/jp/ , Otaku and weeb thread.
This thread is to talk about things on Japanese culture, and the good and bad of it
>>4784>>4789>saged responses<content is genuine questions and links
Is this some kind of sick joke or what?
>>4868are you the subhuman getting mad on /games/ and here for people using sage on a chan of all places
here, just for you
>>4892>are you the subhumanNah that's just you.
>muh sageAbusing sage as a reddit downvote is the sign of a newfag
>/games/No, but seeing who you're talking about, sounds like you're a samefag
Bump, just for you, stay mad
>>4910Sage isn't bad, I just wondered why everyone was saging actual decent responses to the thread OP
>>4727>>4729>>4732>>4756>>4784>>4789Are all legit responses, and all of them are saged because…. I don't know.
>>4879>>4892This guy is just a spammer tho.
saged for off-topic
>>4789While the USSR could definitely defeat the European Axis wholly on its own (Germany, Italy, Finland and the collective forces of Western Europe they amassed). It would be very exhausting, and while the Soviets maintained a large military force in the East to ward off the Japanese, the best they could do without the USA backing them up is push the Japs out of Manchuria and establish control of Northern Continental Asia.
>If Most of East Asia went with the SovietsI mean… they did. Outside of Japan, whose loss at Khalkin Gol was partly why they took their chances striking at Pearl Harbor, Most of Asia was for the USSR. South Korea and its policies were established by brutal US enforcement and war. SEA had it's communists crushed by US and British forces or hired mercs who brutalized populations and enforced anti-communist criminal laws.
If the USSR had gotten control of East Asia more wholly, the USA would have had a lot less power projection and a lot less capability, while the USSR would have a valuable ally in a whole and functioning DPRK.
https://genius.com/Mc-virgins-weaboos-lyricsAyy, Ayy, jumpin' around like I'm Touka
Kirito, I might just, I might dethrone ya'
Erin, I'm swinging around the holster
Cowboy Bepop on my wall, that's a poster
And I might, hit your bitch with this special beam cannon
My apprentice like you Genos, just calm down, like please, dammit
Got that smile, Monkey D. Luffy
Think Nami might hug me and Happy so fluffy
So fire like I'm Natsu, please love me
>>5137I mean not really, but I'll do some "Chuni" things on occasion for fun, oon impulse.
>>5142 No ethical consumption under capitalism. THat said, don't be a brainless consumer either.
>>5146>No naruto reference<weaboo
Kek
>>5689Yeah, that's what I meant. I laughed
with most of the people who appeared in the video, not at them (either because they were purposefully funny or because they seemed to be having fun). And the rest are either "meh", actually cringy, or sad in the sense that I wouldn't ridicule them.
The jokes are obviously lost on the dumbasses who make those compilations.
>>4715It actually seems like not a bad plan to communally clean up, if everyone has to do the same regardless.
>>6018Based BPP.
>>6303We
could have discussions on what consumer goods might look like under a more socialist mode of production (ie, Boris Arvatov's idea of the "Comradely Object", material culture in the USSR, GDR, etc) but rightoids don't seem particularly interested in that.
>>6305Mangas are books.
And seeing the average leftypolack there is no difference whether they pretend to read Marx or Coolkyousinnjya.
>>6303fla-what? I have zero leftist items and all my books are PDFs and ePubs
my most expensive purchase this year is a $250 Robovac – it's really helpful though
>>8226this ones bland af
just like fate in general tbh
brocialismBrocialism >>8232I agree with the fact that fate is a very bland series, but I think Raita's characters are well designed even if his style can be off-putting.
>>8227Don't be pedant.
Orientalism Thread
>>7763School Theme Thread
>>7837>>9035>No one can possibly be this stupid, those have to be botsYou'd be surprised how many people believe Japan is le based ethnostate when it's a giant aircraft carrier for the US, completely subservient to the needs of their master.
Or how the easily ignore how Abe made it possible to import cheap labour from SEA while the JCP opposed it.
>>9050kek I'd been thinking about these "incidents" lately
Hetafags are insufferably retarded even to this day, it's like they are incapable of seeing the implications of what they do and say and watch.
>>9069I still like some of the characters tho
There's not enough USSR/communist fanart
So supposedly these BHs aren't "Marxist", but they do use "dialectical materialism".
https://nitter.42l.fr/BlkHmmrTimes/status/1419321578500894720#mAnd recently have harassed, in the typical BH autism, the PSL about their activities at events for Cuban socialism, even though both support Cuba.
Also, there are some extremely shitty takes on Helen Keller from BH.
>>9115>booktrapaccurate, Sakaists and other such retards are cancer who want black ethno-nationalism but trying justify it as "anti-colonialism"
>>9181>gender ideology<if the parents know the baby to be male, they are more likely to ascribe the kicking to the fact that the child is male and therefore assumed to be more physically active by nature Yep, this is radlib trash that will be yet another excuse to abuse children under the guise of "gender identity" positivity. All this based on tangential anecdotes, badly done "studies" and a clearly reek of sex-obsessed ideology projected onto ill people and children supposedly based on what moeshit anime promote in the capitalist market. It's just such a cart of scummy manipulative opinion that just thinking of how wrong it is raises red flags.
>inb4 why/explain/'no-argument" This is the kind of longwinded, rainbow capitalist radlib twaddle that would take longer to debunk in sufficient detail than the actual article itself, and nobody is going to read that.
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/01/16/anim-j16.html
>Magia Record, Kakushigoto, Fruits Basket and Sword Art Online: A general review of anime in 2020
>Anime is an immensely popular entertainment and art global medium, particularly among young people. It is one, however, to which socialist criticism or general sociological criticism is never (at least consistently) applied. There are millions of texts, blogs and words devoted to comparing one anime with another, but this is almost always done from a fairly superficial or purely personal standpoint rather than one that contextualizes the medium politically and historically.
>We are writing about anime to encourage audiences who, at this point, tend to accept the material that passes before their eyes rather uncritically from a social point of view to begin demanding more substantial work. We live in acutely tense and complex times, and the generalities and banalities that anime has thrived on to this point are wholly inadequate.
>Here, therefore, is a review of a selection of anime that aired throughout 2020 with an eye on different genres, source materials and studios as well as popularity and, admittedly, the author’s own personal interests. >>10538I'm a way too old otaku who's always been into a lot of underground Japanese subculture shit thanks to learning the language but even I have to be amazed at the sort of shallow orientalism that's going on on imageboards, like cumming at sakura trees, larping as an imperialist or making Japan seem as the last trad ethnostate (it really isn't), or more recently and what prompted me to make this thread, someone posting a picture of their room with a huge ass poster of Tokyo's subway map. Like really? What's the appeal of that? Sure, he might have been a train otaku, but nothing else in the picture indicated that.
To sum it up, fuck orientalism.
>>10486Where did that misconception of Japan being trad come from? They're just as degenerate as Americans and just as spergy. They have traditions that are only traditions of habit now it seems. They're an isolated nation we must remember.
I think it's funny because Japan's values are the exact opposite of American's ones.
>One of the strictiest gun laws in the world>Nanny state - fining people for not strictly following the rules and using an ironically informal blacklist for individuals that do not follow them, mirroring China's Social Credit Score. >Not individualist at all>Merit doesn't really matter>Religion is a private matter instead of being shoved down your throat>Public shaming keeps freedom of speech in check>No freedom to criticize the governmentAnd so on, but looks like burgers are willing to trade their "values" in exchange of having less commies (read: liberals) around them.
<well you see, the japs are submissive and they are well behaved and cultured and maintain their traditions so they don’t need guns to defend themselves! Japanese people used to be cool and rebellious back in the 60s-80s, but modern nips are effectively domesticated and brainwashed by their ideological state apparatus. There's a reason why leftism is a pretty fringe thing in Japan. This is very much evident in anime or manga too. Japan's definitely not like some rightoid's wet dream, but it also lacks people and movements that want to change the system for the better along progressive leftist lines. Japan's just filled with confused youth who aren't critically well-equipped to denigrate the current system because no one in Japan guides them towards leftist philosophies. So all they do is rationalize their just anxieties as personality flaws and try to "come of age", which basically means to fit in and look the part (the recent Evangelion 4.0 conclusion is a good example
>>9774 ).
Call this perhaps Nazbol, but there is something tragic about how Japanese culture has been majorly cucked by modernity and imperialism, sort of like how the Korean used in the DPRK and the southern entity have become at times unintelligible to each other, so some say.
>>10550 >>10551 >but there is something tragic about how Japanese culture has been majorly cucked by modernity and imperialismI mean they wholesale rejected their culture in a feverish drive to modernize themselves as fast as possible during Meiji era. Yet another impact of Zaibatsu policies.
<Nevertheless, after the Meiji Restoration of 1868, governmental policies of modernization and westernization dictated a wholesale rejection of the preceding feudal era. Even the best elements of Edo-period culture were deemed outdated and vulgar and were thought to require prompt and thorough extirpation. <When, for example, a school of fine arts was founded in Tokyo’s Ueno Park during the Meiji period, the Japanese government established a department of Western music but made no provisions for the study of traditional Japanese music. Today hardly anyone would agree with this policy, but it took many years before Japanese traditional music began to be regarded as equal in value to Western music. And it was not until after World War II that Japanese music was made part of the official public school curriculum. Another big example of this is the creation of state Shinto. Before that Shinto and Buddhism were so intertwined it was to distinguish what was Shinto and what was Buddhist, given how many Shinto sanctuaries and Buddhist temples were built near each other and were supposed to "help" each other. For example, the monks prayed to make the kami residing in the sanctuary attached to their temple to convert it to Buddhism. Then the Meiji government made up state Shinto, forced the separation of Buddhism and Shinto and uniformed Shinto practices throughout the country, this way countless of actually traditional Shinto practices got lost forever.
>>10610This is not to say that old Edo Japan is better for the average person over all.
>Samurai were abolished of their special privilege as a feudal class. The Samurai were pretty much permitted to rape and murder whoever they wanted prior the the Meiji Reforms. Random laymen could be stopped and murdered in spontaneity if the Samurai wanted and no consequences would follow. For example, there is a practice known as Tsujigiri in which Samurai would test their new blade(s) on an unfortunate civilian. In other words, the Samurai pretty much had 100% impunity from any crime (against peasants) any ancient civilized society would deem depraved. >The Samurai were not noble compassionate super-warriors like they were shown on TV and Japanese Imperial Era bastardized Bushido. Instead, they were an extremely oppressive class of nobles who exacted intense suffering onto those below them with virtually no consequences. The only real “traditional Samurai spirit” one can see in the actions of the Imperial Japanese were their absolute brutality fueled by unbridled hubris. Samurai in the warring states period always switches allegiances and surrenders were a totally acceptable outcome. It’s only when the Imperial Japanese needed to impress the Westerners and convince the West of their civility that they began spinning and bastardizing the Samurai narrative to fit the rose-tint lenses of the Western perspective. The Meiji Restoration brought a transition to capitalism and so advanced social rights and other aspects from the feudal oppression. It's something that Rounin Kenshin goes into a bit.
https://www.marxists.org/history/etol/writers/barker-c/1982/meiji/index.htmlWhy the shogunate did not get overthrown prior to the 1860s
https://archive.ph/HN5lW The Last Samurai from cinematographic perspective
https://archive.ph/q55fB Historical Accuracy
https://archive.ph/mU5EY >>10889See
>>10491 and the assorted thread replies
>>10487>seafood>the ultimate white people food.That feel when the earliest archeological findings of upright humans in Africa had them living on the coast eating sea food.
Also do Japanese fetishize Black people (muh blacked) like rightoid incels in America do? Like yeah there is some Black on Asian stuff (
>>9029 ), just about every fetish has some content in this porn-addled capitalist culture, but I mean specifically a focus on the fetish. From my observations both personally and in social media, they tend to be into whites and dislike blacks, edging into racism at times.
Something very common to weebs is an obsession in Right-Wing Japanese politics and their treatment of other nations like Korea or China - thus denial of Nanking and other atrocities that the veterans of the wars themselves admitted. "労務者" (rōmusha) programs having individuals that are "willing" or "benefited" kind of ignores the fact that people that live in such conditions have to change to survive - doing this kind of shit and keeping pretenses of pride leads to death; there is a reason some rape victims act more sexually promiscuous after, trauma and dealing in it is terrible.
An example of this is Videos 1 and 2 and article related
https://archive.ph/mxVWbLinks to said videos in Ytube
1 -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9syNRdgz_Xw https://archive.ph/4LNQ5 2 -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVW-Aryn3PU&ab_channel=FUKUSHIMAVideos https://archive.ph/md5rC The second video refers to documents uploaded on
http://texas-daddy.com/comfortwomen.htm (yes the URL is legit and you can use archive.is if you're wary).
Video 3 is a counter to some of stuff in the first 2 videos
The issue then is not with their wanting to learn the language. I don't have a strong opinion either way; it's not a major problem.
I don't have a problem with people who are into the more obscure stuff like Japanese-only VNs only because of that fact. However they're most often lolicons, coomers, and other kinds of unpleasant people that I wouldn't want to interact with, but that's it. Like many things in the world, it's a symptom, so there's no point in focusing on it.
>>12918Back to /a/ fag
>>12919This
>>12917>>12924>>12925Ok, you're deranged. I advise anyone seeing this thread from not replying further to this normalfaggot.
What's with the string of terrible threads today?
>>12926You're just being a schizo. Why would I specifically mention "Not your average weeb who watches anime now and then".
Did you feel offended? Lmao
>>12929Funny you imply I'm offended when you give a fuck about what people masturbate to just like your average conservatard.
Unlike you, normalfag, I'm accepting of all otaku (as long as they are leftists, of course).
>>12931>otaku (as long as they are leftistsToo bad most of them aren't.
I don't understand why you're even seething
>>12933Because you're a normalfag coming into an anime board to seek validation for your hatred of otaku, which is frankly a very bizarre thing to do. It's bizarre to complain about outcasts on an imageboard in general, really. If someone is an otaku by definition they're "hardcore" to mainstream society.
If your thread is supposedly about an overwhelming minority, why even make the thread in the first place? Almost all people into VNs never bother learning Japanese and are fine with whatever translation they can find, too.
Did you make this thread just to reaffirm to yourself that you are a Normal Person™?
>>12934Ironic weeaboos are so annoying and really ruined it for everyone. "Yeah, I like anime but I don't watch it that often. Fuck otaku! I'm not like those weirdos. Heh heh…"
It's fine if you're depressed or you got mindfucked by society and need to fit in so you can't enjoy anything anymore (or admit to others that you enjoy things) but at least let people still into it do their thing in peace.
To further my point: Hardcore otaku are a lot more interesting to talk to than normalfags like you.
>>12935Your bizarre seething is very soothing for some reason. Is this your first day here? Every other thread is basically just shitting on otaku in this board. This thread is pretty tame compared to that shit.
>why even make the thread in the first place?To get more information on the kind of culture and material conditions that creates these people.
>>12917op youre getting quite mad about a strawman thats living rent free in your head
>le consoom le weeb le coomyou forgot your wojak
>>12931>conservatardburger liberal spotted.
>I'm accepting of all otaku (as long as they are leftists Hilarious ideologue pseudshit - you could be the scum of a fandom and be welcome because "hurr I, a totally honest guy support communism!" ignoring the fact that consumerism by default goes against actual leftism, and that hardcore escapism only helps capitalism.
Otaku are defined today by consumerism and nearly none of them do anything productive unlike the 80s and 90s that had Otaku actually take part in creating works. Even then in the 90s, the trend of brainless waifufag consumerism had begun.
>>12922 >muh NPC<muh normies Go back.
>>12978>Muh normie <normalfag is different, look at de graph Potatoe, potato, fuck off, pseud
>willfully ignorant of the literally millions of artists in social media No I am not, I have seen it and coomershit made en masse for nitter is incomparable to the insane effort done in the 80s and 90s, editing 8mm film, making manga spinoffs and garage kit modeling, all lacking today's convenient tech. Today it is far less common in the fandom at large for there to be productive content, the only reason you can claim millions is cuz the internet has made anime and manga accessible to far more people than VHS and laserdisc copies ever did.
>Old Good New BadBecause you're a n00b that at best has no taste.
>t's so tiring with you peopleright back at you
>>12985>>12986You are the guys mad and depressed that anime supposedly sucks now, even worse, quite blatantly sexually repressed conservacucks while the best you can do is imply I'm an amerilard or underaged while larping as an oldfag with passé terminology.
Why do you try to pin it on me when I'm still capable of enjoying anime while you don't?
>the only reason you can claim millions is cuz the internet has made anime and manga accessible to far more people than VHS and laserdisc copies ever did.lmao so you agree with me? Oh wait, it doesn't count because it doesn't appeal to your specific tastes. The number of anime and manga produced has only increased, at least stop spouting lies like otaku are less involved when they're more involved than ever. That was never really a concern for you.
>>12989>the guys mad and depressed that anime supposedly sucks nowIt does.
>Muh sexually repressed conservacucksBurgeroid mongposters ought to be banned for retarded takes like this; "Ooooh you don't like [X], you must secretly like it!"
>imply I'm an amerilard or underaged while larping as an oldfag with passé terminologyYou talk and act like a burger and your claim of 'larp" is a fail too.
>so you agree with meDios mio… No, you dumb cactus, the quality overall is lower, but the sample size of today is far larger; the basic concept of quality v quantity, idiot.
>The number of anime and manga produced has only increasedNonsequitur and again, quantity =/= quality, the anime today are noted to be worse by anyone not a newfag like you.
>>12993>nly thing you guys have complained about, more than anything, is "porn" and "sexualization"LMAO you actually are making things up. People are pointing out this because it is intrinsic to otaku today, noted by literally every mangaka, animator, etc. of the industry and weebs themselves, ergo the egregious and excessive fanservice even in shows aimed at younger audiences, compared to anime fo the prior decades.
>I'd like to thinkYou don't think, you just whack off and spout bullshit.
>despite being a third worlder in his 30s1) I don't believe you
2) T.A.N.G.O.T.I.
3) If true, then you're even more of a retard for it.
>>12922>oversocializedWhat the fuck does that even mean?
>>12931>>12928And I recommend that you go outside as well as read a fucking book. I don't care if someone is a "normalfag", you're not oppressed for being more into anime than an average person.
>>13033>misogynisticIt's not misogynistic, and you're the clown for thinking that, fucking newfag.
>relevantSame principle, applied to idpol of raace rather than gender, claiming to be black or female or whatever on an anon forum is retarded because it's used to give the anon "credential" to deflect criticism, and unless proof gets posted, they're a blowhard. There's a reaason "anon" is blank or red or green - indicating a placeholder for anyone, because your identity is contradictive to anonymity.
>>13046>It's not misogynistic, and you're the clown for thinking that It is, but you obviously don't and porbably wouldn't understand. Enforcing such a "rule" inevitably ends up alienating those who aren't the "default" of "white American male" (especially those who are female).
>fucking newfagWe're not on 4chan and you're saying "newfag" as if that meant something or were an actual argument kek. Sorry for questioning a retarded "tradition" of imageboard "culture" that I believe should be done away with!
>applied to idpol of raace rather than gender, claiming to be black or female or whatever on an anon forum is retarded because it's used to give the anon "credential" to deflect criticism, and unless proof gets posted, they're a blowhard"Idpol"? Oh yeah, because fighting identity politics is totally the same as telling people on an imageboard that they aren't non-white, third worlders or female until proven otherwise.
Besides, that faggot is partly right, people here are (pretty randomly) accused of being American or zoomer or whatever, as if only Americans or zoomers were capable of having certain opinions, to discredit those opinions and avoid having to make an actual argument. But replying "actually, I'm not American so you're wrong about that and just assuming things about me" is somehow worse, or automatically means you're trying to deflect criticism or forcing idpol?
>because your identity is contradictive to anonymityBut as it turns out, you're not enforcing anonymity any more. Anonymity means that nobody knows exactly who you are, not that no one should ever have a vague idea of what you are, and even while "anonymous" you can guess things about the posters' real life identities, or learn which poster is which across the site. Being free to talk about yourself or your thoughts on certain matters, without being tracked and identified irl or on other sites, is one of the benefits of being anonymous. It doesn't necessarily mean that everyone must pretend that they're all the exact same person behind the screen. I could reveal something about myself in this thread, and in others I'll say something entirely unrelated and seem like two different people, and no one would be able to know it's both me except the mods because they can look at my post history, unless I used a name or avatar. That is anonymity.
By being pedantic about people casually mentioning their race, gender, etc. even when relevant, you're not fighting actual idpol, in fact, you're not even refuting anything with that. If you insist on "fighting idpol", the correct response to him should've been "it doesn't matter if you're American or a third-worlder" and left it at that since you had already addressed his main point. But now that I think about it, he wasn't even arguing anything when he mentioned that, it was just an example he gave.
Fuck you dumbass, I will continue to shit on you and your 4shitter culture
>>13070>obviously don't and porbably wouldn't understand. <I can't explain the nonexistant sexism of the idea of complete anonymity in regards to identity on a chan! It isn't, liberal.
> Enforcing such a "rule" inevitably ends up alienating those who aren't the "default" of "white American male"<Muh Yt malez!!! Literally the entire context is mocking burgers fore outing their inane ideologies, and the pathetic attempt to deflect criticism by claiming to be "le third world" having no proof. Go back to reddit.
>We're not on 4chanYeah, it's remodeled Bunkerchan called leftyPOL.org that originated ON 4chan you fucking hack. Newfag has been used here for years, n00b.
>as if that meant somethingIt does, it means you're a newcomer spouting inane liberal takes.
>muh no argumentThere is no argument because you have none to begin with
>Sorry for questioning a retarded "tradition"It's not retarded, the maxim is simple and logical; You are ANONYMOUS meaning you have no privilege in a conversation by the nature of race, gender or any other aspect, so nobody can cry "I'm [X] and totally have authority about that topic" an entitled burger mentality, and contrary to anonymity.
>because fighting identity politics is totally the same as telling people on an imageboard that they aren't non-white, third worlders or female until proven otherwise.Yeah it is, see the above. Anyone that brings up a claim to be of [X] identity seeks to reclaim the 'advantage' of it in a conversation, because you're too vapid to actually argue a point, or just post proof.
>people here are (pretty randomly) accused of being American or zoomer or whateverBecause Americans & zoomers re the general majority of these opinion types and word uses.
> is somehow worse, or automatically means you're trying to deflect criticism or forcing idpol? Generally speaking, yeah; that is typical /pol/ tactics when they try to pretend a "hello there fellow leftists" approach. /siberia/ has an entire thread dedicated to examples of /pol/ trying to do this
>not that no one should ever have a vague idea of what you areIt does in regards to a conversation wherein you are called out for literal america-tier liberal takes, and try to pull a "I'm totally an adult, and not white, and third-world too!" It sounds doubtful and an attempt to deflect criticism
>By being pedantic about people casually mentioning their race, gender, <Mentioning a general rule of internet anonymity in passing is being pedantic LMAO imagine making a mountain out of a molehill like that, you've made an entire retarded diatribe about a LITERAL ACRONYM I posted casually, you fucking dramatic prick.
Also See above, it's not about race and gender, it is about using your identity (or claim to an identity) to try and deflect criticism or give yourself authority on an identarian subject.
>Fuck you dumbass, I will continue to shit on you and your 4shitter cultureLMAO you're a retard. The guy didn't even reply to my post but you whipped yourself into a fury over an issue nobody had. You're just picking a fight for no reason.
>>10990>do Japanese fetishize Black peopleBefore the 2010s, not really. But this interracial fetishism is on the rise there, (probably due to their decades of burger servitude and the closed-eyes attitude to US Army rape of their women).
An example: VR porn where you get to take magic black man pills and transform into a black man so you can take sexual revenge.
The titles are long as fuck. Must be a cultural thing. Kind of a good idea to just explain every last detail of the film instead of picking a cool title and leaving it to the imagination. Here's a translation:
>[VR] Girls tease me for my small penis. When I take a pill that's supposed to make you grow down there, I turn into a black man! Fucking them with my super strong black dick, I get my revenge on them with powerful SEX!This is it in Japanese:
>最強の黒巨チンを手に入れて仕返しのパワーSEXで見返してやった!森沢かな 花宮レイ 新川愛七 笹倉杏 >>14172>>14179yeah you see, it's markets that is being claimed to cause consumerism. this is the trouble with people just posting stuff before defining their terms - when that retard said CONSUMERISM INCOMPATIBLE WITH LEFTISM he specifically meant that Leftism is incompatible with any forms of market.
>>14180probably some situationist stuff. all Leftism is his extremely specific personal philosophy, you see.
>>14629>he specifically meant that Leftism is incompatible with any forms of market.Correct
>all Leftism is his extremely specific personal philosophySnide word-play that you put into the mouths of others, does not make you excluded from the same folly.
>>14638>read more, liberal<I googled an article to 'defend' me because I had no argument and got butthurtYeah, don't tell people to "read more" if you clearly didn't read the article yourself. The article make some fair points but much of it is taking quotes of various 'famous communists' and cutting out their context (like you are) and so creating the illusion that "consumerism is A-Ok in socialism" ignoring
A) Real world considerations as per the actual real life impacts on/in socialist countries
B) The consumerism of products like cameras or furniture or children's toys is significantly different to fandom consumerism of products.
It does not address Lenin's critique of consumerism and instead goes off into a tangent. It is just another long-winded excuse trying to justify bourg-'leftism' and has the utterly unaware gall to accuse anti-consumerism as being "bourg"
>you're just stupidIndeed you are, and a bad-faith argumentator at that, not only did you take a very specific excerpt out of context but you also ignored the rest of my point on the mechanisms of consumerism in regards to Otakuism.
TL;DR: See
Affluenza: How Overconsumption Is Killing Us and How to Fight Back by John De Graaf
>>14644>A) Real world considerations as per the actual real life impacts on/in socialist countriesmy understanding is that some form of consumerism, not meaning psychological patterning of behaviour to favour consumption but rather the productive element of consumerism, existed in various kinds of real socialism - if we discount Dengism, then we still have Honecker's approach, or the Lange-Lerner model.
>B) The consumerism of products like cameras or furniture or children's toys is significantly different to fandom consumerism of products. Yes, so here we mean where fandom consumerism is as much shaped by the product as the other way around. however, it's one thing to discuss how capitalism creates it's ideal consumer through cultural domination, and quite another to present the effects of this as some sort of personal moral failing.
>It does not address Lenin's critique of consumerism then we have to be including this from the get-go - this isn't the Leninist Anime Board, if you say "real leftism", it will not be automatically understood that this is what you're referring to - you could be referring to literally anything, otherwise. The article does indeed dismiss Lenin out of hand, though - it points out a discrepancy between Marx's theory of revolution and Lenin's, specifically the role of imperialism, and from there takes the liberty of not investigating it further, which is disappointing.
>It is just another long-winded excuse trying to justify bourg-'leftism' and has the utterly unaware gall to accuse anti-consumerism as being "bourg"When we talk about anti-consumerism without reference to already existing socialist movements, which you are not doing but I think it's relevant in exploring the meaning of the term, we generally find individual attempts to escape consumerism, like going off grid or having a garden farm. These behaviours are distinctly the kind bourgies partake in because they have the greater leisure resources to do so, whilst society quite deliberately raises the bar of entry to this lifestyle to almost everyone else. So in this sense, reducing critique of a larger system to a specific opposition to a singular aspect lends itself to impotent moralisations rather than an actual solution to the problem at hand, it is a problematic label.
>and a bad-faith argumentator at thatmy main purpose was to try and determine where exactly your stance was coming from, because it wasn't clear originally.
>TL;DR: See Affluenza: How Overconsumption Is Killing Us and How to Fight Back by John De Graafthanks for the rec
>>14694Listen CONSUMING things is not in and of itself consumerism as the ideology of consumerism is defined. By the very nature of existing and living humans HAVE to consume, you consume resources to survive and as an intelligent being continue to try and nourish your intellect. This is not the same as buying shit and "consooming product". The immediate assumption on this site by anyone that isn't being disingenuous or a n00b, is that by consumerism the latter term is being referred to. This is accepted by default. That is the reason leftypol has laughed at /pol/-bait about iphones and similar crap and the concrete rule of "No Ethical Consumption Under Capitalism (is possible)"
>quite another to present the effects of this as some sort of personal moral failing.Nowhere did I imply that. I explicitly stated that ideologue nonsense about "anyfandom/consumerism is acceptable if they claim to be leftist" ought to be rejected outright as an easy method to turn a blind eye to bad shit because "hurr uncritical support". Literal Kochinsky shit.
>this isn't the Leninist Anime BoardIt is now. But in all seriousness. By leftism leftypol has almost exclusively meant communism/socialism and in cases anarchism, and the marxist model is the primary one of the site, ML being a close second. I should have perhaps replaced leftism with socialism but it'd been a snappy response to a shitty post on a random thread of a Chinese Checkers forum.
>it points out a discrepancy between Marx's theory of revolution and Lenin's And ignores that Lenin's reason for the discrepancy is based on Marx's folly of ignoring several factors such as peasantry, proven by Marx's utterly ignorant dismissal of Russia as a revolutionary origin, despite Russia having the longest history of uprisings and attempted people's revolutions and revolts in Europe during and before Marx's lifetime. Marx, despite recognizing Prussian ideology in Germany ignored that in his claim that countries like Germany would become the centers of Revolution in the step to socialism and communism, something that the crushing of the various West European communist revolution attempts prior to and after the October Revolution demonstrate.
>These behaviours are distinctly the kind bourgies partake in because they have the greater leisure resources to do soYou forgot one tiny little detail… this is a very First World take. There are plenty of non-bourgieosie people that partake in anti-consumerism on a relatively individual or small community level, the Amish as a famous example (among them are often communist groups that form isolated communes).
>main purpose was to try and determine where exactly your stance was coming from, because it wasn't clear originallyMy unclear stance is because it's just banter, I didn't expect nor seek to make an /edu/ effortpost, I've got plenty of those under my belt as it is.
>thanks for rec Ya velcome.
>>14709>Listen CONSUMING things is not in and of itself consumerism as the ideology of consumerism is defined. yes - HOWEVER, consumption produces a culture of consumption out of which grows consumerism, at least, I thought that's what you were saying. for example, you mentioned escapism benefiting the current regime, and this is something that can be engaged in without any overconsumption - which begs the question of whether one can engage in consumerism whilst buying nothing. it's logical that consumerism is a frame of mind, but is it still consumerism if the consumer is not consuming more than they need as a result of that framework?
>The immediate assumption on this site by anyone that isn't being disingenuous or a n00b, is that by consumerism the latter term is being referred to. This is accepted by default.Yes, but there are parts which were less clear. For example, do we mean both piratefags and buyfags? Both build the framework which allows for the buyfag, so there we could have our hypothetical non-consuming consumerism. For another, when we consider how a system produces consumerism, we tend to think about how products encourage patterns of behaviour, and of the prevalence of advertising, but both of these factors work much less strongly in favor of anime than, say, marvel movies. Are western anime fans producing a rogue consumerism in mindless emulation of the culture that produced them? I ask these simply because it seems to me that even though there's certainly consumerism involved, it's not clear cut or simple at all.
>And ignores that Lenin's reason for the discrepancyI tried to word that diplomatically, rather than saying "it points out various disagreements between Marx and Lenin", for example.
>Marx's folly of ignoring several factors such as peasantry, proven by Marx's utterly ignorant dismissal of Russia as a revolutionary origin, despite Russia having the longest history of uprisings and attempted people's revolutions and revolts in Europe during and before Marx's lifetime.Agreed. And even in Russia there was still a large industrial proletariat factor, Mao dunked on this idea of peasants not being especially revolutionary subjects even harder. The one area that I am intrigued by in this is aspects Marx said would grow out of the most advanced forms of capitalism in a socialist society, the closest to which we've seen would probably be East Germany. Would an authentic socialism born in a first world country, just for hypothetical purposes, look better or worse than the ones we've seen so far?
>You forgot one tiny little detail… this is a very First World take.it is. I think it's fair to say that consumerism for first-worlders and third-worlders is a different experience. The Amish are a good counter-example, but these methods are a bit like the old utopian phalansteries. An Amish-Mutualist revolution would be fun to see, though. But I wonder whether one even could end consumerism in a first world country in a lifetime - under socialism in these places, I could see people scrounging around for the last supplies of particular goods, people hoarding coca-cola and stockpiling funko-pops. Would development of luxuries begin to mirror the forms of old consumerism, and would people left to their own devices in their own free time set about making their own coke and funko-pops and so, of their own accord, produce a sort of replica of what went before?
>>14873>Consuming media is purely virtual!<merchandise? Buying dvds and blockchains being on physical servers that have to burn energy to run? Fuck that, it's all totally in your head Fuck off.
>>14872>my position not being much different from your run-of-the-mill antihumanist theoristBeing a "theorist" does not exclude being a theorylet, Stirner had plenty of theories, yet his internal logic is fucking inane.
>proper marxists would rather focus on production rather than consumption<Production and consumption aren't linked! To change production does not exclude changing consumption. That is excluding that it isn't a 1-way street interaction.
>ets keep having discussions over what products or how much it is wrong to consume <"N-no don't criticize self-destructive escapism that divert people from drastic reality and their need to face them." The CIA thanks you.
>>14981If they wanted to make them huwite adults, they would usually give them blonde hair and often harder jawlines.
Also people don't realize japanese beauty standards are more 'paedo-centric' than 'euro-centric'
A year ago (2021) Liev Schreiber’s son was trending on Japanese social media 'cause of how much he looked like an anime character
>Back in 2016, Donald Trump’s son Barron went viral in Japan, where he was dubbed a bishonen (“beautiful boy”) idol.>Now, another famous son is making news for his bishonen status, and this time it’s 13-year-old Samuel Kai Schreiber. Kai, as he’s affectionately called by his parents, is the son of Hollywood actors Liev Schreiber and Naomi Watts>When this photo of Kai and Liev popped up on Twitter in Japan, it immediately went viral, with people agreeing with the original poster’s comment, which read:>“The issue of Liev Schreiber’s son being too beautiful.”>over 143,000 likes and more than 14,000 retweets, >the majority of commenters likened him to a real-world Howl, from the 2004 Studio Ghibli film, Howl’s Moving Castle.>The photo of Kai and Liev that went viral in Japan was actually taken some years ago, at the 2017 Emmy Awards(when he would have been between 8-9 years old).Now the only reason this Liev Schreiber’s son looks like an 'anime character' is because he's a kid, caucasians after 15-16 usually very and I mean very rarely have the short midface/smooth skin/short nose thing anime characters have. Anime characters faces are just a collection of caucasian with very very neotenous features, look at the comparisons made, Howl from Howl's Castle looks nothing like adult white man, despite being a man in his early 20's his face is similar to a white kid's (even though he's 27 and not 9 like that kid). So Japan is kinda of a weird country with its ideal of what is considered desirable.
Even Japanese people note this social trend:
https://girlschannel.net/topics/3656778/ >>14981More importantly the Japanese do this to try an differentiate themselves from other Asian characters. An example is a Japanese war crime denial manga someone posted on /a/, all the Japanese characters were drawn in the typical anime/manga style while the Koreans and Chinese were visibly depicted as more Asiatic. Possibly due to the impact the more Caucasian looking Ainu had on the Japanese physical appearance makes them think that they can see the delineation between themselves and Koreans more distinctly than outsiders can, despite this not being the case. Back in the 2000s someone did a test where they asked Koreans, Japanese, and Chinese to identify random photos of people from those categories and they were no better than randomly guessing.
https://quizterra.com/en/can-you-distinguish-a-chinese-from-a-korean-or-a-japanese Just as an FYI but there's a reason that most Asian people especially in Japan and especially in the past, had been small, and had smaller jaws like pic 1 rel - lack of nutrition, for the same reason many Asian males have receding hairlines. Lack of dietary nutrients that Europe had in more abundance led to smaller, and under-developed (physically) people. That's also partly the reason Europeans and in general humanity has had average height increase over time.
>>>/edu/8665 (part about Male pattern baldness in Japan and food).
Additionally make up, hair-styling and more can be a world of difference to facial change, pic 2 rel.
>>14984>Japanese war crime denial manga someone posted on /a/, all the Japanese characters were drawn in the typical anime/manga style while the Koreans and Chinese were visibly depicted as more AsiaticWhat manga is it?
I would like to see it for the memes
>>14991[DISC] The Girls Trying to Bring About National Pride (and a couple other similar manga.
Volume 2 is especially about this, specifically depicting Koreans angry about 'comfort women' attacking current Japanese youth over the atrocities of their ancestors of the time.
While I also don't deny that fact that many Korean/Chinese survivors of WWII who've survived these atrocities also hold hostilities toward the Japanese I'm sure that in reality only a small minority of them (if any at all) would actually blame the youth of Japan for those crimes. If anything this was just made to discredit those groups and paint them in a negative light.
Author:
https://myanimelist.net/people/49765/Akiko_Tomita Vol2:
https://archive.ph/bHW9m https://www.wired.com/story/who-owns-4chan/bros the fake news media is on 4chan's case again
but late to the game
>>15187So who got the GoodSmile money?
moot or Hiro?
>>15191Definitely Hiroyuki.
>>15188I remember 2ch and Futaba saying shit like "surely 4channers aren't stupid enough to fall for Hiroyuki's deception", meanwhile everyone on 4chan actually believed Hiroyuki didn't know English or that he couldn't afford to pay 4chan's bills.
>>15195>M-muh generalz Faggot please, Get thicker skin and stop bitching about you not being able to make your separate, overly specific special snowflake thread on the same topic.
>Otaku boardBut not every thread is specifically about Otaku and /jp/, most are about specific anime or anime genres.
>>15187 >Holodomor awareness monthThis better be a fucking joke.
>>15193diDn't the guy literally go to a Burgerstani college?
how did that not get discovered on the question thread
the claim could be more believable
>>15556>if you aren't terminally online like meYeah no, stop projecting
>call your momUnlike your burger ass I have a family that isn't alienated generationally, take your own 'advice' snowflake.
>>15187.
How is moot these days, anyways.
>>16880Indeed he was. I don't want to sacrifice my life like that and I wouldn't say it online if I did, but damn. If there was actually a threshold of based shooters like that reached I think it would actually have a positive effect. How safe our politicians feel walking around the general public despite all the scumbag shit they do to us is a shame.
As a hypothetical thought experiment: If people were to do that and leave a very based manifesto before hand(not cringe Spyro the Dragon shit like Tarrant) I think it really could inspire people. Can't think of one shooter who left a based Manifesto. Dorner's was super cringe as well sad to say(actually the part about the cops was based, and it really sounded believable, but he starts talking about how much he likes Michelle Obama and weird shit like that.) Imagine if one of these assassin shooters left a long and detailed an unarguable justification for killing their target and also a broader message. Could probably redpill some people.
Why aren't otaku NEETs more anti-capitalist? Correct me if my sample is biased, since I mostly hang out on imageboards, but a ton of them are right-wingers even though they recognize that, for example, work is shit and ruins your life, increasing commodification of anime and vidya is ruining their hobbies, and that companies don't have their best interests in mind. If you suggest that this is caused by capitalism, though, they'll rage, flip the table at you, and invent some mystical reason for their problems.
>>17915we don't, though. i don't know any communist besides haztard schizos who glorifies work
>>17916they aren't, gacha for example is a constant cause of controversy within the otaku community for obvious reasons
>>17914Is it that difficult to comprehend how come many nihilistic consoomers, who are often lumpen-petty-bourgeois, just sufficiently financially endowed to be able to go become hikkiNEETs, or prone to the fetishization of Japanese imperialism and the encouragement of misogyny, aren't very receptive to communist ideologies?
>>17919Yes indeed, and, like, basically every explicitly socialist state had historically the obligation to work for all who are able written into their constitutions.
Also, Marx himself remarked similarly that, to paraphrase, the aim of Communist society is to make it such that to labor is considered nigh sacred. Labor, that power to transform the world, is a special, perhaps divine, gift of humanity and should be celebrated and joyful under Communism. It shouldn't have to be work that is all drudgery, obviously. But even the gradual extension of humanity's time for leisure, as one goal that Communists have supported, is ultimately for the sake of the replacement of the domination of the burdensome necessary labor, which is what toil is necessary work for merely human survival, with the primacy of labor that is done for the sake of fulfillment for each and every, the realization of the felicitous and blessed destiny of humanity and the realization of justice and salvation; as Communists, for our goals' sake the productive forces, yes, must be developed, so that the burdens of necessity are no more the yokes which upon the masses cruelly weigh. >>17920Thats more the right wing thats obnoxiously moralizing.
>>17916Alot of our anime/mamga entusiasts are only in it for childhood feels. Not unlike Western superhero movies/comics.
Its all about feeding an inner child that was neglected of any physical experiences of youthful adventures.
Its a plague of Millennials, Gen Z, and future generations.
>>10614 Speaking of Edo Japan
>>>/edu/1855 is the Samurai/Japan thread so feel free to explore this, it's got a lot of effort posts on the subject.
An issue that rarely gets talked about in relation to /jp/ is Toyoko Kids. It seems to be a replacement for Delinquent and Sukeban subculture (
>>7655 ), although much less flashy and 'cool' looking. I think it's a reflection of Japan's repressive capitalism that seeks to hide everything that appears bad while refusing to fix endemic issues.
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2024/02/05/japan/society/toyoko-kids-tokyo-subculture/In case of Embed Death
>>21579 >Japan's Ridiculous Weatherwoman Fiasco >Japanalysis <"Hiyama Saya experienced massive blowback last month after a major revelation" TL;DR: Cute weather woman who played a single, young girl as a role for her job got idolized by Japanese men. When she was revealed to have a relationship and a personal life, immediately was attacked by these incels for ruining the immersion of their escapist obsession.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7QG9owYEUY >>22738mp4 file 1
>>22814 >Japanese Fans FURIOUS About Woke Translators Ruining Their Animes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5coh8UoYqvA >>23222>nagashi soumen, which is like, ramen sliding down a half bamboo with a gentle stream of water pushing it along.>222What cursed trips, the fuck?
<[Eng sub on] Extremely Fast Nagashi Soumen >つかれた犬のアニメ>>23957>Several things mark out the Toyoko Kids as being different to the homeless people who have historically occupied the area. For one, they’re much younger. And secondly, contrary to popular belief, they’re not all homeless — while some are, others who are from Tokyo, Chiba or Saitama prefectures go back home after staying in the area for a long time to escape their home environment.>>Then there is the fashion: For girls, there is the “dark kawaii” aesthetic of frilly blouses and short skirts or oversized hoodies with anime-style makeup, and for boys an emo-influenced look of black, baggy clothes with dangling chains. The overall style has been dubbed “jirai-kei” (literally “landmine type”).>>Toyoko Kids have also become influencers and fashion icons on TikTok, X and other social media platforms, further drawing neglected youths to the area — for example, those being abused at home or bullied at school. Hierarchies partially linked to social media clout exist within the community, with individuals given titles like “God,” “King” and “Empress” depending on their popularity and influence in the area.Wait,
that's where jirai-kei allegedly (hadn't bothered to research yet) comes from???
Also:
>“Someone will offer them a place to stay, with one person booking a single bedroom[…] and smuggling around six people in one room,[…]But[…], they would eventually have to pay for their share too and so they have to go ‘work’ — as in street prostitution.”Yooo what the fuck? And society is okay with this?!?
That's like the-real-shit sort of lumpenproletarian activity, not merely delinquent/sukeban behavior, which is much more petty with its orientation and is fairly tempered in the actual level of "criminal" activity involved.
>>14984 >>14983 >>14981 This conversation was revived recently on /siberia/ so I'm reposting an amalgamation of the best takes plus my own.
>What's up with chinlets doing this "we wuz annie may n sheiiit" stuff?Main character syndrome but on a “racial basis”, as in
<thing non-european is popular… so it must be because the cartoon characters are secretly white with their aryan features like blue hair and gigantic eyesThen comes the question why darker skinned anime character still have the same gigantic eyes and non-natural hair colors and the cope goes into overdrive. Plus most characters in anime are either black-haired youths or otherwise have distinct hair that isn't just blonde aryan. Many Japanese anime make fun of that actually or have them as antagonists, or both; for example, Riser Phoenix in High School DxD is an asshole antagonist, Darkness from Konosuba is a fucking masochistic joke and Dragon Ball's General Blue is both an antagonist and a source of some humor. Ironically the character of Naruto and Edward Elric are among the few mainstream anime characters that most casual anime viewers know of and who are blonde and blue-eyed. Luffy and Goku are black haired with black irises and Ichigo was ginger with brown eyes.
There are exceptions to this, but generally that's in older anime or anime that has a style of more normal (or excessive) proportions, such as Ninja Scroll, Naruto or One Piece. The First is pretty realistic in physical depictions, with the only grotesqueness being characters that are obviously abnormal monstrous humans. Naruto has fairly normal proportions of the body, so Black people from The Hidden Cloud such as the Raikage are fairly normal humans but still obviously black. One Piece has a massive variety of absurd character designs, (like tiny legs for massive bodies or weird faces or whatever) so it obviously breaks the mold here.
Frankly speaking however it's just a massive, *Disney type exaggeration of traditional conceptions of young female beauty; big eyes, smol nose, round yet shapely face etc. It got so exaggerated at times that it became a common meme among weebs since at least the early 2000s about "animu face" wherein the eyes were so large that it was like a Roswell Gray alien's head. Only terminally online escapists actually associate this with real women.
Japanese people aren't clones of each other and there is some variation in appearance within their population. And like pretty much everywhere, most artists draw character who match some beauty standards rather than ugly people.
*Osamu Tezuka loved Carl Barks' works making the Donald Duck comics, having been introduced to them as a child by a US soldier after the end of WW-II. He even sent cards of thanks for the former. So in essence the big-eye anime style was originally an emulation of early Disney style, and later it came around full circle in the early 2000s when Western cartoons like ATLA or Ben 10 began to emulate the big eye Japanimation style. Ironically during the 80s and 90s both Japan and the USA focused on smaller-eyed characters, which is why characters like She-Ra (She-Ra) and Yuria (Fist of the North-Star) have fairly normal looking faces.
As a side note modern Disney-face edits with more 'normal' eyes:
https://www.eonline.com/news/663484/here-s-what-disney-princesses-would-look-like-with-realistic-eyes >>24644 >44Checked Addendum about Self hating japs (pic 1 rel)
>Wide nose Japanese>Eyes extremely far apart>Purposefully slouched over with wide waist and malformed/bowed legs>Eyes placed too high up on the face compared to real life >Ears placed too high >Head deliberately squashed to look oblong>Shorter height despite it supposed to be a 1:1 comparison This is what Japancel otaku escapists actually believe.
>>2464624 46 46
Damn, those are some solid dubs for a pretty decent post. nicu.
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