>>2866866Previous thread:
>>2850517 >>2866866wayne rooney looks like graham platner and darksydephil had a baby in that picture
>>2866903Was it really wasted if it was money spent on an emergency healthcare response? Like you can't expect that to be perfectly economically efficient.
>>2866996I mean I kinda thought that at first, but like, £10 billion is a LOT of money, there was probably staggering amounts of corruption in that process
I'm proud I never liked this K-word. Was so annoying when that Borat movie was popular.
https://x.com/Tracking_Power/status/2076995499006075224>For those not quite sure about Sacha Baron Cohen or his racist 'comedy' characters including 'Ali G' (A Jew pretending to be a Muslim pretending to be black), have a little look at his pedigree.
>He is a graduate of the Habonim Dror School of racist comedy. A Zionist grooming and radicalisation vehicle for young Jews.
>Here's the article I wrote about it [link in replies]:
<The Habonim Dror School of Racist Comedy>Source: Al Mayadeen English 31 Aug 2022.>In their attempts to groom and radicalize Jewish children and young people, into ideological partisans of the ideology of Zionism, the Zionist movement seems to have fostered an identifiable strand of racist comedy. Zionist youth groups such as Habonim Dror are key to this according to the testimony of former members.
>The Zionist movement makes a very significant investment in the indoctrination of Jewish children and young people. In the UK, the largest group fundraising for the ethnic cleansing of Palestine is the United Jewish Israel Appeal (UJIA).
>It invests in a wide range of organizations for young people, all dedicated to fostering the racist ideology of Zionism. But it also schools and coaches young Jews in wider racist ideas and ideologies. How does this work out when they grow up?
>Take the example of a school in North London, the Haberdashers’ Aske’s School – now known more simply as Haberdashers’ after dropping the name ‘Aske’s’. This was because the Merchant, Robert Aske, was an investor in the Royal African Company which had a monopoly on the British slave trade. As with most areas of public life in the UK children who attend private schools are significantly over-represented in elite professions including in the entertainment industry. As it happens, significant numbers of nationally and internationally known entertainers attended the school including :
>Matt Lucas and Ashley Blaker who were behind the popular comedy show Little Britain.Robert Popper, who among his other activities was Commissioning editor at Channel Four where he commissioned Bo’Selecta and produced two series of the comedy Peep Show.
David Baddiel, the stand-up comedian, and co-host of Fantasy Football League.
Perhaps best known is Sacha Baron-Cohen who made his name presenting himself as a young Muslim (Ali G), pretending to be black, and then played a series of other Muslim comedy characters including Borat in the internationally known film of the same name.
>Work produced by all five has been criticized or removed from streaming services for racism.
>However, many of those involved in the British comedy world (such as Baddiel, his brother Ivor, Popper, Baron-Cohen, the producer of Whose Line is it Anyway/Mock the Week, Dan Patterson, and his colleague in both shows, Mark Leveson) also credit a little known Zionist youth group - Habonim Dror - as playing a role in their success. The Jewish Chronicle reported that Lucas was a Habonim alumnus. He subsequently clarified the was a member of RSY-Netzer, which was, however, also signed up to the racist ideology of Zionism, through formal membership of the Zionist Federation and thus the World Zionist Organisation.Read more:
https://english.almayadeen.net/articles/opinion/the-habonim-dror-school-of-racist-comedy>>2866996Well, benefits schemes are Orwellian, since it is an interpersonal process of proving your weakness to the state by interviews and forms, processed by GPs and DUP departments. The Job Centre is much more streamlined since you just fill out a form and get paid each interval.
>>2866996nah the procurement process was laughably corrupt. for example: tory peer michelle mone is currently being sued because she told the government they should give PPE Medpro a contract to give the NHS surgical gowns and face masks. they did, and it turned out the PPE they provided was so bad it was unusable. what she didn't mention at the time is that she and her husband had an offshore trust that got millions of pounds of profit from its stake in PPE Medpro. (PPE Medpro itself went into liquidation without paying the government what it owed, so they're currently trying to get it back of her, her husband, and the other beneficiaries.)
(long time scottish nationalists may remember her ditching Scotland for London in 2015 because the SNP apparently turned it into an angry, divided country riven with hatred and also loathed successful businesspeople like herself, and for getting into a twitter spat in like 2018 after they made fun of her for having a poor attendance record even by house of lords standards.)-
not going all in on this corruption angle is one of starmer's many failures. every single negative question by a Tory or Reform person was an opportunity to go "yeah well you and your bent mates stole [x] million"
Israel was never popular in this country.
I fear there is this collective revisionist history is being made, where, Israel was popular then Oct7 happened and then everyone turned against Israel, either because of the genocide or because antisemitism, depending which side of the culture war you are on.
Feel like the truth is, at least in my experience, Israel was widely unpopular, Israel and Palestine was used to denounce Corbyn, sowing the seeds of the culture war and muddying the issue, Israel steadily rises, Oct7 happens and this turns into an open rupture with the culture-war we see around the issue today.
>>2866996Anon, it was just handouts for mates. this was a scandal at the time.
>>2867172Fuck you on about, you know they make you come in to the jobcentre and constantly try to kick you off benefits right?
>>2867322So, what exactly is your issue?
>>2867435I need a train ticket…
>>2867324Separating 'benefits' from 'jobcentre' is incoherent, it's the same system
>>2867435i remember socdem flag advocating for "beautiful lady😍🥰, ayrshire" to be a wordfilter because it would at one stroke (a) annoy anti-trans idpol weirdoes and (b) show that the word is water off a duck's back by being playful and not actually removing it, just making it inherently silly when used as an insult.
mods didn't do it tho
>>2867443That's dumb and would just encourage them
Damn none of you bongs are watching the game? I guess all the footie enthusiasts no longer post here.
>>2867456i havent really been feeling like following the world cup since its being hosted in the US and i dont know where to watch it
>>2867456Don't like sports
>>2867456I just watch the highlights
>>2867456Not an England supporter and anyway I'll hear about the interesting bits from my friends and family
I'm rooting for England because Argentines have been so annoying lately.
ENGLANDDDDDDDDD
IT'S CAMMON 'OME!
something very unbecoming about twitter lefties trying to contort themselves to do "haha we won the falklands war" LARP but wokely
the correct take is that the falklands are irrelevant but that winning the falklands was psychologically ruinous for britain while losing could've set us on the path to accepting that we're a normal mid-sized european country that should focus on a high standard of living, not a half-nation half-empire justified in unlimited arrogance.
never forget: you can always say nothing!
Englishmen vs. Spanish Balconies, name a more iconic finale
>>2867476Why are people saying Argentina is zionist?
It’s over, lads…
Nooooo
Englerland, it is not over yet, but now I am going to be stuck here for another half hour. Goddamn overtime matches.
Hold the line.
Ok now I am mad. You cucks have zero momentum since the first goal. Cowards.
Has parking the bus ever worked?
no…..
Englernad…
Kane nonexistent all tourney
STARMER HAS RAN ON THE PITCH TO MAKE THE EQUALISER!!!
>>2867489My Prime minister…
YA BOTTLED IT
>>2867468secretly gratified to go look at their timelines and see them all riffing on Argentina when the score was 1-0, then going strangely quiet and talking about other things.
Counterstrike voice
<Zionists win
Binface status?
>>2867511they hate britain becuase they view the nakda as a liberation war from british empire. also because of today and muh islam and muh londonistan hamas qatar sadik khan
>>2867435Been there, nice enough place for a Scottish seaside town.
>>2867558>>2867511Pedro Sanchez, you know what you must do.
>>2867561Pedro Sanchez just extended Spanish jurisdiction of the Spanish border force over Gibraltar's external borders with Gibraltar's Schengen accession two days ago. Don't think they are supportive of the UK side in territorial conflicts.
>>2867513USians seem really insecure lately and constantly try to assert supremacy over everyone. It's odd because even critics of the country seem to need to insert this defense of its increasingly odious behavior *everywhere* even when its a total non-sequitor.
One part about English culture I really like are tea rooms. I love tea rooms so much it is such a vibe.
Why did you people job so hard against ArgenSSimians?
>>2867580He isn't a zionist nonce though.
https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/article-902589UK judge orders ICJ Palestine to pay £82,130 to British-Israeli IDF soldier it tried to prosecute>As covered by The Jerusalem Post at the end of June, the ICJP formally applied for a court summons to prosecute Soldier A for allegedly breaching Britain’s Foreign Enlistment Act (FEA) of 1870.
>UK judge orders ICJ Palestine to pay full legal costs of £82,130 to a British-Israeli dual national it tried to prosecute for serving in the IDF.
>The story, as covered by The Jerusalem Post at the end of June, is that the ICJP formally applied for a court summons to prosecute Soldier A for allegedly breaching Britain’s Foreign Enlistment Act (FEA) of 1870 by voluntarily serving in the Israeli military.
>The ICJP’s attempt failed dramatically in court, with Senior District Judge Paul Goldspring of Westminster Magistrates’ Court unleashing a damning polemic against the ICJP’s legal team. Goldspring called the attempt “egregious” and legally “inadmissible.”
>He also called it “fundamentally misconceived in law,” as the FEA does not apply to dual nationals.
>Then, on June 19, Goldspring ruled that the ICJP must pay legal costs to Soldier A, the exact amount of which was just revealed on Friday.
>In the new ruling, Goldspring ruled that, where a private prosecution is commenced on the “basis of culpable, profound breaches of the fundamental duty of candor, costs should be assessed on an indemnity basis to properly restore the Defendant’s position.”Lol. Israelis are literally above the law.
>>2867803Name of the judge? Where do they preside? Postcode?
>>2867821In the article right there, Goldspring.
>>2867803I do feel like this was a very silly use of money. Surely would be better to try to prosecute people for war crimes. It still wouldn't work but would garner more sympathy surely
It's amazing how many "Anti-Imperialist" Welsh nationalists with Palestine flags in the bio will drop that to support a settler colony (both a country and their own pet one) and Zionism's strongest soldiers.
>>2867882>Dismantling the idea of the Palestinian stateAlong with people's limbs
>>2867894Holy fuck that's bad
>>2867924Still never getting the Falklands
So Burnham is now filling his cabinet with rightoids, Starmerites, Blue Labour, Blairites. Didn't expect anything else myself.
Also fuck all Argenazi imperialists, you fascistic zionist dogs of war will never be allowed to ethnically cleanse the indigenous Falklands population.
>>2867828Argentina is far away from both Scotland and Wales and is basically irrelevant.
England is near both Scotland and Wales and, because it is part of a political union with them which it dominates by population size alone, creates lots of tedious moments where media outlets create the impression that England is the national team of the whole UK and not just one nation's team.
In the clunky terminology of "rationalists": Argentina is a "fargroup" while England is an "outgroup".
("a what?"
>An outgroup is a group of people you actively oppose and feel negative views towards, usually consisting of ideological or cultural rivals who live close by. A fargroup refers to people who are so geographically, culturally, or intellectually distant that you feel complete indifference toward them)Anyway, I find English lefties taking football too seriously far more unbecoming. Part of the responsibility of being the biggest country in the union (and getting the good deal of having most institutions back your side!) is dealing with the smaller ones taking the piss.
>>2867926The island of Diego Garcia is now Mauritian, Gibraltar's borders are now controlled by Spanish border guards and one day the Malvinas will go back to Argentina. Cope and seethe imperialist.
>>2867894this looks like a soyjak template
>>2867803My kneejerk reaction was literally the ICJP were just retarded, but then I actually read the legislation, then ran the legislation through various AI's (who are pretty fucking good at legal bullshit since they are replacing paralegals) and yeah… the court just literally made up some bullshit lmao.
There is literally no provision that allows dual nationals to fight in armies of foreign forces, with nations that are recognised and are at peace with the UK.
>>2867953One thing to take the piss (all for it, its just banter); another to see Welshies defend the mass rape of communists to own le english.
>>2867924basado
down with oppressor nations
>>2867924Are there a more cucked people than the Argentines? Forced to eat Donkey out of poverty but there are islands 10,000km with 2,000 people and sheep on so gonna reelect the guy who made them so poor in the first place? These apes didn't deserve Peron.
>>2868121Dan "deport the Sikhs" Evans on the unherd pipeline again.
Novara's Aaron Bastani did a video interview with the Telegraph (eww gross I know) in which he says Mao was evil, that modern China is socialist despite having free markets and billionaires etc, and basically just accepts the fascistic hosts' framing of every question and point without pushback.
lol not one communist is elected anywhere in the UK, not even at local council level.
continuity SDP and liberals, WPB, a million independents and "community first" groups, "Blue Revolution" (some tory?), weirdo right-wing welsh nationalists, cornish nationalists, "national flood prevention" TUSC, TERFs, and even "The Rubbish Party", but no communists.
and it's not because communists don't run. our communists are just so dire they can't even compete even at this level. they should all pack up and go home.
>>2868131> that modern China is socialist despite having free marketsHe explicitly reject the assertion that China is a free-market economy.
>>2868391our so called "communist" parties are really really dire
the only ones to run in the local elections a few months ago were a tiny hyper-zionist trot sect nobody had even heard of before, running broadly on a pro-israel ticket and trying to link the concept of communism to uncritikkkal support for israel.
that said, i don't think even getting a few genuine communist councillors elected would change anything at all.
for example when cornish nationalists win a seat, it doesn't lead to a spike in support for cornish devolution or a push in people learning kernowek.
grassroots support drives the growth of a movement, local council victories do not.
and in any case, a mass party of the working classes doesn't exist in the UK, and if it did it can't win in the farce that is the current electoral model even under ideal circumstances. liberal bourgeois democracy is built to keep us out of the running.
imo any such party should reject electoralism for the waste of time and money it is, at least initially, and focus on building rapport by helping local communities instead, attending protests, and raising class consciousness via day to day party activities and discussions.
of course that leads to the biggest issue of all - all communist parties in this hellhole always do at least one (and often several) of the following:
splinter, become social democrats, become terfs, become social reactionaries, become cults, have a rape problem, become uni student social groups, become newspaper pushers
>>2868391>WPBThey are technically are a Communist party. They wish for the UK to move to Marxist-Leninist state based on an adaption of the model of ML used by the CPC.
Yes, in reality they are more a Muslim interest party, like all of Galloway's vehicles, but they are "Communist" in the general sense of what we call a Communist.
>and it's not because communists don't run. our communists are just so dire they can't even compete even at this level. they should all pack up and go home.>>2868534Agreed on both, but honestly I don't think there is much UK Communists can do. Going to protests, running soup kitchens etc does literally nothing because for most of the country, community doesn't even exist anymore. I have no fucking idea who runs soup kitchens in my local area, nor do I care, and I think 98/100 people on the street would agree with me on that.
We live in an age of personality, what the left actually needs is people who are
>Very media savvy >Educated Marxist Materialist. Aligns to Materialist logic.>Very experienced and witty debaters >Aggressive/never go on the defence, always are able to cut through attacks by flipping it back on the attacker to make them look like an idiot.>Extremely likable/Charismatic>Already has a media/public profile so already has mass audience reach.>optional, but helps: 8/10+ in looks. Yes, these people are very rare, and tend to not be left wing, but Marx was someone like this, he ruthlessly eviscerated in often funny ways anybody who stood against him in debate, Lenin was like this, Mao was like this. There is nobody in the Western left who are like this.
Galloway is a witty debater, but he's a self-serving charlatan.
Corbyn was likable, but spineless.
Lynch is media savvy and and a witty debater and aggressive, but is terminally Labour Party no matter who.
Another issue is the UK left are disjointed themselves, swaths of the Left are Idpol obsessed woketard puritains who will literally not go out and support someone who doesn't agree with them on 100% of their idpol views. Meanwhile swaths of the rest of the left won't vote for someone who holds those idpol views. This is why honestly, Idpol shit should just be left up to referendums and not be focused on by Leftist parties, but again you get the issue if you don't openly vocally support LGBT no loads refused parties, or take a knee and cry police brutality when Jamaal Ngubu the gangland hitman is killed by police after he pulled a gun on innocent bystanders, a good solid chunk of the left won't come out to vote.
I mean for fuck sake, left voters abandoned Corbyn over Remain and "antisemitism" ffs.
>>2868625Guy sounds like a massive twat, of course he's right that the BBC is garbage and should just be abolished but I'm sure he somehow believes it's communist and not that it's reactionary filth. It's notably more right wing now than it was when I was younger, but he is probably too triggered by seeing black people on TV to realise that.
Him being raised by BBC 4 makes a lot of sense to why he seems like a massive right wing psued
>>2868625>>2868738Since the BBC sold licensing rights for Doctor Who, I knew it was the end.
>>2868621>I have no fucking idea who runs soup kitchens in my local area, The churches
>>2868740I feel like that's not really the big problem, but a highly questionable one for sure.
Here's some local news, apparently the unitary authority plans are communism, won't someone think of the poor greenfields…
>>2868758I mean I hate suburbs as much as the next guy, but it's stupid to tear up good quality housing from the Victorian era to build flats when we can use worthless empty fields instead
>>2868309He just has a lot of feelings, okay?
>>2868759Also, buying a flat makes no sense unless we get rid of the prehistoric leaseholding system, why buy a house only to get raped by a £500/month property charge you have no control over?
>>2868759I think we could convert fields into woodlands instead - and besides, many new builds on greenery has led to flooding and marshes because of deadlines. But this is typical British housing policy anyway. My friend grew up in a council house built on top of a bog.
>>2868771I'm not saying we should build in floodplains but we should end the NIMBY obstructionism that stops new housing being built. The rural folk near me are up in arms about how it's evil that the Labour government is letting the city councils control the land surrounding them so that they can actually grow, I say good, fuck the rural bourgeois pigs.
>>2868534>the only ones to run in the local elections a few months ago were a tiny hyper-zionist trot sect nobody had even heard of before, running broadly on a pro-israel ticket and trying to link the concept of communism to uncritikkkal support for israel.This came up before but do they call themselves the Communist League?
https://themilitant.com/2026/02/20/communist-league-points-way-forward-in-uk-elections/That would make them affiliated with the American SWP (absolutely *no* relation to the U.K. SWP). The organization itself is directly descended from the one set up by Trotsky's followers in America in the late 1920s but it transmorged into a batty cult. I saw them show up at AFL-CIO events around here with their card-table shrine and signs out supporting Israel.
<China disapproves of British Steel nationalisation decision by UKhttps://www.reuters.com/world/uk/china-disapproves-british-steel-nationalisation-decision-by-uk-2026-07-17/The dengcel rage about foreign countries nationalizing assets
>>2868778I am a NIMBYite myself, so I disagree.
But let's look at some statistics:
<On Census Day, 21 March 2021, there were 1.5 million unoccupied dwellings in England and 120,450 in Wales.https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/housing/bulletins/numberofvacantandsecondhomesenglandandwales/census2021<There were 1.34 million households on local authority housing registers (commonly known as waiting lists) at 31 March 2025, an increase of 1% compared to 31 March 2024 and the highest it has been since 2014.https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/social-housing-lettings-in-england-april-2024-to-march-2025/social-housing-lettings-in-england-tenants-april-2024-to-march-2025If councils buy up land in the first place, why not seize vacant properties as a priority? It's not as if we are simply without housing, its just that it is distributed inefficiently. Even the asylum seeker stuff is mysterious - why would foreigners receive free housing over citizens? If you rebooted the system, an increase in construction would obviously be rational, but if we are already exceeding supply, then making more than necessary is irrational, unless it is largely a con job by estate agents, which it largely proves to be. An uncritical YIMBY attitude doesn't address the system itself.
>>2868797I'm all for seizing vacant homes sure. But there needs to be a certain amount of elasticity in the system, it's inevitable some houses will be left empty if somebody dies, or somebody moves out but nobody else wants to move in due to what area it's in, etc. Houses also need to be close to jobs and services.
Idk maybe I'm a bit heated because I'm trying to buy a house in Plymouth and everyone on Facebook is such a fucking child. Yeah the council sucks and is corrupt but still better for the city to grow. I end up wondering if I should really put down roots in a place that's so Hitlerite, and everyone is screaming for the next defense investment. But I like my job and this is where I grew up. It's just sad and makes me want to think about moving somewhere that's slightly more left wing. But then is living in a council run by austerity greens really that much better?
>>2868822I wrote chud not child.
But yeah idk, I went to a protest against the Iran war a few months ago and we got attacked by fascists and Iranian diaspora filth, and everyone around was just insulting us and so on, it was really blackpilling, I thought we would just get ignored, but the military worship in this town is everywhere.
>>2868797Do they doe? I did look up on the asylum housing thingy, and it seems like a corrupt scheme where the government pays a bunch of unaccountable private orgs to find a way to house refugee people, who are often housed in squalid houses on cheap poor British land for a few bucks under precarious circumstances where they are employed in the informal sector in what can only be described as “modern slavery”, with the expenses falling onto local councils who already struggle to make end meets and would end up in bankruptcy if not for central government aid.
It really does a disservice to both British citizens and the asylum seekers who are cogs in the machine of fraud.
>>2868825Bet they consoome daily overdoses of AI slop on Faceberg, X’itter and ShitTok made by third world SA/SEA grifters looking for a quick buck LOL
But yh, sad to hear that. Guess like povvos are hopeless until we can get our own Platner onto British politics as a Green’s candidate, considering how before his cuckout Platner was actually capable of posing a challenge to the GOP in Maine
>>2868834>It really does a disservice to both British citizens and the asylum seekers who are cogs in the machine of fraud.Yes, and it principally concerns private profiteering, such as with the Asylum hotels. If occupancy is able to be subsidised at the drop of a hat, then zero people need to sleep rough each night. So, housing is not just a matter of production, but redistributing existing property.
>>2868834I'd rather fucking die than vote for some Neonazi. Fuck Platner.
Idk it would just be nice if there was a way to talk to local people that are actually normal. Clearly I need to stop going on Facebook but the last council election was like 90% Reform victory so hardly just online either. I'm tired of fucking babykillers and war profiteers and needing to be "the bigger person".
So yeah I guess I'll just ask an open question, for anyone that has fled to lib cities like London or Bristol or Brighton or whatever, is life better there? Or just the same thing?
>>2868825>>2868822Well yea, anon, isn't it surrounded by military bases?
think all the good people from Plymouth just move to London, Brighton, Bristol, etc. I've known some solid comrades from down that way over the years.
>>2868873 (me)
>>2868844>has fled to lib cities like London or Bristol or Brighton or whatever, is life better there? Or just the same thing?I'd say life is better here, yea. Obviously it's still shit because, this country, but better, yea. Going to other parts of the country for even a few days tends to make me pretty misanthropic and legitimately want to KMS, like you said, full of little hitlerite freaks.
You'd have trouble affording it though due to heavy gentrification. Although you can also just move within decent transport of a good city. I'd say Cardiff or smth would probably be quite reasonable.
>>2868873Yes, there are military bases here but it's hardly like that many people are actually in the military. There's plenty of fucking perennial criminals or just regular people that also drape themselves in the flag. I honestly feel like this city wasn't anywhere near as virulently right wing a decade ago. Doesn't help that the Labour council is corrupt and seems to be hated by everyone, but so was the previous Tory council, seems everyone has forgotten that.
I dunno, maybe I should pack up and move away, but I worry I'll just feel out of place anywhere, it's not like there's any communist cities in the UK. Idk it's just stressing me out, I want to buy a house and stop getting raped by landlords but maybe I shouldn't in such a rightoid place. Maybe I should be trying to find a job to run away to somewhere else even if I'm happy with my job here.
>>2868882I imagine it probably does pay a large part in local culture and politics though, i imagine the military people have a decent hand in local politics and so on, too. Could be wrong tho.
Either way though, yea, you might as well start looking if you can find a job somewhere else, i guess. I would if i were you, for your own sanity and quality of life.
>>2868897Damn I didn't realise it had the highest military population of anywhere in the UK 😭
>>2869149Probably the same shit Starmer says. Honestly Labor is dead for as long as starmerites and blairites remain at the top of labor’s leadership. These lots need to be dragged by force into the povvos and actually confront reality instead of living in their cozy ivory towers and pretend that communism is somehow a bigger threat than the reactionaries they love to indulge.
But ofc, in a democracy popular dissent is still less powerful than moneyed interests, which are aplenty in Westminster.
>>2869145>more student flats whilst homelessness continue to soarfucking kill me.
>>2869198foreign students are one of our few economic drivers TBF
>>2869206Yea and it's fucked.
Empty the foreign student lists.
Free and incentivized mass education for all nationals and long-term residents.
A portion of these mass of flats converted to provide a guaranteed room and support for every rough-sleeper.
>>2869199How long do we think he's got?
>>2869215Anon, you must realise that any changes to it will result in the fast collapse of this Ponzi scheme and British higher education as a whole. Letting it up will lead to a slow burn but in the same direction.
So either choice is fucked up.
>>2869218At most until the next election, if the war in the middle east escalates causing a price shock the party will disintegrate under its own weight
>>2868534i don't necessarily think it would change anything in and of itself, but having the organisational capacity to pull it off would be essential and "win a local election seat" is a good externally testable goal (e.g. the victory criteria are not set by the party itself, you either win a seat or you don't, and you can't rig the election.) so you can reward success and learn from failure, rather than retroactively going "wow, comrades, 1200 communist members managed to round up as 2,622 votes across 14 candidates, our best vote count yet" at a result inferior to that achieved by random old people with nothing better to do than form a local interest party or run as an independent.
though i think you're too dismissive of the merits of holding some form of elected office. one seat obviously isn't going to change the world, but if you look at the SNP, scottish independence basically wasn't taken seriously at all until 2014. the SNP got it taken seriously by going "look how competently we run the country, now imagine how good it could be if we controlled
everything rather than just the devolved areas", by making it imaginable and by running figures with enough stature that you could imagine them as leaders of a real country (unlike Scottish Labour who kept putting up local authority tier people.), and part of the reason they had that institutional skill level is because they worked their way up. (In 1974 they had just 80 councillors and one council under their control, and that was probably a high point because this was during the "it's scotland's oil" era + general disillusionment with Labour and Conservatives. In 1951 they could only pull in 7,299 votes) the grassroots pro-independence movement
mostly sprung up during the 2014 referendum campaign, once people realised it was actually happening. (hence the sudden surge towards "yes" as the "wait, better things are possible and i can campaign for them?" moment hit home.)
even in terms of detoxifying the idea of communism, being able to put leaflets around going "hi, it's your local communist, you're probably wondering why the streets look like shit. here's our budget: now here's our budget minus statutory obligations set at westminster: as you can see, we're not spending all your money on LARPing seminars, actually we're doing much better than [cherrypicked lib/lab/con/ref councils], here's how we'd re-arrange things if we had more power. you should send nagging e-mails to [local MP] telling andy burnham to give us more money. all power to the councils!", having people go "oh yeah, the only person who'd help with my bins / school / care / etc was a communist" is a good way to build goodwill.
(not that i recommend any of this as an
end, merely as a means of basically training people to complete tasks with something approaching set failure standards. you aren't going to build communism or indeed much of anything at the british local authority level, but you can build a party around succeeding at that level.)
i can't accept that bourgeois democracy is built to keep communists out of the running at the council level. at the westminster level, sure, its designed to keep basically everyone out, but it's insane that running as an independent makes you substantially more likely to win than running with communist party backing. that speaks to a totally dysfunctional party apparatus. if a communist party cannot round up ~1000 votes for a council seat or find a candidate to run in one of the small number of uncontested wards (and so get in by default), basically any other task will be beyond it.
at the risk of appearing contradictory: i also think that electoralism is a waste of time for communists and that they should do all those things, although in that case i think they schould eschew the party form entirely (hell, maybe even at the council level people should run as "independent communist", though that might encourage some more ego trips.) because having a party creates too much reason to LARP, to draw up the "party line" on Iran, the nationalisation of the top 200 monopolies, the necessity of combatting anti-stalinist revisionism, whatever, despite there being no purpose to this "Line" because it is tied to an organisation that cannot even round up 1000 votes in an inconsequential contest and so has no business talking like it will one day govern 70 million people.
>>2868621for the WPB i wouldn't count them just because they don't call themselves communists, although i suppose i have to credit the CPGB-ML for helping him out without fucking the whole enterprise up. (although their line, oddly, is that he's a socdem.)
having some leaders like the ones you describe would be desirable, but there's the secondary problem of getting a platform for them to actually engage with the public. There's no point having a second Lenin if the best he can do is post on leftypol.org. This is one area where a party apparatus and a little bit of electoralism would be helpful: the party can get you invited to all sorts of public events, and if you can get into local election debates then being the most sensible person there (easy early on if everyone's expecting you to go "all these people should be executed by the cheka, praise stalin" and you actually go "none of these people's proposed budgets add up, none of them can explain how your bins are going to be collected, all of them answer to their westminster parties and don't really care about this area")
i think you're wrong about idpol though. if you look at the demographics who abandoned Labour between 2017 and 2019, they're mostly the anti-woke pro-Brexit archetype. (old, poorly educated) while (despite getting most of the propaganda aimed at them specifically) younger and more educated people still voted Corbyn in Blair-1997 numbers. Some more numbers:
21% of Remain voters thought Labour was institutionally antisemitic versus 44% of Brexit voters
44% of Remain voters thought Labour was
not institutionally antisemitic versus 19% of Brexit voters
26% of 18-24 voters thought Labour was institutionally antisemitic versus 40% of 65+ voters
34% of 18-24 voters thought Labour was not institutionally antisemitic versus 20% of 65+ voters.
25% of Remain voters thought Corbyn was personally antisemitic, vs 48% of Leave voters
19% of 18-24 voters thought Corbyn was personally antisemitic, vs 45% of 65+ voters.
now, personally, i would be fine with every communist party fudging these issues (which, because of the level of institutional capture, is a little easier than usual. "do you agree with the supreme court judgement?" "i don't think we should have a supreme court at all, in a country where parliament is supposed to be sovereign, this should've been decided by MPs", "do you support the EHRC guidance", "i think we should abolish Quangos like the EHRC, where board members are paid £500/day to set us all against each other btw") because it'd be a big improvement on the status quo and because the only thing you'd really be forgoing is the ability to use pride as one of the many public events where you can promote the party, but it's important not to led superficial narratives cloud your judgement of how public opinion actually moved or of who is more vulnerable to having their opinions manipulated by the UK media apparatus.
>>2869271How do we get even one seat though?
>>2868780>This came up before but do they call themselves the Communist League? Yep, those are the ones.
>>2869206The absolute state of our economic system for this to be actually true though
>>2869583heartbreaking: someone who is almost certainly the worst person you know makes a great point
>>2869214Liz Truss 🦁 tried to deport Gammons to Doggerland and cut their pension while being trans-neutral and the establishment will never forgive her for this.
The Last Patriot.
>>2869199New Order = Progressive. Hopeful. Hip. Labour-coded. Tasteful. Pro-social. Life affirming.
Soy Division = Reactionary. Misantropic. Passé. ReformUK or possibly Restore coded. Grotesque. Anti-social. Suicided frontman.
>>2868780>>2869397I have met these wankstains IRL because they are """active""" in Manchester. Very strange bunch they ran a leaflet in the Gorton and denton by-election basically saying "Long Live Socialist Cuba and Bibiist Israel!". Their slur is "the meatpackers" because apparently they used to all join meatpacking plants to salt them. Their only guy under 60 is this random egghead who is a Unite Rep for BAE (who could have seen that coming).. They are actually crazy they aren't even zionist in an AWL way of "Oh dont you feel bad for the israelis who died in the intifwada" they fully endorse Benjamin Netanyahu it's mad.
>>2869691> Their only guy under 60 is this random egghead who is a Unite Rep for BAElel. fuck sake. absolute farce.
More oil drilling and Shabana Mahmood in No. 11
Yep, we're going to the right of the Tories with this one
Oh also Monster Raving Looney party are fielding 3 candidates in Clacton, because they're seething about Binface being more popular, although Binface himself is just some pro-EU guy who used to work on comedies at the BBC.
Seems a party can field as many candidates as they want in elections? I didn't know that
Although stands to reason that typically having more than one party candidate per seat would be an act of self sabotage.
Oh and half the people running seem to be independents with little to know information on them.
>>2869700Eyes of a crazed schizophrenic who has convinced himself that Netanyahu is Trotsky reincarnated
No one riot over the World Cup loss? Tbh it is kinda understandable if football fans crash out such terrible substitutions.
>>2869715Meh this is more clout chasing (on both sides) and less crashing out imo. Another symptom of declining English culture… 😭
>>2869590there's literally nothing wrong with it. britain is a basically irrelevant mid-tier country and educating a huge chunk of the world would be a good way to build soft power and good diplomatic relationships (who is going to want to blow up their old uni in a war?) while basically earning lots of export revenue (that's what people bringing money from abroad to buy tuition, flat rental, food, etc, are doing! they are boosting the balance of trade just as surely as exporting steel would!) and cross-subsidising universities for domestic students (who should get free tuition.)
and, best of all, it's already something we're half good at. it doesn't require any special leadership to make money with, it just requires some fairly easy legislative and planning changes + not totally fucking the sector up by, say, restricting student visas to meet an arbitrary immigration target. (students shouldn't be considered immigrants at all unless they get some kind of residence visa.)
"oh, but if you got a 10/10 developmentalist leadership like the ones they had in asia ages ago, we could make cars under a domestic brand again
we already make cars!! we make lots of cars, just not under british brands! just as the car industry becomes a commoditised adjunct to the battery and software industries" yeah, and in the real world what will happen is that a few hundred billion will be pissed up the wall on bribes to god knows who without ever building a single car because our politicians are 3/10 tier. they cannot build a domestic railway line, stop fantasising that they can conjure new sectors out of thin air and punch the principle of comparative advantage in the jaw to completely re-orient our economy towards your aesthetic fantasies and accept the reality that we should lean into the things we're already good at.
>>2869724You're such a faggot.
I just want my family to be able to have somewhere to live, an education and a life that is more than serving some bobo cunt student who won't ever learn their names.
>>2869704Well yeah, that's an image of a hustings for all the Gorton by-election candidates to sell themselves, they were all there.
>>2869752British End Credits
>>2869733and you think destroying the education sector will help you achieve any of those aims? grow up.
you're not homeless, tuition is basically accessible now even with student loans, and you shouldn't define your life by your job. (but if you really want to: there are still lots of infrastructure jobs! steer them towards network rail, the national grid, the water companies, gas companies, telecom installation, construction, all sorts of driving jobs, or the widely beloved NHS.)
>>2869757>you're not homeless,An incredible amount are in citrel and i have had family members who have been proper homeless and i have had to live on peoples sofas and with partners for a time. People tend to have to leave to get housed, even when they grew up here.
>tuition is basically accessible now even with student loans,As if that's the only issue.
<According to data from the University of Bristol and local education statements, 14 out of the 34 council wards in Bristol see fewer than 15% of young people advance to higher education.>While affluent areas like Clifton see university progression rates hit 100%, systemic educational inequality leaves parts of South Bristol ranked in the bottom 10 regions nationally for higher education access.<Hartcliffe & Highridge: 8.6% to 8.7% progression rate <Withywood: Fewer than 5% progression rate>Hengrove: 14.2% progression rate<Clifton: 100% progression rate (lmao)To reiterate; fucking sheltered retard.
>>2869586Britain is the Florida of Europe, it seems. Like, how much of a boomercon pussy you have to be to engage in moral relativism just because you don’t want to admit the Nazis were bad?
>>2869776Too bad Amnesty cucked out. I think it would be a great idea to have someone like contrapoints or some trans Leftypol anon have a live debate with Rowling at Oxford. Contrapoints sucks ass, but they’re competent on trans issues and could wreck Rowling.
Because let’s face it: The reason TERFs rarely get into debates is because they know they’d flop if they were actually challenged by other people.
For instance, Rowling is prone to naturalistic fallacies and using disinfo, forgetting that the trans position is one of ethics, not nature.
>>2869776A new publishing deal
>>2869776>Something needs to be done about online celebrityOr just log off twitter?
>>2869691They actually remind me of the German woketards who are basically idpol busherites and clintonites, and what’s worst is that it’s all out of spite for the German old left which was econ-focused in the Marxist tradition on the top of supporting Palestine against Israel.
That is the inverse of the dynamics in France where much of the French old left was Zionist since many of its members were Jews and shabbos goyim, in contrast to the French woketards who are still into idpol-tardism like their German counterparts, but with the caveat that the French woketards are more critical of Israel compared to the French “old left” (read 1960s left) since the woketards are lovers of brown people and their religions, as opposed to some principled anti-zionist stance. But that’s in the 2010s, not sure how things have changed in those scenes since 2020.
>>2869699They really hate socialists that much, uh?
>>2869794In this country we managed to get leftist jews who were anti-zionist.
Worked out okay for us really. For a time at least.
>>2869771leaving shit areas is a good thing. if you can get housed elsewhere, go elsewhere instead of waiting for a benevolent government that
isn't coming to help you.
you did not say you wanted an end to educational inequality, you said you wanted
your family to get an education. the former is much more difficult than the latter. if you're in a shit part of bristol, and shit parts of bristol have some of the worst access rates in the country, it follows that the best thing you can do for your family is leave, even if you leave for another shit area in another city the odds are that you'll increase their odds.
it is not being sheltered to recognise that a lot of people live their lives by default and won't gamble on making things better when they can wallow in the status quo, that indeed the UK is an entire country of people who do this because all our optimists emigrated.
>>2869918#nooticing it is also identical to every single radfem sob stories about being persecuted by BTC on campus
>>2869882It just confirms the obvious: There’s as much corruption in British politics as there is in American politics, and both American and British politicians are cheap whores for foreign lobbies and transnational oligarchs. In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if much of the “Russian interference” was less about Putin’s involvement and more about the few Russian oligarchs that have Putin’s favor trying to cut cheap deals in the British financial and real estate markets by paying off Westminster people, as opposed to actual Russian state lobbying.
And Robinson is to Farage what Rohm was to Hitler.
>>2869918Same in American campuses, where all the cries of Jewish persecution are just privileged Jewish students whining about feeling uncomfortable at goy students talking about Palestinian people being human beings deserving of dignity.
So much for all the hamstringing about Russian/ Chinese and Qatari interference when none of those lobbies have 1% of the power Jewish lobbies have across the Atlantic.
>>2869970Further proof that, unlike islamophilia and western interest in Buddhism and eastern mysticism, philosemitism is much less pure and based solely on a combination of tribalistic hatred of the “I love the crips cuz they hate the bloods” type and bourgeois class solidarity, considering how most radfems are middle and upper class bourgeois and petit bourgeois and will thus identify themselves with Borg-coded groups like capitalists and Israel over prole-coded ones like socialists and Palestinians and even trans people. Hence why I think philosemitism is far less stable and incapable of self-reproduction, unlike interests in Islam and Buddhism which actually involves genuine appreciation for them à la Guenon and Savitri Devi, regardless of their faults.
But yh, I never understand why radfems are entertained in the left to begin with considering how not only much of their support rests on institutional support within the imperialist and reactionary undercurrents of the bourgeois, especially TERFs given how niche their pet issue is, but also because radical feminism only emerged as a rejection of BOTH liberalism and Marxism for not centring women above all else. Like, just because they treat as a material reality doesn’t make them materialists since their rejection of Marxism is based solely on idpol BS on the top of the fact that radical feminism rests on two metaphysical premises:
- Gender essentialism
- Rapeceptionalism
The second is a term I coined myself based on the premises behind “sexceptionalism” which is the observation that society tends to treat sexual matters more acutely than non-sexual ones, and my term is related to that insofar that radfems really do see rape as this spectacular event that is so essential to human existence that questioning the very premise behind it is tantamount to gender-based violence.
And ofc, much like racial essentialists, radfems are too cowardly to take their logic to its natural conclusion or be intellectually honest about social constructionism.
As an example, if rape is truly biologically inherent to men, then we’d have to ask what else is inherent to men, and whether the disparities in outcomes between men and women that favor men are due to biology as opposed to patriarchy (as all feminists, radfem or not, assert). The funniest thing is that, for all of their mockery of “libfems” for taking the nurture side over the nature side, radfems often fall back onto liberal mores in many of their arguments, such as appeals to human rights which in itself is liberal considering that both the notion of natural rights (and its secularisation in the form of human rights) are liberal inventions, and relatively recent too (moreso human rights which was cooked up by anti-communists liberal conservatives as a tool to attack the left that was later on taken up by left-liberals).
>>2869601>New Order = Progressive. Hopeful. Hip. Labour-coded. Tasteful. Pro-social. Life affirming.New Order. New Labour.
>>2869691>Very strange bunch they ran a leaflet in the Gorton and denton by-election basically saying "Long Live Socialist Cuba and Bibiist Israel!".Yeah their American equivalents are very pro-Cuba too. I did buy a copy of a Cuban military commander's memoir of the Angola war from them because it was interesting when I came across their table. Pathfinder Press is their publishing house and they translate these Cuban books. They lean on Malcolm X hard too. It's like Cuba, Malcolm X, and then this die hard pro-Israel stuff. The members are mostly old Jews following a guru named Jack Barnes. So they've got this tiny U.K. groupuscle following them but the source of this abnormal group is in America.
The Militant is their newspaper. They had a moment in the 1960s with students who were coming into the left. Lee Harvey Oswald held up a copy of their paper in a famous photo of him also holding a rifle. He tried to join the party but they didn't let him so they sent him newspapers. They were a different organization then. I'm not sure how many members they have here now, maybe 100. They act like Jehovah's Witnesses.
>>2870712May Burnham be misericordious….
>>2870712the sex trafficker also has CSAM in his possession ?
crimes really are like pokemons,once you catch one might as well catch them all
based de lads.
>>2871116remember when every reply to the thread came out as this for a bit a few years ago
>>2871058Attenborough nature docs tho…
In all seriousness, the BBC could redeem itself if it older British media widely accessible, lowered the subscription price to that of Netfux, hired fans to write their shows, distributed more anime, made collabs with local British creators outside of the big cities, and actually made news impartial (the latter being impossible as it would require independence from the state).
Honestly, the choices ain’t good as both the BBC and the private alternatives are quite lousy, most of all the Murdoch media empire and the dozens upon dozens of outlets funded by hedge fund managers. The BBC iPlayer’s only upside is its lack of ads.
But that’s just me.
Built for BBC
If the BBC made good films and TV programmes maybe people would watch it
>>2871179I prefer private channels to BBC because at least they don't try to piss in your face and tell you it's raining. Channel 4 is a billion miles better than BBC (or at least less odious) and doesn't have to steal money from the public to survive.
My boyfriend sends me BBC articles sometimes so I have the misfortune of being on their website, it's fucking disgusting, the most jingoistic TERF radfem filth you can imagine.
>>2871319It's an industrial production centre for commercial entertainment
It will never go back
>>2871321does it even produce anything actually entertaining? it seems to just be a mechanism for spaffing massive amounts of ordinary people's money to unfunny celebrities that nobody likes or cares about
>>2871334Again, it's an industry. The content it manufactures is conditioned by the capitalist maxim of profit, its shows are the specular or inverted reflection of this, namely its corporate structure and institutional labour practices.
There is nothing entertaining, it's just the bland regurgitation of wider consumption trends narrowed into a political format which are the result of social forces it simultaneously possesses and lacks the capability of pinpointing. Even where the content may be said to be entertaining for the viewer, it's primary function is the propagandistic reproduction and obfuscation thereof of prevailing class relations. Not a shred of thought is allowed to enter the viewer's minds as all alternative ideas are expelled from conscious thought, and the very unconscious mode of its subjects existences are forced into an ideological straight jacket, denying them any ability for critical reflection whilst habituating them to the servility of their own subjugation through the decrepit ideals which sustain a mutual exploitation by the would be vultures - script writers, directors, bureaucrats - who profit from the insipid disgusting of their own slavery.
The BBC is the absolute apogee of this, along with every other media production service, it is just rendered all the more clear by its explicit orientation towards painting the political hegemony of a ruling faction in transition
>>2871358its primary function*
>>2871358disguising of their own*
The BBC will die with David Attenborough
>>2871133I wonder how seaside mark de lads is getting on these days if he's still with that retarded bint helen.
>>2871358But that's the thing, it's not even "giving the people what they want" in a bottom of the barrel ITV kind of way, it literally is not bound to try to please anyone at all since they get paid either way. Like who the fuck cares about "a celebrity newscaster", they're just a talking head, it's fucking deranged that some of them get paid millions
>>2871405They aren't there to please, they're there to produce. To churn.
Stop watching it altogether
the think tanks are angling to cut university entry numbers, in the case of the policy exchange by 6%/year or 30% over 5 years.
<good, uni students are wankers and uni is a scam to get you into debt
not good. as you may remember because i never stop banging on about it, the two things correlated with remotely left-wing politics in this country are youth and education. whatever their excuses, this is the actual reason they want to cut the sector: to cut down on the growth of the left and secure a more reactionary public.
The people of this planet do not deserve freedom if they will not choose it
>>2871464Counterpoint, freedom is responsibility and that’s scary
>>2871412I don't watch it, just pissed off by their audacity
>>2871469The responsibility of a slave to shatter their chains once and for all
If this godly earth consumes itself the universe, being a finite infinity, would be all the better for it. It is all or nothing, and in the last instance they must choose: socialism or barbarism.
This world is hell
>>2871449"An educated proletariat is a worker with dynamite" is something a Reagan advisor once said iirc.
The entire UK page of the Guardian has just become a pro-Burnham brothel upon his incumbency
Nothing will change, there is no hope. There is zero political will in the register of the public's consciousness for an alternative, precisely because so long as the conditions which render modern poverty necessary remains restricted to a particular underclass, and so long as Britain's support for genocide remains a political lever controlled by its ruling strata, then a nation of nearly 70 million people may safely ignore its descent along with the rest of global society into war and environmental collapse.
So long as you may safely shovel shit into your mouth whilst gorging on fossil fuels, so long as you are paid your stipend (a fair trade), and so long as you may glance at the issue of rearmament with the same recognition of necessity as like your masters, then you deserve this fate.
I hope the powers that be open Pandora's Box, and find that they cannot put the lid back on
What is Burnham's position on Israel?
Disappointed we never got to see Keir Starmer's cock.
>>2871882You're right that things are bleak but don't use the guardian as your standard for 'the left' especially since they got raided by police, they're just establishment shills like the rest that want to rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic
>>2871890Neither did his wife
>>2871891It's symptomatic of the general state of political and social regression within this nation
Because you cannot sell the idea of collective liberation it is as worthless as a mortgage note or paper money, the latter being the principal of the former.
We aren't on the fucking Titanic, the ship is about to split. The priority or the defence budget along with German rearmament to the tune of a trillion euros, coupled with the long term incapacity to transition away from fossil fuels and develop a solution to pollution of every time, it is a death sentence.
The order of change this country must pass through in its inevitable decline will push towards the extreme the antagonism of capital against labour and worker against the state. The demands of the day from all wings - including the bourgeois socialists of the SWP and the morons at the CPGB - is compromise. They do not understand that a policy of one nation socialism is too late and that their political programs are built on the anachronism of twentieth century dogma.
Now, of all moments either that titan of the globe, the proletariat, in utero, must emerge into the view of its proponents or risk utter defeat. Britain, along with every other nation, is advancing to the cusp of a revolution it cannot forsee because it has yet to enter the minds of its dismal intellectuals upon its own nature.
Commies should do more to push victimhood mindset among the working classes as a form of "identity politics".
The British working class were literally treated in absolute complete inhumane conditions up till like the 1930s. Average British heights dropped over 7cm over industrialization while Soviet ones grew 10cm over Soviet Industrialization. Areas of the UK and London had over a 50% child mortality rate.
Instead of constant "muh slavery", "Muh atlantic slave trade", Left should be demanding reperations for the condition that the British working classes toiled under. UK didn't even abolish child labour until a decade after the USSR lmao.
>>2871906Windrush built Britain.
>>2871882The Guardian has always been controlled opposition were you asleep when they were shitting on Corbyn relentlessly starting from 2015?
>>2871906Nah, this is a bad idea. It's why every Labour MP has a sob story about growing up in a council house despite having grown up to become a lobbyist prick. Their reparations come in the form of being able to loot as much as they like now that they're rich because they're a working class boy/girl come good.
All of the British class identities are poison and they should all be destroyed. Whatever the hypocrisies of "classless" societies, they are nothing compared to the nonsense of the British caste system.
>>2871906If we were to use the same standards used to classify Pol Pot’s actions as genocide, the same standards can be used wrt how the British elites (both Labour and Tories) have treated the British working class. I mean, letting the British working class die of hypothermia because the elites can’t be bothered to provide an affordable energy grid is already an egregious example.
>>2871918it was the same when sir Keir came to power they had an article about hwo he was a sex symbol
>>2871981That article was the most accurate piece of journalism the Guardian has produced in about 20 years.
>>2871995the fabians have been part of right wing conspiracy lore for a while. those look like bots though.
>>2871995I'm assuming some artificially boosted retard on twitter taught them a fun new word
>>2871995The entire Labour leadership contest is a behind the scenes power struggle between the judeo-freemasons and the judeo-fabians.
(((They))) don't want you to know this.
>>2871995>>2871998>>2871997Rupert Lowe fearmongered about the Fabians on JRE.
Of course, the Fabians are the right wing of Labour, comprised of such members as Blair and Starmer. You can see the Fabian resistance to Corbyn and his left wing faction in this article:
https://labourlist.org/2020/04/how-labour-under-corbyn-rejected-fabianism-and-lost-elections/The reactionaries of this country would benefit from understanding that leftists are themselves against the Fabians, not their servants. For added context, here is Lenin denouncing the Fabians (1915):
<The Fabian Society is undoubtedly the most consummate expression of opportunism and of Liberal-Labour policy. The reader should look into the correspondence of Marx and Engels with Sorge (two Russian translations of which have appeared). There he will find an excellent characterisation of that society given by Engels, who treats Messrs. Sidney Webb & Co. as a gang of bourgeois rogues who would demoralise the workers, influence them in a counter-revolutionary spirit.https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1915/jun/x02.htmI saw Carl Benjamin claim that Burnham has filled the government with far-left communist lunatics. This is the naked ignorance which we have come to expect. In any case, I am not hopeful about Burnham.
>>2872003>judeo-freemasons and the judeo-fabiansThe Masons died off in the early 20th century, as Rudolf Steiner informs us. You can support the Grand Lodge by buying merch though:
https://shopatfmh.com/ >>2871979I don't really see the advantage of brown rice unless you are on a diet of only rice (I mean I've been there but beans aren't expensive)
Man dealing with Zoomers on reddit, Woke "DECENT FUCKING HUMAN" shit has honestly turned them into the most fucking pathetic thin skinned pussies.
Literally could have the US turn into Evangelical hell hole handmaids tale and they would still be "Well, you can't actually say Christian theology is at fault here, because some Christians oppose this, i'm sure, it's actually bigotry to say that Christians want this, because my friend Steve is Christian, and he said it kinda sucks" *Poll says 99.9% of Christians think this is awesome and approve*.
Even on shit like r/Atheism, people are like this now, what the actual fuck?
Surprised the Elites haven't come up with "People of wealth" or "People of homes" to describe porkies and landlords and have a horde of young naive moronic Zoom zooms rush to defend them because actually having a spine is being a meanie poo.
I thought us Millennials were the pussy spineless generation, but looking at how Zooms talk on Reddit, and X and on Tiktok, we're actually fucked.
I kind of realize one of the reasons, I along with a lot of the Stupidpol, Redscarepod/rs_x, TAFS, etc types seems to get banned often and cycle through accounts, is because we're simply from a far more wild west mean internet, which gave us way more backbone than whatever the fuck is Reddit and such today.
>>2872094>RedscarepodYou could have left this one out
>>2872094You need to read McLuhan and stop getting worked up about what people say on a website that incentivises them to be that way. There is no such thing as a neutral communications medium that impartially passes along your message. The telephone cannot show you pictures, the lightbulb transforms the world despite having no content at all, and Reddit makes people into Redditors.
Most of the "wild west internet" is/was similarly dogshit. Imageboards (and Twitter-likes) are deeply dependent on moderator taste to stop the bottom from falling out (4chan/Twitter) but also moderator restraint to stop stagnation and death (/leftypol/'s inward turn, ideological homogeneity, and slow-burn death.), but don't worry, I PM'd you the fix. :)
(yes yes twitter isn't "the wild west", i say twitter-likes because he's citing stupidpol and red-scare, we're hardly going down the iceberg to golgolmois and the fact Britain technically independently invented the imageboard and it's still online.)
>>2872003I had an uncle who was into all that freemason shit. I think it just means you learn funny handshakes and get off of court easier for things like drink driving.
>>2872094>>2872103Also in general, what you're describing is literally the result of massive algorithmic manipulation of the subaltern hegemonic ideological consciousness from the big tech bourg. They bought tiktok, they took away r/all, they bought twitter and turned it into psycho right-wing brainrot.
The methods of mass communication are 80% compromised. Piercing through that veil is harder day after day. Which is why mass politics that can spring through the false map of the "hyper-real", hyper-commodified haze of literal propaganda, misdirection, and distraction is
absolutely necessary.
And this means… Getting socialism into the zeitgeist,
forcing the intelligencia to react and platform us (like how they brought Gustavo onto Fox News last week). This means it was good when we ran Bernie sanders, because DSA membership skyrocketed and "socialism" was a word in people's mouths. We have to continue to do this. It's the only way to get the attention of the masses.
>>2872094Your buddies from redscarepod and stupidpol also wants to facilitate the mixed race gay conservative christcuck takeover so i don't know makes you think you are more intelligent than the moralfag intersectional zoomgolems.
>>2872103Gone to shit in recent years, but it's still in theory a community of us old SomethingAwful/4Chan/lolcowfarm millennials.
Also Redscare was at least interesting to me in finding out so much of the old 4chan/SA types were actually female users.
>>2872105Of course, but what has changed on Reddit to make it this way? Go read Reddit threads from <2016 and Reddit back then is far closer to 4chan in tone and discussion, than the spineless pussy libtard central it is today where everyone is a narc and runs to the mods because they saw an opinion they don't like.
>Imageboards (and Twitter-likes) are deeply dependent on moderator taste to stop the bottom from falling out (4chan/Twitter) Hot take, but 4chan has always had the best moderation out of any site, it found the right balance. Only problems I ever had in terms of moderation, was of course, Snacks becoming a meglomaniac for a short while, and /a/s moderation was far too strict to the point you had nowhere on 4chan to discuss Manhwa because if you tried to then discuss it on /co/ the jannies would tell you to fuck off to /a/.
That said, I still think moot mismanaged 4chan in the end. /pol/ left in the state it was is a mistake and /his/ should have been around since like 2006 when people demanded it all the way back then.
>>2872114last generation to be normal unironically.
>>2872116Agreed, but again, what pisses me off is how Redditors instead of hating this, reinforce the system, instead of just downvoting, they now downvote and report. It's so fucking pathetic and annoying. I'm burning through Reddit accounts at an astonishing rate every time I step out of the Stupidpol adjacent communities.
redscareuyghurs in partical are pretty open about trying to manufacture consent and a safe space for hinterland & exhurban lolbertarian-christroaches on the behalf of the GOP into the secular cosmopolitan areas of American society. They are also dysfunctional sexual deviants which chinaflaganon normally hate but not when they are anti-trans and get artificialy boosted by PreP golems from SV apparently.
Odd fellow, very gay indian coded guy that china flag anon.
>>2872116You are both too optimistic and too pessemistic in blaming algorithms. Right-wing brainrot slop is, in large part, demand-lead. All that the big tech bourg have done to facilitate a rightwards turn is take off the guardrails that used to limit how bad things could get. In the case of 4chan specifically, it is true, mods actively facilitated and facilitate rightwards turn, but much of the general turn to retarded contrarianism was home-grown. Fundamentally, in hindsight, I think Google's 2017-era right-wing slop spam reflected something organic rather than Google trying to pull things right at that point. (Musk, on the other hand, artificially tries to boost right-wing slop and it only provokes the resentment of most intelligent users, convincing a small number of people at worst.)
The mirror image of this is the rising popularity of socialism, rooted in the same basic forces. The same social media that allows people attracted to right-wing slop to coalesce is also what allows those opposed to it to coalesce. This is the basic force behind the rise and fall of e-atheism. (Low agreeableness debate-bro types + proto-SJWs in coalition against Bush era Christians, followed by the debate bros realising it's more fun to mock Islam and the SJWs realising that Christianity isn't the beginning and end of social injustice, followed ultimately by debate bros realising it's more fun to go all in on Trump and post-SJWs becoming self-identified communists.)
People are meeting their psychological needs with these sites semi-independently of bourgeois manipulation and the spill offs for that on the left in isolation are positive. (e.g. most SJWs were, in fact, pro-Bernie despite high-profile bait articles passed around /leftypol/ at the time, and most have now soured on Bernie justifiably for his weakness on Palestine. Despite almost all the anti-Corbyn wrecking being aimed at this demographic, it still voted for Labour in Blair numbers while the people who peeled off are, psychologically, tabloid readers.) The concurrent rise of right-wing slopulists willing to pander to this demographic is unfortunate, but things were tipping in that direction anyway because British tabloid slop is basically 90% of the way to right-wing Twitter today anyway. (Britain is anomalous in this regard. Why our right-wing and our press in particular are so irredeemably awful is worthy of further study.)
The rise of the left (or at least the popularity of left-wing ideologies) is all the more impressive for the underlying incompetence of the actually-existing left. It is difficult to watch Your Party and conclude that 2017 was anything but a total fluke, difficult to watch any of Britain's communist parties and conclude that it's a tendency that could go anywhere, difficult to watch /leftypol/ and believe socialists will ever avoid self-sabotaging. And yet, and yet, and yet…
Being glib: having people believe that you have to be a socialist and socially progressive to be a
decent fucking person is good, actually. Most good people want to be good people! "To be a good person, vote [Corbyn/Green/Communist]" - winning message in the long-run! (See the 'yes' side's monopolisation of "better things are possible" in Scotland for more of this. Again, despite mostly being run by the malicious and the incompetent over the last decade + actively being fucked by Westminster wrecking.)
Let all the vice-signallers burn in hell and all the virtue signallers enter
the kingdom of heaven without god without praying and the good of this world without working.>>2872145- The underlying tendency of Reddit has always pulled this way. You cannot have an upvote and downvote system without it pulling users towards a certain blandness, a certain conformism.
- Sites hadn't fully cross-pollinated. In 2016 Tumblr was still relevant and /leftypol/ still had ideological diversity.
- Dominant strategies had perhaps not yet been optimised or people had not yet been worn out by a decade of seeing the same bad posts. If you'll forgive a reddit analogy: think of it like a Skyrim playthrough, where the average player can start as a warrior or a mage but will pretty much always turn into a stealth archer because being able to attack from a distance is a dominant strategy without any real downside. 2016 is before people realise that reporting is more effective than downvoting to get rid of posts that piss you off, but that underlying feature is already baked into the site layout.
- 5 I am open to some change in the new reddit layout c. 2018 being responsible for this. Perhaps it made the report button more prominent, or some other change. I do not use Reddit enough to comment directly.
I will be quite honest: if I used reddit, I would probably downvote and report. If someone is making shitty posts, I want them to have a bad time. I want them to encounter as much friction as possible so that they do not post again. Now, I personally wouldn't use this for posts I merely disagreed with - disagreement is fine so long as I'm not bored - but if I'm bored? If I'm rolling my eyes because I've seen this slop before? All bets are off.
You give 4chan too much credit. A large part of the reason it's the shithole it is today is because RapeApe actively babysits rightoid slop even when it violates the rules and shits up non-/pol/ boards while being paid for it. I personally wish 4chan would die and western imageboards would stop seeing themselves in its shadow. (A tendency in /leftypol/ that has fortunately diminished a little over time, but still not enough.)
/leftypol/'s moderation is better than 4chan's, though mistakes are more noticeable due to lower PPH (and you'll disagree because you find yourself on the wrong end of it. no offence, of course.) and I won't go to bat for some of the administrative (rather than moderation) decisions like adding dead boards in the face of repeated explanation that this isn't how you generate discussion on a topic. (fuck, WHY.)
>>2872151What we need is an alliance of woke-liberals, neoliberal sociopaths, and nice communists to put the GOP freak coalition back in their box. We WILL collapse all social differentials. We WILL make a girardian scapegoat of Peter Thiel and his flunkeys. We WILL deregulate the coca cola bottling, car dealership, and entire-British-economy sectors removing the material basis for right-leaning economic-but-not-cultural elites.
If you want a vision of the future, imagine Lisa Simpson pushing Bart down the stairs, forever.
bridget phillipson kinda bad tho
Why the fuck has bonkers burnham put Wes in defence?
>>2872375some sort of smoke filled room deal where nobody wanted wesley streeting around but he threatened to release all the dirt so they had to give him a job to keep him in line.
I don't like the sound of this anti robin-hood movie. Robin Hood is a hero of the oppressed and it seems like they want to tarnish the image.
James Obrien in as minister of truth
>>2872473Your Party is so fucked, these guys only have one face between them.
>>2872439Yikes, the government won’t do anything about right wing terrorism. Is it perhaps because the British deep state supports the fascists in the country both as a mobilisation force to push WW3 and to suppress any and all dissent much like the Italian blackshirts, or because they want to rile em up into a terrorist attack they can use as a pretext for further repression?
I mean, PA got charged with terrorism following new amendments to the law by Starmer following the 2024 British race riots by the gammons.
Tbh, one wonders if chuds are even right that Europe is repressive on them. Like, despite all the hate speech laws and terrorism legislation, chuds in Europe (UK included) are living their best lives ever. Of course, it’s because all the crap about being jailed for hate speech is made up persecution complex BS created by them as a narrative to justify their self-victimisation, considering how rarely hate speech violations lead to actual prison sentences, most of which only occur if you cross a politician’s wrong foot.
Never trust chuds and gammons, nor the fascists for that matter. They are pure vindictive liars who want any pretext to do evil.
>>2872480No, “Your Party” is literally the name of Corbyn’s party.
>>2872171Good post.
Very interesting take that people have learned to min/max reddit. That is probably correct and a very interesting way to look at it.
>>2872475I wouldn't even say it's fucked, it's just a non entity, barely exists. All the leadership is turning on each other too lol (read the weekly worker if you're interested)
>>2872777its only a matter of time
>>2872731 >>2872778Honestly might be the best option, it would dispel any notions people have about Corbyn being a leftist radical and we could finally move on from him
>>2872171>Britain is anomalous in this regard. Why our right-wing and our press in particular are so irredeemably awful is worthy of further studyMy theory is that a lot of them come from upper and middle class backgrounds in a society that is deeply classist, so the nastiness generally correlates with a hatred for the proletariat. Like, as much as they whinge about the grievances of the white British working class, they never really discuss their material conditions and even with immigration, it almost always harkens back to culture war shyte. And even when they do approach something akin to economic material analysis, they still fall back onto culture war slop or revert to Reaganism because socialism/communism is too scary or whatever. I guess you should let them figure it out on their own.
Ofc, it’s because the ChudIntern’s mockingbird influencer network is funded by a series of neoliberal hedge fund managers and other rich fucks with reactionary tendencies, so you’ll never see them question capital.
The flaw is also within the left where they get caught into a game of emotions in this issue. Like, it’s clear a lot of leftists aren’t really pro-open borders, they just oppose the anti-social and violent tendencies of the gammons and other British reactionaries whom they see (correctly) as totalitarian dupes being played and bankrolled by the oligarchs to preserve the current regime of structural wealth inequality.
Ofc seriously debating each other might lead to a peace treaty with the chuds, but neither side wants it because let’s be honest: It’s a personality play over who can impose their vision in their entirety, and besides immigration wouldn’t even be an issue if the British middle class wasn’t broke. Matter of fact, the issue of immigration is largely because we’re all broke AF. That’s how I know you’re in pain, my lads.
>Being glib: having people believe that you have to be a socialist and socially progressive to be a decent fucking person is good, actually. Most good people want to be good people! "To be a good person, vote [Corbyn/Green/Communist]" - winning message in the long-run! (See the 'yes' side's monopolisation of "better things are possible" in Scotland for more of this. Again, despite mostly being run by the malicious and the incompetent over the last decade + actively being fucked by Westminster wrecking.) Let all the vice-signallers burn in hell and all the virtue signallers enter the kingdom of heaven without god without praying and the good of this world without working.I do think it works insofar that it attracts the kind of people who are willing to work for something greater, as opposed to base sectarians and tribalists, which would then allow for a better leadership that is less pliable to emotional manipulation. After all, the British alt-right wouldn’t be full of neocons if they didn’t base their politics around hatred and base tribalism, which makes them easy targets for manipulation.
But it’s also better for society insofar that it sets a higher standard not just for ourselves but for society, which is an improvement over the third-worldism sweeping the western right as its kahanisation has led them to eviscerate any future of improvement towards perpetual warfare and siege mentality that characterises modern day Israel which, let’s be honest here, it’s a shithole that would fall to 4th world status without aid from the USA, Germany, and its mafia-like international financial and tech network.
>>2872784Your Party’s best action was trying to unite the left around a pan-leftist alliance which we knew would falter in a whimper. But honestly? It’s still useful in terms of laying the groundwork for left wing activism.
I just think a more militant left will emerge only after Labour and the Tories collapse because, let’s face it, they won’t last for long given the current trajectory. And it’s shocking too since both parties are some of the world’s oldest extant political parties in world history, so their fall would be an omen not just for Britain, but liberal democracies everywhere.
>>2872802The problem is that the left is not prepared for that to happen, whereas the far right and even market liberals and social democrats to some extent are.
>>2872725Absolutely it is allowed for political reasons. The fascists attacked our anti Iran war march in unison with Iranian diaspora freaks. It doesn't even have anything to do with their pet issues, they were yelling at us about Islam being evil, and immigration and rape gangs even though it's nothing to do with what we were there for, and they were allied with a bunch of insane Muslim immigrants lol.
>>2872810Though TBF I could see some Zoroastrianism shit with the diaspora people, so yeah, I'm sure they have had a genuine conversion to a religion that hasn't existed for like 1000 years.
It's like that comic with the "we don't like your kind around here" guy about how to create a synthetic middle eastern pro western identity out of nothing
>>2872802>so their fall would be an omen not just for Britain, but liberal democracies everywhere.TBF this became such comon happenings in europe i think by the time that happens the cat has been very well out of the bag.
>>2872857i tried to look for it for a few mins, i can't, it's just a little meme i saw on here
>>2872111Is your uncle circumcised?
>>2873131no idea, anon, i wasn't molested by any of my uncles.
>>2873470Cringe northern student-politics weirdo who never had a real job.
Beyond useless.
Andrew burnham to lower bus fares to £2 nationwide.
\
>>2873511>Student PoliticsI have never seen this used in any kind of consistent way people just throw it as an insult randomly.
>>2873470I would probably want to do this kind of shit if I was chief central planner (I did karaoke of Common People and was complimented how surprisingly good it was) but obviously, cringe as fuck
Are Andy will declare late this year our transition into communism
>>2874423As a journalist, I can gladly say 41% do not oppose using the Uk bases to bomb Iran !
Imagine entering the war at Trump's lowest point of approval. Like this guy is going to either be dead or Democrats will take the house and perhaps the senate and they aren't going to be friendly to anyone who cozied up to Trump. Just spineless cowards.
Burnham said this was Labour's last chace, well, they fucking blew it for me. I will vote Reform, Tory, Green, whatever at the next election other than Labour.
>>2874809Wrong accent S poster is a welsh guerrilla.
>>2874809You could hold a gun to an ants head and these people (staffing all of western Marxism-Liberalism mass party orgs) would mindbreak at the request of explaining the vanguard party.
>>2874809At least she dresses lady-like
>>2874810I have an autism accent / fagcent / south east english accent (due to voice training which has overwritten my original accent).
>>2874809Based but not me!!
>>2874837PROOF the trans agenda is a posh-southern assimilationist project against poor, proletarian celtic fringe gays.
>>2874809That drumming is fucking atrocious.
>>2874809I want her
>>2874814MLs on suicide watch that animal rights people actually do stuff that gets them arrested instead of just book clubs
>>2874809>show up>have a goal in mind>execute on that goal>encounter challenges>continue anyway>probably had some kind of marginal impact on the store's bottom line>the message they're trying to spread has organically reached me.>the message they're trying to spread isn't reactionary nonsense some boomer read in the daily telegraphfor this unprecedented display of basic competence, these people should be awarded complete control of every party left of the greens.
>>2874843it's so unfair that yanks get the international standard fagcent while in britain your options are to read as a posh cunt or as a straight man.
>>2874916Based and correct
As for the accent thing… Idk do you really want to hang out with someone who is going to get offended about what accent you have? I sure wouldn't, you can fuck off if that's how you feel.
>>2874923Not meaning you can fuck off, but like, if someone thinks I'm posh, ok, whatever, I know I'm not but if that's how you feel then fine, I don't wanna hang out with someone who is gonna give me shit over that
>>2874923>>2874924i'd never give someone shit for their accent but i don't like that mine gives people the wrong impression. i don't mind being judged but i hate being seen inaccurately, and there's a lot of people out there that i'm not going to talk to long enough for them to see how funny it is that my accent and voice is paired to my personality.
>>2874934Fair enough, I think it's better to try to not be bothered about what people will assume about you, but obviously easier said than done
>>2873470>Thoughts?Politicians need to take more dance classes so they can just bust a move on people. With New Order I guess you can do a shuffle dance.
Also works for left-wing groups. Knew a communist guy who took hip-hop dancing and could also sing R&B at karaoke. He was white and this is in Burgerland of course and our group (operating within a labor union) marched in the MLK parade in front of thousands of black people, so obviously they're going to be skeptical of a mostly white contingent, but they had a DJ set up around the main stage / public viewing area as the parade came through, and he went out and busted a move in front of these people and it just completely won over the crowd like he was Justin Timberlake.
a Dragon was spotted over Glasgow
>>2875015That was a shahed
>>2875015Sure it wasn't a dragoon? Easy to confuse.
>>2874916>it's so unfair that yanks get the international standard fagcent while in britain your options are to read as a posh cunt or as a straight man.This is such a cap Big Friendly Gay Northerner is a well known type.
>>2875259Yeah but only in Britain, maybe some of Europe.
Most people arrested during Henry Nowak protests had been reported for domestic abuse…
Or in other words: violent people tend to be violent people
So much for “protect women and girls!” thugs, amirite?
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jul/24/most-people-arrested-during-henry-nowak-protests-had-been-reported-for-domestic-abuse
>Most people arrested during violent protests after the sentencing of Henry Nowak’s murderer had previously been reported to the police for domestic abuse, the Guardian can disclose. Data released by Hampshire police under freedom of information laws shows that 22 of 37 people (59%) detained in Southampton after Vickrum Digwa was jailed for life have been reported for crimes associated with intimate partner violence. Protests took place on 2 June after police bodycam footage was released showing Nowak, 18, handcuffed as he lay dying after being stabbed by Digwa, who had falsely accused him of racism. Nowak repeatedly said he had been stabbed. Digwa stabbed Nowak with a large blade he claimed to carry as part of his Sikh faith, before falsely telling police he had been the victim of a racist attack, leading officers to initially arrest the white teenager rather than his killer. The footage led to claims from Nigel Farage and others that it was evidence of “two-tier policing” and “anti-white prejudice” within police forces.>Demonstrators initially gathered outside a city centre police station, with several hundred people then attempting to march towards the murder location and the street where Digwa’s family lived. During prolonged violent disorder, 12 police officers were injured, and nearby properties and vehicles were damaged.
>Harry Varney, 34, claimed he attended the public gathering to pay his respects to Nowak, but was later filmed swearing at police and punching their riot shields. He was sentenced to three years’ imprisonment.>In 2023, he pleaded guilty to assault by beating after pinning his partner against a bedroom wall, bruising her neck. He claimed she deserved to be beaten by a previous abusive ex-partner and continued to threaten her after this attack.She said in a written statement read out in court:
>“I suffer with flashbacks, anxiety attacks and nightmares. I also now struggle with my social life trusting people. I can’t be left alone with a man without feeling scared.”
>Dillon Crawford, 29, was sentenced to three years’ imprisonment after throwing a brown bin and a metal chair “with some force” at police officers during the disturbances. He has 19 previous convictions, including for domestic abuse offences. During one incident, he broke a partner’s front teeth, punching her unconscious, and, after she woke up, told her he had put bleach in her hair.>Andrew Summerhayes, 38, was seen throwing a wheelie bin at police during the disorder. He was sentenced to three years and two months for violent disorder and possession of an offensive weapon.>Hampshire police confirmed that 33 people had now been charged for their involvement in the public disorder. The force has referred itself to the police watchdog, with two officers who attended the scene being investigated for potential gross misconduct by the Independent Office for Police Conduct. The investigation is considering potential failures to identify that Nowak needed urgent medical help and the decision to arrest and handcuff him before providing first aid.>The Guardian previously revealed that two out of every five arrested for participating in riots in 2024 had been the subject of a domestic abuse report before their involvement, with one in five subsequently being reported for domestic abuse.>Farah Nazeer, the chief executive of Women’s Aid, said: “Over the last two years, we have seen recurrent anti-migrant protests that have erupted into violence, with many of those arrested also carrying convictions for domestic abuse or other crimes against women and girls. It is not surprising that someone who is violent in public may also be violent at home, as there is a proven correlation between the two.”>A Home Office spokesperson said: “Violence against women and girls is a national emergency. We will continue to deploy the full power of the state to bring perpetrators to justice and prevent harm before it occurs.>“Our violence against women and girls strategy sets out how we will pursue and manage domestic abuse perpetrators, including through the rollout of new domestic abuse protection orders.”>>2875738>crimes associated with intimate partner violencemeaning what?
>Been driving for 20ish years
>Literally got defensive driving accreditation course down overseas
>Literally driven across continents
>Failed Hazard Perception test completely
wtf is this bullshit test? It literally fails you for being too good at spotting hazards lmao.
https://xcancel.com/Yugopnik/status/2077169285865087181Y’know, given how obsessed the MUSKrat is with the UK, you wonder if he genuinely feels American or if it’s all a ruse on his part, much like Boris Johnson’s wannabe working class act.
Slop aside, this kind of shit never happened, because we all know that British society is gynocentric so a woman’s testimony is worth five times more than that of a man regardless of his skin color. That’s why Elon and his bot army had to create AI slop to generate their imaginary scenarios in the first place.
But yh, considering how it seems like big tech is turning against Russia, if you’re a Russian or Belarusian that owns a Tesla product maybe you are a retard.
>>2875599What thread are you in lad?
>>2872777sad.
there was so much hype
Is the Anglo-Saxon a slave in the Isles?
<It is customary to think of England as Anglo-Saxon. It is this mistake which leads to all misunderstanding about the kinship of the English with the American. The British government has always been Celtic and not Teutonic. The five Celtic nations, at one time or another, in one way or another, have always come to the front. The Scandinavian and Saxon elements have been made hewers of wood and drawers of water. The paradox is sufficiently curious, since it is the Celts themselves who have been oppressed. But until the time of William III when the kingly power passed to the aristocracy, once and for all, no monarch of other than Norman or Celtic blood sat upon the throne. The Celtic chiefs allied themselves, too, with the Norman nobility […] The purely Anglo-Saxon name is nowhere prominent. Wilson is Lowland Scots. Roosevelt Dutch, Morgan Welch. The deeper one looks into the ancestries of prominent men either here or in England, the more one is struck by the complete absence of the English. Run through the British cabinet today: I think it will puzzle anyone to find a genuinely English name in the whole crowd.https://hermetic.com/crowley/international/xi/9/1066-a-study-of-the-ruling-class-of-england>>2877151<It is customary to think of England as Anglo-Saxon.I don't think it is. Most people don't have the kind of autism that makes them consider this stuff.
>>2877153"England" literally means "Land of the Anglos"
Anglo-Land. Eng-land.
>>2877151>I do not think that there is anything in the world so subtle and so strong as this peculiar caste feeling which obtains in the ruling classes of England.
>the Englishman's is not an honest pride that he is helping on the good work. There is a very devilish quality, a sardonic joy, in his position. He feels himself an honored member of the great conspiracy against the world.
>The possession of the secret is the one passport to success in England. If you have this, you can go anywhere and do anything; you may make a perfect cad of yourself and commit all the crimes in the calendar. But as long as you do not do anything “un-masonic”
>n obvious example is the immunity of Alfred Douglas. Here, in spite of innumerable violations of the law of the most outrageous kind, both by him and his enemies, no prosecutions ever take place
>Wilde was disgraced. It was because he was popularizing one of the secrets of the aristocracy, a disgusting thing to do, when you are just trying to gain admission to it. Wilde was letting the uninitiated know what the initiated did. The church, the army, the bar, the Houses of Parliament, are packed with people who practice strange vices. the victorian epstein scandal
>>2877151The cast system is:
Normands > German & Dutch nobility > Anglo-Saxon = Celts biomass
>>2877159Back then, this largely referred to homosexuality (sodomy), hence the invocation of Wilde. The ruling classes made it illegal for the commoners to be sodomites, but not themselves. Thus, Wilde's pretension is his openness. Of course, many aristocratic types still lamguish in a closeted lifestyle, since this is a long tradition.
>>2877423We see a present wealth and status inequality between Norman and Anglo-Saxon families to this day:
<Using data provided by genealogy website Ancestry.com and studying the U.K. distribution of those surnames over the past 800 years, they found that social status, wealth, education and occupational status was highly heritable – even more so than one’s height – and could be correlated to one’s family name […] Just take the names of the Normans who conquered England nearly 1,000 years ago. Surnames such as Baskerville, Darcy, Mandeville and Montgomery are still over-represented at Oxbridge and also among elite occupations such as medicine, law and politicshttps://www.cnbc.com/2013/10/30/whats-in-a-name-wealth-and-social-mobility.htmlThe Normans also perpetrated a genocide against English people known as the "Harrying of the North" (1069-70). It is known that the aristocracy was so allergic to fraternising with the English that the first king after Harold II (1066) to have English as a first language was Henry IV (~1400), around which time, feudalism was coming to an end. The War of the Roses' different factions were also just a continuation of the Norman, Plantagenet and Celtic bloodlines. The great farce then, as Mr. Crowley tells us, is the identity of the English with the ruling classes, when they are excluded from them. The line of King Arthur Pendragon (Romano-Celtic) has been the archetype, in the Britonic war against the Saxons. This war is still raging.
>>2877440I wonder if it also applies to Ireland since the normands went there too.
>>2877455Looking at the list of billionaires in Ireland:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Irish_billionaires_by_net_worth- Collison and Dorrance are Scottish
- Grayken is British
- Armitage is English
Desmond, Murtagh and O'Brien are Irish names, yet O'Brien is descended from royalty, in Brian Boru, a medieval Irish king. O'neill is also a name given from elite bloodlines, and wealth is often associated with it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O%27Neill_dynastySo then, the ruling classes of the past also largely rule today. My mother's maiden name is Walsh, which was brought to Ireland from Welshmen during the Strongbow invasion (1170), and this name descends at least as far as my great grandfather, who was racially discriminated against in Liverpool for being Irish. I believe that on my great grandmother's side is the name Carey, which is either Celtic or Irish in origin. In Irish, it refers to "black", and apparently, my great-great grandmother was called both "uyghur" and "chink". My maternal line is also "Black Irish" (Irish darker features), but my grandmother also had an East-Asian look about her, so maybe there was some race mixing in there. We know that Chinese immigrants arrived in Liverpool at least in the early 19th century, so its possible. But in all likelihood, I am probably 100% Celtic, yet I am still sympathetic to the cause of English liberation from the Norman yoke.
Just got recommended this.
Hardly a manc accent, is it?
Regardless, I decided to look at their website:
https://nationalrebirthparty.org.uk/Agenda/The policies are standard social democratic stuff, along with a program of "British" identity and heritage. I did notice that the Union Flag was prominent in the speech, and I wondered about the swastika, but the policy also says that it believes in the freedom of religion. Upon the symbol of the nations, they are flags of Catholic saints; St. Patrick, St. Andrew and St. George. In looking at the history of the English flag, I found that during the reformation, all saints were purged from public honour besides St. George, who was a type of folk saint, who of course became a Patron Saint of England. I do think its ironic, especially after the Puritan period of the 17th century, when Whigs were terrorising Catholics, to have a Catholic "Saint" (e.g. idol) as a symbol of our nation. Before this, we only had the Plantagenet coat of arms, being the three lions we still use today. The Triquetra on the Union Flag is slightly contradictory, since it is really a pre-Christian symbol of Celtic spirituality imposed onto the Catholic. A Pagan, Anglo-Saxon nativist known as Simon Tomlinson seems to prefer the dragon as a symbol, but of course we also know that there are two dragons; the red (British) and white (English) dragons, but even this is born from a prophecy of English defeat. I suppose that a "British" identity must differ from the English, but little has seemed to unite us. Even as late as 1685 we had the Wigtown Martyrdom, where English Christians were killing Scottish Christians for refusing to unify. After the Acts of Union (1707), the Scots already resisted it, and only a century after the union of 1801, the Irish gained independence. It is hard to see "Britain" as a cohesive nation, so I have doubts for this party.
>>2877542Yeah this shit just looks like your standard far right party trying to ape the NSDAP with a few words changed around
>>2877567>>2877542Wow. That's deeply embarrassing for them. Talk about Amateur hour christ.
>>2877570>>2877576Reading some more, the founder, Alek Yerbury was in the group "Patriotic Alternative" and left in 2023 to found the National Support Detachment, which then led to the National Rebirth Party in 2024. I found this little detail of Alek's activity interesting, as well…
<The founder of a new far-right ‘supergroup’ aiming to unite fascists across the UK has spoken of targeting union offices and picket lines, openDemocracy has learnt.https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/alek-yerbury-national-support-detachment-unions-strikes-pickets/So then, just like the Blackshirts and Brownshirts, it is labour which is the real political enemy, it seems. I remember reading Mein Kampf and Hitler's resentment toward unions always stook out to me. The class background of Yerbury is that he went to private school:
https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/i-was-just-cold-im-no-nazi-the-former-adelaide-private-schoolboy-denies-dressing-like-hitler/news-story/8bad2e0f348676d8e3e4391bd19e3336?amp&nk=c36d9a60f72f8b8f6e0bcb09fb115065-1785083938So then, some posh boy wants to play British Hitler, I guess.
https://hopenothate.org.uk/case-files-national-rebirth-party/ >>2877597Thats even sadder, these posh boys used to exude confidence and charm, superficially if nothing else. This cunt has anti-charisma. He sounds and looks like a west country farmer, but not a successful one in with the local gentry, one that's a single bad payment negotiation or order cancelation away from blowing his brains out.
I can even hear the cunts discord pings.
Deeply embarasing.
>>2877621In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king…
>>2877639Searchlight is a good source BUT they write very over positively about how well antifascists did etc. Take their optimism with a handful of salt.
>>2877639it could be just falling out over petty drug debts
>>2875559>the coolest part is that the flight isn't even powered by the wings, but by hidden propellersLiterally the least cool part. It would've been infinitely cooler if they'd made the wings functional
>>2877858not really possible unfortunately
>>2877858Exactly what i thought lol, like, wtf, i'd rather have not known. Just tell me it's a flying dragon model thing in the future and i'll happily come to my own conclusions.
>>2877969<make yourself an above ground form organization<Call yourself bash back>NOOOO HOW COULD YOU THINK WE'D BE VIOLENT? WE'RE A NON VIOLENT PEACEFUL PROTEST ORG WE CONDONE NO HARM!!Why are people like this?
I will go get FFS in Colombia. But I have to wait for all my grandparents to die in order to get £5,000.
What do you think of Spiked? Apparently it used to be a trotskyist mag, before turning into the current RW “libertarian” rag mag that it is. They literally defended Jimmy Savile ffs!
>>2878011Asking, because I’ve seen so many Trotskyists turn into busherites and tatcherites as of late. WTF leads to these sorts being predisposed into reactionary politics?
Is it the leftist equivalent of “scratch a liberal, find a nazi”?
>>2877972you might be a retard. if they get proscribed, that's a good thing, 100x more people know about palestine action now than before the proscription
>>2878013Trotskyism was a massive tendency that was utterly dominant, it's not that surprising that peoples politics changed, I'm not convinced theres any real connection here.
Free Isobella Sullivan!
I am proscribing the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland as a terrorist organization. Anyone paying taxes to, working in the UK, or part of it’s government is doing material support for terrorism and will be prosecuted as such.
>>2878011Glows brighter than the sun.
>>2878013In the general case: It's because your politics are in large part defined by your enemies. If you set yourself up as an anti-Stalinist and an anti-SocDem, then your enemy groups are Stalinists and SocDems, while Conservatives and Fascists are just this other irrelevant side-thing. Liberals sometimes find themselves more afraid of communists than of fascists, and Communists make the same mistake of Liberals.
In the case of Living Marxism, so far as I can tell, a large part of their specific oddness came from an addiction to contrarianism. They realised riling up other leftists was more fun than droning on about how bad Thatcher was to an audience of people who all hated Thatcher and kept going until they posted too close to the sun by accusing ITN of faking footage from the Bosnian war. (Which made them a cause celibre for gullible libs, but all the gullible libs in the world can't save you from the force of god that is British libel law, especially
when you're actually doing libel.) They were doing the whole anti-woke schtick decades before it was cool (pic very much related) and have all sorts of other weird little rabbit holes. (Frank Furedi hiring himself out to supermarkets to encourage people to eat unhealthily, is it? You'll be unsurprised that this "living marxist" went on to work for an Orban think tank and appear at the Natcon conference.)
From there, you get all kinds of dodgy connections. Their weird climate change denialist (well,
endorsing) streak is well known, but why did Channel 4 let one of their alumni do a 3 part documentary series pushing that line in the 90s? (For which it was subsequently forced to broadcast a prime time apology! Have you
ever known a TV channel to fuck up that badly?) Why one writer made a peer, under Johnson? Why did Spiked get Koch money in 2016? Why did a different one of their writers head Boris Johnson's policy unit(!?)
A funny personal postscript here is that I have also drifted in an incredibly libertarian direction out of a mix of contrarianism, not being immune to being defined by my enemies - the nationalist right - and through legitimate and coherent analysis, yet in doing this I've only become more distrustful of Living Marxism. They only become more uncanny from this vantage point. >>2878512Hopefully I'm one of those homeowners soon.
They are making agitslop games now:
https://boriswave.com>>2878940Wtf are these controls, literally unplayable on mobile
>>2878949https://beverley-and-holderness-gov.uk/schools/send-transport/Ooooo they're not happy with transport to school for the disabled kiddies 🤡
>>2878951
Maybe it's easier with two hands, I'm eating lunch at work cause I have a job unlike the bellends who made this probably
>>2878954It's from the same people as the '30 year old simulator' from a year back or whatever apparently
https://nicksimulator.com/I'm sure there's Thiel/Musk money behind this, but what can anyone do
>>2878962
I'm sure it's not a real leaderboard you div
>>2878940Wow AI coding really has come a long way.
>>2878992I dunno, don't you think getting shut down would just encourage them? It seems like nobody cares about this game currently, I don't want it splashed all over the tabloids
>>2878993Right. Guess it would be better to let it slide, or just hack the website so that the links only display the flag of the USSR victory banner or some other communist flag. Would make it less noticeable but still funnier and ambiguous.
>boriswave
Really? British reactionaries are so cowardly they will blame anything but Brexit for Britain’s current freefall to being the poorest country in Europe, as opposed to being the current placeholder for poorest in northwest Europe.
>>2878961It's won't be that all of these cunts work in finance in London (notice how they call people who disagree with them brainwashed lib dems its because they are fuckinghamshire and have moved to the cities) so I imaigne someone's dad did it for a laugh. Also I imagine 90% of this is vibecoded.
https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/lord-glasman-wrote-song-exiled-crown-prince-iran-playedLord Glasman Wrote A Song For The Exiled Crown Prince Of Iran And Played It To Him>Exclusive: Labour peer Maurice Glasman wrote and recorded a song dedicated to Reza Pahlavi, the son of the last Shah of Iran, in support of his exiled dynasty returning to power.https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/lord-glasman-wrote-song-exiled-crown-prince-iran-playedRecording is here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FVFo3rkpIOVfcKPd2ZMko6qlLudD2KYu/view >>2879115based that we have a specific autist who is really good at this game and we can use them to troll for agitative propaganda. Good work anon.
>>2879229Not really. Anyone on such a site is going to be already far to gone, it's propaganda not aimed outside but internally.
>>28795872012 London was best London. Amen
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KzJqAdAZ_E8Neo-nazi TERF who let her pug die under the summer heat confronts shitlib Muslim prole, gets OWNED!
In all seriousness though, the fact that this atheist reactionary that LARPs as a “Christian” (which is what cultural Christianity amounts to, a LARP) could be even condemn the Old Testament for having the same shit as the Quran was incredible.
But yeah, I wished some masked trans field teacher would have souped her with some stinky soup and leave whilst shouting “trans rights are human rights”. That would be epic, and also easier to do if you’re a fast marathon runner since I doubt most gammons can even keep up with even a 10 yo.
>>2879366It's a retarded thing to like, anyway.
>>2879587ah yes i remember this Lisa Simpson giving a blowjob Olympics
>>2879366>>2879665his claim is that it was an accident and, given the guardian's explanation, that seems likely, the BBC coverage is ridiculous.
>Asked if he wanted to apologise to Farage, Polanski said: "Well, if I'd done it deliberately I'd be apologising but because this was a mistake I think the important thing is that I point out this was a mistake, that I also make sure that I condemn political violence, and also crucially I make a commitment to be better on social media.">Asked for a second time whether he would apologise, Polanski refused because he said Farage had cropped the image to make it look like he had posted it himself, which he said was "fundamentally dishonest" and only amplified the problem.>Saying he had received a death threat earlier on Tuesday, Polanski added: "The ramping up of the language to say 'this is incitement to murder me' feels like that's also putting me in a dangerous spot.">Given a third chance to apologise, Polanski doubled down and said: "You know as well as I do that as soon as I do that Nigel Farage would run all over social media saying he was correct about incitement to murder and this would all ramp up again.>"I think it's important that I draw a line and don't play his game… It is important that he's kept safe, it is important we condemn political violence, but I also recognise this as the political attack that it is.">"If Nigel Farage wants to apologise for all the times that he's put other people in danger then I will be happy to make an apology," Polanski added.the emphasis that he's not apologising despite being "given [x] chances" is comically skewed. he doesn't need chances, he's said he's not doing it! shut the fuck up! you're the BBC, it's not your job to say what he should do! he could say he did it on purpose and he'd do it again and it still wouldn't justify this partial reporting.
the guardian explains what actually happened.
>As such, few were hugely surprised when Polanski pressed the “collaborate” button on an Instagram post comprising about 20 photos from an event he attended, the first a photo of himself.>Near the end of the collection – and never, it seems, properly scrutinised – was a photo of a man wearing a T-shirt showing a guillotine and words from a 1979 song by the band XTC: “We’re only making plans for Nigel.”>The collection was swiftly removed from Polanski’s feed with the party saying the T-shirt was “clearly in poor taste”. Reform have asked the police to investigate. i mean fuck OFF. reform should apologise for diving in front of the refs like this.
>>2879229>>2879245It's not supposed to be that deep lol
Also, I have covered the top 10 places.
Restart is making me do training rubbish next week every day ughhhhh
>>2879799Wish Burnham would put on a shirt, already sick of seeing his slovenly disgusting belly through his too small t-shirt.
>>2879799As a grown man, I refuse to wear anything besides a dress shirt.
Wearing a t-shirt is like wearing pyjamas.
>>2879903Why should anyone try to dress to impress for a world that doesn’t reward it? Want me to wear a suit at the airport? Make the airport something other than hell
>>2879907It's not about others, it's about having pride in yourself.
Where's the protestant ethic, lad?
>>2879908I'm proud of the pretty designs on my tshirts
>>2879903Same if im not doing physical work, aside anything else it's just more comfortable.
got fucked by adventurism boys. It's gg.
If you're going to discuss clothing, where do you shop exactly?
Do you walk around in a Mao Suit? Graphic t-shirts and shorts? Tracksuits?
Are you a CPGB-ML who is obligated to adhere to their "proletariat dress code" of wearing a polo shirt?
Everything is so expensive these days tbqh I don't think I've bought anything new in years…
>>2880189I get some shirts on Temu and other stuff like trousers from Uniqlo
>>2880189>where do you shop exactly?Charity shops. I find decent shirts all the time.
Sue Ryder tends to be very good quality clothes if you have one near you.
>>2879799I wear retro style dresses, or a jumpsuit and red beret when doing active party work.
>>2880311A consummation devoutly to be wished
>>2880311Transylvania makes a bit of sense, but it's kinda nuts how the Hungarians tried to claim literally all of Slovakia and almost all of Croatia (minus the tourist islands) was somehow rightfully theirs.
I guess nationalists for some reason just love autistically inventing the most outrageous territorial claims and producing maps supporting said claims, and have done from classical antiquity right up until present.
At least now thankfully a great many of them choose to safely stay at home and realise such maps in Paradox historic fantasy video games rather than starting wars over it…
>>2880452I mean you could say the exact same about the British Isles. I think the point the image is trying to make, is that the treaty of Trianon was without historical precedent and appears more like a deliberate attempt at balkanization. You could also argue it was a direct reaction to the Hungarian revolution.
>>2880657if you are happy why rock the boat
>>2880713That’s China’s job
>>2880680Idk… Cause having more money is nice. It would make me feel accomplished I guess
>>2880713What about the people in the Mediterranean? Embrace Maghrebi lifestyle?
>>2880717And people in the Maghreb will embrace death (words of the insane)
>>2880713I miss ecofascist malthusians over these apocalyptic neoliberals
We need to organise a /leftybritpol/ mental health walk for mens mental health me thinks
>>2881356Oh my god, 1500 per week that will probably be sent back anyway, who cares…
>>2881361>Who cares?Sane people.
>>2881362Literally why? Who should care? Migrants aren't the ones bankrupting the country and taking all our rights away
>>2881367>Why?If you don't know, then you don't know.
It's impossible to reason with insanity.
>>2881368How right you are. Fuck off.
dark woke idea: psyop gammon into going out into the channel in small boats themselves with the promise of being able to harass illegal migrants. ideally during storm conditions.
>>2881368Okay? Then fuck off.
Twat.
>>2881378Populist claim cause Italy gets more people lmao.
>>2881356Morocco does this everytime it wants something from Spain. Turkey uses the same tactic with Syrian refugees. Spain and Morocco will deport them in exchange of the world cup final or backign out an Algerian deal or something.
>>2881495Good for them and bad for everyone else.
>>2881406>Spain will deport themThey are arriving because Spain is doing the opposite of deportation
The United KKKingdom is nothing more than a criminal organization that has yet to he brought to justice, all 50 million of you are going to jail on RICO charges
>>2881644So long as the House of Windsor stands, we are a criminal enterprise. It's shocking that the Left in this country has dropped Republicanism.
>>2881649The Stewards and Cromwell weren’t better, everyone of you needs to serve jail time, or at least flip on your superiors for a lighter sentence
>>2872171r/politics is down the hall and to the left, kind stranger.
>post-SJWs becoming self-identified communists.There's like ten SocJus libs who went further left, the entire movement deflated into good ol' fashioned neoliberalism and globalism but with half of CEOs being women.
>Let all the vice-signallers burn in hell and all the virtue signallers enter the kingdom of heaven without god without praying and the good of this world without working.How the fuck do you riff on Christians/Abrahamics for their spiritual nonsense and then talk about secular Christianity? Why do you assume every person claiming to be a woke lib is genuine and not a stealthy /pol/cel or g(r)oyper?
>>2881654It's not about getting "better" results, its about the institution of the monarchy itsslf.
>>2881678>the entire movement deflated into good ol' fashioned neoliberalism and globalism but with half of CEOs being womenthis one should be easy: get me a quote of a senior Green figure saying 50% of CEOs should be women.
<b-but they're not communistsyes, so the ones who became communists should have an even stronger stance on this than the liberal green party, shouldn't they? chop chop.
>>2881356Ngl the non-black ones are nigh-indistinguishable from Spaniards
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRJBZrlT2kwThat Oxford debate with crypto scammer and professional hoaxer Tommy 10 names has dropped.
https://xcancel.com/doctor_rahmeh/status/2082919982321500592Seems like he got mogged there.
Context:
https://searchlightmagazine.com/2026/05/oxford-union-rolls-out-red-carpet-for-tommy-robinson-in-secret/https://searchlightmagazine.com/2026/06/anti-fascists-take-the-shine-off-tommy-robinsons-oxford-showcase/Given the actual lineup of the debate, I can’t feel as this was anything other than a publicity stunt for Tommy 10 names, especially considering how the mostly-Muslim staff seemed to have approved the debate solely to get their fame up.
>>2881858Honestly what does it even matter, he's still massively popular, and will be relentlessly TPTB anyway. Anti-fascism seems pointless, we lost. Britons can't be saved.
>>2881897*relentlessly pushed by TPTB
I dunno I'm just blackpilled, it seems like fascists have almost total cultural dominance
>Unison, Aslef, Usdaw and the Musicians Union will not attend Labour Women’s Conference in September over the exclusion of trans women from formal business at the event
Why is every other Labour affiliated union being so cringe
(Not that the ones skipping it aren't cringe, but "will you stand up to Labour on this obvious psyop that doesn't even require you to surrender any real access to the party" is a pretty easy bar to clear.)
A theory I won't check: these unions skew younger and boomers are holding the others back or trying to fudge the issue
>>2872094The fuck are you talking about? There's still tons of edgy atheists ripping into the sky fairy lovers. Of course the ones from 90s and 00s aren't as prominent, they're all 50 years old on average and you don't see the old school trilby hat tippers calling people normalfags and cucks for going to church; edgy atheism of 2020s is more about slamming them for being against queers, abortion or other worshippers migrating to their country.
>>2872171uygha not a single SJW ever picked up an ideology to the left of social liberalism, have you seen any of the people yammering about social justice become more leftist? No, so stop talking out of your ass.
>>2881858>Lawrence Fox (an actor) and Tommy Robinson (a hooligan) debate religionHumiliation ritual?
>>2882082basically every tumblr social justice yammerer I've ever seen has become a self proclaimed communist. "not even one" okay: Kate, the fired homestuck^2 writer.
<But that doesn't count she just says she's a communist that's not real communismWe can play that game if you want but then nobody on this shithole is a communist either. All the communists are either dead or in China.
Is there anywhere good to discuss leftism guys? I'm so tired of this board, just non stop incel shit
WTF?
>>2882198The answer to most problems is to lower the total population.
>>2882198Thought my local parks been looking dead.
Bet these tards feel absolutely moronic preferring fields over woodland now, lmao.
>>2882294they don't care. that's the fucked up part.
>>2882198Good. This island was never meant to have so many animals on it anyway.
>>2882312No one even cares, since most Anglos are atheists even if in name only, and most Christians are either in the “spiritual but not religious” box or e-crusader LARPers of the slovenly white lumpen variety.
>>2882312Who fucking cares. Grow tf up and allow the oldies their biscuits.
>>2882312It's not ending unfortunately, and it's still the state religion. Which is a total joke.
What's happening is that it's schism-ing into 2 distinct churches, with the more socially & theologically conservative Anglican churches (primarily based in Africa) leaving to form their own separate Anglican communion.
This was triggered because they're butthurt that a woman is archbishop.
>>2882633I wonder how African Christians feel about the fact that the average white Christian right-winger despises them as much as the KKK does:
https://www.friendlyatheist.com/p/a-catholic-racist-refused-the-eucharistI know the racist in the article’s subject is Catholic, but many Euro Christian reactionaries really be like that. You wonder why they bother being Christian at all when they could just be folkish neopagans.
I mean, church affiliation has been declining for ages and the process would accelerate without immigration of African, Latino and Asian Christians (which many churches rely on now for their staff), and that’s been occurring with or without churches being “woke”. I know that the answer is that said racists didn’t read the Bible (which is true), but still… eh even bother with what amounts to a LARP that only your fellow sectarians buy into?
It’s kind of like how tradcaths have to cope with the fact that the pope they’re supposed to pay heed to is some “anti-pope” or whatever simply because they disagree with him politically, when many of these tradcaths go against both biblical and papal orders, and that’s more glaring in how they struggle with concepts like love and forgiveness and compassion towards their enemies. Really tiresome, and hopefully they end up in a gulag.
>>2882763>even bother with what amounts to a LARP that only your fellow sectarians buy into?sunken cost fallacy,maybe their parents met in church,they met friends there,they're part of a catholic community etc,it's all very real as opposed to what all the other people you mention do,I wonder if they even go to church (maybe watching nick fuentes is their church moment)
>>2882763>the average white Christian right-winger despises them as much as the KKK doesI don't think this is true at all. The holy war is Chrietianity vs Islam. Whether or not the support os feigned, it was politically imperative for America to support the Nigerian Christians against the Muslims, so you are reducing these conflicts down to race, when religion also plays a part.
>You wonder why they bother being Christian at all when they could just be folkish neopagans.You don't understand religion of you think its just a "choice" people make.
Really want to see Camilla Tominey subject to a brutally violent Maoist style public struggle session followed by public execution.
Vile individual, a Telegraph journo with more or less ᴉuᴉlossnW tier fascist views and one of those people who manages to be equal parts evil and stupid.
She tried to argue that Tommy Robinson, Lowe and Farage aren't fascist or far right because "fascism and far right requires a violent military coup" (no, it doesn't).
Then mere moments later she calls the Greens and Corbyn " extreme left wing fascists" and going off about how green energy and "transgenderism" is destroying Britain.
How do clowns like this have the ear of thousands of people?
>>2882872But it's still true that Lowe, Robinson and Farage are all moderate civic nationalists. All 3 of these men have called oit extremists on their own side.
>>2882872- They got cushy positions thanks to oligarchs funding them via “dark money” networks
- Britoids in general are as lumpenised as Americans but unlike Americans, have this need to LARP as le aristocrats much like Dalits try to compensate by lying about their caste
There’s a reason Britain is often referred to as the “Florida of Europe”:
https://m.youtube.com/shorts/KYWnRJv9UmU >>2882904>baitYou are vlearly naive if you think Farage is as bad as it gets
Farage isn't "moderate" but he is the last dying gasp of British nationalism before England goes full Serbia
>>2882921>Farage isn't "moderate"Yes he is. That's why the reactionary right have abandoned him.
https://archive.is/IwCwNInsane shenanigans? In Scottish Labour!?!
(tl;dr "Campaign for Socialism" are wrecking themselves by undermining the left candidate in the leadership contest because some old TERFs don't want a pro-trans leader - despite backing her in 2021 before they all got psyopped by tufton street - and
everyone is wrecking her because she's open to a second referendum at some point in theory)
>>2882923Rohm is moderate, hence why the reactionary right have abandoned him…
>>2882942If you think Farage is "literally" a nazi, you are a child.
>>2882910>Farage is as bad as it getsNot at all what I said but he is clearly far right, Lowe is certainly fascist or fascist adjacent, Robinson is clearly a white nationalist.
What do you achieve by denying or downplaying the threat?
>>2882945I think Farage is not moderate. I do not think he is a nazi, but I do think that if you extrapolate from British politics before it went completely off the rails (either 2015 or 2019) his positions are undoubtedly extreme. You could pretend that because Starmer triangulated towards him, that means they're now moderate, but I would reject this on the basis that it's clear that British politics as a whole has broken down. This is the motivation for the Rohm joke: recognising that Germany has gone insane is more important than nitpicking over whether Alfred Hugenberg and Franz Gürtner and Franz Seldte are now "moderate" just because things have gotten even worse since 1933.
>>2882953>why are you not spreading hysteria?Because I care about the truth. Lowe is a libertariantory wanker, not a fascist, and Robinson has nevrr professed white identitarianism - his agenda id anti-islamic zionism.
>>2882959>ExtremeWhat exactly are Farage's policies? He has said that he wants to deport illegal immigrants, which would simply be upholding British law.
>Rohm jokeimplicative of Farage being a nazi, which in your reason, you have quelled, but think a bit further. What are Reform's "extreme" policies? Why is Farage "extreme" but Badenoch isn't?
>>2882986- Leaving the ECHR is something no moderate party has proposed with any seriousness, to take an anodyne example.
- One can uphold existing law in extreme ways. Would it be moderate to send firearms squads after shoplifters?
- Badenoch is extreme (because she's just LARPing as Farage.)
Specific policies in manifestos etc don't really matter so much as a harder to articulate
direction of travel. Keir Starmer was not elected on a pledge to ask his judiciary pals to legislate from the bench to abolish the GRA2004 or to criminalise peaceful protest, but you could tell based on his past performance he was going to do awful awful things. Farage, similarly, has clearly pushed* British politics in an extreme direction, even if you technically can't pin much on him because establishment figures LARPing as him held the dagger.
*Here I will exculpate him slightly: to some extent establishment power brokers have simply used him as a figurehead for their own derangement, in this sense his phenomenon is demand-lead rather than supply lead. e.g. it's not that he brings otherwise normal people right, but that rightists go to him because
they are extreme weirdos, and because the elite power brokers who should be constraining this tendency instead exacerbate and promote it because they are the most extreme weirdos or all. This is why they're now capable of clipping his wings a bit by turning the machine from suck to blow. (Though whatever they've got in store next will surely be worse.)
>>2882986>Lowe is a Libertarian Ah yes well known libertarian policies like "repeal minority rights", "fund the genocide of Palestinians ", and "deport all foreigners / non-whites"
>The literal founder of the EDL isn't white nationalist Oh boy you aren't the smartest tool are you?
>>2882999A followup, to restate very clearly: Labour in 2024 is far to the right of Theresa May in 2017. British politics has become extreme and deranged.
(Cross compare New Zealand, which has remained broadly sane though sadly LARPing as Britain a bit, or Australia where the Labor government have been your normal disappointing socdems but the right have gone mental.)
>>2882999>>2883002The Tories also want to leave the ECHR:
<Kemi Badenoch has announced that the next Conservative Government will leave the European Convention on Human Rights.https://www.conservatives.com/news/conservatives-announce-echr-exit-policy>One can uphold existing law in extreme waysWhat is extreme? Farage has suggested daily flights for deporting illegal immigrants, not throeing them into the sea.
>Badenoch is extremeOkay, so what isn't extreme? You need to set a measure.
>rightists go to him because they are extremeWell, precisely. When Farage isn't following the angry mob, they drop him.
>British politics has become extremeIt has becomr sensationalosed, but it still largely operates within the framework of free markets and managed decline.
>>2883001>repeal minority rights>deport all non-whitesYou have Lowe and Laws confused.
And for the rest, why is it inconceivable for a libertarian to also be a Zionist?
>Tommy Robinson is a white nationalistI have never seen proof of this in his rhetoric. He has always been an anti-Islamic Zionist. That is the founding of the EDL itself:
<The EDL was not a neo-Nazi organisation. It distanced itself from neo-Nazism, burning a Nazi flag, flying the Israeli flag during demonstrations, and creating a Jewish division. In 2010, Robinson stated: "We're not Nazis, we're not fascists – we will smash Nazis the same way we will smash militant Islam."https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Defence_League >>2883026You are either mentally retarded or a troll. The EDL tell you "we're not racist, really!" and you just believe them?
>>2883032>The EDLAh, but notice the difference Tommy isn't "the EDL".. As discussed with the other anon, there are cults of personality, and then there are cults which attach to personalities. The EDL as a unit is certainly racist, but Tommy himself has had a single mission - to be an ally to Israel and to banish Islam from the UK. That is hks unswaying motive. If you can find any evidence of him being directly racist against people I will concrde my defense of him from accusation.
>>2883040NTA but Muslims has absolutely become a racialized category in our modern discourse. Grantwd Yaxley-Lennon is a slippery one on this, but for most of his followers and mileue It's synonymous for Arabs.
>>2883026I have offered you British politics circa 2017 as a benchmark for "not extreme" (really "less extreme")
The ECHR thing would illustrate this: May advocated leaving as a hard-line home secretary pandering to her nutter base, but her 2017 manifesto committed to staying in and her subsequent premiership dropped the issue.
Free markets don't really exist here. We love nothing more than to ban and to regulate and to micromanage and to centralise control. For all their LARPing, what Thatcher and Blair really set up was a regulated grift for ruling class twats, rather than anything truly competitive. This is the underlying reason our politics are so reactionary: in the US the material base of Trumpism is disproportionately people in industries that only exist as they do due to stupid federal regulations (e.g. coke bottling plant franchises are subject to dumb rules to make sure they're not actually competitive, car manufacturers can't own car dealerships, etc, creating a subsidized cut-out for small business tyrants to become their state's self made" rent seeker) but almost the
entire British economy is like this.
(Except our supermarkets, oddly enough. Maybe because half of them are foreign owned, and actually competitively so, not just "we gave the money printing rail contract to the Dutch, we have the money printing electricity contract to the French".)
Not that anyone will do anything to fix this, of course. Even Farage for all his extremism would not actually take the extreme step of moving Britain towards a market economy when push came to shove. None of the modern right would - not even the so-called libertarians or free marketers. Not even the ones who post all day about economics - when the chips are down they all just love rich people and hate the poor, so they'll gladly keep something like the present setup in a new hat.
>>2883094>not REAL free market economicsnot this shit again, there's literally never existed a non-corrupt capitalist country where the bourg don't rig the game for their own benefit
>>2883122Your thinking is too binary, too parochial, and too
optimistic. It is true that there has never been a capitalist country where things aren't rigged in favour of the bourgeoisie, but it is idiocy to ignore distinctions below that level. Nobody denies that there are structural differences between the economy of Britain and Germany when it comes to, say, manufacturing cars, or between Britain and Japan when it comes to building high speed railways. Yet when we step over to asking "did Thatcher actually throw off the shackles of the state as her supporters and opponents both insist, or did she actually create lots of new shackles by centralising power in London and privatising lots of companies into non-competitive regulated environments with a guaranteed profit. Did Blair actually double-down on the market as Thatcher did, or did he create even more non-competitive cut-out grifts for the golden boys of the British class system while
talking about markets a lot to show he wasn't a lefty" we're crossing some sacred line.
No, everything bad that happens in Britain must be the result of markets being inherently bad and not good in the same ways in all contexts everywhere. Britain is just a normal capitalist country, a normal capitalist country with abnormal wage stagnation, abnormal productivity stagnation, abnormal levels of regional inequality, abnormal lack of a centre-left+liberal party, abnormal stagnation of output, abnormal cult of personality for political leaders from 30-50 years ago, abnormally low capital investment… It doesn't have a weird caste system layered on top of the standard bourgeois/proletarian distinction common to all capitalist countries which could explain this dynamic. Thatcher's implementation of economic liberalisation was exactly the same as Reagan's or Mitterand's or Hawke's or Deng Xiaoping's. This is just a normal capitalist country, doing the normal things that happen in every capitalist country.
Well, every capitalist country in the United Kingdom anyway.
tl;dr free(er) market economics HAS been tried in other countries and they outperform us, even if they're still not ideal. This is why I charge you with optimism: you are not willing to see that Britain is so bleak that every other country's ongoing nightmare is our best-case medium term scenario.
THIS RESTART SCHEME RETAIL TRAINING WANK IS THE DULLEST THING IMAGINABLE SHORT OF PRISON
>>2883384It is what it is, I'm convinced that a large part of the job application process is to check that you're willing and able to complete pointless busywork
>>2883081>synonympus for ArabsAre Pakistanis Arab? They get the brunt of things.
Also, if it's "racist" to criticise Islam, then you are basically saying that it's racist to reject Sharia Lawm Why a leftist would say this, I have no idea.
>>2883094>Free markets don't really exist hereThis is a tired, pedantic argument.
Our public utilities are in the private sector; that,xs what's relevant.
>>2883152>free(er) market economics HAS been tried in other countries and they outperform us, even if they're still not ideal.American healthcare is freely competitive, yet is more expensive and less reliable than our own. "Performance" measured by GDP is a nonsense.
>>2883393I think he meant to say that in modern European politics (British included) Muslims are racialised as just brown people, hence why it’s not hyperbole to deem Islamophobia as a form of racism considering how in Europe “Christian” is often shorthand for white people, while “Muslim” is shorthand for non-white. Like, let’s be honest here, Albanians and Bosniaks are European Muslims at least nominally, and yet they aren’t included in the current discourse about Islam, just Arabs, South Asians and certain black people.
And yes, it applies even for black people considering how there are more black Muslims in Europe than in the western hemisphere. Not that it lets black British escape from racism, as shown by the latest Belfast riots where Ugandan Christian nurses had their homes burnt down.
But you’re right about American healthcare. Most Americans are in medical debt, yet British retarded are so delusional about daily life in the USA. Reminds me of how American and Russian liberals are bigger supporters of the EU than Europoids themselves
>>2883395>in Europe “Christian” is often shorthand for white people, while “Muslim” is shorthand for non-whiteIs this actually true, though?
>the latest Belfast riots where Ugandan Christian nurses had their homes burnt down.I mean, people in Belfast also murder Catholics - where does that fit into the "Christian = white = good" theory? The point is that there is absolute separation between race and religion, and trying to combine them makes it "racist" to criticise Islam - or Christianity. So tell me, is it racist to reject Shariah Law? I've seen shameful apologists on this website justify the Charlie Hebdo murders for offending Muslims. If nits not racist to blaspheme Allah, then your point does not really stand. My own perspective is that most reactionaries support Sharia Law in its doctrine, just not in its religion, so fall into contradiction, calling Islam "medieval", but literally fantasising about medieval ljife, and so on.
>>2883393> if it's "racist" to criticise IslamI didn't say that.
Why are rightists like this? Why do they all have sub-primary school reading ability?
>>2883395Even when it comes to Asians, Thai or Philipino Muslims ate not considered either.
>>2883406That’s because Thai and Filipinos aren’t the most visible minorities, but that won’t stop racism against them as shown in the case of an elderly couple assaulting a Filipina nurse:
https://www.pep.ph/news/foreign/191804/british-couple-attacked-pinay-nurseuk-jail-a717-20260417And yes, Islamophobia is a form of racism insofar that it exists in Europe (UK included) considering that it’s basically a shorthand for brown people as shown by how the terms “Muslim” and “boat people” are often conflated by eurochuds to mean “non-whites” aka black and brown people.
Are chuds and the agitprop slop that they consoom incoherent about this? Yes.
Does that invalidate treating Islamophobia as a form of racism? No unless the Islamophobia isn’t racialised. But more often than not, it is. You’d have to be disingenuous or stuck under a rock to think otherwise, especially after 9/11.
But yh, not sure why we’re wasting time over trying to categorise chuds when they are themselves often incoherent and who are often driven by hatred, particularly the gammons and lumpen hooligans that live in nazi povvos.
As for where Farage and Lowe fit into the spectrum, give or take both are essentially Thatcherite with Enoch Powell characteristics who are all capitalist fanatics, and that is to no one’s surprise for they are all part of the ChudIntern, whose main goal is to turn all of Europe into another Latin America that is servile to the Globalist American Empire (GAE).
>>2883393Our public utilities being "nationalised" would mean nothing if the same people stayed in charge of them and continued running them in the same way as they do now. Do you really think BAE Systems would stop being subsidised merchants of death just because we moved all the shares to Andy Burnham's account? Is Saudi Arabia a socialist paradise because the state is one big publicly owned oil company? Is your faith in the British state - which has proven itself to be a mixture of outright malicious and utterly dysfunctional time and again - really so unwavering? Be serious.
Not once have I cited GDP (you are the first to mention it ITT) and you know in the bottom of your heart that "muh yank healthcare" is a disingenuous argument. (Health is an anomalous market, the US healthcare sector is highly regulated, controlled, and protected by the insurance lobby, American paypigs cross-subsidise much of the world,
and yank healthcare still beats the decrepit, compromised remnants NHS in many ways. For one, it's not built on the utterly asinine principle of rationing access to cheap and trivial treatments via extreme waiting lists [c.f. autism, adhd, trans] out of institutional control-freakery.)
You want to tar me with the brush of being pro-American despite my only reference to the US in prior posts being a negative one (detailing
their problem with reactionaries crawling out of the noncompetitive parts of their economy and taking the place over), a lazy trick. Why not compare us to Switzerland, Ireland, or Australia? Why not to the Nordic countries? (which, despite their welfare states, are far less regulation-happy than we are.) It's obvious why: because these places blow Britain out of the water, because nobody would freely choose to be born in Britain rather than one of these places, because 257,000 British citizens, mostly young people, emigrate every year. But no matter: I charge you with something worse than being pro-American, you are
pro-British state. >>2883417Are you sure you want asthmatics to pay 6-digits grand for an inhaler? Because that’s what Americans with asthma face if they luck out of the expensive and exploitative insurance lobby, and most Americans are already saddled with medical debt that they’ll never be able to repay back.
And that’s just a microcosm of the wider problem of American healthcare. Go ask an actual American instead of making up fantasies based on chudslopers who want to turn the USA into a British colony they can lord over.
>>2883414Yes but thry were most likely racialised as Asians, not Muslims, kind of proving my point.
>the restI didn't say nor imply any of that. Are you autistic?
>>2883427Do you not see the complete and utter insanity of going "yeah but Americans have to pay for their Adderall" when faced with the charge that Britain faces
>abnormal wage stagnation, abnormal productivity stagnation, abnormal levels of regional inequality, abnormal lack of a centre-left+liberal party, abnormal stagnation of output, abnormal cult of personality for political leaders from 30-50 years ago, abnormally low capital investment… a weird caste system layered on top of the standard bourgeois/proletarian distinction… centralising power in London and privatising lots of companies into non-competitive regulated environments with a guaranteed profit… I will be blunt: I do not give a fuck about healthcare. The country is dying, but at least once your quality of life has gone to complete shit the NHS will give you emergency treatment so you can keep suffering long enough for the DWP to euthanise you by starvation.
It's a lie that I don't care about healthcare, I actually know a lot about healthcare and could bore you all day with how an ideal social democratic government could reform the NHS basically in line with its founding principles, The problem is that this relies on a fantasy government, fantasy civil service, and fantasy NHS management structure. There is no point sitting around masturbating to fantasies of good government in a country with a bad one at every level! "If I was in charge" - if I was in charge I'd be removed faster than Liz Truss, if I had a magic wand to implement all my whims I'm smart enough to just abolish disease instead of fixing the NHS.p.s. You cannot get Adderall legally in Britain at any price. Why? Because that's a decision for Yvette "interviewed in her role as a minister by her husband on the BBC without anyone thinking this was a conflict of interest" Cooper, not you. >>2883405>Muslims are basically a racial group<So its racist to criticise Islam?>[sagepost] why are right wingers like this?Illuminating discourse…
>>2883417>Our public utilities being "nationalised" would mean nothingWould privatising the NHS apdo have no effect?
>Not once have I cited GDP Then what are you measuring "performance" by?
>you are pro-British state.Why wouldn't I be? I think we need to go back to Attlee's era where the state had more control of the economy.
>>2883443LOL no wonder you had to ignore my inhaler example and instead divert to meths, since my example would destroy your yankee-sucking.
NHS sucks, sure, still can’t see how is that supposed to be any worse than having to pay exorbitant prices for heart surgeries and being saddled with medical debt.
Like, do you really think it’s optimal to have to pay for ambulances to take you to the hospital, or having to rely on GoFundMe just to get medical care that would typically be covered by universal healthcare in any other European country?
Ridiculous how the best leftybritpol can come up with is nitpicking over whether Lowe is a fascist or not, and glorifying America like the average dumb gammon does.
>>2883457How is it our fault if right-wingers can’t decide as to whether Muslims are a racial other or a religion? It’s not like they’re an kinder to what they refer to as “boat people” and “invaders”, which seemingly includes Filipinos as well:
https://www.dailymail.com/news/article-15051525/couple-arrested-racially-assaulted-NHS-nurse.htmlDon’t play games with us. You know it’s not about debating theology, it’s indeed about race, especially since “Muslim” is just shorthand for brown person. You may be autistic, but that’s how everyone, both in the right, left and centre of European politics, sees it.
>>2883462You keep insisting that its impossible to discuss religion without invoking race, which is my primwry disputation. I thus ask you whether or not it is racist to criticise Islam, and you have failed to answer, causing immense need for presumption. So tell me, is it racist to blasphene against Allah anf Muhammad? If not, then you recognise a difference - a differenve which must be made explicit.
BAMES are not why your life sucks
>>2883457Privatising the NHS would make things worse, but this is a tautology: almost everything we do will make things worse. This is a monkey's paw state: you can't have a simple and good concept like "digitise NHS records" get from theory to implementation without feeding everyone's patient data (and public money) to Oswald Mosley's grandson.
I measure performance by all of the problems I have touched on. If you want me to pick one, I pick wages, if only to force others into the position of either accepting that we have fucked something up
even as a capitalist country, or defending wage stagnation.
Attlee's era lead us to the era we're in now, but I will spare you a long digression and oversimplify: Attlee's state was controlled by Attlee, by competent civil servants, and by a balance of class and regional forces that were capable of generating desirable results. This state no longer exists, nor is there an obvious path to rebuilding it in the medium to medium long term. What use is the state having more control over the economy when Andy Burnham, The Tony Blair Institute and the Daily Telegraph have control of the state?
>>2883460I considered doing an anecode about how getting a Salbutamol inhaler is a pain in the neck compared to other countries but I was struck by a terrifying vision of this idiotic "talk about everything but my point" discussion getting derailed into the
clinical merits of various medications. I mean for fuck sakes, half my post is a big black bar about how I've a bucketload of NHS reform schemes that cut directly against my free-marketer schtick and you still bring out the "why should we pay for ambulances? why do you love America? let's talk about healthcare and completely fucking miss the point" bullshit. Learn to fucking read!
I think we should have Sweden's healthcare system.I have picked Sweden at random. I have picked it purely so that, from now on, if you engage in this stupid distraction you will have to pretend to know something about Swedish healthcare. >>2883472>Privatising the NHS would make things worseYou just say things without explainong them - privatising the NHS is bad because it is subjected to a free market. That is the crux of it. Free markets are good for unnecessary items like consumables and luxuries, but nothing more.
>Attlee's era lead us to the era we're in nowThatcher and Major's missions were to dismantle Attlee's welfare state, leading to Blaire and the resy of our managed decline.
>What use is the state having more control over the economy when Andy Burnham, The Tony Blair Institute and the Daily Telegraph have control of the state?Some things are better than nothing.
>wagesWages by themselves don't measure anything. The US has higher median wages than the UK yet has more poverty and crime than we do as well.
>>2883467Never said it’s impossible, you 55 Tufton street troll. I made the obvious point that, barring cases where a distinction between race and religion is explicitly made, a right wing interlocutor will implicitly mean brown people when they talk about Muslims, as shown by how neither Hindus nor Sikhs are spared by the gammons, who often speak of a “white Christian Britain” as if Christianity is an ethno-religion for le “white race”. It’s you who assert that it’s impossible for chuds to treat Muslims as a racialise group.
>>2883472You used the American example to jerk off the star-spangled cock, not me. Try to think next time, doofus. It’s clear you’ve never lived in America, so STFU on that
And I see you picked Sweden as a better model. Better than the average gammon
>>2883480You do not appear to understand that you can have private industries that are not subject to a free market, where the government dispenses licences to print money while controlling market entry/exit or competition so that incumbents are protected. (See, for example, the farce of Lumo having to pay compensation to other railway operators for "stealing" their passengers.) Insofar as the NHS has already seen some privatisation, this has been how it works.
<Some things are better than nothingPresumes you're going to get something. Why would Tony give you anything? What makes you think the Daily Telegraph wants anything but for you, personally, to be miserable? What makes you think Andy Burnham's going to set it all right?
You miss my point on wages: America being richer than Britain is not the notable point. What is notable that almost every first world country has higher wages now than in 2008. Britain does not. This would be one thing if we were all working 20 hour days, loving life, and approaching the 20th year of a very successful Gordon Brown premiership with some of the highest global happiness rates in the world and near-zero emigration… but that's not what's happening, is it? It is almost universally agreed that this is a country in miserable decline. There is a world where we're in miserable decline
and our wages are rising as in a normal country, but - if I can quote you on this -
some things are better than nothing. I stand by wages as a measure of
unusual failure in Britain.
>>2883488Please quote me using the American example like that. I want actual words. I foreshadowed that I'd pick Sweden way back in
>>2883417<Why not compare us to Switzerland, Ireland, or Australia? Why not to the Nordic countries?It is, however, very funny that you think I'm a gammon. How do you reconcile that with the fact that
twice now, I've cited our socially illiberal uniparty politics as one of the unique problems of this country? How do you reconcile it with one of my examples of NHS failure being that our trans healthcare policy is "lol lmao"?
You
are reading before you reply, aren't you?
>>2883488>Never said it’s impossible>barring cases where a distinction between race and religion is explicitly madeRight, so you agree with me, then. Tommy Robinson's personal platform explicitly separates race from religion, which as you have stipulated, is a decoupling of racism grom theology. So then, the political antagonism against Islam can be non-racoal. Upon the "right" in geberal, such as on the "left" both race and religion are coupled together by implicit association, leading tp feckless cowards on the left defending Shariah Law, and feigned ignorants on the right promoting a race war. The end of reason then is letting the mob rule, in any case. We are surely above that, which is why you agree that its emphatically NOT racist to blaspheme against Allah and Muhammad, right? Now, to bring inncontinuity, just because Robinson isn't a "white nationalist" doesn't mean you can't reject his influence for different reasons, at the same time.
>>2883489>you can have private industries that are not subject to a free marketThis is just a no true scotsman fallacy though, isn't it?
Define what a "free market" is in positive terms.
>Presumes you're going to get something.Your present example is the NHS - do we receive "nothing" from this?
>What is notable that almost every first world country has higher wages now than in 2008. Britain does notYes - I have brought this up myself from this article:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64970708The diagnosis is a lack of productivr sector jobs, not a lack of a free market. China is reeling at the prospect of Btitain re-nationalising its Steel industry. I wonder why…
White Britains aren’t going to take care of their grandparents, it’s really that simple
>>2883494I am content to go with Google's AI overview
>A free market is an economic system where prices and services are set by supply and demand with little or no government control. Its key components are voluntary exchange, private property, and business competitionThe railways clearly do not count because the government controlled prices and competition, the national grid does not count because the government controls competition, the water companies and power generators both have prices and competition controlled by the government, while supermarkets (for example) operate broadly under a free market framework.
The NHS is not an example I picked of my own free will. It is a nonsense distraction from my point, which is about the entire structure of British society. Nevertheless: lots of people receive nothing from the NHS. I will show my woke hand and go with trans healthcare here. The waiting list for NHS treatment extends as long as 200 years in some parts of the country, and the only reason for this is that Britain adopts a healthcare model that includes lots of unnecessary bottlenecks, because Britain is a centralised control-freak country. You will say "it's a funding issue" but it is
not a funding issue. This could all be done with the resources already available. Basic trans healthcare is so cheap that people are self-administering it!
(Yet instead of providing healthcare, the NHS throws up more barriers. Self-prescribe? Sorry, we can't do your bloods to make sure you don't hurt yourself because that would ~encourage~ you. Come back when you
have hurt yourself and cost us lots of money instead. Go private and get a diagnosis? NHS probably won't convert your prescription to an NHS one without being bottlenecked. Why? Because fuck you, that's why.)
Now you might say: Anon, you're not trans, I'm not trans, most people aren't trans, who cares? I care, because it illustrates a general attitude and an approach where
providing healthcare clearly isn't the priority for our
healthcare provider.
The lack of a free market and our lack of productivity are intertwined, both being rooted in the malice, incompetence, and centralising control-freakery of our ruling class, who could not survive if forced to compete and rely on their (totally absent) skills. I will comfortably bet now that our Steel industry in 2050 will still be essentially irrelevant, and draw a little line under the very ominous reasoning that we nationalised it for
national security. (Someone expects a war!)
>>2883503>>2883504No. When we are dealing with other countries, I can talk all day about market failures. But Britain's problems are much worse than those of other countries, while the causes are usually identified as being the same.
e.g. Australia and Sweden also had a wave of deregulation and privatisation in the 1980s-90s, yet Australia and Sweden are much nicer places to live than Britain. Thus "deregulation and privatisation" cannot explain why Britain is worse to live in, while an analysis of the specifics of that era (which throws up all these odd cases of Britain doing things completely at odds with the spirit of deregulation and privatisation, completely at odds with creating competition, and even against the interests of international capital, but perfectly in the interests of Britain's ruling class)
can illuminate something about how we got here and (to get back to where we started with this line of thought) why Britain has such reactionary politics today, not just in the parties of the right (a global universal at this point surely) but in the dominant party of the centre-left as well.
The constant point of comparison I make is not between Britain and some free market utopia, but between Britain and
normal countries. Insofar as I am sympathetic to the idea of liberalising Britain's economy, it is so actors from those other countries - selfish but not driven by the insane prejudices and spite of Britain's ruling class, and not having their incompetence - can come in and wipe the floor with them. This is not a utopian vision, it is a "least bad option"
(And it's not happening, because only the British ruling class could bring about such change. Funny, isn't it?)
>>2883512Hey man if unregulated markets are so cool then why chinah is so strong right now? Why were wages and literally everything better during the good old Keynesian days? Thank you
>>2883521Britain sucks, that’s why. In a sense, it’s kind of like India where no matter what government you put in the result is the same shithole unless you have some foreign country like China take over everything and rebuild from scratch.
Hey, at least the UK and India have something in common, eh?
>>2883521Since you're replying in bad faith, I will do likewise.
- Dengism
- The Keynesian era is highly overrated. In 1967 25% of all homes lacked at least one of the following: an indoor toilet, fixed bath/shower, or reliable hot water, with 2.5 million homes lacking an indoor toilet. But hey, they were building Concorde and Ronan Point!
>>2883523Oh hey, someone gets it! (Although I'm more optimistic for India than for Britain, the comparison between India and China is endlessly fascinating.)
You could even simplify my point down to Britain operating under a covert
Licence Raj >>2883512I just don't think the cause of Britain's failure is too much red tape (e.g. the old Brexiteer excuse), I think it can be diagnosed from different angles.
What are the problems in Britain? Homelessness. I cite my previous post here:
>>2878512This is an issue of redistribution, not productivity. There is the issue of the NHS, where supply meets an excessive demand, and so a general lack of healthiness, and also an exploitation of the service is at fault, along with any notable understaffing. Whenever I have gone in to get a GP check-up, its full to the brim with people who dont really need to be there. I have previously imagined a credit system to bypass the queue system, which I think would benefit people - not merely based on amount oaid forward, but in how little one has used NHS resources. Japan has an NHS yet it doesn't go bankrupt since it is not overexplouted by the unhealthy anf unethical - so this is also a cultural problem. What else. Transport could be improved by nationalising services like buses and trains to cut personal costs. Rubbish is piling up, as we massively overstaff poloce while understaffing bin men, so we can reverse that. Crime and disorder in general is caused by antisovial behsviour, whivh is always graduated from original cases not confronted hy social workers. There is the issue of immigration which in a more willful state would simply deport all those sho do not belong and have no right, most especially foreogn criminald. On immigration in geberal, it can be limited to the demand from business after a threshold of domestic employment. Say, 90% Whwt else? Wages are relative to rates of productivity, so employing more people in capital intensive public sector jobs could raise wages for these people - in the Attlee era, around 10% of people worked in public industry. Thatcher's liberation of the market thus lead to massive unemployment.
These are just a few concerns which can be dealt with by the state immediately rather than the state stepping back from social processes. I think your anti-political vision of improvement is misguided.
>>2883550>Whenever I have gone in to get a GP check-up, its full to the brim with people who dont really need to be there.How the fuck would you know lol
I hope somewhere in a lab in Wuhan someone is working on creating a new super being that is 60/40 Attlee and Lenin DNA
>>2883772Mandatory penis flattening?
>>2883649Typical protty-dog
>>2884571Absolutely the case, fucking everything up to climb the career ladder. Look at Unite Hospitality for example
The proletariat needs a vehicle that isn’t unions or the party but none has emerged
Is there a single group/organisation/demographic in British society which is historically progressive as opposed to reactionary or useless?
<the proletariatLol, this is a country that has negative levels of class consciousness. Stop looking at your Marxism 101 textbook and think seriously about the problem. Seek truth from facts! I can accept that
parts of the proletariat may be a valid answer, but the proletariat as a whole are obviously at-best
useless at this time.
You do not have to be a doctrinaire Marxist about it either. I would gladly accept liberal forces as historically progressive if you could find any that were not useless or reactionary. Any group that seriously tilts, in short, to improving the status quo in any way is an acceptable answer. Something on which an organisation like
>>2884645 could start to be built.
>>2883649I'll never begrudge a man for fancying a round or two of gwent, and what better a place than the lodge.
>>2884651>Historically progressiveVain buzzwords. Just say what you mean.
>>2884645The only surge of working class politics in over 30 years was the leadership of Corbyn in the Labour Party. We have no effective proletariat in this nation anymore. At most, there is a lumpen politics of begging for benefits, with this being the fore of class warfare, such as the batting down of scroungers in the noughties. Since the 2010s even this declined and now its about race, gender and sexuality. The feigned abolition of class conflict brings us into the disaster of a Hobbesian war of all against all. Here is a helpful list of UK strikes:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Labour_disputes_in_the_United_KingdomNotice how after the 1990s, it mostly became about the unproductive sector bargaining for crumbs, but this reflects the service economy in general. We can see union membership statistics (1995–2025):
<Union membership as a proportion of employees has fallen from 32.4% in 1995 to 22.4% in 2025 […] Total trade union membership in the private sector has declined by 841,000 since 1995, a fall of 25%. Whereas total membership in the public sector has increased by 298,000, an increase of 8%.https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/trade-union-statistics-2025/trade-union-membership-uk-1995-to-2025-statistical-bulletinThe British working class in general has been disintegrated.
>>2884651The country's full of stupid pricks, "the left" are largely comprised of manipulative capitalists who are only interested in advancing their own careers through virtue signalling. I've been a union organiser, all that happens is you lose your job and some wanker in the union apparatus gets applauded internally, maybe you get a months pay a year and a half later at tribunal and get taxed on half of it
I'm all for organising outside of parties and unions but we need to actually fucking do it and stop pissing about, get over superficial differences like sexism, racism, homophobia, transphobia, and actually focus on doing something about the fourth reich
>>2884671>The Fourth ReichWe already left it, didn't we? Brexit.
>>2884674Its locus of power lies in private corporations and shell companies. Look at researchers like Jason Samosa exposing historical links between Third Reich ratlines, the World Commerce Corporation, and the Bank of England expatriating nazi wealth and technology after WW2.
Darwinist doctrine of nazism is retained in neoliberalism, but obfuscated through social murder and systemic means. Look at statistics regarding how many disabled and vulnerable people end up homeless in this country. I reckon "the left" have really got to be engaging more with people who've had experience being on the receiving end of that apparatus, less middle class social media shite and patting ourselves on the back for unions destroying workers livelihoods.
>>2884662Saying there's no working class in this country anymore is just wrecking, you don't have to be in a union to be working class
>>2884684If you’re in the service sector you don’t have leverage, that’s just a fact, not that industrial workers have any leverage either since China opened up
>>2884683You could link a specific article or video.
>>2884684You don't quite seem to understand my point.
If working class politics is dead (it is), then why is this the case?
>>2884662I went on to explain what I mean
>Any group that seriously tilts, in short, to improving the status quo in any way is an acceptable answer. Something on which an organisation like >>2884645 could start to be built.I want as broad a brush as possible. Purely illustratively, you could say "graduates", who (as has come up at length ITT in the past) generally have good political views when surveyed (for example they backed Corbyn by Blair-1997 margins even in 2019), and this would be cause for optimism because the number of graduates has increased over time. If you could somehow organise them as a coherent group, you'd have ~30% of the adult population on your side, supporting basically the right direction of travel. This would be "historically progressive." (I'm not, in the main, seeking contrarian arguments about how Starmer is actually historically progressive because wrecking Britain is good.)
But I think graduates slot more neatly into "useless", with the ominous note that they're also clearly not
inherently progressive given how our ruling class are mostly reactionary Oxbridge wankers. I think the artefact of them generally getting each question right is more of a correlation, possibly a beneficial one if some other group could take the lead, than a sign of some kind of coherence which could be worked with or which actually has beneficial effects on the direction we're heading in.
But that's just an example, you can pick a much narrower group. Cornish nationalists, the North Western & Central region of Network Rail, the AGWSD. I'll take anything so long as there's a good argument behind it being progressive ("beneficial effects on the direction we're heading in") instead of irrelevant or reactionary.
>>2884671I think an underlying part of my thought is that there is no real "getting over" these differences, that fundamentally the best that could be achieved is a sort of popular-front of all those who're on the correct side of the divide (or at least
not on the incorrect side of the divide) against the probable-majority which are on the wrong side of it. In the most optimistic scenario, purely as a temporary defensive sort of thing to buy time until enough reactionaries die of old age that demography is more in our favour. The world is going through a Manichean period, but in Britain it's hard to see much of a light side - or even a grey side - to stand up against the dark one.
Middle class virtue signallers are in the main irrelevant if they can be corralled into such a front (e.g. this would be my view of the bulk of graduates) but some progressive element would have to lead it and give it coherence, otherwise you wind up with something like the Labour party, either under Corbyn (not capable of getting into power) or under Starmer (capable of getting into power, incapable of
not just doing everything desired by reactionary forces.)
This is all tediously abstract, I know, but there's a practical question here:
who do we organise? if we think practically, we will probably have to start small. it's no good saying "whoever comes along" And then sitting back as they all start infighting. Some coherent group is needed, even an imperfect one.
>>2884696You still haven't defined what "progressive" means.
If it's a synonym for "good", then just say "(x) is good".
"Progress" alienates the object of discussion to amorality, and thus it justifies itself by contradictory means, since if something isn't "good", why would I care about it? Death is the most inevitable thing, yet I wish to resist this as long as possible. So, I am simply objecting to the use of the term "progressive", since it clearly cannot mean anything.
>popular-front of all those who're on the correct side of the divideWhat is divided, and what thus determines "correctness"?
>>2884698What do you
think I mean? Draw inferences and I will correct errors.
My enjoyment of tedious abstraction abruptly ends when we're just playing word games.
>>2884704I think "progress" is simply a synonym for "good" and "reactionary" is a synonym for "bad". It's a lazy use of language which is all too common.
>>2884709Then take me at that word: tell me who the good and bad forces in British society are in your view. You already have the context that I believe we are in a Manichaean scenario.
As it happens, in my irritation at your silly question, I didn't properly explain myself:
This ambiguity is a virtue in terms of my original post because it allows the answerer to themselves define what they think is good and bad while explaining the group they're thinking of, and detailing their analysis of the situation more generally. I do not want to preclude some nutter arguing that 55 Tufton Street is
progressive (translator's note: progressive means good),
so long as their reasoning isn't the tedious old "they'll ruin us and that's good" cope. My own views on what constitutes good and bad are on the whole irrelevant to the question.
>>2884696Not related to the discussion at hand, but I was reading this article and I thought you would find it interesting (if you are the poster I think you are):
https://undod.cymru/en/2026/08/05/tu-hwnt-i-blair-cymru-ac-argyfwng-y-wladwriaeth-brydeinig/ trigo
>>2884716I don't see anyone who is a force for good in British politics, since virtue is largely a matter of civil society, rather than in the state. This is also why I see activist groups and charities providing services like food and shelter for the homeless, which is not a political act, but is still a virtuous act of society. I am not naive either and imagine that there is any "grassroots" potential in communities, since what is good is only an end in itself, and not a means to an end, and so virtue is not any type of "social capital", as it may be pretended. Matthew 6:
<when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth […] thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are […] that they may be seen of men […] pray to thy Father which is in secret […] use not vain repetitionshttps://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%206&version=KJVThe question of virtue thus continues into a "division" which you portray by means of intellect. If "correctness" is discerned, then it is not a political matter, either. Politics is often an inferior interest, since it exists in the realm of opinion and passion, not facts. As we know, opinions cannot be purely factual, and so 'correctness' is not a quality attributable to political orientation. Or is it? You may enlighten me.
>>2884696Agreed, in response to your question of who do we organise: it would probably start with us lot talking about it here, no? But there are inherent issues of trust, and then what would we be? We don't want to be a reading group or soliciting donations like a fledgling party, maybe we'd have to orient it more around the skills at our collective disposable rather than the capital we have available.
>>2884753What is there to organise around, exactly?
We are already operating in free association; a real life meet-up would just be some presumable homosexual foreplay, but nothing 'more' politically effective than what we're currently doing. When I was young I went to shouty rallies, but now it seems like a LARP unsuited for the contemplative, or worse, a civil religion of protest, like they have in France.
Guys, what do you think of Blue Labour, the more (socially) right-wing faction of the Labour Party whose member Shabana Mahmoud is Home Secretary, founded by a Jewish neocon, and whose head is Dan Carden?
I do have my fair of criticism for it, namely that it seems like another controlled opposition front against New Labour that doesn’t really seek to challenge it as much as pushing Labour to the right. Besides the obvious TERFism, there’s the fact that the faction seems to exist solely to peddle the British version of MAGAcommunism, but even more dumbed down since unlike MAGAcommunism it doesn’t put up pretended to not give a shit about culture wars imported from the USA, down to even opposing affirmative action (which is almost non-existent in the UK).
I don’t particularly reject the entirety of their ideas, as I do agree for instance that the UK public services should be more decentralised and that New Labour has been detrimental for community cohesion. But the rest is just a rebrand of starmerism but with more socialist facade. Particularly suspicious is the lack of opposition towards militarisation and defence spending that has come with the latest austerity measures.
Overall, I find the faction untrustworthy, and their reputation via Shabana has left me with a sour taste.
>>2884913I'm a communist so I think they should all be killed with hammers.
>>2884945Based
>>2884913Social reactionaries, economic liberals, slimeball opportunists. Send them all to a gulag on the island of South Georgia.
>>2884945Based why does leftybritpol seem so full of libs
>>2884945Restore will win
>>2884954Win what? A dozen or so councillors in England's most deprived seaside towns?
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