Why is it that the surviving members of the George W. Bush administration who acted as the architects of the Iraq War have never faced any legal penalties for what they did?
The 2003 US invasion of Iraq was arguably one of the worst human rights atrocities of the past 50 years. Over 1 million Iraqi CIVILIANS were killed. If that's not a low key genocide similar to Gaza I don't know what is. But it's even worse knowing this war was based entirely on a gigantic lie (a "noble lie" if you will) by some of the slimiest, most diabolical villains ever known to American politics. Yes, Dick Cheney, Colin Powell and Donald Rumsfeld are dead and rotting in hell. But George W Bush, Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith are still alive. Neocons Bill Kristol, Robert Kagan and John Bolton who were the top dogs in PNAC (Project for a New American Century), which called for massive military spending and preemptive attacks (also a "New Pearl Harbor" which conveniently happened on 9/11) are also still alive. WHY HAVEN'T ANY OF THEM EVER BEEN CHARGED AS WAR CRIMINALS?????
The Straussian cabal is very real and still holds loads of ideological power within American politics. Many Neocons from the Bush II era have now since become Democrats and publicly supported Kamala Harris over Trump on the basis Trump wasn't Neocon enough. These people have names and addresses and have to face some kind of legal penalties so the world can finally have closure and the Neocon war criminals can finally reap what they sowed.
>>2883310>Why is it that the surviving members of the George W. Bush administration who acted as the architects of the Iraq War have never faced any legal penalties for what they did?because the system was functioning as intended and war criminals are in fact the prime product of the US government?
The “winners” of the war are never charged with war crimes. Also, Israel is far more evil than America.
I hate imperialism as much as you, but why would this matter now? Isn’t Paul Wolfowitz like 90 years old? John Bolton the same age? What’s the use in pressuring the ICC to try these aging neocons? Maybe this would have been something Obama could have done 15 years ago but it has no relevance to today.
>>2883323>$cam Altman's vaporware produces answers I don't likeno shit
>WHERE DID THE NEOCONS COME FROM?
Athens and Jerusalem
If you don’t understand that reference you shouldn’t be writing about this topic. But Maupin speaks out of his ass 90% of the time anyway.
>>2883313>>2883318This, unfortunately.
>>2883310>”Straussian cabal”2005 called. They want their scapegoat back.
>>2883664Yeah well the JERK STORE called and they're running out of
YOU >>2883310>watched the whole video>literally calls Trotsky a “Jewish supremacist” in the endFigures Maupin keeps invoking Medieval Christian antisemitism in his talks. At this point, he’s a preacher LARPing as a tankie. Pathetic.
>>2883310>Why is it that the surviving members of the George W. Bush administration who acted as the architects of the Iraq War have never faced any legal penalties for what they did?Read up on Clean Break and PNAC some time. It was a part of the joint US-Israeli operation to reorder the MENA region under their domination. The invasion of Iraq was planned as early as 1999 under the name "Operation Desert Crossing." Clean Break was a bipartisan operation that was planned under Clinton, started under Bush and was continued by Obama, Trump and Biden. If they indicted BushCo, they would have had to indict themselves.
>>2883713>US-IsraeliIran and gulfies offered more tangible support to the US invasion than Israel ever did, Egypt did more than Israel by opening up the Suez
This fact absolutely mind rapes shitlibs since it demolishes their clash of civilization meme
>>2883723Saddam had bad politics and ruined Ba’athism, doesn’t make the US or Israel good
>>2883723People forget Iran LOVED the US invasion of Iraq since they wanted Saddam out. They only changed their tune once Neocons began threatening them.
>>2883817>US is the greatest satan… except if Iraq is aroundlol tell that to Iran bro unlike me they supported the invasion and destruction of IRAQI PEOPLE (not "Saddam")
>>2883886Undoubtedly yes.
Isn’t “neoconservatism” just standard US foreign policy since the end of WWII?
>>2883601TBH Maupin has never made a worthwhile insight in his life.
>>2883310Neocons are the woke
Every neocon is a liberal in disguise who like war
>>2883310Who brings the charges?
Also, by this logic you’d have to try all living US presidents for war crimes (yes, even Obama).
>>2884331Literally styling himself as a cult leader.
What's the evidence PNAC did 9/11?
>>2883313>>2883318People act as if the Iraq invasion was unique and not regular ol' US imperialism.
>>2884515Burger chauvinists and their pathological obsession with blaming da juice for everything
>>2884519You can take them if you want them Millei. We can even pay you.
>>2883713So Bill Kristol is as much a war criminal as the rest of them? Interesting.
>>2884528No one wants to take in smelly burgers
>>2883310>The Straussian cabal is very realOy vey, cool it with the antisemitism.
>>2884515on the one hand, it was not unique, just as you say. It was pretty basic US imperialism. On the other hand, it was unique in the sense that it was a NATO coalition invasion, not just the US, even Ukraine helped despite not being in NATO, and it was also unique in the sense that, unlike Afghanistan, the US didn't even bother with a plausible excuse like "The Taliban is harboring Osama Bin Laden who did 9/11." but was clearly trying to finish off what they had already started with the gulf war in 1991, "weapons of mass destruction" as an excuse. Here was this Ba'athist regime that clearly had no love for the Wahhabist and Salafist militants and the US was making this out to be a GWOT issue.
>>2884902That Baathist regime also had no love for IRGC islamists that the US put in power
>>2884903no love for Israel either
>>2884906Point is we can all ignore the material roots of US imperialism and conjure up idealist conspiracies to tacitly defend the empire
So what exactly do the neocons want?
American Empire? That’s what the US has always been.
Rule by intellectual elites AKA philosopher kings? That sounds based, actually. Plato was a proto-communist and philosopher kings are chads.
Jewish messianism? Also based given that the Jewish messiah is supposed to usher in communism.
So what’s going on here that I need to be worried about?
>>2884915Not really what I was doing or trying to do, but yes, anyone "can" do that if they want.
>>2884927You're running circles around yourself to essentially save the good name of US imperialism from being tarnished by another war for capital
>>2884929Why are they wrong?
>>2884925r/ultraleft material right here.
>>2884891"Straussian cabal" conspiracy is just "Cultural Marxism" conspiracy for liberals.
>>2884925Dafuq am I reading?
>sees flagOh.
>>2884925>>2885270She is the a Greek-Australian Empanada who chose to stay in straya and get transitioning.
>>2885271In good company with the other legendary Greco-Strayan, Drew Pavlou.
What a credit to your Greco-Strayan Race.
>YPG-flag>Bad Empanadaand
>Drew Pavlou >>2884925This is a question to ask Maupin, since he's obviously the expert.
>>2884925I mean, wasn’t Stalin technically a philosopher king?
>>2885723
A huge number of Americans supported the war on the basis it was revenge for 9/11.
>>2885723
muslim regimes, including le based ones, are infinitely more guilty of enabling the invasion of Iraq than the average american citizen.
not acknowledging this naked fact speaks to how disingenuous opportunists are and how low they're willing to sink even mocking the bloodshed of millions of workers
>>2885792Elaborate please. This sounds like victim-blaming.
>>2885799Who fascinated the invasion of Iraq? What lands were used as a launching pad? Whose waters allowed US armament? Which countries operated CIA blacksites? Who backed the new regime? From where did the militias who to this day brutalize the population into submission come from? Which countries joined the privatization campaign that doomed the place?
The answer is every country, a cross-camp massacre of workers by international capital, no different than Gaza today, or the Holocaust yesterday.
>>2885799>This sounds like victim-blaming.Get real.
>>2885810USA and the neocons/Straussians (perhaps Israel too) are the only ones to blame for this.
>>2885831It is. The Muslim countries were forced to comply with America and israel.
>>2885908>>2885985>the CIA forced islamists like chalabi and alawai to fabricate evidence, what do you mean they were wannabe bureaucrats motivated by self interest?>multinational investors? they were forced to exploit Iraqi oil at gunpoint>housing US troops and allowing them to arm for years with the explicit goal of invading Iraq? ermm…kys retard
>>2886042AIPAC virtually controls America. Every neocon is an Israel First Zionist. Tell me, why are you forbidden to criticize Israel and Zionism in American politics?
>>2886086You can find collaborators in every country on the planet
>>2886105The collaborators are the countries themselves
>>2885799It's an open secret the USA's foreign policy in the SWANA has always been to support the Muslim Brotherhood, because the MB is viciously anti-communist and supportive of free market capitalism. This is, paradoxically, why the US allows certain Muslim politicians like Mamdani, Ilhan Omar, and now this guy in Michigan to take positions of power: all of them are under the same ideological line as the MB. They're pro-Palestine and anti-Zionist of course, but they're supportive of US foreign policy on everything else. There's also a HUGE amount of Turkish and Qatari money flowing into the US. Nearly every major Sunni mosque in America is funded by Qatar and Türkiye, and the US allows it because they want to keep the Muslim population in-check. Qatari/Turkish interests are the interests of the MB. Hell, al-Jazeera is Qatari state media that fully promotes the MB line on nearly everything.
>de-zionizing America
Can I post amerimutt speech bubble or is it bannable for triggering jannies?
>>2886114How many of these pro-Palestine talking heads are explicitly pro-Iran vs. pro-Qatar?
>>2886114>>2886127 (me)
Let me give you another example as to what I mean:
Every single time you hear of a conflict in the world involving "Muslims" (quotation marks because the term is used very loosely) you see al-Jazeera and other MB-affiliated media portray said conflict as one of religious persecution or outright Muslim genocide? Gaza is a very obvious genocide, but when it comes to, say, the Uyghur issue it's very much one of Uyghur separatism and the CPC's response. Yet MB-affiliated media is deadset on pushing the idea of a "Uyghur genocide" because it has a vested interest in promoting pan-Islamism. I'm no fan of Modi, but I remember hearing endlessly about alleged pogroms against Muslims in India in the late 2010s from al-Jizz. Same thing with Russia cracking down on the Muslim-majority regions in the Caucuses. Same thing with the Rakhine state in Myanmar. Or the fighting between Muslims and Christians in Nigeria which of course was framed as Christian Nigerians massacring Muslim Nigerians. In truth, nearly all of these conflicts are either civil wars or involve separatist movements. Very much unlike Palestine/Gaza, these are not actual genocides but are framed as such by MB, Qatari, and Turkish media. Ask yourself why that is.
>>2884891If the cabal is real, how do I join?
>>2883601>But Maupin speaks out of his ass 90% of the time anyway.He also recycles information over and over and over ad nauseum. I think his recent books are mostly verbatim content from his older books.
>>2884925>and philosopher kings are chads.Bruh, who the fuck wants to be ruled by kings?
I have a philosopher king-sized penis.
>>2883310>The Straussian cabal is very real and still holds loads of ideological power within American politics.Not really. The neocons thing died out in 2016.
>>2883310Why does Caleb believe Trotsky was a “Jewish supremacist” exactly? He gives no evidence:
>>2886676go to your local center for political innovation branch. take a D-Meter test today.
because underneath the surface of your pristine shiny high tech first-world society and all the performative egalitarianism of the people who live in it is the same old white supremacist monster who believes that all those people who died were not really people, they were subhuman savages who had to die because their way of life is inferior
>>2886818most neocons dont even perform egalitarianism tho.
>>2886825of course they do, that's practically all they do is go on and on about freedom and liberty and promoting democracy and improving the lives of people in poor american cities or poor foreign nations with industrial development and jobs, just like their european colonial ancestors who claimed to be helping to civilize the indigenous peoples of the new world by displacing and enslaving and exterminating them.
>>2886732Because Caleb relies on old school Christian antisemitic tropes about Jews being innately evil because they reject Christian Universalism or some shit. He thinks Christianity is a “higher” stage of morality than Judaism was, that Jews are “tribalist” and “primitive”, and therefore must have their Jewishness stripped from them if they are to be moral people.
>>2883447
Those chimpouts wouldn't have happened in the first place had the US not invaded, you mong.
>>2886928some imperialism shills bring up those points but the high level people usually are talking about "US strategic interests" "they're terrorists who want to destroy Israel" "they attacked US bases (right next to their country)", etc etc. just the language of pure power politics.
>>2883601I watched the whole video (regrettably), and it's quite telling how Caleb leaves out the most crucial aspects of Neoconservatism: the belief that ideas and values have profound political consequences, the concern with the decline of "traditional values", and dismay over the so-called moral degradation that followed the 60s New Left. There was concern about moral decline, cultural conflict, and need for political action against these perceived threats.
Neocons/Straussians have always been highly opposed to the moral relativism of the West, something which (according to them) was directly influenced by the turn towards historicism. Leo Strauss himself bemoaned the historicism of modern political thought which ditched ancient attachment to forbearance and traded objective morality for subjective. In his view, modern political philosophy (liberalism) from Machiavelli onward had abandoned the ancients' concern with virtue in favour of comfort, commerce, and procedural politics. This is precisely why Neocons approach their views from classical political philosophy such as Plato and Aristotle rather than from Christian theology like the Religious Right does. Neocons latched on to religion to enforce social order, on the basis virtue cannot be maintained by purely secular societies.
If we're talking about issues like abortion, which Maupin has implied time after time that he's against, Neocons saw it as indicative of the weakening of traditional moral standards and social institutions such as the family. Pro-lifers began to contextualize abortion as part of a greater decay of culture that involved the destruction of the family, indulgent sexuality, and secularization, all of which plays into the Neocon agenda perfectly.
You also see this with the very polarized thinking that Neocons and their Religious Right buddies hold, which Maupin clearly holds as well. Political, educational, and media institutions become battlegrounds for good vs. evil, supernatural forces influence human events, usually attributed to New Age spirituality, secularism, corrupt elites, etc.
Cultural crisis —> spiritual warfare
Moral decline —> demonic influence on society
Defence of traditional values —> conservative Christian response through activism
Conflict between competing worldviews —> cosmic battle between good and evil
One of the biggest reasons Straussian Neocons are authoritarian is because of their obsession with virtue and the demand that the state impose it on the vulgar masses of people. In this regard, Maupin and his "American Christian NazBolism" isn't much better.
>>2887087ChatGPT-ass post
>>2886679According to Maupin, everyone who hates Russia is a de facto neocon.
>>2883310>WHY HAVEN'T ANY OF THEM EVER BEEN CHARGED AS WAR CRIMINALS?????Who is supposed to charge them?
>>2887328Isn't that their purpose? They're anti fascist ie pro proto fascism (liberalism)
>>2887084Iraq was sectarian long before the U.S. invaded.
>>2887087Maupin opposes abortion because he sees it as a tool of Malthusian population control by the ruling class. Not because of morality.
>>2887087Interesting. Would you say most Democrats and progressives nowadays adhere to this exact same mentality? We see it with the left’s embrace of Heideggerian traditionalism and Gen Z prudishness towards sex.
>>2887087>One of the biggest reasons Straussian Neocons are authoritarian is because of their obsession with virtue and the demand that the state impose it on the vulgar masses of people.So cancel culture, basically.
>>2887394I’d say a major element here is how with Trump the American right no longer has to put on the façade of morality (or intellect for that matter). So the left ends up embracing an obsession with sexual morality and virtue as a means of countering Trump and his sexual immorality.
>>2887087>Leo Strauss himself bemoaned the historicism of modern political thought which ditched ancient attachment to forbearance and traded objective morality for subjective. In his view, modern political philosophy (liberalism) from Machiavelli onward had abandoned the ancients' concern with virtue in favour of comfort, commerce, and procedural politics. This is precisely why Neocons approach their views from classical political philosophy such as Plato and AristotleProtip: tradition is just peer pressure from dead people.
>>2883321War crimes should still be punished. There are former Nazis who are 90+ years old who still get charged with genocidal crimes.
Someone needs to send this thread to Caleb and see what he says.
>>2885810>no different than Gaza today, or the Holocaust yesterdayWoke socialists celebrated the Abu Ghrabi rape-torture prison camp guard Graham Platner as a "committed anti-fascist", but the mods will ban you if you follow this logic to its obvious conclusion about the relationship between anti-Stalinists and the entity
>>2887087> the most crucial aspects of Neoconservatism: the belief that ideas and values have profound political consequences, the concern with the decline of "traditional values", and dismay over the so-called moral degradation that followed the 60s New LeftTheir lofty ideals and uptight morality were determined by historical materialist conditions like all of ours are. The most crucial aspects of neocons was their desperate obsession with assimilation into WASP supremacy of imperialist Tucker Carlson guys. That's why neocon libs (and their DSA socialists coworkers lol) are so mad at Tucker: he broke their pact! In the 1960s era the neocons explicitly said that women and gays and black people gaining civil rights was bad for them, as white-ish Jews or as men or closeted bourgeois gays, or whatever their privileged class position was. It was like those Jewish people who thought "fighting the KKK is bad for us". They became reactionary when faced with the prospect of actual revolutionaries, not the utopian Trotsky dogshit of "incremental progress of permanent global revolution of free markets for consumers of delicious treats". Seeing militant working class people assert of their universal rights forced them into reactionary ideology to defend their hegemony. Norman Finkelstein often brags about how he went to such a legendary school full of high status Jewish kids, and he only knew one black girl.
>This is precisely why Neocons approach their views from classical political philosophy such as Plato and AristotleBoomers: "Young people must read the classics!"
Young people: "The Republic is about Epstein class guys doing a late night secret cabal for anti-democracy pedophiles"
>>2887629Very oversimplified way of putting it.
>>2887441I don't get what you mean by this.
>>2887776>They became reactionary when faced with the prospect of actual revolutionaries, What "actual revolutionaries?" The 60s new left was mostly a CIA psy-op.
>>2887776>In the 1960s era the neocons explicitly said that women and gays and black people gaining civil rights was bad for them, as white-ish Jews or as men or closeted bourgeois gays, or whatever their privileged class position was. It was like those Jewish people who thought "fighting the KKK is bad for us". They became reactionary when faced with the prospect of actual revolutionaries, not the utopian Trotsky dogshit of "incremental progress of permanent global revolution of free markets for consumers of delicious treats". Seeing militant working class people assert of their universal rights forced them into reactionary ideology to defend their hegemony.And does this not perfectly describe Maupin's turn to the right? I've seen plenty of his livestreams where he rants endlessly about how queer people, Black intersectional feminists, abortion rights activists, etc. have "polluted" Marxism and that "true" Marxists should be concerned with upholding American patriotism and the patriarchal bourgeois family. Does he not see these exact people as threatening *his* social power, as a white, cis-het Christian male, hence his embrace of crypto-fascism, antisemitism, smearing of feminists and Black activists, etc.?
>>2887776>about the relationship between anti-Stalinists and the entityStalinism has no relevance to today. The only people calling themselves "Stalinists" unironically are autistic tankie online LARPers.
>>2887813>Hannah Arendt traces back to Max ShachtmanWhat the fuck is he talking about?
>>2887777NGL that was quite a good listen, anon.
>>2887835Yes. It's brain food. Forget what the haters think and enjoy it anyway.
>>2887776Manichaean worldview is the mentality of whiteness, idiot. Fanon literally talks about that shit in Wretched of the Earth. There’s no contradiction between what (you) and
>>2887087 are saying.
>>2887087>>2887776Why did Lyndon LaRouche got from Trot to fash?
>>2887776>anti-Stalinists and the entity>t.Also
all leftcoms are opposed to graham relative to few MLs
>>2887923>le stalin was le israel.tired meme pushed just like the holodomor, so called materialists ignoring every historical event to push a ideological narrative is funny.
>all leftcoms are opposed to grahamtheir opposition is very flimsy when they carry water for him by being tools like trotskiites.
>>2887929>ired meme pushed just like the holodomor, so called materialists ignoring every historical event to push a ideological narrative is funny.Google what was the first country to recognize Israel.
>>2887931google what country send weapons to the arabs in the subsequent wars.
>>2887932Sounds like they made a very dumb move in the first place. Sounds like their zionism got the best of them and it wasn't good realpolitik.
>>2887934sounds like you, general hindsight, knows what a political gamble that goes wrong is like.
you need to have political power to do these things however, something that is never gonna happen so all that is left is being a judgemental catty bitch.
>>2887932>send weapons to the arabs*sold
That was used to kill more Arab workers than Israelis btw
>>2887776>Young people: "The Republic is about Epstein class guys doing a late night secret cabal for anti-democracy pedophiles"Stalin was arguably a philosopher king FYI. Lenin and Mao too.
>>2888348Didn't Stalin fuck a teen girl?
the primary architect of the iraq war was donald rumsfeld and that guy was like human teflon, a man with a totally unimpeachable character. he had the ultimate good ol' boy reputation of a fine upstanding american hero who served in the us military with distinction his entire life, he had a very disarming personality and jovial manner of speaking that made him seem like a very reasonable and decent and down-to-earth man, and he had an incredible ability to dodge questions and deflect blame and minimize catastrophes and distort reality, and he would do it with such conviction that he himself seemed to believe it. even his most vocal critics who tried to confront him about the horrific consequences and tremendous costs of the war and the non-existence of the alleged weapons of mass destruction would quickly find themselves dazzled and incapacited by his verbal gymnastics, he was a silver-tongued devil, a true psychopath, one of the finest human instruments of evil that the american nationalist military state has ever produced.
>>2888777This reads like pasta.
>>2883323Will any of you celebrate when Wolfowitz dies?
>>2887845Didn't Marx have a PhD in classical Greek?
>>2887951What are you talking about?
>>2887776>Young people: "The Republic is about Epstein class guys doing a late night secret cabal for anti-democracy pedophiles"Interesting how there were no Straussians in the Epstein files.
>>2888878Which should make you question the assertion that if Epstein was a Mossad agent who was single-handedly puppeteering US foreign policy for decades how come NONE of the architects of the Iraq War appear in the files? Cheney, Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, etc. aren’t mentioned in the files. GWB is but there’s no evidence he did anything dirty with Epstein. Doesn’t Mearsheimer think the Iraq War was a war for Israel? If so, how does he prove it?
>>2887813Caleb browses leftypol and came across this thread.
>>2888878Bill Kristol keeps wanting more of the files released, because he hates Trump that much.
>>2888897All this means is that neocons are so evil they don’t need to be blackmailed to invade Arab countries.
>>2889517Interesting. What does he argue?
>>2889277She's not wrong.
>>2883310Who the fuck in Trump’s administration is a neocon?
>>2883675>>2884331>>2884891>>2885268>>2884925>>2887087Neocons despise ordinary people. Leo Strauss saw himself and his students/cult followers as philosopher kings who must deceive the masses in order to preserve their power. Most neocons were former Trotskyists and Trotsky, likewise, HATED the working-class. This is largely because neoconservatism is an expression of Jewish supremacy. Jews believe they are the "CHOSEN PEOPLE" and seek to preserve their ethnocentrism and tribalism against the universal brotherhood of man brought into the world by Christ. You can't separate these things.
>>2890007Uh most of them? Hegseth for one?
>>2889277I follow her, and she made a post right after this one saying no one would call it a cabal if Judith Butler had former students of hers working with Mamdani. As if the two are equivalent. Strauss literally told his students to deceive people. Butler doesn’t even teach poli sci but linguistics and she’s always promoted social Justice, anti-Zionism and human liberation.
>>2890010everybody believes they are the chosen people. every autonomous organism capable of independent thought assumes by default that it sits at the center of existence and that the universe exists outside of it and around it, that's just the nature of subjectivity. to overcome this false assumption requires a biological capacity for metacognition and a continuous exercise of mental discipline and humility that most people cannot or will not devote themselves to. everything you're saying about jews applies to every other human being who ever lived, because there are no jews, there's no such thing in physical reality as a jew, a jew is just an idea, there are only human beings and they are all pretty much the same.
>>2890015>to deceive people.Name a single government that doesn't lie to the people it rules over. Did the leaders of the USSR not lie?
>>2890010How did Trotsky “hate” ordinary people, exactly?
Also I’m autistic and we naturally hate 99% of humanity.
Someone send Maupin this thread so we can get his response.
>>2887776> Seeing militant working class people assert of their universal rights forced them into reactionary ideology to defend their hegemony.How does this explain someone like David Horowitz, who was raised in CPUSA, worked with the Panthers, and didn't become right-wing until the late 1970s?
>>2890010You say this, yet I believe you think the Palestinians are the people destined to redeem the world and "Palestine is the only issue that matters" or something.
>>2890010Why does it matter if they are “Jews”? If the neocons were all Irish Catholics, would you still hate them? If they were Pakistani Muslims? Palestinian comprador/national bourgeoisie? Is your beef with neocons, or is your beef with “Jews”?
Also, calling Strauss a “Jewish supremacist” makes no sense at all given that he had an Ancient Greek fetish. What did Trotsky say that indicated he was a “Jewish supremacist”, given you obviously know so much on the topic?
>>2887845This is correct. Socialists should embrace this.
>>2883323ChatGPT users deserve public execution.
>>2893110Iceland tried to ban circumcision and international Jewry threatened their tourism industry until they gave up lol
>>2892676Why does it matter?
>>2883310> Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith are still alive. Neocons Bill Kristol, Robert Kagan and John Bolton who were the top dogs in PNAC (Project for a New American Century), which called for massive military spending and preemptive attacksYeah you don't get charged with war crimes just for saying shit.
>>2893110>>2893215>international JewryFinally horseshit theory vindicated. Left & Right wings of capital unite!
>>2893110You seem to be obsessed with Jewish genitalia. Why?
>>2893110You think Bill Kristol underwent metzitzah b'peh as a baby?
>>2894099People still read that rag?
>>2894099Back in July, following an eight-month fetishization of Luigi Mangione on the far left, another gunman in New York City killed several people, including a mother of two school-age kids who happened to work at—uh-oh—Blackstone. It was, unambiguously, a horrifying tragedy. But on the Luigi Left, reaction to the gruesome murders was not only neutral, or ambivalent, but celebratory, and explicitly supportive of the killer. (One prototypical post featured the woman’s image with the word LUIGI’D stamped over her face, along with the caption “Death is not always tragic.”) This was no small group of crazies, either. Some version of the reaction was shared thousands of times across X, Threads, and Bluesky on the grounds that cartoonish caricatures of “the rich” were, in a sense, physically harming the poor. Therefore, killing the rich was an act of self-defense.
Question: Is this Abundance?
Potentially, I mean. Can this be Abundance? Can center-left liberals, who claim they want to introspect and reform and actually build a lot of housing and infrastructure, and generate new resources rather than punitively redistribute us all into stagnation, open their tent in such a way that there is room for committed, eat-the-rich communism and sensible housing policy alike? Can they not only wrench the youth of their party from Hasan Piker’s armpits, but actually get Hasan, a real authentic bad-boy socialist, to join them?
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/09/abundant-delusion/684124/The Article name,
Abundant Delusion should be their papers new name.
>>2893325>whyCan you blame him? Have you seen some of these gals? No disrespect, of course friends. They're usually highly intelligent compared to Ameri-goy white girls, and even their more modest / "nerdy" appearing woman know exactly what sex appeal means, and are excellent lovers. Many idealistic white men may get mad at me, an Iraqi, Muslim born communist saying this.
أني ما أؤيد هالموجة الجديدة من الصهيونية العدوانية ضد البوند اليهودي، وبالمقابل ما أدافع عن تاريخ العرب مع اليهود، ولا أعتقد أن للشيوعية مستقبل قائم بالمنطقة، لأن الوضع كله صار إما تطرف ديني أو عمليات نفسية ما تصدق.
>>2894868Is that woman a war criminal?
>>2894883I would bet money on it before I bet money against it. In all reality, I have no idea, I forgot the origin of the image. It was from social media.
>>2894868>comradeGPT translation كسم الضحك يا ابن المتناكة
>>2884925>Rule by intellectual elites AKA philosopher kings?Strauss defended liberal democracy.
This meme is so forced.
>>2892676>>2893110Keep this trash in 4/pol/.
>>2894907A.I has caused paranoia among people, it's already ruined the internet. Every time somebody is skeptical of something they say chatgpt or grok. you know, people still use other tools right? ive seen dumbasses go this is AI then they'd run the image through the a.i scanner, it comes up for 0 AI and they assume its real. meanwhile they're getting fooled by a picture that was photoshopped. You know you can just use a regular translator without AI? You can photoshop pictures. You can avoid a.i detection in texts with AI, so testing text is near pointless. A lot of people dont even believe whats real, and believe whats fake. Its bad.
>>2894909It's not a meme, this is the reality of marxist leninism
>>2895266>this is the reality of marxist leninismWhat?
>>2895271marxist-leninism is a remodeled updated version of philosopher kings ruling over society.
>>2894000He has the slimey jewface which makes me think yes
>>2883323What bullshit. The Holocaust architects got the death penalty even though they didn’t kill a single Jew themselves.
>>2895352Speer didn't even tho he was 120% guilty with evidence that appeared after the nuremberg trials
>>2895352Apples-and-oranges circumstances, dummy.
>>2893110I mean, isn't it similar with the burqa bans? Denmark bans the burqa even though only a handful of Muslim women in their country actually wear it, but we recognize the ban as being racially and xenophobically motivated, right? How would banning rituals performed by only a small number of Jews be any different?
>>2896181Based. Shitlibs should stop pretending that the Iraq war is bad because it is le illegal or based on le lies as opposed to the other good wars™️ they had
>>2896065Only like three or four of the top “neocons” were actually students of Strauss.
>>2883318>The “winners” of the war are never charged with war crimestruth nuke
>>2883318>Also, Israel is far more evil than America.false nuke not in the sense that you're being mean to israel, but in the sense that you're being nice to america
>>2896174religion shouldn't be pandered to. Israel genociding Palestinians is way more important of a thing that should be opposed than Denmark trying and failing to ban burqas or Iceland trying and failing to ban circumcision. diversity is fine in the sense that nobody should be oppressed for their race or sexuality or nationality but religion is different because it is a highly political thing that compels people to discriminate against others.
>>2886099you couldn't critique Americas war crimes until recently either. America is worse, pretending otherwise means you're stupid or addicted to Instagram reels.
>>2883664To be fair, this conspiracy was popularized by Shadia Drury who is a Palestinian woman.
>>2894099Yeah I mean the neocon GOP was more about virtue and moralfaggong while the Trumpist GOP is more about conspiracy theories.
>>2896791In Natural Right and History, Leo Strauss argues that modern relativism — especially historicism and positivism — undermines the very idea of objective moral truth. He defends the classical tradition of natural right, particularly as developed by Plato and Aristotle, which holds that there is a permanent, knowable standard of justice rooted in human nature. Strauss believes modern political thought lost its way by rejecting this idea and instead grounding right in changing historical contexts or subjective preferences. He critiques thinkers like Hobbes and Locke for reducing natural right to self-preservation and utility, and he calls for a return to the ancients' more noble conception of virtue and reason as the basis for political order. For Strauss, rediscovering natural right is essential to resisting nihilism and restoring serious moral and political philosophy.
In other words, Strauss was a giant moralfag just like Maupin.
>>2897039why does maupin hate him? both were moralist, cared about traditions, started cults with diciples …
>>2897039Okay and how does this lead one to neocon thinking and belief America has a “moral” duty to invade other countries to spread democracy and capitalism or whatever?
>>2897057>started cults with diciples …What cult? You mean forming close relationships with his students and teaching them the great books? That's just what we Jews do. We greatly admire our teachers in Jewish tradition and our teachers feel a strong sense of commitment to their students. The sages of old did this (example: Rabbi Akiva). That's literally our culture.
>>2897062Ask Drury because she will probably give you a better answer than I could. AKA she will pull something out of her ass.
>>2897039So basically, exactly what zoomers want only thru call it “empathy” rather than moral absolutism.
>>2897065>You mean forming close relationships with his students and teaching them the great books? Sorry but even if there was nothing weird going on a professor creating little cliques of his students is still not an appropriate way for an educator to act. The lines get blurred between students and teachers way too much and people don’t see how it ignores boundaries.
>>2897604It's fine actually
>>2897039So why do you see this way of thinking so much with Evangelicals but not with Catholics?
>>2896287>Iraq war is bad because it is le illegal or based on le lies as opposed to the other good wars™️ they hadTrue in general, but appealing to these institutions can be a good rhetorical tactic sometimes. Same reason we cite bourgeoisie academic sources.
>>2897604So profs forming reading groups with their students after class is “predatory” now?
>>2897610>>2897703Power imbalances are a problem even in friendships. You never see 50-60 year olds with high amounts of social power hanging around 20-year olds in any other context.
>>2897742Power imbalances hurr durr muh age gap zzzzzzzzzzzz
>>2897793Zoomer moralists will soon call for a return to arranged marriages and a hereditary caste system in order to prevent power imbalances in everyday relationships, I swear.
>>2897798So because the victims of other wars can't get justice, the victims of the Iraq War shouldn't?
>>2897742A long time ago people used to hang out in mixed sex/age environments. It was good because the older people could drop wisdom on the youngins. Not anymore tho.
>>2897742Intellectuals don't have "high amounts of social power" in America where intellectualism is shunned and mocked.
>>2897604You never hung out with your professors after class just to chat and get lunch?
>>2897916Yes no one deserves bourgeois justice
>>2897992Why not? Justify your statement.
>>2897993Because reformists like you need to be impaled for imperialism to forever end, instead of fighting its social roots that is inherent to our social order you run cover for it by sacrificing so called war "criminals" for the maintenance of the whole system.
>>2897996If Iraqi victims of the Bush invasion get some sort of justice, it will help de-legitimize US imperialism. Also, are you against Holocaust reparations, or reparations for Black folks for slavery, or reparations for indigenous folks for colonization/genocide? Hell, would you be against giving the Palestinians reparations?
>>2897543Natural Right is a metaphysical argument, empathy largely is not.
>>2898007I'm an Iraqi victim, shove your bourgeois justice up your ass
>>2883348 >>2898010Why are you against bringing your oppressors to justice?
You think GWB and Wolfowitz and the rest of them are better off dying as free men with clean hands rather than being sued to oblivion or spending time in prison for war crimes?
>>2898015>>2898015>You think GWB and Wolfowitz and the rest of them are better off dying as free men with clean handsYes, but unfortunately that's not the case and we got shitlibs like you running around and absolving capital by transferring the blame to this or that great man as intended and instructed by your ruling class. Enjoy celebrating their peaceful deaths and acting like the debt is paid tho as that's the only protest you're capable of
>>2898019What the he’ll are you talking about?
>>2898019So if your parents were murdered by a serial killer, you wouldn't want the perpetrator to go to prison because AAAAAA muh bourg criminal justice system?
>>2898302Obviously not because you can never be tactical or pragmatic ever.
>>2887813I tried looking up stuff on Max Shachtman and he’s virtually an enigma. No one even knows where the guy is buried FFS. How does someone who had so much influence on American politics have so little info about his life?
You don’t suppose he was an intelligence agent, do you?
>>2898330>Implying anyone involved or mentioned here are left-wing even by American standardsYou know the Democrats pretended to be "left" wing under Obama righ? Even though there was always a socialist contingent under the surface, you know… actual leftists? There's a thing called "centrists" and "the center right" for a reason: because it's not fully all the way right wing, but it's definitely not left wing either.
>>2898334Correction: "under surface" I should have wrote "hidden away" or "underground" and "repressed". Etc etc
>>2898334Mumia isn’t left-wing?
>>2898339If you're writing a letter telling political prisoners of a regime currently under attack by the most reactionary imperialist force in history to aid that imperialist force into turning your own country into Syria… then no. I would say you aren't left wing. Also you're writing a letter alongside Angela Davis, who is retarded.
>>2898343>Angela davisFor some reason I read that as "Angela Nagle", which is someone actually retarded. Angela Davis is based. Unfortunately she is wrong on this imo, but only by being an agnostic anti-campist.
>>2898302>>2898309You're a liberal zionist
>>2898355How so? Explain.
>>2898330>Judith ButlerThis one hurts…
>>2898488What does this have to do with Judith Butler?
>>2898493I don't care about the letter, I just think Angela Davis is retarded and CIA
>>2898494Post-structuralism is for faggots
>>2898497Queer theory helped me discover and embrace my trans identity, asshole.
>>2898497You think Angela is a neocon now?
>>2898499False consciousness
>>2898500No, she's such a revolutionary that she just so happens to be employed by the most elite American educational institutions.
She's also an amazing revolutionary for sucking off CIA asset Jim Jones in the 1970s. So radical!!
>>2898502Prove Angela Davis is a CIA agent.
>>2898330>Maupin was right. Rockhill was rightContradictory statements. Syncretic fash and Gabe cannot both be correct.
>>2898583That doesn't prove shit.
>>2898658Maybe not if you’re retarded
>>2898497>I don't care about the letter, I just think Angela Davis is retarded and CIAmassive and obvious goalpost shift
>>2898660How can I shift the goalposts if that was my first post in the thread?
>>2898659>her PhD advisor worked for the CIA once before they became the CIA, that MUST make her a CIA agent too!You're the retarded one here.
>>2883679Damn, I'm so old I remember watching this exact doc on YouTube in like 2008.
>>2898008Natural Right is empathy dressed in metaphysics.
>>2898790
>especially that spook Marcuse who pioneered the Western left towards intersectional garbage more than anyone else.
Laughably false
>>2898678You’re right. It’s a pure coincidence, everyone knows a couple OSS/CIA guys, no biggie, especially that spook Marcuse who pioneered the Western left towards intersectional garbage more than anyone else. Nothing to see here, folks. Coupled with her privileged position at one of the most elite American bourgeoisie educational institutions, she is a true revolutionary through and through! Onward to dismantling WHITE SUPREMACY (and sucking off CIA mind control experiments like Jim Jones for some reason lol).
>>2898794None of this proves she’s CIA. You think Judith Butker is also “CIA?”
>>2898967Now he gave you plenty of arguments to work with yet you chose to act like nothing changed?
Go on now, on to the proper reply.
>>2897057Every accusation is a confession.
>>2887087>>2897039And why did he think a virtuous society can only be enforced through rule of philosopher kings?
Anarchists reject social hierarchy largely based on their strong moral beliefs.
>>2899032Fink thinks prison abolition is a CIA-planted ideology? Please.
>>2899058Abolishing prison during the capitalist mode of production is retarded. Fink is right.
>>2899062Prisons are an integral part of capitalism. Prison abolition and the replacement of prisons with community care is a huge step towards the implementation of socialism.
Also, isn’t Finkelstein a liberal Zio who’s also deeply transphobic? Fuck him.
>>2883310>>2883664Yeah I mean technically weren’t the Bolsheviks a cabal?
>>2899099They were pretty open about their objectives and methods while being the tip of the masses spear so I would say no even if they did some scheming like the october revolution
>>2899124They organized in secret and that’s what makes them a cabal, dumbass.
Sad
Hehe
>>2897057Caleb’s obsession with mass-production and MOAR STUFF (which he borrowed entirely from Lyndon LaRouche) has no moral element to it. Producing loads of vegetables and steel isn’t going to condition the population into taking up a Christian moral worldview in itself.
>>2899063>Prisons are an integral part of capitalism. Prison abolition and the replacement of prisons with community care is a huge step towards the implementation of socialism.Retarded radlib moral idealism.
>deeply transphobicBased and anti-false consciousness.
Also, Finkelstein is absolutely correct in that image. American imperialism deliberately let the October 7 attacks happen as a catalyst for a second restructuring of the Middle East. Hamas is a boogeyman creation of Israel the same way al-Qaeda is a boogeyman creation of America. October 7 = 9/11 part 2 electric boogaloo
>>2899063i used to have a more naive view about jails and prisons until i actually spent some time in jail for drug possession and got to know a lot of inmates personally. most of them weren't bad people and were just unlucky and had fucked up lives and became drug addicts/alcoholics or they were schizophrenic and had some major psychotic episode that landed them in jail, etc. but there were a few that were legitimately evil, like unreformable psychopaths who genuinely enjoy hurting people and like to rape little girls and mutilate animals and shit. there's definitely a lot more people in jail/prison than there needs to be, there's no question about that, but i wouldn't go as far as to abolish them entirely because there's some sick motherfuckers out there. and the scary part is, the psychopaths are not nearly as easy to spot as one might think, the ones i encountered seemed like very nice reasonable normal people who didn't seem to belong in jail at all, and i wouldn't have even known had the other inmates not quietly pulled me aside and said something like, "hey, you don't want to be seen talking to that guy, he got locked up for giving a 9-year-old a clit piercing and eating her out" and i'd realize what a terrible judge of human character i was
Unique IPs: 94