/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>2830327
There is nothing "the left" can meaningfully say or do at this point. It is irrelevant. We have fully Hungarianised our politics. This anon is right though >>2830303 we have been facing right wing proto-paramilitaries for a bit in Manchester that is where we are headed.

>>2830342
My bet is that said paramilitaries are inspired by Ulster loyalists, given how that’s where some of ‘em relocated when escaping from blood feuds in Northern Ireland: https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/shankill-suburbs-how-loyalist-hardman-27215408

Which begs the question: Do the MI5 and MI6 still work with Ulster loyalist paramilitaries and are the ones behind organising the British far-right? Because, as conspiratorial as it sounds, it’s just a fact that liberal democracies often foster fascists to be used as attack dogs against any proletarian revolt, or as cheerleaders for the next big military adventure that will only benefit the oligarchs.

As for the “Hungarianisation” thingy, I think Kahanisation is a better term since it perfectly captures how Israeli the British far right has become, whether it’s their petty tribalism, the thirst for blood and violence on par with demons portrayed in Christian eschatology, and general stupidity that is only kept on the leash by the more high verbal autism score elites.

As for the future, I don’t think the country will head to a brutal civil war like the Spanish one in the immediate future, but it’ll more likely be similar to Italy’s years of lead where you had a liberal centre barely struggling to contain both far left and far right street violence, or Weimar Germany in general where EVERY party had its own paramilitary proficient in street gang warfare.

Not sure what the closest analogue to the UK is beyond the Troubles.

>>2830350
>My bet is that said paramilitaries are inspired by Ulster loyalists
They are explicitly so since they are predominately Britain First-aligned (itself heavily tied to Loyalist groups).
>Not sure what the closest analogue to the UK is beyond the Troubles.
There isn't one. We are in uncharted territory for British history. The times when there has been mass social unrest it was proletarian organisations. We have never had a mass reactionary movement.

>>2830168
I wrote a more in depth reply but I'll cut it and just go for this
>Its just such an extreme example of unequal treatment its like shit out of the american south during the 1950s.
You're doing it again! You can't just go "this is a sui-generis injustice faced by my in-group that you should care about", you have to go "Look, look liberals, we're just like American black people too! you have to love us like you love them!"

>>2830226
You don't have to monetise your hobbies and in-fact I'd council against it, since you might feel bad when you realise nobody wants to give you money.
I am "from a working class background" I prefer to think of myself as one of a small number of "normal people", e.g. not a middle class wanker but also not someone with a chip on their shoulder about how working class they are. more importantly, I do not have a good job now either. That doesn't get me ranting about how hard done by I am as a white-boy, however, because I can still derive a sense of self-worth and status from being smart and correct about politics and sociology and arguing about it on leftypol.org. That's a hobby! Not a profitable one, but a hobby!

This is one of the things I judge rightists for: there are infinite optional status hierarchies and in-groups and they insist on sticking to ones where they're a fucking loser while arrogantly maintaining the presumption it should be otherwise. Well, I'm not a loser, I'm just poor.

>>2830287
>Truly, we live in an ‘idolatry of victimhood’
As the great liberal, Murray Rothbard (1979) once said, the victim gains a privilege in their status, because when "society" is blamed, every individual besides them becomes responsible for their problems (this is later repeated by Thatcher's infamous quote). We see this sentiment as early as the socialist Robert Owen, who attributed all crime to external causes, and so literally found no error in the criminal, but only in the structure of society itself (a bit similar to how when catholics would execute people, their soul would be forgiven, yet their mortal body punished by death - the process of "rehabilitation" obviously has its religious content, in redeeming the corrupted soul). Marx gives attribution of this to the emanation of French Materialism (1845):
<If man is unfree in the materialistic sense, i.e., is free not through the negative power to avoid this or that, but through the positive power to assert his true individuality, crime must not be punished in the individual, but the anti-social sources of crime must be destroyed, and each man must be given social scope for the vital manifestation of his being.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1845/holy-family/ch06_3_d.htm
Yet we see this already in Aristotle's writings (350 BCE):
<poverty is the parent of revolution and crime.
https://classics.mit.edu/Aristotle/politics.2.two.html
Displaying causation to the phenomenon of crime, and thus, a mechanics of civil disorder. Here, the ends of policy is given by the formal structure of society itself. The consequence is the status of being a victim of society in general. Being a victim then, has currency, because it substitutes agency from oneself to another.

As a person who has the pathology of often victimising myself, I understand its toxicity, to oneself and to others.

>>2830354
There is something contemptible in victimhood, and something contemptible in visibly lacking empathy for victims. Hence we generally politely ignore professional victims on the left, like other leftists, and loathe rightoids who play victim undeservedly but have no empathy for other victims and indeed decry their game.

Maybe the ideal society is one where everyone tells you you're a victim and that one should sympathise with victims, but you have to insist you're not, "it was nothing" style, or else being socially awkward.

>>2830352
>You're doing it again!
did you have a stroke or did it take you 7 hours to figure that out

>>2830380
or maybe i'm having a stroke

>doing it again
>again
it was 1(one) post, you replied to it 2(two) times

>>2830377
Well, what is best is to devalue the status of being a victim by giving people available options to gain independence. If there is truly no excuse for self-inflicted misery, then the victim has no more recourse to blame others. We need more than "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" (which itself is a rhetorical paradox), yet we need to foster a culture of responsibility nonetheless. For example, in a socialist society, the possibility of failure should still exist, to teach people how to succeed, without the unnecessary cruelty or inequality of capitalism. If you are given money, you should be allowed to waste it, and for which case, inequality is justified. The project of racial reparations in the US has this sort of ethos, that once the historical debt is paid, there are no more excuses, and thus a natural equality of opportunity. This is also what Rothbard suggests.

Victims are le held up in our le society, i can't believe this :chudface:

>>2829790
What's preventing someone from just refusing to disclose whether they are trans or lying about being cis? If you have female on your id then for legal purposes you are a woman no? You can't really find the trans Juden unless you mandate a legally binding penis inspection day

>>2830389
Conservatism is an eternal politics of victimhood:
>mandatory seatbelts? you are oppressing me!
Even being a chud (e.g. incel) is literally claiming to be a victim of existence, akin to exclaiming "I didn't choose to be born" in all its infantilism.

>>2830388
The problem with just having responsibility (even in conditions of general socialist abundance) is that you lose the valuable cultivation of empathy that having victims around stimulates, unless we move to caring deeply about ameliorating the suffering of wild animals or something instead. Being a victim is bad for you, but every new soviet man really ought to be a bit of a saviour.

Maybe we could have everyone responsible for something, but a victim (usually "of nature") in some other sense. Everyone responsible for both themselves and for others, everyone high status to themselves and lower status to others. From each… something something.

>>2830397
>>2830354
thank you for this decade late schizobabble on victim hood

A theory: rightoids struggle with and thus hate self-authorship, which is why transgenderism is the major culture war flashpoint it is. (It sets societal expectations directly against self actualisation) They want someone else to script their lives for them and don't want to be told they're responsible for choosing a derivative script and then performing it badly.
This is also why they can't come up with their own victim narratives and always find themselves plagiarising the left. It takes some imagination to decide you're oppressed by pomegranates but none whatsoever to swap whites and blacks in the Yankee script or blame the Jews like it's 400AD.

>>2830431
Nothing they've said is schizobabble and they're basically correct about the right being addicted to feeling victimised

>>2830444
So, I other words they’re just failed normies? That explains a lot, like how many of them idolise Japan even tho it’s basically NPC topia where dissent is socially stigmatised and being an edgelord is looked down upon. Like, even being a loudmouthed chud is met with scorn by the public as anti-social behaviour despite Japanese society being chuddish thanks to a weak left and the public being passive towards their reactionaries.

As to why chuds are prone to victimhood, methinks it has to do with both how they’re such losers they would still be losers even if they lived in a white ethnostate, and the fact that the modern wignat has no experience actually ruling over anything since 1945, so their only experience as a political bloc is when they’re the underdog, which is why MAGA and Reform act like victims being persecuted despite the former being the literal US government at time of this writing, while Reform is being funded by dark money interest on the top of the media class giving it lip service and promos (unlike Zack who gets hounded as an anti-Semite for wanting Britain to do BDS on Israel even tho both Reform and Restore have literal Nazis in their ranks). Not to mention that Rupert Lowe pretends to be a victim too despite he himself being an oligarch on the top of being payrolled by the world richest man who is also a cyberpunk-style nazi billionaire who is a product of apartheid SA.

Just a thought there.

>>2830444
>Nothing they've said is schizobabble and they're basically correct about the right being addicted to feeling victimised

Its a grasp for straws to flip the old victim narrative stuff that was in vogue a decade ago onto rightoids who aren't going to care whatsoever, brought on by an event where a migrant successfully victimized himself to the police after stabbing someone to get the guy he stabbed put in cuffs instead of himself, with schizo babble bought on by people drawing obvious comparisons to jorge floyd

Literally no one's going to take this seriously

>>2830403
There will always be victims, but the question is whether people must always be treated as victims of others, or of themselves. So long as you have external victimisation, you cannot have personal responsibility. So my plea for socialism is a plea for maturity, in precisely the Kantian sense of "enlightenment" (1784):
<Enlightenment is the human being’s emergence from his self-incurred [immaturity]. [Immaturity] is inability to make use of one’s own understanding without direction from another.
https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/ethics/kant/enlightenment.htm
In civil society, this maturity is taken for granted, which then permits one's subjection to law, but political criticism as a legal discourse must intervene at this level to reform current conditions so as to make people free by better laws. Engels relates this to Marx (1886):
<England is the only country where the inevitable social revolution might be effected entirely by peaceful and legal means. [Marx] certainly never forgot to add that he hardly expected the English ruling classes to submit, without a “pro-slavery rebellion,” to this peaceful and legal revolution.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/p6.htm
Aristotle in diagnosing the causes of crime, also suggests the redistribution of property to allow for a general entrance into the middle class, and in other places, directly criticises existing laws, such that murder was treated less harshly than theft. Plato wrote his Laws, as did Moses, and Jesus established the essence of the law in the spirit, not the letter. The act of jurisprudence is then significant to world-historical revolution, as a means to make us more free; e.g. all revolution is a legal re-constitution, such as we see in this country with the Magna Carta (1215), Petition of Right (1628), Instrument of Government (1653) and the Bill of Rights (1688). We see in France, the Declaration of the Rights of Man (1789); in the US, the Declaration of Independence (1776), Constitution (1787), Bill of Rights (1789), Emancipation Proclamation (1865), etc. Robert Owen also wrote codes of law in his work, such as in "Revolution in the Mind" (1849). An issue with much of Marx's own criticism is that it is too negative, and so fails to build a positive project, codefied in law.

rightoids unironically saying "I can't breathe", i'm sorry but that's hilarious

>>2830516
Yh, especially given all those years of muh law an ordah, back the blues, etc…

So it made me think: For as much as the average rightoid chants about “high trust society” this and dat, many of their characteristics such as low trust in institutions, penchant towards conspiratorialism, lack of inhibition towards violence compared to the average leftist, and hyper-individualism would obviously clash with the needs of a high-trust society such as conformity and high trust on institutions.

Because if that case happened in Japan, SK or China, there wouldn’t be riots and protests over it since:

1. The state would do its best to cover it up and minimise the case
   
   
2. Most normies would be too trustful towards institutions to do shit. Case in point, the many times US army soldiers raped Japanese women and girls. Apart from localised protests, none actually rioted over it in Tokyo. Same happens in SK as well. Why? Both because the normies there trust the state to a high degree due to societally-enforced conformism, and because the concept of harmony is upheld by the state so much so that any attempt to break said harmony is is countered with partial media blackouts and minimisations.
   
   

Also, isn’t it ironic how chuds claim America is a low-trust society, when the fact that Americans give tips to services despite nothing legally forcing them to is a great counterpoint?

Now, I’m not sure what would be the equivalent of that in the UK or Ireland for that matter…

>>2830473
>Literally no one's going to take this seriously
No one takes anything seriously in chud/TERF island because the collapse of civics has meant that almost every group, political or otherwise, lives in its own echo chamber. Guess what? We are now at a point where politics is just pure spiteful tribal cold warfare led by a series of opportunists.

And honestly, both the capitalist left and capitalist right bear the blame for it, whether it’s Nigel Farage, Margaret Thatcher or Keir Starmer or any other capitalist shill.

Also, isn’t it me or does anyone find it weird that a case from months ago is being brought up just now? Like, where was the energy for the riots back in December 2025, the month and year in which the murder occurred, and why now just as Digwa got arrested?

>>2829272
Is it that bad tho? I think there could be improvements like flying the Union Jack alongside the Palestine one. Now, that would be rad.

>>2830527
>the capitalist left and the capitalist right

there is no "capitalist left", they're neolibs

>>2830177
>yes it was lmao
Has happened to me twice now. My tip is to grip them around the joint safely and only twist them the way that won't accidentally loosen.

>>2830542
People who are anti-racist, feminist, and support LGBTQ+ rights but are also capitalist in the sense that they favor the pure free market-ism or that but with a welfare state (i.e., Rhine capitalism) are technically on the left of the political spectrum if we use the quadrant model of the political mapping.

>>2830527

the energy is manufactured through right-wing networks. get "ARRRRR TOMMEHHH" on it to amplify it for the orcs and trolls.

>>2830545

like I said, neolibs who want a socially left-wing message to market so they control the superstructure for the capitalist base

>>2830516
or writing it on their masks to show their opposition to disease control

>>2830527
>isn’t it me or does anyone find it weird that a case from months ago is being brought up just now?
bodycam footage came out 2 days ago

>where was the energy for the riots back in December 2025, the month and year in which the murder occurred, and why now just as Digwa got arrested?
details were still fuzzy https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c5y2lklgpl9o

Keir Starmer called me a "fooking donkey" and told me to "fack off" on my way to the poob

>>2830546
Speaking of orcs, I think it would be a good idea for the lib left to reappropriate the LOTR franchise from the right. Like, it has all the signs:

>Author was a WW1 veteran who opposed Nazism in WW2
>Said author was an anti-apartheid Catholic in a deeply Protestant country that supported apartheid South Africa all the way until the 1980s
>His book is about a multiracial coalition fighting against an evil empire made of monsters who pose a threat to the world
>Silmarrion features an interracial relationship

Before the objections come in, the only point that I’ll concede is that it’s indeed childish idealistic slop that isn’t particularly feminist. On that I’ll agree. But for the rest, not so much. I’ll address them point by point:

• On classism: While it is true that most of the hero’s party is made up of nobles and aristocrats, it is also true that the books show that good character in itself isn’t innate to the nobility, as shown by how Sam, Frodo’s servant, often acts as the one who has to rectify Frodo’s character and often shows virtues typically associated with nobles
  
  
• On the Shire: It’s not supposed to be some Arcadia, as shown by how the Hobbits’ own provincialism has led them into being easy pawns for Sauron. And you know who saves the place? Not the locals, but the Hobbits who are displayed as worldly and travelled far and wide.
  
  
• On racism: The orcs aren’t even human, but that didn’t stop Sam from pondering on their humanity in an empathetic way, nor for Tolkien to give his own in-universe explanation which sadly he couldn’t complete, leaving us with different origin stories for the orcs with each having different and contradictory implications from one another. As for the Haradrim and Easterlings? Well, both are forgiven after the war. As for their physical appearance, “swarthy” can mean any number of things and “slant eyed” just as easily describes Slavs and Scandinavians. I should also mention that Mordor is on the north, which complicates the notion of a good west/north vs evil east/south moral geography applied to LOTR’s fictional geography.
  
  

In fact, if it wasn’t for the introduction of the paperback format for mass publishing and hippies adopting LOTR en masse for its supposed agrarian and anti-industrial message (Tolkien opposed allegories in general, btw) then LOTR would be left into the dustbins of history considering how back when it was published it was considered as juvenile idealistic slop by the literary press.

Good or bad idea?

Because if WW2 and the British empire can’t be adopted thanks to BLM despite it being the only national mythos in the UK that was capable of uniting both the four countries plus the BAMEs of yore (such as the Windrush generation), then LOTR might be the only viable story that is pertinent to British culture.

Otherwise, the left would be amiss to try to unite Britain under a socialist cause.

And yes, I’m aware of that Russian take on the LOTR where the canon is portrayed as victors’ propaganda against the proletarian orcs and Soviet leader Sauron, but that isn’t the point for now.

>>2830575
>>2830593
Is the joke about Starmer allegedly using a trust to buy a donkey sanctuary for his parents and then selling it to dodge inheritance tax?

>>2830553
>>2830571
That looks genuinely bad then for Starmer. Now, whether the left can cajole some of these rioting lumpen into being antifa by using the anti-cop energy is another question altogether because, frankly, I’ve never seen any gammon turning into a leftist with just talks.

But yes, I do think the focus on race, even if pertinent in this particular, is ultimately a distraction over the broader issue of the unspoken police brutality in Europe that affects poor people regardless of race. You’d be surprised at how militarised the police forces in France, Spain, Italy and Germany are. I have Italian friends who showed me some of the latest news from Naples, concerning a police task force brutally evicting a poor working class Italian family after they failed to pay rent.

Granted, I’m not sure if the narrative that police is really afraid of racism as gammons say is truthful considering the general trend of cops being chudded out as well as the fact that for years the British left has claimed that the slow trial over the murder of Anthony Walker was due to the Met’s racist bias and the fact that the white perp was the son of some upper class Briton.

Up

Chat, has this borne out at all?: https://xcancel.com/souljagoyteller/status/2024828394731360727

>>2830607
In that case Burnham’s best bet would be to have Restore actively compete against Reform in Makerfield to split the right wing vote.

>>2830636
Yes, Restore is a party of the terminally online. They will get "Only Ran" status outside of Greater Yarmouth.

>>2830645
*also ran FUCK

Considering how Digwa is an Indian and Henry was a Pole, here are some good baits for you to use on gammons. They should be something like:

• “Who cares? It’s just migrant-on-migrant violence. Send them all back to where they came from.”
  
  
• “Both are invaders to our native land. Remigrate all of them, Slavic uyghurs included. No exception. This is BRITAIN, not WHITETAIN”
  
  
• “Why u so mad? It’s just untermensch-on-untermensch murder, or did the Polacks turn into Aryans the moment Tatar leader of the Soviet Golden Horde Putler decided to attack the Aryan empire of Polonia?”
  
  
• “uygha-uygha intraviolence is no concern for me, whether it’s curry uygha or sausage uygha. Now STFU and let me watch my F.C. sports show.”
  
  

I used a variation of the third point back when Iryna’s murder was still en vogue on X’itter, and the amount of chuds that I baited with was enormous. Hell, they even thought I was pro-Ukraine despite me LARPing as a Zigger.

>>2830660
>This is BRITAIN, not WHITETAIN
That's what you'd like to think, but no contemporary nationalist actually has a concept of what Britain is or ought to be except somewhere that was once more "white" and should return to that condition. People are entirely consumed by philistine presentism.

>>2830673
>English nationalists
But what do they know of England, as Enoch Powell once exclaimed? They imagine that history began in 1945, after the great primordial chaos we call WW2. As an amateur researcher of English history, it is isolating to collect facts about this island from before the 20th century, because people find no continuity in it. They are wholly absorbed in the post-war myth, even without giving credit to Attlee in founding the social democratic welfare state, and which these same "nationalists" seem hell-bent on dismantling since the 70s onwards.

>>2830677

I can't tell you how much I loathe those rightoid droneflies who echo everything the ultra-rich tell them to say.

Our boy Sir Keir Starmer has proudly announced he is straight up giving £1.3 billion in British taxpayer's money to Comcast/Universal Studios to help them pay for their new theme park in Bedfordshire.

What the fuck is he thinking???
Why can't the US megacorp worth almost £100 billion pay for it themselves??

>>2830740
Someone tell Keir Universal is pushing transgenrism NOW

>>2830740
Because the English will never accomplish anything useful, that’s why.

t. Karl Marx

>>2830327
>do you guys think the killings of George Floyd and Anthony Walker were justified, or not? If so, why?
Why the fuck would you even say that? Are you retarded?

>>2830285
>What more are they even asking?
For the police to be put on trial for manslaughter.

>>2830941
That is hoping against hope

Spindly Hitler supporter and avid Neo Nazi Steve Laws wants you to know that he is really, really concerned about the life of the Polish Henry Nawak, even doe if Henry was sent to 1940 Germany he would most likely be in a concentration camp, just as the very Fuhrer Steve fawns over wanted to.

In all seriousness tho, I find it sickening how avowed Neo-Nazis Pearl clutch about the death of Slavs as if they themselves aren’t opportunists who merely see dead Europeans as martyrs that solely exist to justify their ethnic grievances not unlike how the crops use their dead as martyrs to rally around for their next gang wars.

Remember all that AI slop of Hitler hugging Iryna Zarutska posted by chuds, as if Hitler wasn’t a virulent Slav-hater?

As much as I think the cops were dumb and should be arrested, the opportunism behind the UK riots makes me cynical of any rightoid on X’itter lecturing us over this. Like c’mon, man.

Anyway, whatever man, I don’t think there’s anything the British left can do about it besides trolling chuds on X’itter for some cheap laughs, or doing something more useful like developing its own paramilitary wing.