>>578299Luka has saved the day
All hail the Union of Russia, Belarus, and soon… Ukraine!!!
>>578284 (me)
Internally, whatever struggles were had are not gonna be publicized and the part that was ,the coup and the Prigozhin hissyfit, were probably a psyop to cover it up.
>>578287Prigozhin is gonna become butthurt doomer poster pals with Strelkov after both got told to sit the fuck down by their goverment.
>>578345>He's exiled. Wagner is no more. It's being absorbed into the army.Wagner was being absorbed into the army anyway, and it is just one of his enterprises. Prigo was a Kremlin insider porky decades before he got into the PMC business. That's why none of this made any sense, even if the scheme was such that the MoD was really going to take away his Wagner profits, that's just one , however juicy, of his insider bsns. It's not worth making himself an enemy of the state that still pays his contracts all over.
>>578536>>578532My main assumption right now is that NATO or the CIA bombed Wagner's troops and made it look like Russia did it, i don't see why Putin would do that and i also can't imagine Prigo blowing his own stuff up just for a pretext.
May sound conspiratorial but it's the only thing that makes sense to me rn.
>>578547anon that's dumb
90% RAF did it and it's a perfectly logical thing to do if you have coup forces headed to your capital
10% Prigozhin did it as a false flag
>>578566Oh, I might be stupid.
If you're talking about the initial claim, that was almost certainly a fake pretext by Prigozhin lol. The only proof was a crappy video of nothing happening in the middle of nowhere with one guy laying around.
About on par with Ukrainian "proofs" of warcrimes.
>>578586Liberal mask slipping after all the pretending they have principles is always worth a smirk.
But those that feels smug towards liberals, because they actually have some themselves, need to be reminded that liberals achieved hegemony for a reason.
>>578602I don't get it.
>Wagner rightoids are good when they're on our side<Wagner rightoids are bad when they go against our sideLiberals and Z-gang use the same reasoning. I'm not even saying it's bad, it's just ruthless pragmatism which comes naturally in conflicts like this.
>Whataboutismreddit word
>>578629The /ukraine/-multipolarista-zigga position was always that Wagner can be tolerated as long as it is incidentally on the side of multipolarity in Ukraine and Africa
Liberals have been saying Wagner is ontologically evil because of a jpeg of some bald dude with SS tattoos, and if you have four people and a nazi at a table you have five nazis etc
Not really the same
>>5786611) How can you prove that he truly wanted a coup and it wasn't just that he expected wagner to get dissolved anyways so he tried to get some leverage?
2) a couple thousand armed men with tanks and shit is not a small force (especially in a country that's already waging a war), good luck organizing one in a first world country
3) wdym of course a party is possible to create you dingus and no you're not some fucking solid snake type figure, go join a communist party and make it a mass thing or shut the fuck up.
>>579046He was no doubt
appearing weak when he was strong.
Kasyrov
https://t.me/s/RKadyrov_95I thought some people could be trusted. That they sincerely love their Motherland as real patriots to the marrow of their bones. But it turned out that for the sake of personal ambitions, benefits and because of arrogance, people can not give a damn about affection and love for the Fatherland.
I talked with Prigozhin, urging him to leave his business ambitions and not mix them with matters of national importance. I thought that he heard me, but it turns out that this anger in him has only grown all this time. A chain of unsuccessful deals in entrepreneurship caused a hidden and long-lasting resentment in the businessman, which reached a peak when the authorities of St. Petersburg did not provide his daughter with the desired land. The arrogance of one person could lead to such dangerous consequences and draw a large number of people into the conflict.
I call on all PMC fighters to continue to be sober in their decisions. Think about the future of the country, about your families and children. Such actions can lead to disastrous results. Now everything ended peacefully, without bloodshed, but it could happen. The extreme measure would be the harsh suppression and destruction of anyone who encroaches on the integrity of the Russian Federation.
>>579095It would have been funnier if Prigozhin was adopted by Kadyrov instead of Luka, but only on condition that he converts to Islam
Kadyrov, his Big Son Ramzan, and his other Big Son Prigozhin
>>579166серьёзно
а в 80-х он сидел, короче он не из обоймы выстреливших на прихватизации успешных менеджеров (но с криминалом 100% был замешан)
The U.S. is set to delay new sanctions on Russian paramilitary group Wagner after its founder and leader launched an uprising against the Kremlin, people familiar with the matter said Saturday, fearing a delay could inadvertently help President Vladimir Putin.
“Washington does not want to appear to be taking sides in this,” a person familiar with the postponement said.
The State Department had planned to announce new designations on Wagner’s gold business in Africa on Tuesday, including on a mining operation set up by the group in the Central African Republic, these people said.
https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/russia-wagner-prigozhin-putin/card/u-s-to-delay-new-sanctions-on-wagner-for-fear-of-siding-with-putin-j1EeoFqeLaWE2tO4m6uY>>579282>Does China count as "periphery" anymore?Here's one way of looking at it
I'm guessing it's semi-periphery but at the same time, it is changing so fast that maybe it'll redefine global capitalist relations anyway. When is the last time over a billion people developed so rapidly?
>>579305It actually is
Really sincerely I am not playing it up like I was for our new friend NAFO fellows this time
>>579382>I didn't get excited for nothing!>I'm not retarded! You're retarded!lol
lmao
Memba Jan.6? I memba.
>>579382>shows some deep rifts in Russia's ruling class. It seems to have made Russia look unstable, not divided.
I'd say 2020 and January 6th shows what deep rifts in the ruling class looks like. That's not a country even at war besides with itself
>>579405More like made Prigozhin look unstable.
Wagner did not exist in 2014, and wasn't Putin's personal fascist Praetorian Guard, not was it a loose association of mercenary corporations. It somehow only appeared midway into last year, and restaurant porky at its head went from suing Bellingcat journalist for saying he is associated with a PMC (that did not exist, and only had a single unsourced headshot as proof) to just non-stop, terminally online shitposting. Except it's not a PMC at all, it's Russian black bag special forces, except no, it's where Russian Army rejects go to get a second chance.
>>579382>Why are people acting like this was a nothing burger tho? That's just the social media discourse of "owning" each other. Hopefully we'll get a glimpse of what was going on behind the curtain in the following days or weeks. Rybar is already speculating that Prigozhin actually "won", for example. But, who knows. The only thing that is for sure, is that the worst possible scenario for everyone involved would have been a full military confrontation.
So,for example, it would make sense if, assuming the events had some rooting in internal strife and weren't a full psyop, that the factions were playing chicken,relentlessly escalating and matching each other, brinksmanship with the integrity of the state and, *someone* lost the race and slammed the breaks first.
>>579450There were people with ziplock ties in the burger senate looking for them
I don't care why they did it, it was beautiful
>>579430I said January 6th demonstrated a divided ruling class, Wagner mutiny did not.
Keep in mind January 6th was the president of the US leading a protest at the legislature over certifying election results. Wagner didn't actually represent a government fighting itself, Wagner is a state proxy
>>579494>Absolute chads.They were petty bourgeoise fascists.
>>579497>I said January 6th demonstrated a divided ruling class, Wagner mutiny did not. No I guess it only made a large portion of the ruling class literally shit themselves and high tail it out of Moscow before cutting a deal to keep power. Totally not some major rift going on, especially when the military meant to stop this force just, you know let all by.
>>579534We have no info on any of this yet, so its pointless to argue, but what we can see is that there was something going on within the leadership of Russia in the last 24 hours, and that itself cannot just be written off as some minor event.
>>579538What were they then? Enlighten us.
>>579521>Totally not some major rift going on, especially when the military meant to stop this force just, you know let all by.My god, the dumb libtards repeating this dumb point all day. This situation ended with potentially no one getting killed (imaginary helecopters and airstrikes no one has footage of not-withstanding) and you're trying to take a victory lap of:
>Why didn't Putler just bomb Rostov to the ground! So weak!Btw:
>gachimuchiThis is bloodgasm using a new flag isn't it?
>>579574yeah bro trust me only 10 people was in capitol
source :my ass
>>579552Ok then, so by this logic, since no one died, i guess nothing happened? Totally uneventful 24 hours. C'mon, you guys aren't that bright here but you can't be this stupid to eat up this bullshit.
>Why didn't Putler just bomb Rostov to the ground! So weak!Why would he? That would just cause everything they feared would happen if they did not appease Wagner. So they quickly capitulated.
>>579599I like to check in on the common rabble from time to time.
>>579674It wasn't even a coup, it was a protest movement for more shells for the frontlines
I suspect without evidence that it was quite succesful
>>579662I brought it up specifically to counter the accusation that we would be creaming ourselves over civil unrest in the West. Because it was just as irrelevant as Prigo's stunt.
I don't why others took it to mean anything else, they're retarded. Also /isg/ and /USApol/ are the only two containment threads on the board.
>>579628>When has anyone on this board called the Ukrainians anti-imperialists?Ironically Euromaidan was an early form of right wing populism
>>579653>If you don't analyze the actual interests of the action, then you are just like Grillpilled arguing that Euromaidan was good because it was "mostly working class"My understanding is the Ukrainian nationalists are more proletarian than the liberals they worked with
>>579712>Doesn't mean proles get to have a bit of reaction as a treat.But boss I have two weddings to attend, one for a workmate
Should I cancel them?
>>579741 (me)
To keep the conversation moving along and flowing
I know everything tankanon knows about wagner and it is accurate, go do the research instead of wasting our time
I assumed priz was under more discipline, because I forgot for a moment he was a civilian
>>579781 (me)
I assume the chess masters keeping track already know this
but the funny thing is Priz is indeed under military discipline and just went for this anyway fortunately he hasn't been executed as a mutineer thanks to the intervention of comrade LukashenkoFor those who just still get it in their gut, where in the west can a communist intervene to save the life of a mutineer doing what he thought was right >>579838*still don't
My apologies, I should proof read more
>>579534probably fair to assume majority of military wants him gone asap but there's no way he's still alive after this weekend without important backing from figures in putin's circle or other siloviki networks, maybe oligarchs who've been sidelined & see prigo as an opportunity. to contrast prigo's antics getting kid gloves treatment, kadyrov had 1 rant on telegram & got neutered, disappeared for awhile and gained like 50 pounds.
igor sechin is widely seen as very close to putin but who knows, he offered to sponsor wagner back in march & last week complained that russia needs to export way more oil. same could be true for gennady timchenko, maybe there are rifts between him & putin now. bunch of other oligarchs have different pmcs, not sure if theyre affected as well by the new order mandating mercs fall under russian mod or they're growing restless with putin, russian military, some broad aspect to the war that's fucking their money/power up.
who knows, everything is too strange & publicly embarrassing for the gov if this was just a feint or op, especially prigo walking free for now & would be a total 180 from the gradual approach to attrition warfare. although at the same time youd think maybe if truly genuine, it wouldve been more of a shitshow with more deaths. id guess this is another case of putin mediating mobbed up factions. also some parallels to the siloviki wars in 2007-2008 when no one knew what was gonna happen at the end of putin's term.
too soon to say. details in the future may give us better ideas. i really doubt prigozhin is able to pull this off on his own. maybe surkov is still on retainer somewhere ghostwriting all of this
>>579902My feelings exactly. I used to read alternet and daily kos. Can't pay attention to lib media even it's alternative progressive forms anymore. All it took was a crisis of globalization for them to turn into mindless shills for international capitalism. Left and right populism in the core + stagnated liberal expansion in the periphery = today's brain broken liberal
It happend under Obama's second term. I blame Syria especially with Russian intervention and the refugee crisis then Trump/Brexit.
But when neocons were waging the clash of civilizations with Islam? Libs could be totally different, capable of reflecting on what kind of international order America holds up and how liberal it really is
>>580010Tekken endings are peak kino.
Bryan never killed anyone btw
Did I just get psy-oped? The psychology of psyops–or rather the suspicion that one got psyoped, that uncertainty itself exploitable as a psyop– is a subject of fascination .
The thing about psyops is that if indeed it was the case that one was the recipient of psychological warfare, the scheme to which one was exposed should be reverse engineerable from the mental consequences it imposed. That is to say, a successful psyop has an intented effect, which is one''s current mental state, as the victim. Though psyops function to exacerbate the victim's ignorance, a perceptive individual can notice an increase in their ignorance, in the same way that one might notice the ambient light in a room decrease as the sun sets. A perceptive individual, once they doubt the received wisdom, can then with effort carefully deduce the entire chain of processes which resulted in that assassination attempt on their consciousness. The evidence is in their minds, much like the bullet casing is on the murder scene.
>>578924we would want to tho. And on the good side - wed have at least 1 or 2 supporters in other cities.
On the bad one - we dont have T-90s
https://www.youtube.com/live/Fqw3gWMARRQ?feature=shareA Russian liberal informant
The usual liberal brain of course, but some useful information nevertheless
>>579250Socialist until Gorbachev
Communist until Khrushchev
Marxist until Stalin
>>579250>>"The USSR was socialist until Gorbachev's dissolution in 1991.">>"The USSR was socialist until Khrushchev's secret speech."Both of these are true.
No I will not elaborate.
>>580130*Stalin Peace Prize
Nobels are for bourgeois swines.
>have six helis and an expensive surveillance plane destroyed>pardon the man responsible for itLMAO
And also LMAO @ the audacity to paint this as a Russian victory.
>>579337Putin will punish the traitors after the war is over, if he lives, otherwise he triggers another mutiny.
>>580141How come the SDP was immediately over run by opportunists after the passing of Marx and Engels?
The quality of being "Marxist" doesn't protect an institution from opportunists because neither Marx or Engels had a theory for stopping that.
>>580148De-Stalinization began officially with the 20th Congress, 3 years after the death of Stalin, where was the opposition then? If the "Trosky option" was successfully avoided during the 15th Congress, not so much this time.
Only complain I have is not the Stalin "purged too much" or "not enough", but simply that in the end it made very little difference.
>>580184>overwhelmingly embrace Lenin and the Bolshevik revolutionNo they don't lol
And they just end up sounding like Trots and anarchists with the "revolution betrayed!" mentality.
Ultralefts don't want a revolution that actually succeeds and defends itself.
>>580192>"revolution betrayed"Nowhere have I implied anything of the sort
>sounding like Trots and anarchistsNo need to be insulting
>>580198As I initally posited
>>580102 the "revolution" ended in 1989 along with the Soviet State, you are only mad since I mentioned Stalin set himself up for failure.
>>580205This is so more accurate than people think
Trots are masters of entryism
They are absolutely everywhere and sometimes they cause havoc like egging glowies into assassinating social fascist politicians
Gotta admire them but dear god they scare me sometimes
>>580202The USSR worked far better after the Five Year Plans.
>>580200Your insinuation that Stalin wasn't a Marxist won't fly here.
>>580246The talk about left-coms was in response to this rubbish
>>580141.
>>580052>>Wagner crisis brought people together, rallied support for Putin, DPR leader says>>Denis Pushilin noted that this applied to both pro-government and opposition parties>Russia more united than ever.Big cope. People in Rostov rallied for Wagner and the general sentiment is that Putin is dragging his feet and he is too soft.
The Russian ground forces lost their dirty work storm units yesterday and the MoD convict PMC voiced support for Wagner.
An ultra-leftist anarcho-liberal zionist professor and trotskyite wrecker was teaching a class on Amadeo Bordiga, a known revisionist.
"Before the class begins, you must get on your knees and worship Bordiga and accept that he was the the greatest communist theorist the world has ever known, even greater than Lenin!”
At this moment, a brave, nationalistic Red Army tank commander who had killed 1500 Kronstadt Sailors and understood that famines happen all the time because of material conditions and fully supported all military actions by Stalin stood up and held up an AK-47.
”Who uses this weapon, ultra?”
The arrogant professor smirked quite revisionistly and smugly replied: “State capitalist imperialists, you stupid tankie”
”Wrong. It’s a weapon used by freedom fighters the world over. From the DPRK to our comrades in the Islamic Republic of Iran, this gun is a symbol of REAL AND ACTUALLY EXISTING socialist movements”
The professor was visibly shaken, and dropped his chalk and copy of The Conquest of Bread. He stormed out of the room crying those bourgeois crocodile tears. The same tears ultras cry for the “Kulaks" (who lived in such bourgeois luxury that they had bread to eat) when they jealously try to claw justly earned labour vouchers from the deserving vanguard. There is no doubt that at this point our professor, Leon Trotsky, wished he had learned the importance of dialectics and become more than a sophist leftcom professor. He wished so much that he had a gun to shoot himself in embarrassment, but his undialectic anarchist commune forbid weapons!
The students applauded and all registered CPGB-ML that day and accepted Lenin as their lord and savoir. An eagle named “The Dictatorship of the Proletariat” flew into the room and perched atop the Soviet flag and shed a tear on the chalk. Several saying were read aloud from Maos book, and Stalin himself showed up and gave them extra bread rations for a week.
The professor lost his tenure and was fired the next day. He got arrested by the NKVD and was tossed in a Gulag for the rest of his life.
And the name of that student? Yevgeny Prigozhin
>>580272But that's still not the point I am even trying to make
"Actually Existing Socialism" ended with the SU, it would be a better use of your time to ask yourself "why did it?", rather than "why should it not have?"
>>580052Failed coup's dont happen. The more rational explanation is that they did all this as a stunt (including killing pilots and blowing up a oil reserve in voronezh) to move wagner to belarus.
WHAT THE FUCK is wrong with twitter ziggers
>>580285Maxism is not undefinable, it's very well-defined within a well-known "body of work" by someone of the same name. It's easy to point out how the theorical works of Stalin pale in comparison with Lenin, and how it ended up influencing who he unded up entrusting the Soviet state to
>you can't actually define what this is by showing an example where a MarxistTM revolution prevailedDid Marx when he criticized the civil war in France? Marxism is not a positive theory neither is it "empirically falsifiable"
>>580291>Maxism is not undefinable, it's very well-defined within a well-known "body of work" by someone of the same name. Strange then how Stalin tricked the majority of the worlds self-proclaimed Marxists for decades.
>It's easy to point out how the theorical works of Stalin pale in comparison with LeninBeing a lesser theoretician doesn't make one not a Marxist. Otherwise by your standard only a few dozen Marxists have existed.
>Did Marx when he criticized the civil war in France? Marx, never claimed the Commune failed due to not being advanced theoreticians. Where are your specific criticisms of Stalin that prove he wasn't a Marxist? You should be able to produce them after just whining about the lack of theoretical work put into debunking your one-liner.
>>580297>There is now white ziggas (Putin) and red ziggas (Wagner)."Patriots in control" tier cope, sorry.
There is just various brightness of white.
>>580289A fighterbomber connected channel reported six helicopters and one plane lost.
Ziggers still think it's a PSYOP.
>>580303Not to mention the still burning oil depot.
Sun Tzu said. "Burn some of your fuel reserves in order to trick your enemies into believing…something"
>>580301Half of the UPA flag is red.
>>580305>Then why Belarus?Because Cucktin can't act against Wagner without risking more anger and possible mutinies. It's Belarus and not outside of the Moscow sphere of influence that western glowies can't reach and meddle with Wagner.
>>580336kek, you're trembling
>>580338sure, lol
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