>Bye, bye, Microsoft! – editionhttps://www.zdnet.com/article/china-drops-windows-for-linux/The Chinese question is: how does a comfy non-imperialist nation transform itself into a global socialist model that can be reproduced and adopted by the rest of the world, without either reproducing the aggressive and counter-productive policies of the USSR or appearing toothless, while resolving the contradictions of the so-called first world FOR THEM and liberating them from capitalist domination, therefore using the empire's collapse to accelerate material conditions to enable the global revolution?
<A thread for the harmonious discussion related to the saviour of socialism, the uplifter of nations, the king of cooperation, the soviet of SOVL, the enjoyer of empathy, the ally of Africa, the demigod of development, the bureaucracy for banter, the prince of ping pong, the lobotomizer of labour aristocracy, the protector against proxy wars, the sponsor of sophisticated sciences and culture, the guarantor of gommunism, the Proletarian Dictatorship of Chynah™.Original threads:
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>>2832385 Deng lost.
>>2901158Deng literally made possible communism.
>>2901155this feels overkill
>>2901157gimmicks, tbh
show me infrastructure like solar panels, hospital automation and reforestation. I'm sick of booj treats and marching footage.
>>2901166Surprised to find a fellow Mexican Chiapanecan online.
>>2901155Wow, china uses light fans to display images just like my western office does!!!!1
This is cool tech, but you're being a nationalist faggot right now. This is showing off a cool kid doing cool things, not some chinese innovation.
Why some bourgeois states have dedicated generals on lefty/pol/? Can I make a general for my own bourgeois shithole?
>>2901166so you are not a
fan? >>2901167<the total automation of physical labour is mere>gimmicks, just because it is Deesplayed (tm)Marx would spit on you
>>2901170>Wow, china uses light fans to display imagesin reality:
<China did a cool fucking thing>just like my western officeLol, uygha, your "Westrn Office" didn't innovate for 30 yrs, LMAO
Has anyone followed the 14th five year plan? Hows the progress? Did they meet their goals for crushing the "3 mountains"?
Actually come to think of it, the robots and the more extreme streamer / influencer culture might be related. Like it's a more dynamic capitalist economy really for good and for ill, contradictory as it were.
is this, traditionally, the anti-leftcom/anti-ultra thread?
>>2901170>My western officei've never seen anything like this in my life so maybe you are high up on the food chain
>>2901179Not much. trying to find a decent price in central mexico for appartments
China is nice!
(Controversial statement in the deteriorating Western world.)
>>2901165> for completely eliminating physical labourMaybe I'll live just long enough to see most of humanity mulched by the rich after we become worthless eaters. Like the old quote goes, the only thing worse than being exploited by capital is NOT being exploited by capital.
So apparently there was this flood catastrophe in Choynah, and my lib news outlet is already telling me thqt the Choynese state figures of 7 confirmed dead is false, the "reality" is like 600 dead, which number the communist party of Choynah is covering up….
Democratic China will be better world leader than USA, and potential Russia great allies. Communism cucks it’s full potential tbh.
>>2902653"democratic" cope, by democratic you mean liberalism where the rich can buy the state from the outside and the population can play with the stress ball that is elections, but as shown today where every "democratic" nation is marching to be a failed state, russia included and china is rising in every metric shows your claim of it being cucked to be completely wrong.
The KMT will come back and all of the CPC’s little “accomplishments” will be for nil
>>2902653i wanna kill you
>>2902653I agree if they were more imperialist the PRC would be more based (historically progressive)
>>2902653Does anyone know what language this is? My AI language to English translator only works if you know what the input language is.
I still wouldn't call China socialist, but it's undeniable that state capitalism (or, to be more precise for their case, state-directed capitalism) is superior to westoid finance capitalism for national development. It's still not what I want, but there's no denying it's better.
>>2902854Yeah, even if you don't believe that China is socialist, there's no way you can claim that China is equal or worse than USA for the world. Lesser evil at the very least, or a straight up communist country - zero reasons not to support China
Deng won.
>>2901184>replacing human labor like… uhh athletic sportsgimmicks.
Marx would smile and shake your hand and then write a letter to Engels calling you a Jewish nigger.
Den Wong
>>2901191Yes, it has.
You are hilarious, and I like you, but I hope you stay online and far, far away from the socialist movement.
>>2901150I don't doubt your experience. Development is very uneven. My country doesn't have high-speed rail and some countries have had lines running for over 60 years.
Hologram fans were commercially available (in less advanced form) for around 10 years now:
https://hd-focus.com/news/when-were-hologram-fans-invented-85182389.htmlhttps://www.dseeholofan.com/about-usI only know this by chance, it's not common knowledge.
>>2903461This won't end well since main lander males are bunch of incel.
What did he get right and what did he get wrong?
https://mrkrudd.substack.com/p/the-evolution-of-chinese-economic>Xi Jinping—for those of you who have read his stuff, and I made it my business to read all of his stuff when I, at the tender age of 59, decided to do a DPhil at Oxford and produced a book called On Xi Jinping, having studied for four years his ideological framework—takes ideology seriously, in a country which takes ideology seriously.
>If you read Xi Jinping’s ideological framework carefully, my three-line summary of the ideological changes he’s brought about in the Chinese system is as follows.>Number one, Xi Jinping deliberately set about moving the centre of gravity of Chinese politics towards the Leninist left: more power for the Party.>Two, he also took a deliberate decision, probably from the 19th Party Congress in 2017, to move the centre of gravity of Chinese economic policy towards the Marxist left.>And three, throughout this period, we see a parallel shift in China’s approach to its foreign policy and national security policy by moving its centre of gravity towards the nationalist right.>If we are to make sense of the Xi Jinping ideological project, it is reflected in these three dimensions.
>[…]>>2902597i have found that people in general have retarded ahistorical beliefs. the reason for some younger people "liking hitler" is probably because they think hitler was opposed to zionism or something schizophrenic like that.
if you think
zionism = jews
and hitler = against jews
you conclude
hitler = against zionism
meaning
hitler = anti racist freedom fighter
>>2904718Marx and Engels were cretins in their personal lives and in the first international, they would be victims of purges in any communist party that ever actually took power
>>2904724Engels and marx were gigachads who fugged to tier gorilla grip pussies while having devoted loyal wives, the fuck you be talking about uninformed uygha?
>>2904730You mean besides the multiple times Marx was caught cheating on Jenny? Mao would have forced Marx to face Willich in the duel when challenged
>>2904732Marx cheated and still didnt get dumped? Ultragigachad, pinnacle of male succes and domination.
>>2904735Jenny didn’t have the legal or practical opportunity to leave hin
What are some key reading about China? I want to learn more about the socialist experiment in China.
>>2904783milton friedman's collected works should get you started
>>2904744Suck my fucking dick
>>2904724True, but not for the reasons you're describing
>>2904999Politics is class conflict and personality is a big factor because people are in positions to influence things directly
>>2904597I think it’s just due to communism is rising and when communism the elites push fascism so both extremes rise or whatever
>>2902597Fascists don't like to say that they bootlick finance capitalists, really the only reason a fascist would claim to dislike the PRC is the Gaokao policy favoring national minorities, or wanting more emphasis of Confucianism (even though Confucian ideology is already steadily growing even under PRC).
Famously ᴉuᴉlossnW claimed Stalin as the fascist leader of the USSR, Yukio Mishima famously said that his only disagreement with the Communists was on the question of the Emperor.
>>2908309
how old is your civilization?
>>2907762yeah of course the bourgeoisie push fascism but when they meet with success among alienated youths who develop ahistorical retarded beliefs, and some of those youths are not even petty bourgeois, there is a superstructural aspect of their reasoning which supports their shaky and contradictory beliefs. One can follow the train of ill-logic to approximate what it is many of them think.
>>2909554in America we have empty suburbs. the real estate companies just keep building mcmansions and sitting on them as speculative assets. but god forbid a country plan for future growth.
>>2910599I live in an "older" neighborhood and there's a new neighborhood down the street that is kind of stately where I walk my doggo through to get to the park and I swear half the houses are unoccupied and are just being sat on for speculation.
Anyways here's a song. It's actually quite catchy.
>>2910921…a ghost town, dare I say?
America has the AI bubble and China has the humanoid robot bubble.
>>2910921i'm so sorry but it sounds like she's saying
>injuns in my faggotry >>2910795Why not show the chinese state media stating this
>>2910945because it never happened
>>2910944u r forgiben, my son
>>2912248>socialism is when povertyThis is why nobody takes you seriously
>>2912248We fight for bread but we fight for roses too
>>2903941that looks terrifying
they handle them as if they were objects
>>2912251he is referring to capitalist owned luxury apartments in the video, not government owned rent free apartments
>>2912253socialism is when hedgehodges are in control
>>2912257>capitalist owned??? Do you think that specialists-stakhanovites shouldn't be rewarded for their hard labor?
I want to love China but there's two non-negotiables they fail:
- I can't run my mouth. I can sit here and call the leader of my country a lying sack of shit in public and nothing will happen to me; not in China. I simply cannot trust any leader who bans criticism of himself.
- Porn is banned. I'm too much of a gooner, this is simply a non-starter.
>>2912405You get around those with a VPN, just don’t be too harsh or deliberately draw attention to yourself
>>2912405> I can't run my mouth. I can sit here and call the leader of my country a lying sack of shit in public and nothing will happen to me; not in China. I simply cannot trust any leader who bans criticism of himself.There are things you cannot criticize in the West. If you say them you will be punished harsher then anything you can say in China.
> Porn is banned. I'm too much of a gooner, this is simply a non-starter.Stop gooning so much. Don't do it so much it rots your brain like this.
>>2912405>Porn is banned. I'm too much of a gooner, this is simply a non-starter.Dawg chinese people are giga-gooners. Don't treat the literal text on the legal papers as what's actually the content of the society.
>>2912413You can goon in china, just do it inside of someone’s holes in private consensually, the party doesn’t give a fuck
>>2912405Why do you want to bad mouth Xi? You can bad mouth Trump in China just as well as in USA, be happy with that
>>2912416Of course, but that other anon has rotted his brain with so much pornography he didn't realise this. The anti-porn legislation in China is for the good of the people including both the women exploited by this industry and men who suffer porn addiction.
You don't need a capitalist porn industry or anyone else to get off. You can create a picture yourself with pencil and paper, fantasize about it, and get off. So you could even get excited in a prison with nothing and the situation in China isn't even that bad. There is still plenty of ways to get porn. The only reason this would even be a fucking issue is if you have serious brain rot from a porn addiction.
>>2912413That's not really true. The West is designed to give people the illusion of having political agency. You can scream into the void as much as you want, nothing changes anyway. It nevertheless is a red flag if you don't even offer people that illusion but shut down dissent completely and force people to act like they approve.
>>2912405Whats bad about banning porn unironically? Porn industry as a whole should be banned.
>>2912419It's not even about whether I want to or not, it's the fact that I can't even if I change my mind. If he decides to do something I think is catastrophically stupid, it doesn't matter - I still can't criticise him. The law presumes he is infallible - or, rather, prioritises making him appear infallible.
>>2912421There’s a billion people in China, by law of large numbers you’re gonna find someone up for casual sex and I’m sure WeChat has an okcupid/tinder style dating function for this
The development of industrial capitalism simplified class antagonisms. Where before there were many classes, afterwards there were only two: the proletariat and the bourgeoisie. However, the development of information technology has complicated the class system. From the development of information technnology has emerged a new social class: the giga-gooners.
With the emergence of giga-gooners capitalism has created an entire class in the developed countries with no revolutionary potential. Ask a giga-gooner to give up everything and set up a base camp in the mountains and they will cry: "where is my smut?"
>>29124592 is debatable but 1 is not. 1 is the opposite, it's the leader going me me me.
I just don’t like Chinese aesthetics
>>2912428China has tiered council system ala Soviets, you air your grievances to your representative, if there are enough people like you, who also air their grievances to their representatives, all the representatives air your and their grievances up and up and up. Xi can be dismissed from his position by national congress, there is a law about this, and national congress consists of representatives of lower level councils.
>>2912428There's mechanisms for internal criticism
You, a bourgeois brained liberal, just think that democracy consists in spreading counterrevolutionary propaganda thru the media in a "marketplace of ideas"
That's not criticism, that's rabble rousing
Xi status?
>>2912488then don't live in China.
>>2912421There is no such thing as "porn addiction"
It is simply incel guys only way of coping
Give all these "porn addicts" a chance to be with any real woman and they will drop porn in a heartbeat
>>2913382I knew a guy who was tall, hung, married to a hot chick, had kids with her, and still watched a lot of porn and even paid for it. I think he qualified as addicted to it.
>>2913384>HungHow do you know this lmao
>>2913382Women do not replace porn. Do you stop watching cooking channels after cooking and eating?
>>2912253never saw a pig farm award
>>29133822 rights 1 wrong
>>2913385his wife told everyone whether they wanted to hear it or not
>>2912253watch dominion lol
>>2912253Animals are objects and should be treated as such
>>2913575People are animals
Animal should be treated as objects
Therefore people should be treated as objects
>>2913575>>2913621jackie treehorn treats objects like women, man
>>2912253Chinese people are notoriously inconsiderate of animal welfare
>>2913645People in Asia in general aren't know for welfare of animals, the idea of welfare of animal is a western thing, being more frank I considered people who mistreat animals as barbarian and inferiors.
>>2913652I think its also relative.
For example, Indians venerate cows, while we eat them.
Arabs like cats, but hate dogs, and so on.
From the time of Aesop's Fables, to Francis of Assissi, to Grimm's Fairy Tales, Walt Disney and the Furry movement, I do see a particular veneration of animals in general by Westerners. White women are especially fond of treating animals better than fellow human beings, which can also be rather exclusive. For example, Hitler was a fan of animals, and a vegetarian, while also valuing animals over fellow men.
>>2913658almost everyone who "treats animals better than humans" only does it with some select animals, like domestic dogs. I also find it very tiresome when people go "you know who else was a vegetarian? that's right. Hitler." yes and I'm sure Hitler also understood that 1+1=2, but I'm not going to reject the equation on that basis alone.
The real thing is to treat both animals and humans without cruelty, which is needless. It is entirely possible to defend yourself and acquire food without needless cruelty.
>>2912703Only in theory. They would never dare actually try to do it - even suggesting the idea to try to gather support would get you locked up on sedition charges or something. He is a dictator, there is no fudging around it.
>>2912704I can already tell you use the ML definition democracy, which isn't democracy (don't even bother - no, I will not accept it). It's just a rhetorical cover for absolute power by whoever is in charge, that's it. You can dress it up however you want, it's not democracy.
>>2913670not the anon, but if all societies are objectively class dictatorships, then there is no real ideal "democracy" in the bourgeois sense of the word where you have this multiparty pluralistic society where all classes have an equal say, that's absurd. some classes always have more power than others, that's what makes them classes in the first place. so the conventional definition of democracy where the bourgeoisie and proletariat have an equal say is silly. if you have reservations about the "ML definition" of things then say what the alternative is. how do you create a society where the working class, the majority, all have a say in governance without creating the "too many cooks in one kitchen" problem?
>>2913712If we're going to be more particular, the only *actual* way is direct democracy, but that becomes exponentially difficult to handle as the number of people involved grows. Otherwise, the task has to be outsourced to a political class, so it matters what the character of that political class is. In China, the political class - the Communist Party - is a self-selecting entity that gatekeeps who gets to be part of the class so the status quo - where they hold ultimate power - is not disrupted. The public holds no mechanism of accountability or authority of any kind over them short of violence. Anyone who claims China is "democratic" is simply axiomatically asserting the Party represents the will of the population, but without any mechanism to hold them accountable *to* the population, there is no way to actually make that happen.
>>2913764what if political will of the majority is stupid? what if "the people" (interclass construct) always vote to give their direct democracy away and replace it with management by a political class? Or even worse, what if they vote to preserve their short term interests as a particular generation of people over the long term stability of the society (as boomers have done in the USA)
>>2913670>They would never dare actually try to do it - even suggesting the idea to try to gather support would get you locked up on sedition charges or something. He is a dictator, there is no fudging around it.Wrong, Chinese do vote people out of elected offices all the time.
https://en.people.cn/n3/2016/0919/c90000-9116649.htmlThere was also Zhou Sufen (???) in Hunan, but I can't find a good link, google fights me all the way declaring that Soviet-style law for recalling elected officials by lower level Soviets doesn't exist in China or doesn't work or is never used, lol, despite the fact that google does find evidence that it works and is used often.
>>2913987
uygha everyday there is a mass shooting, school shooting, gang shooting in the fucking america and you decided to pick a random video of a violence in a country with near two billion people.
why burgers are so retarded?
>>2913987
Patriarchy still exists in Capitalist and Dengoid China. Same with every other nation of earth. It's that simple.
>>2914045xi is like in his 70s, he is not immune to strokes, especially at this age. its pretty weird realizing that kim is probably gonna outlive both xi, cucktin and trump, atleast if his weight doesnt kill him first
>>2914045Cringed at having to sit with reactionaries
>>2913952Disingenuous. Politicians above the local level are all appointed, not elected, meaning you can't achieve higher office without the approval of the existing party hierarchy. The people cannot put you there, they have no say in the matter.
>>2913866The political will of the majority *is* stupid, I agree. I'm far more interested in electoral mechanisms as a way to mitigate abuse of power than actually allowing majoritarian politics, especially since in the vast majority countries, that would lead to some flavour of rightist drivel. Only in a country socialised over the long term within a socialist economy might have an egalitarian majority, as socialism being perceived as the norm would cause the sheep (ie conservatives) to settle into and reflexively defend it simply out of familiarity and fear of change. But you have to get to that point first, and no socialist experiment has lasted for even a century.
What I want, really, is the socialist inverse of the capitalist west: you can vote for whoever you want, as long as they don't threaten the economic system. Presently, that's capitalism; I want to make it socialism instead. The resource disparity between the two sides might make more authoritarian measures needed to make that safe of course, like outright banning capitalists from politics is almost a given I think since even a small capitalist presence will be disproportionately resourced and influential. Whether we need a vanguard party or multiple parties is up for debate; the important thing is not going the Leninist route and banning factionalism, whether that's between parties or within one. Otherwise, that is an easy excuse for exercising absolute, unquestionable authority, which then hinges the country's fate entirely on one man's whims.
>>2914277are these those proto-chinese characters from tortoise shells? there's already cuneiform, hieroglphys, linear B, etc. so it's overdue
please xi nuke the yasukuni shrine i'll do anything
please xi nuke each of the wa islands into a vast tennis court.
Hydrogen as fuel os pretty meh tbh
Xi status?
>>2914411unicode是字符集，小篆是字体，字符集收录一种字体，有点不对劲。
>>2914671China made the Soviet dream of producing means of production on a grandest scale a reality
>>2914665xi clearly had a stroke
>>2904732marx cheated? woah. communism debunked.
>>2915212I understand Dr. Light, I want a robot son.
>>2915513Do not talk to me or my robot son ever again.
>>2904732>the multiple times Marx was caught cheating on Jenny?afaik this rumor comes from 1962, was spread by simon sebag montefiore, the same epstein planerider who called stalin a pedo, and has zero evidence, and is just part of the general anticommunist scholarship that fabricates claims about the personal lives of major communist figures
>>2915843
USSR didn't have a truly universal healthcare either. It's one of those issues usoids and euroids cope about China with, it's a pervertion of facts and an extremely uncharitable reading of situation. China have had full healthcare coverage for quite a while, but it was either residency-limited or job related (like in case of monocities, where there's one big company/factory that builds and maintains the whole city), and "universal healthcare" from westoids in this case related not to having universal coverage, no-no, it related to haaving free doctors for everyone anywhere. China had "free doctors for everyone in this city", in every city, but it somehow doesn't count towards universal healthcare. There was the same copium about USSR back in the days.
Today, though, China abolished residency permits of various kinds, because of availability of transport and fact of everyone moving around so much, so now they have standard health insurance, but while in the West it counts towards universal healthcare if it's Europe, it doesn't count for China.
>>2915843
ive looked into this before and at face value it seems pretty messed up but then you realize they at most get charged like 100 dollars for big things and for 90% of things its less than 10 dollars.
If you consider most countries with 'free' healthcare tax workers a higher % than what the Chinese have always paid to get the same thing, its not so bad.
>>2916186
stop trying to turn his reply into a cheap gotcha
>>2915778>scholarshipMontefiore is not a scholar. He's just a pop history writer.
>>2916233doesn't negate the point anon was making
>>2917092It's well known that the Maori were late colonizers tho
>>2917096glowies dont let facts get in the way of their anti china hysteria
>>2917092Chinese coins don't mean they settled it. It means it was part of a large trade route.
>>2904732Can people stop repeating this?
There is zero evidence of it
>>2917092weren't the polynesians originally from southern china anyway?
I do think china should annex myanmar because they seem to have had some common ancestry like 8k years ago
>>2905070I don't think anyone here bothered to listen to the clip for more than 30 seconds (can't blame them), but what he says is even more insane. he's saying that mao was a liberal that wanted china to join the liberal concert of nations, and that he betrayed the communists but it was good that he did that. and, of course, that he set the bases for the economic reforms but then he died and the communist hardliners like deng took over and that's why china is bad now
idk why but irl I'm like a magnet for this kind of mentally unwell middle-age men that want to tell you their theories about how degaulle was actually a bahaist
>>2917092This is some "Nazis go to Tibet" shit holy fuck
On September 18, the Cyberspace Administration of China issued the "Notice on Strengthening the Management of Infringing Information Concerning Enterprises and Continuously Optimizing the Online Business Environment". Here's the most imporant part in the notice (most notably 2, 4 and 5):
[…] Website platforms must proactively identify and address the following types of infringing content:
Personal information: Includes the disclosure of personal identity and contact details, such as ID cards, passports, household registration records, home addresses, and phone numbers, as well as sensitive personal data like biometric information, medical and health records, financial account details, and location tracking data.
Insults and derogatory content: Includes verbal abuse or insults directed at enterprises and entrepreneurs; the malicious parodying or caricaturing of corporate logos, products, or entrepreneurs' likenesses; maliciously linking enterprises or entrepreneurs to pornographic or vulgar topics; and using stigmatizing language to disparage enterprises, entrepreneurs, or specific brand users.
Impersonation and counterfeiting: Includes impersonating news organizations to produce or publish information regarding corporate oversight; publishing information under the guise of an enterprise or entrepreneur; and the unauthorized use of names, logos, or entrepreneurs' names and likenesses, identical or similar to those of the actual enterprise, in the names, avatars, or profiles of public accounts.
False and misleading information: Includes taking entrepreneurs' past statements out of context or distorting their meaning; displaying search keyword suggestions or landing page results that contradict the facts; republishing false information that has already been authoritatively refuted or clarified; and disseminating information that conflicts with public statements issued by the enterprise or entrepreneur via their official accounts on major platforms.
Other categories: Includes content designed to incite conflict by pitting enterprises against one another; the aggregation and resurfacing of old news or negative information about enterprises; infringing content that the platform has previously addressed; comments regarding enterprises posted by bot accounts or paid astroturfing accounts; and information that smears or disparages enterprises and entrepreneurs in a manner that clearly violates public order and good morals.
source:
https://www.cac.gov.cn/2026-09/18/c_1791396347229199.htmWhat do the china stans have to say about this
>>2917377It was promised to them 8000 years ago
>>2917427But nazis did go to tibet…
>>2917803>implying everyone in the West is having sex all the time, and that there are no people who just don't have sex for years or decades>implying finding another partner is impossible, only 1 to 1 Christian paradise style marriages are possible in sex lifeLol, lmao
>>2917092mate the british met blackfellas in australia that could speak english because they learned it in singapore. history is fucking weird, and us anglophone dickheads only learn european history. the maori arrived in NZ around 1250-1300CE wheras the chinese were crossing oceans from 3000BCE.
zheng he produced nautical charts that suggest he sighted australia around that time. other explorers could have landed there but died.
>>2918135>the chinese were crossing oceans from 3000BCE.
>oceans>3000BCE>the chinesewhat
>>2918168The Chinese have always possessed teleportation technology don't you know?
>>2918168The Chinese writing system goes back in it's early form to 6000 BC
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiahu_symbolsWhy do you think Chinese people cannot build boats
>>2918168yeah, the pottery of the longshan dynasty of 3000BC is all over the place including all the islands of the south china sea. we don't know how advanced they got because none of their wooden vessels survived. I didn't claim they made it to NZ in 3000BC but the archeology isn't settled, with some archeologists saying they were using dugout canoes, and some saying they were using pontoons or even more sophisticated craft made from planks.
boats are boats bro, just sailing somewhere wouldn't be a crazy anachronism like the antikythera mechanism.
>>2918242jiahu is proto writing. i did not say chinese could not build boats, i just very seriously doubt anyone was crossing oceans in 3000BCE except perhaps polynesians, but they were more like island hopping than doing sustained voyages of several months without compasses.
>>2918777>longshan dynasty>dynastyi looked it up and they were not a dynasty but a pottery culture. big difference. also pottery can move far away from its point of origin due to exchange. it does not necessarily imply a chinese national identity going back to 3000 BCE, let alone a "dynasty" that "crosses oceans."
>>2918829>jiahu is proto writingsorry, small correction, there is not yet a scholarly consensus on whether jiahu symbols were early writing or proto writing but I tend towards the proto writing camp. I am part of the mainstream that thinks sumerian cuneiform is the first writing system with strong evidence of being a full fledged writing system.
>>2918832You seem confused friend. In many respects China did in fact develop faster than the western world. They did invent many things like silk, gunpowder, woodblock printing, and crossbows. It is the specific claim of having invented writing in 6000 BCE and having "crossed oceans" in 3000 BCE that I find doubtful. In particular the characterization of the Longshan black pottery culture as a "dynasty" is ahistorical.
>>2918829ok, but the current consensus is that they were a seafaring culture.
>it does not necessarily imply a chinese national identity going back to 3000 BCEyou're running off with the goalposts dickhead. people keep trying to paint china with a colonial brush but international law and convention vacates any claim or right of return after ~120yrs (unless you're a zionazi) so it's more of an archaeological curiosity than anything that means fucking anything.
>>2918840>you're running off with the goalposts dickhead.that's odd, because I'm sure the original goalposts were
>>2918135<the chinese were crossing oceans from 3000BCE.which is an absurd claim because there is no evidence of any culture being able to cross oceans in 3000BCE
but then the goalposts got moved to
>>2918242>Why do you think Chinese people cannot build boats(which is something I never said btw)
and
>>2918840> the current consensus is that they were a seafaring culture.There's a huge difference between
"The chinese could cross oceans in 3000 BCE"
and
"various bronze age cultures inhabiting China were capable of building boats and moving their pottery around the South China sea."
The latter is completely reasonable and I never disputed it.
The former is in fact the absurd claim and the "original goalpost"
Accusing me of "running off with the goalposts" is a bit strange, I'm not sure you know what "moving the goalposts" means since I'm the one disputing the claim, not the one making it. To move the goalposts means to make an absurd claim, and then change what your claim is after receiving pushback.
>>2918844Just to sanity check your bizarrely condescending and aggressive tone I read through this summary of the history of settlement of the Pacific islands and there are examples of human settlement originating from Asia onto remote Pacific islands dating back to 1000 BC and even 2000 BC. Given this I don't see how throwing out the seafaring Chinese cultures of 3000 BC is so unreasonable as an example the maritime history of the region merely to evidence the plausibility of (and not prove) a voyage (or a chain of voyages) from what is present day China to what is present day New Zealand before the Maori got there around 1340 AD.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Pacific_IslandsThus I assert you are indeed moving the goalposts and accusing me of making claims I am not, and in addition to this violating norms of conviviality.
>>2918840> keep trying to paint china with a colonial brush but international law and convention vacates any claim or right of return after ~120yrsIndia should return the rightfully Portuguese Goa!
Oh ja, we now report zat se glorious Kaizar Wilhelm has order alles government workings with ze Amerikaner-kapitalistisher internet-kompanie zat was monopolizing ze peoplez acces zu ze intzernet and haz replaced it wid ze mozt cutting edge open source platform ja. Duetchesocializmus by zwei tauzand und fiunzig! Heil Kaizer Wilhelm! Heil zwei tauzund jahre uf unbroken Deutcher folken historie!
>>2920005China should just fucking nuke these bugs already
>>2920158
>Japanese left
LOLOLOLOL
Next arm the Israeli "left" and act surprised when they only use them to slaughter Palestinians.
Japs, left and right, despise China. The genocide and atrocities from 1931 to 1945 were literally bi-partisan in Japan. The Japanese Left were some of the most active in the Settler colonial Manchukuo government, which oversaw Unit 731. Japan's national character at its foundation is anti-Chinese, there is no future of Japan ever reconciling with China. After 2000 years the Chinese are finally starting to figure that out, hence why China will never relinquish the right to unilaterally extinguish them.
>>2920163
Name a singular accomplishment of the JRA in Japan, aside from killing teenagers in self-criticism sessions.
>There is already multiple movements and organizations in Japan backed by leftist parties all over Asia
Like what? Chongryon is a Korean organization located in Japan, not of the Japanese.
JCP literally supports Japan's claim to Chinese territory stolen during the Sino-Japanese War.
>there are plenty of contradictions to exploit in the name of worker's liberation.
Japan will always see the solution to their economic troubles in plundering neighboring countries. Even today, as Russia, Korea, and China developed nukes for their self-defense, they still are on the militarist path, itching to restore their Imperial conquest.
Its their national culture to ignore material circumstances and devote themselves for the attack, this is called samurai honor. Not an advent of capitalism, this is their culture from the earliest records.
>>2920178
epicly meme'd response, my friend!
My father has become full chinapilled. He's a working class man who works with his hands, phoned my yesterday to whine about however he points out anything that's better in China than here (UK) his boss and others blather about 'human rights'.
>>2917803If you are a young man gender ratio in your cohort is the number one predictor of quality of life.
>>2921462How the fuck nobody in this thread ever brought this up?
Promoted by government and built together with society. Give full play to the government's roles in organizing, guiding, promoting, and modelling. The government is responsible for formulating and implementing development plans, completing regulations and standards, and fostering and supervising credit service markets.
Establishment of credit in the production field. Build production safety credit reporting systems, improve records of production safety pledges and negative production safety information, as well as systems for punishments of untrustworthy production safety conduct. Focus on coal mining, non-coal mining, hazardous chemical product, fireworks, and special equipment production enterprises as well as enterprises producing or selling civil explosives and demolition enterprises or units, in completing mechanisms for production safety credit review and evaluation at entry and withdrawal, and promote the implementation of enterprise responsibility for production safety.
Focus on food, medicine, daily consumer goods, agricultural products and farming inputs in strengthening credit management for all kinds of production operation entities' production and processing steps, and establish systems for sharing information on product quality credit information between different regions and departments. Promote the establishment of systems for credit investigation on quality, accelerating the improvement of the 12365 product quality complaint reporting and inquiries platform; establish systems for reporting on creditworthiness regarding quality, releasing a black list of the untrustworthy, restricting market entry and calling for market withdrawals.
Establishing credit in the field of circulation. Research and formulate systems for the collection and sharing of enterprise credit information in the fields of trade and logistics, improving the basic norms and index systems for credit appraisals. Advance the establishment of credit in wholesale and retail, trading and logistics, accommodation, food and drink, and residents’ services, carrying out categorized management of enterprises by credit. Improve credit cooperation models for retailers and suppliers. Strengthen law enforcement against monopolies and unfair competition, intensify investigations of acts of illegal acts such as market distortion, false publicity, commercial fraud, commercial defamation,and commercial bribery, exposing typical and major cases to increase the costs of untrustworthiness for enterprises, and to promote creditworthy business and fair competition. Gradually establish nationwide systems for tracking product circulation based on symbols such as product bar codes. Strengthen the establishment of creditworthiness systems concerning the quality of health inspection and quarantine.
>>2922198>>2903461This a woke channel
Just look at Chinese social media where men are angry and venting about this. Lol?
I'm working for Miniso now. Am I now officially helping to develop the Productive Forces™?
>>2923315<umm sweaty china identifies as right wing actually because they aren't a buncha trewn-luversahahahahahahha like they need to get a fucking grip
>China makes artificial sun<ummm sweaty nazi germany woulda did it first if it weren't for judeobolshevism sabotaging usholy cope from chuds
>>2923315>blaming election cycles for economic underperformancePfft. Bourgeois governments strive towards minimal responsibility towards their people. Hence, nobody votes in those "democracies", the most politically ware people just refuse to choose between shit and piss candidates, neither will help the people.
Communist government is people's government, vanguard party of the proletariat is in charge, therefore the illusion of lack of democracy as libs imagine it - that democracy is when many parties with 2% approval ratings, all arguing something in a parliament. That's not democracy, that's usurpation of power by parties that are extremely far away from what people want
>>2923315Social democrats recognise real
>>2923315Base-Superstructure at work. China's success is undeniable, of course people are trying to attribute it to anything but Socialism. And the best way to square the circle of capitalist propaganda with China is to say that China is also some kind of right wing reactionary state. The most dangerous avenue in my opinion to divert attention is the confucian lawyer vs engineer bullshit some diaspra cuckasian are pendling right now.
>>2923315The rats beg for a ship transfer
>>2925621>Bourgeois governments strive towards minimal responsibility towards their peopleThe exact opposite. The bourgeois do not like an unmanaged proletariat.
>Communist government is Government dedicated to the proletarian class and the development of communist society
>vanguard party of the proletariat isA concept that attempts to supplant the concept of true class dictatorship.
>>2925709>China's success is undeniably capitalist Lassallian
>>2925730If China were really capitalist it would be as poor and backwards as India is today.
>>2925730>The exact opposite. The bourgeois do not like an unmanaged proletariat.Wut. Bourgeois parliament strives towards being UNACCOUNTABLE. I have no idea where your comment came from. That's the essense of dictatorship of bourgeoisie - they always, forever and ever, create "deep state" so that people's votes never amount to anything. This makes people who do not vote the most class conscious - they just refuse to participate in a humiliation ritual, it's a type of protest voting
>>2925771>This makes people who do not vote the most class conscious - they just refuse to participate in a humiliation ritual, it's a type of protest votingthe petty bourgeoisie actually do get red meat tossed to them as a class so they are fairly class conscious when they vote, especially on local commissioners, boards, propositions, etc.
>>2902602>Maybe I'll live just long enough to see most of humanity mulched by the rich after we become worthless eaters. so… like them? Also who will they sell commodities to? Why "mulch" everyone if the whole point of developing productive forces was to be more competitive at mass producing commodities for mass consumption? Why go through the work of "mulching" everyone? Even if they wanted to be rid of us, just going Gaza mode on the entire planet seems like a difficult commitment to make when they could just mass sterilize poor populations or subsidize non-reproduction… yet the US gov. seems to move in the opposite direction, trying to make abortion and birth control illegal or at least really hard to get.
>>2925768>If China were really capitalist it would be as poor and backwards as India is today.Also, the key thing to realize is that after the founding of the USSR world imperialism was firmly against the further development of productive forces. RP Dutt noted as far back as 1935:
> It has remained for our day that all the capitalist governments of the world should meet together in the world economic conference to proclaim […] the supreme aim to restrict production and to raise prices.He then gives many examples of capitalists doing this on purpose, which they still do to this day.
We should also look to the way imperialism uses sanctions, embargoes, loans, structural adjustment programs to keep countries "underdeveloped and overexploited." 19th century imperialism made the mistake of forcing Japan out of isolation and into rapid development. once Japan became a near-peer rival of Europe after the 1905 Russo-Japanese war, the racial delusions of the Europeans were (at least partly) broken. They realized then and there that any country could become just as developed as the "civilized world". From that point onwards imperialism developed new strategies to ensure that rapidly developing nations didn't develop too rapidly, and remained junior partners and dependents of the countries developing them. A too rapid development of their productive capacity especially would make them into near peer rivals. Only in the late 20th century was the mistake of Japan repeated with China (Mao/Nixon normalizing trade) out of desperation during the 70s oil crisis.
>>2925771>Bourgeois parliament strives towards being UNACCOUNTABLEThe BOURGEOIS strives towards being unaccountable. Their parliament is a different story.
>>2922194Here in china the Bride Price has become mostly a joke. It does still have some pressure on a man to have savings before getting married, but this money is almost always returned as a gesture (also given as a gesture) or is invested into a house or a car for the couple. Its a cultural holdover without the economic purpose.
China's 'artificial sun' hits new milestone with research campus delivered for use, targets 2030 for first electricity output
China’s efforts in accelerating the transition of its nuclear fusion program from fundamental research to large scale engineering have achieved a major milestone, as the project campus of the Burning Plasma Experimental Superconducting Tokamak (BEST), which is dubbed China's "artificial sun," was officially delivered and put into use in Hefei, East China’s Anhui Province, China Central Television (CCTV) reported on Thursday.
Currently, the construction of the BEST's main machine has entered a critical "four-layer nested assembly" phase. BEST is a new-generation fusion burning experimental device independently developed by China, aiming to simulate the nuclear fusion reactions inside the sun to obtain nearly inexhaustible clean energy.
Since July this year, multiple key core components of the BEST have been delivered to the site, and assembly has progressed steadily, with tasks now more than halfway complete.
Recently, the most critical task in the construction of BEST’s main machine started – the "four-layer nested assembly." Like a giant "thermos-like barrel" nested layer by layer, the device has, starting from the innermost layer, a vacuum vessel, then a thermal shield and toroidal field magnets are wrapped around it. The final step involves installing internal precision components, according to CCTV News.
The vacuum vessel is the "furnace chamber" where nuclear fusion reactions occur, and the thermal shield acts as a super insulation layer to block heat. The toroidal field magnets are responsible for generating an ultra-strong magnetic field, firmly confining the high-temperature plasma so it does not touch the vessel walls.
According to the plan, overall construction on BEST is estimated to complete by the end of 2027, after which deuterium-tritium fusion power generation demonstrations will be conducted around 2030. The experiment will replicate the sun's principle of "shining and generating heat" on Earth, and verifying the feasibility of commercial power generation through controlled nuclear fusion.
China has steadily accelerated progress toward commercial nuclear fusion in recent years. In January 2025, the "artificial sun" project sustained a plasma temperature of 100 million C for 1,066 seconds, setting a new world record, according to CCTV News.
Also, its Experimental Advanced Superconducting Tokamak (EAST) has repeatedly set world records. On June 28, the research team confirmed with the Global Times that development acceptance and full parameter testing on the two key superconducting magnets for EAST’s fusion reactors have been successfully completed.
Upon completion, the BEST facility is expected to demonstrate fusion electricity generation for the first time in history, according to the Xinhua News Agency.
>>2926048the european union had a joint project with china and the us to build one of these. I guess all of that went nowhere and was just an excuse to leech research from the EAST project?
anyway, the one thing that makes me skeptic towards these machines is that for some reason they only turn them on for like 15 minutes per year. do they get so fucked up that they have to basically be rebuilt every time? that doesn't sound very practical
>>2926132
that's something you have to prove, not assert
but a priori I can tell you that you're wrong; there are no such vulgar and simple determinisms in marxism
>>2926141
>analogies and platitudes
L
>>2926147
Convenient
>>2926147
>The Tao cannot be expressed in language retard
can anything be truly expressed in language? if someone were born blind, how do you explain to them what the word "green" means?
>>2926147
If you understood that, you'd realize that the rock is neither unmmoving nor a fixed object.
>>2926215
>A rock with nothing forming it nor nothing dissolving it is a fixed object.
And where in the universe would you find such a rock? You cannot. Your image of a still universe is itself a work of the universe in motion, of fiction of its own produced by a mind in motion. Go drink water
>>2926210>the government made by collaborators for collaborators>claims that it is going to go against pro-japanese capitalsnationalism is so pathetic holy shit
>>2918844As s Chinese, I feel I should clarify a few things. The earliest dynasty officially recognized in China is the Xia dynasty, which is dated to around 2070 BCE. Archaeologists have discovered relatively advanced urban settlements with clear social hierarchies dating to this period, which supports this account. Most archaeological sites from earlier periods, by contrast, were scattered villages.
The earliest identifiable Chinese writing system is the oracle bone script of the Shang dynasty, China's second dynasty, which began around 1600 BCE. Of course, I'd bet that China already had some rudimentary form of writing before that, the discoveries at Jiahu provide evidence of this. However, the dozens of periods of social upheaval and dynastic change in the heartland of Chinese civilization have made it extremely difficult for archaeologists to find such evidence.
As for seafaring, the Chinese probably developed their own coastal transport networks quite early, but truly largescale maritime expeditions did not come until the Qin dynasty, established in 221 BCE. Qin Shi Huang, the first emperor to unify China, sent a court practitioner named Xu Fu eastward, toward the rising sun, to search for legendary islands of immortals. Xu Fu never returned, and historians at the time believed he had died during the voyage. Some modern historians, however, have argued that he actually reached the Japanese islands and settled there, introducing various technologies from Qin China to the local population. Some early Japanese historical sources appear to support this account.
The attachment is a Chinese history textbook for the first semester of seventh grade. It covers the period from the Stone Age to around 589 CE and can help you understand how most Chinese people are taught about the origins of their civilization. You can use Google Translate to read it.
>>2926223
>There is nothing outside the universe, making it a fixed object and there is no such thing as an internal process
So says the result of an internal process.
>>2922194You could argue that present-day China is some kind of “state-capitalist” regime (although I don't personally agree, there are certainly signs of it), but claiming that China still has some sort of “feudal” character is stupid. The vast majority of harmful feudal customs were eliminated through successive reform campaigns under Mao.
Today's “bride price” is more of a new phenomenon dressed up as a feudal tradition, rooted in the skewed sex ratio and declining birth rate caused by Deng's stupid family-planning policies.
>>2926252I wouldnt call the one child policy stupid. The more I have been here the more ive thought about the positive benefits of it, largely the fact that families would invest all their efforts and resources into a single child, who would be much more capable of studying and working as a more advanced technical worker
>>2926295we might say the one child policy was a way to refine the "quantitiy" of chinese labor into "quality" labor
>>2926209>>2926197I understand what you're both talking about. You're using language to say that language can't say anything. If that's the case how come I understand what you're both saying?
>>2926215
Eventually the protons in the rock will decay, just gotta wait 10^34 years.
>>2926295It was stupid but when you realize the IMF where pushing it on China due to overpopulation fears in exchange for access to global finance capital the tradeoff makes sense given its modern day prosperity.
>>2927211>Fascists trying to claim China for themselves againKek who's going to tell him about all the woke shit like Affirmative Action, extra exam points for minorities, mandatory classes on socialism, reserved government posts for ethnic minorities, taxing richer regions to redistribute funds to poorer ones, active censorship of racial hatred, etc?
>>2927228I did mention that and he replied that he’s not against it. In fact he’s supportive of it, since China’s ethnic minorities are native to their respective lands. He said he would support policies that promote the interests of the micro-ethnic groups within his nation. Again, they also aren’t particularly hostile to socialism.
>>2927211I hate social democrats
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