๐ฝ UNITED STATES POLITICS ๐ฆ
>Thread for the hellish discussion related to the scourge of the earth, the destroyer of nations, the king of coups, the sultan of sanctions, the emir of the embargo, the autocrat of austerity, the doge of deregulation, the baron of busting unions, the prince of privatization, the lord of loan sharks, the patron-saint of proxy wars, the sponsor of settlers, the guarantor of genocides, the Divided $nakkkes of Amerikkkaโข
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deep list of horrible shit we (royal we) have done //
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https://www.hueylong.com/programs/share-our-wealth/huey-longs-share-our-wealth-speechPrevious Thread
>>2845862 Pickle
This whole arrangement is completely unsustainable and yet it keeps going
CHATGPT, WRITE ME A PARAGRAPH THAT WILL TRIGGER THE TREATLERS EPIC BACON STYLE
CHATGPTโฆ kiss me, you fool
>>2847893Good but no one will do anything about it. People will say thank you to these nazis as long as treats are on the menu
>>2847846life is just swinging from one unsustainable thing to the next tbh
at some point we should seriously consider how to live off of extremely long-lived (trillions of years) red dwarf stars, compared to much shorter lived yellow.
>>2847920Oswald Cobblepot lookin ass
>>284792930 years was the lowest sentence. One person got sentenced for 100 years, again just for protesting and having anarchist zines. Fascist police state bullshit at its finest and it's coming for the rest of us
>>2847929>>2847930
>After a three week jury trial, the nine activists were all found guilty of a slew of criminal charges in March, stemming from a Fourth of July protest at an immigrant detention facility in Alvarado, Texas, south of Fort Worth. The demonstrators arrived late at night with a plan to set off fireworks as part of a noise demonstration to show solidarity with those detained inside. A few of the protesters spontaneously broke off from the main group and vandalized cars in the parking lot, a guard shack, slashed the tires on a government van and broke a security camera. When a police officer arrived on the scene and drew his weapon, one of the activists fired an AR-15 from the woods, hitting the officer in the shoulder. The officer survived.
>Zachary Evetts, Autumn Hill, Savanna Batten, and Elizabeth Soto were sentenced to 50 years in prison. Maricela Rueda, another demonstrator, was sentenced to 70 years in prison. Benjamin Song, who fired the gun at the police officer, was sentenced to 100 years in prison. The other protesters were continuing to be sentenced Tuesday morning.seems like a bit more than zines, give them some credit
>>2847937Message received, in for a penny out for a pound.
We'll see if this regime lasts another 30 years.
>>2847937YOu need to make it so there are repercussions for this stuff for the state and so on.
>>2847937are we having the same conversation
>>2847943the guy tried that and got 100 years
>>2847956Well if they're going to send us to prison for several decades anyways just for being around that person and having zines we might as well become more militant
>>2847931Further proof adventurism is a waste of time
>>2847965That wasn't even adventurism, he saved multiple people from getting executed by the cops that night
jacobin put out an article talking about the leftist history of the confederate flag
bruh what is going on in their editor's room
https://jacobin.com/2026/06/young-patriots-panthers-chicago-classright after juneteenth these people are insane
like sure there's a place to discuss this slice of history but come ON
https://prairielanddefendants.com/defendant-writings/statement-by-benjamin-champagne-song/Statement by Benjamin "Champagne" Song, spread it far and wide
>I donโt Hate. I donโt Hate anyone. I donโt Hate cops. I donโt Hate Trump. I donโt Hate nazis. My beliefs are composed thus:
>First, that we should help each other.
>Second, that we should protect one another.
>What we all saw happen to Renee Good and Alex Pretti is my worst nightmare. I never want to see anyone get hurt. I never want to see good people, standing for what they believe in, gunned down in the street.
>What happened on July 4th, 2025 was that exact same nightmare โ when I saw Lt. Thomas Gross point his gun at the back of a running, unarmed protestor, and assuming an aggressive firing position, leaning forward hard into the recoil of his gun. As a firearms instructor and a United States Marine Corps Veteran, I knew exactly what was about to happen. I knew another protestor was about to be murdered right in front of me.
>I used, No. I was forced to use, by my duty to Life, the minimum defensive force possible. To prevent what happened to Alex Pretti. To prevent what happened to Renee Good. To prevent another Botham Jean. To prevent another Manuel T. Teran. To prevent another Atatiana Jefferson. To prevent another Philando Castile. The last thing I wanted to do is hurt anyone. And I am so, so happy that No One had their life stolen from them that day. By anyone.
>Now, 21 people have been arrested, have been persecuted, have been punished. For knowing me or being my friend? This is wrong. This is mass punishment. Collective punishment. This is guilt by association. This is injustice.
>So, should I have done nothing? Should I have looked the other way? Should I have just allowed yet another innocent person to be slaughtered.
>Heaven forbid. Every life is worth as much as every other. Whatever is stolen from you is stolen from me.
>Back in 1895, the white supremacist and U.S. Senator, Pitchfork Ben Tillman, gave a speech to the new Constitutional Convention of South Carolina on how to use injustice to steal power. He said, โHow did we recover our liberty? By fraud and violence. We tried to overcome the 30,000 majority by honest methods, which was a mathematical impossibility. After we had borne these indignities for eight years, life became worthless.โ So goes the story of how men steal power over others. By injustice, by fraud and violence.
>First, They removed every Black juror, so no one would question the police.
>Second, They told me I cannot protect myself, I cannot protect others, They told me I wasnโt even allowed to say it: Self Defense.
>As you heard in the trial: They tortured their own witnesses. American citizens, tortured and terrorized and medically neglected. A 24-year-old had a heart attack. A 58-year-old said she would die. Mothers, Fathers, Teachers, Students, Package Workers, Programmers, Engineers persecuted and tortured in this case.
>It may be my friends today, but it will be your friends tomorrow.Whatever is taken from me is taken from you.
>On June 9th of this year, the President of the Southern Poverty Law Center testified that โHate has migrated into the government.โ Into the government. The Hate is Right Here. The government, in their secret motion to give me a life sentence, calls me โThe Embodiment of Antifa.โ Because what they really want to Bury is an Idea. What They Hate is the very Idea of Being Against Racism. The Hate is Right Here.That Hate is taking power over me. That Hate is taking power over you.
>I do not fear for myself. I fear for you. What will you do? In this time of great failures and great injustices, what will you do? How will you help each other? How will you help yourselves? >>2847969>jacobin put out an article talking about the leftist history of the confederate flag It looks more like it's just an article about the YPO.
>>2847967>That wasn't even adventurism, he saved multiple people from getting executed by the cops that nightCare to explain what happened?
If you think that proletarian dictatorship, abolishing the parasite imperialist state, distributing means of production to the global south and ending colonialism is in any way shape or form 'problematic' then GET THE FUCK OUT
>antifa
Imaginary product and persecutory delusion of the paranoid hysteria of the ruling class
Is there anything more symptomatic of their own decay?
>>2847982Read the statement
>>2847971 he explains how it went down
>>2847983>distributing means of production to the global southIt would be far more effective to just provide them with the means to build up their own means of production.
>>2847992that would in fact be "distributing means of production"
i'm not sure how else that works
>>2847969not what that article says by any stretch of the imagination
say what you will but they got handed some monster sentences and i didn't see no tears, but you look at the right and they stay sobbing on the stand
>>2847969>>2848050Did you two even read the article lmao
>>2848065Antifascists understand what the potential consequences of their dissent can be based on history, they're ready to be martyred in defense of freedom. Rightoids meanwhile are always infuriated that they're even being charged for a crime in the first place, the law exists simply to protect them from the unwashed masses
>>2848024It's the difference between packing up all the machinery in a factory and shipping it elsewhere vs helping a formerly colonized country build a new one. Though I suppose that's the difference between redistributing and distributing, but I've seen people unironically advocate for the former.
>>2848081heaven's sake, I'm not a TW.
>>2847848>>2847899Europeans cant afford energy because of yanks so they cant afford air conditioning
>>2848083they can afford it just fine. euroids are simply culturally averse to it. in order to install an AC unit in Switzerland you need a special permit from the government for example
>>2848088
The only real consolation here is that hopefully it can galvanize people further against fascism especially with the demonstration that no matter what you do you're going to be sent to prison for the rest of your life anyways
>>2848092euros bitch and moan about china dumping solar panels into their market while the yanks don't let those commodities in in the first place. euroid cocksuckers are unaware german companies still use fax machines. euroid stagnation is 100% self imposed
>>2848087>they can afford it just fine.Retard.
>>2847971>I donโt Hate nazisI get that he's pleading to a fascist government for mercy, but come on. You wouldn't have been there in the first place if you didn't have at least some hate for Trump's personal fascist force
france out in africa trying to reclaim a literal colony right the fuck now for the sake of pillaging other people's incomes and yet they're still out here acting like they're fucking oppressed victims who did nothing wrong lmao
>>2847939>>2847937IIRC the founder of the Han Empire was once a lowly guard who, under his watch, saw a group of peasants escape. He turned to his comrade and said:
>"What's the penalty for allowing prisoners to escape?"<"Death.">"And what's the penalty for rebelling against the Emperor?"<"Death."At that point he found the prisoners, joined up with them, and overthrew the ruling dynasty.
Did you guys read the manifesto of the Montreal shooter?
https://www.rebelnews.com/manifesto_reveals_alleged_montreal_gunman_s_antisemitic_far_left_and_incel_ideologyHe talks about the loneliness young men face today in our "hypergamy society". What he did was wrong but his analysis is not so completely wrong. He even cites scientific and leftist writings.
>>2848131Wrong thread also fuck off incel
>>2848131The first ever incel communist shooter. What did he do?
>checks notes>he shot 1 cop by complete accident >he actually wanted to assassinate a porn company ceo but failedlame. should have spent less time writing the manifesto and more time planning the hit.
>>2848135damn im kinda sad he failed that would've been so based
>>2848138Of all the porkies he could've gone after some porno peddler is of the least consequence.
>Arms manufacturers, mining companies that use slave labour, investment banks that rob millions of people blind every day, pharmaceutical companies that are glorified drug dealers? No thanks, billions must stop gooning. What 0 pussy does to a mf.
>>2848148wrong. the porn industry contributes to the escalating problem of human trafficking as well as the continued commodification of women. all real communists will not hesitate to kill porn ceos. you are epsteinite. you are revisionist. you are a libtard. you are cia. the communist storm will sweep you aside like the trash you are.
>>2848148lets be real porn is just as exploitative as healthcare both to its customers and its models. if he succeeded we'd be celebrating it as another luigi. and i am very pro-porn conceptually tbh. the industry is just very evil in its current incarnation. no one would miss a dead porn studio ceo. 100% of them are pedophiles anyway.
>>2848154you aren't funny. you've never been funny. shut the fuck up. your bait is cringe. making bombs that drop on palestinians is obviously of more consequence than sex videos. stop pretending to be retarded
>>2848148He himself states to not underestimate the loneliness of our society. I think he does have a point. Not justifying what he did though.
>sentencing antifascists to decades of imprisonment as an explicit message to the left
<leftypol: I sleep
>some guy who's not even American tried and failed to kill a porn ceo
<leftypol: REAL SHIT???
>>2848160wow……………………. people are lonely…………………… stunning philosophical insight……………………
>>2848167what's there to say? houdini pretended they got a trillion years in jail for "having zines" in a narcissistic attempt to make zines like his sound like guerilla warfare, but a cursory glance at the article revealed the guy got 100 years for shooting at a pig. the burger reich will execute you for much less and throws people in jail for decades over nonviolent crimes like having drugs
>>2848159You are so braindead you dismiss the exploitation and trafficking of women as a nothingburger. To you their lives have no value as long as you get a gooning session out of it. Kill all moids NOW.
>>2848167I remember some of the dakota access protestors got decades in jail
>>2848171no i didn't you bad faith trolling imbecile.
>>2848171>making bombs that drop on palestinians is obviously of more consequence than sex videos<I CHOOSE TO INTERPRET THIS AS SAYING SEX TRAFFICKING GOODretard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard retard
>>2848178Most of the amateur scene are either revenge porn by a disgruntled ex or professional pornstars filming on their iPhones pretending to be amateur
tucker carlson is gonna outflank the USA left
>>2848170The other people sentenced didn't shoot anybody though, and in at least one case wasn't even present at the protest
>>2848086The existence of the zines were also used as evidence against the defendants and the judges explicitly stated they were giving these harsh sentences to send a message to anyone who "shares their ideology" ie is an antifascist. You know, us.
>>2848179
bad troll
>>2848186yes. what is there to say? the US government will kill you for being a dissident. we've known this for decades.
>>2848186You are posting on a forum where anti-fascists are immediately banned to protect an out and proud fascist from any critique and pretending that you are under threat.
There are exactly zero anti-fascists on leftypol and anyone espousing anti fascist ideologies will be banned as soon as they hurt CPUSAnon's feelings.
>>2848197why haven't you destroyed DSSA yet
>fake anfem troll gets banned
>wrongschizo gets banned
>ok time for felix
yawn. i am bored. release the chagos.
>>2848200Nah it's not the real Iron Felix, not enough long winded rants
>>2848186Post the zines. I want to see thisndangerous ideology
>>2848209Not felix but i think its funny how fascist DSA racists who say karmelo anthony deserves jail for defending himself cry about some zinetards
>>2848211He wasnโt defending himself and youโre a retard if you think he was
>>2848213
That is pretty weird actually.
>>2848125Neck yourself false-flagging inceloid.
>>2848212Ok cracker. You read your zines. You fight yours i fight mine
YES WE ARE AWARE
>>2848213
>Improve ethics at the massive porn site
LMAO
>>2848213
Man they're just trying to lend credence to /pol/ at this point.
Stay on topic you fucking retards
>>2848158>>2848154Porn as an industry is bad but not nearly as essential to capitalism as armaments, finance, or natural resources. Plus, if you're going to do propaganda of the deed then it should target somebody that's connected to a widely hated industry or practice, one which could inspire workers to stand up to the parasites they encounter daily, and scare the ruling class into being less vampiric even temporarily. Luigi was celebrated because he not only got a CEO of an industry most people struggle against regularly, but it briefly led to a sudden increase in healthcare claims being accepted. Luigi mogs this sexless loser as far as these types of attacks go.
>>2848171This is why I only goon to animated/drawn stuff.
>>2848228Now do this for the /iran/ thread, you fucking retards.
>>2848228Mod, just gonna throw this out there but I think the general opinion on the site is that things are… not so good.
Not trying to be an ass, but I'm wondering if there are any internal discussions on cleaning up /leftypol/ so there can be some actually better discussions on here? Or maybe growing the site? Just curious.
>>2848231I legit dont understand why most shooters fail. Doing what Luigi did seems to be the obvious choice. Just wait patiently.
>>2848234The deleted post was literally on-topic. A rabbi was just shot walking out of the pornhub HQ he worked at by an incel shooter who specifically targeted the pornhub HQ because he hates porn. That's what is being discussed in this thread right now.
>Now do this for the /iran/ thread, you fucking retards.They don't do it in this thread. They'll let anyone spam anything all day, it's just because this story involves Jews that xir is here in 1 second flat.
>>2848237I think a lot of them are in a really anxious, emotional headspace, and maybe realize if they don't do something
then and there they might "chicken out" as it were. I don't think most shooters are all that sane, to be honest.
>>2848234I already took care of that pseudo leftcom fucker earlier, report some more posts and I'll bring my hammer down
>>2848235Dont I know it. Yeah site quality is in the absolute dregs these days even when compared to our earlier years but the people with the power to actually change anything are afraid of "overmodding" so pretty much the only thing we can do is hire more mods and fill in whatever time gaps we have.
>>2848238And he also mentioned Jews, but what he said I think would be /leftypol/ approved. He was saying the Zionists give the good Jews a bad rap.
>>2848238It's not on topic and neither is this shooting because it's fucking Canadian
>>2848244So why not just ban this entire thread then? That's literally all the posts in the thread today.
>>2848237most of them want to go out in a blaze of glory with a big audience which results in them panicking when they pull out a gun in front of dozens of people and then they miss and get blasted by cops or security or just get tackled by a random office worker embarrassingly. they don't have luigi's humility to stalk a target and go after them at their most vulnerable. they're too low autism score for propaganda of the deed.
>>2848238That happened in Canada you fucking mongoloid.
>>2848242>I already took care of that pseudo leftcom fucker earlier, report some more posts and I'll bring my hammer downIf you're actually reading them great, i'll start reporting more. I spent weeks religiously reporting before, when one does this it becomes quite clear that you all dont bother even to look at the reports list for the most part.
>>2848244I mean you came in, left your message and still that's the only thing anyone is posting about.
>>2848245>>2848248Because the same person had repeatedly posted about the topic in this thread and multiple other threads in an active attempt to derail discussion. Now people are more discussing Luigi than whatever this incel shit is
>>2848242>Dont I know it. Yeah site quality is in the absolute dregs these days even when compared to our earlier years but the people with the power to actually change anything are afraid of "overmodding" so pretty much the only thing we can do is hire more mods and fill in whatever time gaps we have.I mean, maybe we can have an open discussion on how to improve site quality? Or maybe quality of the most popular threads? I understand its a limited team working for free so there's only so much that can be done.
Granted I'm sure there are people who'd heavily disagree with what's ruining quality on here.
>>2848256I think there is a general consensus we don't want any of the trolls and flamewars between you and Felix and all that other repetitive shit.
>>2848242> but the people with the power to actually change anything are afraid of "overmodding" Why don't you guys just use the website? You'd know what kind of shit is filling this thread with useless garbage. These trolls even regularly say there goal is simply to make this website unusable over and over again.
>>2848256>I mean, maybe we can have an open discussion on how to improve site quality? Or maybe quality of the most popular threads?you are platner
>>2848237Yeah this guy was all in on the LARP, with military fatigues and an SKS. He would've been way more successful wearing civilian clothes and armed with something more concealable.
>>2848131>hypergamy societyI hate retards
>>2848252>Because the same person had repeatedly posted about the topic in this thread and multiple other threads in an active attempt to derail discussion.Which guy are you talking about? Because it seems that everyone is posting about this topic in this thread and in the Canada thread:
>>2848261>>2848262 >>2848259>I think there is a general consensus we don't want any of the trolls and flamewars between you and Felix and all that other repetitive shitUnpopular opinion but CPUSAnon vs Felix is the only thing pumping blood in /USA/ at this point while waiting for elections like good burgers
>>2848259Buddy I DO use the website. A lot. For over a decade at this point. And for most of that time I've had to watch powerless as moderator inaction led to bad faith trolls, sockpuppets, and schizos completely dominating the conversation because there would be 8 to 10 hours periods where nobody was even online. Now that I can actually do something about it I'd like to at least make an attempt at salvaging something from this place
>>2848259>I think there is a general consensus we don't want any of the trolls and flamewars between you and Felix and all that other repetitive shit.Nah I get you man, and for what its worth I've honestly made an effort before to just not respond to Felix or people I suspect are him. Not always successful, of course, but for a couple months at least it'd be Felix losing his shit or that "you are epstein" guy responding to what I write and me just not, at least not directly.
I'm trying to do my part, for better or worse. Sadly the dude's obsessed so I think he'll keep it up endlessly.
>>2848264It's more just Felix losing his shit at me my man, and I don't think its pumping blood in here, I think it just actively makes things worse.
Like my personal thought is its like that whole "Nazi Bar" metaphor, by the time you realize you've "become the Nazi bar" then there's this feeling of "Well these are my only customers so if I ban them now I'm out of business."
>>2848270Mods should just ban third worldists and maybe leftcoms tbh. I'd welcome some ideological diversity if the discussions were high effort and good faith but they never are.
>>2848131Do you think he posted here?
>>2848270Yeah, I'm not blaming you. I know he is rather obsessed with you. I think it's best not to engage with him. On a broader note: I think if everyone who's not a troll and a wrecker should do more to post news or anything else even mildly interesting to discuss. I try to do it myself and I know it can be disheartening taking the time to clip and screencap things only for it to get zero replies inbetween whatever flamewar is happening at the time. That's the other thing we should do, is try and give replies to quality posts and just ignore the spam.
>>2848279That's pretty much my position, too. They both try to chase everyone and anyone out by accusing them of being the worst kind of reactionaries and then whine endlessly if they get any pushback. I think they, more than anyone else, are responsible for the diminished quality of discussion on here.
>>2848286Yeah, for what its worth I'm thinking of trying to put more effort into my own posts.
Real wage status
Pool status?
>>2848314NO matter how much you try to RE-INVENT (RE-THINK) things —- MATERIAL BASE STAYS SAME!
>>2848319People like to throw out this base and superstructure thing with no clear definitions.
>>2847900$100 that shit in there is just mountain dew.
>>2848314I mean too, maybe there are some people with prestige in society who I might consider respectable or honorable. Scientists and academics, philanthropists etc. But what are these people doing outside of their narrow main focus? Like the whole of society is just pretending like everything is going normally or whatever bad stuff that's happening is just a small fluke. I can't stand how weak-willed people are and how little they care about the big picture or the future of this country and the world.
>>2848327These individuals have no relatable connection aside from the shared anxieties of their positions as proles, which are presented to them through the same bourgeois consciousness which sells wealth to the poor and poverty to the rich
Industrial society is in decay. The most these individuals can muster is the same condition of neglectful dismay which reflects the symmetrical division of society into discrete enterprises wherein their entire position depends on the perpetuation of a well educated ignorance
>>2848327>>2848329That is to say they have no regard outside the confines of their slavery, even cheering where possible
>>2848326>$100 that shit in there is just mountain dew.I'll take that bet.
>>2848350>with a video from the day showing him looking miserable as he got his diploma before shaking his head as he walked off the stage.The true outrage
>>2848350>Tragic shooting happens involving a poorly integrated teenager with no recourse for their own perceived failures>"OMG HE WAS SO CREEPY"Kill me
>>2848314>we live in a society>brick and mortar quoteanother reddit tier edgelord
>>2848310what the fuck is the point of this
>>2847929>30 years for simply having left wing zines<"A few of the protesters spontaneously broke off from the main group and vandalized cars in the parking lot, a guard shack, slashed the tires on a government van and broke a security camera. When a police officer arrived on the scene and drew his weapon, one of the activists fired an AR-15 from the woods, hitting the officer in the shoulder. The officer survived."another failure of democratic centralism falling into undisciplined splinter groups, sad
>>2848177>making bombs that drop on palestinians is obviously of more consequence than sex videos<"sex videos""you dismiss the exploitation and trafficking of women as a nothingburger. To you their lives have no value" If I wanted to disprove this, I would simply choose to mention the people in those videos
>>2848375Anon, there is no vocals in that clip, just some distorted music.
>>2848279>Mods should just ban third worldists Israeli communists in their version of the DSA: "the symbol of communism is outdated because I don't know the names of anyone in our farms or factories like our undocumented Palestinian slave caste"
I'm gonna run into a cybertruck so hard it explodes
>>2848385mods should swat anyone who posts a soyjak
>>2848383motherfucker do you even MERZBOW
>>2848375>"My opponent is BLACK!"<"Race doesn't matter tho"The 2028 Republican primary debates will just be each candidate playing chicken to see how close they can get to saying the n-word without actually saying it.
The 2032 one will be that Vegan Teacher as the dark horse candidate running on a platform of reclaiming the n-word.
>>2848386You donโt need to do much for that to happen
>>2848366>another reddit tier edgelordProjecting much?
lol Darializa might win. Libs will be big mad.
>>2848403I just saw in the news yesterday the kidnapper said she dead.
>>2848405rip lil guth she was a real g or not i don't know
>>2848415Every election until the inevitable AOC presidency will continue to confirm the hatred of everyday Americans for the aipac machine. The stupid goy cattle have finally turned.
Claire Valdez won too. It's going to cause more centrist meltdowns because they were hoping Mamdani was a one-off.
>>2848418AIPAC won a seat in Maryland but this old-style NYC machine politics stuff is not working. Like you don't even get a free turkey on Thanksgiving anymore.
>>2848288Can yoy write more essays about how sorel or how bernie lost because of the blacks
>>2848418I think the best take on it I've heard is that a lot of people, even if they can't articulate a socialist or anti-zionist viewpoint, don't trust someone who takes AIPAC money not to stab them in the back in some other way.
>>2848423Boring. Write more essays about mosely
>>2848406the DSA candidates tend to heavily run up the vote on same day ballots too so it's looking good for her.
>>2848424Go to bed, felix
>>2848418>Every election until the inevitable AOC presidencySo AOC's gonna defeat Schumer in 2028, then run for president in 2032. Then what happens.
>>2848425She's got it. Espaillat doesn't have enough remaining votes in the Dominican neighborhoods to make up the gap.
>>2848426Babylon's whores here never rest. Theyve been going longer than i
>>2848429DSA sweep; a terrible day day for felix
>>2848431Jesus, you're a fucking loser.
>>2848422>how bernie lost because of the blacksBeing a flagfag or namefag your history gets remembered. That rant about blacks by cpusanon was bizarre but he grew since then
Hate the succ, hate electoralism, hate the cheerleaders of both, but ngl that centrist rage is hitting just right at the moment
>>2848400>>2848399>>2848415CNN just called it for her.
>>2848439>They are malding right now on CNN.Told ya
>>2848441<citing as her source the Qiao Collectiv^^^
>>2848444I don't know who this pretty lady is but she was just telling the guy complaining about 'radical socialism' or whatever, and she said:
>You have to understand that socialism isn't a scare word for people anymore >>2848436>>2848441>>2848440V)}OV<AITIJNGSHCUCUBUJMEDSN INTNCNETIRISIISFFIS JADOWN ASS
>>2848448ahahahaha hahhahahhaha hAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHA HAHAH
I AM SUCKING CENTRISTS INTO MY ASS AS I DAB LIKE A HORRIBLE VACUUM. THEY SCREAM AND CRY AS MY ASS BLENDER ACTIVATES. THEY ARE PULP FOR MY PROTEIN INTAKE
>>2848437What was the rant about exactly
>>2848455I don't know/remember but I think about Clyburn and Black voters shafting Bernard in the 2016 and 2020 primaries.
TBH there is a little something to it. I remember this working class Black woman telling me "Fuck Bernie, he's racist!" in 2016 while supporting "Hillary 'Super Predator' Clinton."
Is Fox News some kind of sick joke? Every clip I watch from there looks straight up like a skit, it's beyond just regular right-wing propaganda.
>>2848461Fox News feels like a Tim Heidecker bit that got out of hand for years on end
>>2848461>>2848463>>2848465Amerikkkans have no sense of satire which is how Bush-2-era conservatards actually thought Stephen Colbert was a legit conservative pundit for years
>>2848468
you are either drunk or are an LLM who has not received enough training data to produce coherent output
>>2848469I Ama mnaot odurank
obama era is back baby
>>2848470IG JAM NOT DRUANK
>>2848460>I don't know/remember but I think about Clyburn and Black voters shafting Bernard in the 2016 and 2020 primaries.
>TBH there is a little something to it.I wouldn't ascribe it to "the blacks" but the Democratic machine in South Carolina lead by Jim Clyburn absolutely did conspire to fuck over Bernie Sanders to the benefit of Joe Biden. This was well documented at the time.
https://www.blackagendareport.com/freedom-rider-black-people-lose-2020
>James Clyburn, the so-called king maker in the Congressional Black Caucus, operates on direct orders from the Democratic Party establishment who declared that the 2020 nominee would be anyone but Bernie Sanders. Clyburn and his cohorts make us all losers when they act in concert with people whose interests are diametrically opposed to ours. Clyburn has received more than $1 million in campaign donations fromย big pharmaย Political Action Committees. That means his machinations are never carried out for the benefit of the people he allegedly represents.https://www.politico.com/news/2020/02/26/jim-clyburn-endorses-joe-biden-117667
>โI do believe it will be an extra burden for us to have to carry. This is South Carolina, and South Carolinians are pretty leery about that title โsocialist,โโ Clyburn said Sunday on ABCโs This Week.
>Clyburnโs sentiment is widely shared by others in the Congressional Black Caucus, whose members have been more likely to endorse Biden โ the two-term vice president to the nationโs first black president โ than any other candidate in the race. lets get libbed up
>>2848460>>2848455I detest digging up old history and peoples' memories of it may not be accurate because I wasn't using a trip at the time; it was around that point that someone would take the name or flag I was using and then go over the top, hell I might not even be able to provide an objective account of it myself given I'm naturally biased towards, well, myself and this was years ago.
But long story short there was a pretty popular trend at the time that amounted to: "Black people are just de facto the most progressive demographic in America and have done objectively the most for socialism out of any group of people" and a parallel trend that "White people are de facto reactionary and bear responsibility for Reagan because of VOOOOOOOOOOOTING"
So I said if we're going to hold groups of people accountable because of voting, then Black people are responsible for Bernie losing the 2020 primary at least because they swung for Biden. Got a lot of "well it was older Black people" and "well that isn't fair" which I think was
way more charitable and nuanced than what you'd get as a White person broadly on the left (i.e. that you inherit some "sin" from your ancestors that needs to be expunged)
Anyways that trend kind of died down over time. Mamdani won despite not winning the Black vote and I think a lot of activists came to realize over time that dragging Black people into the forefront of struggles in which they can't see a direct line to their own personal struggle (such as trying to portray Israel-Palestine as a "Black issue") just… doesn't really work.
As for why the Black vote went against Bernie and continues to be wielded against progressives, most of it just has to do with the fact that the DNC still has a strong political machine among what could be termed a "Black establishment"; ministers and the like. I think a lot of elderly people get bussed out through things like predominantly Black churches and they vote for a slate determined by their ministers and the DNC establishment. Its not necessarily an ideological statement so much as a matter of the Dems having a well-oiled political machine.
Personally I think unless things change, we'll probably continue to see Progressives/Socialists locked out of some higher offices because of the DNC's ability to use their political machine as a checkmate. I think they even moved their presidential primary process to start in the Black belt first in order to weed out other attempts at a progressive coup.
>>2848432Millions must join cadres
hope and change guys
>>2848476>As for why the Black vote went against Bernie and continues to be wielded against progressives, most of it just has to do with the fact that the DNC still has a strong political machine among what could be termed a "Black establishment"; ministers and the like. I think a lot of elderly people get bussed out through things like predominantly Black churches and they vote for a slate determined by their ministers and the DNC establishment. Its not necessarily an ideological statement so much as a matter of the Dems having a well-oiled political machine.Agree
>>2848474Yeah, but there was more than just that as I was alluding to. There was this whole narrative going around that Bernie was racist and Hilldawg was the real pro-Black candidate in the race because Bill played sax on Arsenio Hall or something.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/03/why-black-voters-dont-feel-the-bern-213707/https://apnews.com/article/archive-fact-checking-8527360252Video edited to claim Bernie Sanders made racist commentshttps://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/09/23/on-twitter-bernie-sanderss-supporters-are-becoming-one-of-his-biggest-problems/On Twitter, Bernie Sandersโs supporters are becoming one of his biggest problems>Sandersโs predominately white backers are targeting black activists and journalists who dare question the candidateโs civil rights record.Meanwhile Black primary voters went for the architects of the crime bill Joe "Black children love playing with my blonde leghairs" Biden and Hillary "Super Predator" Clinton. Frankly I think it's fair to say they are one of the most uninformed group of voters out there and are easily swayed by whatever narrative gets pushed in Black media circuits.
would u vote hillary if she joined DSA and ran as the DSA backed dem candidate???????
>>2848492The craziest part of the story is that the actual "Corn Pop" himself ended up coming out and largely affirming it to be true
>>2848476We'll have to see how redistricting could change things in the future. A bunch of these majority black; democratic machine districts are getting drawn out, thanks to the new supreme court decision, no? Could open up the opportunity for a more populist multi-racial coalition based on class issues to be built, of course that is many decades of hard work out.
>>2848480Yeah I heard a ton of "BERNIE IS RACIST!" shit during the primary. It got way worse during October 7th too, because not only did I see a few "Progressive" Jews suddenly talk about how "complicated" the whole issue was (they'd previously been "DECOLONIZATION NOW!" types) and I saw a few comments that amounted to "If you actually care about Palestine enough to not vote for Kamala you're revealing your white privilege" which kind of just gave me a cynical view on how much universal ideals of justice and fairness are actually believed by people who invoke them.
Weirdest was a Black dude talking about how much "White people care about Gaza" but "They aren't even in the same country as you, so who cares?"
>>2848489I do think there is something to minority groups being extremely skeptical of the electoral prospects of a minority candidate until they are able to prove that they actually are able to get real results (i.e. win a primary). People often say Obama for example struggled with the black vote in polls until he won Iowa in the primary, proving that yes, white people were ready to vote for a black man for president. idk how true that is though. Same pattern here with mamdani.
>>2848501both parties are openly bourgeois and openly racist, it's just that the democrats are more polite about it.
>>2848487True either Vance wins in 2028 and brings on โpopulistโ neo-Conservativism or AOC restores the Obama era
>>2848501>old stock blackThat only exists in the south
>>2848505what? there's old stock blacks in the north too, especially in new england
>>2848499Might be.
A funny thing on the Hasan stream, Ryan Grim and Hasan's camera operator walked down the block to where Espaillat was canvassing. And this white boy who weighed as much as a leaf was heckling him about AIPAC and would just not stop, he was trying to disrupt his GOTV op. And Espaillat had this detail of big Dominican and black guys with him, and it started escalating with the white boy calling him a racist (because his campaign did seriously push anti-Haitian stuff) as Espaillat's guys tried to shoo him away, and one the black guys got mad and was like "you got a lot of nerve saying that here in Harlem you cracker-ass bitch." Like some generalizations are probably necessary when talking about politics but when it breaks down on the individual level it can get completely bizarre.
>>2848506Not that much I guess thereโs some pre-1776 freed blacks though THEYRE in small numbers and most black people in the north come from great migration
>>2848427Schumer is already dead New Yorkers just see his office as being occupied by a literal tombstone. Unfortunately the establishment is trying to run that worthless faggot Gavin newsome and he might just have enough anti-trump white guy charisma to win over the good for nothing liberals.
>>2848511maybe newsome will win? it's not exactly clear but if AOC manages to beat him amongst other groups, or even young men then there's a chance
>>2848511Schumer is so unpopular a dead skunk endorsed by DSA could beat him
>>2847836Is America becoming based and christpilled
>>2848518Alright, then who are you voting for?
>>2848518Honestly the left needs to form a revolutionary multi-tendcy United front 3rd party or whatever but they just vote blue though centrist liberals are so unpopular that even my liberal mother said she would only vote for โprogressiveโ dems which is small steps towards understanding that we should separate from the duopoly and take revolutionary action
i think we all have to admit that maybe electoralism and entryism were right and correct and valid
>>2848521In the big โ26
>usa electing leftists in Congress
>The global heckin south in latin America electing fascist after fascist the past few years
Your noble savage myth of the pure heckin wholesome global south is bullshit
>Regime changes!!!
No the latin Americans are straight up electing fascist over and over now
>>2848512>maybe newsome will win?Thatโs what worries me
>>2848513Fuck it man at this point the dead skunk could be taking aipac money and Iโd still think it was preferable to Schumer.
>>2848515She is the only contender you should vote for. Buttigieg and newsome deserve to be fed feet first into the wood chipper.
>>2848535>>2848540 (me)
im SO fucking sorry. wrong gif.
>>2848535They hate us cuz they anus.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1873/01/indifferentism.htm> โThe working class must not constitute itself a political party; it must not, under any pretext, engage in political action, for to combat the state is to recognize the state: and this is contrary to eternal principles. Workers must not go on strike; for to struggle to increase one's wages or to prevent their decrease is like recognizing wages: and this is contrary to the eternal principles of the emancipation of the working class!
>โIf in the political struggle against the bourgeois state the workers succeed only in extracting concessions, then they are guilty of compromise; and this is contrary to eternal principles. All peaceful movements, such as those in which English and American workers have the bad habit of engaging, are therefore to be despised. Workers must not struggle to establish a legal limit to the working day, because this is to compromise with the masters, who can then only exploit them for ten or twelve hours, instead of fourteen or sixteen. They must not even exert themselves in order legally to prohibit the employment in factories of children under the age of ten, because by such means they do not bring to an end the exploitation of children over ten: they thus commit a new compromise, which stains the purity of the eternal principles.
>โWorkers should even less desire that, as happens in the United States of America, the state whose budget is swollen by what is taken from the working class should be obliged to give primary education to the workers' children; for primary education is not complete education. It is better that working men and working women should not be able to read or write or do sums than that they should receive education from a teacher in a school run by the state. It is far better that ignorance and a working day of sixteen hours should debase the working classes than that eternal principles should be violated.
<It cannot be denied that if the apostles of political indifferentism were to express themselves with such clarity, the working class would make short shrift of them and would resent being insulted by these doctrinaire bourgeois and displaced gentlemen, who are so stupid or so naive as to attempt to deny to the working class any real means of struggle. For all arms with which to fight must be drawn from society as it is and the fatal conditions of this struggle have the misfortune of not being easily adapted to the idealistic fantasies which these doctors in social science have exalted as divinities, under the names of Freedom, Autonomy, Anarchy. However the working-class movement is today so powerful that these philanthropic sectarians dare not repeat for the economic struggle those great truths which they used incessantly to proclaim on the subject of the political struggle. They are simply too cowardly to apply them any longer to strikes, combinations, single-craft unions, laws on the labour of women and children, on the limitation of the working day etc., etc. https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1872/09/08.htm>You know that the institutions, mores, and traditions of various countries must be taken into consideration, and we do not deny that there are countries – such as America, England, and if I were more familiar with your institutions, I would perhaps also add Holland – where the workers can attain their goal by peaceful means. https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/communist-manifesto/index.htm>We have seen above, that the first step in the revolution by the working class is to raise the proletariat to the position of ruling class, to win the battle of democracy.
>The proletariat will use its political supremacy to wrest, by degrees, all capital from the bourgeoisie, to centralise all instruments of production in the hands of the State, i.e., of the proletariat organised as the ruling class; and to increase the total of productive forces as rapidly as possible.
>Of course, in the beginning, this cannot be effected except by means of despotic inroads on the rights of property, and on the conditions of bourgeois production; by means of measures, therefore, which appear economically insufficient and untenable, but which, in the course of the movement, outstrip themselves, necessitate further inroads upon the old social order, and are unavoidable as a means of entirely revolutionising the mode of production.
>These measures will, of course, be different in different countries.
>Nevertheless, in most advanced countries, the following will be pretty generally applicable.
>1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.>2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.>3. Abolition of all rights of inheritance.>4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.>5. Centralisation of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly.>6. Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State.>7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.>8. Equal liability of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.>9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.>10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of childrenโs factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, &c, &c. >>2848543>exclusive monopolyMarx was such a fucking tankie, itโs sad
>>2848548electoralism vindicated
Can I still be a true Marxist-Leninist if I have engaged in voting in the past?
Lenin forgive me, for I have voted.
>>2848514the FBA is such an obvious glowie psy op
>hey african americans, get mad and supremacist towards haitians and jamaicans NOW sincerely totally not bourgeois whitey hiding behind tariq nasheed >>2848563yeah sure go ahead fuck it nothing means anything
>>2848563i don't get why people ask questions like these. Like why do you as an individual matter to the movement. Why are you seeking approval from imageboard randos.
nobody cares if you voted in the past, or even if you vote in the future.
just stop
- making voting your sole strategy
- supporting the two main parties. (i literally don't give a FUCK if you vote for PSL or DSA or CPUSA as long as you aren't voting for democrats)
- the real long term goal is to build a militant party that is exclusively and explicitly for the working class, and uses both legal and nonlegal methods of struggle to constantly achieve real concrete goals.
>>2848518do the luigi or stfu
>noooooooooooooooooooo thats hecking adventurism, my goal is to scold voting and scold adventurism, and vaguely mumble "muh real movement muthafucka" whenever someone asks me what i'm doing >>2848476>So I said if we're going to hold groups of people accountable because of voting, then Black people are responsible for Bernie losing the 2020 primary at least because they swung for Biden. Truly retarded. Only a small minority of black people (6%) voted in 2016 democratic primary.
You know, I think all this post-modern trash turned this country into a joke. I love America and I'm proud of America despite the faults in our history. To me, America is the vanguard of mankind. Liberty, and justice, and truth for all. The first to ever do it. Obviously not without shortcomings and struggle. But America is probably the most progressive nation to ever exist, at least the most progressive that still exists. I think the English have been somewhat maybe the next progressive, but you look at their anthem and it's all about giving your life for King Charles or some stupid shit. America is the first nation that ever stood for any kind of ideals and the only one that survived undefeated until today. You can look at the patriotic songs of America and I think there is not one thing to correct. I think the only problem is America has lived short of its ideals and now in the present fully abandoned them.
Oh beautiful for heroes proved
In liberating strife
Who more than self, their country loved
And mercy more than life
America, America may God thy gold refine
'Til all success be nobleness
And every gain divined
And you know when I was in school
Oh beautiful, for spacious skies
For amber waves of grain
For purple mountain majesties
Above the fruited plain
But now wait a minute, I'm talking about
America, sweet America
You know, God done shed his grace on thee
He crowned thy good, yes he did, in brotherhood
From sea to shining sea
(America, America, God shed his grace on thee)
America, I love you America, you see
My God he done shed his grace on thee
And you oughta love him for it
'Cause he, he, he, he crowned thy good
He told me he would, with brotherhood
(From sea to shining Sea)
Oh Lord, oh Lord, I thank you Lord
(Shining sea)
>>2848590>I love America and I'm proud of America despite the faults in our history.95% of the existence of Amerikkka has been wartime. Get a grip. Destroy the cursed land of Babylon and Mammon
>>2848592Didn't the world get better in that time?
>>2848496But your entire party voted for Kamala
If socialism means being ruled over by rich NYC people then I'd rather just not
>>2848605But you will get more treats.
I mean, do you guys want to do some gangbanging shit, people getting killed in mysterious murders? Is this the path you want? This is feasible. A lot of people can be killed and the culprits never caught, but for what?
I don't give a fuck about NYC or it's politics. Rich coastal elites are not your allies.
>>2848499This is actually true. Jesse Jackson had heavy support from the black community overall but there was fear that he couldn't beat Reagan or Bush. Tragedy is if Jesse was only 20 years younger we could have had what people thought Obama was going to become
>>2848610And the percentage of the people charged are innocent of course.
>>2848612A * certain percentage of those charged and convicted.*
>>2848608>muh coastal eliteshistorically progressive force
You know, we are all so doxxed online, if it was me, I would find out where a target lived, look for their trash pickup schedule and then blast them out there when they take out the can.
>>2848440It is entertaining but I swear we are now going to have unironic electoral DSA shilling just like 2018
>>2848495It makes sense why they are freaking out about the black districts getting erased because those districts were political machined. Now what is going to end up happening is something new especially in the South where the blacks are not all holed up in one district. It will end up being a chunk of the population that more populist candidates who will try to gain black support and a bit of white support to win their elections. It will change the entire post-Civil Rights Act that has been in place since the 1970s and perhaps lead to a lot of changes. Even the NYC races showcases this
>>2848619You know, even better is just be in an out, break down the door, breach it with a shotgun on the locks or whatever, go blast their brains out, be in and out. I think that's optimal. Probably use incendiaries, interior situations can be tricky with no grenades.
>>2848623Also, just light the fucking domecile on fire and be prepared to shoot them when they come out, but you have to cover all the exits.
>>2848618Trvke we need to back to the countryside these NYC yankees
>>2848619>>2848623>>2848624What kind of glowie conversation is this
>>2848548<Xi Told Japanโs Abe He Wouldnโt Be a Communist If Born in the USXi would have lived a totally different life, and shaped by different material conditions, and life experiences.
Xi wouldn't be the man he is, without the cultural revolution, and the preexisting political culture, he lived in.
>>2848635I don't give a fuck, you and him are all lames, how about that?
My gooodness, I am an expert in what we can and can't do in the legalsphere,. I literally talked myself out of the handcuffs. We can do whatever. We can DO WHATEVER. Really, the sky is the limit. We can imprison all these faggots we choose.
>>2848638If the law won't accede to us, we can just enact our own justice and get away with it. That's how it is. It's so simple.
I'm really sorry being on the team of such cowards. You people are all absolute cowards.
>>2848642Gotta hand it to Houdini for posting about Palestine Action despite having an active case, and on the day the sentencing for the Prarieland crew happened to
>>2848644I dunno, what that's about, god bless him. I talked to the Houdini on the phone years ago but it didn't work out.
>>2848645I mean I still have his number if he still has the same. Maybe I should call him?
>>2848548Didn't Stalin say something once like "If I was born in the USA, I'd be a businessman"?
Let's get it going, I will make the CPUSA, Felix, Houdini, Ginjeet, get along. You know I know a lot of these people on a personal level. I have facetimes ginjeet lol. He is a cool dude. I had a brief phonecall with Houdini.
>>2848650I will never get along with anarchists or fascists and that is because I am an actual principled Communist. None of you have any idea what that's like.
>>2848656I already know which one you are Felix LMAO, you don't beef with me and I have no beef with you and I do agree with a lot of your positions.
>>2848644Still have not seen any coverage of Palestine Action vandalizing the CEO's house anywhere but his site
If you all want to talk to me I'm available. God bless you and do your own thing. That is my general opinion. Go get yours. I bless the next generation.
>>2848671I do what I gotta do, I don't care I if get caught
The DA can play this motherfuckin' tape in court
I'll kill you, I ain't playin'
Hear what I'm sayin', homie, I ain't playin'
Catch you slippin', I'ma kill you, I ain't playin'
Hear what I'm saying, homie, I ain't playin'
>>2848618they develop not only the productive forces, but are responsible for every thing, good and bad
>>2848605New York is the only good city of the US tho
>>2848682We are more real than NYC as a whole. We love 50 Cent.
I mean shit, uyghas is hard, but like we could end all of you in a day or two. Dead mean tell no tales or whatever. Like shit, if I joined the villains I would eliminate all of your quietly without notice. You are all such a joke.
>>2848644Here's his legal fund, one thing that fucks with me is that bro is stuck with a public defender because the arrest cost him his job. Plus it says in one of the updates that the state switching PDs right before depositions. Super sus.
https://www.gofundme.com/f/erik-houdini-legal-fund >>2848700suspicious. the trick where the state puts in a defence and will begin to work against the client
>>2848706Anyways, I remember an interview with the White bitch Chelsea Handler, and Oprah I could not find. There was some more silliness I was searching my memory for, but is there nothing more silly than taking this world seriously. I mean, Gen Z and aA and all that. I don't give a fuck about any of my progenitors, I hope you give none about me. Good on you. Fuck this world, amirite?
Reminder for the lobertarian who read this: the brutal inflation Argentina suffered under the administration before Milei occurred during one of the worst droughts in Argentine history in a country that depend a lot on agro, and that was compounded by the pandemic, the situation in Ukraine, and all the other droughts in other countries in 2023. That was an exceptional moment that will rarely happen again. The moment the agricultural boom and the Vaca Muerta boom falter even slightly, Argentina will be back to square one. Milei is the very definition of someone who fails but keeps winning by luck; his economic devastation in key sectors such as construction, manufacturing, and wholesale and retail trade is evidentโeven with the massive international aid he receives from the worldโs most powerful and wealthy people. Many world leaders have achieved much more with far fewer resources. And the argument about poverty reduction is nonsense. Credit delinquency has skyrocketed to levels not seen in 15-20 years thanks to milei deficit zero policy. Did people in the U.S. who are up to their ears in student debt magically stop being poor? Thatโs exactly what Milei is doing.
>>2848415shes so pretty. i would vote for her. electoralism is gay and stupid tho.
>>2848457>piclmao based
US manufacturing jobs fall at fastest rate since pandemic
>the left does anything here
>people start flipping out and sperging and talking shit
As an actual autist, you people are being fucking autists
>>2848780the leftypol/lefty imageboard experiment failed precisely because they removed themselves from activism. this site's purpose is just for critique and criticism of anything leftists do, not actually organizing or doing anything ourselves.
>>2848783counterpoint: it's better to do nothing than engage in pseudoactivity that does nothing but burn you out. "doing something" implies clearly set political objectives and the organizational capacity to try and achieve them. for example, we're already seeing a bunch of pro-palestine activists either withdraw from their activism or embarrass themselves
>>2848786>counterpoint: it's better to do nothing than engage in pseudoactivity that does nothing but burn you out. is this even remotely true?
like approach activism like any other skill: if you want to improve as an artist is it better to do nothing for fear of failing, or better to draw even despite knowing your art is bad, so you can learn how to improve?
>"doing something" implies clearly set political objectives and the organizational capacity to try and achieve them. it's a process, you really can't have perfect politics and political objectives without being out in the trenches actually talking to people and disrupting the state and seeing what works and what doesn't. you HAVE to fail to get anywhere. Lenin and Mao failed tons of times but didn't let this deter them.
>for example, we're already seeing a bunch of pro-palestine activists either withdraw from their activism or embarrass themselvesthis is just a glowie psyop, most activists have been activists their entire lives and never give up even when it fails. many of the same anti-war activists that opposed the iraq war opposed the iran war as well. "activism fatigue" is not real bruh. they're just cherrypicking a few individuals on social media abandoning activism to make being pro-palestine seem "uncool" because zionists are fucking terrified of young people rejecting israel.
>>2848171Society will be vastly improved when we lock all incels and femcels in an arena and let them kill each other with trucks
>>2848436kinda pathetic that real communist partiesโข can't get the same results. maybe because third parties registered to the government are designed to not win and are a waste of time
>>2848803
rejecting electoralism out of principle is retarded my man, the exact opposite of pragmatic lenin
>we'll have to engage in violent revolution one way or another. Electoralism will not bring victory.
legal politics is just one of the many schools of warfare commies need to be mastering to maximize the chance the inevitable violence is successful. think about how much valuable administrative experience DSA members are getting in zohrans admin for instance. are these people principles marxists? obviously not, so the lesson to those that are needs to be how open and free modern elections are nowadays and take advantage of that, the maine senate race has a 80 year old diseased geriatric vs a sex pest vet that had a hitlerite tattoo so its really the marxists fault for not providing a viable enough alternative to win such an easy election
>>2848802the only reason this is working is because the court is going out of its way to protect republican gerrymanders and strike down dem ones actually. if california was allowed to properly gerrymander its cities LA and NYC alone would account for more dem house seats than the entire southern gerrymander.
in fact the entire point of the voting rights act was to have big cities in progressive regions sacrifice some of their house seats to conservatives to make room for brown/black people getting representation in the south. it was a compromise. there was never really a net "gain" or "loss" to either particular group.
>>2848808Just participating in elections isn't electoralism. Electoralism is when you think participating in elections is the primary, or only, thing that can change anything.
>>2848803Maybe they're just socdems. Maybe they're even worse and just radblis. Maybe they're actually better and you're underestimating them.
>>2848551Doesn't really matter, because the candidates themselves aren't as important as the effect that a bigger and more assertive socialist org will have. We can't get to the revolutionary stage without movement and base building, which takes both parliamentary and extra-parliamentary work. We need to be able to develop the necessary material conditions for revolution before it can be possible; it's not something that can just be wished into existence.
DSA (and a coalition of other orgs/groups) will evoke article V after a sizable amount of metropoles and smaller locals are won, we will rewrite the constitution from the ground up, seizing the means of production and ushering in a new era of prosperity, both for this continent and the world, as imperialism will come to an end.
One problem.
Political power doesn't grow out of the barrel of a constitutional convention. A new document is just a demand, and a demand can ignored, who will challenge the mandate?
>>2848802Louisiana easier to win for us under the second map lowkirkingly
im just happy DSA isn't politically braindead. anti-ukraine positions are hard to find in the west
>>2848818>I chug american cock constantlyYes anon we know
>>2848818nta but i used to be firmly pro-ukraine until i realized it's politically better for us if the war is prolonged as much as possible to drain military resources away from the US(and by extension israel).
so now I'm not pro-russia exactly but a stalemate that eventually turns into a DMZ in exchange for the West making political concessions is the ideal situation. I wish Putin wasn't retarded and accepted this outcome like the based Iranians instead of suiciding his people to the meat grinder, but whatever.
>>2848822>oh no, they called me out for simping for ruzzia… uh… oh, i know, let's say they simp for america, thatll show emcope zigger retard
>>2848827trvke millions must understand space and time compression (maoist)
>>2848824NTA but that would only be true if there were socialist parties in Ukraine and Russia that stood to win from this the destabilization caused by this conflict. But there isn't, so all this does is hurt innocent people for the sake of imperialist profits. It's a bad situation all around.
>>2848829this is usapol though we're not here seeking justice for ukraine or russia but just what conditions are ideal for achieving our own goals.
a ukraine win would be bad for us because it would empower NATO. a russia win or stalemate are the ideal situation for us as it combats global american imperialism and weakens the political position of neoliberalism domestically and internationally.
Heartwarming to see the NSDAP make so many gains last night!
>>2848812A new constitution is the possibility of making a more coherent, structured, militant group, though. The DSA is currently just a loose org that doesn't have its own candidates in most of the time, so it still has the possibility to make changes.
>>2848829>NTA but that would only be true if there were socialist parties in Ukraine and Russia that stood to win from this the destabilization caused by this conflictwhat a narrow minded analysis
>>2848837the path to using the DSA for this means will facilitate building that group in parallel
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1912/nov/05b.htm >>2848830Russia is imperialist and participates in the neoliberal world economy too. Weakening America by itself isn't enough to weaken international capitalism. Even if America collapsed tomorrow the contradictions of capitalism would lead to a new hegemon taking its place, unless we have an international socialist movement that can directly take advantage of that state.
>>2848838"War is bad unless the international revolution can actually benefit from it" is narrow minded?
>>2848845>"War is bad unless the international revolution can actually benefit from it" is narrow minded?yes obviously. to reduce all world antagonisms to the far off distant goal of 'international revolution' is by definition narrow minded. lenin and mao and stalin and trotsky all had no issues analyzing it through oppressed/oppressor and democratic/fascist
>Russia is imperialist and participates in the neoliberal world economy toorussia isn't in SWIFT so this is delusional. they also have by far the most sanctions. america is using ukraine to do to russia what they successfully did to yugoslavia in the 90's so they are clearly an oppressed nation in the international hierarchy. also economically they're in the periphery, so not imperialist
>>2848849What's interesting about the Russian federation is they're in a unique position to resist US sanctions because of their large land mass and many borders with other nations, it is easy to smuggle things into Russia over land to evade sanctions, and also Russia is the one country that seems to have a large stockpile of every element on the periodic table, enabling them to synthesize many things through chemistry they would otherwise have to import. Also they have a lot of natural resources on their land they can survive off of. One of the reasons for the whole Ukraine fiasco is the USA wants the minerals of Donbass, which basically wants to be in Russia instead of Ukraine, due to its population being historically Russian (going back to before USSR redrew borders favorably for Ukraine twice).
>>2848824>>2848818>>2848816the Pro-Ukraine position is to be against America funding the Ukrainian military. The AFU and Ukrainian govt. is a coup government installed by America in 2014 for the explicit purpose of starting a civil war and proxy war with Russia. It is a bigger enemy of the Ukrainian people than the Russian federation could ever be.
>>2848862Thereโs no such thing as a โUkrainianโ, no nation or people exists. There are Malorussians and there are the Austro-Polish colonizers who invented the concept of Ukraine actively engaging in ethnic cleansing against the native inhabitants
>>2848865Lenin only allowed the party to make that SSR after his stroke in a hallucinatory fit, real sad
>>2848849>lenin and mao and stalin and trotsky all had no issues analyzing it through oppressed/oppressor and democratic/fascistUSA and Russia are both oppressors. Their capitalists (as do all capitalists) only care about themselves. Campism that does not ultimately benefit the workers is worthless.
>russia isn't in SWIFT so this is delusional. they also have by far the most sanctionsDoesn't mean they're not imperialist. They have megacorps/conglomerates that engage in consolidation, monopolization, a concentration, utilization, and export of capital to suit their aims… A capitalist nation that uses its economic and military power to achieve such personal goals of self-enrichment at others expense is imperialist. Shall we also claim that former fascist countries, practicing autarky and under sanctions, were also "on the periphery" and therefore "not imperialist"? Then you fall into the same insane line of thinking as people such as WEB Dubois, who foolishly defended Japan's imperialism of China on the grounds that they were opposing the "white nations" and that their imperialism was actually a form of Asian brotherhood/integration. Russia's actions within its sphere have real weight. They're not some helpless country that can exert no external pressure:
https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/306521/1/1907106030.pdf>Using Ukrainian export data for 2009โ2019 at product level, I study the effects of trade restrictions imposed by the Russian Federation against Ukraine since 2016 accounting for the impact of Russian occupation and destruction of productive capacities. … First, I show that the trade measures imposed by Russia were successful in restricting Ukraineโs access to its market. … Finally, I find evidence for statistically significant decreases in employment, number of enterprises or turnover in industries particularly dependent on Russian market and targeted by Russian embargo. Ukraineโs access to its market.>2848865Insane troll
>>2848845>>2848862>The AFU and Ukrainian govt. is a coup government installed by America in 2014 for the explicit purpose of starting a civil war and proxy war with Russia.wasn't it Russia that invaded both Crimea and Ukraine as a whole? Ukraine wasn't even doing anything to Russia at that point.
to be clear I'm not pro-ukraine I just don't buy the argument that ousting Yakunovich was Ukrainians declaring war on Russia just because they didn't wanna be ruled by a Russian puppet. Russia never had to invade Ukraine but did so out of its own geopolitical ambitions not because America forced their hand.
>>2848865>>2848867Read my post when I say the Ukrainian people I mean the people living in the area called Ukraine. the point isn't whether you see the Ukraine government as legit, but to reframe the conflict in terms of what the people actually living there want: They want to stop getting kidnapped off the street by a US backed coup government and thrown into trenches over some minerals in donbass.
>>2848870>wasn't it Russia that invaded both CrimeaCrimean population did not want to be part of Ukraine either. They held a referendum. Yes Russia invaded Crimea but that's besides the point. There's a clear difference between regions of Ukraine that were historically Russian and border Russia wanting to go back to Russia because the Ukrainian government is trying to ethnically cleanse them (we had plenty of videographic evidence of this that got lost in our /edu/ thread on the subject matter when the site's old hard drive died). and the USA intervening to destroy an entire region halfway across the world over some minerals. Imagine if Mexico tried to retake Texas. It's more like that.
>>2848872>They held a referendumat gunpoint, so it's not besides the point.
>the Ukrainian government is trying to ethnically cleanse themsource? but we know russia is attempting to do so to ukrainians actively
>>2848874The October Revolution also happened at gunpoint, so what?
>>2848876>russia taking over ukraine was the equivalent of the october revolutionholy the absolute state of leftypol
>>2848868>whining about campismoh, a brainless trot. just gonna ignore and filter
russophiles at it again
>>2848879The KPRF certainly thinks so and theyโre the second most powerful party in Russia, direct inheritors to the legacy of pre-revisionist CPSU and in a ruling coalition with Russiaโs natural party of governance. Meanwhile the greatest success of the western left in the 21st century was burning down cities to terrorize people into voting for Genocide Joe. I think Iโll listen to the winners
>>2848880I'm not a trot, lol (just because I don't stan one group over another blindly lmao). I accept your concession, though.
>>2848882The KPRF is literally a permanent opposition party that sucks Putin's dick so they can pretend to remain relevant while making money off of their status. They don't want power and they don't care about socialism.
>Russiaโs natural party of governancelmao
>>2848868>https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/306521/1/1907106030.pdfWhat is Econstor?
>EconStor is a disciplinary repository for Economics and Business Studies which offers research literature in Open Access and makes it findable in various portals and search engines. The service is operated by the ZBW โ Leibniz Information Centre for Economics. A EU Economics source here isn't the most reliable. They are some of the most viciously pro-American-imperialist thinkers out there. Like remember this conflict started because of the coup against Yankuovych. Yanukovych was given two loan offers, one from the EU, one from Russia. He chose the Russian loan because it was lower interest rate and came with energy deals that was already connected through existing infrastructure. This made America so mad they couped him and replaced him with Poroshenko. Then after the coup, Ukraine's coup government took out IMF loans that put them in massive debt to America, that the previous government refused to take. Same thing happened when Jeanine Anez replaced Evo Morales in 2019, but also when Thomas Sankara was killed and replaced by Blaise Compaore back in the 1980s. So a common theme with US coups is
>country refuses IMF loan>country is couped>new regime takes out IMF loansUkraine's coup government also signed over natural resources to US corporations, and specifically began preparing for a war with RUssia which Arestovich called "inevitable" as early as 2019, three years before Russia's invasion. What's remarkable about the coup against Ukraine is Ukraine was already a pretty obedient lapdog to the USA, contributing troops to the NATO coalition's invasion of Iraq despite not being in NATO, and making overtures to the Bush administration about NATO membership. So this sort of thing shows how deadly it is to be a US ally. You can apply the "inter-imperialist war" thought terminating cliche as much as you want, but any real attempt to keep score shows the US doing way more to meddle in the region than Russia. America is effectively pitting two ex-soviet nations against each other for its own benefit.
>>2848885Just because they arenโt actively engaging in color revolution against an anti-imperialist state fighting a defensive war doesnโt mean theyโre not communist
>>2848870>not because America forced their handfalse. russia invaded ukraine to stop the process of nato membership which had accelerated in the same way hamas attacked israel to stop the saudi normalization talks that were weeks away. the ukraine crisis is a defensive war on russias part
>>2848874i'm pretty sure the referendum was held before Russia took action. It's very easy for America to say it was rigged, but the sentiment on the ground seems to be fairly Pro-Russia. If Mexico took Texas tomorrow I would be okay with it two even though America and Mexico are "bourgeois" and "imperialist" one is clearly the weaker power, and I always the stronger power becoming weaker.
>>2848890he's talking about crimea 2014 not ukraine 2022. i swear you keep jumping into reply for me just to create more confusion.
>>2848885>both sides badle radical centrist has arrived
>>2848889>>2848876stay out of this conversation. you keep replying for me to make me look dumb and create confusion by taking indefensible positions i would never take.
>>2848872>Crimean population did not want to be part of Ukraine either. They held a referendum.a referendum managed by russian troops standing in front of the polls while "vacationing" in crimea lol.
lets not be ridiculous russia is not subtle in its tactics.
i do think russia should keep crimea and the rest of the separatist states though because they were already primarily populated by ethnic russians even before the war that were stranded in ukraine by the collapse of the USSR.
>>2848875
While you're here, what spurred you to make the John Henry site? I like it.
>>2848888>America is effectively pitting two ex-soviet nations against each other for its own benefitOf course it is, we're an imperialist country.
>the US doing way more to meddle in the region than RussiaYes, because the US is stronger than Russia, so it can afford to. I'm not questioning the degree of involvement, I'm saying that any involvement at all, for both, are the selfish actions of capitalists seeking to acquire more plunder for themselves at any cost.
>>2848893Yes, in WW1, all sides were bad because all sides were imperialist. There was no "Well the Russian Tsar is more autocratic so they're more imperialist than Germany so the SPD should vote for war credits." It's bullshit. All imperialists are the enemy.
>>2848895NATO killed ukraine peace deal with Russia
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkpKx6oMN0sTrump exploits Ukraine as a colony
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxxv2IEfU_cZelensky thanks US corporations for buying up Ukraine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYkQO5fOXH8Ukraine sits on trillions worth of minerals. US politicians want them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XuJLV2kfccThe war was avoidable, and basically instigated by NATO
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL4eNy4FCs8 >>2848896never heard of that website, not written by me but if it was it could be because of public persona management during current times
>>2848904>comparing the ukraine crisis to the first global imperialist war of exterminationfacepalm
>>2848881anyone paying attention to the historical context knows this conflict is NATO-driven
>>2848911Geopolitical Economy Report is 100000000000x closer to being real News than Fox News, MSNBC, CNN, ABC, OAN, or whatever burgerslop you consider reliable. I trust an American who fled to China much more than I trust the average American.
The working men have no country, except Russia.
>>2848911wish i could flee to china
I find this video interesting because Reihan Salam is the head of the Manhattan Institute, which is a haute bourgeois brain trust (appropriately headquarted on Vanderbilt Ave in Midtown, that's some of the most expensive office real estate in the world). He is a conservative brain bug though who attempts an objective analysis of the DSA. He has an admiration for it in a way that you'd have for an enemy. It's a different take from the "Gotham has fallen" stuff from Elise Stefanik:
>>2848900 which is slop. It's a different track which is why the billionaries give Salam money to explain this to them.
>>2848877There's some 50-year-old Egyptian guy out there who heard this song and enjoys it unironically and thinks it's really going down like that (not saying it isn't but you know)
>>2848927civil war 2: between commie north with NYC as its capital fighting bourgeois south centered in Miami
>>2848928Well the DSA is going to need to purge the Dems of all centrists and moderates first, the skeleton of the Democratic Party shall be repurposed for the workers' struggle
>>2848923It's interesting to see all this complaining/worrying about the anger behind the movement that fuels DSA and the surge of anti-establishment energy, but no mention of Trump or the current state of the republicans. Trumpism, maga, and the failure of the liberal establishment to combat it is a huge explanation that they are just ignoring, which is weird because just going off the vibes of these men I am sure they are no fans of Trump.
>>2848930yes i agree, though i wouldn't be suprised if establishment dems re-write election rules to purge the ascendant dsa first
>>2848932they will fight bitterly to the very last. I think they will switch to actively trying to throw things to the republicans before the end, outright sabotage if they can't have control. And when the republicans feel confident to start violently purging the left the establishment dems will collaborate. And then the next generation of leftists who carry on our martyred spirits will finally be cured of electoralism.
>>2848932They couldn't do that by just "rewriting election rules" because elections are state level, so they'd be playing whack-a-mole with a patchwork of state-run election systems plus party-level competition that plays out differently in each state. That's not to say the Dems won't do anything about DSA, since we saw in these and previous elections that they spent millions in attack ads and blocking endorsements and so on to deal with them, but changing the election rules isn't likely to be one of them.
>>2848937their whole existence could be a giant holding action for decades while letting the republicans rule and they'd still take that over letting go.
>>2848937you'll be amazed, although you should know better, at what they can suddenly do to purge leftists
>>2848938That's basically their existence already, when they aren't going Third Way and running the country (and the world) into the ground. Post-Keynesian/Volcker shock Third Way is essentially just that -surrendering even the most meager soclib/socdem gains to the far-right and faking surprise when the latter benefits from worker anger; that's why one in four Europeans vote for a far-right party now and why Republicans have gone full mask off.
>>2848939Still can't do much just yet if they go *that* route, unfortunately.
>>2848937a lot of america's problems are in fact "this same policy copied across 40-45 states" so don't completely underestimate that possibility. Rent control is banned on a statewide level across the majority of the country and has to be fought state-by-state unless we somehow get a federal overruling.
Where Salam is basically correct about is how ratcheting up conflict benefits the DSA because it's a motivating force that can be maneuvered politically. These centrist dickheads on Twitter don't get it. Like going full negative like flyers quoting Chevalier saying "Fuck Kamala Harris"
>>2848457 and then expecting people to be upset by it rather than agreeing with it, and the people who do agree will be more motivated to go out and knock on doors for her.
power needs to be centralized in the USA. fuck this states rights shit. only serves to impede progress
>>2848932>>2848933That would probably be the best thing for us in the long term, it would swiftly radicalize the DSA and push them towards Marxism and Anarchism even more than they already are and would force them to break from their class collaborationist elements. Puppetting the Democratic Party meanwhile runs the risk of all the "Marxist" energy being turned into reformism and then we get another SDP
>>2848940It's never been more JOEVER for the GOP
>>2848940lol thats funny. Lander quit dsa over their stance over october 7th and he still gets labelled a radical socialist
Good for NYC, but it's difficult to take the DSA wave to heart when you're in the bastion of reaction that is Texas.
>>2848839She is
Z too? She just keeps winning
>>2848950He wasn't endorsed by DSA either. They supported Alexa Avilรฉs. But you shouldn't expect capitalists and their mouthpieces to tell the truth (or even care, honestly).
Felix's only hope at this point is to start doing entryism into the DSA, assuming he hasn't died of a heart attack over last night's victories
>>2848932We are rapidly getting to the point where Democrats will have to capitulate to at least some of DSA demands and rely on it's organization machine to win elections; it seems like this is definitely the case already for the state of new york. In that situation purging the DSA will not be easy because it will be electoral suicide; doesn't mean some of them won't advocate to do it regardless tho. Of course the next step of the "dirty break" plan is to bring about election reforms that allow third parties to be competitive and the democrats will never ever allow that.
>>2848839>Rush and Krainelmfao idk why that got me but it did
>>2848827that scene always makes me crack up because the irish uncle tom says "they're trying to say we're no different than nyghurs!!!!!!!" when he sees the slavery abolished banner, then bill the butcher literally insults him to his face and says "you ain't" and instead of getting mad at bill he immediately chimps out at the nearest black people.
>>2848956they will inflitrate it dilute it subvert it. they're already doing it.
>>2848959i really like him a lot
also channel 5 went to palestine
>>2848969lol andrew hangs out with louis theroux
>>2848979You're free to snap your fingers and do a revolution whenever you'd like buddy
>>2848981that would require you dogs to be recruitable for revolution but instead you just mock him and tell him to do it by himself
>>2848959>with being an obnoxious TWister edgelord or ACP chud about it.*without
>>2848986At this point the most viable strategy is for Marxists to flood the DSA and turn it into an explicitly revolutionary socialist organ for armed struggle. The other option is to either retreat into some mutual aid "affinity group" or make your own microsect anti-revisionist party that will compete with several dozen others with about six members at most
>>2848988imo i think this is probably the best opportunity we've had for something like this in a long time and i'm trying to push my local org to get more involved with dsa
>>2848988once the DSA is turned into the American equivalent of the RSDLP it will experience the same issues the original RSDLP did, and split into bolsheviks/mensheviks, and then the american equivalent of bolsheviks (lol if such a thing is even possible) will also have infighting over issues like liquidationism etc. So good fucking luck! And this is all before civil war. But we are not Tsarist Russia. We are not 1960s South Africa either (looking at you guy who always posts about Joe Slovo). We are 2020s America. So it's a completely different type of state with drones and facial recognition tech and cameras everywhere. Good luck having civil war here. It won't be done with Mosin Nagants I'll tell you that.
>>2848991That is the
least farfetched and/or difficult path i have heard in over a decade >>2848988Dsa isnt a party though
>>2848981This is what I mean, this inane bluster. You losers do not have a party, you have handlers and careerist politicians. You run liberal zionists for a party that oversaw, armed, and defended one of the worst genocides in modern history and then have the balls to say that your way will lead to revolution? The way of voting and sloganeering, a way that has historically enabled fascism. If your views of the current situation are either capitulation to electoral reforms or just outlandish adventurism then you have already lost to the will of capital. If this is the mindset of the "socialists" within the dsa, then the bourgeoisie already has you fools by the throat.
everything right now will fail. you gotta wait for material conditions to worsen. climate change will eventually bring economic devastation and starvation currently unimaginable to USians. won't happen in your lifetime.
>>2848991At this point in time we dont have a strong enough left to even have effective infighting, and any revolution in America is going to have to be a synthesis with compromises between revolutionary factions because as you said this isn't Tsarist Russia or 60's South Africa. But the state can be beaten, it always can. We use what we've learned from the past to avoid factionalist infighting and refine our strategies as our campaign progresses, just as the Bolsheviks of old did
>>2848998I'm sure your 6 person anti-revisionist Marxist Leninist Maoist party that's an exact carbon copy of more than a dozen other parties of similar sizes will be the one to lead the revolution
>>2849000Mike Macnair argues something similar and although I don't agree with everything he says, I do agree on this point. We can and must do better than the past.
Wrongschizo is banned not because the mods are "zionist" or are afraid of his "truths" but because he responded to an earlier ban by spamming gore and scat on the TOR node a week ago, and now it seems he's trying to do the same thing here. Just to correct the record
>>2849005If any of this were actually true then why woild you bother addressing it and not just ban his network
>>2849005don't worry, no one buys his shit
>>2849002Quality vs quantity. A well read six person "book club" versed well in MLM has more worth than 1000 democratic socialists. Pound for pound.
>all this schitzo gore and scat postingTake this smut to
/b/ x.com.
>>2849005i did not posted yet gore and ever on here besides my post telling the DSA to fuck off.. i am not even a usano and i am using a university work computer and a phone… yet i get a 2 week ban for sectarianism agaisnt…. right wingers… if i can i will recite lenin's kautsky book to all of you and yet get banned for "sectarianism"
>>2849004https://redstarcaucus.org/points-of-unity/FWIW I think if you're ML aligned the Red Star Caucus in particular has a pretty good program, anti-revisionist and firmly based in vanguardism and ML theory
>>2849000I've been thinking a lot about what a modern civil war in America would look like. Even the Russia/Ukraine was is not a good model because even though there's a lot of drones and fancy tech, it's this monoculture of like masculine slavic white kinda chuddy guys on both sides. We are much more culturally and ethnically all over the place.
We need people who know drones, and we need people who know… bear with me here, prosthetics and make up. If you need to sabotage infrastructure on camera, you need a disguise to do it so the AI can't hunt you down later.
>>2849009It though when there are over a dozen competing book clubs with no more than 10 people in each state, all denouncing the other as revisionist fascists because only they are the true vanguard? Because that's the current state of the "alternative"
>>2849007>just ban an entire network for what one guy did lol>ummm if you explain yourself that means you're lyingi hate you wrecker so fucking much
>>2849012I have no faith in Americans fighting a war because the American left/resistance scenes have a unique disdain for anything that could be considered to be related to guns, warfighting, military tactics, prepper shit, etc just because it's usually associated with chuds and hyper-masculine guys.
Americans have deliberately discouraged eachother from learning how to survive against the government just because it feels cringe.
>>2849009>A well read six person "book club" versed well in MLM has more worth than 1000 democratic socialists.No lmao
>>2849016Eh that was true maybe like ten years ago but the American left has gotten significantly more comfortable with being militant since then. Obviously there's still a lot of room for improvement but we all have to start somewhere
>>2848996the party form is for civilization states like Russia/China.
socialism with burger characteristics will have a decentralized network of cooperatives, unions, militias, mutual aid groups, and internet propagandists vaguely working towards a common goal or something.
>>2849016>the American left/resistance scenes have a unique disdain for anything that could be considered to be related to guns, warfighting, military tactics, prepper shit, etcI also don't like larping
>>2849018> the American left has gotten significantly more comfortable with being militant nobody is touching the zionist weapon factories and everyone is dancing in frog costumes, what are you talking about
>>2849021its only a larp until the glowies come for you
>>2849022I'd say setting fire to warehouses and data centers is a positive development
>>2849016>American left/resistance scenes have a unique disdain for anything that could be considered to be related to gunslol what are you talking about. all USians are disgusting gun perverts
>>2849028You know the fact that it's Quagmire of all people making this point really kinda undercuts the message. The points are all valid but all Brian would have to say for a rebuttle is "dude you're a fucking pedophile rapist"
>>2849015moderators gave a 2 week ban to me even if i did not posted gore or other horrenduous shit or did that, in fact i am only active into /brg/, /hoi4/ general and maybe /isg/, or habbening threads. they banned me for saying fuck the DSA and brad lander, when effectively he is a liberal democrat rightist and welfarist. yet moderation take ages to be active and remove the homophobic or bigoted bait that take here on morning hours…
>>2849027bourgeoisie have fire insurance. the point is to prevent genocide, not burn all the toilet paper in california so it costs thrice as much to wipe your ass
>>2849034and yet brian does not manage to do that because he's a fucking lib lol
>>2849043
i report CP threads all the time and don't get banned. you are likely making shit up.
>>2848991I was watching sone YouTube shorts of army guys or maybe just tacticool dudes showing drone warfare. Which is sitting in a trench and trying to skeet shoot a tiny explosive flying around. Its fucked dude, 21st century warfare is brutal.
>>2849009Quantity has a quality all its own.
>>2849047>Quantity has a quality all its own.Your "party" votes for liberal zionists. They have no quality.
>>2849051Brad Lander was not DSA endorsed
>>2849051i really don't give a shit what the problems are with the DSA because right now we need something that can challenge democrats on a regular basis across the country to the point of at least holding some kind of voting leverage against them, before turning to running candidates themselves.
And it should be the more demanding elements of the left that swell and capture this banner or we're just going to let socdems carry it.
>>2849059When structurally you can not dispute with them, i thing garnering the support of partysmen and bases, splitting and denouncing them might be a viable strategy, as you leave the compromised socdems without leverage or you take the leverage with them, resulting into them showing the true colors of them or threading carefully and taking yout demands.
>>2849059Right, Republicans and establishment Dems clearly consider them a threat and they're only growing more and more popular. We can either take advantage of the momentum and build the much ballyhooed Real Movement in the process, or we can set up a gazillion Hoxhaist microparties who all claim to be the true vanguard of the American people while simultaneously having nothing but disdain for 99% of them.
https://redstarcaucus.org/points-of-unity/Like if you're an ML, what exactly about this program is so objectionable?
>>2849034>got distracted by video>ignored textfiltered for ADHD award
>>2849069but that's imperialist. you have to pull up your own army by its many thousands of bootstraps
>>2849073stalin said social democracy is the moderate wing of fascism
one decade before working with conservatives like churchill and liberals roosevelt to defeat fascism therefore a century later democratic socialists in the USA are literally clones of the freikorps or something because idk man i'm just riffing help me out here
>>2849076
actions speak louder than words and you have no actions.
>>2849078The irony is that that principle applies more to the dsa than myself or any individual.
>>2849081Amerikkkans are my enemy, not just the right-wing ones
Being an ultra inflexible pvre communist who obsesses over the minutiae of Eastern European left-wing politics from the 20th century (who all lost btw) and then projects what they've "learned" from that obsession onto the landscape of 21st century USA politics is ackchtually the only real movement, sweaty
>>2849077>stalin said social democracy is the moderate wing of fascismWhich is the biggest self own ever made
>>2849081Zohran aoc and the leadership of the DSA are the modern day Mensheviks/fredrich erbert spders they are the right of DSA while the left of DSA(revsocs) will either leave or be kicked out at the next national convention they are not us
>>2849095>>2849090it's just too easy
>>2848991civil war in america will be between bourgeois factions like warlord china, and will have to deal with foreign intervention taking sides. this is the political reality. people like bannon have wanted to smash the state for decades at this point, they'll welcome it
>>2849091Go dance in a frog cosutume to protest instead of telling me about your favourite e-celeb
>>2849099You're so sure there will be le epic civil war and act as if everyone should take that as a given premise to all left-wing political action in the USA
>>2849097>>2849090Thereโs a lot of similarities between tsar ist russia and the us during the 1st gilded age(1870s-1900) and the 2nd gilded age(1980s/90s-now)
>>2849101go post on a left-wing imageboard instead of doing anyth- wait a second…
>>2849102>spammed cp on Soyjak sitesOnly f-odists do that and failtrollls aswel as they have a hate bone for the Sharty and often falseflag and raid the sharty
>>2849104I bet you and I both like to drink fluids and walk around using the muscles in our legs, too. We're literally the same!
>>2849103Lol yeah. These retards will be geriatrics in 2060 going:
>Yuppp, anyday now, civil war's a coming, I feel it in my bones >>2849106Don't project just because you're a limpdick amerikkkanoid who thinks dancing in a frog suit like it's 1938 is the greatest threat to imperialism
>>2849103global imperialist conflict is inevitable thanks to capitalism. therefore, civil war is inevitable when declining america loses to rising china
>>2849108i mean yeah that is basically the foundation of communism, human equivalence.
>>2849095The DSA are basically our soviets. Go to a DSA meeting and you will see proles voting on issues that matter. They arent building strikes, logistics, or armed millitias like the mensheviks and SR did but thats because american socialism is democratic
>>2849113>global thing inevitable>therefor local thing inevitableLiteral non sequitur
>>2849116there would be nothing 'global' about chinese soldiers in san francisco anon
While I would say (and most people would agree) that the average user here is more intelligent than other forums… a lot of you guys are still not that smart lol
>>2849115True in order to build a socialist vanguard ml party best case is too get a bunch revolutionary anti-democrat chapters KF dsa(they exist) and split at the next national convention with the DSA splinter being a revolutionary socialist version of DSA separate from the democrats and more focused on organizing with it being multi-tendency revolutionary and we would also have resources
>>2849117>global conflict>therefor invasionsAgain man. You have to stop trying to smuggle these assertions into your arguments. At least put some effort into making your case
>>2849121>global conflict>automatically assume american soil untouchedrarted
>>2849121also you just implied that
>invasion from foreign country = civil warLike come on dude really think
>>2849122We're already in global conflict and american soil is untouched.
>>2849126Not to mention that Marx's Conflict Theory generally assumes that conflict is happening all the time at different levels in fluid ways that don't always manifest as militaristic kinetic warfare. Why is it that people think so rigidly about these things?
>>2849126>We're already in global conflictnothing could possibly be called global until india and china are involved so try again
i dont really know anyone who'd be in the kind of position to get anything close to boots on US soil. China maybe if it was very costly and they just schizoed out with a complete 540 degree policy turn, and like, mexico, maybe. Who else?
You're not getting an epic civil war in the USA. You're not having full communism through some great eschatological release where all the heroes triumph and we finally get our just desserts.
Instead, you're going to do boring shit where you go to a local meeting and vote for provisions to slowly move the ball forward, improving the lives of the working class gradually, as has been the case for most of the world throughout the 20th and 21st century.
Your epic revolution is only likely to happen in places like the Philippines where they don't even have capitalism yet, or Bolivia (less likely but still significant to mention) where the conditions are different from most places.
>>2849132>Philippines where they don't even have capitalism yetbwaahaha you're a fucking moron
>>2849131why would you when there's no point? We see imperialism retreating before our eyes with the USA LOSING (FULLY LOSING) the Iran war, and allowing for even more free trade between the global south etc.
People think war is communism, when it's actually trade.
>>2849132The USA will likely have a 2nd civil war(due to extremism the death spiral of neo-liberalism and the rise of China and the 2nd col war) in a few decades even liberals think that and the phillipenes do have capitalism
>>2849135Bro the workers in the Philippines are defacto peasants straight up. I'm sorry but that analysis holds. It's only a *mild* exaggeration to say that.
>>2849132It'll be a combination of strategically pushing reforms to the point where the bourgeoisie engages in open terroristic violence on the American people at large, from which point the organized parties work to bring about a revolution. The above ground and underground struggles are not mutually exclusive but work in tandem
>>2849136War is still communism Iโd wish for China to take more of an aggressive revolutionary instead of diplomacy though tge outcome will still be the same communism
>>2849141>war is communism>trade is communism>diplomacy leads to the same communism>people would prefer not to do war and instead do diplomacy>We will be doing more diplomacy than warThese are the direct implications of what you said. And I agree with this. This is why I do not BET on the USA having a civil war. There are more important things to think about, and single mindedly assuming there WILL be a civil war, in order for socialism to come about, is a strategic mistake.
>>2849138>the workers are actually peasantsread marx, lib
>>2849138Like the ONLY reason that Maoists in the Philippines are a force to be reckoned with is BECAUSE they can apply maoist tactics to their conditions because maoist tactics are designed for feudalism!
>>2849144The civil war will be similar to the fire rises hoi4 mod though with all of the militias state governments and communists though un idk there will most likely be a United federal government
>>2849143The reason why I like war is because it has socialism come to power earlier while diplomacy a bit later
>>2849145you know that peasant and proletariat are subsets of "worker" right?
>>2849147Maoism can apply to any rural capitalist or semi-feudal third world condition
>>2849134It's doubly ironic because the whole reason the crew got into that situation is because the Weyland-Yutani Corporation's pursuit of profit overrode basic human concerns. Maybe the alien wasn't the real villain if you think about it, it didn't choose evil in some moral sense.
>>2849148Timmy, no one cares.
No one knows what theyโre talking about episode #2 billion
I swear it's like some of you guys read stuff and absorb words but can't actually connect and use them properly in logical ways. Literal reading comprehension issue
>>2849153>timmy Go back to TikTok
>>2849151and yet it hasn't except for the Philippines and a few examples in Latam, where it's still barely working anyways. And when it does, it just gives way to a "progressive" liberalism when the revolutionary energy dissipates. I mean talk about "same outcome different speed". It applies when it works. And it only works so well, and it only works so well in only a few places. And if you think one of those places is the USA, I have a bridge to sell you
>>2849159>>2849155>>2849150my comment was for this guy
>>2849162What do you mean Theres like 5 Maoist third world insurrections right now and the map hasnโt succeed in overthrowing the government
>>2848979>Yeah it isn't a scary word as it should be, because you idiots reduced it to liberal theater. Your "socialism" plays into the real fascism and imperialism that continues regardless of how many votes are cast in these worthless elections. 100% this. How do I join your insurgent group comrade bilesplosion?
>>2849160
My eyes
>>2849166He doesn't have one because that would be petite bourgeois adventurism
>>2849150Lenins first published work was to prove tsarist russia was already capitalist, even though the bourgeois had not taken control. no sane person would argue the phillippines, where the bourgeois have control, is feudal, even though it has feudal vestiges like many countries do
Why cant they range ban the spammer? Its ruining my experience
I should've known a few anons talking about DSA winning last night would turn into weeks worth of posts in this thread:
>NOOOOO DON'T YOU SEE?!! DSA WINNING IS LITERALLY THE WORST THING IN THE WORLD! IF THE DSA DIDN'T WIN LAST NIGHT WE WOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN LIVING UNDER COMMUNISM FOR THE PAST CENTURY!
>>2849174Could be worse. At least The Authentic Aluminum Frederick isn't calling us all neo-nazis because we haven't shot up our local DSA gatherings
>>2849172Itโs hurting my eyes
>>2849170Those places in the country where there are feudal conditions are the only places the Maoists have room to move. Thats my point.
20th century epic communist revolutions only happen in backwards undeveloped countries with a relatively small range of conditions to allow it. If it were universally applicable, we would have had maoist revolutions in western Europe by now.
>>2849172But John, you ARE the spammer
>>2849170True
>>2849174The right wing of the DSA winning does nothing for the American left
>>2849181>left wing organization gaining power is bad completely and not a mixed bag whatsoeverBlack and white thinking, literally undialectical.
>>2849134stop making the DSA look based
>>2849184Didnt say that it does slightly heighten class consciousness but the โprogressiveโ dems are going to do nothing and not change anything and might even lower revolutionary appeal if were unlucky
>>2849188
Social democracy(who arent socialist) are tge people winning not some wholesome revolutionary demsocs or anything
>>2849191>local insurgent cellStop the larp bro you arent a insurgent but if you are just go to a different one and besides why are insurgent leftists leaving the instant a social fascist wins sounds like your movement has a lot of revisionists in it
>>2849186Listen man. You have this either or type of thinking that has been the entire issue with ultras from the beginning. Picrel is the old electron model to the new electron cloud model, that has probabilities and shades of grey within.
You're hyperfocused on "revolution" as something "clear" in your mind when the concept *itself* can be deconstructed in so many ways and can take so many forms.
I understand that there is an aspect to "activation energy" when it comes to political forms and their radical change, but there are so many ways to build this energy, and so many forms overlaying each other that to sit here and ASSUME the outcomes based on… not much evidence really? (outcomes being that the "progressive dems are going to do nothing")
And EVEN WHEN YOU GET THE REVOLUTION it still ends up kind of looking the same (china, vietnam, cuba etc). I propose you try and update your schemas, brother.
>>2849194WHAT THE FUCK DOES REVISIONIST EVEN MEAN! It's just a fucking buzzword man! THat was fucking 60 years ago read another book! It's like Harry Potter with you guys I swear
>>2849195Im not I said it could lead to more leftist thought being popular but the socdems will most likely do nothing also China were successful and progressive dems have done absolutely nothing look at Obama or Bernie the fact that there very moderate core policy of a higher wage hasnโt been enacted yet proves that nothing will actual change for the average wagie
>>2849199>Im not I said it could lead to more leftist thought being popularit doesn't
>>2849198Literally nobody is just suggesting vote for Democrats though, that's a strawman you came up with
>>2849197Revisionist is dustorringmarxs word itโs not just a ml thing it can be in non-ml circles aswel like anon was saying that his revolutionary larp group was losing members to fucking Brad lander likeโฆ.
>>2848460>imageI remember that BS and other shit like the news from niko house about sabotage within the Bernie campaign in North Carolina.
Man fuck the dems in 2016
>>2849200The socdem to communist pipeline does exist most people on this site probably started out as socdems
>>2849202>Literally nobody is just suggesting vote for DemocratsWhat party is the winning NY candidates a part of anon?
>>2849205we're not even seeing social democrats that fight for unions, wages and healthcare. We're seeing rad libs obsessed with race and gender
>>2849207Exactly though nobody is supporting the DSA except like 3 people on this site
>>2849201The DSA are like the rsdlp
>>2849208True though thatโs not what Iโm saying im saying as socdems get more popular communism gets popular though that doesnโt mean support aoc im saying support communism
>>2849207Dems aligned with the DSA which the Democratic establishment is shitting their pants over. And while they may be basic bitch succdems within the DSA are plenty of Marxists working in it to turn it into a revolutionary base like the Red Star Caucus, which I still haven't seen any real critique of. But let me ask you what you have done?
>>2849210What he meant was that voting can heighten class consciousness though the means to end isnt voting g but still revolution
>>2849199>progressives>ObamaDude do you even live here? lmao. NO ONE thinks that obama is a progressive. And Bernie actually HAS done things, and they are long lasting. Like bro there's more to politics than your reading group. You aren't proposing anything actionable whatsoever.
The states with more progressive dems in office get better concessions to workers EVERY TIME! Higher minimum wages, better laws for unions, better healthcare affordability, the list goes on and on! You just don't pay attention to any of that because you can just write it off as "well that's not acrtually socialism so it doesn't matter" and you will do this forever until you die.
>>2849212but agian its not social democrats that are getting popular its just liberals who are distracting from class issues in favor of race and sex issues. IDpol has always been used for this purpose
>>2849214That's not what he was saying at all retard. He was saying that if you vote yourself in control of the government you can do the revolution without fighting. Read the fucking post.
>>2849215True Obama started out larping as progressive then became the establish that is what the squad will do
>>2849216Idpol is dying though anti-idpol sentiment gets cooped by idpol capitalists
>>2849213True though those caucuses and actual revolutionary chapters should split at the next national convention and form an organized vanguard that has resources and many
>>2849218the ruling class will not allow you to vote them out of their dictatorship
>>2849216>idpolbro what the fuck are you talking about this isn't 2023. You retards haven't been paying attention. Idpol bullshit left the room in the last year of Biden and never came back. The uptick in Class based rhetoric in the last 2 years from progressive candidates has been astronomical in comparison, but you refuse to pay any attention because that would require reading about the eevul DSA backed elections which you've already written off as unimportant.
>>2849218You can but he still o;Ted for revolution as that was more realistic he said it was POSSIBLE not that it was the only way or a preferable(not saying idealistic) realistic route Marx did beleive it was ideal though not realustic
>>2849219>Idpol is dying though anti-idpol sentiment gets cooped by idpol capitalistsno it isn't.
>>2849224Yes it is the right larps as anti-idpol but is just idpol
>>2849224no no I agree with him, idpol is dying you just aren't paying attention or you don't live here. It's very clear. Sorry to say but its vibes based. You're just socially unaware or something.
>>2849208>>2849216>>2849227why is bro lying
>>2849225so you admit that IDpol isn't dying its just switching from idpol-A to idpol-B
>>2849226>>2849228sounds like you're just socially unaware
>>2849219>predicting the squad will become just like obama, even though they haven't done it yet for the past 10 yearsYeah I'm still waiting for "the squad" (which is also an antiquated topic now) to become juuussttt like Obama. Any time now.
>>2849221Exactly even some right wingers are developing class consciousness and either become leftists or regenerate into revisionists or just normal fascists without class consciousness
>>2849094did you read the rest of the post btw
>>2849229idpol is dying among the center and left. The rightards have always been Idpol, because they're racists. They complain about idpol from the left, when it doesn't exist anymore. That's different than saying that it's just shifting.
>>2849229No it still is dying thatโs why everybody hates it even the right is staring to concede on some class based issues and become nazbols or actual communists
>>2849221idpol is still here but for whites now, every time you say something somewhat leftist some retarded spic LARPing as a KKKracker will say
>y-you just committed a heckin white genocide >>2849231The squad will turn to Obama when they elect aoc to president or somebody like her
I think a lot of online leftists are too wedded to negativity (for some it's more important than their actual politics) so they have to find a way to paint successes as failures.
>>2849109it's not that crazy. we have had a burgerkrieg before. what was wild about burgerkrieg 1 was if we had remained a british colony, slavery would have been abolished without war in 1833. but because we were "independent" with states claiming the right to secede from the union, slavery continued all the way until the 1860s and needed a burgerkrieg to resolve. so the way I see it, the next burgerkrieg has to be a workerwar, because if it isn't, things will only get worse.
>>2849235no it still exists I think you're just lying at this point. Mamdani won on third worldist idpol
>>2849221Exactly a lot of people (from my lib mother to Nazis) are taking the 1st baby steps into understanding class consciousness soโฆ
>>2849237this is only true if you're terminally online
>>2849240I call it apophatic Communism. In apophatic theology priests can only say what God is not, never what he is. In apophatic Communism, they can only say what Communism is not, never what it is.
>>2849245You should do an organized split from DSA and form a communist version of DSA that focuses on organizing
>>2849242> Mamdani won on third worldist idpolthis is delulu, people were denouncing mamdani as imperialist in this thread, not some savior of the third world
>>2849244>terminally online The internet is the center of the market place of ideas a lot of reactionaries are starting to become leftists from [insert random youtuber] to Shartycucks
>>2849215>Dude do you even live here? lmao. NO ONE thinks that obama is a progressive. The only people who thought that were the libs in the first elections (& and maybe the second one) when was running as one then after when elected he was just a neo-lib at day one.
It's a strategy that every other country is copying now since.
One time a mod banned me 4 weeks because i reported a child porn "shota" thread in siberia with title "Boyloving thread."
Modcels are zionist pedophile DSA dick rider dem.cel Getchan loliboard hosting 4chaners. No life epstein moderators wait all day to ban me within 1 minute of posting basic and advanced scientific socialism. I make a post before bed and get banned within one minute. I work 10 hours and post and get banned within one minute. I sleep 8 hours and wake up and post and get banned within one minute.
The [GET] link at top of website goes to getchan which hosts child pornography. The moderators are epstein bloodsucker. Moffin is getchan pedo. Wobbly is a getchan pedo. Pasquale is a getchan pedo. Some others as well, but all are culpabile as the moderators hide names in ban logs to shirk responsibillity for their crimes while policing board for 8 16 hours a day.
The ban log indicates 155900 bans conducted over a handful of years by about six or so epstein mod incels.
Modcels cannot retort to this, only spend another 16 hours of their worthless lives deleting scientific socialism and the evidence of their epsteinism
>>2849240I mean itโs kinda not hard to be if you look at modern geopolitics and the world
>>2849231"the squad" hasn't become just like Obama for the last ten years because they haven't done shit for the last ten years.
>>2849242>idpol exists>volume of idpol rhetoric is droppingMy point is the second one here. You're like 5 years behind man. We were complaining about the dems using radfem and Settlers rhetoric and whatever critical theory bullshit to cudgel the Left 5 years ago, but we don't anymore because the establishment dems have stopped doing that.
>mamdani won on third worldist idpolWhat the fuck are you talking about? He won by appealing to very basic social democratic messaging that the working class responded to. And the only "third worldist idpol" rhetoric he used was "palestinians are people" because he was ASKED all the time, so he HAD to respond.
>>2849253At least you didnโt include the picture
>>2849252Exactly what Obama and aoc will do run briadly ,oderate left but rule right
>>2849256Itโs bait you retard nobody says Mamdani is an idpol third worldist
>>2849248>You should do an organized split from DSABrother, every fucking person in the DSA knows this. It the most obvious thing to literally everyone here, that the DSA is a tentative phenomenon.
The problem is that people like you assume that it should be done RIGHT NOW, when we don't have enough power to do so. Like motherfucker WE KNOW that we're dealing with capitalists and having to actually do politics, and WE KNOW what we're up against. But we literally only JUST started getting wins THIS YEAR. Like dude shut the fuck up, telling us to do what we already know! You're not in the fucking DSA, you don't fucking live here, you don't understand the specifics. You're not a fucking sage who's figured out the perfect strategy that the American Left as a whole should take. You don't have a special vision from behind the Theory Curtain. You're just uninformed and acting like you know best because you see yourself as a trve communist. You're not the only one who's read marx!
>>2849253Yes, everyone here aware the top mods are getchan nonces.
Not a long we can do about it. They own the domain.
Spamming this shit repeatedly however is not helpful.
>>2849221They can't even do idpol as a tool because the White middle class(key to being able to use idpol) has collapsed severe for the past 6 years. In the 2010s white privilege was easy to use but someone unironically saying white privilege gets destroyed because whites economic situation has severely been curtailed. A black professional was able to use idpol to silence criticism now doesn't have it anymore. With the remnants of the Voting Rights Act distracts dying, it will only force more class consciousness
>>2849258Why is this controversial that AOC is going to sellout the minute she gets into office? Some would say she already sold out by helping fund Israel
>>2849260No I assume it should be done at the keft national convention next year
>>2849261how did such a state of affairs even come to pass?
new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264new thread, all rise for the anthem
>>2849264>>2849258I'm sorry but no one here on the Left thinks that AOC will be the same as Obama. Literally no one here makes that comparison. You are just saying shit, when you CLEARLY aren't involved in these spaces. Like yeah, she's a lib by many metrics, but she isn't Obama lmao. No one is saying that voting a progressive for President will bring a socialist revolution. And yet you're using that imagined rhetorical line as a gotcha for why the DSA should become a communist party right now this very instance, and start a heckin revolution xD
>>2849263Never said it would be
>>2849266Hes baiting the working class and slightly caving into popular sentiment how are you falling for this
>>2849272Itโs true though sheโll be similar to Obama in her policies as President KF she rules and wow thread already teached the limit kek
>>2849265>No I assume it should be done at the next national convention next yearYou know that's fucking stupid lmao. "next year" is essentially right now. You are a child if you think that the conditions for a viable split will change between now and next year. You are so fucking out of touch and you are pulling shit out of your ass. Admit it dude.
>>2849277Thereโs a,ready growing sentiment most people in the DSA Dont like aoc I think itโs just ripe
>>2849258>and aoc i was talking about Obama
>Obama and>Obama>briadly ,oderate leftur gay
>>2849253you are correct and you must never stop saying it loud
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