The Black Book of capitalism Beta edition BBOCAnon 2022-11-27 (Sun) 17:24:51 No. 13769 [Last 50 Posts]
After three months of labor, I present you the current state of the translation project of the french Black Book of Capitalism from 1998.
The raw traduction is completed, the work is in the process of being proofread to enhance the general english level. So far two benevolent English speakers manifested their interest in this endeavour, one of them already corrected the Foreword and Introduction.
Gitea of the Black Book of Communism:
If you download the whole deposit and run it trough a Tex editor, a whole book appears! Credits to LaTex Anon for this magic
This thread will be used as a hub to update the progressively the book with the proofreader's input, but also to sketch the specification of an enhanced edition of the BBOC, as well as gathering material in this regard, because after a few more decades of neoliberalism, some updates would be welcome. Furthermore as some people remarked, the book is far from exhaustive.
Anonymous 2022-11-28 (Mon) 12:00:48 No. 13773 >>13769 >>13770
I think an extended edition
in the fullness of time
, maybe after the 2nd ed., would be great if it included just basic definitions, further readings, *but* to prevent scope creep use the contents of the BBOC as the framework (so not just randomly throwing stuff in just because).
Anonymous 2022-11-28 (Mon) 12:26:17 No. 13774
Holy shit! This is insane!
I'm thinking of printing and binding this book.
I found this:
I don't have linux, but the rest of the instructions seem like DIY stuff I can manage, cause I usually suck at this shit.
I'm even thinking if I manage to find time and find it's straight forward, maybe I could send some to anons here, but I need to investigate how to send things anonymously, and maybe nobody wants to get sent shit by randos on the internet. For sure I will try this for myself.
Anonymous 2022-11-28 (Mon) 12:39:36 No. 13775
>>13774 >I'm thinking of printing and binding this book.
Very cool, but hold off on that for a while if it costs you money, see >>1282157
But if you just want to make one for fun, please do and post pic :D
>tfw your art ideas make it to the cover :D
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-11-28 (Mon) 14:12:41 No. 13777
a chapter on global warming might be prudent. estimates for the number of people who will die range from 100,000,000 to at least 1,000,000,000. add to this the 40 or so million who die from starvation and treatable diseases every year
1) I'd suggest waiting for the first proofreading pass to be done. on the other hand printing might be useful for proofreading
2) you probably want to compile it as A5 rather than A4 if you're going to print and bind it as folio. this requires changing font size and margins however. hmm
you can use Windows Subsystem for Linux (WSL) to install a suitable distro alongside windows. Debian should have everything you need
Anonymous 2022-11-28 (Mon) 15:54:45 No. 13778
based anon, thanks for doing this
BBOCAnon 2022-11-28 (Mon) 19:15:25 No. 13779
Reposting few ideas from last thread when it comes to enhancements. And a few I thought about.
Some Vietnamese Anon made the remark that the chapter dedicated to Vietnam mainly speaks of the eponymous war between the North and the South, and ignores the awful shit from the colonial era and the US puppet South Vietnam republic (see last thread for exerpt. Shit's hardcore.), he was nice enough to link something from the Vietnamese Internet, but when I tried to machine tl it, I got garbage I couldn't clean by myself since I don't speak Vietnamese myself.
So unless someone got some Western or at least already translated material, this particular subject will be on hold until VietAnon is done with his own projects (If he's reading, I'm still hype for Hô Chih Minh's book translation. Plus the wikipedia stuff)
LaTex posted something related to the degradation of UK's population health under neoliberalism.
I think the Irak chapter deserve a
update, the book was published five years before the 2nd Gulf War. It's truly a caricatural illustration of US's imperialism.
East Timor situation changed a bit. I don't know enough about it to estimate If a whole chapter would be made out of it, but at least a few line to report on the evolution would be nice.
A third kind of footnotes linking to an endbook dictionnary? Or some changes to the bibliography maybe?
A global warming chapter could be great. But it need extra rigor in its making.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-11-28 (Mon) 20:43:48 No. 13780
a dictionary may be useful for hard-to-translate terms
Anonymous 2022-11-28 (Mon) 20:47:11 No. 13781
>>13779 >A third kind of footnotes linking to an endbook dictionnary?
I like the idea of having same-page footnotes to indicate the original word(s) in a tricky translation, with an appendix acting as a dictionary of those terms.
Anonymous 2022-11-29 (Tue) 05:38:57 No. 13783
Oh yeah I’m here on the translation of the organizing planning and commune coop building chapter of Ho’s pamphlet. I would appreciate corrections especially the French Revolution parts due to ancient Transliteration of French into indochinese french of that time.
Proofreader Anon "Comrade Jeb!" 2022-11-29 (Tue) 05:58:02 No. 13784
Holy smokes, this project is actually happening, cheers anon!
Count me in as another proofreader. I was actually involved in our abortive translation project for Kautsky's history of the French Revolution, so I have experience. This book I think is a much better candidate for translation, for two reasons: 1. The book is already a collection of essays by several different authors. This helps a lot if we're going to crowdsource aspects of it, since you're not expected to have a unified "voice" between chapters. It may be a good idea to try to assign proofreaders to specific authors, however. 2. The book is mostly agitation against the atrocities of capitalism, and therefore not a work where theoretical precision is paramount. Therefore a better choice for a fan translation than the Kautsky book - we could produce a readable English manuscript, yes, but not something you can be assured is a precise translation of Kautsky's theoretical work. For a book that formed so many revolutionaries' conception of the landmark revolution before 1917, accuracy is important, and I started to get scared that we were poisoning the commercial viability of a professional translation of the German text. Anyway, I'm here for proofreading of any chapters of the Black Book. I am a native American English speaker with little to no knowledge of French, however I do have experience with digging up French passages for translators to check. Two more quick suggestions: 1. Proofreaders should choose an alias so that the editor doesn't lose track of who did what chapter. I've already picked "Comrade Jeb!" for myself. We can all be fully anonymous in the final product if that is preferred. 2. We should decide right at the outset whether the final product will use British English or American English. I've already noticed a discrepancy in the proofreading of the preface here, where "channeled", which is correct in American English, is corrected to the British spelling "channelled".
OP 2022-11-29 (Tue) 11:28:01 No. 13787
>>13782 >>13785 >>13786
Saving all these and will read it when I have time. Maybe after work or during the week end.
I just took a quick glance and it appears that some symbols are failing to be conveyed by my software though.
I guess stuff like â€œ are either quotation marks or guillements.
BBOCAnon 2022-11-29 (Tue) 11:28:54 No. 13788
Wrong name. Force of habit
Anonymous 2022-11-29 (Tue) 12:26:11 No. 13790
>>13780 >a dictionary may be useful for hard-to-translate terms
This too. Even as a separate BBOC Reading Guide doc perhaps?
Anonymous 2022-11-29 (Tue) 12:29:56 No. 13791
Proofreading Anon #3
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-11-29 (Tue) 12:39:11 No. 13792
it's an encoding issue. in Firefox do View -> Repair text encoding
plaintext UTF-8 needs a byte order mark (BOM) as the first character in the file to automagically detect as such. not all editors output that, in particular I don't think windows notepad does
Anonymous 2022-11-29 (Tue) 12:42:32 No. 13793
Oh yeah the ‘ symbol is fucking up when I redownload those files as well. Dunno why.
Anonymous 2022-11-30 (Wed) 06:09:39 No. 13795
Will you consider uploading this to somewhere else for archival purposes, such as libcom.org or library genesis
BBOCAnon 2022-11-30 (Wed) 06:58:37 No. 13796
Uhh, is there two identical chapters in the original also?
Anonymous 2022-11-30 (Wed) 07:32:39 No. 13797
>>13795 >such as libcom.org or library genesis
it will be so
Anonymous 2022-11-30 (Wed) 07:33:56 No. 13798
Is there a part in here about Australia?
I feel like I could give it a crack at proof reading and adding some ~extra~ sources (about Australia). No crediting unless/until I produce a doc. >Proofreading Anon #4?
BBOCAnon 2022-11-30 (Wed) 17:46:44 No. 13800
>>13784 >We should decide right at the outset whether the final product will use British English or American English.
That's a good point. Ideally, the most spoken language, or at least the language who will help reach the most minds.
A wild guess would be Burger English because American english basically colonized the Internet and Internet is where the work is most likely to spread, even if there are intiatives there and there to print it.
Unless someone have more arguments in favor of British english?
If the various proofreaders interested in this are split between Burgers and Bongs, you could always make one version of each is there is a real risk of misunderstanding from one or the other nation if it's in the other's language
Australia is mentionned a few times in the east timor chapter and in the migrations chapters. It doesn't have a chapter on its own though.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-01 (Thu) 17:58:38 No. 13801
I can never figure out what words are Burger English and which ones are Anglo English, but I can facilitate search-and-replace using sed. for example to change "labour" to "labor" just do this:
sed -e 's/labour/labor/g' -i *.tex
sometimes blanket replacement is not appropriate, for example when the book refers to the British Labour Party
for now if you list word replacements as s commands like above then they will be easiest to apply en masse. multiple commands can be chained by putting a semicolon between
and so on
Anonymous 2022-12-01 (Thu) 18:11:39 No. 13802
i think sed is too much in this case.
You could work with vim macros to allow manual checks.
makro find the next instance of the string to f
makro string substitution to r
- if string needs replacing press r,
- if not press f to skip to the next instance
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-01 (Thu) 18:23:04 No. 13803
true. I've sent corrections to marxists.org using sed scripts but then there's context with each correction so it only affects a single place
OP 2022-12-03 (Sat) 08:45:25 No. 13805
While waiting for news from proofreaders, I'm reading your translation VietAnon.
For starters, what >Diligent while still economical means? You have to be wary with money when you're active on your projects? Or is economical have a figurative meaning like in french? As it not being exhuberent, or being humble? >if you don't try your best, how can you? It seems the ending of the sentence os a bit abrupt? Would adding something like " how can expect achieving this?" "how can you hope to succeed?" betray the text? Are the definitions and clarifications between brackets ([ X ]) your doing or Ho Chi Minh's? >natioanlist >dideology Typos?
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-03 (Sat) 16:25:34 No. 13806
since I can't do much for proofreading I've been sketching an extended edition. for now I added VietAnon's text as-is. also using a different cover to keep them apart. see pdf related. will push what I have in a separate branch
is there an original pdf that one can look at for reference how paragraphs, sections etc are split up?
what should the chapter be called?
added Comrade Jeb! to list of proofreaders. also haven't heard more from #2. might be easier to keep track of if all proofreaders pick names as you suggest
OP 2022-12-03 (Sat) 17:28:42 No. 13807
VietAnon's text is Ho Chi Minh's pamphlet Road to revolution. It's a book on its own.
He linked the original here
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-03 (Sat) 19:51:21 No. 13808
looking more closely at it, maybe it would be more appropriate as a separate book? much of the boilerplate for the BBOC could be reused in a separate repo for this book.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-03 (Sat) 20:03:39 No. 13809
it strikes me that smaller pamphlet-type books are especially suitable for DIY binding since the limited number of pages means they can be printed as a single batch, folded, then sewn or even just stapled.
a local person I met a couple of weeks ago collects old socialist pamphlets and whatnot. some of these are studies in absolute economies of print, sometimes consisting of a single quarto or octavo leaf, folded but not cut. I saw one that had the cover stapled to such a set of leafs. presumably the reader is supposed to make the cuts themselves
OP 2022-12-03 (Sat) 20:03:41 No. 13810
Yes it would be better I think.
OP 2022-12-03 (Sat) 20:06:24 No. 13811
Well making it easy to spread anywhere was one of the goals.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-04 (Sun) 17:06:30 No. 13812
I went and created a repo for the Ho Chi Minh text:
I see a lot of tempus issues in this translation. past and present tense are mixed. I have done my best to try and make that a bit better
as an experiment I have made the layout A5 with smallish margins in the hope of saving on paper when printed as folio. this first part is 10 pages compared to the original 14 pages
in places where there is a semicolon; I have made the following word not capitalized since it is part of the same sentence; like so rather than; Like so.
I have marked corrections in
red >Why must be revolutionary if we want to live?
be revolutionary if we want to live?
>Why is the revolution a matter of everyone, not a matter of one or two individual?
Why is the revolution a matter of everyone, not a matter of one or two individual
>What is to do in a revolution?
What is to
in a revolution?
>it owns factories and make goods
it owns factories and
>If you have factories, they want more workers to work for them to operate machineries. If you create products, they want more people to buy from them.
If you have factories,
want more workers to work
them to operate machineries. If you create products,
want more people to buy
>it wants to keep the feudal system they want
to keep the feudal system
>After they taken all the goods and rights of the people, when there is a war, it forces the people to die as their cannonfodders
taken all the goods and rights of the people, when there is a war, it forces the people to die as their
cannon fodder >and then taxing the families of those conscipted. If you win, they will benefit, if you lose, you will die lose all that you have.
the families of those
. If you win, they will benefit, if you lose, you will die
lose all that you have.
>join forces to drive away their oppressors joined
forces to drive away their oppressors
>travel on his horses traveled
on his horses
when >the stronger the revolutionary the revolutionary will
the stronger the revolutionary will
>from this they gained their bravery
from this they
>has been thousands of years old and build a new one. is
thousands of years old and
build a new one.
>So a revolution had to explain theory and dideology
So a revolution
to explain theory and
ideology >thise strategies these
some things I found grammatically iffy but that I have made no change to yet:
>Bringing the revolutionary history of other countries as an example to learn from. >Bringing the world movement to the eyes of our compatriots. >To know who is our friend?
the meaning is clear, but the exact wording is not quite right for English I think
>To the merchants, how much tax they will collect is completely of their whims with no measure or restraints
"they" should maybe be replaced with "the landlords"
>When a country that relies on strength comes to conquer a weak country, governs its people by force, and takes all economic and political rights. The people of that country have lost both their freedom and independence, and the more they make, the more they are plundered by those powers.
maybe: When a country that relies on strength comes to conquer a weak country, it comes to govern its people by force, and to take all economic and political rights. The people of that country lose both their freedom and independence, and the more they make (produce? work?), the more they are plundered by those powers.
>every day til the end of the year
til here could be until, till or 'til but not til. not sure what is appropriate
>Just as Annam fight the French,
fights or fought?
>But those 2 Revolutions
not sure if revolutions should be capitalized here. I see the original text has it capitalized. perhaps "two Revolutions" looks less strange here. I think it is improper in English to use numbers for quantities below 13 or so if I remember my English education correctly.
sometimes this is spelled An Nam. perhaps we should stick to one or the other
>Therefore, the Annam Revolution and the French Revolution had to communicate with each other.
Therefore, the Annam Revolution and the French Revolution has(?) to communicate with each other.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-04 (Sun) 20:21:33 No. 13813 >>13812
here is a rough version of the entire pamphlet. 64 pages. the section COOPERATIVE is not in the original text, at least not in the pdf. I have done my best paragraphing it
>3. Don't be a narcissist because of your abilities (1) you are smarter, your salary is higher, but that doesn’t mean you can despise people for being clumsy or earn less money than you. >3,000(2) samples each
here are footnotes but they are not delineated
>In the Party, any person who does any job, a worker or a peasant
there is a footnote in this paragraph which is missing in the translation
>National Congress of Unions (1)
here is also a missing footnote
>1 sample = 5000 m² = 0.5 acre.
hectare is probably meant here, or 1.25 acres
OP 2022-12-04 (Sun) 20:58:49 No. 13814
Great Job! now waiting for VietAnon to chime in for feedback.
Anonymous 2022-12-05 (Mon) 02:01:43 No. 13815
Translating poetry sucks honestly. It's extremely easy for stuff to get lost in translation.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-05 (Mon) 02:13:34 No. 13816
managed to squeeze it into 40 pages mostly thanks to \twocolumn and fiddling with margins
VietAnon check it out
Anonymous 2022-12-05 (Mon) 02:42:26 No. 13817 >>13805 >The original is: "hòa mà không tư" which means being "diligent while not caring about personal benefits" >It seems the ending of the sentence os a bit abrupt? Would adding something like " how can expect achieving this?" "how can you hope to succeed?" betray the text?
Okay I'll fix it right away. Thanks.
I think "Live" should be replced with "survive" to be a little more fitting. What do you think?
For chapter 2
The section on coops is in this. Mostly the entire text was preserved in the Court of Indochina with the coop texts being blurred.
Here's the more complete documents:
The site is also the biggest and most comprehensive archive of all Vietnamese communist texts, Since it is directly operated by the government.
>fights or fought?
Probably fights as the struggle was still ongoing as the time of the pamphlet's creation.
>>13813 >here are footnotes but they are not delineated
The footnote: "This part was blurred by water damage, so this complete statistics is speculative."
>acres and hectares
Yeah here it is used as the same thing, so i'll change it
>national congress of unions
the footnote is: [can be understood as the "National federation of labor unions"]
I think the original format is more readable but this is pretty good as well.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-05 (Mon) 02:56:29 No. 13818
>I think the original format is more readable but this is pretty good as well.
yeah it's admittedly a bit cramped. I checked some books I have and they have around 30-40 pages per bunch. I got kinda inspired by bookbinding anon so maybe I will print and sew a twocolumn print just for me
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-05 (Mon) 02:56:56 No. 13819
also it's super late here, not sure why I'm still up
OP 2022-12-05 (Mon) 06:55:03 No. 13821
Maybe you could add a footnote to signal the original is poetry ?
Anonymous 2022-12-06 (Tue) 01:31:00 No. 13824 >>13821
I’ll try to do 2 versions. One word for word and the other meaning focus.
Anonymous 2022-12-06 (Tue) 01:39:34 No. 13825
what does the text in the window say?
Anonymous 2022-12-06 (Tue) 01:48:25 No. 13826
Does it show a final death tally?
Anonymous 2022-12-06 (Tue) 05:29:20 No. 13827
Oh it’s also a famous communist poem about the author’s experience being enlightened by the revolution and joining the party.
Anonymous 2022-12-06 (Tue) 08:29:42 No. 13828
interesting, very nice.
BBOCAnon 2022-12-06 (Tue) 12:09:48 No. 13829
Chapter 33 have a list. But non exhaustive. Plus it ignores everything that happened the last 20 years since the book was published in the late 90's
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-06 (Tue) 14:10:15 No. 13830
I read the entire thing yesterday, making minor corrections at the moment
how is the math example in the Cooperatives section supposed to work? how many dimes are in a dong? for reference the current text is
>Example: Each barrel of kerosene (cost 3 dong, get 50 liters) Traders would dillute it into 53 liters. Each household buy a liter and pay a dime, the oil spoiled, so it burn out fast. All in all traders can profit by: >1 steel barrel 0đ20 >23 liters of dilluted oil 2đ30 >Summing up in 2đ50 >53 houses at a loss: 2đ50 and 53 hours. >If those 53 houses pooled together to send one person to buy a barrel, it would have saved 2d50, and the time that goes with it. Use those 53 hours to do something more productive work.
from this I get 1đ0 = 0đ24
1đ0 = 0đ100 depending on how I count. the former I get from (50/53*3 - 2)^-1 = 1.2 and some other stuff that I forget
is the 23 a typo? where does the 53 come from? (also what is the kerosene diluted with? this is more a curiosity of mine)
let's say cents instead. 1x 23 liter barrel = 20 cents, diluted oil to fill it with = 230 cents -> 250 cents
53 houses would need just over two such barrels, say three, for a total of 3*20 + 530 = 590 cents
one undiluted barrel clearly costs 300 cents, presumably including the barrel itself, and this is enough for 53 houses -> 290 cents saved
maybe uncle Ho doesn't count the two barrels needed to fetch the extra kerosene, or the barrel is reused? if it's reused then what I have two lines up is 550 cents not 590 and so the saving do indeed come to 550 - 300 = 250 cents. so the 23 and 53 just make the money numbers sort of convenient because an empty barrel costs 20 cents and 23+2 = 25, 53+2 = 55 and humans like such numbers because we have 5 fingers per hand (most of us anyway)
Anonymous 2022-12-07 (Wed) 00:11:31 No. 13831
Kerosene back then was often dilluted with straight water (colonial indochina just sucked ass like that).
Hào is translated into a dime because each is worth 0.1 đồng. So using bullshit dillutions and 30% profit margins for selling costs.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-07 (Wed) 14:56:22 No. 13832
kerosene isn't even miscible with water. has to suck for those getting the last couple of liters
5đ30 / 3đ0 - 1 = 77% profit
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-08 (Thu) 18:25:03 No. 13833
a thought struck me: how many excess covid deaths are due to patents on the vaccines? perhaps people in COVAX would know
BBOCAnon 2022-12-08 (Thu) 21:29:14 No. 13834
Why stop at Covid? Commodification and intellectual property of medicine is a cancer that would well deserve a chapter.
Anonymous 2022-12-08 (Thu) 22:24:44 No. 13835
Wasn't there a clearer cover image posted at some point? I remember one where you could see the chapel which looked pretty cool.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-08 (Thu) 23:32:38 No. 13836
sure. lack of access to basic health care is responsible for ~20M excess deaths per year
Anonymous 2022-12-10 (Sat) 01:47:54 No. 13840
Quick correction the book is published in 1927 and is a compilation of Ho’s lectures in China from 1925 to 1927.
Also why is some pages are upside down?
Anonymous 2022-12-10 (Sat) 01:55:18 No. 13841
so, does it worth it?
BBOCAnon 2022-12-10 (Sat) 08:59:55 No. 13842 >>13840
Looking at the chapter about liberal revolutions. You had fears about translitarations but I don't see weird stuff when it comes to this.
But I have a few questions and I'd like to make a few precisions about french history. Ho Chi Minh makes quite some shortcuts and simplifications since he was building revolution, not writing academic work. I don't think it's pertinent to include that in the work but since I'm autistic about this, I'll rant about it at least here.
>On the other hand, educated men like Montesquieu (1755), Voltaire and Rousseau (1778) propagated liberal egalitarianism.
1 Is there any particular reason only the year of thoses Enlightment era thinker's deaths are quoted? Usually both year of birth and year of birth are quoted in that kind of context. Maybe the conventions are different in Vietnamese?
2 Montesquieu, Voltaire and Rousseau all contributed to liberal thought, but egalitarianism only really apply to Rousseau's thought.
>On October 5 of that year, the workers and women of Paris, went to Versailles to arrest the king for his crimes
Believe it or not, back then even though the people resented the nobility, the king himself was kinda liked. Parisians didn't come to arrest the king but to make demands to him related to food shortages and to ratify the new constitution. The divorce happened between Louis XVI and french people a few years later. As Ho's write after that:
>In 1792, because the king sought help from foreigners and communicated with the counter-revolutionaries, the people deposed the king and founded a republic.
What truly sealed his fate is that he tried to flee in Austria (the birth country of his wife) but was caught on the way because one of some organisational fuck ups and also because a postmaster recognized his face from a coin (pic rel 1)
>Although the French people had little food and lack of guns, it was only thanks to their courage to fight with their lives on the line that they suppressed the internal rebellion and destroyed the foreign coaltions. At that time, the soldiers were called "Sans-culottes" or soldiers without breeches, who are without hats, people without shoes, torn shirts and tassels, thin faces and hungry stomachs. But wherever the soldiers went, the foreign soldiers lost, because they were so daring to sacrifice, no one could fought back with equal fevor.
Motivated patriots fighting with their hearts against lukewarm mercenaries is what I've been taught in shool. Altough of course there is a bit more to it. Motivation played a part but it's wrong to say they had no guns (To get guns was the point of seizing the Bastille). Plus the french army under revolutionnary command benefitted from military innovations of the Ancien Régime's royal army it was build upon (Artillery refroms of Gribeauval which came in handy to BTFO Prussians in Valmy) and the premises of modern conscription. Also did you mean fervor?
>From 1792 to 1804 it was the 1st Republic. In 1804 counter-revolutionary Napoleon crowned himself emperor. In 1814, the countries defeated Napoleon and brought the old king line to the throne until 1848.
In 1848 there was the second revolution.
There was also a revolution in 1830 (it was this one which inspired pic rel 2), but since It just ended with a change of dynasty and a more liberal monarchy rather than a complete regime change, I guess the author didn't judge it that interesting to mention.
>In 1871, with the French king lost and fled,
Napoleon III was technically emperor, not king. Do the original use a generic word for autocrat that doesn't make the distinction?
>When the French had just surrendered, the Germans forced France to disband all their soldiers, keeping only 40,000 culottes.
Culottes as sans-culotte so a metaphor for militia men? I'm not sure what Ho Chi Minh meant here.
Anonymous 2022-12-10 (Sat) 12:52:13 No. 13843
>>13840 >Also why is some pages are upside down?
they're for Australians
Anonymous 2022-12-11 (Sun) 04:15:33 No. 13844
>>13842 >1 Is there any particular reason only the year of thoses Enlightment era thinker's deaths are quoted? Usually both year of birth and year of birth are quoted in that kind of context. Maybe the conventions are different in Vietnamese?
Unlike the west in Vietnamese culture, deathdays are highly regarded because it’s meaningful to celebrate the person’s accomplishment throughout their life. Birthdays are less like to have anniversary than death days and years. It’s a fairly common tradition in the East. For some further reading.
http://scootersaigontour.com/death-anniversary-in-vietnam/ >2 Montesquieu, Voltaire and Rousseau all contributed to liberal thought, but egalitarianism only really apply to Rousseau's thought.
Regarding this the original translation was more generalized as “liberal and egalitarian thoughts”. The reason all three men are mentioned was because they’re the most popular figures in indochinese education regarding enlightenment colonial historiography. The French authorities also used their names for roads, locations and propaganda for the French exceptionalism propaganda.
>What truly sealed his fate is that he tried to flee in Austria (the birth country of his wife) but was caught on the way because one of some organisational fuck ups and also because a postmaster recognized his face from a coin
Plus on the way Louis couldn’t stop asking for pastries which Madrid a dead giveaway to their hideouts.
>Napoleon III was technically emperor, not king. Do the original use a generic word for autocrat that doesn't make the distinction?
In Vietnam, the term “king” or “vua” is often used to generally discuss about any autocrat or monarch. I think what Ho meant here is that he considered Napoleon III to be lesser than his uncle following Marx’s comments on history repeating itself and napoleon III being a farce to napoleon I’s tragedy.
>Culottes as sans-culotte so a metaphor for militia men? I'm not sure what Ho Chi Minh meant here.
Probably militias after the Austrian victory.
BBOCAnon 2022-12-11 (Sun) 08:38:13 No. 13845
>>13844 >Unlike the west in Vietnamese culture, deathdays are highly regarded because it’s meaningful to celebrate the person’s accomplishment throughout their life.
I think it deserve a footnote then. That's quite the difference compared to western customs and it might be confusing for western readers.
>Regarding this the original translation was more generalized as “liberal and egalitarian thoughts”.
Is there any reason not to choose this expression over liberal egalitarianism?
>In Vietnam, the term “king” or “vua” is often used to generally discuss about any autocrat or monarch. I think what Ho meant here is that he considered Napoleon III to be lesser than his uncle following Marx’s comments on history repeating itself and napoleon III being a farce to napoleon I’s tragedy.
Would "ruler" or "lord" still work? I'm afraid that this nuance would be kinda lost in translation. Or maybe a footnote about vua?
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-11 (Sun) 10:57:12 No. 13846 >>13844
I see parts of the translation uses "acres". should these not also be samples?
I got around to being able to build both versions of the pamphlet (single column and two column) using the same branch, see pdfs attached. the twocolumn-book is for printing
there's still some typos to fix that I noticed while proofreading
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-11 (Sun) 10:59:39 No. 13847
also I turned all places where the text goes
into proper enumerations. this mostly means they get typeset a bit nicer. had to fiddle a bunch with margin crap to get it to look right, but that only needs to be done once in the preamble and then LaTeX does its magic for the entire text
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-11 (Sun) 22:40:27 No. 13848
I fixed a bunch of obvious spelling and grammar mistakes. some notes:
>In the past, no one understood the biological principles in the change all life In the past, no one understood the biological principles in the change of all life >In 1917, on February 23, women in the Russian capital surfaced In 1917, on February 23, women in the Russian capital shouted >The people of that land are Indians, hunters and gatherers who do not know how to commerce and do business. "how to commerce" could be worded better I think, but I'm not quite sure how >In the 14th century, no one knew where the American continent was. In 1492, a merchant named Christopher Colombus went on a trade ship to India, but lost his way, but fortunately landed in the Americas. The people of that land are Indians, hunters and gatherers who do not know how to commerce and do business. this paragraph looks ahistorical, especially ignoring Leif Erikson >A year later, on July 4, 1776, the revolution was achieved and the United States declared its independence, and it became a republic. this is also a bit iffy since the war lasts between 1775-1783 >Yet the people of Annam have not from the United States example to state a revolution! wording >How many private enterprises are taken over as public property what is meant here? >Thanks to the two men to correct the program wording >Because many people mistakenly believe that capital will return to its prosperity like before the European war. wording >See in the organization of the Third International, there is a separate ministry, dedicated to researching and helping the revolution in Asia - Far East. See? >The slogan for that week was: "Asking for women's suffrage". really only "asking"? >The reformist factions only advocated for trade union support of the political parties, but it should merge with the political party. who are "they" here? parties? >Communists, with the policy of overthrowing capital and that workers is the revolutionary foundation, there must be a political party to lead the trade union to do the revolution. the wording here is a bit awkward >(for fear that the capital of the other country would outcompete their capital). it as well. ? >In the new language, counter-revolution is called yellow color; and revolution is called red. maybe "In the new language, yellow is the color of counter-revolution; red is the color of revolution." >Annam: 000. why is this "000"? >Other than that, it is possible to set up a study groups, a football associations, or hobby association to select comrades and propagate. propagandize? >There are two ways of organizing, the organizing by trade and organizing by production. there is probably a better word to use for the latter, like industrial unionism >If this limit needed to be strictly, less it will cause confusion. ? >With both horizontal and vertical organizations, then according to which orders of the horizontal general union or the vertical general union to follow? wording >But our peasants are very miserable, there is no job to work does this mean wage work? >If you calculate all the money to rent for cattle, buy manure, hire a job hire a hand? as in a farmhand >Those who enter must volunteer to keep the rules of the association, and must be introduced by former members. existing members? >Peasants' association should set a sub-group or not? ?
Anonymous 2022-12-12 (Mon) 01:11:09 No. 13849 >>13845 >Is there any reason not to choose this expression over liberal egalitarianism?
It's more generalized I think.
>Would "ruler" or "lord" still work? I'm afraid that this nuance would be kinda lost in translation. Or maybe a footnote about vua?
I don't think it will be needed asthe general purpose of the pamphlet is a quick introduction into the history behind contemporary relevant revolutions.
>>13848 >"how to commerce" could be worded better I think, but I'm not quite sure how
"The ways of commerce and doing business" could work.
>this paragraph looks ahistorical, especially ignoring Leif Erikson
Most of the research regarding the viking settlement of Vinlands was done in the 1960s, 30 years after the pamphlet was written. I think this section could be regarded as a relic of its time, similar to marx's analysis on asian feudalism and primitive communism.
>this is also a bit iffy since the war lasts between 1775-1783
He probably set it at the date of the approval of the declaration of independence. Which makes sense considering Vietnam's independence date was also set at February 2nd 1945, even the though the war raged on until April 30th 1975.
"Yet the people of Annam have not learnt from the United States' example to stage a revolution of their own!" would flow better
>Thanks to the two men to correct the program
"Thanks to them the slogan was corrected into"
>Because many people mistakenly believe that capital will return to its prosperity like before the European war. The Congress clearly testified that prosperity was false prosperity
"As oppose to some at the time still mistakenly believe that capitalism will return to it's golden age before the European War, The congress had clearly shown that prosperity to be a farce."
"As seen by" could be a better word to use there.
>really only "asking"?
Probably "demmanding" would be a better fit. The word "đòi" and how forceful it is is heavily dependent on the context of the sentence and paragraph. It could range from demmanding to petitioning.
>The reformist factions only advocated for trade union support of the political parties, but it should merge with the political party.
Yeah there was a mistake here: "The reformist factions only advocated for trade union to support political parties, rather than working in tandem or merging with the political party."
>Communists, with the policy of overthrowing capital and that workers is the revolutionary foundation, there must be a political party to lead the trade union to do the revolution.
Agreed, probably need a rewording "The Communists, with the political line of overthrowing capital and using workers as the revolutionary foundation, proposed that a political party to lead the trade union in a revolution was a must.
"the Government delegate of those countries asked the other countries to also use 8 hours as a common practice (for fear that the capital of the other country would outcompete their capital) as well."
>maybe "In the new language, yellow is the color of counter-revolution; red is the color of revolution."
Makes sense to me.
>why is this "000"?
Probably to explicitly imply that the labor union movements in Annam was still so small that no one joined it yet.
>If this limit needed to be strictly, less it will cause confusion
"If this limit in joining unions isn't strictly followed, it can cause a lot of confusion in organizing"
>With both horizontal and vertical organizations, then according to which orders of the horizontal general union or the vertical general union to follow?
"With both horizontal and vertical organizing, then according to which line of orders should a member operate under?"
>does this mean wage work?
More like feudal style artisanal crafts. So maybe the word "craft" could be a better fit?
>hire a hand? as in a farmhand
>Peasants' association should set a sub-group or not?
"Should peasants' association form sub-groups as well?"
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-12 (Mon) 12:36:53 No. 13850 >>13849 >"The ways of commerce and doing business" could work. >"Yet the people of Annam have not learnt from the United States' example to stage a revolution of their own!" would flow better >the Government delegate of those countries asked the other countries to also use 8 hours as a common practice (for fear that the capital of the other country would outcompete their capital) as well. >In the new language, yellow is the color of counter-revolution; red is the color of revolution. >propagandize >If this limit in joining unions isn't strictly followed, it can cause a lot of confusion in organizing >With both horizontal and vertical organizing, then according to which line of orders should a member operate under? >existing members
went with these suggestions as-is
>Most of the research regarding the viking settlement of Vinlands was done in the 1960s, 30 years after the pamphlet was written. I think this section could be regarded as a relic of its time, similar to marx's analysis on asian feudalism and primitive communism.
I'll leave it as-is then. anal readers like myself will know this anyway
>"Thanks to them the slogan was corrected into"
this misses that they also changed the program. going with this for now: "Thanks to them the program and slogans were corrected to: overthrow of the bourgeoisie - establishment of the rule of the proletariat - the construction of a communist world."
>"As oppose to some at the time still mistakenly believe that capitalism will return to it's golden age before the European War, The congress had clearly shown that prosperity to be a farce."
fix the misspelling of opposed. total sentence is: "As opposed to some at the time still mistakenly believe that capitalism will return to it's golden age before the European War, the Congress had clearly shown that prosperity to be a farce; in fact, capital in the world is close to an end, and the revolutionary workers and peasants must be ready to take action."
>"As seen by" could be a better word to use there.
went with "As seen in"
>Probably "demmanding" would be a better fit. The word "đòi" and how forceful it is is heavily dependent on the context of the sentence and paragraph. It could range from demmanding to petitioning.
went with "demanding women's suffrage" since the suffragist movement was quite forceful
>Yeah there was a mistake here: "The reformist factions only advocated for trade union to support political parties, rather than working in tandem or merging with the political party."
corrected union to unions: "The reformist factions only advocated for trade unions to support political parties, rather than working in tandem or merging with the political party."
>Agreed, probably need a rewording "The Communists, with the political line of overthrowing capital and using workers as the revolutionary foundation, proposed that a political party to lead the trade union in a revolution was a must.
did the same thing here with plural unions: "The Communists, with the political line of overthrowing capital and using workers as the revolutionary foundation, proposed that a political party to lead the trade unions in a revolution was a must."
>Probably to explicitly imply that the labor union movements in Annam was still so small that no one joined it yet.
right, this is only 1927. other parts of the text is damaged by water so I was worried that maybe it was originally 1,000 or something. I'd have expected just a single 0 if it was truly zero, but I'm a math person
>More like feudal style artisanal crafts. So maybe the word "craft" could be a better fit?
went with "there is no craft work"
>>hire a hand? as in a farmhand >Yeah definitely
reads like this now: "If you calculate all the money to rent for cattle, buy manure, hire farmhands, and pay for food and drink"
>"Should peasants' association form sub-groups as well?"
plural: "Should peasants' associations form sub-groups as well?"
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-12 (Mon) 12:39:10 No. 13851
also it'd be nice if a native burger or brit took a look at this since English is a second language for me. but we're getting pretty close to no glaring problems
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-12 (Mon) 12:40:37 No. 13852
also I think we could embellish the front with some graphics, but I'm not sure what would be appropriate. there's a bit of space on the last page as well for something
Anonymous 2022-12-12 (Mon) 14:24:07 No. 13853
Oh yeah, I’m not too familiar with localizing of figures of speech
Anonymous 2022-12-12 (Mon) 14:36:07 No. 13854
This will be required reading under socialism.
Comrade Jeb! 2022-12-14 (Wed) 09:22:06 No. 13855
I can give it a read through (native burger). Is there anything in particular that you want me to pay attention to?
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-14 (Wed) 09:33:46 No. 13856
don't know actually. just give it a once-over
Comrade Jeb! 2022-12-14 (Wed) 10:40:40 No. 13857
It'll be a day or two. Would it be possible for you to put up a word doc or similar that I can easily just write some colored notes into? It'd make proofreading a lot faster. Hypothetically I could also just correct some of the obvious errors like mispellings without comment.
I've just skimmed over the text very lightly, and here are some comments:
"Parts of the revolution"
I see this word a lot, and my first thought is that it should be "stages" of the revolution. "Stageism" is a loaded word in Marxist theory and I think we should take care with sections dealing with it, because the question of whether communists in colonial countries thought there must be a bourgeois revolution before a socialist revolution, etc. is an important theme of this pamphlet.
Also, I have to say, wow, Ho makes a lot of factual mistakes in his historical overview. I'd be interested to see what sources he drew from in writing this, if possible.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-14 (Wed) 11:14:40 No. 13858
you can actually annotate pdfs. otherwise just a plaintext document or greentext your corrections like I have. anything really. or do you mean for more editing-friendly on your end? you might want to set up git
>Also, I have to say, wow, Ho makes a lot of factual mistakes in his historical overview.
yes I noticed this as well
Anonymous 2022-12-15 (Thu) 00:44:31 No. 13859 >>13857 >I have to say, wow, Ho makes a lot of factual mistakes in his historical overview.
A lot of the stuff he made mistakes of came from modern historical reviews that highlighted the colonial injustices of western historiography. Back in 1920s I think there's not even many studies that even talked about how Colombus was an evil slave trader.
Oh yeah. Ho openly called for the complete liquidation of Trotskyists stemming from them collaborating with Japan and being snitches in China. So at the time of writing in 1924 I don't think he even care at all if its loaded or not.
Something to note that this animosity only strengthened over time especially after the fall of Sai Gon where Trots refused to join the united front and caused chaos battling both the British and the Vietminh provisional government which led to the British - French coalition capture of the city (with it most of southern Vietnam). After that, the Vietminh policies towards Trots was to "shoot on sight".
>I'd be interested to see what sources he drew from in writing this, if possible.
Considering it's a pamphlet. It's kinda impossible to find sources from as it is a shorterned version (technically a glossary) of a 6 month training course for communists in Guǎngzhōu. The premise is to draw people in with the pamphlet then for official political education for later.
Comrade Jeb! 2022-12-15 (Thu) 01:37:08 No. 13860 >>13859
If Ho is writing in 1924 I think that'd predate any kind of animus towards "Trotskyism". The charge of "Trotskyism" only really became a thing after Trotsky published
Lessons of October
in late 1924, which basically accused his political rivals Stalin, Kamenev and Zinoviev of scabbing for the Mensheviks in the Russian Revolution. This prompted what is known as the "literary debate" trying to refute Trotsky's charges. Either way, it took quite a while for "Trotskyite" to become a political swear word, at least until the early 1930s (in the USA at least).
More on Trotskyism - it's heavily associated with the Anglosphere nowadays, but when Trotsky himself led the movement his main base was in the colonial world - in LatAm, Vietnam, and especially China, because of Trotsky's commentaries on the failed Shanghai revolution. I'm kind of curious to what extent Vietnamese Trotskyism transferred over from their Trot friends in the CPC.
Also, this is off topic, but I was really surprised just how scant Marxist literature was in China during formation of the CPC. There were only a handful of pamphlets available that were translated into Chinese (Mao for example was radicalized by a sloppy Chinese translation of a sloppy English translation of Kautsky's book on the Erfurt Program). Nearly all information on Marxism was filtered through elite intellectuals who were educated directly in Russia. It took until the late 1930s, after all the Trotskyists had been expelled, that they could finally produce the first Chinese translations for foundational Marxist texts like
I'll try to get my first proofread pass done by tomorrow.
Anonymous 2022-12-15 (Thu) 02:31:40 No. 13861
>>13860 >Either way, it took quite a while for "Trotskyite" to become a political swear word, at least until the early 1930s (in the USA at least).
Yep but even back then Ho was trying to incorporate 2 stage solutions in anti colonial struggles with world revolution. Some thing which made him a direct opposite of Trotsky and in some way against Stalin as well.
https://www.marxists.org/history/etol/document/vietnam/pirani/hochiminh.htm >I'm kind of curious to what extent Vietnamese Trotskyism transferred over from their Trot friends in the CPC.
They had almost no connections with the Chinese trots. Most were PCF members that split following Stalin's coming to power. More or less they were concerned about the 3rd international's support for the kuomintang at the beginning.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-15 (Thu) 02:47:26 No. 13862 >>13859 >Trots refused to join the united front and caused chaos battling both the British and the Vietminh provisional government
trot -> fash pipeline confirmed
>After that, the Vietminh policies towards Trots was to "shoot on sight".
by the way do you have any contact with Luna Oi? maybe we can get a copy of the translation to her and EJ for feedback. considering EJ is a burger that may be ideal
>>13861 >the 3rd international's support for the kuomintang
Anonymous 2022-12-15 (Thu) 03:10:16 No. 13863 >>13862 >trot -> fash pipeline confirmed
Their flag literally looked exactly like the Brtish Union of Fascists flag and the Singaporean PAP under Lee Kwan Yew.
>by the way do you have any contact with Luna Oi? maybe we can get a copy of the translation to her and EJ for feedback. considering EJ is a burger that may be ideal
No because I often find the e-celeb crowd distasteful.
Throughout the second Sino-Japanese War (1937–45) Stalin instructed the Chinese Communist Party to support the Unified Front with the KMT against Japan, as Stalin wanted Japan to be bogged down in China and not free to attack the USSR. At the same time, the USSR supplied weapons and advisers to the KMT after the German advisers which had advised the KMT left China due to Japanese pressure. Another part of the relationship between the KMT and Stalin is that Chiang Ching-Kuo, the son of Chiang Kai-Shek was attending university at Moscow in the 1930s, and was so much influenced by this experienced that he in fact petitioned to Stalin for membership in the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, which Stalin denied.
This was the true genesis of the Sino Soviet split. I would have happened either way, revisionism or not.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-15 (Thu) 14:41:13 No. 13864
>>13863 >Their flag literally looked exactly like the Brtish Union of Fascists flag and the Singaporean PAP under Lee Kwan Yew.
>No because I often find the e-celeb crowd distasteful.
I'm more gesturing towards the fact that they're already in the process of translating Vietnamese texts to English
>the USSR supplied weapons and advisers to the KMT
oof. but also what can you do
Anonymous 2022-12-16 (Fri) 00:17:43 No. 13865
>>13864 >I'm more gesturing towards the fact that they're already in the process of translating Vietnamese texts to English
Oh yeah, it's great that she continues to translate Vietnamese shows and broadcast.
>but also what can you do
Despite what a lot of Grover Fur worshipper say, Stalin did a ton of stupid shit.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2022-12-16 (Fri) 00:33:24 No. 13866
>>13865 >Despite what a lot of Grover Fur worshipper say, Stalin did a ton of stupid shit.
true. but the more important question then is what should have been done differently? hm. anyway this is not the thread for such questions
Anonymous 2022-12-27 (Tue) 02:05:32 No. 13869
I would like to translate this to Portuguese once it's finished.
Anonymous 2022-12-27 (Tue) 02:14:28 No. 13870
After some consideration I've decided against it but I know someone who might be interested in taking the job
BBOCAnon 2022-12-27 (Tue) 11:41:13 No. 13871
While waiting for news from proofreaders of the BBOC, I'm considering translating Road to Revolution in french but I'm afraid I will bang my head against a wall when it comes to poetic parts.
Maybe I'll just stick to the meaning and add in footnotes that's poetry with rhymes and all in the original but it feels like a waste.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2023-01-03 (Tue) 23:37:31 No. 13872
new year's bump
not a bad idea, and would make good use of the LaTeX code we already have
Anonymous 2023-01-04 (Wed) 05:05:24 No. 13873
Don't forget to rest :)
Anonymous 2023-01-11 (Wed) 11:20:34 No. 13875
Pulling ones intestines out through ones anus.
Anonymous 2023-01-11 (Wed) 13:08:49 No. 13876
What the fuck, and I thought anal impalement was bad
BBOCAnon 2023-01-15 (Sun) 20:51:29 No. 13877 >>13874 >Pierre Brocheux et Daniel Hémery, Indochine, la colonisation ambiguë
I just got that in french. I'll post it in the following.
I'll translate it in the next weeks. There should be stuff interesting for the enhanced edition and will kill time until I got news from proofreaders.
Anonymous 2023-01-15 (Sun) 23:23:03 No. 13882
[also 'tech-illiterate' tends to be hyphenated]
Actually, if I notice any minor spelling/grammar/typo issues, should I make a pull request to the git repo, or just post them here?
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2023-01-16 (Mon) 01:28:38 No. 13883
if you know your way around git then it'll be easier if you just fix it immediately. I could give you push access to the repo if you like. undoing any bad commits is easy enough
also I just pushed some things I had laying around
>d5539d4 Also clean bboc.lot >bb7194b Add Comrade Jeb! to list of proofreaders >e5bbb46 Split intro.tex into separate files for each chapter >>13875 >Pulling ones intestines out through ones anus.
wtf man who thinks of this stuff?
Anonymous 2023-01-16 (Mon) 01:31:59 No. 13884 >>13875
And I thought the Howie Mandel shit was bad.
Nice where did you get this stuff. I would love to look for more stuff colonial era as reading material.
Anonymous 2023-01-16 (Mon) 01:59:29 No. 13885
Yep sweet, just add me (Discomrade) and I'll push anything that's a simple typo or grammar fix.
BBOCAnon 2023-01-16 (Mon) 17:53:57 No. 13887
Well it's better for the book to be error free. You can testify the accuracy of my claim by adding the number of errors you had to correct in this single sentence.
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2023-01-16 (Mon) 22:29:49 No. 13888 >>13885 >Yep sweet, just add me (Discomrade) and I'll push anything that's a simple typo or grammar fix.
>>13886 >That's literrally what you do to birds before cooking them
I've been studying animal slaughter lately, and usually what you do is cut around the anus. you don't try to finagle the intestine out through it. once you've cut through the pelvic floor extracting the innards is easier. cutting up the abdomen is also a possibility, and it only leaves you with the sphincter and the last bit of intestine attached to it. not that you bother with that for fowl, at least not wild fowl, because almost all the meat is in the breast
now if the French were actually doing what I describe then that's even more heinous. because rather than a severe case of prolapse, you're cutting around the asshole. now I'm no torture expert but isn't the idea that the victim shouldn't outright die from it? there's some large blood vessels nearby, not to mention the chock alone is probably enough to do someone in. fucking frogs man
Anonymous 2023-01-17 (Tue) 01:25:04 No. 13889
Fucking copyrighting bastards. The EU sucks. It's bad enough that z-library got taken away by the FBI.
>>13888 >fucking frogs man
Cannibalizing political prisoners was really prominent in colonial eras. The whole idea with deadly torture is instilling fear and obedience.
Anonymous 2023-02-03 (Fri) 18:14:42 No. 13890
Anonymous 2023-02-04 (Sat) 08:11:53 No. 13891
Hey Y'all amazing and valid :3
Anonymous 2023-02-04 (Sat) 08:49:39 No. 13892
>atrocities of capitalism are just the consequences of natural human savagery, it is the norm, so we must blame the human condition >atrocities of socialism are the consequence of human meddling, a human-made, imposed idea, therefore it is the ideas themselves that are to blame How do you counter that without sounding like you're coping? I know that what we consider "normal", "natural", "the human condition", etc. is downstream from material conditions, but trying to explain to a normie that that their conception of reality itself is a product of capitalism makes you sound like a schizo.
Anonymous 2023-02-04 (Sat) 15:58:02 No. 13893
that'd be a like explaining the concept "wet" to a fish
Anonymous 2023-03-05 (Sun) 10:57:15 No. 13894
Just say they're wrong and say if it's the norm then how do things get done and why do people do nice things.
Anonymous 2023-03-05 (Sun) 11:31:36 No. 13895
By asking to show some monkeys or primitive human tribes where 1 monkey owns 99% of the banans and the rest starves to death.
Anonymous 2023-03-05 (Sun) 13:28:03 No. 13897
How do people get involved with this? Where can we contact you?
I'm a writer/editor/proofreader and am interested in contributing
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2023-03-05 (Sun) 13:42:37 No. 13898
ideal situation: register a user on git.leftypol.org and I can add you as a contributor. then just read, make any suitable changes to the relevant .tex files, git commit and git push. it'll be easiest if you use either a Debian-like OS or maybe WSL in Windows 10 can do it. you'll want the build-essential and texlive* packages. you use make to build the pdfs
LaTeX Anon !cBWnNqbO3o 2023-03-05 (Sun) 13:43:39 No. 13899
it's also possible to just post any mistakes you notice in the thread and either me or someone else with push access can incorporate the fixes
Anonymous 2023-03-05 (Sun) 18:11:47 No. 13900
Debt to Death, and that in e.g. NGOs in the third world loaning Micro Credit to those in Agriculture, creating a cyclical debt and general poverty leading to death. Google Micro Credit, NGOs and Bangladesh, Anu Muhammad has a good explanation on it, however no death statistics, you will have to search for evidence. Best of luck.
Anonymous 2023-03-16 (Thu) 14:07:11 No. 13901
Does anyone have the robert kurz's black book of capitalism? I cant find an english translation.
Anonymous 2023-04-04 (Tue) 22:25:12 No. 13902
Anonymous 2023-04-29 (Sat) 19:18:12 No. 13903
Any news from our proofreaders?
Anonymous 2023-04-30 (Sun) 01:44:14 No. 13904
=UPDATES PLS I NEED THIS TO DEBOONK LIBS==
Anonymous 2023-04-30 (Sun) 19:42:25 No. 13905
I don't know French or Vietnamese so I can't really proofread either of the texts in question
Anonymous 2023-11-19 (Sun) 11:07:52 No. 20967
Combine the cover page and the document into a file with poppler pdfunite or imagemagick convert (with the appropriate density).
Anonymous 2023-11-22 (Wed) 13:35:11 No. 20969
<BBOC is kill :(
Anonymous 2023-11-24 (Fri) 01:51:05 No. 20970
there's a bajillion ways of doing cover pages in LaTeX itself. you can also do it with some external program then use pdfjam to join it with other pdfs
I've had in mind to create a thread on the main board about this to try and drum up some proofreading interest again
Anonymous 2023-12-01 (Fri) 05:51:12 No. 20978
>>20970 >I've had in mind to create a thread on the main board about this to try and drum up some proofreading interest again
Good plan imo, an update with initial version, plus notes oin what is to be done, would be cool :D
Anonymous 2023-12-01 (Fri) 10:01:50 No. 20979
yeah. having proofreaders adopt a tripcode would be useful too I think
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