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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internets about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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File: 1614787853217.mp4 (3.75 MB, 1280x720, China Is Asshole.mp4)


Tell me more about this shit. Stockholm syndrome & cuckoldry can be cure, no? I don't try to become a dengoid, but is there anything worse than becoming a cuck? Why there are so many cucks out there?
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Eh, could be worse. I think being under 100+ years of British rule significantly altered their identity and attitudes towards politics, so it is not a surprise they don't always mesh well with China.


I always wonder what percentage of hongkies are those insane colonial bootlickers. Is it normal for that many people to welcome imperialism with open arms just to stick it to the Chinese or is it just an insignificant minority overblown by western media?


Kek I can't


It's definitely blown out of proportion and astroturfed to some degree. There are varying results from polls, but the commonality among all of them is that a majority are opposed to independence.




The Western media would have you believe that the entire country is fighting for independence, but that is most certainly not the case


Moved to >>>/b/15381.

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I'm listening to the Revolutions podcast atm and the dude is discussing the 1907 Bolshevik bankheist Stalin led and organized, to discuss this he gave the background on Stalin's life and holy fuck, this dude's life was crazy! Like, a committed revolutionary as a teenager, leader of the tiny faction of Georgian Bolsheviks, a genius and lover of the arts his entire life, a rough and tumble adventurer who had shootouts with tsarist officials while robbing trains and stagecoaches to fund the revolution, holy fuck this dude's young life is genuinely worthy of a film adaptation! Like, this genuinely sounds like shit out of a movie, a real life fantasy story. A dude who broke out of the gulags to nearly freeze in Siberia, but accomplished his escape later on anyway! Apparently when he attended his first Congress of socialist parties he was thrown off by how so many of them were effete writers and thinkers while he was a true revolutionary soldier. Honestly it's throwing me off since most famous socialists don't have life stories anywhere near as interesting as this.
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What'a the problem with NazCentBolism?



I unironically wanted to make a graphic novel about Stalin’s life. Not even a big “Stalinist” or anything, I just also find his life insane. He basically rose up from nothing, and there is so much that one can sympathize with and judge harshly. He is like a Don Draper esque character in some ways, he almost seems chosen by God with how successful the ultimately was, but there are aspects of his personality that are extremely unlikeable as well. Like how he treated his ex-wives and illegitimate children. It all feels like it would make for a great story.


It just another retarded meme contributing to melt the brain of whoever is exposed to it.


It just seems to be neoliberalism, but unapologetic.


Bros Im not gay but…

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In another thread >>96519 I wrote an explanation of Marx's use of value, exchange-value, and use-value. In my explanation, I tried to write from the perspective of describing processes, not defining terms, since Marx didn't treat them as terms to be defined.

Since this is a controversial topic, I'd really like to see what others think about value, abstract labor, and commodities; this is a fundamental issue that affects our understanding of capitalism as a whole and especially communism.

One type of a commodity is a useful item that is produced for the purpose of exchange. Nothing is a commodity independently, because the state of an item being a commodity depends on the existence of the social relation of value and exchange. A useful item, such as a brick, is a use-value as long as it's in use. Use-values don't have to be commodities, and they don't have to be produced by humans; the air that you breathe is a use-value. Marx doesn't care why a thing is useful, just whether it is. Use-value is not synonymous with utility; a use-value is useful but it isn't "a utility". This is important because utility as a concept in modern economics is distinct, they try to quantify it.

Exchange value is the necessary form of appearance of value. The ratios at which a commodity exchanges to other commodities are its exchange-values. 10 bricks exchange for 1 bottle of vodka, but could also exchange for 5 bananas. Eventually market economies develop a universal equivalent, commodities are exchanged with money as the prime mediator; price is the form of expression of exchange-value measured in money. To be exchanged they must be reduced to a common element. It isn’t the use values themselves, because they are plainly qualitatively different. It isn’t the type of labor that went into making them, because the concrete labor that went into making the bricks is qualitatively completely different from the concrete labor that went into making the vodka. The basic common element between commodities must therefore be human labor in the abstract. This reduction to abstract human labor is occurs in both the act of exchange, which equates commodities as values, and commodity-producing labor, which presupposes exchange. These commodities are values.

Value is therefore objectified abstract human labor. The magnitude of value is determined by the amount of Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
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Marx says explicitly that not everything bought on the market (i.e. everything with a price) has a value. From Chapter 3:
>Things which in and for themselves are not commodities, things such as conscience, honour, etc., can be offered for sale by their holders, and thus acquire the form of commodities through their price. Hence a thing can, formally speaking, have a price without having a value. The expression of price is in this case imaginary, like certain quantities in mathematics. On the other hand, the imaginary price-form may also conceal a real value-relation or one derived from it, as for instance the price of uncultivated land, which is without value because no human labour is objectified in it.
Marx deals more specifically with this whole "exchange value without value" problem in Capital Volume 3 in his chapters on rent.
>room for proper commodities has been shrinking
What has been expanding is the gulf between commodity prices and values, due to monopoly distortions like branding, advertising, etc. This is why books like Paul Sweezy and Paul Baran's Monopoly Capital have been written. The basic social relations still exist, though.


Are you Leftism Today?


No, thank God


I thought of a new title for this thread: "The Holy Trinity of value: substance, form, and magnitude"


The Holy Trinity of Labour: Hardness, Length, Girth

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Dictatorship of the proletariat is the most retarded concept on earth when it prioritizes party members and disallows the average proletarian from having a say in the government. True socialism can only come about when every proletarian has a say in their government and a piece of the political power pie, and when robust systems are in place to keep bourgeois reaction from undoing socialist movements. Mass repression is not the answer, and bourgeois reactionaries only need to be kept out of the system. Proles grounded in theoretical knowledge of Marxism should be at the center of deciding who is bourgeois, but they should not be exempt from being held accountable to the people at large.
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Besides, I didn't say it didn't have anything to do with the peasantry. Learn how to read.


Maoists be like:

Drake no: a person from a proletarian background saying that the CR was a petty bourgeois movement

Drake yes: Sison (from a prominent landlord family) and Gonzalo (petty bourg academe) says China is imperialist.


>>Dictatorship in marxian times literally meant "rule" or "government"
No it fucking didn't. Both in Marx's day and today, "dictatorship" literally means a period during which the Roman Republic was ruled by an appointed dictator, who was appointed in times of emergency. It was after Marx's day that "dictatorship" began to colloquially mean a government that rules without consent of the people as opposed to power used during an emergency. Marx meant dictatorship in a hybrid sense, "dictatorship" at once refers to the ruthless oppression of one class over another, and its temporary nature, terminating once the transition to communism is complete.


you said it was urban intellectual movement which somehow also did everything to level urban-rural differences (which greatly benefited the the latter ofc)
we are talking about the cultrev not the dengist counterrevolution
we talking about the cultrev not foreign maoists
communist leaders had overwhelmingly middle class backgrounds anyways


Just because it was a petty bourg movement doesn't mean it didn't benefit the masses in anyway. Deng wasn't a counter-revolution. More like trying to make the best out of shitty circumstances. The culmination of what happened at Tiananmen square was really a culmination of Mao's stubborn failures. Foreign Maoists are the only ones who glorify the cultural revolution, and while some communist leaders had middle class backgrounds (except Stalin), it wasn't on the level of Sison or Bob Avakian.

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So anarchism is a CIA psyop just like the hippie movement, right?
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Communism, CIA and hippies are anarchist psyops to hide the fact we live in complete ontological irony.


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irony time


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Didn’t FBI reports revealed that anarchist groups are hard to infiltrate due to their nomadic lifestyle, too much theory and too busy cancelling people on twitter.


Moved to >>>/b/15351.

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A grande richiesta e dopo un'inutile e penosa scissione, rieccoci.
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That's not true and you know it


He was possible involved in the killing of Enrico Mattei who pissed off the US oil companies (he was also warned twice by the USSR)


Quindi .net é morto?


è abbastanza moribondo, ci sono rimasti solo i nazi lì sopra e la moderazione fa cagare.


E sepolto

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What is it that leads modern "internet" leftists in the west to be so individualistic? Everyone wants to make their own ideology (ex: Anarcho-[insert]ism or Marxism-[insert]-[insert]-ism). Why are modern western leftists so disconnected from actual working class struggle and lean so hard into pedantry, arbitrary contrarianism, debate-bro-ism, edgy bullshit and just straight up grifting?

The solution of working class unity requires people going out and doing shit in numbers, so many "internet leftists" seem more like AM radio pundits who are just grifting a niche audience for money and fame rather than actually trying to advance the working class.

Of course they rationalize it by saying twitch streaming is their praxis: well assuming its true and not just a post hoc rationalization for their grifting internet-boi careers, then its a bad form of praxis. Doing anything, literally extremely basic liberal/charity stuff like attending/organizing a protest, organizing feeding the homeless, working with a tenants union or something, would be more productive than the bullshit they do.

Of course, it would also require them to 1) get a real job because they would no longer be able to support themselves off patreon bux, and 2)humble themselves and be a team player who works with others, not just an attention whore dudebro primadonna.

The left really needs an American/Western Mao who will send all these breadtube radlibs down to the countryside to actually learn what work is. Make no mistake: these are not "leftists". If you try and interpret their actions as that of a person coming to conclusions and conversing in good faith you will be confused: a breadtuber, as a youtuber, is really just a self-employed person. Petit bourgeois by class status, and that is their mentality.

Consciously or unconsciously, they follow the market. Being a "leftist" is just a shtick for them, the same way Belle Delphine is a "gamer girl" because she identified a market of lonely video game nerds. Breadtubers were people who identified an underserved market of liberals and leftists who wanted a pushback on mid 2010s anti-sjw shit. They are entrepreneurs first and leftists second, if at all.

That is why people like socialism done left, Hasan pivot from being leftists to being liberals, because it's a bigger market. These types quickly figure out that they either have to branch out or quit, because there aren't enough people on the actuPost too long. Click here to view the full text.
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>have you seen is video on Marxism
No haven´t watched this one, because of my low expectations. Thanks for telling me this background info, will check out some more of his vids.
I did not mean to refer to the subreddit, I saw some posters here referring to proper marxist yt channels as "beard-tubers", so that´s what I meant. I have rarely been here in the last 1,5 years due to different factors (broken PC, mental breakdown+ other stuff)


>Engels owned a factory, get out of here with your purity test.
Engels didn't depend on "being a Marxist" for his livelihood. It's not a matter of purity, but about your own relationship to the left. If it's effectively the relationship between yourself as a personality and an audience filtered toward your videos by the platform. It sets up a dynamic where you're dependent on "leftism" only so long as it affords you this audience and a livelihood, making you vulnerable to changes in platform policies and the wider culture, and wary of contradicting popular opinions. It could force choices between "Marxism" and "eating next week," at both a "macro" (what you should talk about in general) and "micro" level (what you should talk about in individual videos, avoiding expressing views that might provoke controversy).

My guess is that you'll see a gradual movement toward diversifying content, whether through media criticism, gaming, or something else, and, once "the left" on Breadtube has served its purpose for the bourgeoisie and Youtube decides to ban "radicalism," these Youtube personalities can switch to some other niche while keeping much of the same audience, who'd formed a relationship with the personality more than the left, and using the excuse that "it's not my fault if Youtube bans this, but we can continue struggling together as comrades," namely by watching the Youtube personality play video games.


>using bougie apps like tiktok


File: 1614775501790.png (660.77 KB, 828x564, bed.png)

Does anyone remember 10-15 years ago when the entire internet was full of right-libertarians? Every podcast was libertarian-leaning, Ron Paul was the guy to stan, anti-government and pro-business takes were the norm on social media. Now most of that is gone, the few that are left are marginalized or have gone fascist, and the current internet zeitgeist is poorly-informed "kitchen-sink socialism" preaching anti-imperialism and raging against the police and Israel while also supporting social-democratic reforms and business unionism.

That's all "breadtube" has done, changed the opinion landscape online. Only a small handful of people take these opinions seriously enough to become IRL activists or cadres, just like the libertarians of last decade. The vast majority stay online and vent, and while its nice to see lefty takes on social media everywhere, they don't actually lead to anything aside from a few failed socdem political campaigns and hyper-local charity/organizing efforts. Part of the problem is the undersocialization of Americans as pointed out by >>101616 plus the entertainment panopticon of modern social media, but the "Left" has been disconnected or cut off from the labor movement for almost a century, it's a much deeper problem and so far no one has been able to propose a generalizable solution.


We always feared a socialism would become the meme ideology of the internet in the same way ancap,anti-sjw, edgy-right nationalism, etc. had been before. Now I guess that's happened and its just as retarded as everyone feared

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I just want you to do one thing.
Get into this tweet and see the replies.
What is to be done about right-wingers?
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Eugene…please shut up


>this guy was in the Soviet Military given his age
>says it was the jews

Felix Dzerzhinksy was truly the MVP of the Revolution(maybe Trotsky). A shame he died so early.


that is just the title the person uploading the video made. he says zionists in the video


File: 1614762234153.gif (911.14 KB, 200x150, too simple, sometimes naiv….gif)

>there are Command chains behind the Scenes. That's how you need to think about it
<That's right comrade. It's the Bourgeoisie
>No, the Zionists


gulag yourself you fucker

File: 1614626129275.jpg (4.89 MB, 4000x3507, Christ in the Wilderness.jpg)


It's quite revealing that sectarianism is the word so often used to describe leftist infighting, since it's typically in reference to conflict within religious groups. Regardless, this is how sectarianism is defined according to Wikipedia:
>Sectarianism is a form of prejudice, discrimination, or hatred arising from attaching relations of inferiority and superiority to differences between subdivisions within a group.
This bears some similarity with Freud's idea of the "narcissism of small differences". Again, according to Wikipedia:
>The narcissism of small differences is the thesis that communities with adjoining territories and close relationships are especially likely to engage in feuds and mutual ridicule because of hypersensitivity to details of differentiation.
What both of these concepts share in common is that groups of people, who appear to have many similarities, tend to come into conflict with each other over perceived differences, even just minor ones. Additionally, in both cases the conflict has a significant emotional content to it.
What do you think causes sectarianism? Is there a solution to sectarianism? If so, what is it? If not, why?

Being the idealist I am, I want leftypol to be a place where honorable and reasoned discussion between opposing points of view can flourish. Because of this, I think it's important to point out the obvious: UNMODERATED DEBATE IS A HARMFUL
The key word here is unmoderated. Debate is not only useful, but in my opinion necessary. However, debate can be very flawed, hence the presence of moderators and rules that help guide good debates. Without such factors, debates can descend into the realm of emotionalism and rhetoric. Banter is one thing, but bullying should have no place in any serious discussion. A good forum will not only allow but actively encourage debate, yet specifically in a form that is regulated.
Ideally, debaters would moderate themselves, but this is clearly not the case. This is why I am in favor of taking an authoritarian stance towards sectarianism and aggressive rhetoric in debate threads. There is no reason why either fair and free debate or even just banter across the board should be stifled by such a policy. All that would need to be done is for an OP to title their thread something like "DEBATE: Should jaywalking be punished with the death penalty?". Then, any such threads should have a clearlPost too long. Click here to view the full text.
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Okay but sectarianism between anarchists and marxists is based because anarkids have held the microphone for too fucking long in the West


>anarkids have held the microphone for too fucking long in the West
Whose microphone?


When totalizing ideologies fight, all but one must lose. The more totalizers end up killing themselves fighting to define what is right and real according to their personal interest and tendency, the better for the rest of us.


Infighting between ML cults is sectarian, and so is infighting between Trotsykist splinters. The disagreements between Marxists and anarchists are not sectarian; there are significant and irreconcilable differences, from theories of the state, class, and capital, to organizing and strategy. They share neither the means nor the ends. The same is true for differences between MLs and most other Marxist groups which actually believe in an international proletarian revolution & not in distortions like "socialist commodity production" and "socialism" with Chinese Characteristics.

TL;DR the differences are too big to ignore


I mean if anything that would be trots but the point is nobody is listening anyway

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 No.2235[Reply][Last 50 Posts]

Volume 4: Finally some actual riots edition

Discuss anything on Southeast Asian politics. Elections, open orgs, jungle NPA or just random shit. There’r still dozens of us! Kiwis are welcome! South Asia can joined too I guess.

Last threads
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Idk, aren't NPA on the decline after failing to make peace with Duterte.


According to the Philippine government the NPA now number -40,000 troops if their reports are to be trusted.


You think there's any timeline where Myanmar isn't ran by drug dealing racist military guys?


Before Aung San’s death there was some semblance of hope. Vietnam faced the same thing which in some case being even worse. The Vietminh knew who their enemies are: religious warlords, bandit paramilitary, ethno-separatists, imperialist supporters, Trots, Chinese KMT… None are given the slightest form of concessions, all were neutralized especially the imperial powers. If they pretend to support you, take it as long as they are useful.
The whole point is to never negotiate with people who are out to destroy you from the start. It’s kill or be killed. Never try to build a government with them.
Which is a huge expansion because only a few years before especially during the schism between China supporters and hardline militants there were less than 2000 NPA members.


I'm joking about them having negative numbers because of the AFP constantly overstating their kills by huge numbers. I saw some guy tally them up and it comes out to negative 40k lol

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