/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

How social-facist is this new unaccountable party?
They don't obviously state they want to join the EU or support Ukraine (yet), but are somehow supported by all the pro-EU parties, and academics always are some of the most reactionary elements of the petty bourgeoisie, especially when it comes to securing their "earned" social status

>>2939802
>marxist
but why even take them at their word? "student" political movement in my country went from being "more communist than the (comintern) communists" by claiming themselves to be "anarcho-trotsko-maoists" to calling for the bombing of Serbia in the name of "humanitarian interventionism" in a few decades

Any leftist among the students list?
Or is it your standard eastern european "anti-corruption" centrists?

>>2940086
>leftist
Not a thing in post-soviet countries obviously, because local porkies who privatized represent every flavor political party and push their own agenda through them. More so ex-"communists" who pretend to be modern left are the worst because they managed to accumulate the largest capital after system change

>>2940086
looks like it's the same exact same platform Zelensky ran as (the first and only time), where it's publicly "anti-corruption" (whatever that means) and doesn't mention or even pretends to seek compromise in any controversial issues regarding Russia, then slowly turn around

>>2940091
Albania and Russia one struggle

>>2939801
Our EUrocrat warmonger neoliberals are celebrating that the "students" won against the "permanently ruling democracy despiser".
When they say "democrat" and "democracy" they mean "bourgeois-liberal" and "liberalism" btw.

>>2940149
Vucic sold weapons to both Ukraine and Israel.

>>2939801
They are a social-democratic left-liberal reformist soft-nationalist movement essentially

Instead of pushing Vučić's line how these are CIA funded color revolutionaries, read their programme, it's available, some 50 pages. Here's the content. The state this board is in is so bad, that people think the Merkel installed eurotechnocrat Vučler is anti-West. FFS the guy introduced sanctions on Cuba. The only people that support Vučić from the "left" in Serbia is the RNP-F, and their line lost last night. The poors don't support Vučič they support t he students. Cope and seethe international liberalty

1. Freeing the courts and prosecution through a Special Prosecutorial Police
   

A vetted police unit to investigate corruption and arrest those responsible without political obstruction, freeing judges and prosecutors from political pressure; a comprehensive review of the Ministry of the Interior, removal of officials linked to organised crime, and dismissal of police officers who broke the law in dealing with protesting students and citizens.

1. Law on the origin and confiscation of illegally acquired assets, and lustration of public officials
   

Strengthening the Tax Administration to investigate the assets of public officials and return stolen public money to the budget; holding accountable officials who abused their position, engaged in corruption or violated human rights, the Constitution and the law.

1. Full transparency of public procurement and audit of government projects
   

Publication of all contracts and tenders, strengthening of the State Audit Institution, and audit of non-transparent and overpriced infrastructure projects, with emphasis on secret contracts, lex specialis laws and projects that missed their deadlines.

1. Freeing the media Unblocking and depoliticising the Regulatory Authority for Electronic Media (REM);
   

freeing RTS; investigating the responsibility of journalists and management of state and private broadcasters for discrimination and hate speech; reallocation of national broadcasting frequencies and a stronger role for the Press Council.

1. Professional employment and departisation of the public sector Ending party-based employment, introducing strict competitive examinations, appointing proven experts rather than party loyalists to head public enterprises, and introducing strict financial control.
   
2. Innovation in education and free textbooks
   

Investment in modern curricula, critical thinking and practical skills; free textbooks for all primary and secondary school pupils, and affordable school trips and extracurricular activities.

1. Knowledge economy and support for domestic entrepreneurs and farmers
   

Linking universities, institutes and professional associations with industry; grants and subsidies for start-ups, innovation, domestic entrepreneurs and farmers, to move from a cheap-labour model to a high-value economy.

1. Permanent contracts after 12 months
   

Amending the Labour Law to reduce the maximum duration of fixed-term employment from 24 to 12 months.

1. Ending the import lobby's monopoly and ensuring food security
   

Tackling import lobbies accused of distorting the relationship between retail prices and production costs; protecting agricultural land and water as national assets guaranteeing food security.

1. Affordable housing for young couples and underfunded professions
   

Flats with favourable rent and purchase terms, with tax relief for young families and employees in education and healthcare.

1. Affordable medicines and a doctor in every village
   

State control and a sharp reduction in medicine prices, renovation of rural clinics and health centres, and employment of young doctors and technicians.

I'm kinda surprised by the reactions in this thread. I would have expected people obsessed by geopolitics to understand Serbia better.

Vučić was an opportunist who shook the hand of Putin regularly while selling weapons to Ukraine and Israel and welcomed the proposal of Jared Kushner to tear down the buildings of Belgrade bombed in 1999 by NATO kept as remembrance in the city center, to build a Trump Tower there, and Vučić justified this by saying "we need to get a better relationship with the US" (in case you are unaware, a very similar proposal involving a natural reserve sparked the current protests in Albania).

Is this the anti-imperialism you want so badly? Seriously?
How the students were supposed "to push SNS to the left?", lmao? This is MAGA communism tier delusion.
What "compromise on any controversial issues regarding Russia" Serbia has to deal with? Serbia is not Ukraine, there aren't Russian separatist groups operating in Vojvodina or anything. Serbs tend to see Russians as their big brothers because both are Orthodox, and both hate NATO, they don't have issues with them. The real geopolitical problem for Serbia is the Kosovo question, if they have a beef with someone, it's Albania (who is pro-NATO and hates its communist past, unlike Serbia).

People talk about the student movement, but while it started with students reacting to the collapse of the Novi Sad's train station canopy, it ended up encompassing many fractions of the population, including Yugoslavia war veterans, who still remember what happened to their country in 1999.
Is it so unfathomable for you that people might not like it when the infrastructure of their own country is rotting because of corruption? When people are opposed to destroying a natural reserve in order to build lithium mines for the profit of Rio Tinto? Especially at a time when protests in Europe are getting more and more widespread?

>>2940149
Bro, you are German, you are part of the country which profits the most from Brussels' technocracy at the expense of Southern Europe, your left is in shambles and pro-Israel, AfD is getting more popular that ever, maybe it's time for you to take care of your own country first instead of bemoaning a successful protest movement which actually achieved one of their goals.

>>2940189
idk how you can blame people for being cynical about Serbia going hard pro-NATO a la Ukraine after this, there has been a lot of "gen z/student protests" that just hand their country to the evil empire and people will be pleasantly surprised if this doesn't but do we really think this won't if we're being totally honest??

>>2940189
Chill. I wasn't even voicing an opinion of my own, just quoting EUrocrat neoliberals, or "Brussels technocrats", as you call them.

>>2940182
This is pretty good, very pragmatic and basically aims to resolve the immediate problems people had after 11 years of Vučić, regarding justice, nepotism, housing costs, development and foreign lobbies.
Hope they will manage to put it into practice for real though, because after the euphoria of victory, there is always the actual problem of implementing all of this, that will make or break the newly elected "student coalition".

I expect some people here to seethe at the "grants and subsidies for start-ups" part of the program, but when it's China or Vietnam doing this, it's genuine communism, so go figure.

>>2940195
>Serbia going hard pro-NATO a la Ukraine
Where are the proofs of this? I told you a lot of Yugoslav war veterans supported the movement against Vučić. Do you think they are pro-NATO? Do you know what happened in 1999 in Serbia?

You don't have to walk around very long in Belgrade to see a "смрт нато" graffiti or sticker. Things are more complicated than you think, and maybe your binary geopolitical framing is too simplistic to understand what is happening in Serbia.
Or actually, it's not complicated at all. Serbs have been protesting for the same reasons French, Italian, Spanish and Albanian people are protesting right now, and they have been successful so far. It's that simple.

But it seems that on /leftypol/, only Western countries are allowed to be dissatisfied with their own governments (and when they do, they are always a bunch of lumpens and liberals so there is no winning ever basically).
Non-western countries should eat shit and bow to their national bourgeoisie eternally according to /leftypol/ because that will make world conditions more favorable for communism perhaps during the next millennia or something. Maybe you should understand that most people around the world aren't as drunk on niche terminally-online ideology like this and don't see things that way because they care about their own well-being and not abstract grand narratives.

It has been a good day. Leftist won in Serbia and Brazil.

>>2940209
Yeah it’s great if you like social fascism and Russian genocide

>>2940178
Sounds like the average leftoidpoler then

>>2940211
>Russian genocide
LMAO
Take a walk around the fortress in Belgrade, you will see stalls with boomers selling pro Putin t-shirts. Go buy one if you are so worried about Russians getting genocided in Serbia.
The main reason why some Serbs might dislike Russians is because a lot of them expatriated there after the war started, which increased rents a lot. But Ukrainians are part of this problem too.
Anyway, it's ultimately the fault of landlords increasing rents while wages are stagnant and it's not an uniquely Serbian problem, it's a worldwide problem.

>>2940211
>every country should serve Russia to their own detriment

Russian bots are mentally ill. They are not even comprehend reality but just barometric intuition what regime is friendly to Putin and what isn't. Like Lula is neutral despite being BRICS ally so they expect that Bolsonaro will be a better choice for Russia simply because of Trumpism. Russofasicm is tiresome…

Serbian students are hot. Glad they won.

>>2940232
>hot
They are ugly doe

>>2940211
>russian genocide
Son

>>2940182
>The state this board is in is so bad
There were people on this board arguing the Malagasy protests a year ago (against a porky president with dual french citizenship) was a pro-IMF anti-multipolarista color revolution
They're hopeless man
>>2940225
Worse. Imagine carrying water for people selling weapons to Ukraine lmao.

I don't know why the mutipolar retards are crying the students said they wouldnt put sancations on russia

Our victory is eliciting the exact amount of seethe i expected it to from this hellboard. Cry about it faggots, your multipoggers fascism will not pass in Serbia.

>>2940208
>Hope they will manage to put it into practice for real though, because after the euphoria of victory, there is always the actual problem of implementing all of this, that will make or break the newly elected "student coalition".
As long as they keep the liberal wing of the student movement castrated and impotent the left (which has a semblance of any program anywhere in Serbia) will hold the line. I've been keeping up with the inner workings of the student movement and since day one they said no to any kind of liberashka nonsense: no to an expert government, no to the pro-EU-opposition. Questionnaires give that only 2% of the student supporters want more EU investing while it's like 10-15% for Vučić. Moreover the same questionnaire told us that poorer and working class people support the students while white-collar and bureaucrats support Vućler.

>>2940189
>to build a Trump Tower there
They even built an Elbit Systems (Israeli) drone factory somewhere in Vojvodina apparently. But these are le productive forces to our multipolaroids I guess

>>2940189
I’m doubtful when it comes to protests, especially when they seem to be particularly well co-ordinated and have the immediate goal of the current leadership resigning and replacing them with some random pro-West guy who’s apparently the people’s elect. Because that’s not democracy even by liberal standards, even if you have 10,000 people with banners and pitchforks filling a town square, that’s neither an election nor the majority of people eligible to vote, but it does get shitlibs around the world shedding a tear over the historic act of superior direct democracy they claim can’t happen at home.

However, elections are harder to rig and sneak a coup through. Absolutely they can be influenced and they are, but generally it seems it’s just the supposed Economic Silver Bullet that is EU membership and it only being possible for nations which adopt policies that Brussels selects.

I suspect though the concern that Serbia is going pro-NATO now is that, although the EU and NATO are separate entities and you don’t strictly have to be a member of both.. for all intents and purposes the EU is the people pleaser while NATO membership is the goal and you can’t at this stage have the former without the latter. Otherwise you’re welcoming a state that does business with Russia into the single market.

Maybe this new elected government can navigate the pressure to go full NATO while satisfying the desire for better economic conditions which will be influenced by the EU even if not via membership, but Serbia will have been the first country to achieve that goal since the end of the Cold War.

>>2940211
>Russian genocide
I wish this was happening.

>>2940280
>replacing them with some random pro-West guy
The student movement has no leader. It's directly organized via student plenums and citizen assemblies.

Swear to Marx people would have been calling 1905 a German color revolution against the developmentalist czar.

>>2940313
That’s a hypothetical situation which would be correctly labelled a colour revolution

>>2940315
Fuck off liberashka. The student movement purged the pro-EU liberals in the initial few months when the movement started. The student list is against EU imperialism. The liberal wing of the student movement, which participated in performative actions like the excursions to Brussels were only given media attention because the media is owned by the EU imperialists. You are a victim of a psyop.

>the pro-NATO neoliberal ghoul getting run out of office is actually le bad because something something color revolution

I swear "multipolarity" induces some kind of aggressive brain worms in people

>>2940316
I think you’ve misunderstood my post, I was saying the election isn’t a colour revolution because those don’t have elections.

>>2910658
truth singularity, milošević is the single biggest reason yugoslavia collapsed but was able to use the nato bombings to rile up blood and soil chuds into thinking he wasn't just a more genocidal gorbachev

>Maybe this new elected government can navigate the pressure to go full NATO while satisfying the desire for better economic conditions which will be influenced by the EU even if not via membership
And this is the key point I’m making. EU membership or not, better economic conditions almost certainly includes better relations with the EU, but of course that’s conditional.

>>2940211
>lula is doing russian genocide
russians are actual israelites holy shit

>New government pledges to stop arms sales to conflict zones (including Israel and Ukraine)
Oh no polaroidzizters I was told this was a heckin crayon revolution
How can this be!?

>>2940280
>I’m doubtful when it comes to protests, especially when they seem to be particularly well co-ordinated
Broski, the protests began 2 years ago almost day for day. It was originally a non-partisan movement, everyone wanted Vučić out, but distrusted the Democratic Party as well.
This is not the first time a diffuse movement like this emerged in Europe, but in the end, they had no choice but to present an institutional list if they wanted to last. They were still debating if they should do this last year and some parts of the "student" movement were against it by fear of being co-opted.
They are co-ordinated because Serbs aren't stupid orcs, are rather well educated politically due to their peculiar history (even if they go full schizo about the Vatican sometimes), and it's a small country of 8 million people with trains.
Hell when Vučić last year suddenly stopped all the trains right before the biggest protest of the year due to a mysterious "terrorist threat" involving someone planting "bombs" on every single railroad in the country, some protestors reached Belgrade by canoes and bikes. You need to understand the determination of Serbs when they are pissed off against something.

I can't take the rest of your post seriously, it's just the usual multipolarista slop. It's so funny how you all applaud the eternal election of the well-established socdem Lula, whose coalition had power for basically the last 20 years aside of the little Bolsonaro moment, all while painting in the abstract social democrats as social fascists, but once a new bottom-up movement made majoritaroly from the regular proletariat gain power, you are immediately distrustful. It's like most communists don't like it when a proletarian movement actually gain power. You people are a bundle of neurotic contradictions.

>>2940320
In 1999-2000, /leftypol/ would have said:
>Noooooo, you don't understand, Milošević is a socialist, that's literally in the name of his party!!!! He was part of the communist party for 30 heckin years!!!! What do you mean he wants to privatize state companies????? Noooo, he is anti-imperialist, noooooo pls support, don't burn the parliament, nooooo, nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!

>>2940316
This is your candidate, yeah?
https://n1info.rs/svet/marta-kos-na-sastanku-sa-rektorom-djokicem-univerziteti-moraju-ostati-mesta-kritickog-razmisljanja-i-otvorene-debate/

>>2940392
Read you daft cunt
>>2940316
>performative actions like the excursions to Brussels were only given media attention because the media is owned by the EU imperialists

N1 is the mouth piece for EU lobbyists. Đokić isn't even on the student list. A fucking EU-crat said something, this means students will genocide Russians in Serbia. You are literally mind broken.

>>2940392
Đokić was literally presented by Vučić to appease the student rebellion and it failed.

>>2940392
Actually the anti imperialist zigger Vuvic has been overseeing the process of Serbia entering the EU since a decade while doing IMF shock therapies to progress, it's why they already are at chapter 26 and the EU sends this nice slovenian lady to talk with the rector

Damn. This thread is a massive redpill on the absolute state of this hellsite

>>2939802
Why did you write grassroots movement in quotes? It was not formed by an existing institution and it is composed of many students across all public universities in the country, except for the one in Kosovo. Or do you mean that a non-marxist movement cannot be grassroots by definition? I don't see why that would be like that.
>>2940319
The Bulldozer revolution (which is called just "the 5th of October" in Serbia) is considered the original color revolution but it involved the USA-backed opposition winning an election against Milosevic which he then tried to blatantly steal after the votes were already counted to be in favor of the opposition.
The stronger argument against this being a color revolution is that the West usually blatantly supports them while there is no such support here.
But the real reason is of course that this is a directly democratic student movement making its own decisions at meetings any student can come to. Color revolutions are by definition supposed to take resources and orders from the West, and this is not the case here.
>>2940229
What does he have to do with anything?

>>2940313
>>2940316
>>2940378
That posts is not describing the Student movement like that, but talking about protests in general and saying the Student movement is not like that.

>>2940392
No? He's literally not on the candidate list. He was on a draft of it at some point, but he was vetoed.

>big tent slopulist party defeats big tent slopulist party
nothingburger

>>2940544
>the West usually blatantly supports them while there is no such support here.
How do you know that there is no not-so-blatant-overt support though? In Serbia of all places, the home country of OTPOR?
Don't get me wrong, I dont know anything about Serbian politics and I do not want to spoil anything for you guys if it's really a genuine leftist thing. However "soft power" glowies are no joke and infiltrating something that is open to literally anyone is a very low hanging fruit for them. Just be fucking careful to not end up as useful idiots ok. Too many did before.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonviolent_resistance#Concepts

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otpor