810553?
Imperialist is a stage of capitalism, that's why we point out that all capitalist states are Imperialist, and if they weren't (like you imply) then Lenin instruct us to support Imperialist capitalism against pre-monopoly capitalism. You support US imperialism while I advocate for civil war.
>>2810559>Imperialist[m] is a stage of capitalismoh, so not the policy of killing workers or "being reactionary"
>>2810559>Lenin instruct[s] us to support Imperialist capitalism against pre-monopoly capitalismwrong, he does not. youre making a logical leap with no justification. withholding support against imperialism for reactionary elements is not the same as supporting imperialism against those reactionary elements.
>You support US imperialismnope
>>2810565>Lenin: Imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism <um… this is a baseless assertion ogey
>>2810566When Lenin says imperialism is "progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism" he means the centralization and socialization of production and division of labor is at a higher level of development. He does not mean that communists should support imperialism against capitalism or feudalism.
If you actually read the text he says right before this part
>monopoly, which grows out of capitalism, is already dying capitalism, the beginning of its transition to socialism. The tremendous socialisation of labour by imperialism (what its apologists-the bourgeois economists-call “interlocking”) produces the same result. Here Lenin is saying the development of capitalism to its highest stage, imperialism, is the signal that it is over-ripe, past its due date, that its progression has completed, and that it has turned into its opposite and is beginning to regress.
heres the source:
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/oct/x01.htm>>2810582Lenin says in the same paragraph "capitalism is progressive compared to feudalism" and he has dozens of essays encouraging the support of the bourgeoisie against pre-captialist formations, that's the basis of Marxist anti-colonialism. Why do you the next sentence in that paragraph which has the exact same structure, carries a different meaning?
>>2810585This just affirms the progressive character of imperialism compared to pre-monopoly capitalism. We are well aware that historical progress is guided by the abolishment of capitalism.
>>2810386it was just the basic gigachad meme with a phone and the ">hit dubai again" in the post no?
>>2810586>that's the basis of Marxist anti-colonialismcolonialism was capitalist imperialist and not a "pre-capitalist formation", and prevented the development of a national bourgeoisie doing non imperialist capitalism in the colonized country, so your argument makes no sense
also, imperialism is a stage of capitalist development that can only be reached by nations who have a dominant position on the world arena. Lenin describe a world where a handful of imperialist nations share basically the whole world among themselves. Suggesting iranian capitalists are imperialists is a laughable misreading of lenin analysis : what financial monopoly do they have that control vast portions of the world economy? fucking none.
funny how all those happening provoke the exact same arguments about imperialism and lenin analysis since russo ukraine war. Wonder if all those debate about it with intbrig and sabo and your humble anon servitor are archived
>>2810597Why do leftists have so much contempt for literal sex slaves?
>>2810603>colonialism was capitalist imperialist and not a "pre-capitalist formation", and prevented the development of a national bourgeoisieColonialism is the reason the national bourgeoisie exists in the global south, its development was hindered by feudal structures kept empowered by colonialism (not imperialism)
You're not qualified to be having this conversation, Read Lenin unless you want to stay a US imperialism apologist for the rest of your days.
Either this is an inter-imperialist war or we must support US imperialism against pre-monopoly capitalism
>>2810559 there is no third option according to Lenin’s imperialism formulations
>>2810586>he has dozens of essays encouraging the support of the bourgeoisie against pre-captialist formationnot on the basis of them being pre-capitalist
>that's the basis of Marxist anti-colonialismof anti-colonialism? no its not
>Why do you the next sentence in that paragraph which has the exact same structure, carries a different meaning?because he explicitly says the opposite: not supporting EVERY movement against imperialism, that is, not the reactionary ones. he is distinguishing between progressive and reactionary pre-monopoly movements.
>>2810589>This just affirms the progressive character of imperialism compared to pre-monopoly capitalism. except if that were the case he would say to support imperialism outright, which he does not, because its not true. imperialism is only seemingly progressive in one sense, that it centralizes production, and in that sense is only progressive compared to non-monopoly capitalism.
if an imperialist country, like the us, wants to break up a non-imperialist country, like iran, this wont result in the centralization of iranian petrol industry under one monopoly, but the destruction of the iranian industry and demolition of their productive forces.
that makes it reactionary and not progressive. similarly if there were a hypothetical country that was faced with integration into a larger more centralized bloc, and they wanted to remain outside for the purpose of stagnation rent and sitting on their laurels, that would also be reactionary, since reaction/progress from a materialist perspective is about the development of productive forces and not about laws ideas cultural issues oppression or other factors outside of the economic reproduction of said society.
>>2810610honestly cant figure out what you think you mean by this. it doesnt really come across exactly as illiteracy or or misunderstanding but instead completely separate from the text at hand like you are not even participating in the same conversation as everyone else. im at a loss here even llm hallucinations are at least slightly related to the conversation
like this isnt even waffles/pancakes or apples/oranges its more like were talking about architecture and you interject about mudpie recipes
Is handwringing about proles the communist version of "but what about the children"?
>>2810603>what financial monopoly do they have that control vast portions of the world economy?The strait of Hormuz. They grinded half the world's oil production. Other than that I agree with you somewhat. Iran is sub-imperialist at best, however now they have proven weapon and have come out as the premier military power in the region. They may escalate into full blown imperialsim in the coming decades and be a major player in the new multipolor world. Or maybe a renewables transition and global warming will fuck them over. But Iran was sub-imperialist at best(and I think that's a stretch) before the iran war, post war? Who knows.
>>2810621>not on the basis of them being pre-capitalist He literally starts his argument with the following "Thirdly, the semi-colonial countries, like China, Persia, Turkey, and all the colonies, which have a combined population amounting to a billion. In these countries the bourgeois-democratic movements have either hardly begun, or are far from having been completed"
Bro thinks our support for anti colonial movements was predicated on moralism rather than the historical development of the proletariat as a class.
>not supporting EVERY movement against imperialism, that is, not the reactionary ones.Lenin later explicitly lists and says that all bourgeois movements are reactionary compared to imperialism. Leaving us only with revolutionary defeatism. The fact that you're blind to see that is telling.
>progressive pre-monopoly capitalism Okay you're just trolling at this point. "Imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism" this is a definitive statement, there are no ifs or buts.
I see dumb liberals wearing red are still using the liberal definition of the word "progressive".
>>2810610>Why do leftists have so much contempt for literal sex slaves?It's okay anon, UAE isn't going anywhere. The war will only reinforce this market. After the hot war calms down, there will be twice as many rich sheiks willing to pay exorbitant money to shit into an e-celeb's mouth, in order to reaffirm their wounded egos. And due to scarcity, they'll be half as likely to chop up the goldigger in half just afterwards, for the lulz.
What's a little bit of shame, for a trophy wife's worth of wealth, for a few weeks/months as a porta-potty eh? Bottoms up!
>>2810640Liberal definition of historical proogress: the historical development of the mode of production and class antagonisms
Trve Marxist definition: When we bomb empty street in Tel Aviv then negotiate a deal w Israel
>>2810645Bro feels jealous of literal sex slaves lol
>>2810648>I stop paying attentionYou don't need to pay attention. Your quality of life will decrease with or without it, LMAO.
>>2810637>Okay so you fundamentally disagree with Lenin and view his theory as flawed.Nope you just have no fucking clue what Lenin actually said
>country that reached the highest stage of capitalism like IranLMAO
>Iran's economic structure is almost indistinguishable from that of IraqDOUBLE LMAO
You gotta watch out for that Iraqi imperialism.
>>2810648You can always stop attention because like with everything always bet on NEH
>>2810660that's hilarious. so what's the play for Xi here? abandon Iran for leverage on Taiwan, or bet big and stick with Iran for the overall global strategy?
>>2810663>US>in a position to bargainUh, nothing. Next play for America is depression.
>The repudiation of national wars in general may either be an oversight or a fortuitous over-emphasis of the perfectly correct idea that the present war is an imperialist war and not a national war. But as the opposite may be true, as various Social-Democrats mistakenly repudiate all national wars because the present war is falsely represented to be a national war, we are obliged to deal with this mistake.
>it would be a mistake to exaggerate this truth; to depart from the Marxian rule to be concrete; to apply the appraisal of the present war to all wars that are possible under imperialism; to lose sight of the national movements against imperialism. The only argument that can be used in defence of the thesis: “there can be no more national wars” is that the world has been divided up among a handful of “Great” imperialist powers, and, therefore, every war, even if it starts as a national war, is transformed into an imperialist war and affects the interests of one of the imperialist Powers or coalitions (p. 81 of Junius’ pamphlet).The fallacy of this argument is obvious
>It is highly improbable that this imperialist war of 1914–16 will be transformed into a national war, because the class that represents progress is the proletariat, which, objectively, is striving to transform this war into civil war against the bourgeoisie; and also because the strength of both coalitions is almost equally balanced, while international finance capital has everywhere created a reactionary bourgeoisie.
<Nevertheless, it cannot be said that such a transformation is impossible: >if the European proletariat were to remain impotent for another twenty years; >if the present war were to end in victories similar to those achieved by Napoleon, in the subjugation of a number of virile national states; >if imperialism outside of Europe (primarily American) were to remain in power for another twenty years without a transition to socialism,>say, as a result of a Japanese-American war, >then a great national war in Europe would be possible.
>Further, national wars waged by colonial, and semi-colonial countries <are not only possible but inevitable in the epoch of imperialism.>The colonies and semi-colonies (China, Turkey, Persia) have a population of nearly one billion, i.e., more than half the population of the earth. In these countries the movements for national liberation are either very strong already or are growing and maturing. Every war is a continuation of politics by other means. <The national liberation politics of the colonies will inevitably be continued by national wars of the colonies against imperialism.This shows how absurd it would be to employ the term imperialism in a stereotyped fashion by deducing from it that national wars are “impossible.” A war for national liberation waged, for example, by an alliance of Persia, India and China against certain imperialist Powers is quite possible and probable, for it follows logically from the national liberation movements now going on in those countries. Whether such a war will be transformed into an imperialist war among the present imperialist Powers will depend on a great many concrete circumstances, and it would be ridiculous to guarantee that these circumstances will arise.
<The fact that the postulate that “there can be no more national wars” is obviously fallacious in theory is not the only reason why we have dealt with this fallacy at length. It would be a very deplorable thing, of course, if the “Lefts” began to be careless in their treatment of Marxian theory, considering that the Third International can be established only on the basis of Marxism, unvulgarised Marxism. But this fallacy is also very harmful in a practical political sense; it gives rise to the stupid propaganda for “disarmament,” as if no other war but reactionary wars are possible; it is the cause of the still more stupid and downright reactionary indifference towards national movements.Such indifference becomes chauvinism when members of “Great” European nations, i.e., nations which oppress a mass of small and colonial peoples, declare with a learned air that “there can be no more national wars!”National wars against the imperialist Powers are not only possible and probable, they are inevitable, they are progressive and revolutionaryhttps://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/jul/junius-pamphlet.htm >>2810663I just don't see China taking the bait. The US just isn't credible or trustworthy.
I'd want Taiwan in my hands before I even entertain any US offer as their promises are worthless.
>>2810597These are good too, thanks.
>>2810599Thank you dadash
>>2810667China does whatever makes line go up, no matter if it's short-term
>>2810648These AI slop thumbnails are so ugly.
>>2810676When's the last time China accepted a short-term gamble instead of playing the patient long game? They aren't Russia. They'd rather take Taiwan through economic domination rather than a land invasion, and they've publicly said they already have plan to do that within the next 50-100 years without the US giving them anything. Abandoning the plan and risking their position would be foolish.
>>2810663>so what's the play for Xi here?Stall, I guess. That is this cold war's monkey's paw. International capital will eventually find sustaining global hegemony, less profitable than alternatives and diversify… into a more regional liberalism.
>>2810684>… into a more regional liberalism.Japan getting nukes confirmed
>>2810687Japan would have to grow some balls first.
>>2810683They aren't doing shit to Taiwan and will never do shit to Taiwan. Most you get is a pro Chinese capitalist puppet government that will do what Chinese piggy wants which is gain more capital and serve as a shield against western interests because China sucks utter ass at foreign policy and does not have an interest in improving the lives of the "Taiwanese" trapped in this system
>when's the last timeAlmost everything Israel related. They do not give af about how much of a hand they have over zionists because line goes up for the Chinese piggy getting some nice Palestinian homes to sell
>>2810684>International capital will eventually find sustaining global hegemony, less profitable than alternatives and diversifyAre you fucking retarded? Do you even understand what "international capital" even is, or what "diversifying into regional liberalism" entails?
Is this what reading too much theory does to a motherfucker - you start seeing abstractions everywhere?
>>2810690What separates Japan from nukes isn't fear but instead the Enemy States Clause which would allow China (or anyone else) to attack Japan without the normally required authorization from the u.n security council
>>2810692You're misintepreting China's indifference towards Zionism as chasing short-term gains. China is fully aware of the Zionist plan and they think it will destroy the US. So long as the Zionists have no influence in China, they are happy to do business with them in the hopes it will accelerate the US collapse through total ZOG political dominance.
>They aren't doing shit to Taiwan and will never do shit to Taiwan.literally the only thing standing between the PRC and reunification with Taiwan is an economic downturn causing the extremely reactionary Taiwanese populace to shift hard against Capitalism. Taiwan has already abandoned its Chinese-Nationalist roots and relations between the two entities are relatively normalized with plenty of trade between them and Taiwanese/Mainlanders getting along for the most part. It's literally just another Hong Kong situation basically. Burgers kept insisting Hong Kong would never be fully absorbed into China due to its British influence, right up until it was lol.
>>2810698You're implying the citizens of Hong Kong wanted to be absorbed into China. They didn't get a say.
>>2810705I'm not implying that at all. Hong Kong could no longer survive on its own and was reabsorbed into China because the British Empire died and couldn't support its overseas colonies anymore. It was just a formality of waiting to have enough political and economic influence to force it through. The will of the colonists is irrelevant.
Taiwan is exactly the same but replace the British with the Americans. China is just waiting for the inevitable death of the Empire and will take back what is theirs once America can no longer afford to keep the colony going. That's all it is. China has no need to accept short-term false-promised from the Americans when it knows the plan is going exactly as desired without any deals necessary.
>>2810711So is Trump's love for capitalizing nouns due to him being spiritually German or from the 18th century?
>>2810637This one (1) image has been posted so many times it's getting jpeg artifacts
>>2810090>the accelerating pace of oil inventory depletion will ultimately force the reopening of the Strait of Hormuz>MFWlmao, vibes-and-feels-based assessment.
good god, idealists are cancerous.
>>2810711They have no navy is trumps version of fear is mind killer from dune he just repeats to him self so he doesnt lose his shit
Once the massive recession starts due to Strait closure, who will neutral countries take action against - the US or Iran? Will they take any action at all?
I like how no world leader is actually talking about the impending catastrophe like it either wont happen or that it won't be a big deal. What are they waiting for? What do they know that we don't?
>>2810754>What do they know that we don't?they know happeningfags are retarded
>>2810710>USA IS WINNING! CHINA is encircled, humiliated, trade warred, gets no oil!!1And then a reality hits you where China doesn't even notice the problem because USA bends over backwards to appease China, lmao
>>2810754people are too difranchised to realize they are getting screwed.
>>2810743shooter: usa
weapon: israel
silencer: nothing
>>2810786>could be>optionscommon cuckslamist nothingburger
>>2810730>lindsey graham would like to have Iranian peace negotiators stationed in Qatar, instead. so israel can bomb them, the same way they did with the Gazan negotiation team.despicable ghouls
how long can they keep this dance going? trump says iran agreed to give up all the nuclear everythign and all their missiles and to pay the USA war reparations and they're completely destroyed etc etc etc. Iran says no we didn't.
what is happening? will the USA start striking Iran again? can they?
>>2810804The emperor has no clothes, but keeps denying it.
>>2810760and China is flat-out ignoring American sanctions now because they have no teeth
>>2810804probably won't because they're running out of missiles and can't make more in any workable quantity or timeframe because porky supply chain is fucked and corrupt. if they strike more it will probably be limited.
trump blew it but he can't admit he's an idiot and a loser so billions will have to die and go poor.
>>2810734"Imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism" everything is that came before Imperialism is reactionary. Either this is an inter-imperialist war or we KKKrtically support US imperialism against pre-monopoly Iran
>>2810653 >>2810655See
>>2810844>here is Iran's mass privatization and workers crackdown>lmaoI accept your concession
>>2810844>Imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalismyou forgot to mention that Lenin stated:
>it is not every struggle against imperialism that we should supportyou are yet to prove that this tactical support is benefitting bourgeoisie politics if Iran, for instance, wins.
There's no state on earth more neoliberal than the US. no country has a bourgeoisie that benefits more from winning wars than the US.
>>2810856He didn't even put a US flag on Greenland lol, what a retard
western 1st worlders love to ignore the national question, which is really nice because this chauvinism allows their imperialist countries to commit mass rape theft and enslavement across the world
>>2810856>this country is very evil and strong which means nobody else can be imperialisttop minds of leftypol
so whats everyones reactions to to the Heredi groups (normally Likud allies) pushing to dissolve the Knesset? seems like faith in Netanyahu to get the job done is fading away
>For many years, and perhaps for as long as anyone can remember, Israel’s ultra-Orthodox community has not found itself stuck in a situation quite like this. The expiration of their historic blanket exemption from IDF service, coupled with the government’s failure to advance a new draft exemption law, has trapped the Haredi public in a tangle from which they do not know how to escape.
>The pot has been boiling for a long time, and on Tuesday the lid finally blew off: Rabbi Dov Lando decided it was time to dissolve the Knesset and instructed his political faction to initiate a new game.
<“We have no confidence in the prime minister; we do not feel like his partners. Elections are needed as soon as possible,” the rabbi wrote on a piece of paper, making a small piece of history. The elections, currently slated by law for October 27, will apparently be moved up by about month and a half, to early- or mid-September.https://www.timesofisrael.com/ultra-orthodox-parties-break-with-netanyahu-but-know-they-have-nowhere-else-to-go/>>2810967Narrator: but they did indeed not get over it
>>2810610>dubai influencers are sex slavesthere are actual sex slaves in dubai you cunt, fucking kys
>Colonialism is the reason the national bourgeoisie exists in the global southno
>feudal structures kept empowered by colonialism (not imperialism)<implying colonialism and imperialism werent two faces of the same coin in the colonies<implying colonialism kept feudal structuresretard
>Read Lenin I have, you on the other hand might have (although its more likely you quote mined rather than actually read his books and engaged with his thoughts), but clearly you didnt understand anything
>>2810630>The strait of Hormuzis not capital you idiot. Local control over a commercial road geographic chokepoint has nothing to do with financial monopoly, or are you arguing panama and egypt were imperialist because they were collecting tolls on their canals?
>They may escalate into full blown imperialsim in the coming decades a simple look at iran financial strength show how unlikely a proposition this is, their stock market compared to gdp is on the level of colombia. The whole basis of lenin imperialism analysis is the global domination of financial capital monopolies. Just fucking look at the stats. Everything big is in the imperial core. Iran is a regional power that will become more relevant if they manage to break free from sanctions, but they are extremely far behind the western empire in term of global weight
Also whining about "maybe in a long time they will be imperialist" is completely irrelevant deflection. Yes the situation in a century will be different no shit, this will require new analysis in time, but right now its just an excuse to avoid the hard truth of their place as an exploited nation under attack by actual imperialism.
>>2810972>this is what Lenin says *paste his paragraphs*<nah uhkys brainlet
We call for the Iranian, Israeli, American and Gulf proletariat to practice proletarian defeatism, and actively work for the defeat of their own bourgeoisie in this war. Only by uniting the world proletariat, for the communist program and not for a nationalist program, can all these wars be put to an end.
Remember that the Russian proletariat, led by a communist party (a real one, mind you) ended WW1. That is not ancient history, and it can happen again.
All communists must call for proletarian defeatism in ALL countries, without exception, and call for the world proletariat to fight against the ruling classes of their countries.
>>2810856we're all living in amerika
amerika
is
… invading itself again >>2810981>Remember that the Russian proletariat, led by a communist party (a real one, mind you) ended WW1. To the dismay of leftcoms everywhere
>>2810993Don't forget that Russian leftcoms (but mostly socdems), led by Kerensky, actively, consciously helped reactionaries to organize under the sauce of "democracy requires letting everyone to have a say!", while attacking communists, and also renaming imperial army into a revolutionary one, backpedalling on demands for peace, and instead declaring Germany a barbaric state and that Russian revolutinary army now has a duty of bringing socdem revolution to Germany, lmao
>>2810993>>2810996Leftcom:Enemy Unknown
>ok siri, what was the leftcom reaction to brest litovsk? why did they consider russian pullout in ww1 traitorous?
>>2810993what did he mean by this?
>>2811003He thinks the left opposition were Italian leftcoms
>>2811003illiterate redlib keyboard warriors just use it as a slur for whoever disagrees that war between 2 porky occupied governments (pog) is based. almost wish they went back to using ultra. the usual list of decontextualized words they deploy when their brains fail them goes something like this:
>leftcom>labor aristocracy>productive forces>historically progressivereminds me of hasan and voosh pulling out the infantile disorder to quotemine it for reasons to vote for the democrats or mls quoting staterev to justify the great purge
>>2810981>We call for the Iranian, Israeli, American and Gulf proletariat to practice proletarian defeatism, and actively work for the defeat of their own bourgeoisie in this warCool, so this means you'll stop seething about Iran right? After all, you aren't Iranian, and Lenin specifically says that engaging in attacks on the "enemy" bourgeoisie rather than your own is counterproductive and works against revolutionary defeatism.
>>2811037Lenin also says revolutionary defeatism doesn't mean supporting the other bourgeoisie. Especially not while dehumanizing its proletariat like you do. Touché
>>2811065I don't dehumanize the Iranian workers, I simply think that they are hurting their own interests if they allow themselves to be subjected to US colonialism. Additionally, I don't think Lenin's comments on mutual revolutionary defeatism in all belligerent countries are relevant here because this is not an inter-imperialist war. The Islamic Republic is a bourgeois-democratic movement in a colonial country, which Lenin says communists should support. You lot on the other hand invoke Lenin's position on WW1 while forgetting that the Bolsheviks agitated exclusively against their own government, not Germany.
>>2811086You literally cheer for them to get shot while they attempt to steal a rice bag from the people's bourgeoisie
Meanwhile a single lady's death by ICE prompted 7 threads and call to action on this board.
Clearly you don't view them as equals, you can't even imagine them having class or even human agency.
>>2811086>bourgeois-democratic movement Is it pre-monopoly non-imperialist state? Lenin instruct us to support US imperialism in this case
>>2810559 >>2811086>while forgetting that the Bolsheviks agitated exclusively against their own governmentWho critiqued you for supporting the defeat of US imperialism as a westerner? Could you point to him? Are you aware what turning tye imperialist war into a civil war mean?
>>2811086>The Islamic Republic is a bourgeois-democratic movement>Democratic Lol
Lmao, even
>>2811111>NOOOOOOO THIS WASN'T REAL BOURGEOIS DEMOCRACY, BOURGEOIS DEMOCRACY HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED, DON'T YOU DARE SULLY ITS GOOD NAMEkys brainlet larpfag
>>2811108In that context he's talking about the internal development of a country's economy. It is progressive for monopolies to absorb smaller firms and consolidate production on a national scale. It doesn't follow from this that we should support imperialism against a colonized country. Iran is not an imperialist state, and the Bolsheviks actively supported governments of the exact same class character as the Islamic Republic such as Attaturk and the KMT.
>>281111I'm critiquing you people for constantly attacking the bourgeoisie of the "enemy" country, which Lenin specifically instructs us not to do.
>>2811111Yes, Iran is a bourgeois democracy. It has an elected parliament, a constitution, and a presidency that regularly changes hands in competitive elections. Its simply bourgeois democracy operating in the context of Persian culture and under siege conditions.
>>2811029>reminds me of hasan and voosh pulling out the infantile disorder to quotemine it for reasons to vote for the democratsI have also noticed a correlation between "campists" (at least some of them) and democrat dickriders, because of this I have started warming up to the irakkki and the mexican leftcom posters and their takes
>>2811118>bourgeoisie of the "enemy" countryI'm
- From the 'enemy' country (international site)
- Supposedly discussing this inter-imperialist war with fellow communists, not normies, you're under no obligation to repeat Iranian state propaganda on here, why then do you refuse to recognize the nature of this imperialist war and revolutionary defeatism as being the only solution? Why do you rather convert to Islam than show solidarity with the Iranian proletariat and recognise its own struggle? If you did that you'll essentially have the "ultraoid" position. We are against Indifferentism. We are for class war.
>>2811126>Supposedly discussing this inter-imperialist warIt's not an inter-imperialisr war. Simple as that. Iran is a pathetically small economy locked out of global markets. The US could invade fucking Somalia and you'd be out here talking about the evils of Somali imperialism. The entire premise of your position is factually incorrect.
>>2811115>>2811118Iran is not a bourgeois democracy, if Iran were a bourgeois democracy it would be allied with the west and the global financial market.
>>2811130That's fucking retarded. Even if you consider Iran an autocracy this wouldn't be any barrier to its participation in world markets or an alliance with the US. The conflict has to do with the US attempting to snuff out Iranian sovereignty, it has absolutely nothing to do with Iran's internal political system. The US doesn't care about such things except to the extent that they produce governments that are compliant with imperialist interests, which Iran is not.
>>2811153>Rejecting the primacy of class war during imperialist war is a tenant of western leftismIs Mao a western leftist now
>>2811165Iranian communists sure aren't Maoist or shy away from revolutionary defeatism
>Is Mao a western leftist
No he independently reached Lassallism (western leftism)
>>2811105What the fuck do you want, you retarded concern troll? Support US bombing the mullah for freedums? Start an """Iranian people's uprising""" just for it to be exploited and reward by another US and Israel war? After that the Iranian proletariat will soon be fighting actual colonial masters and occupiers (
who are now the primary reason for any economic turmoil and lack in Iran) instead of domestic bourgeoisie and theocrats. One small step forward and ten huge steps backwards.
Even in WW2 the most retarded revolutionary defeatists mostly switched sides as soon as soviet union was attacked. Iran shanking the yank might be one of the most impactful events in decades. I guess it's easy to think this way when your world has no shades of gray, and no sense of lesser and greater evils and goods, just black and white. You are the only real pure socialist and all the countries and just capitalists and reactionaries and nothing is changing, ever. For you the world politics is just bourgeoisie factions rearranging the seats among themselves and nothing will ever change and only thing matters is personal ideological purity.
>>2811168Part of the reason why revolutionary defeatism makes sense in the context of an actual inter-imperialist war is because it's not likely to lead to the wholesale subjugation and colonization of one state by the other. Germany was not reduced to a colony after WW1, it was not deindustrialized or subjected to a puppet government. The same is true of Russia after its defeat by Germany in that war. This is why it was able to produce the intended result, either a proletarian government in the case of Russia, or a much weaker bourgeois one that was far more susceptible to socialist revolution in the case of Germany. However this wouldn't happen in the case of Iran, because it isn't a peer competitor to the US. Rather the defeat of the Islamic Republic would simply result in the creation of a puppet regime that would be equally anti-communist, but would roll back whatever progress the national bourgeoisie have been able to make on the issues of sovereignty and economic development. In other words it would place additional burdens on Iranian workers rather than removing them. How would such an outcome be good for them?
>>2811180
>Number of proles killed during the war: +8000
Who killed them?
>>2811183
Ah I see, they were killed by an abstraction rather than by actual people.
>>2811174>muh lesser evilmods, permaban this kkkamala voter
>>2811192
Stupid non sequitur to my point. Thousands of Iranians have been killed by the Americans and Israelis, because America and Israel are attempting to subjugate the country and restore its colonial condition. To lay their deaths at the feet of an abstract "international capital" in which the Iranian ruling class is somehow equally complicit despite being ostracized from this system is nonsensical. One wonders why international capital only saw fit to kill Iranians in this war and so few Americans. One also wonders why Iran is a target at all if it is supposedly a comparable player in this system and ultimately on the same side as the people they're fighting. US imperialism is to blame for the deaths of those people.
>>2811134So basically Iran isn't a bourgeois democracy because the bourgeois can6do business in Iran because the Iranian nationalists defend their market, Iran is not bourgeois democracy but an autocracy
>>2811200Iran has historically conceded to every demand of the west and even in its isolated state managed to restructure its economy in line with neoliberalism to integrate further into the world market, yet still western imperialism went to war with it.
If there is any real resistance to the normalization of Iran, it is American resistance, not Iranian one. You should ponder on why that is, what do Iranian communists know that you don't for them to react this way? Try leaving your noble savage idealism at the door while at it
>>2811205>Iran is not bourgeois democracy but an autocracyIran is a bourgeois democracy for all the reasons I mentioned earlier. It has a competitibely elected legislature and presidency, constituonal division of powers, etc. Any differences between it and the average Western country are either superficial or a direct result of its siege conditions.
>>2811212>If there is any real resistance to the normalization of Iran, it is American resistance, not Iranian one. Obviously. Iran wants reintegration, but the Americans are not willing to accept this on any terms that might preserve Iranian sovereignty or its capacity for self development. That doesn't address any of my points regarding the inherently progressive character of a bourgeois-democratic struggle against imperialism as described by Lenin, or the fact that Iranian defeat would place far more obstacles to socialism than it would remove. The fact that you haven't addressed this last point is especially telling. How would getting some Egypt or Jordan tier puppet government help Iranian workers? How would it advance socialism at all?
>>2811225"Imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism" - Lenin
>>2811226A completely irrelevant statement that's talking about an unrelated topic. This isn't about the internal development of a state to the monopoly stage of capitalism, but about a war between an imperialist country and a dependent one.
>>2811225Iran is the reason Iraq is a Jordan tier puppet shithole except Iraq has like 5% of the world oil reserves
This is aside from the fact that Iran already carried out deindustrializing and privatization without invasion
Iran will win
Leftcoms will seethe
>>2811230*Iran's ACKsis is the reason Iraq and Lebanon are Jordan tirr puppet shitholes
>If tomorrow, Morocco were to declare war on France, India on England, Persia or China on Russia, and so forth, those would be “just” “defensive” wars, irrespective of who attacked first; and every Socialist would sympathise with the victory of the oppressed, dependent, unequal states against the oppressing, slave-owning, predatory “great” powers.t. Lenin
>>2811230>Iran is the reason Iraq is a Jordan tier puppet shithole - It isn't, much of the country is under the control of Shia militants who participated in the recent war against the US.
- You can't keep dredging up things from decades ago and pretending that nothing has changed. It's interesting that you bring up Iraq, since it was initially an imperialist proxy and Saddam was installed in an actual CIA coup. It doesn't follow from this that the 1991 and 2003 wars weren't attempts to subjugate the country and enhance imperialist dominance. Because guess what? Geopolitical relations are in constant flux, and states which are on the side of imperialism in one time and place can become its enemies and victims in another.
>This is aside from the fact that Iran already carried out deindustrializing
No it isn't, on the contrary the sanctions have led to it developing robust local industry that has been able to sustain a war against the US longer than the Americans themselves. A deindustrialized country would not have been able to outlast the Americans the way they have.
>>2811236>compares semi feudal colonies to a bourgeois state at the highest stage of capitalism lole
>>2811237If you would actually read the quote you keep peddling about imperialism being progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism, you would understand the nonsense of that position. In that quote he's saying that communists should not align themselves with pre-capitalist ruling classes against imperialism. However we know both from his statements and from Bolshevik foreign policy that Lenin supported national bourgeois governments in their attempts to protect the sovereignty and development of their country from imperialists. In other words, pre-capitalist semi-feudal countries are exactly those which are not worthy of support even against imperialism, while national bourgeois ones (like Iran) are.
>>2811235
>Too bad they're incompetent weaklings who are begging for ceasefire.
I've only ever seen this reported by American, Israeli, or British news outlets trying to force a narrative that the US is pressuring Iran into capitulation any day now. The rest of the global media has zero reporting on Iran supposedly cucking out. Curious why Leftcoms keep spreading CIA propaganda?
>>2811238Still not addressing any of my points. All you're doing is throwing out a jumbled list of bad things Iran has done without any analysis of why their defeat would be good for socialism in that country. Tell me, how would the installation of a pro-American regime advance the cause of Iranian socialism?
>>2811240>Iran and the US sign a ceasefire >liberals celebrates the status quo>Gaza is still flattened and raped by investors>Iran, Israel and the gulf welcome multinational and give them reconstruction contracts We did it Patrick! We saved capitalism from overproduction! Another victory for Allah (the rate of profit)
>>2811241
>That must be why he said "imperialism is progressive compared to capitalism"
The meaning of this sentence is that it is progressive for a country to advance to the imperialist stage of development rather than remaining in the pre-monopoly stage. In other words, it is progressive for monopolization to reach its conclusion than for production to remain divided among countless small firms. It doesn't follow from this that its good for dependent countries to remain dependent. He went on to say that "we will not support an uprising of the reactionary classes against imperialism and capitalism ". This indicates that he is referring to precapitalist ruling classes like landowning nobility, since a national bourgeoisie wouldn't rise up against its own mode of production. Finally, there's no way around actual Bolshevik policy, which was to support the national bourgeoisie against imperialism.
>>2811253
>The western proletariat lacks a class party for it to practice revolutionary defeatism
So does Iran.
>thanks to your ideology
My ideology is pretty much nonexistent in the West. Support for or passivity in the face of imperialist aggression is far more common.
>>2811234Iran is not controlling Lebanon. Lebanon is incompetent as shit. WTF are you talking about?
>>2811247The war is still ongoing though so your headcanon is off-topic nonsense.
>>2811266It also just talks about a ceasefire without any elaboration about what it's actual terms are and how these impact the broader international situation.
The thing I noticed about leftcoms is their complete and total inability for tactical thinking. They think exclusively about big picture questions and the operation of the capitalist system at the highest levels and longest timescales. There is no room in their analysis for how short term developments can create more or less favourable conditions for revolution. If they saw somebody being murdered in the street, they would probably conclude that there's no point in helping the victim because death is inevitable anyway.
>>2811271
Maybe just apologize for having zero ability to analyze how the outcome of a conflict with influence the prospects for class struggle. If you want class struggle to succeed then you should be invested in creating conditions that make that success more likely.
>>2811274
>The international bourgeois can't do business in Iran
Yes they can, they are simply withholding their own capital and markets because they want to starve the Iranian bourgeoisie into submission, and forget them to surrender their sovereignty and capacity for national development.
>the bourgeois doesn't control Iran
Yes they do, Iran's political system functions more or less the same as most Western ones, and has the same mode of production.
>Iran is controlled by a reactionary religious minority
No it isn't. The Mullahs serve to ensure the government operates within the boundaries of the Islamic constitution. Their closest Western counterpart is a supreme court, or perhaps ceremonial aristocracy like that in Britain. They do not carry out the day to day functions of state.
>>2811270>tactical thinkingaka 5D chess multipolaroid nonsense
>>2811279You're actually stupid, you know that? You're being dismissive of basic planning and political strategy. Short, medium, and long term implications of existing developments and conflicts should always be carefully analyzed. Without this there is no chance of success.
>>2810929Malicious support to the welfare queens.
>>2811118>In that context he's talking aboutthey dont give a fuck lol. they are not leninists let alone marxists
>>2811229>A completely irrelevant statement its just the new "anti-imperialism is a sham and a humbug". posting it out of context to imply the opposite of what it says on purpose to piss you off and flood the thread with inane bickering instead of news about the united states and israel getting btfo is the objective
>>2811270they arent leftcoms, or even crypto anarchists, or leftists at all
>>2810877>canis doing all the heavy lifting.
also, what odd thing to say, agent smith.
>>2811294>the closer USA is to defeatI stand by what I said at the start of these threads: If the Iran walks out of this not "neutralized" wrt NATO interests then they've won. And it seems to be the case. But we don't know yet what concessions will come out of the ceasefire.
I would count an Iran which has a permanent ASPIDES-like taskforce parked in the Persian gulf not quite so much in control of the strait. Or a Hezbollah which repels the invasion(and they have), but accepts a framework in which Lebanon becomes a French/NATO protectorate again, normalizes relations with Israel in all but name and teeming with 10x the spooks undermining the resistance, would also be a loss. Or a more permanent ceasefire while NATO sicks KSA again on Ansar Allah, or coups Oman to undermine the strait control and so on.
>>2811313>not quite so much in control of the straitIt's not about the perfect control of the strait. Iran effectively controls the economies of Iraq, Kuwait, Qatar, Bahrain and UAE. Minimum. Oman and KSA
may be okay? Yemen is lost. Booj hate uncertainty, especially when it comes to moving billions of dollars worth of commodities every day.
>>2810710did they cross the american blockade?
>>2811308i thought they produced the images themselves? are they getting them from elsewhere?
By the way, Iran claiming sovereignty over Straight of Hormuz isn't correcting some past injustice. They weren't screwed out of it by imperialist powers. They are directly violating UNCLOS, and failing to stop them means actual breakdown of established international order. Which is fantastic news for us, but not so much for anybody hoping the times were going to get less interesting.
>>2811351UNCLOS isn't universal. Neither the US nor Iran are party to it, for example.
>>2811353Yeah, but most of the world is. Most of Middle East is. And when Iran says "no", you gotta lay down the law. A law doesn't exist, if nobody enforces it.
>>2811335>did they cross the american blockade?possibly.
>i thought they produced the images themselves?they do.
>>2811405If billionaire hedgefund managers are saying x, that probably means x is a lie.
>>2811425Probably. Gonna have to think critically. Not sure if that's what you're used to.
>>2811470Profit = Revenues - Expenses
Yes, I know Revenues are big.
I get my materialist theory from the IMF, ultroid.
Hey, remember when Trump came into office and immediately gut USAID? Then jacked up tariffs on everyone? That sound like a profitable empire to you?
At least the seething and coping responses tell me you're not actually a glowie, but actually just a retard doing it for free.
American billionaire doing more legwork and being better at historical materialist analysis than (you). That must sting.
Friendly reminder that the Trump admin created the biggest multinational playground since the Iraq war after Israel and the previous admin were done flattening Gaza
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_peace_plan>>2811370
The Shia militias, did they or did they not attack US bases and troops during this war? If so then clearly Iraq is not a pacified country.
>The largest data center in the world is in Hohhot, China, and is 230 acres.
>Utah just approved the building of a 40,000 acre data center.
Guys, the imperialists are building Skynet.
Buckle up.
>>2811522>timmy accidentally getting a concussion (it was targeting a nearby family house as a show of force) = AMERICAN IMPERIALISM DESTROYED>fighting on the side of US for decades, killing insurgents, killing workers, handing oil to US contractors, upholding Bremer's constitution = nothing burgerLiberals actually believe this
>>2811513I think what's indicative of glowie behaviour is that they constantly bring up random stuff from decades ago without context or analysis to try and prove that there's no difference between Iran and the US. You can give a long and detailed explanation for why US defeat is beneficial to the socialist movement and why Iranian defeat would at best do nothing for Iranian socialists and at worst make things much worse for them. You can quote theory to support your position, lay out all the factors and how they interact to support your conclusion. In response they'll bring up things that happened 20-40 years ago under different conditions that have nothing to do with the current conflict and don't address any of the points you made. It actually mirrors the sort of tactics you see promoted by Zionist troll farms, which is to always play offence.
>>2806908no proles in israel
>>2811530>Gaza peace plan was decades agoGive it a rest brainlet
>>2811527>fighting on the side of US for decadesWhat side are they fighting on now? Using your logic we'd have to conclude that because the US and Soviet Union were allies in 1944, they must also have been allies in 1964. Because according to you, nothing ever changes.
>>2811533Iran wasn't part of that.
>>2811505>immediately gut USAIDthat might as well be explained that it became too obvious when
sumtin sumetin radio free
sumitin had the USAID as top sponsor, no one could trust that such a media didn't have ulterior motives.
>>2811546>The Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) is an initiative by the second Trump administration in the United States. It was first suggested to Donald Trump by Elon Musk in 2024, and was officially established by an executive order on January 20, 2025.You think this administration is known for subtlety, do you?
>>2811493the problem is:
>so the US isn't as interested in being the world's policeman.>imperialism isn't profitable anymoredoes not proc if they left intact the institutions, like the IMF, that are only backed by violence.
also, they don't care. they can indebt themselves more. who's going to claim those unpaid checks when you have nukes?
that said, I do think there's a re-order or re-management of their imperialism.
When the US approves your ACKsis PM pick, you defeated US imperialism.
When every dollar that gets into your shithole goes through the US federal bank, you occupied Washington.
When you ACKsis PM hands Chevron your second largest oil field a month ago, you own wall street.
We are the ACKsis of resistance, we forgive and forget, don't expect us.
>>2811520trump's gaza peace plan assumes that israel can recover economically and return to business as usual. this is complete horseshit, they're finished. israel isn't going to make it to 2030. even if they sold the entire territory to american banks and oil companies the colonial project in the levant is completely indefensible and not economically viable.
I suspect our iraqi leftcom is (((sunni)))
>>2811552>they can indebt themselves moreYeah, on what is this based on, by the way? :^)
>>2811533What does Iran have to do with Trump's Gaza "peace plan"?
>>2811558violence. the same they exerted on Iran, Venezuela, possibly Cuba, Russia in Ukraine. and if they don't get what they want from China, maybe China in the Island of Formosa, too.
>>2811565Uh-huh. And how is that working out for them right now?
>>2811405i reposted that video and also got yelled at. it's great.
>>2811425nah that ray dalio video is mostly truth nukes with maybe the occasional asterisk
>>2811571Except the conclusions. He's still a liberal, after all.
>>2811566well, they fucked up. miscalculated. it's not unprofitable, it's they are desperate, maybe. and desperation made them take a serious of stupid decissions.
also trump had this insane idea of taking Iran since the 80s…
…so.
I knew leftypol would be a shithole as soon as I saw that US opinion polls where overwhelmingly anti-israel and simultaneously hezbollah had repelled the IOF and counter attacked occupation forces in palestine. it's shocking that there are people that would waste time trolling a vietnamese water puppet forum when they desperately need to get their money and family members out of the doomed zionist reigime in palestine.
>>2811563by entire territory I was referring to isntreal. everyone already knows what the zionist entity has to do with the iran war.
>>2811581throughout history wars start only after:
you have the money for it.
you have some of the money for it, and you think you will have the rest of the money for it.
>>2811573yeah that's what i meant by the occasional asterisk. he calls FDR a peaceful revolution towards the end. that made me LOL
>>2811588nobody had the money to fight iran. this was initiated through corruption and kompromat.
>>2811599>kompromat.again, trump wanted this since the 80s.
was he since then 'kompromated'? he's simply an amalgam of US exceptionalism, bourgeoisie interests, and obsessed chud, who thought he could get away with Iran.
>>2811633>has trump been a pedophile since the 80syes
>>2811633Why does he want Iranian oil so much, anyway?
>>2811534normally I'd say the jew but emiratis are like the only thing more dishonest than an israeli and they're also terrible at covering their lies so I would bet money UAE is lying.
>>2811639by that date, by the social context of the past, more backwards, he could have had a 17yo gf, and no one would have batted an eye. I don't think he got 'kompromated' by then.
>>2811641beats the hell out of me. blinken, sullivan, nuland were obssessed against Russia, you can read about that since they were very young, in their 20s. you see the results.
>>2811643I love it. the UAE created its own drama, for being ziocucks.
>>2811530>It actually mirrors the sort of tactics you see promoted by Zionist troll farmsya think? nahhh
>>2811677>>2811530the persistent shilling is a good sign. it means they're afraid and desperately trying to correct their public perception.
waiting for things to get worse for them and the shilling to stop, which would signal that they've run out of resources to waste on propaganda.
>>2811530seeing them get triggered by calling iran a bourgeois democracy and insisting it's an autocracy/theocracy instead is the tell that you're dealing with a westcamp lib/anarcho-bidenist wearing a mask and promoting division under the cover of communist jargon.
>>2811656>17yo gftoo old. in the 80s he was fucking 13 year olds and making them get abortions
>>2811530>always play offence.always play offense, deeply kafka traps, bring backup so they feel outnumbered and unpopular, make sure to always type less words than them so they get tired faster, decrease respect as they increase effort, be humorous when they are serious and serious when they are humorous, question their motives, move the goalposts, get them defending stuff irrelevant to the original conversation, etc.
>>2811702It's actually weird that they use bourgeois. it'd be more convincing to use the libtard critique because there's not very much marxist discourse on Iran.
>>2811766They aren't anti-autism meds. They're anti-depressants.
What do you feel when you aren't fucking despondent over the state of the world? Pissed the fuck off.
>>2811699i dont think its actually zionists though i think wrecking is just the next gen of "for the lulz"
>>2811402>possibly.i had forgotten that drumpf was meeting xi so probably amerimutts let them cross as a goodwill gesture
>>2811770>What do you feel when you aren't fucking despondent over the state of the world? Pissed the fuck off.Horny
>>2811932I ain't watching penthouse owing privileged diasporat children of the regime where people strave
gtfo gusano
>we prefer to be invaded that's why we signed 10 ceasefires and begged you not to start the war :)
>empire's victims: Iraq and Afghanistan that Iran supported the invasion of
Why are liberals so corny?
>>2811964It's Israel fault that Iran supported the war on terror, they used Jewish brainwashing beams on cuckmenei .
>>2811702>iran a bourgeois democracyThat's the problem innit
>>2811702Leftcoms are the only people who call regimes like that of Iran a liberal democracy, liberals and leftists (liberals) always insist it is le something else
Fuck Putler.
>>2812045I gussed this post is referring to me before the (You) was rendered
Absolutely mind broken
>Saudi Arabia has discussed the idea of a non-aggression pact between Middle East states and Iran as part of talks with allies on how to manage regional tensions once the US-Israeli war with the Islamic republic ends, diplomats said.Riyadh is eyeing as a potential model the 1970s Helsinki Process that eased tensions in Europe during the cold war, said two western diplomats, as the region anticipates a postwar Iran that is weakened but still poses a threat to its neighbours. They added that the non-aggression pact was among various ideas being considered.
Gulf states in particular have been concerned since the US and Israel launched the war against Iran that they would be left with a wounded, more hawkish Islamic regime on their doorstep once the conflict ends and the large American military presence in the region is scaled back.
The Helsinki accords, signed in 1975 by the US, European countries and the Soviet Union and its allies, sought to address security issues and foster greater economic co-operation between rival powers.
They have previously been raised as a potential model for the Middle East, where Iran’s neighbours have seen the country as a destabilising force and potential threat since the 1979 Islamic revolution.
But the months of war have created a new sense of urgency among Arab and Muslim states to rethink their alliances and the region’s security apparatus.
Many European capitals, and the EU institutions, have swung behind the Saudi idea and have urged other Gulf countries to support it, the diplomats said. They view it as the best way to avoid future conflict and provide Tehran with guarantees that it also would not be attacked.
The US and Iran have been holding back-channel talks over a deal to end the war and reopen the Strait of Hormuz. But the negotiations have focused on the republic’s nuclear programme, not its missile and drone arsenal or support for regional proxies, which are key concerns of Arab states.
An Arab diplomat said that a non-aggression pact modelled along the lines of the Helsinki process would be welcomed by most Arab and Muslim states, as well as by Iran, which has long sought to project to the US and other western powers that the region should be left to manage its own affairs.
“It all depends who is in it — in the current climate you are not going to be able to get Iran and Israel . . . without Israel it could be counter-productive because after Iran, they are seen as the biggest source of conflict,” the diplomat said. “But Iran is not going anywhere and this is why the Saudis are pushing it.”
Iran retaliated against the US-Israeli war by firing barrages of missiles and drones at Gulf states — hitting energy facilities and other civilian infrastructure — and in effect closing the Strait of Hormuz. That has underlined its potential threat to its smaller neighbours.
Some Arab and Muslim states have also become increasingly concerned about Israel’s military conduct in the wake of Hamas’s October 7, 2023 attack. Many do not have formal relations with Israel.
They blame Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu for dragging US President Donald Trump into a war they lobbied against. Israel is increasingly seen by many Arab and Muslim states as a belligerent, destabilising force as it continues to launch attacks against Hizbollah in Lebanon and Hamas in Gaza, while also occupying parts of southern Syria.
There are also divisions among Arab and Muslim states — particularly between Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, the Gulf’s two most influential states — over conflicting visions for the region and economic competition.
The UAE has been the most hawkish Gulf state towards Iran during the war, and has criticised Arab institutions for not being more robust in their response to the Iranian aggression. It has made clear that in the wake of the war, it intends to double down on its relations with Israel.
Two of the diplomats questioned whether the UAE would be willing to join any arrangement.
Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states, meanwhile, have been more supportive of Pakistan-led mediation efforts to broker a deal between the US and Iran to end the war. The kingdom is part of a burgeoning alignment with Pakistan — with which it signed a mutual defence pact in September — Turkey and Egypt.
Diplomats say that while they do not have a formal alliance, the states are likely to deepen defence, foreign policy and economic co-operation in the wake of the war.
Pakistan’s defence minister Khawaja Asif said on Monday that Islamabad had developed a proposal for Qatar and Turkey to join the Saudi-Pakistani defence pact to build an “economic and defence alliance . . . that will minimise dependence outside the region”.
The idea of expanding the defence pact was first mooted before the war, a Pakistani official said.
https://www.ft.com/content/ab78e60e-7a41-4943-a1a5-bd60b4ca31b9 I don't get why leftists want the Middle East to permanently remain a war torn destabilized shithole. When even the American glowies want to turn the Middle East into another EU like stable economic zone, why do leftists hate ME proles so much they want them to continue pointlessly suiciding, *ahem*, "martyring" themselves?
I mean, look at South America or the EU or SEA. These regions have been mostly stable for the past 40 years. They dont have countries that constantly bomb each other and support terrorists in each other. Why shouldnt the Middle East be allowed to have that?(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
>>2812202I keep forgetting everyday is opposite day
>>2812207Iran is the source of destabilization. The Gulf countries are open about this. The end of IR and its proxies will bring about a golden age of peace to the ME.
Leftists are terminally "geopolitics" brained. In practice, what this "geopolitics" means is the question "How does this benefit China/Russia?". It removes all agency from the actual countries that exist in the region. The countries there (at least most of them, with a few exceptions), want stability, peace, and trade with ALL blocs.
>>2812217>The Gulf countries are open about this.Well if the Gulf countries say something it must be true
>>2812202>>2812217Stop larping timmy
I can smell your deng cum stained breath from here
>>2812218>>2812219See, this is what I'm talking about. You completely dehumanize and remove all agency from the Middle East. Apparently they are either subhuman golems with no independent thought who only parrot US propaganda, or they are jihadists whose only goal in life is to attack some vaguely Western aligned target to increase Russia/China's relative power by 0.000000001%.
Leftists are gonna have a meltdown in the coming years as multipolarity actually becomes a reality. And REAL multipolarity means the various poles will not bend their knee to either the US or China, but will pursue their own independent imperialist goals.
Or maybe leftists will lose their interest once the LARP becomes unsustainable and we go back to 1950s/1980s level of irrelevance of leftism in the general culture.
>>2811699any countries intel community has known for at least a century that the benchmark of propaganda being effective is if you get people to reproduce it for free. if it becomes self sustaining. there will likely be shills who are just programmed randos for some time.
>>2812268Iran has aided US hegemony for the past 50 years by creating security problems in the region, therefore forcing Gulf countries to take protection from the US.
The fall of IR is an act that actually goes against US hegemony and is a step towards multipolarism. The fall of IR is a CONCESSION from the US towards the rest of the world as the world becomes more multipolar.
>>2812275 (me)
I know this sounds like a glowie post, but please try and actually THINK and you'll realize I'm right.
>>2812392 (samefag)
Importantly it shows the aftermath of an FPV strike against an armoured communications vehicle. The drones seem capable of completely destroying them.
>>2812101what did the nytimes publish?
>>2812450they're upset about a palestinian describing israeli dogs that were trained to rape prisoners even though haaretz reported on it already months ago
>>2812518this shit has literally been known for years why have the media just decided to talk about it now??
>>2812518to call them upset is a bit too charitable. they're weeping jewish crocodile tears demanding NYT fire this Palestinian and delete all his contributions as a display of Zionism's geopolitical influence. and NYT is a zionist rag so they will of course comply.
>>2812540It was a Palestinian opinion writer and the NYT buried the articles, they were just intended to be there so they could "profit off both sides" so to speak now that there's a very sizable demographic of anti-Zionist liberals and NYT/WaPo are rapidly losing subscribers due to their inherent Zionism. NYT is now stuck in the position of having to delete an article they never wanted in the first place and being able to claim Israel pressured them to do it, making anti-Zionist libs more sympathetic to NYT for "falling victim to Israel's pressure campaign". It's all so dumb tbh.
>>2812268>that glitched sign turning into a bookshelf at 3:08so close
>>2812518>israeli dogs that were trained to rape prisonerswhy are Epsteines such evil monsters?
>>2812662I think they stole that technique from Egypt. CIA blacksites there reportedly used that method for decades.
>>2812670use google, retarded chud. Was Israel also responsible for guantnmo and abu ghraib?
>>2812674considering they did 9/11, yes, i'd say so
>>2812678Did they genocide natives, enslave africans and colonise latins?
>>2812684yes, on the slavery part
what does any of this have to do with Epstein vermin training their dogs to rape people?
>>2812688israeli dogs have a right to rape non-israeli detainees. it says so in the bible
>>2812688>yes, on the slavery partGo back to pol burger chauvinist retard
>>2812691>le hecking chosen people never owned any slavesis that what they teach you at mcgoy school?
>>2812693/pol/. Behave yourself.
>>2812689There is nothing Israeli about that method. It's part of bourgeois civilization you and zionists like to save so much.
>>2812693>mcgoy schoolI want to an Arabic school
>>2812699>if our dogs don't rape them, somebody else's willdoes this pass as an argument according to the talmud?
>>2812643I genuinely believe if Iran nuked Israel the world would enter into a golden age from collective happiness from the extermination of the world's greatest evil.
>>2812662>why are Epsteines such evil monsters?their holy book tells them that goyim are less than human and can be raped, murdered, etc without consequence.
>>2812704Every major bourgeois state is aiding Israeli rape of Palestinians in one way or another. The periodic annihilation is a function of this global system. If it isn't Palestinians, then it is Iraqis or Afghans or Vietnamese, etc. Israel is merely the tool. Israel could dissappear tomorrow and the same cruelty would continue.
>>2812715can you point me to the part of Capital where it says M-C-M' necessarily means having dogs rape goyim?
>>2812778People pretending they weren't insulted or attacked is very weird to me.
>>2812786China are gassing him up during his state visit and his narcissism convinced him Xi is a great guy for being nice to him therefore any of Xi's criticisms towards America have been intended for Biden. It's really funny how easy it is to manipulate Trump.
>>2812788Do none of the Trump's aides warn him about veiled Asian insults?
>>2812791stolen from USApol
Trump doesn't listen to his aides but even if he did Republican aides all hate their bosses.
>>2812793what kind of kids get selected for these shows?
>>2812778Late stage of cope.
Interimperialist war
Someone bake.
>>2807075note that vietnam had a communist movement before the war, which iran does not have
>>2807118can you point me to a resource that explains this process for me? i've tried some searches but they aren't breaking down the process like this
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