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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internet about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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Not reporting is bourgeois

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This thread is for the discussion of cybercommunism, the planning of the socialist economy by computerized means, including discussions of related topics and creators. Drama belongs in /isg/

Reading
Towards a New Socialism by Paul Cockshott and Allin Cottrell: http://ricardo.ecn.wfu.edu/~cottrell/socialism_book/
Brain of the Firm by Stafford Beer
Cybernetic Revolutionaries by Eden Medina
Cybernetics: Or the Control and Communication in the Animal and the Machine and The Human Use of Human Beings (1st edition) by Norbert Wiener
Economic cybernetics by Nikolay Veduta
People's Republic of Walmart by Leigh Phillips and Michal Rozworski
Red Plenty by Francis Spufford
Economics in kind, Total socialisation and A system of socialisation by Otto Neurath (Incommensurability, Ecology, and Planning: Neurath in the Socialist Calculation Debate by Thomas Uebel provides a summary)

Active writers/creators
Sorted by last name
>Paul Cockshott
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damn he was a twink

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>>2477677
Kinda looks like Ivan Drago. I imagine he was fit for the COBI.

>>2477554
I've come to the regretful conclusion that 2/3rds of people advocating for "planning" are just market socialists in disguise

if you ask chat gpt to apply category theory to economnics it basically starts talking in marx-like terms even if you never mentioned marx to it before

>>2477677
The word "twink" has become completely fucking meaningless.



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If you hold that communism's victory is inevitable then genuinely why bother with all the heart ache and tiring work of doing action, educating, keeping informed ect. Why not just do whatever tickles your fancy if your contribution will be less than 0.001%?

It's a question I've asked myself a lot when I feel like killing myself in despair and I've only ever really resolved that this is just my lot, someone's gotta do what little they can with others who feel the same (or not) and deal with it like a man.
19 posts and 5 image replies omitted.

Lenin didn't sit around hopefagging while doing absolutely nothing, the implication of the phrase is that people would actually do things and work towards advancing the movement since the material condition of the post-capitalistic system would inevitably arise demands for communism as a viable and only solution. Of course this is bait anyways but many modern leftists rely on the principle that a few good ones will do the bulk of the dirty work, be it setting up the foundations and educating the mass or other exhaustive tasks, while they paid zero in contribution. It isn't by a surprise only a deranged right wing radicalized groyper schizo with incoherent ideologies and metal in his backs can kill kirk and get away with it. A leftist would have turned the gun around themselves or missed like a retard and give the target best pr shot ever in recorded history, dooming the movement into obscurity

>>2475588
Whatever you say, liberal

>>2475519
>it is socialism or barbarism, not socialism after barbarism
Holy shit that is an actual killer post and phrase. I'm screenshotting and saving. Best thing to come from this thread

>>2475138
He's Double Lenin

>>2482649
Maybe even triple



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LONG LIVE THE CANADIAN PEOPLE'S ANTI-COLONIAL AND PROLETARIAN REVOLUTION!

DEATH TO THE REVISIONISTS!
DEATH TO THE ROADERS!
DEATH TO THE COUNTERREVOLUTIONARIES!
DEATH TO THE REACTIONARIES!
DEATH TO THE OPPORTUNISTS!
DEATH TO THE SOPHISTS!

REMEMBER ALL FELLOW MARXIST-LENINIST-MAOIST ANONS AND FEMANONS OF LEFTYPOL:
HIDE ALL ANARCHIST/SOCDEM/LEFTCOM/SJW/LIBTARD/DEMOCRAP/PC/WOKE/LEFTLIB/DEMSOC/TROTSKYIST/LUXEMBURGIST/SYNDICALIST THREADS.
IGNORE ALL POSTS FROM THESE TRAITORS.
DO NOT REPLY TO THEIR POSTS.
THEY ARE WRECKERS. THEY ARE CLASS TRAITORS. THEY ARE OBJECTIVELY COUNTER-REVOLUTIONARY.

Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
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I literally can't refute any of what you said, its all fax

>>2478516
ACP slop detected

>>2478516
Very cool anon, based and real movement pilled. Have a (You)

>>2482431
not an argument, chud

>>2478516
Canada will never be communist unless invaded by China.



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>Marxism-Leninism teaches that the state is just a weapon with which one social class supresses other
>The state by itself is neither good neither bad, its value only depends on what social class wields it (if the state is ruled by a "good" (revolutionary) social class it is good, if it is ruled b a "bad" (reactionary) class it is bad)
>Using the good old logical induction, any social structure which had historically developed as a weapon of class warfare is also neither inherently good, neither inherently bad
>Modern (post 1960s) Marxism teaches that white supremacy/racism and patriarchy (which has sexism, misoginy, homophobia and transphobia as its [overlapping] sub-systems) are just weapons with which the ruling social class opresses the proletariat
>Therefore, it should be concluded that institutionlised racism, sexism, misoginy, homophobia, and transphobia are not inherently bad and can be used for the revolution

I think I may have invented an argument that glitches and crashes the minds of Marxists. Does anyone know where I can contact the CIA and request the reward for my discovery?
59 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

>>2482554
division by who? this new class of "representatives" or the people?

>>2482546
marx was a 'dialectical materialist', inheriting many ideas from Hegel, including the dialectic conception of history. dialectics is not 'deterministic', but the forces involved in the dialectic change the dialectic over time as they interact, in a way that is irreversible and partially determined by material conditions. for example, there can be no 'going back' to feudal agriculture in the modern world, as the technology already exists to out-produce feudal agriculture - this is an irrevocable 'progress' of social organization.

>>2482563
read:
<Intrinsically, it is not a question of the higher or lower degree of development of the social antagonisms that result from the natural laws of capitalist production. It is a question of these laws themselves, of these tendencies working with iron necessity towards inevitable results. The country that is more developed industrially only shows, to the less developed, the image of its own future.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/p1.htm

>>2482561
under communism there is no 'who' who would benefit from promoting sexism, as the 'representatives' are not a distinct separate class, but rather social servants who are subject to popular recall etc. the 'who' under capitalism are the capitalist oligarchs, if a communist revolution succeeds there will be no oligarchs. during a revolution, there may be a vanguard party, but if this is a genuine proletarian movement that is well equipped and educated for the task, this vanguard party will also see no benefit in dividing the working class, replacing class consciousness with vulgar bigotry. the goal of the communist revolutionary is to build class consciousness, not to erase it and replace it with bigotry. to try to entice the people by appealing to their basest bigotries and prejudices is pure tailism, the vanguard must advance the level of political awareness and class consciousness among the people, rather than conceding to reactionary lies.

>>2482575
if sexism is based on a division of labour of the sexes, would it be more sexist to integrate sports or segregate them based on gender?



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Thread dedicated to /leftypol/ original content.
>Post original content you've made, or OC someone else recently made which you want to share.
<Or ITT collaborate on improving content already made.

If your original content is good enough, it would most likely be shared on the /leftypol/ twitter account!
Make sure to follow us and feel free to leave suggestions on this thread~
https://twitter.com/leftypol_org
https://nitter.net/leftypol_org

previous thread: >>1762168
>>>/leftypol_archive/1762168 (if it gets archived by mods)

New Booru:
https://lefty.pictures

MAKE SURE TO UPLOAD YOUR OC TO THE BOORU SO IT DOESNT GET PRUNED FOREVER!!!
576 posts and 430 image replies omitted.


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>>2477574
I thought he's a groyper?

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>>2478778
kino 👌



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🗽UNITED STATES POLITICS 🦅

<XLR8 Edition


Thread for the hellish discussion related to the scourge of the earth, the destroyer of nations, the father of fascism, the enabler of ethnostates, the treatlerite tyrant, the protector of pedophiles, the exporter of ecocide, the captain of capitalism, the king of coups, the sultan of sanctions, the emir of the embargo, the autocrat of austerity, the doge of deregulation, the baron of busting unions, the prince of privatization, the lord of loan sharks, the patron-saint of proxy wars, the sponsor of settlers, the guarantor of genocides, the Divided $nakkkes of Amerikkka™

🏈 💵 🌭 🍔

🛠️ Strike Tracker ⚒️
https://striketracker.ilr.cornell.edu/

🇺🇸 Deeds of the Burger Reich 🇺🇸
https://github.com/dessalines/essays/blob/main/us_atrocities.md

📺 Live News 📺
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>if we didn’t get them this time, we’ll get them next time
US ambassador to Israel.

The new thread has been crapped up

>>2467844
This is the correct take to have.

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>>2482382
>There isn't a single person on the far right who can put in the effort to pretend they actually believe in morals and convictions anymore. All it amounts to is a horde of brain-fried sociopaths and their enablers who resent the fact (in their heads and their heads only) they can't do the depraved shit they want to do without being rightfully ostracized on all fronts, but everyone they hate (non-whites, trans people, leftists) can

Never forget that they want you broke, dead, your kids raped and brainwashed and they find it funny.

>>2482463
you bumped a seven day old thread to say this?
>>2482482
this is the old thread. let it die



 

A lot of anti-fascist rhetoric can get boiled down to "punch a nazi".

While we all know the right thrives on violence, but does the repetition of phases like above just further cement violence as the norm? Does that make us violent reactionaries just the same?
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>>2475863
>If we accept that as the default mode of political expression, is there any difference between ideologies if violence has to be normalized for it to even exist?
One of the most retarded takes of all time.
Politics is not just your methods of struggle. It's not even primarily that. If you think that the difference between ideologies is just about how much you do civil debate vs violence, then by the exact same token, if we're all just debating and vooting how are those ideologies any different from each other either????

>>2475850

1. nazis are ideologically committed to enacting genocide and ethnic cleansing and other degradations to quality of life

1a. as people that may be targeted by these acts, we would prefer to prevent these from coming about

2. allowing nazis to have public media platforms to spread their ideology will make genocide and ethnic cleansing more likely

2a. they will use their platforms and public presence to advocate for the goals of their ideology

2b. public presence will normalize their perspective

2c. successful displays of power in public are a major factor in nazi recruitment/growth/morale

2d. allowing them to participate in the political processes will enable them to protect themselves from legal consequences of their actions
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Good observation. Confirmation bias media is designed to enforce cohesion among ideological adherents. This is the destroyer of critical thinking, a fear that kills the mind, so to speak. I doubt the so-called "left" will fall in line with violence since it is more diverse and atomized compared to the personality disorder driven reactionary right that only sees things in black and white, but the fringes of both fall into the same traps. So hate and violence appear to have become indispensable for controlling these 'sides'. I imagine there's only a small minority of us in this country who avoid partisan engagement since it is all contrary to the Gospel, but my minority perspective is just that; a minority. I don't matter. But the hate that motivates the partisan fringes has become mainstream, and this back and forth will only mean escalation of the hate which precedes violence. If "the left" actually existed as a monolith, the right's plans to frame and entrap them in this cycle of violence might succeed. As it is, the anti-intellectual movement on the right which discourages critical thinking and encourages spiritual sloth will slowly destroy them as the fatigue of defending lies affects their health and shortens their lives. If the "left" collectively fell for the contrived violence, then the misdirection would be a success for them. I'm just trying to make sense of things since I know some in the cult and can't figure out what motivates the unwaivering loyalty to a cause that exploits them as a mere resource and means to an end..

>>2475850
>pacifist socdem
Where do you think you are?

Violent rhetoric often leads to acts of violence, and this lesson used to be learned on the playground or in a street fight depending on where you were raised. The terminally online keyboard warriors, particularly the consumers of Murdoch Inc. and the influencer subsidiaries and disciples must have never learned the basic lesson of kindergarten. The delusional narrative and framing by the right of a violent left, I think, is a combination of projection, presumption and of 'believing their own press'. Of course the instigator's primary concern is keeping their dependents angry and on edge. It's all based on delusion and the left is no threat.



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Previous thread: >>2189753

Links:

Previous Thread Archives
Thread 1 https://archive.ph/ROnpO
Thread 2 https://archive.ph/f29Po

Youtube Playlists
Anwar Shaikh - Historical Foundations of Political Economy
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTMFx0t8kDzc72vtNWeTP05x6WYiDgEx7
Anwar Shaikh - Capitalism: Competition, Conflict and Crises
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLB1uqxcCESK6B1juh_wnKoxftZCcqA1go
Anwar Shaikh - Capitalism
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLz4k72ocf2TZMxrEVCgpp1b5K3hzFWuZh
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
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is there a point to writing about political economy if you can't get it published lol
should I just write on substack? I have a few plans for what I want to write on

>>2481959
to expand I want to write about the other topics in Marx's original plan for critique of political economy (in his contribution's preface), something short and simple
I'm starting to study more intensively Adam Smith, David Ricardo, of course, Marx (I ignore Keynes and other retards)
the idea is to also write something interesting for the readers of my specific country
is Anwar Shaikh worth reading?

>>2481326
I can counter him by spamming friedrich list stuff. Do you want that?

>>2481961
>i ignore keynes and other retards
you've never read keynes, so be quiet. and in similar fashion, you'll resist austrian and neoclassical economics without even possessing the context for your disagreement. intellectual dishonesty.
>>2481326
i wouldnt have so much input if i wasnt countered at every turn by illiterate cultists. my posting began in the das kapital thread, where i gave my disagreements of marx's commodity money theory, which after a thousand posts, was finally admitted to. so if people accepted the truth to begin with, there would be no need to endlessly insist upon factual matters. my further disputes of "value" as a metaphysical substance is correctly historicised by marx in one respect but not another - he accepts that "value" is largely a modern concept conditioned by wage labour, but also sees that value is an unconditional medium of commodity exchange by retroactivity - whilst also dismissing certain exchanges as possessing a relation of "imaginary" value, without elaboration. its this same metaphysic which also causes marx to dismiss fiat currency, which in light of contemporary theory and practice, is a false starter. marx's historical example of aristotle lacking a theory of value also fails, since aristotle has a theory of value as consumer demand, with a subsequent chartalist theory of money. so its not that marx is outdated, he's just wrong on this topic. he infects engels, who says ridiculous things like this:
>the law of value has prevailed during a period of from five to seven thousand years
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1894-c3/supp.htm
of course, smith has no such conjectural jargon, since he separates value into two modes, utility and exchange, which has its general and particular forms. marx's bad grammar is also present here, where he speaks of "use-value" separate from "value" as such. "use-value" should refer to a "value in use", as smith puts it. anyway, i'll leave it there for now.

i've completed by transcription and translation of antoine montchretien's "treatise on political economy" (1615), book 1 ("on the usefulness of mechanical arts and manufacturing regulations") - the FIRST modern book on political economy! 😃👍 hope you all enjoy.



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>Communism is the real movement that abolishes the present state of things. It is a living science that must be checked against real-world material conditions and adjusted accordingly
>Karl Kautsky is a dirty revisionist! REVISIONIST REVISIONIST! HE SULLIED THE SACRED NAME OF MARX!! REEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!
Why are Leninists so fucking stupid? For reference, Kautsky was Engels' direct intellectual heir.
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>>2461356
>completely betrayed internationalism
Eh, 75% betrayed it imo. He did vote against the war in internal votes, only when he was outvoted did he go along with it.
Lenin didn't know that though since the internal vote was secret. Common democratic centralism L.

>>2472844
It doesn't matter if you promote the mass slaughter of workers because you actually believe it because "you are just following orders". Classic german behaviour though.

<fuck the guy who oversaw the most successful socialist revolution in world history, creating a socialist republic lasting decades and incorporating dozens of nations

<actually this social democrat who helped hand the actual nazis power with his liberal reformism bullshit is the ONE TRUE LEFTIST HEIR OF KING ENGELS


Not Today CIA

>>2473291
>fuck the guy who oversaw the most successful socialist revolution in world history
that would be Mao doebeit

>>2482113
Can I just stop everyone for a second and point out the elegance of Mao's solution?



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https://archive.ph/ArRwk

Has it ever struck anyone that, even way before the Kirk shooting and even before the election, rightoids have only becoming more and more incoherent since the start of the decade? This isn't to say they've never not had fundamentally fucktarded beliefs, but at the very least they had some baseline level of consistency and conviction.

"Palestinians hate me, want me dead, and are ruining white society, but Israel is also the one importing them to white society because they loathe us more than anyone, ergo both must be wiped off the Earth for a new thousand year Aryan age to commence" was the "standard" opinion as far back as like, 2017, now you've got people like Howling Mutant all but becoming Netanyahu's strongest soldiers, to say nothing of how much more openly deranged they've become (pic and linkrel). Epstein is only the tip of the iceberg with them.

To anyone who gets what I'm saying, what do you think happened?
2 posts omitted.

why you read fucking amarna

>>2481815
Because it's fascinating to see into the minds of broken people?

>>2481816
people here or on 4chin aren't broken enough?

>>2481438
>"Palestinians hate me, want me dead, and are ruining white society, but Israel is also the one importing them to white society because they loathe us more than anyone, ergo both must be wiped off the Earth for a new thousand year Aryan age to commence" was the "standard" opinion as far back as like, 2017
This has never been the standard opinion anywhere outside of 4chan. Touch grass.

Holy fucking shit nobody cares about autistic GEM.



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