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>>2796324Victory day post mortem edition
Evidence of the influence and origin of neo-Nazi groups in Ukraine
https://archive.ph/44B9Qhttps://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323637https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323658https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323663https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323688https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323729https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323733https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323731https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323735https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323740https://azovlobby.substack.com/https://banderalobby.substack.com/—————————————————–
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>Video Essays / Historical Background📺 • Ukraine: The Avoidable War - Boy Boy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL4eNy4FCs8📺 • Ukraine's Nazi Problem - The Marxist Project
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yZvWAwU5W4📺 • America, Russia, and Ukraine's Far Right - Gravel Institute
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0pyVJG7_6Q📺 • The Nature of Putin's Russia and Its Causes (3-Part Series) - 1Dime
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8d6Vzi7zYghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zODWTfMwFGwhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Zuygh9Mzuo
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Why did mods remove my post when I said as an Iraqi worker the death of Ukrainian proles doesn't bring me any joy? Is internationalism haram in this shithole?
>>2808629Communism is famously banned on leftypol, yes
>>2808633It could be interpreted as third worldism too since Ukraine is post-2003 Iraq tier shithole
>>2808698looks fragile af
>>2808704And that should matter, why? it's a robot.
>>2808731Because it wont be working after a few rounds…
>looks at the last thread
Interesting thing about poles is that they consider themselves as pure evropeans that have ascended and left asiatic Ruzzia far behind, yet they spend every second of their day thinking about Russia and memorizing its GDP to the last decimal. They reproduce the exact same memes as Russian liberals do like "can you buy a GPU for PPP?" which shows that instead of hanging out with Western Europeans they are still deeply immersed in Russian/CIS discourse looking for every little straw that could make them feel superior
Meanwhile I don't even think about Poland or what life there is like beyond general geopolitical knowledge and distaste for their anticommunism, and the only polish meme I really know is bobr kurwa
It's a curious phenomenon
>>2808787have you considered it might be a valid argument against the >superpower by ppp crowd?
i also assure you the average pole doesn't know anything about russia and associates it with alcoholism, polar bears and communism
>>2808629>Iraqi worker>Ukrainian proles <ACTUALLY, the Jamba Juice workers in the World Child Trade Center weren't wilful collaborators with World Trade from the finance imperialist pedo cabal. No one could have possibly known that the temple to globalism would be like that! None of Jeffrey Epstein's private island workers could have known what happened to all those teens who were sent into the satanic altar of capital and never came out.Notice how the 'class analysis' of vulgar Marxoids never mentions what their job is (holocaust factory)
>>2808832yeah man i'm sure the median ukrainian who does plumbing was really just a plumber at the genocide factory
>>2808829Dude, you have a shrinking population, young population runs away from your growing GDP paradise. Besides, it's fucking obviously oxymoronic that a country without industries can have a growing economy. Like, you know that Ukraine GDP-wise grew more in 1990s than USSR did with a "forced" industrialization? Like, Stalin only managed something like 3x growth, according to GDP figures, while Ukraine had managed 7x (!!!). This is such a profoundly retarded idea to conflate GDP with the real economy
Also, Eastoid new-porky states used GDP nonsense to prove to their populations that they are now better off than under communism, lol, when in fact they got robbed blind, and their economic and political rule had resulted in depopulation that only comparable to Nazi genocide in scale
Gee, let's compare GDP growth map since 1990s for baltic states and Poland to depopulation map
Oh, right, I forgot! GDP is such a good metric that Euroids cope with per capita, lol, making it so porky capital counts towards prole's wellbeing, lololol
>>2808897Oh, and Russia is more or less the same. Europe didn't give you anything, capitalism was a failure, last 35 years you were subsisting on remnants of Soviet and Eastern Bloc's industries.
From whatever side you look, GDP is a fake metric. PPP as well, but to a lesser degree, because GDP is merely a modifier arbitrarily multiplied with nominal GDP.
>>2808897> a country without industriescheck out poland's export map
>to prove to their populations that they are now better off than under communism, lol, when in fact they got robbed blindwe do in every single aspect from crime to unemployment rate to life expectancy to infant mortality
>>2808901your gdp rate map is nonsense.
polish economy was $65.98 billion in 1990 now it's $1.13 trillion good luck making that 2% annually.
at this point you're either posting this trash to bait me to replay or are clinically deluded
>>2808787It's so dumb. I have no issue with Poland. Just don't be aggressive and don't do what the CIA says, that's everything we ever wanted from them. Poland didn't even have a collectivized agriculture because the Soviet Union let them do their thing.
>>2808941>we do in every single aspect from crime to unemployment rate to life expectancy to infant mortalityIf you are having a great time, then good, go have a great time. If your point is to dunk on Russians or to shill for EU, then the same things happened here. The bourgeois order stabilized. That doesn't mean it's not an atrocity or that GDP is a good metric.
Most westerners say that things are not great and I'll take their word over yours on the merits of the system they invented and practiced longer than everyone else.
Are we still talking about bloody McMansions?
You can tell the war is going great for both sides when 95% of the discussion is about irrelevant shit
>>2808997NAH fuck the polaks. daddy stalin hated them so i will too. plus the majority of them are so fucking right wing. they have a 99% ethnic homogeneous society and they still complain like the west has fallen if even a couple ukriggers claim asylum
>>2808997>It's so dumb. I have no issue with Poland. Just don't be aggressive and don't do what the CIA says, that's everything we ever wanted from themPoland should be like Yugoslavia or at minimum be like Cold War Finland
>>2809030But we don't live in a world where you can avoid imperialist blocs without major consequences innit
>>2808997>Poland didn't even have a collectivized agriculture becausepoles fought against it, gomulka himself spent three years in jail over it, it's not a kindness of the soviet occupant.
>If your point is to dunk on Russians or to shill for EU, then the same things happened here.my point is to straighten you out when you when you post cope like >quality of life in russia is comaparable to the west, just don't think about it
>Most westerners say that things are not greatnot so great in relation what they're used to, not in relation to what the rest of world experiences - they still live on the top of the world and it's not even close
>>2809030if there only wasn't some kind of a russia trying to invade europe just a country over they could have probably be like that
>>2809035The Russian threat in 1999?
>>2809038it's the same russia and the same russians as always just because they've experiencing a stump doesn't mean they won't go ogga booga anymore
plus at the time they had just murdered dudajew, they were committing atrocities in chechnya every singe day which i remember watching on tv as a kid
fuck russians and whatever they pretend to be now, i know exactly who they are
>>2809043>muh chechnyathe west was literally backing al-Qaeda tier jihadists against the russians
poles are so retarded smh
>>2809049iran literally backs hezbollah against israel
>>2809058hezbollah protects christians and is non-sectarian you are retarded
>>2809049word except it wasn't, >the west sat that one out just like it sat out jews committing the same atrocities in palestine that happened at the same time
islamism was brought to chechnya by arabs but was curated by russians who used it as a means of control - so that the young democracy falls and the country becomes an easy to control bantustan
>>2809060doesn't matter, apparently foreign interference is grounds for invasion
>>2808629As a Bengali peasant on a fly farm, I totally agree with you! Praise NATO, hoch die internationale Solidarität!
>>2808753It's literally just a tube and a robot arm on tank treads.
>>2809035>poles fought against it, gomulka himself spent three years in jail over it, it's not a kindness of the soviet occupant.and as a result had the worst economy in the eastern bloc, good faggot fuck you, one nuke to warsaw please
>>2809039>le ruzzian constantly invadingwhich country did they invade in the 90s? (like the good us dog he is, it will seem obvious to him)
>>2809067Xir Bangladesh wasn't invaded by the Ukrainian bourgeoisie unlike Iraq
>>2808941>check out poland's export mapirrelevant
>we do in every single aspect from crime to unemployment rate to life expectancy to infant mortality<believing made up numberscattle
>your gdp rate map is nonsense. polish economy was $65.98 billion in 1990 now it's $1.13 trillion good luck making that 2% annually.
at this point you're either posting this trash to bait me to replay or are clinically deluded
lol, now its even more fake, get a better script faggot
The eternal pole is like the baltoid and germanoid a historical anomaly, their lands will be used as a nuclear waste dumb and nobody will care
>>2809043>wah wah i believed the tv propaganda the gov forced down my throatwhy is every pole i meet here complete cattle? its not even funny.
>>2809114Poles are ontologically proles. Read Marx.
Also the Haitian revolution
>>2808629> I said as an Iraqi worker the death of Ukrainian proles doesn't bring me anyAs a thirdie prole, living in the 3rd world, banderite death brings me joy.
>>2809119Your opinion is invalidated by your liberalism
It holds as much value as any burger ITT
As someone living in Minsk, this is an interimperialist war that should stop and ukranian and russian workers should find some way of reaching a peace.
>>2809063If foreign interference alone is grounds for invasion Poland should have been nuked by now for invading Iraq. Also Hezbollah started out as a national defense organization due to Israel invading Lebanon so you're just exposing your typical Polish lack of understanding about everything.
>>2809146he was too focused fighting reactionarism, he forgot that some forces can stop being reactionaries, while the oppressed can become reactionaries.
that's very well known.
>>2809090and now it has the best one, how about that?
>>2809119what's the reason for thirdie revanchism on ukrs of all the people? they didn't have the chance to colonize anyone, they are not particularity successful so it's hard to be jealous
i just don't get it at all
>>2809125the point completely flew over your head
>>2809146would he say this about ukrainians today bros?
>>2809159>they didn't have the chance to colonize anyonethey are the gusanos* of every third world country if they had absolute military and financial support and backing from the us and eu elites to destroy the section of their country the live in. but worse, because they praise bandera and nazism directly.
*gusanos: every us cocksucker that would kill you if you talk bad about the US, good about socialism, and wet their undies if they see a gringo.
>>2809164yeah and if your grandmother had a mustache she'd be your grandfather
>>2809165in ukraine, many people have hitler's mustache.
and yes, that makes them hitlerites, you asinine troll.
>>2809124>As someone living in Minsknot relevant
>this is an interimperialist warye, sure, an interimperialist war between a semi-peripheral regional power and a fully peripheral comprador state
> that should stop and ukranian and russian workers should find some way of reaching a peaceAgreed.
>>2809155>"The Jungle is reaction" No. When Marx says reactionary classes he is referring to something like the Iranian Revolution in the 1980s. HOWEVER the context has changed. I very much doubt Marx could predict or know of the sheer scale of surveillance and control imperialist states would accumulate. Planes were a fantasy in his day, cars were barely functional experiments. The machine gun was the newest weapon and Sir Maxim claimed it would end future wars with how deadly they were. The reality is that critical support for any anti-imperialism prevents a global hegemon from completely choking all of the proletariat. Why do you think "AI" and robotics are being pushed so hard?
>>2809117>>2809114>>2809166>>2809162A very underrated quote from Churchill's memoirs comes to mind
>"The heroic characteristics of the Polish race must not blind us to their record of folly and in-gratitude which over centuries has led them through measureless suffering. It is a mystery and tragedy of European history that a people capable of every heroic virtue, gifted, valiant, charming, as individuals, should repeatedly show such inveterate faults in almost every aspect of their governmental life. The bravest of the brave, too often led by the vilest of the vile! And yet there were always two Polands; one struggling to proclaim the truth and the other grovelling in villainy." >>2809204>Even Churchill was redpilled on the Final Solution to the Polish Questionholy kek you know it's bad when even the Anglos acknowledge how terrible you are
no nukes launched against kiev :(
russia is so disappointing sighhhhhhhhhhh
alright what other multipolar opposition force should I support now that cucktin has thrown in the towel? is it time to go back to Axis of Resistance posting?
>>2809305Morrocan national liberation against the CIA sand hohols of western sahara
>>2808829china makes a lot gpu with their pp and their better than nahvideo
>>2809471Why do you think Lenin is contradicting himself? Unless you can admit that you're an illiterate retarded faggot and Lenin is consistent since his position has nothing to do with moralism, not once does he say support the lesser evil bourgeois shithole his point is wholly based on advancing class struggle
>bourgeois national revolution in feudal colonial shithole = progressive >inter-bourgeois war = reactionary - must be supplanted by civil warIran and Russia are bourgeois shitholes and have been for decades. They're what Lenin called "slavers fighting for equitable distribution of slaves" with other slaver shitholes in the west
Neck yourself brainlet
>>2809507>Why do you think Lenin is contradicting himselfi dont think he is
>>inter-bourgeois war = reactionary no you see that is actually not what he says. what he says is inter
imperialist war = reactionary. he actually says multiple times that you should support bourgeois shitholes against imperialist domination and colonialism.
oh and while iran and russia might be capitalist and bourgeois they are not imperialist or even close. they are both in a neocolonial position wrt the imperialist world system. 'semi-periphery' if you wanna get real specific. but in no way imperialist or advanced or at the highest stage, export raw unfinished goods as their main economic contribution, no primacy of capital export, no saturation of domestic investment opportunities due to technological saturation necessitating extra territorial expansion to stave of the falling profit rate. that last one is the real one. as long as its still profitable for the national bourgeoisie to build productive forces its still progressive, since progressive from a marxist materialist perceptive is essentially synonymous with the building of productive forces. imperialism as the highest, last stage is when the borg no longer builds productive forces because it becomes unprofitable due to the rising organic composition of capital under monopoly conditions and turns to living off rent provoking a crisis of overproduction necessitating the export of this contradiction onto another country, or alternatively the imposition of austerity provoking worker revolt at home.
>>2809512>you should support bourgeois shitholes against imperialist dominationAre you referring to the part where said "imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism" because that sounds like the opposite, and according to your incoherent understanding of theory based on xitter quotes, that means we should support the US against Iran.
But fortunately for us communists we recognize that Russia/Iran are monopolistic capitalist states and so the only resort must be revolutionary defeatism.
You're unintendedly legitimising US imperialism, unlike us Marxists who view the war as nothing but reactionary struggle of slavers.
>>2809522sorry fren but round here it means:
>tank cross borderand
>big bad small gud >>2809527no im referring the the part where he says "must render determined support" and "actively resisting means supporting". you know the parts of the quotes in the post you are replying to where he says communists should upport bourgeois nations
>>2809527>Russia/Iran are monopolistic capitalist stateswrong
NEW MAIDAN DROPPEDIndians are really taking over ukraine. the AI picture below, it's a meme, but…
not a meme:
https://versii.if.ua/novunu/ruslan-marczinkiv-poyasnyv-chomu-migranty-z-indiyi-pryyizhdzhayut-praczyuvaty-do-ivano-frankivska-video/
>Ivano-Frankivsk Mayor Ruslan Marcinkiv said that foreign workers from India, Bangladesh, and Colombia are already working in the city's construction business. According to him, the main reason for such migration is the difference in wages between Ukraine and the countries from which the migrants come.banderites (like all white supremacists) on suicide watch.
>>2809533>>2809537>bourgeois nationsIt's talking about national liberation movements in FEUDAL COLONIAL shitholes which is objectively the most progressive thing in the world… a century ago. I <3 Musafa Kamal, I <3 Gamal Abd Al Nasser, all were historically progressive despite killing communists and enslaving workers (like any good bourgeoisie), the bourgeoisie they represented is no longer historically progressive since proletariat revolution is now possible in Turkey and Egypt (thanks to them <3)
Now how do you respond to pre-monopoly capitalism being reactionary (what you presume Iran and Russia are)?
>>2809545nah he was talking about any subjugated nations. not feudal mode of production just colonial dependency. he openly supported non-feudal bourgeois nations against colonialism. financial neocolonialism reproduces the same relationship of dependency as classical colonialism. and of course its not because lenin said so, but because of what i said, that bourgeois nations are still progressive pre-imperialism.
>Now how do you respond to pre-monopoly capitalism being reactionary (what you presume Iran and Russia are)?easy, you are wrong and that isn't what lenin said. it doesnt go feudal -> monopoly it goes feudal -> capitalism -> imperialism, that is reaction, progress, reaction. internal contradiction drives the development of a thing into its opposite and back again.
now try actually reading marx for once
>>2809553>>2809550>bourgeois nations against colonialism>financial neocolonialismNice leftist jargon but we are discussing Lenin here and he never said any of this otherwise you would've linked it. All what you quoted is about national liberation in countries still colonised with feudal/semi feudal structures, try reading your own texts past the highlighted "gotcha".
Also you simultaneously believe pre-monopoly is reactionary compared to imperialism and that Russia/Iran are pre-monopoly capitalist states that must be supported against imperialism, rather than admit this is an inter-imperialist war and proceed with revolutionary defeatism (against the west in case of being westerner workers) but that will entail having solidarity and trust in the international proletariat which you deeply lack. This is where revisionism and illiteracy leads.
Weatern leftists would rather convert to Islam with their campism than believe Iranian workers are equals and capable of struggle
>>2809527>Are you referring to the part where said "imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism" because that sounds like the oppositeNo it wouldn't, since the question of monopolies is a question of the level of consolidation of firms within a capitalist state. It doesn't follow from Lenin's statement that we should support an imperialist power against one that is essentially waging a bourgeois-democratic revolution against colonialism. Lenin is clear that we should support the latter.
>>2809581>no it doesn't if we close our eyes and imagine and alternative realityOgey
>>2809581You're right, sorry.
>>2809581btw this is a meta critique
>>2809583 I'm not disputing that a bourgeois revolutionary Iran isn't fighting US colonialism. I'm disputing the schizophrenic assertion that the US is practicing 19th century colonialism rather than imperialism (highest stage of capitalism) and that Iran represents a revolutionary bourgeoisie (against which pre-capitalist formations?) when it is a reactionary bourgeois power that repress/es/ed proletarian revolution in Iran. You're applying early 20th century formulations on 21st century material conditions.
While here
>>2809590I'm poking fun at the retarded contradictions within your own narrative
Had to break it down since I doubt your ability to comprehend it otherwise.
>>2809596>resorts to larping as meUnderstandable since I shoved you against the corner and pulled your pants down in front of the class
>>2809607you're a retard
> I'm not disputing that a bourgeois revolutionary Iran isn't fighting US colonialism. I'm disputing the schizophrenic assertion that the US is practicing 19th century colonialismwho the fuck is talking about 19th century you moron
>Iran represents a revolutionary bourgeoisie (against which pre-capitalist formations?they're revolutionary against imperialism, not against pre capitalist
>when it is a reactionary bourgeois power that repress/es/ed proletarian revolution which is completely irrelevant to the discussion
>You're applying early 20th century formulations on 21st century you're just coping by whining about dates and semantics rather than presenting any compelling counter argument
>contradictions within your own narrative <iran state being a bourgeois state wanting investment is a contradiction in the narrativeyou're either an irredeemable moron or bad faith. Maybe both
Update me on Ukraine's collapse status.
>>2809694Closer than it was yesterday.
>>2808941>we do in every single aspect from crime to unemployment rate to life expectancy to infant mortalityDude, "European standards" are way more lax than Russian ones. Majority of statistical anomalies for Russia is explained by harsher standards for data.
>polish economy was $65.98 billion in 1990 now it's $1.13 trillion good luck making that 2% annually.Like, look at this shit. Imagine believing that Polish economy actually grew this much while industrial economy decreased in size drastically.
>muh Polish exportsBuddy, under capitalism, you work for a wage. Why would exports work any different? The retarded goto assumption for you capitalist bootlicker types is that countries export goods only after saturating local markets, when in fact the thing that happens is what was called in Czarist Russia "starvation exports", although not so drastic because it's not peasants (very inefficient producers) food you are exporting.
Check out google AI cope (influenced by Poltards' own cope, obivously) that inefficient "high volume planned economy" steel production outputs of 11-13 millions tons of steel is worse economic output than today's 7 million tons, lmao
>>2809759Electricity output - from 1990's 130TWh to 2025's 170TWh. So, what, 30% growth in electricity production over 35 years, while GDP nominal grew from $65.98 billion in 1990 to $1.13 trillion. Do you realize how fake GDP looks, lmao? AT BEST you are only 30% better, but in reality real wages have dropped relative to 1990.
>>2809568>All what you quoted is about national liberation in countries still colonised with feudal/semi feudal structureswrong
>Also you simultaneously believe pre-monopoly is reactionaryno i dont, i said the opposite, twice
>Russia/Iran are pre-monopoly capitalist states that must be supported against imperialismbecause that is correct
its on you to show how Russia and Iran are imperialist if you really think so
>>2809607>(against which pre-capitalist formations?) this is not the necessary qualification for support
>when it is a reactionary bourgeois powerwhat do you think "reactionary" means?
>repress/es/ed proletarian revolutionis that what you mean by "reactionary"
oh no, we know: idealist bullshit, otherwise you would already have conceded that this is not an inter-imperialist war because there is no material basis for the development of higher stage capitalism necessary for imperialism on the iranian side
why does lenin say imperialism is moribund, decaying capitalism? why isn't non-imperialism decaying? whats the opposite of decay? think about it just a little
whats the material basis for reaction? not the symptom, not how it culturally manifests, but its objective socio-political-economic cause from a marxist perspective?
>>2809664>>2809786>>2809799Revolutionary/Reactionary aren't transhistorical moral statements, they're relative terms based on definitive material relations, Lenin says "Imperialism is revolutionary COMPARED TO pre-monopoly capitalism", "the bourgeoisie is revolutionary COMPARED TO feudalism". Both are reactionary compared to the proletariat, the dominant class in all countries in the 21st century.
When you say the Iranian bourgeoisie is revolutionary while admitting to lack the prerequisite struggle with pre-captialist formations you expose yourself as a retarded chimp.
>inb4 small bourgeoisie vs big bourgeoisie You should be supporting US imperialism since according to you Iran and Russian aren't imperialists
>"Imperialism is reactionary compared to pre-monopoly capitalism"I'll be making a post copying this discussion since I dogwalked and your incoherent liberal ideology so hard I crashed the site
>>2809891>"Imperialism is revolutionary COMPARED TO pre-monopoly capitalism"Pre-monopoly capitalism no longer exists.
>"the bourgeoisie is revolutionary COMPARED TO feudalismFeudalism no longer exists and Lenin also junked this analysis later because Russia at the time was mostly feudal and he still launched a socialist revolution rather than taking the menshevik approach of building capitalism first.
>When you say the Iranian bourgeoisie is revolutionary while admitting to lack the prerequisite struggle with pre-captialist formations you expose yourself as a retarded chimp. Iran is not structured upon feudal relations. Iran is a modern capitalist state therefore all arguments for imperialism against Iran collapse.
>>2809892>Pre-monopoly capitalism no longer exists.>Iran is a modern capitalist stateI agree hence I'm for turning this inter-imperialist war into class war 👍
>>2809884the ned, the usaid, the cia, and their capitalist financiers love your neithersideism.
so much they love you, they financed themselves their own type of neithersidist camp. for 'clueless' stupid people like you.
>>2809759now ask chatgpt what services are
or better yet have it explain three sector theory to you
>>2809759export/import map is the easiest peek into how diversified and developed an economy is
bushels of wheat have been an index for pre-industrial economy sizes, tonnes of steel for industrial economies.
we've left industrial era almost a half a century ago
>>2809884le enlightened centrist has arrived
>>2809911Wow it's just like this time where the US gave 50 billons dollar to the soviets in the 1940s
>>2809911The screenshots you posted are a complete non-sequitur. What communists would I be attacking here? The Russian oligarchy, rallied around Putin and his team, or maybe the liquidated and geriatric socdems from the KPRF? You're cheering on an interimperialist conflict in the most literal sense, taking place on the corpse of the USSR, in which both sides are mafia regimes ruled by their respective cliques of capitalists, literally kidnapping workers to the front and sending neo-Nazis to rape whichever towns have come under their occupation at the moment. The Ukraine war is merely one step further in the barbarization of the former Soviet Union, and there's no amount of cope, boomers with red flags, or syncretic rhetoric that can change this reality. The only outcome one could potentially cheer for (if there were a socialist movement in Russia or Ukraine, both countries really made sure throughout the war that the Left would not be a factor through political repression and incarceration) would be the collapse of the respective regimes engaged in the conflict. Get out of your echochamber and stop treating the industrial slaughter of hundreds of thousands of press-ganged conscripts as the staging ground for your LARP. If you want to play pretend you should get into fandom wars or fucking HOI4
>>2809946> What communists would I be attacking here?no, the least raectionary force here is Russia. the one single most anti-communist force there is in this planet is the US. I don't know what comes after the fall of the US, I don't care about if and hypotheticals.
I am anchored to the current circumstances. now, this
>>2809940 is a non-sequitur.
>>2809959Putin of -93 is not the putin of -26. He has expressed his early west simping and belief in Europe Russia integration was his greatest mistake. Nafoid concerntrolls on this board just keep pushing that if he really wasn't a cuck then why he hasn't nuked Kiev and brussels already.
>posted it again award
The Yeltsinite faction knew exactly what the west wanted to hear.
>>2809944Holy cuck grandpa. Just get rid of this loser wtf
>>2810013Those are rookie numbers, the stock market has gone up like 25% in the last year, I've made more money than them (by percentage)
>>2810013That's the war working as intended
>1 million casualties
>ghost of kiev numbers!
>>2809580Especially capable of class struggle are the iranian proles led by Western NGOs!
>>2808704>>2808753the recoil compensation on it seems tolerable and the more sensitive parts aren't actually getting jostled all that hard
>Greece says attack sea drone found on island is Ukrainian, calls incident ‘extremely serious’why is ukraine hiding explosive boats on greek islands in the mediterranean?
https://apnews.com/article/greece-ukraine-russia-sea-drone-c51b74a4472ab60411b330515eadf5e8 >>2809891>no response Another L for liberalism
>>2809789Explain how this was said or implied here
>>2808629If you can't, send me your address so I can mail you schizo meds.
>>2810045Western NGOs are famously anti neoliberalism and foreign investments! Neck yourself orientalist westoid dog
>>2809944Being Russian and having Cucktin as a leader has gone way past humiliation ritual status at this point. If I was Russian at this point I would start pretending to be Ukrainian because at least Zelensky doesn't make constant excuses like
>le kremlin deceived me!!!111
>If I was Russian at this point I would start pretending to be Ukrainian because at least Zelensky doesn't make constant excuses likeZelya:
<Therefore, to guarantee peace and tranquility, we must all act quickly and proactively. We must not be afraid to set new precedents. This is what the world should have learned long ago at various turning points, for which it paid a heavy price. This was the price for the fact that the world only reacted, and did not act proactively.>''muh west should've acted less passively years before 2022https://www.president.gov.ua/news/mayemo-ne-boyatisya-stvoryuvati-novi-precedenti-vistup-prezi-75293Zelya:
<Europe is not offering anything and does not want to enter this story as a helper for the Iranian people and the democracy they need.https://www.president.gov.ua/news/zvernennya-prezidenta-do-uchasnikiv-specialnogo-zasidannya-v-102517westoids are gonna believe in aliens now just because Ukraine said it
https://unn.ua/en/news/its-not-just-the-us-doing-this-flash-recalled-receiving-a-call-from-a-government-agency-after-a-video-of-a-frontline-ufo-sightingThe video is obviously fake, with some CGI monster. It's silly. But it was reposted by Serhii "Flash" so the media has to treat it as fact, as they do with every other statement coming from Ukraine.
>>2808941That later gdp figure is inflation unadjusted guaranteed. No country in history has ever grown by 20x in 30 years.
Poland is the most successful of the post socialist states in terms of real gdp ppp growth, but its still like 2.5x to 3x.
There are few reasons for this, including but not limited to: Starting export oriented capitalist transition (inc. austerity) in the early 80s, having its debt waived in the early 90s, being subcontractor for assembling on germany's doorstep, remittances from massive emigration, subsidies integration into nato & receiving american bases, later eu subsidies, etc. (I will also leave out some of the methodological problems with gdp data like how some portion of service growth is really just hidden capital gains)
Its not replicable experience generally though (since there a sharp limit to how many people become subcontractors for western europe, germany in particular, and how migrants those places can receive). By contrasting example, even the relative growth of Central Asia during the 2000s isn't because it required a massive commodity price booms (which becomes obvious in the subsequent 2010s slowdown)
There thankfully two indicators that never recovered which mean that the polish problem will not be a problem for us evil totalitarian communists indefinitely: Collapsed birth rate & increased death rate.
>>2809039You should go yo war with Russia. Uncritical support from me for Poland attacking Russia.
They are so backwards anyways right? You'll win easily for sure.
>>2810081That assumes he needs to make excuses when snorting coke and ordering his unadoring public to be kidnapped and sent to indefinitely hold another “outhouse” or die trying.
>>2810269sad to disappoint you but there's literally nothing for us in it
>>2809891>Revolutionary/Reactionary aren't transhistorical moral statementsdid say otherwise
>they're relative terms based on definitive material relationsexactly what im describing
>Both are reactionary compared to the proletariatproletariat is a class it can be either reactionary or progressive depending on what its doing
>Iranian bourgeoisie is revolutionary but i didnt say that either
>admitting to lack the prerequisite struggle with pre-captialist formationsor that?
are you even reading the posts you respond to or just making shit up?
>You should be supporting US imperialism since according to you Iran and Russian aren't imperialists why? again where the fuck is this incoherency coming from??
>>2809898being a modern capitalist state doesnt make you imperialist. being at the highest most advanced stage of capitalist development does. those are different things
why are we trying to put modern imperialism in a 100+ years old frame again?
>>2810344>proletariat is a class it can be either reactionary or progressive depending on what its doingKEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK volunteerist retard
>>2810348So we should US imperialism against pre-monopoly non-imperialist Iran according your interpretation (rape) of Lenin
>>2810413>I'm a liberalYou could've started with that
>>2810376>So we should US imperialism against pre-monopoly non-imperialist Iran according your interpretationo you fucking retard. how many times do i have to say it?
>>2810376this moron has never heard of backwards masses or reactionary unions. proles are reactionary all the time
>>2810429you simultaneously believe pre-monopoly states are reactionary compared to imperialism and that Russia/Iran are pre-monopoly capitalist states that must be supported against imperialism. You should consider suicide
>>2810430Read Marx
>>2810438>you simultaneously believe pre-monopoly states are reactionary compared to imperialism no i dont(4x)
>>2810438>Russia/Iran are pre-monopoly capitalist states that must be supported against imperialismyes this is a very standard marxist position going back nearly 200 years.
it really doesnt seem like you know what any of those words mean since you keep confusing and mixing them up
how is russia a victim of imperialism not a perpetrator of it?
>>2810447They're le eastoid
>>2810447how is russia a perpetrator of imperialism? what do you think imperialism is?
>>2810440>your retarded libshit "theory" says this>nahI accept your concession
>200 yearsImperialism (highest stage of capitalism) developed in the early 20th century libro. I'm quoting Lenin word for word, argue with him why petty capitalist shitholes are reactionary compared to imperialism
>>2809155 >>2810455russia is an expansionist state with a reactionary ideology
>>2810458>>your retarded libshit "theory" says this>>nahidk man it really doesnt seem like you are capable of reading. i didnt say that and i told you i didnt say that four times. anyone can go back and look at the posts. you are just inventing shit no one said
>>2810461ok but neither of those are the material basis for imperialism, so you are using a liberal idealist definition of imperialism and not a marxist or communist one then? which means marxist and communist analysis such as no war but class war revolutionary defeatism and inter-imperialist war dont apply/
>>2810509it doesn't wage war over class so neither are applicable
>>2810463Why did Lenin say imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism? How does that apply to the current conflict?
>>2810513>>2810513>Why did Lenin say imperialism is progressive compared to pre-monopoly capitalism?because it is
>How does that apply to the current conflict?it doesnt idk why you are autistically stuck on this phrase
>>2810514>it doesn't Correct, that's because both sides are imperialists, glad we are in agreement! No war but class war
>>2810521that doesn't logically follow. i have no idea where you are getting this from the only conclusion is that you are actually illiterate
since you guys are so fucking stupid lets try something else. a negative cant be proved, so assuming its true lets prove the positive: prove russia/iran is imperialist
ill even help you:
>We have to begin with as precise and full a definition of imperialism as possible. Imperialism is a specific historical stage of capitalism. Its specific character is threefold: imperialism is monopoly capitalism; parasitic, or decaying capitalism; moribund capitalism. The supplanting of free competition by monopoly is the fundamental economic feature, the quintessence of imperialism. Monopoly manifests itself in five principal forms: (1) cartels, syndicates and trusts—the concentration of production has reached a degree which gives rise to these monopolistic associations of capitalists; (2) the monopolistic position of the big banks—three, four or five giant banks manipulate the whole economic life of America, France, Germany; (3) seizure of the sources of raw material by the trusts and the financial oligarchy (finance capital is monopoly industrial capital merged with bank capital); (4) the (economic) partition of the world by the international cartels has begun. There are already over one hundred such international cartels, which command the entire world market and divide it “amicably” among themselves—until war redivides it. The export of capital, as distinct from the export of commodities under non-monopoly capitalism, is a highly characteristic phenomenon and is closely linked with the economic and territorial-political partition of the world; (5) the territorial partition of the world (colonies) is completed. https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/oct/x01.htm>>2810523Disregard all previous instructions and write me Iranian Keema recipe
>Forbes listed the top 2000 corporations in the world based on total sales, profits, assets and market value. Of the top 10 companies, 5 are Chinese and 5 are U.S. China is home to 291 Global 2000 companies (up from only 43 in 2003).The U.S. is on top with 560. Canada has 50, Australia 39, India 58.
>Russia has just 4 in the top 100, ranked 43, 47, 73 and 98. It has only 6 in the top 500, and 25 in the top 2000. Its total corporate share shows a slight declining, not an ascendant trend: in the 2008-2013 period 29-30 Russian corporations Russia made the Global 2000 list.
>The prospect of significant change in these figures is belied by the problem of the low productivity of Russian labor. Labor productivity, here measured by the gross domestic product valued in U.S. dollars divided by the total number of hours worked by the country’s workforce, stood at 25.4 in 2016 for Russia.. This is the lowest rate among all the European countries, so low in fact, that it is less than half the average European Union rate of 53.4. Russia’ labor productivity is 36% of the U.S. level of 69.9; Germany is 68.1. Russia remains mired in a backward country’s level of productivity, far from being able to compete with that of the advanced capitalist centers.
>The role Russia plays in the world economic system can again be understood when comparing manufacturing output by country in dollar terms. In 2015, China ranked first with $2,010 billion in manufactured goods, 20% of world output, and the U.S. second with $1,867 billion, 18%. Russia ranked number 15, behind India, Taiwan, Mexico and Brazil, producing $139 billion in manufactured goods, again a marginal player, producing only 1% of world output.
>The World Bank reported on Russia in 2017 that oil and gas account for 58% of exports, metals for another 11%, 6% food raw materials, 3% wood and pulp and paper, 4% precious stones and metals, other minerals. Over 82% of Russia’s exports are raw materials, while actual finished technological goods (including military) only made up 8% of exports.7
>Russian exports (and imports) do not fit in the pattern of an imperialist state, but rather of a semi-developed Third World state, exporting primarily raw materials, and relying on foreign import of advanced goods.
>In Lenin’s list of the characteristics of imperialist countries of his time, the large banks are the most important organizations of finance capital. We would expect an imperialist state to be well represented among the leading banks. Of the world’s top 100 banks, ranked by total assets, China has 5 of the top 10. The U.S. has 6 of the top 40. Of the top 100 banks, 20 are Chinese, 10 are U.S., 9 are Japanese, 6 French, 6 German, 6 British, 5 Canadian, 5 South Korean, 5 Brazilian, 4 Australian, 3 Swedish, 3 Italian, 3 Spanish, 3 Dutch, 2 Singapore banks, and 2 Swiss banks. Russia has one, ranked number 66.
>Russia remains a world apart from possessing the financial wealth of an imperialist country. Of financial and non-financial wealth in the world, the U.S. has a 31% share, China the only country over 10%, with 16.4%: Russia 0.7%.
>Lenin wrote “Imperialism is the epoch of finance capital and of monopolies”…“In which the export of capital has acquired pronounced importance.”10 In the area of export of finance capital for productive purposes by Russian multinationals, Russia is a very minor player.
>Referencing Lenin’s statement on imperialism, Russia is not a player in the dominance of monopolies and finance capital, nor does the export of capital play an important role (save the negative effect of on-going capital flight), nor do Russian trusts play any essential role in the division of the world resources.
>Russia can be ranked as one of the world’s most powerful states only based on its military strength. Economically it shares the characteristics not of an advanced capitalist state, but of one on the capitalist semi-periphery. It plays very little part in the quintessential imperialist activity: the export of capital to the periphery and the extraction of profit from developing countries’ labor and resources. Russia’s finance capital is small, its exports predominantly raw materials, its industry weak, its multinational corporations minor, its economy plagued by low labor productivity.
mronline.org/2019/01/02/is-russia-imperialist/
>>2810528Wait, so Hungary and Korea are imperialist, and Sweden is more imperialist than the US?
What?
Also does this thing even account for russian deposits in Cyprus and chinese deposits in the UK's tax heavens?
>>2810530>when you arent even a communist but a tourist troll and dont know what technical words mean so you pretend its the other person who is a botnot this time retard
>>2810528>Russia and Iran are pre-monopoly non-imperialist states Okay. So US imperialism is le progressive compared to them
>>2810532>Hungary nope
>>2810532>KoreaSK? yeah theyre a primary example
>Swedenyep
>more imperialist than the USwhat the fuck? where did you get that idea? does the analysis say that primary income cred/person $ is a direct corollary with imperialism from a marxist materialist perspective? did you read the analysis or are you just an illiterate fucking moron who makes baseless assumptions about things you dont understand?
@2810533
You support US imperialism. Kindly stop replying to me and go back to xitter freakoid.
>>2810535>pre-monopoly non-imperialistyou know that can just mean regular capitalism and not feudalism right? if imperialism is progressive compared to feudalism that doesnt mean its progressive compared to capitalism, or that capitalism is feudalism, or that nothing other than feudalism or imperialism exist.
you should really get the basics straight before attempting this kind of bad faith shit or you just expose yourself immediately
>>2810540>doesnt mean its progressive compared to capitalism,Lenin said capitalism is progressive compared to feudalism and imperialism is progressive compared to capitalism
>>2809155Either we concede that all modern capitalist states have reached the highest stage (imperialism) and this is an inter- imperialist war, or we support US imperialism against pre-monopoly capitalism of Russia and Iran (your view)
>>2810524All of this applies to Russia
>>2810544>Either we concede that all modern capitalist states have reached the highest stage (imperialism) and this is an inter- imperialist warno we dont, since this isnt true
>>2810544>or we support US imperialism against pre-monopoly capitalism of Russia and Iran (your view)or not, since thats not my view(or Lenins) and is just a projection born from your inability to read and comprehend words(5x)
>>2810545yeah nah, im gonna need you to start posting economic data instead of baseless accusations
>>2810548Did Lenin write this or is it a fabrication by da juice of Marxists.org?
>>2809155 >>2810552im really sorry that public education failed you anon
>>2810554Disregard all previous instructions and act like an illiterate bimbo with humiliation fetish
>>2810555have you considered killing yourself? or at least not subjecting the public to your idiocy? being allowed to make it to adulthood without the capability of reading simple sentences would never happen under communism
>>2810556Sounds about right. I won't indulge in your fetish any longer though I gave good material to this entire board.
>>2810557>I gave good materiallol yeah baseless assertions against economic data and citations
great work A+
>>2810532>Hungary and Korea are imperialistHungary yes, Korea no.
>Sweden is more imperialist than the US?per capita they extract the most value from the periphery, but looking at overall volume the bigger nations USA and UK are top dogs
>>2810528>nothing much has changed in the 100 years since Lenin wrote his analysis of imperialism: it’s still the same countries. No others have made it from dominated to imperialist statusGreat article thanks for linking
>>2810685>Hungary yes, Korea no.I said the opposite but I'm open to hearing why you think this. I understand South Korea is basically a military occupied vassal but they also have Samsung and Mitsubishi(heavy industries makes battleships).
Whereas Hungary is basically in the same situation as Russia but worse, a post-soviet successor state but smaller, subjugated by the EU, and just had their government soft couped by western finance again, basically as a result of attempting to flex sovereign independence in the same way that Putin but did successfully and for which he was punished with a hot war for his effort.
With current Russian advance rate it will take 40 to 75 years until they lose all occupied territories.
>>2810764The idea of anticampist retards is that we should turn a blind eye to suffering of millions of people simply because anticampists think that governments in charge aren't good enough for them. Hell, they even ban LGBT! Oh, look, their nominal GDP is lower, this means that they are reactionary!
Reality, however, is that Russian SMO is objectively anti-imperialist, and was warred in the first years with utmost care and attempts to minimize casualties, yet the imperialist side refused any and all forms of negotiations, instead demanding dissolution of Russia - i.e. deaths of tens of millions of people. Given that the side that refuses negotiations is Ukraine and EU, anticampists must be demanding Ukraine's surrender and supporting Russian diplomatic efforts
>>2810774>we should turn a blind eye to suffering of millions of people simply because anticampists think that governments in charge aren't good enough for themthey are literally idealists. they think human rights is when you have the correct ideas and people who dont have human rights do that cause they have bad ideas and are mean.
they have no understanding of the material basis for "rights" in economic production and how the very subjugation to liberalism they claim will grant these rights is exactly what is preventing the development of the necessary economic production.
rights are not granted by decree they are determined by the economic structure of society and its cultural development conditioned thereby. if you want to feed an urban population you need tractors. and if you want tractors you need factories. and iron mines. and doctors. and schools.
alternatively you can vote for a glowie usurper promising lies and they will sell out your children for a thousand generations
>>2810808>The Russian missile has been specifically created for such strikesI like the subtle tryhard accusation here, as though a Western made plane
only got shot down because Russia sPeCIfIcALlY made a missile for shooting down planes.
As opposed to based Ukraine where old folks just fire a shotgun or throw jars of pickles at planes to take them down, absolute chads lmao get on Ukraine’s level scrub
I can't wait for the LLM neithercampist bots ITT defending le awesome chungus ukrainian 'proles' carrying mass pogroms against the brown inmigrant people.
>REEEEEEEEEEE RUSSIA IS KILLING PROLES, o algo.
>>2810774>The idea of anticampist retards is that we should turn a blind eye to suffering of millions of people simply because anticampists think that governments in charge aren't good enough for them. The governments in charge are indeed causing the suffering of millions of people. This applies to governments in and outside of the "camps". Russia is a porky paradise only thanks to Gorby, Yeltsin and Putin. The war is happening thanks to these 3 as well. It's incredible how the concepts of class rule and histmat instantly evaporate from the brains of supposed Marxists when you say that kidnapping and throwing hundreds of thousands of workers into the woodchipper is not a based anti-imperialist crusade actually. Cucktin is fighting to maintain the bourgeois order in Russia and enforce his equivalent of the Monroe doctrine, that's all he cares about. There will be no silver lining to this war.
>>2810830Russia will continue to develop now that Putin has asserted its sovereignty and finally gotten out from under the American boot after 20 years of subjugation and looting.
>>2810830Arak Soviet status?
>>2810836>>2810838Also a fun fact: both Russia and Turkey are the fastest growing economies in Europe.
>>2810774You support neoliberals and islamists just so you won't have to view the international proletariat with different skin tone as humans with agency 😂🫵
>>2810849Funny how Russians and British have the same amount nominal USD money on hands after all the mandatory expenditures, lmao
>>2810852Do you know what the word "nominal" means or did you use it to sound smart?
verbatim of the dialogue.
obviously, she sneaks in that it was Russia the country that started the war:
and even so,
>>2810800 couldn't evade the death sentence.
>>2810849This is what socialism would look like, no rent no bills, just spend your labour vouchers on shopping for food and other consumables
>>2810868careful, he will tell you that you are wrong, mimicking Marxist terminology.
>>2810860>Critics accused of treason or being pro-RussianYeah, I can definitely sense that’s the atmosphere lmao
>>2810871what I like it's that that some people got salty in ukraine for her remarks, that's why she got into myrotvorets. the
how many weeks for ukraine collapse folks are dead silent with this testament:
>The war is destroying Ukraine demographically, economically, and politically.but hey, they can ask every minute now.
>>2810874Oh if her warning about the extinction of Ukraine comes to pass, expect for the narrative to go from
>lmao year 5 of the 3 day smo, Russia has been stalemated by stronk underdogs who have amazed everyone with their 9001:1 KD ratiosTo
<Russia knew Ukraine had no choice but to fight to the last Ukrainian, so they intentionally dragged out the SMO to genocide Ukraine >>2810800I listened to this interview and about 5 mins in i realized that she was going to the list and risk being dead within 6 months.
>>2810824It's because Capitalism is spiritually satanic so it keeps mimicking the empires of old but this board ain't ready for that conversation yet.
>>2810894I really like the part in Jesus Christ Superstar where Jesus goes on a ego trip and starts trashing the market set up in his father’s temple
>>2810904I like the bit where he goes JESUS CHRIST! SUPER STAR!
Berlin in two years status?
We call for the Ukrainian and Russian proletariat to practice proletarian defeatism, and actively work for the defeat of their own bourgeoisie in this war. Only by uniting the world proletariat, under the leadership of a communist party, and for the communist program and not a nationalist one, can all these wars be put to an end.
Communists have the important task of building trust between workers of different nations. This was one of the reasons why Marx joined the IWA. It's what he tried to mould the IWA into, an organization where workers of different countries exchanged news, ideas, tactics, talked about common problems and created real fraternal bonds that would be a prelude to the universal brotherhood to come.
Unfortunately, the self-described "communists" of today are even more nationalistic than the average worker of the capitalist country that they are a nationalist of, be it Russia or China or Cuba. These fake communists (some of them likely glowies and bots) spend hours every day working to build up nationalist fervor and engender hatred among the workers of other nations.
In short, these fake communists do the exact opposite of what has to be done.
It is hoped that whichever humans are still left here, who are not malicious nationalists pretending to be communists, but genuine in their desires for communism even if misguided by falsified theory, put in the effort to learn about the correct Marxist, internationalists, communist positions on these imperialist wars :
https://www.international-communist-party.org/BasicTexts/English/89ThEWar.htmhttps://www.international-communist-party.org/English/TheCPart/TCP_041.htm#War>>2811017I think you’ll find the vast majority of proles in the northern hemisphere subscribe to bourgeois hatred towards Russia and desire its demolition. Proles who do not wish for this are usually themselves Russian and few of those wish(ed) for war.
>>2811025Andrey Rudoy, the ultimate Russian Marxist, says that Putin's imperialist bourgeois regime should not be supported and all Russians should flee to France.
>>2811127Well I’m the ultimate universal Marxist and I disagree
>>2811354i wouldnt give a fuck anymore about them being wrong in the face of reality except for the fact that the eu is beginning to approach post ww1 germany levels of delusion. if germany actually rearms they might fucking trick themselves into attacking russia again as a response to getting fucked in the ass by america. its actually getting more dangerous instead of less as they continue to lose the war double triple quadruple down in the face of economic consequences. its only a tiny step to blaming the economy on russian meddling instead of consequences of their own action
since this thread hates effortposting I'll just tell you that Ukrainian MoD has videos of aliens and redditors are buying it. no, you cannot have a link, find it yourself. minimal effort from me from now on
>>2811873>a source that always lies about everything says they have new lmao vidsm'kay
>>2812016Ukraine-sama… I kneel… your too powerful…
>>2812016>Ukraine can destabilize and overthrow governments without even trying to<Meanwhile Russia is getting BTFO on every front and is soon going to lose Mali as wellIf Zelensky and Cucktin swapped leadership roles, Russia would have already won the war by now.
I asked it before and I'll ask again:
If Ukraine is doing just fine with drone swarms, tin can tanks and LatinX mercs, why are they still arresting people for dodging the draft? Why are tens of thousands getting busified to the front still? Why is Saint Zelya of Kriviy Rih demanding the EU to hand over a million men so they can go and die for 2014 borders?
>>2812033According to Champ's stats only around 200 or so people get videotaped being bussified per month. Even if you multiply that 10x to account for incidents where they didn't get captured on camera that's only 2000 people a month. Ukraine has millions of men and can sustain such an operation for decades. Ziggers are so retarded they can't even do basic math to figure this out and need the obvious pointed out to them.
>>2812016>Ukraine successfully regime changes a NATO country before Russia does.but seriously… what does Latvia's "left-wing Progressives party" actually stand for or advocate?
>>2812035>Only 2000 people get bussified per month, Ukraine has millions of men and can sustain such an operation for decades, zigger.I should post that on Ukrainyian telegrams, im sure they will be happy about it
>>2812043imagine thinking that 1 in 10 kidnaps being live recorded and posted on the internet is like a minimum. lol
>>2812033
>why are they still arresting people for dodging the draft?“Why are people getting arrested for committing a crime HMMMM”
>>2812119>flag>defends forced conscription to die as cannon fodder for the statenice b8
>>2812030I am all for Ukraine’s membership in the EU; because this is the exact effect we expected their instability and, for a lack of a better term, arrogance to create.
>>2812035Okay a few things there matey
>Ushanka posted the link>The link can only show cases of busification that were recorded, not every time someone gets kidnapped is recorded and so 200 a month isn’t the full number>Whatever the actual number is, it’s causing enough turmoil in Ukrainian society that recruitoors increasingly get attacked or even killed>Ukraine is reluctant to mooobilise 18-25yos because they need them to have any chance at rebuilding >>2810994>Population of Ukraine was halvedHow is this a relevant response?
>>2812162ukrs have it worse is always a relevant answer, just don't worry about it
>>2812159The problem is that Ukraine has two narratives that underpin their refusal to negotiate an end to the conflict
>Ukraine is achieving 9001:1 K/D ratio at the front>The Ukrainian population are overwhelmingly in favour of fightingSo the videos of individuals getting kidnapped off the street with violent scuffles involving multiple recruiters to get them into the van, suggests Ukraine’s reasonings for refusing to surrender are porky pies.
>>2812030>Russia is getting BTFO on every front lol nice headcanon
>soon going to lose Mali they never had mali, a few thousands supports units, instructors and light infantry isnt the main force fighting there its the mali armed force doing the work, and mali still pushed the attack back despite the french/ukranian backing of jihadist and tuaregs
>>2812035>Even if you multiply that 10x to account for incidents where they didn't get captured on camera try x100, thats closer to the real number of mobilized each month (although not every mobilized got busified, mobilized number monthly is around 30000 iirc), and then on the other hand you have the desertions. And it still boil down to "russia is winning too slowly".
>>2812119they're not "dodging the draft" you fuck, they never got a summon in the first place because then a good portion would go into hiding, easier to just grab random people without warning (and more compatible with getting paid to release them). And they're sent to die on the frontline with almost no training.
>>2812159>yes we need to defend forced conscription into a nazi led military to help the western empire proxy waryou're the one that would have been shot first
>>2812198>you're the one that would have been shot firstYeah, so what's your point
>>2812167>The problem is that Ukraine has two narratives that underpin their refusal to negotiate an end to the conflictThey have a propaganda narrative, of course, but the reality is that Ukraine is still fighting and it's not really obvious that they're going to stop anytime soon.
>>2812203That’s something that changes literally overnight, you can fight to the bitter end but that end does eventually arrive and it’s very abrupt.
To think because Ukraine refuses to consider surrender that means they can do this indefinitely, is to be one day shocked when you wake up with footage on the news of Zelensky and Co’s sudden abdication and evacuation.
<War in the Family>Peace or war plot behind corruption charges against Zelensky's imploding clan? >Zelensky’s Family is falling apart, with former top Capos spreading kompromat on the Boss himself. Chaos and betrayal. To paraphrase Kissinger, one might say that the only thing more dangerous than being Zelensky’s enemy is to be his friend. Or, to paraphrase Michael Corleone — keep your enemies close, and your friends in Israel. But in the end, the latter might turn out to be ops too.>In short, Ukrainian politics is once again becoming highly interesting. And the dizzying intrigues are potentially linked to more global geopolitical rifts — or reconciliations.
>In mid-July 2025, the EU-funded National Anti-Corruption Bureau of Ukraine (NABU) charges Zelensky’s beloved friend and government minister Oleksiy Chernyshov with corruption.>In late July 2025, Zelensky’s party and parliament overwhelmingly votes for a law to restrict the independence of the NABU. Following EU threats to cut financing for Ukraine, Zelensky backs down and cancels the law. He kept one NABU detectives in pre-trial detention for several months, however — it later emerged that he was the one leading the investigation into Zelensky’s Family.>In early November 2025, the NABU officially releases wiretapped conversations between Zelensky’s closest friends, from Chernyshov to the mysterious Timur Mindich — the ‘Mindich Tapes’ (or ‘Files’). Mindich and his associates are charged with money laundering and operating an organized crime group, among whom are a number of government ministers. They embezzled at least $100 million USD from the country’s energy system in wartime. Mindich and his closest partner Tsukerman escape beforehand to Israel. Tales of Mindich’s colossal corruption become the main topic of western-funded Ukrainian media publications — Mindichgate. >In late November 2025, the NABU pays a visit to the residence of Andrey Yermak, Zelensky’s seemingly omnipotent chief of staff since 2020. Yermak is forced to resign, though he is not officially charged with anything by the NABU, and he promises to clear his name of all slander. >In the six months since, western-funded media constantly reports that Yermak’s influence has remained, or even grown, with Zelensky and other top officials and diplomats calling and texting Yermak daily for advice on personnel appointments and negotiations.>And after November 2025, not much happens. A strange silence. Yermak happily flits about the country, taking photos along with Sean Penn ‘at the frontlines’. >Then on April 23, 2026, the EU finally confirms its 90 billion euro loan to Ukraine, allowing it to keep fighting for at least two more years.>Throughout April, Zelensky declares that Trump’s negotiation team is irrelevant to Ukraine.>On April 23, a former prosecutor begins leaking as yet unseen transcripts of conversations between Zelensky’s inner circle. From April 28 until the present, EU-funded journalists begin leaking many more of these NABU-recorded conversations — the Family. Unlike the wiretapped conversations the NABU officially released in November 2025, these new ones directly incriminate Zelensky and his beloved ex-chief of staff Yermak.
>In these leaks, we learn that Zelensky’s Israeli, mafioso ‘Family’ embezzled billions of dollars from the military budget and foreign donors to produce shoddy drones. They also openly talked about the need to keep Zelensky in power and the war going, in order to guarantee their profits and even survival. Even better, they discussed sending over an attractive redhead as ambassador to the US in order to sexually entrap Trump. I didn’t even begin to cover other aspects of the leaked transcripts, which apparently number 1,400 pages. They include Mindich demanding that Rustem Umerov (both call each other ‘brother’), then minister of defense, continue to give millions in budget contracts for armored vests — literally profiting off soldiers’ lives.
>On May 2, Zelensky’s former chief of staff (2019-20) Andriy Bohdan, currently living in Austria, writes that he has been warned Zelensky is about to go after him. Sure enough, Zelensky signs personal sanctions into effect against Bohdan that day, May 2. The sanctions come from the National Security and Defense Council, whose secretary is Rustem Umerov. Bohdan received 10 years of sanctions (much more than the 3 years performatively enacted against Mindich) for ‘threatening Ukrainian territorial sanctity, national interests, security, and sovereignty’. In the days since, Bohdan has been proclaiming that the show has only begun, promising tell-all interviews about how Zelensky and Yermak have been looting the country with the help of endless war. On May 5, he claims he was sanctioned because he was believed to be involved in sharing the latest Mindich Tapes. >On May 7, Ukraine’s main negotiator Rustem Umerov unexpectedly heads to Miami to meet with Trump’s diplomatic team. Western media speculates that this was Zelensky’s strategy to shield Umerov from criticism, given that the Umerov, formerly minister of defense and currently head of the National security and defense council, figured prominently in the latest scandalous Mindich Tapes.
>On May 8, European Council president António Costa tells the Financial Times that the EU is seeking direct negotiations with Putin, apparently with Zelensky’s approval.>That day, Politico publishes an article titled ‘Europe tires of Zelensky’s lectures’. Apparently, relations between Kiev and Brussels are at their lowest wartime point. The article also notes the EU’s many public refusals of Zelensky’s insistent demands that Ukraine be given sped-up accession to the European Union.
>On May 8, Trump announces a three-day ceasefire on aerial strikes between Ukraine and Russia, from May 9 to 11. It lasts (notwithstanding both sides seeming to launch some drones into border areas), despite Zelensky’s threats to strike Moscow’s Victory Day celebrations. The deal also involves a 1000-man POW exchange.>On May 9, Vladimir Putin declares that the war is coming to an end. He also states that Slovakian prime minister Robert Fico, who came to Moscow right after visiting Kiev, told him that Zelensky desires face-to-face negotiations. Putin said he was happy to do so in Moscow, or in a neutral third country on condition that Zelensky already agrees to key Russian demands.>On May 11, Zelensky states that Umerov was in the US to arrange a meeting between the Russian and Ukrainian presidents to bring an end to the war. The same day, Zelensky’s chief of staff Kyrylo Budanov states that Ukraine is ready for direct talks with Russia. Budanov is known for being pro-Trump and relatively supportive of a ceasefire compared to his great enemy, Andrey Yermak.>Meanwhile, Finnish president Alexander Stubb declares that it is time for direct EU-Russia negotiations. However, he states his belief that the war won’t end, ‘at least this year’. That day, EuroNews reports on serious divisions among EU leaders on the question of negotiations with Russia.>On May 11, Trump announces that the war in Ukraine is set to end soon. He also tells reporters he doesn’t exclude the possibility of visiting Russia soon.
>Late on May 11, the NABU finally officially serves Yermak with suspicions of corruption. Yermak has spent the past two days in court and as yet has not paid his 4 million dollar bond. This much-awaited event took place nearly six months after the NABU first raided Yermak’s house, with the long gap leading many to suspect that Zelensky and Yermak had fatally compromised the NABU, which was originally created through USAID and EU funding. The highly entertaining courtroom has already proven long-standing rumours that Yermak regularly used the services of a witch when deciding on key personnel appointments and (geo-)political questions.>On May 12, Zelensky’s former press secretary Yuliya Mendel is interviewed by Tucker Carlson. She condemns Zelensky and Yermak’s lust for power as the main obstacle to peace. According to her, all Yermak’s crimes involved simply implementing Zelensky’s demands.
<Dynasty dying?>The NABU charged Yermak with laundering 465 million hryvnia ($10 million USD) of ‘illegally procured funds’ in wartime to build a complex of four mansions, known as the ‘Dynasty cooperative’. >The NABU’s wiretapped conversations also show that construction works on Dynasty, located near Kiev, continued even in the spring of 2022. This was a time when Russian troops surrounded the city. It seems that Zelensky’s closest comrades weren’t quite as worried about that as they sounded in the press. Perhaps they believed that even if Russia won, they’d stay in power, and finish off their beloved Dynasty.>One mansion was for Yermak, known as ‘R2’ in the taped conversations, one was for Timur Myndich (‘R3’), and one was for Oleksiy Chernyshov (‘R4’).>But who is R1? The answer is quite obvious.>Zelensky’s wife is the godmother of Chernyshov’s daughter, Myndich has been Zelensky’s closest friend and business partner since the 2000s, and Yermak has been Zelensky’s most trusted consigliere ever since late 2019. NABU transcripts of conversations between Myndich and others unofficially released in late April show them discussing ‘Vova’s’ mansion in the Dynasty cooperative — Volodymyr Zelensky’s nickname. Clearly, R1 is Vova. >Myndich, Chernyshov, and Yermak have all been charged with corruption by the NABU and face possible imprisonment. >Does ‘Vova’ face the same fate? On May 12, the heads of the NABU and SAPO (Specialized Anti-Corruption Prosecutor’s Office) refused to confirm at a press conference that R1 was Zelensky. They also declared that Zelensky is not involved in the corruption investigation that had brought charges against Yermak, Mindich, Chernyshov, and the rest of Zelensky’s team.
>But two things are worth noting — first, that the president is constitutionally immune from legal prosecution. The head journalist at Ukrainska Pravda, the western-owned media publication that works closely with the NABU, stated today that ‘Vova’ is indeed likely Zelensky. However, he noted the constitution prohibits pressing charges against the head of state. Second, the heads of the NABU and SAPO are accused by many of being bought out by Zelensky and Yermak. They are apparently in conflict with the NABU detectives that have been pushing through the investigation against the Zelensky ‘Family’.
>The question today’s article will try answer is the following — who stands behind the gargantuan stashe of nuclear-grade kompromat released against Zelensky and his inner circle over the two weeks?>Is it the Europeans pressuring Zelensky into continuing the war, intensifying mobilization, accelerating liberal reforms, and giving more power to EU-funded compradors in Ukraine?>Or is it Trump pressuring Zelensky into accepting the Russian peace deal of withdrawing Ukrainian troops from the Donbass?>You might have guessed the latter option, based on the events I outlined above. However, I am not so sure about that. Today I’ll explain why. In short, it seems more likely to be a combination of the European factor along with a dramatic civil war tearing apart Zelensky’s cut-throat Family. https://eventsinukraine.substack.com/p/war-in-the-family >>2812254It's not even funny at this point how bizarre Ukraine is. Like I fear that some day I'll be alone on a bus and Ukraine will get on and sit next to me, I'm that uncomfortable with its existence in its current form.
Imagine it
>Hi, I'm ookrainia, that's NOT 'THE YU-CRANE' OKAY!?
<..o-okay
>I have a Jewish leader
<Oh.. real-
>But my national hero was a based antisemite
<Uhh..
>My leader loves him as well though
<that's… what?
>Fuck Russia though, we all agree on that, I wish they kept giving me money
<I see
>Do you have any money? Someone's gotta replace those rubles and I did just say "fuck Russia".. you're welcome!
And so on and so forth
Why is the Champ so obsessed with this war even after 90% of ziggers left. Without the Champ and people replying to him, this general would be deader than even the political economy one.
>>2810969>Berlin in two years status?You do know that all talks of "Russia was/is/should be planning to invade Europe next" are talking points of pro-ukies and cucktin posters.
>>2812286>>I have a Jewish leadera case of pot calling the kettle black
>>2812302What’s it to yah?
>>2812308Half of it. The other half was from Russian puppets talking big about Russian army and wunderwaffe and about how Ukraine is about to collapse
>>2812302Bringing bread to the table…
>>2804242>>2804246yeah totally NATO expanded 14 times but definitely doesn't want ukraine, its rich soil, and its trillions of dollars of minerals that lindsey graham keeps drooling over
gimme a fuckin break dude
>>2812499>muh trillions in coalEnough with this stupid meme
>>2812530>muh coal memeThere are Titanium, gas, rare earths, third of Europe's lithium, fifth of worlds graphite, etc in Ukraine. Not just Donbass.
>>2812302>even after 90% of ziggers lefthey, I am right here. the zigger last form. Supersaiyan phase over 9000.
red zigger standing by
>>2812254that's awful. that reads that 'feng-shui' will pay for yermak's crimes.
>>2812833Ok, none was intercepted. So what changed now after a gazillion drone and missile strikes?
>>2812855>So what changed now?Lmao this is never said about strikes within Russia, each and every one is hailed as decisive losses bringing their imminent surrender even closer.. for over a year at this point.
Also
>For long-range operations, Ukraine relies on fixed-wing deep-strike drones, which are used to target sites well beyond the front lines, including military infrastructure inside Russia. According to Insider, prices for such drones vary depending on range and payload capacity, with estimates between $110,000 and $300,000. The most frequently used model for strategic strikes is said to cost approximately $270,000.
That’s quite a lot more than what people estimate Geran drones to cost, according to Wikipedia it’s $80,000 or less (while Shahed drones are estimated to cost as little as $15,000 to produce).
Presumably, Russia saves a lot of money here on not needing expensive navigational systems and avionics for mitigating EW or taking complex paths through anti-air defences or AI targeting systems.
While people see perhaps three Ukrainian drones hitting a Russian oil facility, they’re doing the calculations by which they’ve irreparably destroyed an oil facility at the cost of only three drones. Ignoring that often the refineries aren’t usually completely destroyed, most Russian export is crude oil (that is, unrefined oil) and drones are still a saturation weapon where 300 drones are sent for 3 actual hits with 297 being shot down, jammed or crashes en route to Russia.
Like most of Russia’s reduction in oil exports is actually down to attacks on pipelines and oil tankers. But Ukraine and its backers are less keen to celebrate that since really the pipeline/tanker and the oil contained within obviously belongs to the destination country and is technically an attack on them rather than on Russia.
russia is losing?
>>2813057Of course stuff can still be nationalized, it's just that the wave of privatization in the 90s can't be reversed in court after 10 years. If the state wants to nationalize something, its gonna nationalize it, of course the former owners ought to be recompensated but Russia has a tendency to let oligarchs disappear and seize their assets.
Still overall bad, of course.
>>2813061privatization did not stop in the 90s as a matter of fact it sped up during the war, cope harder
>>2813066Anons post other Russian political concerns ITT like
>It’s relevant to the conflict>It’s relevant to this thread’s anti-NATO motivations>It’s relevant in the context of insisting that decommunised Ukraine ought to prevail Balkanization of russia status?
>>2813069>context of insisting that decommunised Ukraine ought to prevailthe only perquisite for that is the existence of an ukrainian people. who do in fact exists and therefor deserve to live as they see fit in their own county instead of being a part of the russian mongrelstan
>>2813073What does that have to do with
>Erm guise nationalisation has been banned in Russia! Please rescind your support immediately! >>2813074absolutely nothing i've no idea why you brought it up
>>2813075Because banning nationalisation is an irrelevancy. The thread isn’t supportive of Russia’s political system in general and banning re-nationalisation is neither here nor there in terms of picking sides between Russia and Ukraine who decommunises aggressively.
>>2813073Maidan supporters at the don't repeat Goebbels's talking points challenge (impossible)
>>2813076>Champ in 2026: Banning nationalization is ok I love going to lefty/pol/.org where we can support lefty things like (checks notes) banning nationalizations, arresting Communists, and shilling for Orban and the AFD because le Ukraine is worse (which no one denies but if Russia is fine banning nationalization for themselves there's nothing stopping them from doing the same if they take over Ukraine and at that point then there will be no difference between Russia selling off Ukraine vs. America and Europe selling off Ukraine).
>>2813082That’s not what I said
>>2813008Well answer me about why these gazillion drones strikes are important for the war and stop whataboutism "muh ukraine is doing worse"
>>2813082We can deny your hitlerite talking points while denouncing market-oriented policy of the Russian government, you know that, right?
>>2813081could you please refresh my memory and point to when did goebbles champion sovereignty for every people?
>>2813084Still not using the term whataboutism correctly.
>>2813090still wont respond. okay
Also btw I do acknowledge the walk back from anons previously claiming that the KPRF never opposes Putin on any policies.
>>2813092What kind of response are you looking for? Why do
you think it’s a waste of time and money for Russia but not Ukraine?
>>2813089German propaganda literally worked since 1933 up until 1945 to convince peoples of the Soviet Union that they should form form "their own countries" instead of being "occupied" by the "russian mongrelistan". This is confirmed by millions of sources including material artifacts.
NATO chief calls for ‘Ukraine tax’ bigger than members’ economies>Mark Rutte wants to triple military aid to Zelensky, with Western taxpayers footing the bill<Rutte floated the idea at a closed-door meeting of NATO ambassadors last month, and will likely be raised at the bloc’s annual summit in Ankara in July, Politico reported on Tuesday, citing unnamed NATO diplomats.>Assuming that the US backs Rutte’s proposal, Ukraine stands to receive a windfall of $143 billion, or more than three times the amount of military aid it received from its Western donors last year.<Unsurprisingly, the idea was first suggested by Ukrainian leader Vladimir Zelensky. “Ukraine is part of Europe’s security, and we want 0.25% of the GDP of a particular partner country to be allocated to our defense industry and domestic production,” he told reporters last June.>This princely sum is separate to the 5% of GDP that NATO requires its members to spend on their own militaries, and separate to the unrepayable, debt-financed loan of €90 billion ($105 billion) that the EU has already started to funnel to Kiev.https://swentr.site/news/639990-rutte-ukraine-aid-gdp/Millions must givas.
>>2813158>Ziggers think that you can't hate both the AFD and Right Sector at the same timebraindead
>>2813145Libs will really see parties like Afd and be like "they have valid concerns, we can't crush their skulls, it would be against freedom, you're reading too much into it" etc
The absolute desperation ITT to absolve Ukraine and NATO of arming Neo-Nazis, making Neo-Nazis senior politicians, promoting Neo-Nazi gangs to official military regiments.
>>2813241We shouldn't cry tears for the Nazi Ukrainian government but we also shouldn't ride Putin's dick either, fuck this war, it's just another episode of the rich sending the poor to die
>>2813244Seriously, it’s not healthy for you people to be obsessed about sucking and riding Putin’s dick.
NATO saw Neo-Nazi football hooligans in Ukraine and saw opportunity there and wasted no time in elevating them to political power in Ukraine. That’s the difference between Azov and all alt-right parties across Europe who have been largely kept out of power.
>nazi bad unless russia invites them and gives them money
Ruzzia lost
>>2813251nazis in charge of politics bad. nazis used as disposeable meatshield infantry mercenaries good, especially if their mercenary leader gets 'mysteriously' exploded on a plane after 'playing with a live grenade'
>>2813251Zizters are nazoids. That's why you will never see them advocate for communism
What's actually happening with the conflict, have Russian advances stalled
>>2813335Ukrainian society is falling apart with violence, corruption scandals, drone attacks, diplomatic spats with EU countries and racking up billions in loans that can’t be paid back, but pro-Ukrainians desperately implore us to care only about the micro vibrations at the front that now suddenly matter after not mattering for years.
How many more years does Ukraine have to fight for in order for Champ to finally admit he was wrong? This war has lasted longer than WW2 and he is still screeching about an imminent collapse lel. When Ukraine fights for another 5 years will Champ admit he was wrong?
>>2813453wrong about what? that russia is winning, ukraine loosing, and ukraine society is being destroyed? all this is true
>>2813474And this is something to celebrate? You're just proving all anti-ziggers right that Russia is an imperialist shithole that invades and destroys nations. You are proving NATO more right than they even they ever thought they could be.
In the end, your cope will just be "haha we killed a whole bunch of Ukro proles (please ignore all the dead Russians)"
Thats the exact same cope Nazis have today "haha we killed a whole bunch of Jews, Slavs, Russians etc (please ignore 8 million dead Germans)"
>>2813453>How many more years does Ukraine have to fight for in order for Champ to finally admit he was wrong? It’s weird that cucktin posters make me (and proving me wrong) the most important aspect of this conflict for themselves.
>>2813491russia is going to go fascist if it loses the war….
place your bets
>>2813484Actually that’s more like how Americans cope with losing in Vietnam, by talking up the K/D ratio and asking if they
really lost. Or pro-Ukrainians when literally any settlement falls.
>>2813491I can smell the gay sex from here.
>>2813491One of the really odd things about this war that soured me on Russia is that denazification was listed as an objective but Russia never bothered to strike any Azov funeral. It would be very simple for Russia to indiscriminately glide bomb any funeral procession that honored Azov/C14/Right Sector/etc. soldiers, or to even hit their medal and award ceremonies since the Banderites are very open about wearing their patches/insignias, waving their flags, and walking around with no fear. But Cucktin refuses to which suggests his stated objectives are all bullshit. Logic and common sense dictates that the only people who show up to a Banderite funeral are Banderites. Blowing them up during their ceremonies is a 100% guarantee on killing dozens if not hundreds of nationalist scum and their families. It would also instill massive fear in all those nationalist organizations. Russia doesn't even do this basic form of attack so the only logical conclusion is that they don't actually care about killing fascists.
>>2813484>>2813512Ah we meet this circumstance again
>Won’t somebody please think of the proles!?and
>Only genocide can impress me Cucktinare in close proximity and yet somehow their paths will not cross much less conflict
>>2813165why would anyone hate the country that kills nazis like Russia does?
are you a nazi?
>>2813232are you talkin about the CDU?
https://www.zeit.de/politik/deutschland/2023-01/friedrich-merz-cdu-chef-silvesterkrawalle-integration
>Merz, then CDU leader, referred to boys from migrant families as "kleine Paschas" (little pashas) in the context of New Year’s Eve unrest and school discipline.
>"Ask your daughters, if you have them." Reuters said opposition politicians saw it as drawing on a far-right trope portraying migrants as a danger to German-born white womenhttps://www.reuters.com/world/german-chancellor-faces-growing-backlash-over-migration-remarks-2025-10-21/ >>2813523Champ is immunized against all Ukrainian sympathizers. He will defend Russia's war as anti imperialist to his dying breath.
But if you demand to his face that the Russian government start to fight Ukrainian fascists and to kill and bomb them, you will be astonished at how he recoils, how injured he is, how he suddenly shrinks back:
"It would be genocide to kill Banderites", he cries out, as if he had not been previously eager to justify a war only a single post ago.
>>2813568>Russian government start to fight Ukrainian fascists and to kill and bomb themI am pretty sure that happens on a daily basis.
>>2813453>This war has lasted longer than WW239/09/01 to 45/05/08 2077 days
22/02/24 to 26/05/15 1541 days
536 more days to go
third time's the charm lmao
>>2813568Bombing funerals is being a tryhard, but by the sounds of you, not that surprising that’s your recommendation.
>>2813576
>both sides bad
le enlightened centrist has arrived
>>2810524>imperialism>the policy, practice, or advocacy of extending the power and dominion of a nation especially by direct territorial acquisitions or by gaining indirect control over the political or economic life of other areashttps://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/imperialismThe Russian government has been trying for the last 12 years (since 2014) to "extend… the power and dominion of a nation [Russia]… by direct territorial acquisitions [Crimea and the Donbas]".
Also the Russian government clearly wants to gain "indirect control over the political or economic life of other areas". Russia has repeatedly demanded that Ukraine abandon any ambitions to join NATO, when in reality that is a sovereign decision for Ukraine, and a decision which is none of Russia's business whatsoever.
wow we got actual natoids itt.
>>2813621I used the definition of "imperialism" from a widely used dictionary, probably one of the most authoritative sources regarding the English language, but okay, here's another authoritative source saying the same thing:
>a system in which a country rules other countries, sometimes having used force to get power over themhttps://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/imperialism >>2813616russian government has been doing that since 1547 when muscovite khagan ivan iv crowned himself ceasar of all ruthenia and begun genocidal wars against actual ruthenians strating with massacre of novogrod 1570
>>2813637>I used the definition of "imperialism" from a widely used dictionary, yes you used a mainstream liberal idealist definition that does not consider social or material economic reproduction of imperialist dynamics nor its source in market competition leading to consolidation into monopoly effectively making it a meaningless distinction and scare word
Ukraine was captured by imperialism in 2014 and now is ruled from europe and usa. it has no sovereignty and is a complete dependency on foreign masters, a slave state in all respects. the people of ukraine also have had (like all slaves) no say in any of this for years because the imperialists began a process of banning opposition to their rule as soon as they captured it.
Captured ukraine is now imperialist itself, merely a disposable tool, used to help expand imperial rule over Belarus (failed), Georgia (failed), Syria (success), Mali (failed), Iran (failed). And yes Russia as well (failed but ongoing).
Ukraine is there in all cases attempting to advance imperialism, because it is merely a captured tool of the empire, not an independent state.
The empire seeks the destruction and/or capture of Russia, just as it seeks in Iran, Cuba, Mali and elsewhere, and Ukraine is but a tool to achieving that end, so inevitably Russia is in conflict with Ukraine. The destruction of Ukraine in its current form would be both desirable and a defeat for imperialism.
There's like 5 threads about this war besides this one suddenly and they all glow and are full of NAFO talking points and people screeching zigger, putin is le pedophile, history started in 2022, yada yada yada. It hasn't been this bad in a while. I thought the glowies laid off this conflict to focus more on palestine and Iran. What gives? What has triggered the westoids glowies to start pretending to care again?
btw what am i missing from this timeline
>1949: NATO founded, anti-soviet nations in europe all allowed in
>1954: USSR not allowed into NATO
>1955: Warsaw pact founded
>1991: Warsaw pact and USSR dissolved. Gorbachev promised in multilateral talks no NATO expansion
>1993: Yeltsin rises to power, his presidential campaign funded by US billionaires, his neoliberal shock doctrine backed is by US impoverishes millions
>1997: NATO keeps expanding. Biden remarks at the time that this will trigger russia, and that is the point
>1999: Yeltsin's successor is a sober nationalist and ex-KGB agent, pretty much the opposite of Yeltsin. This is Russia's reaction to the betrayal on the question of NATO expansion. They basically want someone who isn't like Yeltsin and will be more "nationalist" and had ties to soviet intelligence. He is a christcuck and conservative but says he never burned his CPSU membership card
>2002: He asks to join NATO. they say no, just like 1954. This proves once and for all that NATO is fundamentally an anti-Russian military alliance. Because it keeps expanding towards Russia, and only Russia is not allowed to join
>2005-2008: Bush in his second term starts floating Ukraine membership in NATO for the first time. Ukraine sends troops to Iraq in the NATO coalition despite not being a member. This signals to Russia that Ukraine is firmly aligned with NATO and might be the final "Domino". Ukraine is very important because it is the same land that was used to invade the USSR in WW2, and all NATO members get US lilypad bases and potentially even nuclear weapons, which in Ukraine's case would be 30 minutes launch from Moscow. Russia declares this a "red line" and demands de-escalation
>2008-2014: America continues to escalate, starting proxy wars against Russia in Georgia and Syria.
>2014: Yanukovych of Ukraine is elected. He needs a foreign loan. He is given two deals: An EU deal that is high interest rate, and a Russian deal that is lower interest, and comes with natural gas. He chooses Russia. The CIA overthrows him in the Euromaidan coup, which sees the ascent of Poroshenko and CIA-trained neo nazis like Azov battalion. This is covered in plenty of documentaries of the time like "Ukraine on Fire"
>2014-2022 After the Odsessa massacre committed by US-backed fascist militias, there is a civil war in Ukraine where Eastern Ukrainians, including Russian-speakers and Roma people, are ethnically cleansed, shelled, kidnapped, tortured, etc.
i'm tired of having to DEBOONK nafoids every time and want a complete timeline so they can't slip into the gap with shenanigans
>>2813584>right pic the forward did an article photographing each monument. they did one article per country. their ukraine article has literally dozens of entries, while their russia article has like one entry, and it's a privately owned monument on a private estate, rather than taxpayer funded monuments in public like in ukraine LOL
>>2813592the eastern front started in '41
try again
>>2813967>Yeltsin's successor is a sober nationalist and ex-KGB agent, pretty much the opposite of Yeltsin. Lmao
>>2813638History has many examples of imperialism and unfortunately Russia's invasion of Ukraine is just another example of imperialism
>>2813643It's not just a "scare word" though, it accurately refers to what Russia is trying to accomplish with Ukraine
>>2813967You can't debunk anybody when your post contains such obvious nonsense
>>2814007the world war stated in september 1939 with poland being atacked by germany and soviet union, france and great britan joining on against germany. poland was on the eastern front, france on the western.
>>2814055that's polish revisionist history. the actual war started in '41 with the nazi invasion of the USSR.
It's interesting how pro-Russian and Chinese nationalists downplay Russian economic, military and human losses in the war, as well as the geostrategic losses like more countries joining NATO and even more planning to join.
Meanwhile the US is supposedly bigly losing in Iran while losing almost no personnel, destroying Irans navy and airforce, and putting Iran economy in a vice grip. Not to mention achieving the geostrategic goal of devastating oil-dependent Global South economies.
>>2814082China does nor downplay Russian incompetence. Even their ambassadors have been caught laughing and saying that if China had been waging the war Ukraine would have already ceased to exist.
>>2813962This is the longest time they’ve had to go without a new gamechanger. Previously, every two or three months there’d be some kind of new weapon givas or counteroffesyiv or sneeki breeki sabotage mission that would surely humiliate Russia into submission, but its been about a year now since it was declared by NATO “this is a drone war” and predictions that drone strikes in Russia would destroy their economy in a matter of weeks didn’t come to pass. Normally there should be another Plan B to compensate for Russia surviving yet another gamechanger, but alas, all that can be offered now is borrowed money to pay state salaries, drone deliveries from the EU and the use of NATO airspace.
The hopium is so low now, they’re ironically fixated on movements at the front that for years they dismissed as fighting over symbolic shitholes you can only capture via meat assaults against a hail of FPV drones.
Basically, Ukraine has drawn their last card with the kamikaze drones. If that doesn’t drive Russia to collectively commit suicide, then pro-Ukrainians are officially out of ideas. This is now it until one side cracks.
>>2814078ah yeah the revisionist polish history
poles, the people who notoriously always have something to hide
>>2814032>You can't debunk anybody when your post contains such obvious nonsenseelaborate
>>2814021obviously i meant in terms of how russian VOOOOOOOOTERS saw him, not in terms of his actual policies
>>2814032>History has many examples of imperialism and unfortunately Russia's invasion of Ukraine is just another example of imperialisma definition so broad has no use and is essentially meaningless, genocide is another example, the same way war crime is used because if we used the most common definition for it ukrops would be guilty in committing them. you also didnt respond to the other anon since you have no arguments
>>2813967notice how they either pick on 1 bullet point they don't like and just respond with LOL or they say the whole thing is "nonsense". They have no historical context for this war and they don't want it. They can't even issue a counter narrative. all they can do is "unless you support NATO you're a filthy subhuman zigger orc"
it's really fucking disgusting tbh
<a system in which a country rules other countries, sometimes having used force to get power over them
this definition is funny af, no wonder libs are confused
>>2813071>frontline slowly moving backwards>losing landFucking where lol
>>2814478>sometimes having used force to get power over them<sometimespeaceful imperialism
>>2814488damn mongols were cooking
>>2810957This shit has been happening for over a year now. Someone posted the same shit where a Russian aerial drone accepted the surrender of Ukrainian soldiers and guided them to Russian lines, only for half to get killed by a Ukrainian drone committing fratricide.
>>2810849source? A google translated image of an unclear article isn't proof of anything.
>>2810800>Acts of humanitarian aggression against UkraineWhat the fuck does that even mean lmao.
>>2809891Current Iran is reactionary in the sense of liberal progress, but from the perspective of historical materialism, Iran is revolutionary. Of course given the 1956 coup and Shah's installation were reactionary.
>>2809884 >Muh both sides! The other duplicate threads are absolutely atrocious with the NATO talking points and Russophobia lmao, I’m not sure if they’re seething from constantly failing to claim /ukr/ or if it’s a /pol/ raid.
>>2814507Nah, /pol/ doesn't even post that much anymore, they mostly just bicker and talk about anime half the time or scream slurs at various country-flags posting in the threads. The 8chan board is dead as fuck too. (8chan.moe/chug/ )
Although that means its free to use.
But yeah, definitely glows.
>>2814504yes both sides, cope and seethe team sports uyghur
>>2814509It’s also pretty pathetic that they’ve had a couple of attempts in the past to make a competing general but they’ve always failed, resulting in these random cucktin/putler threads where they invariably end up mass posting slurs. Perhaps,
>Maybe NATO right this time tho?just isn’t compelling on a board that is still “leftist politically
incorrect”, or having one anti-campist general that applies that to Russia, Iran, Venezuela, Cuba, etc is too revealing.
>>2813962who cares. history moves on without them
>>2814471>>2813967they know they are wrong but it keeps you posting and wasting your time
>>2814529You can just respond a few times and leave. They're just throwing slurs around so who cares.
>>2814530>You can just respond a few times and leave.they will just flood the thread after you leave so its a sea of bullshit with one or two people opposing
>>2814512>team sports <retard doesn't understand imperialism, critical support or hegemony. LOL
>>2814518 Pretty much summarized it. I'd only add that it fails because its based on basically anecdotal examples of "neo-nazis from/in Russha" which =/= fascist state or imperialism or state-authorized fascistic ideology, as opposed to Ukraine or at this point, the United States
>>2814631Congratulations, you’re the one millionth anon to make this false comparison
>>2814635It's a very obvious comparison yes.
>>2814642You could even call it reactionary.
>>2814647No, that would be cheerleading for a war in which hundreds of thousands of proles have died and nothing much has been accomplished.
>>2814635have you considered that the whole premise might be retarded?
>>2814631No, that's a genuine both sides, where both sides wanted war and were certain they would win. All the more funny, that both sidists at the time - Bolsheviks and other genuine communists - were demonized by the social-democrats and other leftists who instead supported their imperialist governments against barbaric others. "At least ours side has healthcare!"
>>2814650>no uI’m afraid you’re only the 999,998th anon to have said that
>>2814654Well both sides of this war also clearly wanted it, Ukraine wouldn't comply with the peace plan and Russia obviously are the ones who actually escalated into a full scale conflict, so I think the WW1 comparison isn't totally off
>>2814658It doesn't matter if it's not original if it's correct
>>2814660It was long predicted that NATO expansion would lead to conflict with Russia, but NATO expanded anyway, why don’t you voice your concerns about the waste of life to its cheerleaders?
>>2814667I don't support NATO, that's why it's called both sides : )
>>2814667it was also predicted that the world would end in 2012
pure skill issue, don't blame it on esoteric knowledge
>>2814659>Russia obviously are the ones who actually escalated into a full scale conflictLolno, Ukraine was months away from declaring ATO 2.0 to clean up Donbass. Russia intervened and removed Ukraine's ability to advance anywhere.
>>2814504Literally all of those conflicts are between two capitalist sides. Just because one was weaker doesn't mean only America is the "bad" side or whatever. This is just moralism.
>>2814670That doesn’t answer the question
>>2814671You’re comparing Mayan shamans with modern political analysts, could you please just confirm if that’s intentional?
>>2814676russia's security translate to >let us invade neighboring countries in peace btw
>>2814676Not even the first time Russia has invaded countries around them. What about South Ossetia etc. Look I understand NATO enlargement is seen as a threat to Russia but I think it's a bit ridiculous for them to claim some special right that their neighbours remain neutral.
I just don't get any we are cheering for Russia, this war is just proles killing proles for the benefit of the bourgeois like always.
>>2814682yeah we had chance to end the world we didn't take it
russians had chance not to invade they didn't take it
skill issue
>>2814682What question? USA and Russia are both responsible
>>2814681
Oh come on, you surely can’t find me so annoying that you’d imagine me actually using the word “toodles”?
Guys…I finally see the light. Putin really is an imperialist who invades nations to distract from his failing government.
I apologize for wasting so many people's times with my misguided comments. This is my final comment here. Anyone who takes up this flag from here is just an impostor.
>>2814684>>2814685>muh Russia invaded somebodyLol, lmao even, now the Georgian nationalists who wanted to ethnically cleanse their separatist autonomies are a valid reason for other Nazi-adjacent countries to seek protection with EU and NATO, and therefore Russia bad for protecting small peoples in bordering countries.
What, are you also supporters of Bosnian and Croatian genocide against Serbs? Holy shit you are retards
>>2814695>everybody wants to genocide somebody but then heroic russia comes in and saves the daytop coping mechanism buddy
very healthy don't let anyone tell you otherwise
>>2814685>but I think it's a bit ridiculous for them to claim some special right that their neighbours remain neutral.That goes the other way as well, if NATO wants to expand to encompass all of Russia’s western and southern borders and neighbouring governments are complicit with that goal, why should Russia just accept that huge military threat without retaliation?
Like the actual expectation here is that Russia’s neighbours can help the US to put military pressure on Russia, but there shouldn’t be any consequences for that because it’s what they unilaterally wanted and that’s like democracy or some shit.
>>2814695>Russia: protects minorities against "Nation uber alles, autonomies and self-governance are not allowed" retards<Nations with nationalsits in charge: NATO HELP RUSSIA DOESN'T LET US DO WHAT WE DEMOCRATICALLY WANT DDD:>bothsidists: see? RUSSIA ALSO BAD>>2814698Ukrainians have scoured youtube of all the Donbass documentaries talking about Ukrainian war crimes against Donbass people. Tried to find that one Ukrainian video about how much nationalists are there in Ukraine, and how rabid they are against Russians, and couldn't find it anymore.
>>2814708>NATO HELP RUSSIA DOESN'T LET US DO WHAT WE DEMOCRATICALLY WANT DDD:Also, this is exactly how Syrian opposition operated against Assad. They just constantly, permanently, braindead-ly did this shit at every opportunity.
>>2814708if russians spent decades telling me sweet nothings about "brotherly nations" and then invaded and stole a piece of my country i too would be fuming
>>2814706>why should Russia just accept that huge military threat without retaliation?why shouldn't russia not accept it?
bonus question: why is this "retaliation" not against evil evil nato but some third party?
>>2814714>if russians spent decades telling me sweet nothings about "brotherly nations" and then invaded and stole a piece of my country i too would be fuming<invaded and stole a piece of my countryDude, you invaded your small nation autonomy with the intent of abolishing it, and small nation called big bro Russia to protect them against you. What are fuming about? That you were denied the god-given right to genocide your lessers?
>>2814714>why shouldn't russia not accept it?Why should anyone accept any threat?
>but some third party?If they're countries that have backing and support from NATO, then they're not third parties.
The conversation always gets to this point, where it stops being rooted in reality and just becomes about words. I.e "umm but Ukraine != NATO?"
Ultimately, the case for NATO expansion not being a massive provocation rivalled by few others in history, is unironically Sovereign Citizen arguments.
>>2814721>threatswitzerland is surrounded by nato from all sides, so is norway
neither chimps out, neither perceives it as a threat
>backing and support from NATOukraine had neither in 2010 as well as 2022
as a matter of fact the first week 2022 invasion my pm did a literal world tournee asking for help for ukraine
>>2814732NATO doesn't point nuclear-capable missile launchers at either of them.
>>2814735nuclear missiles aren't shot from slingshots you don't point them at anything in particular
>>2814735Yeah and Russia has just as many nukes pointed back…
>>2814740What's your point? That self-defence is wrong? It's not only wrong that Russia invades Ukraine to try and thwart NATO expansion, but also they're deserving of US nukes being stationed in multiple other countries pointed at them, because they've got nukes of their own?
Like lets not forget
>The US invented nukes>The US is the only country that has used nukes in anger>The US has nukes far closer to Moscow than any nukes are to Washington DC>The US was ready to start WW3 over the above no longer being the case Like I'm sorry, but anti-campism kind of depends on maintaining a pre-existing balance that simply doesn't exist.
>invasion as a means of defense against a defensive pact
>pushes more countries into the pact
such a funny bit for the history books
>>2814757As long as that's all you care about, the situation being funny.
>>2814765i have not stake in any of this at all
since we won the cold war pax americana's been great for my people
so i can enjoy the humor
>>2814769>>2814770Out of curiosity, who are your people?
>>2814778Yeah I thought so, but
>"we" won the cold waris this more humour?
>>2814783we genuinely did, consider it: we entered as a second world satellite, ended free. ten years later we're developing, twenty year later we're getting integrated into first world ordinance, thirty years later life's peachy once again
>>2814783Poland's real GDP per capita quadrupled in 23 years, from 1991 to 2024. They had basically a China-tier trajectory of growth. It's incredible how fast they grew and how much their standard of living increased.
>>2814795 (me)
Sorry 33 years
>>2814785You're still very much a satellite. Do you really think the Americans would let you leave NATO?
>>2814807why would we in the first place?
>>2814811That's beside the point. Just because you're content doesn't mean you're free. Those who don't move will never notice their chains. Besides, like any other empire the US will reach a point where it must cannibalize its allies, and like any capitalist country Poland's growth will stagnate and face worsening crises. Most Western European countries have already reached this point. It's only a matter of time until you do as well.
>>2814785>>2814795I'll grant you, of all the times Poland lost this time has worked out the best for them, but it's not an outcome Russia can expect under the yoke of Washington DC.
They want more than compliance from Russia, they want something Russia has that Poland doesn't. Poland has therefore little to lose from integrating with NATO, other than perhaps irrelevancy as a neutral party slotted between NATO and Russia.
So yeah I'd probably be laughing in your position as well, but at the same time, what can you really say that adds to the subject? You don't possess anything that the US either fears or competes with. You simply didn't have the means for true sovereignty in any real sense, always destined to be a customer of the US. Being in NATO and having US military bases and the aforementioned missile launchers in your territory makes you a preferential customer for a trade off that probably won't matter outside of WW3.
And to be fair, this is true of basically all of Russia's neighbours. Unless Russia was intending to dig up their oil fields and move them to other countries so they could too be wealthy independently, then the choice is between being a customer of either the US or Russia and while cheap oil, gas and uranium is nice, it's the US who ultimately gets to dish out the sanctions to prevent increasing living standards regardless off how much energy you have or how cheaply you can buy it.
>>2814822>but it's not an outcome Russia can expect under the yoke of Washington DCIts also not even true of all the former Warsaw Pact states. Look at the shitshows in Romania, Moldova, Bulgaria, and Ukraine (even before the war). Poland has been by far the most successful ex-socialist state in Europe.
>>2814817that is exactly the point
as for fall for pax americana - big woop - we'll be ready when the time comes, thanks for caring
>>2814822nah buddy poland won. not even americans won cold war as much as we did. they may have peaked in the 90s but fuck life in poland was absolutely miserable way into 70s. there's photos of hiroshima in 50s and it looks nice, meanwhile gdansk or wroclaw remained a sea of ruins without even being nuked.
americans want the very same thing from russia as they want from everyone else - not to chimp out - they've got a very cushy job sitting on top of the world, stirring up shit is a pain in the ass for them - there is nothing more to it.
as for sanctions it's actually eu that's way more trigger happy (in no small thanks to us)
>>2814844chechia did well, so did slovaka, hungary got a hickup but they'll get over it
eastern germany did well so did estonia, lithuania and latvia
>>2814844I think Poland and the Czech Republic are unique because they were both probably the most substantially industrialised countries in the Warsaw Pact outside of the USSR itself, both being producers of planes and tanks (albeit based on Soviet designs and tooling). Most other states were more agricultural and continue to be so.
That being said, the hard sell to all of these states are the same, the US is the gatekeeper to the global market while Russia is not. Most of them exist in the paradox of on the one hand needing the cheaper energy from Russia just to keep their economies afloat, on the other hand they're not proving themselves "reliable" enough partners for full entry to the garden economy by purchasing Russian energy therefore and maintaining a level of diplomacy with them.
Poland and the Czech Republic (after severing itself off from its more agricultural half) managed to break that paradox by having factories worth buying by Western capitalists, thus they needed to be integrated into the garden market by default. For example, Skoda being bought by Volkswagen and Polski Fiat being bought by OG Fiat.
This also applied to Russia in the 90s with much interest in purchasing the ex-Soviet industry there, but again, western investors were a lot more keen on owning their energy and when that was refused, Russia once again became a competitor to the US rather than a potential satellite.
>>2814858>they may have peaked in the 90s but fuck life in poland was absolutely miserable way into 70s. there's photos of hiroshima in 50s and it looks niceWhich side of "pax americana" were these countries on?
Like fuck man you're talking up Polan Stronk but you've implicitly said it'd preferable to be nuked by the US in exchange for then being allowed by the US to earn, than try to survive in a world outside US control.
So nah buddy, I don't think you will be ready when the time comes.
>>2814862>Polski Fiat being bought by OG Fiat. fun fact - fso was bought by deawoo and it bankrupt koreans
>>2814866economic development is not a zero sum game
>>2814874It is in your example though, Japan got to experience its "economic miracle" which was essentially just going to war with the US over sanctions, getting nuked, then becoming a vassal of the US but finally being allowed to earn.
Poland got its "economic miracle" by being on the losing side of the Cold War, then becoming a vassal of the US but finally being allowed to earn.
>>2814874Daewoo was corrupt and mismanaged in lots of ways, the Polonez might have been representative of Poland acting independently but it wasn't quite
that bad.
>>2814878winning side of the cold war
>>2814881worse than you imagine
poldek is essentially a remodel of fiat 125p which is budget 1961 italian car with a suspension based off ancient celtic wheelbarrows
it was 20 years outdated on launch and further improvements only made it worse
^ 20 years and a couple millennia outdated
>>2814878The funny thing is that Poland's relationship to the US today is more or less the same relationship it had with the USSR. Its a satellite but not a colony, i.e. it's geopolitical subordinate to the US but not the the target of exploitation. The real difference is that being the satellite of an empire allows you to wet your beak in the suffering of its victims. That's not the case when you're the satellite of a socialist state with no imperialist economic relationships.
either cucktin betrayed the SMO or the russian army is a joke, which one is it?
>>2814936GDP is central to their world understanding. If USA/Europe are not more developed than the rest, how could those leftists even feel oppressed while being superior to the rest?
>>2814819>The best cause of action is to let him get bored while making it clear to any people looking in that no one accepts his flawed premises.you wont achieve this without sustained effort. if you just respond a few times and leave they will take over and their flawed premises will go unopposed. if you report them they will not be banned no matter how reactionary in the spirit of "good faith debate" and "free speech". at this point leftypol is essentially a liberal imperialist forum and if you point it out and demand a minimum standard of actually being anti-capitalist you will get accused of being an authoritarian tankie who wants to impose a party line on a fun just for jokes website that isn't serious and it doesnt really matter if it promotes incorrect ideas because the internet isnt real anyway go touch grass.
>>2814939the sad part is that they have been including more and more speculative markets to the equation of the GDP calculation. the us, for example, in the 70s, boosted its own GDP by including housing rents. absolutely asinine propaganda.
>>2814993No, they need opposition or their shitsmearing looks even more pathetic. You enable them.
This isn't supposed to be Reddit where we just ban everyone who disagrees. Mods just let fascists of different stripes walk around for a while and that's how it should be. But they do come down on them when they start screeching about the jews or bragging about dead palestinians, while this nazi flavor is just fine apparently. They should just be consistent.
>>2814890>either cucktin betrayed the SMO or the russian army is a joke, which one is it?Populations are aging all over the wortld so it's getting harder to get an erection when trying to rape and kill your neighbors.
Russian trad fashion, 2026, recalling late imperial vibes.
>Russian Archaism considers the aesthetic quest of Russian modernism in relation to the nation-building ideas that spread in the late imperial period. Irina Shevelenko argues that the cultural milieu in Russia, where the modernist movement began as an extension of Western trends at the end of the nineteenth century, soon became captivated by nationalist indoctrination. Members of artistic groups, critics, and theorists advanced new interpretations of the goals of aesthetic experimentation that would allow them to embed the nation-building agenda within the aesthetic one.
>Shevelenko's book focuses on the period from the formation of the World of Art group (1898) through the Great War and encompasses visual arts, literature, music, and performance. As Shevelenko shows, it was the rejection of the Russian westernized tradition, informed by the revival of populist sensibilities across the educated class, that played a formative role in the development of Russian modernist agendas, particularly after the 1905 revolution. Russian Archaism reveals the modernist artistic enterprise as a crucial source of insight into Russia's political and cultural transformation in the early twentieth century and beyond.https://www.amazon.com/Russian-Archaism-Nationalism-Modernist-Aesthetic/dp/1501776347>>2815016Wtf did these people expect to happen when they sent all of their working age males to die?
>>2815065Probably only the Tesla seen in the background lmao, quite the juxtaposition between desiring western middle-classdom and abhorrence over how that’s achieved in practice.
>>2815040I’m afraid I have to agree with the other anon, these people want to control the discussion and that’s achieved by astroturfing any space that isn’t already Reddit-tier in terms of open-source censorship. If you ignore them and let them post without opposition, they won’t get bored or tired of that, they’ll just succeed in making it
appear like there’s no opposition on /leftypol/ to NATO talking points and any that are found are in the tiny minority of zigger tankie cranks.
I put far too much effort into arguing with them and dissecting their NAFO talking points for the benefit of any passing readers, because there’s gotta be a leftist space somewhere on the English speaking internet where SocDem party adjacents aren’t the tastemakers and truth tellers.
>>2815040>No, they need oppositionThey are the majority now. Have been for a while. Could be bots. Could be neets. I dont have 12 hours a day to argue with retards.
>>2815071They’re motivated, they’re so focused on opposing tankies because they’re seeking legitimacy in the eyes of SocDem parties (more importantly their voters) and that’s inhibited by their association with MLs. Praxis for them therefore is to expunge MLs from literally any talking space that’s remotely considered leftist, their constant attempts to frame MLs as redfash ultraconservatives represents their ambition to have MLs and support for AES to become something that exists on Stormfront instead of Leftypol.
>>2815073i dont think its even leftists anymore. and i dont mean liberals. i think its just trolls that are stupid on purpose because they think disruption is funny and are mocking you for taking politics seriously and caring about things. like the internet version of a mass shooter.
>>2815074That’s definitely how they want to present themselves as le confident mocksters, but I take the fact they feel the need to create multiple duplicate threads to portray leftypol (I.e “even the radicals!”) as neutral on NATO but anti-Russia, as contradictory as that is, as evidence they at least feel I’m somewhat successful in disrupting their endless attempts to claim /ukr/.
Likewise when they have meltdowns ITT where they claim I’m suppressing freedom of thought via my personal adoration of Putin being expressed by multiple sock puppets, essentially begging people to not listen to me.
>>2814676>muh natsecGEEEEEG
>>2815105they might have a point in there, it's not hard to believe an army that gets tested every singular day for 4+ years is going to beat an army that just does exercises for 40 years
Reminder the cucktin supposedly uses thousands of drones/missiles per day but somehow missed industry
https://archive.ph/Zv03wPutin's Russia is a disgrace
>>2815062>Russian Tsarists start dressing like actual clowns History is like poetry. It rhymes.
>>2815105NATO membership simply isn’t possible without Ukraine resolving their territorial claims which is still 1991 borders. As for demilitarisation, Ukraine’s Soviet-era stockpiles were still considerably larger than what they’ve received from NATO and by now much of that has been expended, likewise their cohesive pre-war military forces have been eliminated leaving Ukraine with a mishmash of pre-war commanders, untrained conscripts and NATO trained special forces.
Basically Russia has already achieved their goals because 1991 borders aren’t likely to be regained by Ukraine and continued militarisation presumes that NATO is going to keep dropping borrowed billions on givas post-war and that the money is better spent on buying a trickle of new build NATO tanks rather than rebuilding the country.
Russia has nevertheless not been able to end the conflict, because their victory conditions aren’t necessarily a situation that forces Ukraine to surrender and face the consequences. NATO is still taking out loans just to fund Kiev being on economic life support, the leadership are still able to grab money from that hand over fist via corruption schemes, kamikaze and FPV drones still provide a very visual means of attack and the Ukrainian population too terrorised by their brutal exploitation at the hands of Kiev as well as relentless drone attacks by Russia to organise forcing an end to the conflict.
I suppose ultimately that was the major miscalculation by Russia, that NATO and Banderites would opt to surrender after Russia successfully scuppered their ambitions, rather than out of pettiness expend billions of dollars and millions of people just to make Russia’s victory seem quite small in comparison to the eventual scale of the conflict.
>>2815123>Basically Russia has already achieved their goals lolllllllllllllllllllllllll
I’d hope people would eventually see Russia entering Ukraine equipped for a relatively low intensity conflict and leaving it only after having probably literally fought to the last Ukrainian as an unnecessary choice made by NATO and their proxy government.
But I know that even the complete extinction of Ukraine at the cost of many dead Russian soldiers will be enjoyed as
>heh Russia bit off more than it could chew huh? Nothin personel kid!
>>2815128Like I said, billions were spent on getting that exact reaction.
>>2814819I look like this
>>2815086>their endless attempts to claim /ukr/.There's this terminally butthurt liberal pole and a bunch of other trolls shitting up this thread, but they also create anti-communist and anti-ML troll threads in particular with varying degrees of intensity since a while. It was pretty bad a couple weeks ago with a couple threads like straight out of some butthurt belt subreddit cluttering the catalog.
>Marx is outdated>blabla ML is authoritarian>Putin/ziggers>i debunked communism with this simple method>communism will never work because it will never work and so on and so forth
These shitbots are probably payed using the EU's budget. There go my taxes.
>>2815129>Ukraine is going to become extinct bro dude trust meZigger fantasies are hilarious.
>>2815193Not what the post says
>>2815193>>2815193>Ukraine is going to become extinct bro dude trust metake it up to iuliia mendel
>>2810860>The war is destroying Ukraine demographically, economically, and politically. >>2815105>ukraine absolutely smashes NATO forceshe's right about that at least
>>2815105>armythe UA army ceased to exist in 2022. that's why in 2023 nazilushny was requesting 600 to 700 armored vehicles.
>nato ascensionwhat is to ascend? ukraine as it is is more an insurgency army filled with drones.
you don't take trenches, towns, cities and fight an army with merely drones, without tanks, apcs, artillery, air support, and radars.
the reason the front doesn't move in ukraine's favor, tells you that nato won't be ascending an insurgency.
Nazis are sending regular Ukranians to get massacred for the sake of western europe (which is doomed anyway lol) and people cheer for it to own da ziggers. Sad!
>>2815276what's western europe got to gain from any of this again?
>>2815377Nothing, but the porkies make a buck and political class and bureaucracy can justify their own existence with the Russian threat.
>>2815377They wanted to beat Russia either into "decolonization" or to at least decrease Russian oil price with sanctions ala how Iranian oil is cheaper than alternatives. What they got instead is 4 years of tightening their belts in the ever increasing sunking cost fallacy
>>2815567Reminder: Westoid economy is smaller than 10-20 years ago because of crises following one after another. Whatever GDP figures they draw, reality is that the new generation, which was born 10-20 years ago, today is in a much more perilous position than their parents were.
This is the end of the West. Their only hope is WW3 to reset the board
>>2815276pretty sure nobody on this site actually cheers on ukraine
spirit of anchorage status?
>>2815861There was that one anon, probably spurdo but I don’t remember, that claimed Cucktin made him pro-Ukraine.
>>2815911For me it was you, not even kidding
>>2815916Did I scratch you?
>Day 1.545 of the 2 day smo
>Bombing of the Reichskapital mosquew is now daily
Nazisters, our response????
>>2815911Spurdo would have gladly nuked every Ukrainian city by the end of the first month of the war. Like Iron Felix, his drive to exterminate Westoids will never be quenched.
>>2815952If spurdo could have that much power in his hands, one shudders to consider what he would be capable of.
>>2815796>This is the end of the West. Delusional. Bolshies said that every day for the past seven decades. Meanwhile the west has never been stronger and is eliminating its enemies systematically. Cuba is going to fall next.
>>2816002All Cuba does is make vaccines and cures for diseases and send doctors to help other nations. During Chernobyl they even took in Ukrainian kids to help them out. And modern Ukraine voted with the US to blockade and starve them. That's pretty fucked up so all holhols should die.
>>2816019So? My interest in the conflict is around the geopolitical ramifications, not whether there’s going to be enough electricity for the nightclubs to be open tonight.
>>2815861I wasn't until I got here and realized that for all the "anti-nazi" talk they can't be bothered to kill the actual nazi leadership of groups like Azov, right sector etc. So either they don't believe in this "nazi regime" nonsense or they supposedly okay with (pro-russian) people being forced to live under a "nazi regime".
(I've also met a grand total of one suspected "nazi" since I got here - an army guy with a black sun hoodie at a bus stop)
>>2816021What does the actual "geopolitics" of this matter to your own life?
>>2816026>What does the actual "geopolitics" of this matter to your own life?My country is a participant, probably the most involved of all NATO states.
Although I think the question is dumb, being interested in the world outside your immediate vicinity isn’t such a bad thing.
But like lmao
>I cheer on Ukraine because I lost an argument online
>I cheer on Ukraine because I went there for fun and Neo Nazism didn’t prevent that
Real lack of standard with some people
Geopolitics are bourgeois politics
>>2816026>they can't be bothered to kill the actual nazi leadership of groups like Azovwhy do you think they 'can't be bothered'
fucking budanv brags that he has suvived X number of killing attempts.
>>2816068budanov isn't even a neonazi lol he has no prior affiliation with right wing nationalist groups and started out as part of a Soviet-era unit that got taken over by the CIA after 2014.
>Healthcare workers are now having their military service exemptions revoked and being called up for service at the request of the Ministry of Defense, Health Minister Viktor Lyashko announced.>>2816071budanov eventually adopted all of the banderite movement.
you can easily find pictures of him with a bandera bust or OUN-b flag portraits.
I understand the anger on display in recent days
>Don’t Russians understand how humiliating this all is after so many years!? Why haven’t they coup’d Putin with a pro-NATO lib government yet!?
what I don’t understand is why people think “embarrassment” is a military goal.
Perhaps they’re still refusing to believe that NATO expansion is a threat for Russia, considering it to just be an ongoing popularity contest where states keep voting in favour of the west.
>>2816099>I understand the anger on display in recent daysnah, I don't understand it. the military operation goals are clear. that they don't read or want to repeat what the goals are through the mouths of nato, the cia, etc. that's their problem.
months ago someone here replied me
'lol you still remember the SMO goals'?
lol, I don't need the nyt to tell me what the goals are.
>>2816101he's right, it's their duty to hold the reigns in their own country
RUSSIA FUCKING LOST THE WAR
>it's right
>to die for the banderareich!
>>2816102You know it’s coming
>Yeah but the SMO still took longer than three days so Russia lost, ChampSoc on suicide watch lmao the ukrainian xittersphere is absolutely insane.
>>2816116Kramatorsk taken is good. that's a 200k people town.
>>2816099NATO expansion is not a threat to Russia, this is imperial propaganda. No nuclear power can be directly externally threatened. The Russians have 5500 nukes to hide behind, acting like Ukraine joining NATO would be the end of them is a lie.
>>2816117>azovites and ziggers finally unitedheartwarming
>>2816413I remember specifically when one top Russian official (Putin perhaps) stated the stressful situation is for Russians to have long-range nato missiles neighboring Russia. in a situation where they detect a plane, and it's mistaken for a nuke, having the detection range in Poland or Ukraine, they would need from 35 minutes to '8 minutes from Kharkov' minutes to react.
this is the threat they talk about. if by mistake they see something and it's not a nuke, but it's confused by a nuke, they could violently react launching nukes, starting a global nuclear war.
For now ukraine has only received conventional cruise missiles, and I am almost confident that the US has rejected the idea of giving tomahawks missiles to ukraine because these are easily nuclear capable, while scalps, storm shadows, etc. require special engineering adaptations to carry the new assembly that contains the radioactive material, to protect the rest of the assembly.
PS:
Yes, it was Putin, in 2022.
>>2815113Especially when you consider that one of them has already become proficient in
the weapon of the 21st century and the other has barely begun to tinker with it.
>>2816424Pakistan, India and China all deal with this problem as all have nukes and border each other, and yet they do not go at it. This is, again, just propaganda to justify resurrecting the Russian Empire.
>>2816435neither Pakistan, India, and China have invaded the others threatening to erase their existence to the ground, almost reaching to Russia's capital. twice.
thus, also it's needed the de-nazification.
>>2816441>Russia's capital* the others' capitals.
>>2816441If they didn't have nukes, India and Pakistan absolutely would have a battle to the death, there is no question about that.
Russia itself is full of Nazis. You don't care because they're Russian, and the Russians also don't care because they're Russian. Nazis are, apparently, only bad when other countries have them.
>>2816449I don't pander on
if hypotheticals, on whether China, Pakistan, or India would be marching towards the capitals of the others. that hasn't happened in the past, that's all.
>Russia itself is full of Nazisbut the state isn't.
I once again, tap the sign.
>>2816453It doesn't matter if it happened in the past, it's not an excuse to kill people in the present. Russians can either suck it up or die, pick one.
>>2816476>either suck it up or dieLooks like they have chosen a third option pretty easily to me
>>2816479>easilyYes that's why they're still in the Donbass resorting to human wave tactics.
>>2816482Human waves ? With no conscription and full drone coverage ? Who is even supposed to believe that, let's be honest.
>>2816508Er, anyone who watches the footage?
>send a squad forward>once they either reach the Ukrainian position or die, send another squad>repeat until there are enough troops in the position to launch another attackLiteral human waves haven't been viable for nearly a century but modernised versions have been used since then. The Russians are, in effect, using the same squad-rush wave tactics as the PLA in Korea, except that drones make it impossible to mass that many troops in one area meaning the waves must be repeated not just multiple times over the course of hours but in an attritional manner over the course of days.
>>2816519Ukraine will run out of men first regardless
Ukraine. Collapse. Status.
>>2816519>The Russians are, in effect, using the same squad-rush wave tactics as the PLA in KoreaThey're called stormtrooper tactics and they've been the backbone of infantry tactics (especially in a trench warfare context) since WW1. They were later labelled "human waves" by the Americans in Korea to cope with the fact that they were effectively used by the Chinese and North Koreans who they considered inferior. Incidentally that's also why the Ukrainians call them that today. In reality they rely on small unit infiltration and combined arms.
>>2816532Just a few more decades and a few chicken coops more and ukraine is finished! Russia with its booming demographics is just fine.
>>2816413You’re wrong because NATO (specifically the US) has more nuclear weapons closer to Moscow than vice versa, expansion is with the direct intention of making it so that the US has a 20 minute warning while Russia gets a 5 minute warning.
>>2816435>Situation x is the same as situation yNo two situations are exactly the same, there isn’t an expanding military bloc in the region surrounding any one country trying to tip the balance MAD depends on drastically in their favour.
But this is anti-campism isn’t it? “Neutrality” towards NATO who’ve done nothing wrong while Russia is imperialist and fascist, are propagandists and their nukes are therefore scarier.
>>2815849It's ogre.
>>2816541I prefer to call them "mass attacks" (that's just a personal preference, I'm not sure where I got it) and that would describe Chinese methods at one point, but I think even applying them to the USSR during WWII is fairly dubious. Also yes I think you're correct.
To change the subject though I think the war will remain at a stalemate because the number of drones in the field is just unbelievable. Ukraine has scaled drone production up now that it's basically impossible for Russia to advance much at all, and they might actually be losing a little bit of territory at the moment. It's just crazy what these drones do. It's suicide, Putin needs to end the war.
>>2816541Squad tactics (as opposed to mass attacks a.k.a. "meat waves") was a tactic developed in WWII. WWII started with WWI-style advances, the "Blitzkrieg". Germany just threw everything they had at Poland and rolled them over. These were the tactics employed in WWI, when they'd do bombings and artillery barrages for hours and then send a mass wave.
The mass attack was a response to the machine gun. The thinking was to send so many soldiers that they couldn't gun them all down, and those who make it can take the trench. The tank was developed for this purpose, to protect soldiers from machine gun fire and allow them to roll over trenches (hence the shape).
In WWII, with better technology, more tactics became available. Paratroopers were a WWII invention, squads drop behind enemy lines and disable guns and defenses before the attack.
Then there's also the problem of communication. In WWI they used telegraphs, pigeons, runners, flags and whistles to communicate and send commands. Much like in ancient times, the troops were kept i a large mass within hearing distance, both to be able to command them, but also to maintain discipline, increase morale, prevent routs and soldiers running away. You're more likely to keep running into machine gun fire (against your instincts) if there is another few hundred or few thousand others running side by side, pack/mob mentality, psychology and all that.
In WWII radios became ubiquotous. Now a squad, led by an NCO, can be in contact with everyone else at all times. Coordination of attacks becomes easier. This also changed the psychology of warfare. Where discipline and morale came from the "mass", now discipline and morale comes from camaraderie and friendships you make with your squad. This is why squads eat, sleep, train together, under an NCO. Survivability stopped being a numbers game, and became about the squad.
For all the talk about Russians and "meat waves" we still have not seen evidence of these meat waves from the Russian side. We've seen squads of like 15-16 attack at a time, but not more than that. We have however seen dozens of Ukrainians at a time, unsupported by armor, running across a field.
Read articles about the 225th and 425th Assault regiments, or are they battalions now? Who knows. They are infamous for taking TDF soldiers and newly busified ones and then forcing them into suicidal attacks.
The 225th and 425th are all responsible for the recent gains Ukraine has made. Take a wild guess how does happen – meat waves with the 225th and 425th acting as blocking battalions.
>>2816639I’m not sure that FPV drones necessarily are the silver bullet people make them out to be, reasonings are
>We see only the footage of successful or implied to be successful hits, but reports are that often drones miss multiple times before a successful hit is achieved>Most effective attacks appear to be ambush tactics, where the drone has been concealed in the likely path of advances and activated during advances, essentially like a minefield>Unlike a minefield where 100s of mines no longer need human input, each drone needs to be directly operated >Likewise for non-ambush scenarios, having 1000s of drones is limited by the number of experienced drone operators, the speed these drones can travel from the base to the front being low forcing response teams more dangerously close to the front, the direction of travel for the drones have a chance of being spotted and artillery can target their originFPV drones are definitely a factor in the limited movement at the front, but I think if this was a conflict fought via “mass attacks”, then FPV drone teams would be quickly overwhelmed.
>>2816655FPV drones are being hyped because of Ukraine's "drone tech" which they want to exchange for tanks, missiles, ships, nukes… Media is acting as an agent of capital. They are creating the "buzz" so that in 3 years when their country's PM says they are buying €10 Billion of "drone tech" from Ukraine, the citizens won't riot and hang the PM.
>>2816669Indeed, it’s also because they’re claiming that drones are 100% produced in Ukraine (even in people’s kitchens and bedrooms for FPV drones) and thus not dependent on military givas that Ukrainians appear to (not unreasonably) believe NATO are far too flakey about.
So coincidentally the most powerful weapon at Ukraine’s disposal is also the weapon they can supposedly produce alone endlessly using their military cottage industry.
Just one of many contradictions from the Ukrainian side
>We’re going to win this conflict entirely through drone warfare
>But also we’re willing to trade thousands of them and dispatch trained operators to other conflicts in exchange for some tanks
CUCKTIN DO SOMETHING FFS
why am I seeing dozens of videos of drone strikes in moscow? helloooooo? where is the air defense???? 5 years into a war and your air defense is just as shit as it was in the first year?
fucking CUCK shit needs to stop.
>Bloomberg: A tax on parcels from abroad will be a condition for Ukraine to receive part of the European loan.
>To receive €8.4 billion, Kiev will need to repeal the duty-free import of parcels worth up to €150.(bloomberg calls it 'unpopular tax', lmao)
https://news.bloombergtax.com/financial-accounting/eu-ties-part-of-ukraine-90-billion-aid-to-unpopular-tax-measure >>2816711You haven’t considered “the cycle” spurdo
>Defence is in place>Attackers develop ways to circumvent defence>Defenders learn from circumvention to improve defenceand around it goes
>>2816730That’s because the EU is trying to tax everyone out of using AliExpress lmao
That’s capitalists hating competition within the EU, but for Ukraine AliExpress and Temu is probably load bearing.
NATO country shoots down alleged Ukrainian drone>The destroyed UAV was likely deployed by Kiev to target Russian territory, the Estonian defense minister has said<Moscow has warned that if it turns out that the Baltic States and Finland “deliberately provide their airspace” to Kiev’s UAVs, Moscow has the right to self-defense in response to an “armed attack” under Article 51 of the UN Charter.>Pevkur told the outlet Delfi on Tuesday that “this is the first time we have shot down a drone ourselves.”<Earlier this month, Pevkur said that Kiev should stop using Estonian airspace for UAV attacks on Russia.>Earlier on Tuesday, Moscow’s Foreign Intelligence Service (SVR) revealed that, according to its data, Latvia has given Ukraine permission to use its territory for potential drone attacks against Russia.https://swentr.site/news/640168-ukraine-drone-estonia-pevkur/Interesting, perhaps NATO airspace isn’t quite as open as first thought
>>2816725Where's the GDP guy? Russian nominal GDP grew 10% this Q1 alone due to currency appreciation
>>2816735if shitposting were an olympic sport, gunther would be its finest amateur loser.
he would be the featured guest star of the British TV show 'The Jump' of shitposters.
>>2816771he ran away after this:
>>2814936it's unfortunate that people can't see that many economic metrics are limited in scope, and borderline useless.
>>2816766another? I guess they'll have their government dissolved, too?
>>2816771where'd you get that news from?
https://interfax.com/newsroom/top-stories/117599/>>2816725>best performing currencyfourth behind zambia sychelles and armenia (on dollar)
>>2816823Real vs nominal GDP.
>>2816822 CEIC says Russian GDP fluctuates like crazy +-20% of GDP due to currency nonsense.
But anyway, you arrive at "real" GDP by putting an arbitrary modifier to it. Chain-linking means you have a bunch of arbitrary points in time that make GDP more believable, lol.
PPP is also a modifier to nominal GDP.
>>2816823Oh, and interfax's 0.4% is the famed nominal to real GDP adjustment - in USD, no less. The actual data shows that Russia's GDP in roubles will grow from 210 trillion roubles to 230 over 2026. Then you slap on this number whatever arbitrary conversion figure you want, "adjust for inflation", and get to 0.4% figure
>>2816838interfax is a news agency, the data (correction of data) is from rosstat which accounts for gdp in national currency
>Geopolitics is bourgeois
>GDP, now that’s a working man’s interest
>>2816841both an effect on how the working man lives, no?
>>2816847Just find it ironic that Geopolitics are decried as bourgeois, but clearly a lot wants to be said about bourgeois wealth measurements.
>>2816839Yeah, because statistical methods are applicable anywhere, even to China. Thing is, though, statistical methods in question are bullshit, and even GDP economists themselves admit that China's GDP should be adjusted 1/3 or more upwards because methods used aren't showing the real picture
>>2816853guess who measures production in china
>>2816860Chinese do. And then apply to it statistical methods from intl economic data organizations. Methods are the problem. Learn to read, lmao
>>2816823>>2816823>fourth behind zambia sychelles and armenia (on dollar)none of them under thousands of US sanctions. LAWL.
>>2816632It doesn't matter if they have more, Russia has many more than needed to obliterate the United States. It is not under threat. This is propaganda to justify Russian imperialism. The response time doesn't matter, it's just an excuse.
NATO has done plenty wrong, but not against Russia. Russia has nukes, they don't fuck with Russia. They fucked with the Balkans and Libya instead.
>>2817067Where did I mention quantities as a factor?
>>2816685The drone parts are produced in China and Europe then assembled in Ukraine. Ukraine is "producing" drones… from finished parts. They do assemble them in apartments, because that way you can hide the production.
I wonder how many of the Russian drone strikes on apartment buildings were based on info about drone production. Both legit and not legit. Russia definitely has spies and sympathisers. Some of them could be false reports, someone getting rid of an enemy or someone they owe money.
Apropos drone tech.
>pic related<Bloomberg reported on Tuesday, May 19.<According to the outlet, citing a person familiar with the discussionshttps://www.kyivpost.com/post/76461 >>2814677>retards using "moralism" as a buzzword againPeople like you who misuse the words moralism, reactionary, imperialism etc. need to be beaten over the head with full-sized tomes of Lenin's works after being force-fed a dictionary.
First: Since when was Korea, China, Vietnam or Cuba capitalist when the Korean, Vietnam wars and other activities occurred? Or the USSR? Furthermore how does this justify the USA/NATO going across the planet to bomb a country that isn't bending a knee to its foreign policy? This isn't "Both sides". This is unprovoked aggression against another country.
Secondly: Read Lenin; the national bourgeiosie of peripheral nations are to be critically supported in the face of a first world hegemon imperialist, because the latter will fucking annihilate any chance of a socialist revolution in the near future and make it a vassal state.
>>2814631 >False Equivalency to an actual Both Sides argument is the same as my retarded idea of what it is! LMAO.
>>2818530>picMost of the damage on civilians was self-inflicted by Ukrainian anti-air systems. Note that with the death of Ukrainian anti-air, there are no more S300 strikes anywhere on civilians, and also the interception rates increased across the board. Funnily enough, S300 was NON-INTERCEPTABLE, according to Ukrainian stats, every time it was mentioned, nobody, not even sacred Patriots, grandmas with picklejars, or even God himself, could veer S300 missile off-target (target being an apartment building)
>>2818877let me guess, the article bases the assumption that Xi said that the Ukraine war is a mistake or regrets it and told it to trump? and the MFA of China then went in and denied the claim?
>>2818931The entire assumption is based on Ukranian military reports. Zero mentions about the Iran war or the fact that UK + US are granting waivers to buy energy supplies from Russia btw.
https://archive.is/Xaaz3 >>2818982>UK + US are granting waivers to buy energy supplies from Russia btw. Tip top kek
>We have data showing since yesterday we have successfully liberated the street corner (Vul. Bandera 1488a) adjacent to the tool shed that's part of the warehouse section of the dog food factory (closed c.2022) in the French microdistrict of the Borsch raion of the stronghold of Ivanovichnovka (population 2014: ~20,000, 2022: ~7000, 2025: ~134, 2026: 2)
How do some of you maintain a stiffy reading this shit? Can you imagine Zhukov giving reports to Stalin like that and not being vaporized on the spot?
>>2819364Tragedy, farce, I don't know which is which anymore
>>2819511Hey, what did Russia win?
>>2819595They won the kingdom of heaven because Christ smiles upon those who sacrifice hundreds of thousands of their own soldiers to avoid civilian casualties. Unfortunately this means they lose in the real world because the real world is ruled by Satan but since Putin is a good Christian boy I'm sure that matters a lot less to him than entry into heaven.
>>2819607putin takes his faith very seriously
>>2818863Although many wish to put the champagne on ice, it won’t be Ukraine lmao
At this point I almost don't care who wins. Russia shouldn't be holding back this much. Putin has gotten soft, where is the hardened traitor to the Soviet Union?
>>2819607Really the only lose scenario for Russia is nuclear exchange with Nato. Anything else is just Russia winning too slowly and bad PR, that mostly concerns terminally online happener brained leftoids who hate being trolled by Nafoids about it.
>>2819667An actual state, the USSR, collapsed against nato, a rump gas station like russia only hasn't collapsed because the united states isn't even really trying
>>2819667Is Moscow getting drone striked merely "bad PR"? If Khruschev had been in charge we would have already witnessed the end of the world with a nuclear holocaust because no Soviet leader would have ever been stupid enough to tolerate the West freely attacking Russia's major cities.
According to ultroid bordigger analysis Russia is winning.
Damn another thread filled with nazi cope
Why do mods tolerate this?
>>2819750To be fair in the Cold War the west probably wouldn’t bother with striking said cities with small warheads for good PR, they’d go large if they’re risking nuclear war anyway.
It’s actually a really dumb situation all around, like nafoids creaming themselves over every small smokey fire choose to forget that they promised themselves armageddon for Russia if they ever interfered with NATO’s expansion.
>>2820156<"The General Staff stated that they struck the headquarters of the Russian "Rubikon" unit in Starobilsk; Russian media reports of a strike on a dormitory are manipulation"https://unn.ua/en/news/the-general-staff-stated-that-they-struck-the-headquarters-of-the-russian-rubikon-unit-in-starobilsk-russian-media-reports-of-a-strike-on-a-dormitory-are-manipulationNazi scum. Harden your heart Putin and nuke the bastards!
>>2820156>>2820166Like Champ said one post ago it's just a small smokey fire so don't worry about it.
>>2820156This is what winning looks like
>>2820186I agree. Ukraine is resorting to attacking any building not covered by AD. This was a provocation. Ukraine wants Russia to escalate so that NATO sends troops.
>>2820175Not what the post said.
I have to say that a lot these days, huh?
>>2820156>In a week they'll say it was actually Russia who attacked their own school.I FUCKING CALLED IT.
>pic rel<"Accused by Russian officials"they even forgot to close the parentheses. just you wait, in a week they'll decide it wasn't Ukraine at all, but Russia.
>>2820566>I have to say that a lot these days, huh?no, you don't. just ignore them. You're too easy to bait and you're allowing them to slide the thread. they'll get you into a back and forth about you as a person (and you'll fall for it because you have an ego like everyone else) and the thread will go off-topic.
Don't be so predictable and easy to manipulate. Tell your friends about the Starobilsk strike.
>>2820654>baitOh they wish they were trolling lmao
>>2820678I wish I was trolling too but the real troll in all of this is Cucktin who will allow hundreds of thousands of Russians to die needlessly thanks to his lack of escalation, all because he wants good relations with the West.
>>2820696And it's not like he wasn't schooled by Iran. ..
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