/siberia_archive/ - Siberia Archive

>>5524
Testosterone makes you more uninhibited/hornier so if you're bi you're more likely to pursue your same sex attraction than to keep it in the background

>Ukraine megathread does nonstop LGBTphobia
>constantly insinuating that the vast majority of LGBT are affiliated with western think tanks, pro NATO, pro Nazis
>all this despite the fact that Ukrainian nazis are massive LGBTphobes
>constantly taking western porky's pinkwashing at face value, and unironically believe that because NATO officials have been pretending to be pro-LGBT that LGBT people are pro-imperialism
>mostly dogwhistles
>whenever one of them starts doing ultranationalist orthodox christian ranting they get accused of "false flagging" even though that's the natural conclusion of the thread's ideology
>one of them always comes in with a big brain take that LGBTphobia is justified because "unipolar globalization is in crisis and we need multipolarity" even though the latter being true does not justify the former.
>one of them claimed in the last megathread that /LGBT/ thread in siberia was "raiding" and "false flagging" them
>come here
>nobody's posted in days

damn y'all live rent free in their heads.

>>5526
I hope the /Ukraine/ thread turns out to be a honeypot to find the regulars to rangeban them. Like 99% of the site's glowie activity is either from /Ukraine/ or spills over from it.

>>5527
You think the mods are on your side? The cuckraine thread is under mod protection 24/7 while you are exiled to siberia and even here you get shit on constantly by anti-LGBT anons while the mods do nothing.

>>5526
The ukraine thread is nothing but rightists who think they're leftists because they sided with the underdog. I'm so tired of those ghouls.
>>5527
>>5528
Yeah mods are into it too and there is no saving this site from it, this site is in a downfall and there is not saving it from it.

>>5529
>The ukraine thread is nothing but rightists who think they're leftists because they sided with the underdog.
This. it is possible to be anti-NATO without being literally Ztarded

>>5529
Yeah probably. It's getting close to time for another leftypol to pop up and try again on a fresh slate. Perhaps the life of a leftypoler is a nomadic one.

>>5530
kinda getting really tired of all the crypto stormfags too pretending like they didn't just come over at the start of this year

>>5529
>The ukraine thread is nothing but rightists who think they're leftists
More like "pretend they are leftists", because when all this shi started and i was still active on those thread, after certain amount of arguments ziggers almost always devolved into being schizo putinists talking about how putin took down oligarchs, rebuilt the russian industry and so on. Sometimes it was like "he was bad, now he is good", like he is surely gonna build communism and restore USSR.
>Yeah mods are into it too and there is no saving this site from it, this site is in a downfall and there is not saving it from it.
Kinda like the whole world if i am being honest. I am not a doomer but the whole situation just doesn't look like it's gonna go in our favor, more like this is the last century of our civilization. Or maybe even a humanity.

>>5528
I made the first general associated with this sequence months ago and literally the first post on the thread was a mod moving it to Siberia for "obvious" (their word) reasons that they never spelled out. At this point I personally consider this board heavily reactionary leaning when it comes to LGBT people despite being the most leftwing image board in the English speaking world, sadly.

>>5533
>Kinda like the whole world if i am being honest. I am not a doomer but the whole situation just doesn't look like it's gonna go in our favor, more like this is the last century of our civilization. Or maybe even a humanity.
LGBT people are like a canary in a coal mine. If you can't even guarantee us basic respects then let's be honest, there is no genuine desire for communism in the 21st century. This goes for boards or countries

>>5535
If you don't conflate respect with "follow what LGBTQ organizations are saying" i don't mind, but they usually glow like fuck and probably curated by real glowies to reduce class consciousness.

I will call you brother (or sister, i don't give a crap) regardless if you are trans, gay, lesbo, black, jew or whatever as long as you are for socialist revolution and proletarian dictatorship and don't do "class reductionist brocialist scum" bull.

>>5535
>If you can't even guarantee us basic respects then let's be honest, there is no genuine desire for communism in the 21st century
This shit is kinda telling tho. Anon, you do understand that communism is the only path to survival of humanity, right? Like if we don't build communism, we are not gonna survive as human civilization, right? Not only that we will severely fuck up our planet, so possibly we will even end as species. Anon are you telling me that you are willing to throw the fucking white flag because a couple of socialist hold less than perfect (from your perspective) views? Is that what you are telling me? That saving humanity from insane amount of suffering is not worth it if you don't get everything that you want? Please tell me i am reading you wrong.

>>5536
>If you don't conflate respect with "follow what LGBTQ organizations are saying" i don't mind, but they usually glow like fuck and probably curated by real glowies to reduce class consciousness.

I probably agree with most of what they are saying though. Assuming its "dont kill us, dont put us in the wrong gender prison, let us get married etc". I don't even know what you're talking about, this seems to be a common anti-lgbt talking point. What organizations?

>>5538
And sorry to tell you but Russia and basically every middle eastern country utterly fails these criteria. As does the US. Basically everywhere in the world does. And that's before we get into proletarian liberation. I'm talking about in comparison to non-lgbt proles as things stand now. This seems to be controversial on this board ever since the Ukraine war

>>5535
>LGBT people are like a canary in a coal mine. If you can't even guarantee us basic respects then let's be honest, there is no genuine desire for communism in the 21st century.

if you say this to Ztards they'll just post pics related at you.

>>5538
>dont kill us
If you don't stand against revolution, why would we kill you? Aren't you overblowing this? Yeah i know plenty of socialist who hold somewhat boomer views on gays and shit, but i don't think there are socialist who would say somethign even remotely close to this.
>let us get married
I mean, the institute of marriage is the product of forms of private property. With their abolishment isn't this kinda a non issue?
>What organizations?
All kinda of "left" liberal organizations that tend to promote this view that opressions is like very intersectional and class is just another way of opression. This is erasure of class consciousness to the same vien is nationalism is - creation of interclass identity. You are all one because you are all americans, blacks, gays, women and so on, don't mind that some of you are capitalists, after all to properly represent your interests you just need more gays/women/blacks in the parlament/ceo positions, not some outdated proletarian revolution. If you agree with that than we are definitely not friends, more likely we are enemies, but not because you are gay or something.

>>5537
You don't understand what a canary in a coal mine is? If the canaries are dying that means that cave isn't viable for mining. We need to reorganize elsewhere and try again.

>>5540
>gorky quote

n-no he didn't actually mean it like that… because reasons, OK?!?!

>>5537
>This shit is kinda telling tho. Anon, you do understand that communism is the only path to survival of humanity, right? Like if we don't build communism, we are not gonna survive as human civilization, right? Not only that we will severely fuck up our planet, so possibly we will even end as species. Anon are you telling me that you are willing to throw the fucking white flag because a couple of socialist hold less than perfect (from your perspective) views? Is that what you are telling me? That saving humanity from insane amount of suffering is not worth it if you don't get everything that you want? Please tell me i am reading you wrong.
Nice, I express that I'm lgbt and I expect rights for lgbt people and you immediately start talking at me as if I'm not a communist and start communist-splaining me based on that assumption. This is part if the problem. How is what I said implying any of the nonsense you said after your first sentence? Analyze your unconscious biases and figure out why you immediately assumed I'm not a communist.

Now let's communist-splain you a bit. What makes you think proles can assume socialism or communism are developing well if there are still segments of the population even capable if maintaining their original capitalist-maintained oppressions even after a socialism is supposedly under construction ? Maybe you misunderstood the meaning if the phrase "canary in the coal mine". When the coal mine runs out of air the canary dies first before the human miners. If the humans see the dead canary they immediately evacuate the mine because something is wrong. Similarly, if lgbt proles are being oppressed still, something is wrong, something that is probably still affecting or can or will affect non-lgbt proles in the near future.

>>5541
I'm talking about present reality anon not some hypothetical future where are proposing where you are in charge lmao. Wtf

>>5533
>pretend they are leftists
Some of them pretend, other are sincere, they think leftism is just being a contrarian and nothing else.
> more like this is the last century of our civilization. Or maybe even a humanity.
Civilization will go on for a while it'll just get worse.
>>5534
To be fair an lgbt general would had been a magnet for trolling but if the mods can babysit the ukraine general they should babysit the lgbt general too
>>5535
If we can't guarantee lgbt rights then no other rights can be guaranteed because it means the ruling class is not willing to make concessions or negotiate.
rights and freedoms have to be universal and we have to fight for the rights we don't use or else we're harming the rights we do use.
Also holy shit the replays to this post are awful "i have no prioblem with gays as long they're on the side of the revolution", I hate this messianic talk about revolution where people wants to sit down, do some preformative acts and expect people to revolt by themselves, deplorable.

>>5533
>Sometimes it was like "he was bad, now he is good", like he is surely gonna build communism and restore USSR.

ironically this is the same shit the US state department believes

>>5546
>>5546
>Also holy shit the replays to this post are awful "i have no prioblem with gays as long they're on the side of the revolution", I hate this messianic talk about revolution where people wants to sit down, do some preformative acts and expect people to revolt by themselves, deplorable.
Right. Anon even LARPs as if he's part of "we" who is doing killing. Lmao:
>If you don't stand against revolution, why would we kill you

>>5542
That's an idiotic position. Socialist aren't some ubermensch who can just ignore material conditions. We grew up in capitalist society, we are irreversibly fucked by it. Expecting for socialists to be some kind of pure ideal representation of all that is good and not holding several reactionary or just retarded views is even more retarded.
Read what Lenin write about socialism and religion https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1905/dec/03.htm

While it is obvious that religious institutions are instruments of oppression of the ruling class, doesn't mean that socialist can't be religious for precisely stated above reasons. If you gonna wait for perfect socialists you might as well slit your wrists because the only thing that you will get from that waiting is fascists taking over and burning people like you on a stake or something.
>>5544
> you immediately start talking at me as if I'm not a communist
That's not what i have said. What i reacted to was you saying "we don't need communism unless it exactly what i want". Yes, let's abondon the idea of freeing the humanity for endless suffering of class society and commodity production. from slavery and war because after all some socialist may not be too ken on gay marriage (not that the marriage itself gonna exist most likely when communism is achieved). That is the kind of thinking i am talking about. And that has nothing to do with your orientation, i say same things to everybody because most people have some sort of brainworm from capitalism that works against class consciousness wherever it is gay rights, nationalism, feminism, veganism, liberalism or whatever. Personally i am fine with gays and if you want to get married (for some reason that completely eludes me) be my guest. You probably gonna be pissed that i put nationalism and feminism in the same place, but if you think about what i have said, you may understand why.

It's not a canary is some fucking coal mine, it's you engaging in some purism and not gettig you priorities straight.

>>5545
Present reality is precisely what i am talking about. I guess it jsut didn't hit you yet. Don't worry, when you are dying from starvation in some bombed to shit ruins or worked to death in some concentration camp it may dawn on you that maybe gays marrying in any church wasn't exactly the proper hill to die on. By that time i will probably be dead to, so i wouldn't be able to say "see, i was right all along".

>>5546
>Some of them pretend, other are sincere, they think leftism is just being a contrarian and nothing else.

Yeah, probably. We have a lot of schizo in Russia who think that communism is when you pray to icon of Stalin in orthodox church.

>>5548
>I hate this messianic talk about revolution where people wants to sit down, do some preformative acts and expect people to revolt by themselves, deplorable.
This is just projection, you know?

>>5549
You don't have to be an ubermensch to not be a homophobe, fucking retard scumbag. Sick of your kind

>>5546
>rights and freedoms have to be universal and we have to fight for the rights we don't use or else we're harming the rights we do use.
This is just some idealistic bullshit. No rights are universal, they are always concrete and specific. And also always divided by class lines.

>>5549
>maybe gays marrying in any church wasn't exactly the proper hill to die on
Who is dying on any hills. If you can't even get basic lines right like "let gay people do everything straight people can" then give up already, such a great "socialist"

>>5552
Stop talking in abstractions. These are very concrete oppressions were talking about here.
>don't let it be legal to murder gay people
>don't make it illegal for gay people to appear in public
>don't put trans women in men's prisons
Etc
Youre so far removed you have to deflect and pretend anon is speaking about ideal utopia when they are really speaking concretely

>>5551
>You don't have to be an ubermensch to not be a homophobe, fucking retard scumbag. Sick of your kind
In what way i am homophobe? I don't hate gays, i don't hate them marrying or being on movies and shit, i always benn pretty openminded about stuff like that. But i do think i hate you, not because you are gay (if you are), but because you are some liberal holier than thou asshat, probably living in some rich regiong, fat on imperialist gains and values his multicultural pluralism more than you value actual emancipation of humankind because you enver bothered to check your privilige.
>>5553
As proles we have to unite around our class interests first and fremost. First because it's what will allow us to bring most of the good to everybody, second because it's the only shit that will work. Splitting because of views on some really unimportant stuff liek gay marriage only works against us all regardless of position. Eventually our society will be progressive enough that we will achieve all that good shit, but it's not gonna happen now.

If you wanna bring forth the actual revolution you will have to work with people you don't always agree on, wherever it would be some religious nutjob, homophobe or just an asshole like me. Otherwise we all will loose.

>>5555
Stop larping. Youre in the lgbt thread. I can write that same shit you are writing right niw too yiu know.
Do some self crit and find out why lgbt people are sick of you not even giving us 10 forum posts of consideration let alone rights after your made up revolution. Now you call me a liberal too. I think k youre a larper. Retard

>>5554
>don't let it be legal to murder gay people
How about just "don't let it be legal to murder people"? Are you talking about some middle eastern or african countries? Because even in Russia (we are mildly homophobic) you won't get off with crap like that. Murder is murder.
>don't make it illegal for gay people to appear in public
Ok.
>don't put trans women in men's prisons
Can we put trans men in women's prisons tho?
On a serious note the prison system gonna be reworked heavily. Separation by gender would probably one thing i abolish entirely. Maybe with the exception of some really nasty stuff like rapists, murderers and serial killers.

>>5556
>Youre in the lgbt thread.
I actually didn't notice. I was browsing siberia and saw post shitting on ziggers and joined.
>sick of you not even giving us 10 forum posts of consideration
Fucker, am i the mod or something? If it would be in my power i wouldn't put serious thread in siberia. The ukraine clown shit deserves it more.

>>5557
I don't think you know how bad the situation is anon. Its literally legal to murder trans women in the US using "trans panic defense". And its u officially legal to abuse and murder lgbt people in general almost universally, who do not get fair trials in many scenarios.

And no shit we need orison abolition. But in present reality trans women are used as political pawns in prison and are almost guaranteed to get raped and get aids. So we need reformism for those ones right now in the present. Don't call that liberalism or fuck off

>>5558
No excuse, we need good lines on lgbt rights in every thread not just this one. Start defending g us against anti-lgbt comrades.

Reactionary distraction, doesn't serve the working class.

>>5561
>Reactionary distraction, doesn't serve the working class.
Lgbt people are working class. And most working class people have an lgbt person in their social group. Kys

>>5559
> Its literally legal to murder trans women in the US using "trans panic defense".
If that is true, US is way worse than Russia. Kinda ironic.
On the other hand i am pretty sure that those who can exercise this right are people with power and money or cops, right? You should see that opression even when done to minority that wouldn't suffer that oppression otherwise is still going along the class character. For some reason i don't think a poor prole can do that or that a rich trans person that can hire bodyguards, live in a guarded neighborhood and have amazing surgeries and medical attention to look more like standard image of a woman would be in danger.

For example we have a congressmen that hit a child with a car and the court allowed him to settle things with money. Does it mean it's legal in Russia to kill children? It's not a question of legality, it's a question of power and such power comes from being capitalist (or doing some important work for him like being a cop keeping proles in line).

>But in present reality trans women are used as political pawns in prison and are almost guaranteed to get raped and get aids.
yeah, your prisons are even wrose than ours. Tough we do get some horrible shit happen too. Like there were news relatively about cops torturing a prisoner by raping him with a broom. Again, if you are rich you can get to much better prisons or not even get thee at all. You do understand that your problems coming not from beign trans or gay (i still don't know who you are in this regard), buut fromn being a (relatively) poor prole in a society where money cna buy you anything from bubblegum to sex change to "justice"? And still you think that if there are socialist that dont' have utterly progressive views on sexuality and orientation then we don't need socialism at all? Don't you understand that in a socialist society you will get shitload of advantages even if they don't permit gay marriages? I mean look at Cuba, they didn't start very progressive in that regard, but they have changed to the better because socialism allows for progress and betterment of society. Capitalism doesn't.

>>5560
>No excuse, we need good lines on lgbt rights in every thread not just this one. Start defending g us against anti-lgbt comrades.
I always profess my views on sexual orientation if they are relevant.
But also, fuck you. If you are not willing to work for bringing socialism closer just because od some stupid shit like gay marriage then i don't really care about you. Defend yourself.
>>5562
>Lgbt people are working class.
Obviously most are, some aren't. The point is not just being working class, but having class consciousness. If you think like a pork it doesn't matter that you are working class. If you think that you a gay first and foremost and only then you are working class - same shit. Temporarily embarassed millionaries my ass.

>>5552
>This is just some idealistic bullshit. No rights are universal, they are always concrete and specific. And also always divided by class lines.
you could go further on and explain how rights are not real and just spooks. But rights are starting point inside the ideological apparatus and if we're not fighting for "rights" and "welfare" then we're not fighting for socialism.
>>5561
>>5562
Working class is anyone who lives under wage labor, anybody can be working class and that's why the wellbeing and welfare of minorities and socially vulnerable people are also the wellbeing and welfare of the working class.

>>5563
>You do understand that your problems coming not from beign trans or gay
Explain why one of the most rich and famous trans women in the world was recently put into a men's prison in the US
https://www.opb.org/article/2022/11/10/transgender-beauty-influencer-mens-jail-miami-arrest/

>>5564
>Defend yourself.
Like we ever have a choice. I don't care about socialism anymore. Solidarity is just a fucking pipe dream.

>>5567
Let's keep in mind these are just dumbass comrades who need to touch grass. Only socialism can liberate us too, even if even socialists are pitiful when it comes to even bothering to try to understand or care about our position, even in our own thread. Solidarity comrade

>>5565
>you could go further on and explain how rights are not real and just spooks.
Kinda the opposite of what i have said. Maybe read Lenin? I dunno.
>But rights are starting point inside the ideological apparatus and if we're not fighting for "rights" and "welfare" then we're not fighting for socialism.
They aren't really. You should read more. And we definitely don't fight for "welfare". Well, maybe you do.
>Working class is anyone who lives under wage labor, anybody can be working class and that's why the wellbeing and welfare of minorities and socially vulnerable people are also the wellbeing and welfare of the working class.
If many lgbt people are working class then helping working class is helping lgbt people. And should be the first priority. If you can't get behind that then it's on you.
>>5566
>Explain why one of the most rich and famous trans women in the world was recently put into a men's prison in the US
<Turner Guilford Knight Correctional Center
Some minimum security fucking resort for rich people. I fucking live in worse conditions.
>>5567
>I don't care about socialism anymore. Solidarity is just a fucking pipe dream.
So why should i care about you? Like, for serious? Tbh it was obvious from the start which is why i pressed it and gave you so much shit. If solidarity is pipe dream then the only ting left for you is to screech about homophobic brocialists and priviliged cis white men while the world declines in absolute reactionary shitholw and we all fucked either by nuclear war or climate change. Because you couldn't put aside some of your sensitivities and make priorities. I mean i hate religious nutjobs, but i work with them. Why can't you?
>>5568
>even if even socialists are pitiful when it comes to even bothering to try to understand or care about our position, even in our own thread.
I do understand your position, what is there not to understand? Perhaps you don't understand your own position fully.

>>5569
Fuck off anon. Keep coming in the lgbt thread lecturing us about not prioritizing the working class as an abstraction rather than in specifics. For lgbt people, a sizeable portion of the working class, the specifics differ from non-lgbt people in many notable ways. You just want to tell us to shut up. So I tell you to. Fuck off retard.

>>5570
One of you literally said he doesn't care about socialism. Yeah, that's what i was talking from the start - brainwashed with invented interclass identity.
>Keep coming in the lgbt thread
Motehrfucker, this is a left wing board. I have more reason to actually ask what they fuck are you doing here even, if you are not about prioritizing worker class?
>Fuck off retard.
Same to you pork sucker. Vote blu more, maybe that will stop fascits.

>>5572
>One of you literally said
fuck that person, they're wrong.

Moved to >>>/siberia_archive/3757.