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File: 1762693893293.jpeg (159.88 KB, 1057x947, amrNKJe.jpeg)

 

Has there ever been a materialist explanation for why western socialist and communist groups are overwhelmingly white, relatively gender balanced and majority cis (disregarding pronoun nonsense)?

Whereas the membership of contemporary rightoid fascist groups is disproportionately hispanic, Indian or otherwise nonwhite, overwhelmingly male, and rife with pedophiles, perverts and other abusers?
16 posts and 6 image replies omitted.

There are two types of "right wing". Ethnonationalist right and civic nationalist right. Ethnonationalist right are almost entirely white. Civic nationalist right are majority white, but does have some minorities in it.

The left in most countries has a much bigger minority presence, since the left is (or at least claims to be) the defenders of minority rights.

So in short OP you should take your hitlerite proganda and shove it up your ass. The ethnic nationalist right continues to be irrelevant, and the civic nationalist right continues to eat it's lunch and cuck it out of politics.

Most Westoid communists and socialists are just LARPy libs affected with white guilt.

A lot of people seem to be misreading OP's point about the right being disproportionately ethnic minority as implying that it is majority ethnic minority.
A single black Klansman is disproportionate, given the stated aims of the KKK!

>>2555036
per >>2546215
left-wingers have high cultural capital, while right-wingers have low cultural capital. this divide is more fundamental than the racial divide, which is why you get the ironic situation that low-cultural-capital ethnic minorities will team up with racists because racism, too, is a low status belief. meanwhile anti-racism is high-status, so you'll have an anti-racist communist org which is 100% white.

>>2555121
you're basically right in the second part, but the case of party leaders is muddied a little by events and general cultural stereotypes.
when a woman leads a socdem party, people think she's distrustworthy for showing desirable socdem traits like being caring, empathetic, etc. because these are all female stereotypes anyway, they serve as a disadvantage. meanwhile in a right-wing party, you have to show everyone that you're a sociopathic bastard - which neutralizes the feminine stereotypes.

as for ethnic minorities, in britain the case is more mixed. Welsh Labour and the SNP both had ethnic minority leaders who held public office (albeit briefly, because the Welsh one was a crook and the SNP one took some terrible advice and blew up his own coalition.) overlapping with Sunak, and even Sunak (unlike Thatcher) was electorally unsuccessful.

>>2555128
It's not hitlerite nonsense to talk about cultural capital. It's not some transcendent truth that certain races are high/low capital or anything like that. It's always culturally contextual.
It's most interesting to discuss precisely within the context of white people. What is the strongest predictor of how a white boy will vote? Well, in the data it's education, but if you're going by vibes, it's how cool he is. for a certain definition of cool. you might waPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>2555036
What is your question?

>overwhelmingly white
Its statistics, like the birthday problem or something
>(disregarding pronoun nonsense)
OP is a reptile who poops and pees out of the same cloaca hole



 

Many people believe that economic depressions and recessions cause crime, and that economic booms are associated with low crime rates. History, however, tells a different story.

In my new LSU Press book, The Roots of Violent Crime in America: From the Gilded Age through the Great Depression, I examine in detail United States crime rates over a sixty-year period, from roughly the 1880s to 1940. I wrote about a more recent period, 1940 to 2015, in my previous book, The Rise and Fall of Violent Crime in America (2016). Together, these works provide new insights into the relationship between crime and various social conditions: poverty, immigration, economic crises, weakness in the criminal justice system, group subcultures of violence, and more.

A major issue addressed by Roots of Violent Crime, which I would like to touch on here, is the relationship between economic conditions and violent crime. I will limit my remarks to crimes of violence, that is, murder, rape, assault, and forcible robbery. This leaves out property crimes, such as theft/larceny, fraud, burglary, and arson. I’m also excluding so-called public order offenses, including drunk driving, weapons violations, and immigration crimes.

Property crimes and public order offenses correlate with economic conditions in a different way than violent crimes. One can readily see why. Suppose we have a terrible depression, as in the 1930s, with millions of people desperate for necessities and even for food itself. It doesn’t take much to imagine theft and burglary rising in such a situation. As I will show, however, violent crime does not follow the same trajectory as property crime, though it is widely believed that economic decline is a principal cause of crime increase.

The United States has suffered numerous economic recessions, the worst of which (the Great Depression) lasted for more than a full decade, from the stock market crash of late 1929 to the war boom of 1941. Major recessions also occurred in 1873–1879, 1893–1897, and 2007–2009. But there was no consistent relationship between economic decline or economic booms and violent crime.

In the 1890s, a major recession and the influx of millions of massively impoverished immigrants should by popular assumption have produced higher violent crime rates. As I write in Roots of Violent Crime (p. 168):

“If cities breed crime, then the late nineteenth-century United States should have experienced a crimPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

so violent crime is not affected by economic conditions?

Sure, if the cliche lefty explanation were true poor countries would be crime ridden hellholes, and sometimes they are especially if it's a failed state, but not uniformly. Seems to be more about community ties and religion. Similar with happiness studies where poor countries often end up ahead of rich countries, although northern European welfare states are usually near the top.

>For over three and a half decades, Barry Latzer served as professor of criminal justice at John Jay College, CUNY
Why is there a cunny university in New York?

Hmm so if it's not economics, then what else could it be?



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Politically, there are no people more repulsive to me than those Balts (by the way, I’m not a Russophile or anything like that). Such an exhausting underass fly syndrome and good house uyghur vibe radiates from all three countries in that forgotten little corner of Europe. To some extent, it can be understood, considering their position and historical context, but their pathological hatred and Nazi-leaning collusion, in the style of an obedient little dog, is so irritating and disgusting that it goes beyond anything that could justify them.

I don’t know what your experience with them is, but whenever I’ve come across someone from that crowd - mostly online - it’s always the same impression: they throw shade and open hatred toward 'my' country (‘little Russia, blah blah blah’), convinced that they’re above the Russians, with some strange badger-like habitus about them. Incredibly unpleasant people.
1 post and 1 image reply omitted.

I only ever met a transwoman from Lithuania. She was nice.

Read Devils Trapped In Amber

>>2566363
I actually only ever met nice people from the baltic countries in real life. And when it comes to the rude ones online, it helps to remember that they only exist because CPSU collapsed and only as long as it doesn't recover. The difference in firepower makes their existence as in any way politically relevant very easy to end as soon as the decision to restore the Soviet Union is taken.

>>2566960
>end as soon as the decision to restore the Soviet Union is taken.
Isnt this exactly what Russia is trying to do in Ukraine but without the socialism part?

>>2566363
>convinced that they’re above the Russians
aren't they?



 

New Noj rants on Lenin's Government. Key takeaways are as follows Lenin abandoned his ideals from State and Revolution, that being a state that eliminates the alienation caused by the difference between worker and politician that is prevalent in bourgeoisie democracy, due to the civil war. But kept the elimination of the distinction of different branches of government and that the idea that all political conflict arises from different class interests. The state was separated into two halves the Soviet Government and the Party with a matching set of hierarchy. With the goal of the party to guide the government, but as time went on the distinction between the too blurred. With the Politburo becoming the head of state due to its quick ability to create and pass laws as compared the slow bureaucratic soviet government. The party at all times dominated the government and prevented from any real change in policy from it. Finn ally the party was highly undemocratic as getting into the party required to be approved by other party members and any deviation in ideas could resulting in expulsion.New Noj rants on Lenin's Government. Key takeaways are as follows Lenin abandoned his ideals from State and Revolution, that being a state that eliminates the alienation caused by the difference between worker and politician that is prevalent in bourgeoisie democracy, due to the civil war. But kept the elimination of the distinction of different branches of government and that the idea that all political conflict arises from different class interests. The state was separated into two halves the Soviet Government and the Party with a matching set of hierarchy. With the goal of the party to guide the government, but as time went on the distinction between the too blurred. With the Politburo becoming the head of state due to its quick ability to create and pass laws as compared the slow bureaucratic soviet government. The party at all times dominated the government and prevented from any real change in policy from it. Finn ally the party was highly undemocratic as getting into the party required to be approved by other party members and any deviation in ideas could resulting in expulsion.
22 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

>>2558358
I think one thing the video misses is the fact that the "Soviet Government" as it existed wasn't ever supposed to be a permanent state of affairs. It was essentially a slap-dashed thing put together after after the sudden success of the October Revolution. But after the German Revolution failed the bolsheviks were left holding the bill so to speak. So I can only really shrug at alot of his criticisms because he seems to be under the assumption that Lenin's project was a permanent Soviet state apparatus rather than a temporary structure meant to carry Russia over the socialist finish line. Once the world revolution was closed off permanently the Bolsheviks whole world view at that point was in crisis and alot of changes had to be made at a point in time where Lenin's health was declining massively, so saying that Lenin was too egotistical or such to give up power I think is wrong. Its more that he only realized that the entire system had to be changed only after it was too late, really Lenin approving of the formation of the USSR in 1922 at all was a compromise from him. Initally at the 10th congress Lenin told Trotsky to oppose the integration of Georgia because Lenin didn't want the return of Russian chauvinism but he relented after since he was literally dying. It then became almost impossible for him to actually implement changes when running against party opposition practically because he didn't really have the energy to do anything other than sit in his dacha. Lenin really only had alot of managable political power during the civil war, and once it ended he was far to sick to refound the entire government as was needed and no one other than him had enough political legitimacy to operate such a task without Lenin dying first and creating a power vacuum. So in the end Stalin was able to consolidate power primarily because the position of general-secretary was an afterthought in a temporary jury rigged system that wasn't even supposed to last as long as it did. There are definitely criticisms to be had for a lack of long-term thinking but I think the video judges Lenin with the benefit of hindsight far too much.

>>2566703
already told in the text as an example, he adamantly denied that such document existed but when it became useful claimed was real when the only text pointed is one where Lenin is pissed off at everyone and specially stalin for talking shit to his wife.
also an testament is meaningless, after all who chooses the Gensec where the party and the soviets and not lenin, it was just a power play, useful for trotsky but a falsehood.

>>2566725
Not that anon but Stalin was a retarded Georgian mafioso who killed all the actual communists in the USSR. Once that happened any reforms became impossible because every communist was dead and replaced with braindead cocksuckers who only knew how to grovel. Quit defending the retard who left the communists in Greece & Korea out to dry because he was a coward who gave up every inch possible in the cold war. Collectivization was retarded and his policy of social fascism caused the Nazi's to rise to power in germany aswell. Truly he was the architect of the USSR's demise and its a wonder why anyone defends that brainlet. Trotsky was dumb aswell before you call me a Trot find some other boogeyman.

>>2566732
>Not that anon but Stalin was a retarded Georgian mafioso who killed all the actual communists in the USSR.(bunch of spergposting that is worth no time)
completely idiotic positions based on fallacies, distortions and no actual facts, an waste of time.
thanks for contribution to the discussion about how people will use lies and falsifications to strenghten their positions with no material factology behind with an actual example, seek a book and not a cold war indoctrination manual thanks.

>>2566732
> Stalin was a retarded Georgian mafioso who killed all the actual communists in the USSR.
This characterization of Stalin is typical of people who have not read his works

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXUFLW8t2snvqAQfkfz4OPo36DwgsaEPL



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Alienation is not some fucking moral crisis of humanity it's literally just how wage labor and capital accumulation work. Marxist humanists can't admit that because they keep putting "the human" at the center of everything instead of looking at the material setup that creates it.
12 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

It's a legal term, from which the "moral crisis" proceeds

File: 1763540343212.png (101.79 KB, 248x262, ClipboardImage.png)

Alien nation? That's what we're gonna be if we don't build that wall!

alien nation.

think about that.

>>2561611
>Alienation is not some fucking moral crisis of humanity
nobody with any marxist background, humanist or otherwise, says that
stop fighting imaginary enemies in your head

I got into a fight with a leftcom online about this. they got mad because I pointed out that not only is alienation not bad, it's what makes proles proles. we should lean into it



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Let's put aside the elephant in the room (India's obsession with Israel), and even their anti-muslim pro-hindu-obsession. Just look at their diplomatic and trade situation with Russia, China, and the USA.

India, by the laws of history, should have become communist-led by 2010, the latest. Socialism was (and still is) the class interest of 98% of their population. It's fucking insane, if you think about how cucked their comprador bourgeoisie situation is + the underdeveloped state of their infrastructure, their semi-feudal small manufacturing, their idiotic e-scam economy, the absolute destitution of their villages/peasants, and so on. Obviously, it was the USA that """"helped"""" India to get rid of the Naxalite """"threat"""".

But then you look at this fucking country's geopolitics/diplomacy/trade and it DOESN'T MAKE FUCKING SENSE, DUDE.

https://swentr.site/india/627932-new-great-game-in-south-asia/ (Please ignore the title and keep reading, it's a very good summary.)

Like, what the actual FUCK is India's foreign policy?!

They hate Pakistan, they try to bribe Sri Lanka, they suck both US and multipolar dick at the same time, and they have constant border disputes.

It's fuckin insane, to the point that future historians will be writing books about the ridiculous failures of India's foreign policy.
13 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

>>2566181
First time seeing an imperialist wannabe?

File: 1763607932387.png (117.61 KB, 1600x900, ClipboardImage.png)

>they suck both US and multipolar dick at the same time
most countries do this
"multipolar" powers also suck the USA's dick

>>2566707
Kerala should be independent first. USIR when?

>>2566270
I honestly don't know how the Naxalites didn't get more support. There must have been really strong boogeyman anti-communist propaganda by Hindu religioids/West-glazers

>>2566430
No one can convince me electoral democracy isn't just a release valve for revolutionary pressure.



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Why don't Palestinians just make czech hedgehogs like picrel? It worked for the Ukrainians. They have plenty of rubble.

Fuck Israel fascists! Free Palestine! RIP Abu Obaida!
1 post omitted.

>>2566424
if it was a useful tactic im sure they would have adopted it. but i guess the metal is far more useful to be melted down, they can use it to reinforce tunnels, or make improvised explosives and shells.

>>2566519
Yeah,but they can get some rebar fucking easily.

>>2566589
There is a cease fire going on last time I checked. Maybe focus on humanitarian issues instead of building rebar obstacles.

>>2566591
>There is a cease fire going on
….? The Israelis never honored it and humanitarian aid is still being blocked

>>2566591
The ceasefire that the Zionists refuse to respect? That ceasefire?



File: 1761390896291.png (1.39 MB, 1248x832, notanantiimperialist.png)

 

Can someone give me non-bullshit explanation of how exactly Western PROLETARIAT benefits from imperialism?

The West exported their investments and know-how and helped in the industrialization of the third world. Not just China, but also SEA, Asian tigers, India, Brazil, Poland, Malaysia etc. This resulted in the exact opposite of what happened in colonialism. The Western industries were hollowed out this time, and outsourced to the third world. Now sure, the Western bourgie benefited from this, but the money didnt trickle down much. That's why in the 1970s you could support a family and live a decent life doing a simple blue collar job and now you cant. So where exactly did the Western PROLETARIAT benefit from this imperialism?
243 posts and 26 image replies omitted.

>>2562260
it didnt give westoids any treats so thats why they think it didnt do shit

I speak for the empire but the empire doesn't speak for me

>>2562307
>The point of Scientific Socialism is to build Communism, not abolish markets. To negate the commodity aspects of socialist direct social products and to attempt to abolish commodity production is obviously erroneous. Ch’en Po-ta, a renegade and Trotskyite, clamored for the abolition of commodity production and exchange during the period of the rapid development of China’s rural people’s commune movement in a vain attempt to lead revolution and construction astray. Chairman Mao saw through this conspiracy in time and engaged him in a resolute struggle. In the resolutions of the Sixth Plenum of the Eighth Central Committee of the Chinese Communist Party personally convened and chaired by Chairman Mao, this was pointed out: “This way of thinking which attempts to prematurely abolish commodity production and exchange, prematurely negate the constructive role of commodities, value, money, and price is detrimental to developing socialist construction and is therefore in correct.” Socialist commodity production must not only be retained, but must also be developed to consolidate the economic link between China’s industry and agriculture and between urban and rural areas in order to promote the development of socialist construction.
uh yeah "prematurely" abolish commodity production. In full communism its abolished. So yes the point of scientific socialism is to establish communism but communism implies that commodity production is abolished otherwise you will eventually recreate the social antagonisms of capitalism including class. This is basic shit.

>>2566158
You retards are both wrong, probably because you both redefined “socialism” to mean a specific government policy ya stupid cunts

>>2562294
I don’t identify with any nation, faggot



 

Nazism is founded on Satanism.
Nietzche, the philosopher whose works were used as a philosophical backing for the Reich, was a Grand master of the Ordo Templi Orientis Lodge, whose leader was Aleister Crowley. Aleister Crowley, if you don't know, was the premier satanist and occultist of the 19th century, who coined the term "Do as thou wilt shall be the whole of the law". He is the man who inspired LaVey to found the Church of Satan.
Hitler himself was deeply interested in occultism, and openly expressed this. Nazism in fact directly traces its roots to Ariosophy, a racist offshoot of Theosophy, the movement Crowley was a part of. Himmler was particularly embroiled in this.
The recent rise of Nazism is nothing more and nothing less than a psyop to compromise the right-wing youth into being Satanists.
2 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

>>2565990
The return of anti-Semitism and fascism on a global scale is a foreshadowing of a global alliance of Gentile nations against Jerusalem. God is allowing this rebellion against Him to happen on purpose so that Jews will repent to God and accept Jesus. Biblical end times prophecy or something

>>2565990
>Nietzche, the philosopher whose works were used as a philosophical backing for the Reich, was a Grand master of the Ordo Templi Orientis
<Fact
Reported for retardation.

Aleister Crowley was/is absolutely not a 'satanist', and neither was/is the Ordo Templi Orientis. Their beliefs are essentialy Jewish Qabbalah with a few 'egyptian' influences, they worship the same Abrahamic God as almost everyone else, they just have sex about it sometimes so puritans kneejerked and labelled them 'satanists'.

your analysis is historically illiterate and idealist, material conditions are the primary determinants in the development of history and culture, the social 'superstructure' is derived from the material, is a reaction to it.

>>2565990
I would describe everything in this thread (including Ayn Rand) as an outgrowth of German Romanticism.

Also btw i copy and pasted this thread unto mutiple imageboards and found this site had the most intelligent takes on it



File: 1746122505249-0.png (1.54 MB, 600x1200, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 1746122505249-1.png (660.48 KB, 600x600, ClipboardImage.png)

 

This thread is for the discussion of cybercommunism, the planning of the socialist economy by computerized means, including discussions of related topics and creators. Drama belongs in /isg/

Reading
Towards a New Socialism by Paul Cockshott and Allin Cottrell: http://ricardo.ecn.wfu.edu/~cottrell/socialism_book/
Brain of the Firm by Stafford Beer
Cybernetic Revolutionaries by Eden Medina
Cybernetics: Or the Control and Communication in the Animal and the Machine and The Human Use of Human Beings (1st edition) by Norbert Wiener
Economic cybernetics by Nikolay Veduta
People's Republic of Walmart by Leigh Phillips and Michal Rozworski
Red Plenty by Francis Spufford
Economics in kind, Total socialisation and A system of socialisation by Otto Neurath (Incommensurability, Ecology, and Planning: Neurath in the Socialist Calculation Debate by Thomas Uebel provides a summary)

Active writers/creators
Sorted by last name
>Paul Cockshott
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
587 posts and 110 image replies omitted.

>>2562210
Introducing Fixed Prices

What if instead of a bidding for resources with variable-price bids, the bids must be done at fixed prices? I very strongly feel that a resource-allocation system needs to have some flexibility. Imagine only one pseudo-firm wants some resource, but doesn't have the play-money. Isn't that a very silly situation? If the prices are fixed, it should be possible and indeed trivial for that pseudo-firm's spending to exceed its budget to get the resource.

What is the purpose of the budgets? To give the pseudo-firms power to access resources. If society decides to give pseudo-firm A twice the budget society gives to pseudo-firm B for the next period, our working assumption is that society evaluates what A will do as more important than what B will do (even though the two decisions might be made by two different committees without a single person being a member of both). If we have to state any sort of ratio of importance here, we assume that what pseudo-firm A will do is deemed as twice as important by society compared to B. (I'm assuming here A and B are in the same tier. Like in the system with flexible prices, we can have lexicographic tiers of importance for the pseudo-firms, so that a lower tier only gets the leftovers from the higher tiers.)

Suppose the spending period isn't over yet so no new budgets are yet available, but both pseudo-firms are already out of play-money for accessing resources. They are going into minus. I'm using this phrasing for a reason. I'm NOT saying they are "going into debt", because they won't have to pay back anything. Any pseudo-firm's play-money account, whether positive or negative, gets reset to zero at regular intervals and it gets a new budget.

Suppose there is a resource that nobody is bidding for except A and B, each asking for all of it. (Despite using fixed prices here, I'm still using the term "bids", because like with variable-price bidding the requests are not instantly approved, instead we wait for a while till bids are closed; and if the demand exceeds what's in stock, we allocate the stuff in a way that follows a simple rule that has nothing to do with the order in which the bids arrived.) Suppose both A and B are in minus. Again, it is clear that the resource should be assigned despitPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>2564859
>We can even split up the same resource and make available some amount of it in each system
I've been thinking along these lines. the plan amounts to a set of entitlements to resources. beyond the plan we could have spending money, but firms choosing to use their money instead of plan allocation get lower priority. for this to work we also need firms to produce enough of a surplus that such spontaneous orders can be accommodated. in other words we should plan for a bit of an excess

File: 1763538237512.png (155.14 KB, 398x316, ClipboardImage.png)


>>2562210 (me) & >>2564859 (me)
Reminder I made this not as a proposal, but so that we have something to prod.

In the example where A gets twice the budget of B, that also means that if we give B one POMF, we should give A two POMFs. Seems ridiculous to obsess over such a detail that doesn't matter… but when they both go broke except for their POMF accounts they haven't touched yet, it suddenly matters a lot and this is exactly what we want in that situation.

I think the second system with the fixed prices is worse than the first. The fixed prices were introduced to deal with worries about raising prices. But to deal with that, it is enough to have a price ceiling. I have to think a bit more about how I replace the second system (already with an eye on how to combine two systems into one); but I can already tell that by yeeting fixed prices, we also get rid of the necessity of letting accounts go into minus.

Anyway, thread is full. Btw. OP's links to Veduta & Zachariah are dead. I predict the next OP will still include them.

new thread:

>>2566144



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