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Comments on an "Anti-Capitalist" Riot
Friedrich Engels

These excerpts are from letters written by Engels in the immediate aftermath of the February 1886 "West End Riots". The letter to Laura Lafargue is taken from Engels-Lafargue, Correspondence, Vol.1, 1959. The letters to Bebel are from Marx-Engels, Correspondence, 1846-1895, 1934, although the last two paragraphs from the 15 February letter have been translated from the German original in August Bebels Briefwechsel mit Friedrich Engels, 1965.

To Laura Lafargue, 9 February 1886

Our clever folks of the S[ocial] D[emocratic] Federation scorn to rest on their laurels. Yesterday they must needs interfere in a meeting of the unemployed – who count now by hundreds of thousands – in order to preach La Révolution, revolution in general, and ask the mass to hold up their hands, those who were ready to follow M. Champion wherever he would lead them to – well, to what he does not know himself. Hyndman, who can only overcome his personal cowardice by deafening himself with his own shouts, went on in the same strain.

Of course you know what a meeting at 3pm in Trafalgar Square consists of: masses of the poor devils of the East End who vegetate in the borderland between working class and Lumpenproletariat, and a sufficient admixture of roughs and 'Arrys to leaven the whole into a mass ready for any "lark" up to a wild riot à propos de rien [about nothing].Well, just at the time when this element was getting the upper hand (Kautsky who was there says das eigentliche Meeting war vorbei, die Keilerei ging los und so ging ich weg [the meeting proper was over, the brawling broke out and so I made off]), the wiseacres above named took these roughs in procession through Pall Mall and Piccadilly to Hyde Park for another and a truly revolutionary meeting. But on the road the roughs took matters into their own hands, smashed club windows and shop fronts, plundered first wine stores and bakers' shops, and then some jewellers' shops also, so that in Hyde Park our revolutionary swells had to preach "le calme et la modération"! While they were soft-sawdering, the wrecking and plundering went on outside in Audley St and even as far as Oxford St where at last the police intervened.

The absence of the police shows that the row was wanted, but that Hyndman and Co donnaient dans le piège [fell into the trap] is impardonable and brands them finally as not only helpless fools but also as scPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

I have a lot of views on this book, but I couldn't reasonably explain everything i want to say about it just know it's not perfect and has a ton of issues with overgeneralization and misinformation but it has a lot of things to say

Also one thing that stuck out to me were the implications of patriarchal nuclear families and social alienation along with parental abuse. How many marriages and broken down families today are byproducts of this outdatwd model and what can be expected in the future. Guess I'll have to wait and see

Can we have a thread to discuss pre-marx socialists thinkers? The idea of communal ownership and abolishment of money existed long before Marx, lets discuss the philosophers that helped usher in the line of communist thought.

The USSR during the Stalin Period was arguably marked by a general retreat of revolutionary forces in many regards. While some things; including the most progressive constitution in the world at the time; clearly illicit praise and support, it's generally hard to extend this level of support to many other projects. The mass deportation of Volga Germans, the mass deportations and dispossession of the peasantry (as the USSR underwent socialist primitive accumulation), and the eventual illegalization of homosexuality are clear signs that many social forces faced active regression. Obviously, not all of this was Stalin's fault, and the contingent of radical liberals who attempt to pin all of this on him personally are not worth really a minute of our time. However, with that in mind, it seems quite obvious that Stalin, despite his successes, obviously had major underpinnings and failures. And many of them become increasingly hard to support in the face of new archives, leaks, and the such.

China also underwent it's own socialist revolution. Interestingly enough, Stalin pretty clearly helped in this one, backing Mao and giving them access and control of liberated Manchuria, no doubt a respectable deed. After the takeover of China, Mao didn't, despite even harsher circumstances in many cases, participate in a large level of social regression. The Cultural Revolution was a revolution within a revolution, the first of it's kind, and has lasting effects on China to this day. People in China don't revere the emperor's of old and Han Chauvinism, while existent, has generally been under control.

The reason i'm making this thread is because of a recent poll i've seen. People who support Stalin generally point out on how most polls in the former USSR regard him as a hero or one of it's greatest leaders. This doesn't really line up considering how the last Tsar of Russia, Nicholas, is usually rated not too far behind, often beating out Lenin (https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna25691312). It's even more concerning on how the White Army leader Kolchak is also rather popular in these polls (https://tsarnicholas.org/2019/12/08/nicholas-ii-stalin-and-lenin-top-popularity-rating-of-russian-historical-figures/).
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

I came accross, Stalin and the Scientists, but can't seem to find a copy. Anyone have a copy?

there has long been a tendency online that can only be described as 'vulgar hardline' – an attraction to superficially similar, hardline/'anti-revisionist' states that appear to be cut from the same cloth, but in reality were often opposed to one another.
the main contemporary example would be the attitude that many self-proclaimed 'maoists' and 'anti-revisionist' MLs (they're virtually the same, one just primarily praises mao while the other stalin) have towards cuba and the dprk: they hate khrushchev, usually consider the ussr and co. post-1953/56 revisionist, but support historically pro-soviet cuba and the fence-sitting dprk. however during the cold war when socialist countries were plentiful and things were happening in real time; alliances more clearly defined and happenings more clearly understood by various followers in the west; maoists were highly critical of cuba, to put it lightly. to many, it was nothing more than a soviet sugar plantation helmed by a fascist puppet. the dprk was also disliked, but how intensely depended on how much of a red guard you were.
of course there are still those niche gonzaloites with more awareness of the maoist tradition, who continue this negative attitude towards castro and the kims, but for the majority of 'anti-revisionist' communists they're recieved very well.
this vulgar hardline position becomes even more confusing when we further examine actual relationships between the key 'BASED' hardline countries (china, albania, dprk, east germany) and their 'CRINGE' opposites (ussr post-stalin, yugoslavia, the broad cmea.) getting the obvious out of the way, east germany was naturally 100% ride and die soviet until gorbachev and considered fellow revisionists by maoists/hoxhaists of the time, but nontheless you do see plenty of corn critial characters who think the ossies went hard.
now on to the rest…
the dprk in the 60s was both pro-soviet and pro-chinese, depending on the present situation. here's a pro-soviet example from 1960: https://digitalarchive.wilsoncenter.org/document/journal-soviet-ambassador-dprk-am-puzanov-16-june-1960
and here's a pro-chinese example from 1966: https://digitalarchive.wilsoncenter.oPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

Mao’s Contributions to Communist Theory and Human Emancipation Are Truly Profound—
But the “Mass Line” Is Wrong
The Chinese revolution, and in particular the revolutionary upsurge of the Cultural Revolution in China (a revolution within socialist society itself!) and the role of Mao Zedong as the leader of that Cultural Revolution, in the 1960s and into the early 1970s, had a major positive impact on masses of people around the world. This included large numbers of oppressed people and educated youth in the U.S. The Red Book of quotations from Mao was in the hands of literally millions of people in countries all over the world, including in the U.S., as well as providing basic revolutionary orientation for the masses of people in China itself.

(I am speaking of the actual role of Mao and the essential emancipating character of the Cultural Revolution in China, not the crude distortions of this by people speaking out of gross ignorance and those anti-communist political functionaries engaging in deliberate and systematic distortion. A serious, scientific analysis of the necessity, the objectives, and the course of the Cultural Revolution in China—including the contradictions it was seeking to address and the contradictions characterizing the process of this Cultural Revolution—can be found in works of mine, and others, at revcom.us.)

Mao’s further development of communist theory was expressed in a number of dimensions, most of all in the understanding of the danger and basis for revolution to be reversed and capitalism restored in a socialist country—and the means for combating this, which was given concrete expression in the Cultural Revolution.

One significant aspect of Mao’s thought (and a chapter in the Red Book) was what Mao referred to as the “mass line.” This was taken up as a significant tool by those of us who, in those times, became not just revolutionary-minded in some general sense but revolutionary communists inspired and influenced above all by the Cultural Revolution in China. Yet, as has become clear in the decades since then, this concept of “mass line” is not correct and actually runs counter to Mao’s overall adherence to, and further development of, communist theory.

As I have learned in a continually deepening way, communist theory must be taken up and applied as a scientific method and approach to understanding and transforming reality. It must continually develop as the larger world continuesPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

Why would the vast majority of capitalists benefit from colonialism? They obviously benefit more from decentralized, competitive, non-monopolized supply chains, and keeping costs down isn't their only economic interest. Maybe I can get how the aristocracy and some settlers benefitted from it, but for the bourgeoisie as a whole, it just doesn't make sense. I don't like the vulgar "Marxist" attempt to connect European colonialism to the rise of capitalism, instead of seeing it as a more pre-capitalist historical attempt at accumulating mercantile wealth which was eventually overtaken by industrialization which itself catalyzed the century-long process of decolonization.

Another newfag thread. Interact with accordingly.

Their is, unsurprisingly, a large contingent of the worlds population, still hinging on old Red Scare propaganda, that are convinced of many lies about the relationship between socialism and artistic freedom. Too them, socialists are violent fearmongers who will, at the first chance given, desecrate art, destroy art, and attempt to lead a truly bleak life. One confined purely to the factory or work, where 'labor' is everything, where the individuality of life is wiped out in an instant. Of course, we all understand here that capitalism is the force that sucks up our individuality in favor of making productive workers. Art is not something that can be usually seriously pursued: gone are the days when feudal lords used to commission artists for year long paintings, sculptures, and portraits. We live in an atomized society.

That's not the point. What is the point is that to decide that socialism and art are inherently polar and incompatible is a brainwashed way of thinking. This is most often applied, arguably, to our conceptions of the Cultural Revolution in China. We all have heard about the four olds: Old Ideas, Old Culture, Old Customs, and Old Habits. And people who have even a surface level understanding hear alot about the destruction of cultural heritage during the 10 year period. Modern China even refers to the Cultural Revolution as "Shi nian haoji". "Shi nian" means 10 years, referring to the period of which the Cultural Revolution is generally regarded as lasting. "Haoji" is ambiguous, but generally can refer to the term "holocaust" in modern settings: destruction by fire. Images of a human horde (orientalist hogwash) destroying valuable historical pieces of art come to mind and are used today in the US to scare conservatives over the spectre of vague 'modern art'.

The accusation of destruction of culture and tradition during those 10 years, which i'll be examining, is incredibly overblown in face of the massive artistic achievements and leaps in cultural creativity during the event. An excerpt from "The Battle For Chinas Past: Mao and the Cultural Revolution", page 28.

>Take the example of the fine arts. During the Cultural Revolution years of 1972 to 1975 China held four national fine arts exhibitions, with more than 2,000 pieces of art selected from 12,800 works recommended from all over China. The exhibits in Beijing attracted an audienPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

Are there any books that are for normies which are nonetheless good to read from a leftist perspective

Off the top of my head:

Good to Great
7 Habits of Highly Effective People
48 Laws of Power
Man's Search for Meaning