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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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File: 1656256854198-0.png (2.57 MB, 1197x2048, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 1656256854198-1.png (49.51 KB, 800x856, ClipboardImage.png)

 No.1035374[Reply]

>The Union of Mladorossi (Russian: Союз Младороссов, Soyuz Mladorossov) was a political group of Russian emigrant monarchists (mostly living in Europe) who advocated a hybrid of Russian monarchy and the Soviet system, best evidenced by their motto "Tsar and the Soviets"

>The organization started in 1923, as the "Union of Young Russia" (in Russian: Союз Молодой России, Soyuz Molodoi Rossii) in Munich, changing its name to the Union of Mladorossi in 1925


>The Mladorossi (Russian: Младороссы, IPA: [mlədɐˈrosɨ]), as they were popularly known, at first declared themselves as anti-communists. In contrast to other emigrant political organizations, they argued against the idea of creating a "free Russia" on non-Russian soil, believing strongly that what they called "Soviet-occupied Russia" was the only Russia that could be in existence. The Mladorossi believed that the Soviet government, for all its negative ideology, was preserving the Russian state and defending its national interests. They also believed that the October Revolution was merely the beginning of an evolutionary process that would create a new, young Russia (hence their use of the prefix mlado which means "young")
5 posts and 4 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1035621

>>1035614
nothing. it's just that we'll never get to space without socialism, however monarchism will never return if we have *full* socialism. so Mladorossi type bullshit is the only way to get "monarchy in space" by first using socialism to leave the planet, then regressing to feudalism in space.

 No.1035651

>>1035621
we need to pull the stick-shift to socialism until we've reached space, then we bring it back to feudalism to pull off the coup-de-grace
it's like an aerial maneuver

 No.1035659

>>1035374
Yeah well it was anarkiddies fault they committed regicide

 No.1035665

File: 1656270208946.mp4 (26.89 MB, 1920x1080, Mazovian_Socioeconomics.mp4)

>>1035651
precisely

 No.1035676

>>1035409
DON CARLOS MARX



File: 1656167500860-0.jpg (157.51 KB, 1200x876, ttraitor!.jpg)

File: 1656167500860-1.jpg (39.04 KB, 474x474, eyes left.jpg)

 No.1033425[Reply]

What would it take for police and/or military to ally with socialists?

It's a broad question, so do break it up into parts.
Knee-jerk reactions are narc reddit crap. Many police and military have joined anti-capitalist causes in the past, it's certainly not an unheard of phenomenon. While it may be difficult to gaon, there is a clear benefit to having socialists in these roles, as they are the roles most involved in direct anti-socialism action. So, it's therefore important to consider how they can be appealed to despite their professional roles in maintaining status quo or oppression.

Why do individuals in these groups radicalize to socialism?
Could any of these causes be fostered generally, or only to those predisposed?
28 posts and 11 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1035058

>>1033425
>Why do individuals in these groups radicalize to socialism?
3 main reasons history has shown us:
- Because they were thrown away in a pointless war, and because the military hierarchy was especially shitty and ruthless (these are connected obviously), and socialists were out there propagandizing and explaining how their program would solve this problem, and socialists were actively out there organizing and leading ppl. In other words, the soldiers were unhappy with their lot as soldiers, and socialists provided solutions and leadership.
- soldiers from lower class families trying to escape poverty can get pulled in via their family espousing socialism, saying it's what they need for the general economy, outside of the military.
- out of nationalism, because the whole country is going to shit and they have a strong sense of national pride and morality

But even in the best cases when the military allies with socialists (and it's usually not ever cops- cops are well paid and used to beating people down for their crimes against property and the bourgeois state. This whole job trains them (through their own actions) that it's bad when poor ppl act out because of their situation, and that things are best when rules are followed. Professional cretinism keeps them classcucked even if they came from a good background.

 No.1035221

Surprised this thread has gone on for as long as it has without any of the "every American/Western soldier is a literal Nazi who bathes in Iraqi child blood" crowd showing up.

 No.1035323

>>1035221
I remember that thread very well, but why are you surprised? Hasn't /leftypol/ been politically incoherent since its inception?

 No.1035366

.

 No.1035383

>>1035366
Too bad the man was never equal to the myth.



File: 1653382944269.jpg (45.63 KB, 1200x630, intruder-social.jpg)

 No.987312[Reply]

What are /leftypol/ belief systems you abide by regarding self defense from home robberies to personal attacks to on people on street to being jumped?

How far can people go to protect themselves in your view? Can they kill if you enter their property or attack them? Should they be banned from using lethal force to stop intruders or attacks?

What is your codes that draw your beliefs together? Share your thoughts
15 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1032896

If a guy attacks you then he is socially contracting the possibility of his own death, so fuck him any type of way

 No.1033124

>>1033123
good troll /pol/

 No.1034431

The whole "castle doctrine" and justification of killing an intruder is just an outgrowth from the bourgeois defence of private property. Private home ownership should be abolished.

 No.1035140

>>1032506
as much fun as gassing intruders might be you also run the risk of gassing yourself. also all that chlorine is going to fuck up any and all electronics, exposed metal and who knows what else

 No.1035157

killing someone because they want your bike to pawn off is excessive and their death results in more fallout to society collectively than if you just let them take it

this is doubly true for taking rich people shit because they can just easily replace it and it's only fair and just wealth redistribution at that point



 No.1034888[Reply]

Can we all admit that the old school anarcho-syndicalists were right about sabotaging the capitalist class’ need for workers to procreate? All the states banning abortion not only have ass-tier healthcare and maternity benefits but also ass-tier labour rights and this isn’t a coincidence. I’m thinking we should do whatever we can to distribute abortion information to women in these states as anti-capitalist praxis. Destroying the birthrate is 100% the way to go.
46 posts and 3 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1035188

>>1035158
retarded

 No.1035381

File: 1656257350895.jpg (111.9 KB, 750x737, qftc6uh74wo81.jpg)

>>1035084
>gnosticism is a heresy the same way bernstein or bakunin are heresy.
Bakunin thought lumpen proles were the revolutionary class, so I guess you could call that a Marxist "heresy." If what you're saying is Bakunin is merely a reaction to Marx. levellers? diggers? … I would have thought Bakunin was more in their tradition
But you seem to take as it read that gnostism is the deviation and council of Nicea Christianity® is the original.
Gnosticism has elements which predate this, such as Babylonian astrology on which is based its' map of the world (the prison house of matter) ringed around by archon-guarded zones and beyond these a liberated transcendental zone . (Roman Mithraism has something not totally dissimilar , where your spiritual rank corresponds to the planets.. but that's another thread.)
>It's retarded and has been proven wrong,
where?
>and anyone who sticks with retarded shit should be educated
"required belief" (dogma) may tell you if someone who claims to be, say, a Catholic, really is one. But that's s not proof in itself that what Catholics believe is true.
>Gnosticism is directly anti-materialist,
Not how you're saying it is. It could be argued that by saying we're spirit trapped in meat, that in itself is a illustration of how things often boil down to meat. That's not an anti-materialist world view.
>anti-proletarian as a result,
<When the proletariat is victorious, it by no means becomes the absolute side of society, for it is victorious only by abolishing itself and its opposite.
another anti-proletarian said that

Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

 No.1035386

>>1035381 (me)
that should read
>Hipsters, by the way, are *not* generally despised because of what they're into.

 No.1035581

>>1035159
Doesn’t work after 10 weeks, so if you find out your fetus has a chromosomal abnormality it will be too late to abort.

 No.1035742

Montana and Indiana are banning abortions too, numbnuts.



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 No.1033289[Reply]

Is stealing from your boss praxis or anarchist adventurism? I was wondering because the obviously steals my surplus, but then again there is no meaningful difference if just one person steals (if it were that a majority of people steal, then there would a meaningful decrease in accumulated capital).
12 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1034360

If you don't get caught it's based.

 No.1034404

>>1033289
You should only steal if you won't get caught, it's not worth the small amounts you could get away with versus your guaranteed wage

 No.1034682

>>1033289
It depends
>>1033303
FPBP

 No.1034777


 No.1034941

>>1033289
It depends. If you steal from your boss solely to enrich yourself, you're an opportunist. If you steal from your boss to maximize your liberty, then I could say that you are probably an adventurist. But if you steal from your boss to maximize your liberty and then give the money to your party, is that such a terrible thing? If you steal from your boss solely to benefit your party but do so against the warnings of your party, it might be adventurist. We're not supposed to just do what we want, even if it is justified. It is often justified to punch cops but there is an appropriate time and place for it. Your party might advise you to not engage in stealing only because they're concerned with a lack of discipline you could get yourself and other comrades in trouble, but it might depend on the material conditions of the time. Maybe it isn't only justified but totally encouraged by the party. I can't say. In any case, we should be careful here to not make a moral claim here.



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 No.975461[Reply][Last 50 Posts]

How is islam in anyway compatible with Marxism? despite the fact that Marxism is a materialist analysis of the world and Marx himself believed that religions are a tool used by the people in power to to control the masses (can be true in some cases). How is it compatible with Islam when

1. Marxists want to emancipate people while Islam is explicitly about slavery (Muslims call themselves slaves of God and their daily ritual is bowing down like a slave) plus Islam means to surrender

2. The quran explicitly grants property rights, allows free association (except with non-muslims in some cases) and free trade (except with some forbidden substances and trade with non-muslims in some cases) Therefore Islam is compatible with capitalism or you could call it capitalistic in nature

3. The Quran is not concerned with material equality at all and sees the material world as a fleeting moment and glorifies the afterlife. However there is a concept called zakat which is basically a flat tax given by rich muslims to poor muslims but the goal is not to achieve material equality

This thread is not about whether islam is right or not so there is no need to argue about that and if you dont have any good explanations or anything nice to say then dont reply at all
236 posts and 39 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1034843

>>1034797
<The same could be said about Monarchy.

monarchism literally say king/pope is saint while everyone else is a pleb

 No.1034871

File: 1656213753355-0.png (875.71 KB, 4000x4000, grace qt 2.png)

>>1034843
And Islam wants us to testify there are no other gods worthy of worship.

>while everyone else is a pleb

Not always the case.
As Hobbes says (who affirmed a natural equality for all men).
>The inconveniences therefore which attend the Dominion of one man, attend his Person, not his Unity.

And likewise, for you:
>And first it seems inconvenient, there should be committed so great a power to one man, as that it might be lawful to no other man or men to resist the same; and some think it inconvenient eo nomine, because he has the power. But this reason we may not by any means admit, for it makes it inconvenient to be ruled by Almighty God, who without question has more power over every man

And Robert Filmer adds.
>Greece and Rome have been as famous for Polytheism, or multitudes of gods, as of governors; and imagining oligarchy and democracy in heaven, as on earth

Whereas Monarchy is more complementary to the idea of One God in Heaven, as Bodin ascribes to Suleiman:
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

 No.1034882

>>975461
This post in a nutshell
>this religion has false consciousness and reactionary shit in its holy book
>how can adherents of this religion be radical?
It is true that there are many religious Muslims who have reactionary views. This could also be said of Christians, Jews, Buddhists, etc. Here's the important point: any religious adherent could believe in a liberation theology. It is true that most Marxists are atheists, and I am myself an atheist, but I also recognize that religious people CAN be good comrades if they do not forego the struggle for liberation and socialism and, crucially, possess a material analysis. Having a material analysis is not actually contingent on being an atheist.
<We have to be nuanced about this, because a large portion of working class people are adherents to a religion.
<If we refuse to talk to them because they are religious, then they will be continued to be misled by rightist demagogues who will sell them on a false consciousness, and cause them to become stunted in their personal growth.
>"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor, they call me a communist." -Dom Helder Camara, Brazilian Catholic Bithop and advocate of liberation theology.
That is to say: every person has the potential to be a comrade, but everyone is also at different levels of development, which affects their consciousness. The role of Marxists is to often plant a seed in their heads, but the coming to the conclusion of the need for socialism and liberation is contingent on people figuring it out for themselves. We plant the seeds as an intervention, like many political activities we engage in that also constitute a different kind of intervention.

>>975716
This

>pic not really related

 No.1034884

>>1034882
fixed typo
>"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." -Dom Helder Camara, Brazilian Catholic Bithop and advocate of liberation theology.

 No.1049715

>>975461
Islam is incompatible with Marxism in the way religions are incompatible with Marxism: it is designed to keep the masses silent while the bosses make more profits: it is the opium of the people. Saged for obvious answer



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 No.1033705[Reply]

Ecuador: Call For Debate on Possible Lasso's Dismissal
The request comes amid an indefinite national strike led by the Confederation of Indigenous Nationalities of Ecuador (CONAIE) against the Lasso administration, in which five deaths have been registered so far. The 47 Union for Hope (UNES) members announced their resignation from their seats in Parliament, looking for early elections. UNES legislator Marcela Holguín said via Twitter: "I, Marcela Holguín, assembly member for Pichincha, have just put my signature to advance elections in accordance with article 130, number two, of the Constitution."
https://www.telesurenglish.net/news/Ecuador-Call-For-Debate-on-Possible-Lassos-Dismissal-20220624-0018.html

Petro’s quest for a majority in Colombia’s Congress
The party of Colombia’s President-elect Gustavo Petro is seeking a majority coalition in Congress. Petro’s “Historic Pact,” became the biggest political party in the congressional elections in March, but needs the support of other parties for a majority coalition. This formation process will be led by Senator Roy Barreras, a senior lawmaker who’s been a member of multiple parties in the past. Barreras met with the 20 senators and 28 house representatives of the Historic Pact on Monday to prepare them for the formation of a coalition.
https://colombiareports.com/petros-quest-for-a-majority-in-colombias-congress/

IMF board concludes reviews for Ecuador, unlocking $1 billion
The International Monetary Fund executive board said Friday it had concluded its fourth and fifth reviews for Ecuador's 27-month Extended Fund Facility (EFF), allowing for the immediate disbursement of about $1 billion.
https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/imf-board-concludes-fourth-fifth-reviews-ecuador-disbursing-1-billion-2022-06-25/

Newly elected Labour MP urges voters to join Co-operative Party
NEWLY elected Labour MP Simon Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
2 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1033803

Thank you Based News Anon.

>>1033784
>Pike Place Market
This is their "flagship" store. I hope they close it.
>pro choice riots
Good. Let the fire rise.

 No.1033819

Voting Harder Won’t Bring Back RoeAN INTERVIEW WITH LILLIAN CICERCHIA
In the wake of yesterday’s anticipated but crushing Supreme Court decision striking down Roe v. Wade, Jacobin columnist Ben Burgis spoke to socialist writer and organizer Lillian Cicerchia about how to build a successful abortion rights movement in the United States. Their conversation, which appeared on Burgis’s YouTube show, Give Them an Argument, has been edited for length and clarity.
https://jacobin.com/2022/06/roe-v-wade-reproductive-health-movement-abortion

Iraq: Once again, Muqtada al-Sadr stirs up the entire political system
The recent resignations of the Sadrist bloc’s parliamentarians from the Iraqi parliament at the order of their political leader, Shia leader Muqtada al-Sadr, took everybody by surprise. Relinquishing the institutional power that comes with being the biggest parliamentary bloc with 74 seats, and leading a majority alliance of approximately 182 seats that still has a reasonable chance to form the next government, seems foolish at worst and a high-stakes risk at best. A closer look may reveal that a well-calculated strategy is underway and that surprise is just one element of it. The Sadrist rival, the mostly pro-Iran Coordination Framework, received the unexpected gift of dozens of replacement parliamentary seats to fill the spots left by the Sadrists. This gives the Coordination Framework somewhere between 120 and 130 seats, enough to lead the government-formation process and start the usual difficult fight over the spoils. The Framework’s many internal conflicts, overlooked during its six-month confrontation with Sadrists, will make it very hard for it to form a government without significant Iranian intervention. This would be needed to impose discipline within the political bloc and coerce reluctant Sunnis and Kurds, demonised by the factions for their previous alliance with Sadr, to join another fragile national unity government predicted not to last long with the Sadrists out.
https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/iraq-sadr-stirs-political-system-again

Working class independence and the war in UkrainPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

 No.1034661

File: 1656207339564.jpg (483.99 KB, 800x840, 67297314_p0.jpg)

Thanks News Anon

 No.1034732

Tybna

 No.1034770

>>1033803
If Schultz lets the Pike Place store close after selling the original Starbucks decades ago, we will honestly be able to say that there is no act of stupidity that he is above.



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 No.1024007[Reply][Last 50 Posts]

How do you respond?

I mean to us it intuitively makes sense why mainstream academia would find Marx taboo - can't rock the boat after all. But how do you convey that to someone who doesn't intuitively get it? Keep in mind the issue isn't whether Marx is right or not, no - before we can get to that "you" must prove to me that Marx is a "legitimate" source in the matter we are arguing, else I do not care what you have to say.
117 posts and 21 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1028768

>>1028474
>better read than liberal and pol retards
Lately this place has been rather disappointing in this regard, even if good threads still pop up from time to time.

 No.1028824

File: 1655994745630.mp4 (7.98 MB, 1080x1920, AS_Risitas_Laugh.mp4)


 No.1028836

>>1028088
because when I read it, I read it with people and we always used SNLT instead of marx's vaguer term "value." And I'd like to home in on something, you yourself have swapped between saying you were referring to SNLT and exchange value, which are different things. There are 3 Marxist ideas of value. Use value, exchange value, and socially necessary labor time (which marx indeed calls "value.") but earlier ITT you not only said nature didn't produce value (ignoring that it does produce USE value), but you went on to say you meant exchange value, and then later SNLT. It's not my fault you refuse to be specific and assume this stuff is obvious to everyone, while yourself waffling between which you refer to

 No.1029033

>>1028824
jew mommy milkers big boobas
>>1028836
anon you are talking about different people. I >>1024477 and >>1027814 , not >>1027886
every time someone fails to keep separate Marx' concepts of value we can't but assume it's some clueless lib who has not yet learned to tell them apart
the only thing here that can perhaps get confusing is that Marx uses the term wealth rather carelessly. whenever Marx talks about nature as being a source of wealth he always means use-values. therefore nature is a source of wealth and not value (SNLT). perhaps we should avoid words like "wealths" and "free gifts of nature" and just say use-value

 No.1034438

>>1027970
Academia and scholars are those who work at universities, in think tanks and philosophise for the ruling class on their money, stop being a disingenuous pseud.



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 No.1022282[Reply]

>consistent economic growth (era of stagnation is a meme)
>principled and dedicated communist
>political instructor in the Great Patriotic War, took part in the Victory Parade in 1945
>stopped rehabilitations of the likes of Tukhachevsky and Yakir
>tried to rehabilitate Stalin
>forced the USA into recognising Soviet military strength
>largest nuclear arsenal in the world, libs mad
>cracked down on liberals and nationalists
>made small steps towards restoring relations with the PRC without capitulation to Dengism
>period saw communist victories and revolutions in Vietnam, Laos, Angola, Mozambique, Afghanistan
>defended the Afghan communist revolution
>oversaw internationalist military action to crack down on the Czechoslovak liberal nationalists
>cracked down on dissidents, unlike Khrushchev letting Solzhenitsyn and co waltz around

Apologise.
77 posts and 28 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.1024379

>>1023990
>think the NEP's original run was cut short
Because it failed and was no longer needed. It was a concession made.

 No.1024918

>>1024133
sovietbros… not like this…

 No.1027939

File: 1655930152588.png (608.73 KB, 710x640, 1634379249202.png)


 No.1027945

>>1023325
Soo comfy. Anyone got some more Brezhnev-era /balticwave/ ?

 No.1034258

File: 1656194141410.png (48 KB, 756x760, 1556334807443.png)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKq5UN9sjqU

>Comrades, we have every reason to look at the future with confidence. The communist movement, loyal to the immortal teachings of Marx, Engels and Lenin, has enormous possibilities at its disposal, to acheive new victories in alliance with all anti-imperialist powers in the historic battles for social and nationa liberation of peoples, for peace, for a bright communist future for all of humanity.



 No.985358[Reply][Last 50 Posts]

mod reminder: assuming board consensus is a wrecker tactic and technically against the rules
OP:

What do you guys have against Rojava? Look how Iraq and Turkey treat the Kurds. Look up the Anfal campaign.

A libertarian socialist breakaway state for the Kurds is far, far better than fucking Assad, even if it's working with Americans.

Russia didn't do jack shit to help imperialism, all they did was bomb civilians.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/3/5/syrians-recount-horror-under-russian-air-attacks
275 posts and 68 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.990733

File: 1653532873197.png (33.54 KB, 729x141, ClipboardImage.png)

How do anons square statements like picrel with the claims that the movement is but an american pawn?

 No.990843

>>987646
this but unironically

 No.1034184

>>990733
Countries in the imperial core don't have the exact same interests, sometimes they disagree with each other on minor points.

 No.1034210


 No.1034275

File: 1656194764187.jpg (42.42 KB, 400x400, YJvCiG6V_400x400.jpg)

>>985358
>working with Americans.
>better



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