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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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So, lately I was wondering about free will, the idea that we somehow have total free will over our behavior sounds kind of absurd to me in some sense, be either genetics (you don't choose your genes) or environment (you don't choose your enviroment which you grow up), both don't let much of choose for the person, that how truly free are we? What's the LeftyPol opinions of the question of free will and the implications to leftist policies?
5 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

>>2421431
eh, its a bit more complicated. i basically agree on the fundamental level but it is not a satisfactory answer to the question of why we meaningfully experience ourselves as having free will

>>2421383
look into free-will compatibilism OP. its the generally accepted and imo intuitive version of determinism among contemporary philosophers of consciousness. basically, we do in fact live in a deterministic universe, but our perception and experience of our lives include free will in a non-superficial way.

its not that free-will is just "an illusion" or a "benevolent lie" (some people say the latter which i think is retarded), but that self-direction and choice is so central to human experience that it does meaningfully exist even if it doesnt have ultimate causal power. the way i think of it is: all the material & processes that make up an individual human brain, all the events & circumstances & socialization that go into our thoughts & behaviors, are part of the determinative matrix. if that is the case, which i think is true and follows from determinist presumptions, then the experience of free-will is an integral mechanism in the human experience. our "freedom" may not be infinite and metaphysical, but anybody who asserts this in any case is delusional and wrong. the fact that "we were always going to do what we end up doing" is likewise not necessarily a negation of our free-will, since our free-will as it actually exists is not the freedom to act outside of the deterministic universe we are part of, its our freedom to act within our own lives within the tangible boundaries presented to us. one of which boundaries is inevitably time, which makes the question of whether we were "always" going to do something not only practically irrelevant but a question that only makes sense if you presume that there is experience which exists outside of time, ipso facto absurd unless you are a theist of some sort (in which case none of the determinative premises need to apply anyway)

Free will is a nonsense concept that only exists to imply it's absence, to convince people they are destined to do the thing the speaker wants them to do.

Someone that believes they don't have free will behaves differently than one that does, as do both behave differently to someone that either doesn't know about it or rejects it entirely.

Its basically a complete spook isn't it. Whether we do or don't have it, nothing changes practically or subjectively

>>2421584
This is a huge amount of confused rambling
Free will is ultimately about responsibility
If you believe that people can be punished for their actions you ultimately believe in a free will
>But material conditions are what shapes people's beliefs and actions
There is a difference between absolute free will and relative free will. When talking about free will most philisophers and ethicists talk about the latter

A true anti free will position would ultimately entail some sort of radical antinomianism. This takes shapes in psychoanalysis where the individual itself is revealed to be an illusion. And also in Buddhism where the goal is not to be a "good person" (being good implies you have concrete will over your actions) but to realize that individual existence is ultimately an illusion

>>2421603
>Free will is ultimately about responsibility
yes, but "agency" is perhaps a preferable term. are we "free"? perhaps not. but do we have agency? we must, for we are made responsible for our own karmic debt.
>>2421473
a natural slave is someone externally moved, rather than inwardly willed - so this is the circumstance of environmental primacy. self-reflection must then begin by stillness in the body, which brings steadiness in the mind. personal will then represents a fundamental negation or restriction against the unconditional, by appropriating it under the condition of one's own ends. this is basic instrumental reason, where man becomes a master over his environment and so determines it. this is present in any child, whose first act of creation is destruction.

the external then has primacy over us when we allow it to determine us rather than elsewise. fascinating wisdom literature concerns this relation, where to some, resisting nature brings strife, while to others, strife is necessary for a man's own being. the boring but sensible position is to aim for balance. lao tzu recognises that the way of nature is to level everything back toward its own primal order. nature resists man and man resists nature, like the tension of a branch holding a nest, yet in this is also supplication and necessity. as lao tzu correctly discerns, if you sharpen a knife too long, it becomes blunt, and so man can only live in vain, ultimately. if man is a servant of nature, then nature may be a servant to man. that is our hope.



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This thread is for the discussion of cybercommunism, the planning of the socialist economy by computerized means, including discussions of related topics and creators. Drama belongs in /isg/

Reading
Towards a New Socialism by Paul Cockshott and Allin Cottrell: http://ricardo.ecn.wfu.edu/~cottrell/socialism_book/
Brain of the Firm by Stafford Beer
Cybernetic Revolutionaries by Eden Medina
Cybernetics: Or the Control and Communication in the Animal and the Machine and The Human Use of Human Beings (1st edition) by Norbert Wiener
Economic cybernetics by Nikolay Veduta
People's Republic of Walmart by Leigh Phillips and Michal Rozworski
Red Plenty by Francis Spufford
Economics in kind, Total socialisation and A system of socialisation by Otto Neurath (Incommensurability, Ecology, and Planning: Neurath in the Socialist Calculation Debate by Thomas Uebel provides a summary)

Active writers/creators
Sorted by last name
>Paul Cockshott
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
386 posts and 74 image replies omitted.

>>2419109
Beggars can't be choosers. I have no problem working with Parecon people.

>>2419109
>we need an explicitly Marxist planning institute for new central planning
go found one then instead of whining here. but also it's important to attack incorrect ideas. we can't be too abrasive about it either, because then people won't listen. it's one thing to bitch ITT

>communist mmorpg
Unless you make it so people have to sit in lectures to become doctors in the game might as well skip the realism and just make it like neopets

>>2419251
>They discovered an infinite money glitch
And what would this glitch be? Please, I need money…

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Dave Zachariah was recently on Föreningen Aurora's podcast. it's in Swedish, but perhaps it can be AI translated or something:
https://foreningenaurora.wordpress.com/podcast/
https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/aurora-podcast6/episodes/David-Zachariah-En-modern-arbetsvrdeteori-e36ckce
https://podcasts.apple.com/se/podcast/david-zachariah-en-modern-arbetsv%C3%A4rdeteori/id1640039866?i=1000720695990
it summarizes what he, Farjoun and Machover say in How Labor Powers the Global Economy. attached it just in case anyone ITT hasn't read it



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Thread dedicated to /leftypol/ original content.
>Post original content you've made, or OC someone else recently made which you want to share.
<Or ITT collaborate on improving content already made.

If your original content is good enough, it would most likely be shared on the /leftypol/ twitter account!
Make sure to follow us and feel free to leave suggestions on this thread~
https://twitter.com/leftypol_org
https://nitter.net/leftypol_org

previous thread: >>1762168
>>>/leftypol_archive/1762168 (if it gets archived by mods)

New Booru:
https://lefty.pictures

MAKE SURE TO UPLOAD YOUR OC TO THE BOORU SO IT DOESNT GET PRUNED FOREVER!!!
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base superstructure type meme

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🇫🇷🇫🇷🇫🇷 Aux armes, citoyens ! 🇫🇷🇫🇷🇫🇷
I noticed there is no thread for France related shit. So let this be one. French people deserve a safe space and guarantees for their continued existence on loser imageboards!
J'ai remarqué qu'il n'y a pas de thread dedié pour la France, alors que les salauds américains et anglais en ont des centaines. Français, ne succombez pas à l'impérialisme anglochiotte!

Subjets of Macronpiter, leave a post.
115 posts and 26 image replies omitted.


>>2421167
Comme Mélenchon qui se met à hurler dès qu'une personne critique Mitterand ou Jospin devant lui, si Le Pen était pas attardée et néolibérale elle pourrait le détruire. Surtout que maintenant LFI ne parle que de Gaza (sinon les Sunnites vont voter pour Villepin dans deux ans), l'extrême-droite non-néolibérale à un boulevard pour faire un programme protectionniste et anti-UE

L'élection va probablement se jouer sur la récupération politique des manifs du 10 septembre, et Macron a encore un mois pour prévoir comment il va écraser et diviser les manifestants. Si j'étais lui j'enverrai juste un flic ou un membre de la FNSEA déguisé en fermier qui insulte les arabes, les trans et le Hamas devant les caméras.

What are the best French leftist novels?
I like Zola but he seems like a liberal

>>2409988
>L'Europe en tant que projet et tout a fait bénéficiel a la gauche.
La Gauche au parlement européen est extrêmement faible et sert à rien.
Il est aussi très dur de se positionner sur l'Europe pour les partis de gauche, les confus-abstentionnistes pourraient être sensibles à ça.
Une seule solution: le démantèlement de l'UE par le prolétariat international en armes.

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>>2421167
On s'en bat les couilles de l'orientation sexuelle de Bardella. C'est une merde humaine qui n'a pour lui que son image, mais qui chie mou dès qu'il est mis sous pression (comme quand il était étudiant).

Et dire que le RN s'est adouci en le comparant à Sarkozy, c'est ne rien comprendre à ce qui s'est passé pendant les élections présidentielles de 2007. C'est Sarkozy qui s'est radicalisé, et depuis lors, c'est toute la droite française qui lui a emboité le pas. La différence entre à l'époque et aujourd'hui, c'est que comme toute crise du capitalisme, la bourgeoisie pousse vers le fascisme, et les discours d'extrême-droite se sont banalisés dans les médias.

>>2412735
C'est complètement contre-productif de ne pas se revendiquer de gauche aujourd'hui. Comme si rajouter de la confusion dans un champ médiatique complètement dominé pas la droite et l'extrême-droite allait être à l'avantage de la gauche.
Au contraire, tu le revendiques fièrement et tu rallies les gens aux idées communistes/socialistes.

>>2421177
>si Le Pen était pas attardée et néolibérale
Oui enfin, c'est comme dire "si un lion n'était pas carnivore" hein!?
L'extrême-droite française a fait son virage pro-européen pour justement se dédiaboliser et avoir une image respectable, et ne fera pas marche arrière.
Je suis curieux de savoir ce que tu définis comme une extrême-droite non-néolibéral.

Et t'inquiète que si il se passe quelque chose le 10 septembre, c'est la gauche qui "récupèrera" le machin, parce que la droite et l'extrême-droite sont des débiles individualistes fainéants qui ne se sont jamais bougés le cul dans la rue, et c'est pas aujourd'hui que ça va arriver.



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4 posts omitted.

this is why you stick to the big guns MELS, and not some opportunistic nationalist hogwash tbh

>>2421281
>>2421274
yeah im sorry but without further information i am not going to believe one photo and the fucking Miami Herald, and even in that article they suggest the reasoning may have been epstein looking for somewhere to flee before his trial. it is not even clear whether castro knew the details about that trial or epstein in general, and if he did he was in the minority considering per the miami heralds own report, the man that traveled there with epstein allegedly did not know about lolita express etc. even if that guys lying, it was a credible enough lie prior to epsteins 2019 arrest where almost no one knew the name jeffrey epstein, that castro as head of state and diplomatic representative meeting with him once under ambiguous circumstances in 2003, means absolutely nothing until some further information can be provided

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>>2421281
>revisionist was a possible pedophile
ml cope incoming

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why do moralists insist on pathetic attempts at character assassination instead of simply admitting they have no argument and moving on.

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>>2421421
So you are a fellow Branca enjoyer, I see



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Epstein is connected to Israel, this is why Trump is covering it up. He doesn't want to risk the political fallout for Israel when people realize all of Epstein's clients were blackmailed and used as Israeli assets.

"The most concrete link is his relationship with former Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak. Epstein and Barak met numerous times between 2013 and 2017, with Barak visiting Epstein’s properties in Florida and New York approximately 30 times, including a 2014 private flight in Florida. Barak received $2.3 million from an Epstein-associated foundation between 2004 and 2006, and Epstein invested $1 million in a limited partnership established by Barak in 2015.

Another connection stems from Epstein’s ties to Ghislaine Maxwell, whose father, Robert Maxwell, was a British media mogul alleged to have had links to the Israeli intelligence agency Mossad. Some sources, including former Israeli intelligence officer Ari Ben-Menashe, have claimed Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell ran a “honey-trap” operation for Mossad to blackmail influential figures. A lawsuit by a woman identified as Jane Doe 200 alleged Epstein boasted of being a Mossad agent.

Epstein was also associated with the Wexner Foundation, which supports Jewish leadership and has ties to Israel. His financial backer, Leslie Wexner, was a member of the “Mega Group,” a collection of Jewish philanthropists, which some, like former NSA counterspy John Schindler, have speculated was linked to Israeli intelligence operations. Epstein reportedly invested in an Israeli startup, Reporty Homeland Security (later rebranded as Carbyne), connected to Israel’s defense industry, further fueling speculation."
8 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

Aight but why a tall jpeg tho? Could've posted a link or saved a text file.

>>2407313
I will never trust these zionism obsessed "leftists". Its a /pol/ psyop.

>>2411831
It's sufficient enough.


I know this.



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🇵🇸 PREVIOUSLY ON THE HOLY LAND 🇵🇸
>>>/leftypol/2304450

————————
🚨 Live Happenings/Updates 🚨
Sites that have active live-blogs:
• Al-Jazeera: https://www.aljazeera.com/

• Middle East Eye: https://www.middleeasteye.net/israel-palestine-hamas-war-gaza-live-invasion

• The Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/world/palestinian-territories

• Times of Israel: https://www.timesofisrael.com/topic/liveblog/ (trigger warning)

—————————————————–————————
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.
474 posts and 183 image replies omitted.

>>2419176
>He said he remained “desperately committed” to the two-state solution
these ghouls still can't see Israel for what it is. at this point I think the only plausible punishment is decimation of the entire Israeli population

>>2420865
Gays, Roma and communists weren't allowed to play victim for 80 years due to that narrative.

>For a long time, the enemies have been planning, skillfully and with precision, for the achievement of what they have attained. They took into consideration the causes affecting the current of events. They strived to amass great and substantive material wealth which they devoted to the realisation of their dream. With their money, they took control of the world media, news agencies, the press, publishing houses, broadcasting stations, and others. With their money they stirred revolutions in various parts of the world with the purpose of achieving their interests and reaping the fruit therein. They were behind the French Revolution, the Communist revolution and most of the revolutions we heard and hear about, here and there.

>With their money they formed secret societies, such as Freemasons, Rotary Clubs, the Lions and others in different parts of the world for the purpose of sabotaging societies and achieving Zionist interests. With their money they were able to control imperialistic countries and instigate them to colonize many countries in order to enable them to exploit their resources and spread corruption there.They aim at undermining societies, destroying values, corrupting consciences, deteriorating character and annihilating Islam. It is behind the drug trade and alcoholism in all its kinds so as to facilitate its control and expansion.


>The imperialistic forces in the Capitalist West and Communist East, support the enemy with all their might, in money and in men. These forces take turns in doing that. The day Islam appears, the forces of infidelity would unite to challenge it, for the infidels are of one nation.


>Nationalist Movements in the Palestinian Arena. The Islamic Resistance Movement respects these movements and appreciates their circumstances and the conditions surrounding and affecting them. It encourages them as long as they do not give their allegiance to the Communist East or the Crusading West.


>Today it is Palestine, tomorrow it will be one country or another. The Zionist plan is limitless. After Palestine, the Zionists aspire to expand from the Nile to the Euphrates. When they will have digested the region they overtook, they will aspire to further expansion, and so on. Their plan is embodied in the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion", and their present co
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bump

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>Israel plans to take full control of the Gaza Strip, says the country's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in an interview with Fox News. According to Netanyahu, the goal is to "liberate" the Palestinians from Hamas rule.

<– We want to liberate the people living in Gaza from Hamas's terrible terrorism, he says.


https://www.foxnews.com/video/6376659553112



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Adulthood is realizing that Stalin was right about basically everything (except maybe pissing his pants when the Nazis invaded and giving bad military orders, but in the end the Fash chuds were defeated and you can't fault the man for not being both a political and military genius)

/leftypol/, suggest to me good reading material for red pilling people about /ourguy/ Stalin

Kulaks/Uyghas/Zionists fuck off
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itt

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>>2421042
world of baitcraft

>>2421028
>they should have just done X Y Z despite morale, supply lines, plans, provisions
Alt history HOI4 brain idealism

>>2420947
Feels like he should have more of an accent. He spoke russian with a thick Georgian accent apparently, so it'd be more appropriate if the English version also sounded less standardized

>>2421027
Alexander Yakovlev was a total bleeding heart libfag tho. You are still right, I'm just saying the people of perestroika were the prime example of unnatural selection where the fags who said the right words were considered righteous communists as opposed to those who had their own opinions.



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‘Unprecedented’ wildfire burns area size of Paris in southern France
The fire, which started on Tuesday afternoon, had burned 16,000 hectares (39,537 acres) inland from the Mediterranean near the Spanish border. It began in the village of Ribaute in the Aude department, spreading across the rural, wooded area of the Corbières, famous for its vineyards and medieval villages.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/aug/06/france-largest-wildfire-this-year-corbieres-hills

Hamburg dockworker demands union action against genocide in Gaza
Mohammed Alattar, who has lost 80 family members in the Gaza massacre, writes in a petition addressed to Verdi that he approached the union leadership with his story and asked what the union was doing in answer. He described the response with anger: “Nothing came back, no chance. Only complete ignorance and silence.” This disregard for the suffering and catastrophe in Gaza, Alattar writes, “reflects the same disregard and isolation that Jewish people in Germany experienced 80 years ago.”
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2025/08/06/fbfe-a06.html

About 300 migrants start walk north from southern Mexico
The group of migrants that left Tapachula, near the border with Guatemala, was small in comparison to migrant caravans in years past. There has been very little movement of migrants in public since U.S. President Donald Trump took office in January, though migration numbers had been falling even prior to that. Those walking Wednesday said their goal was not to reach the United States, but rather central Mexico. They complained that they had been waiting for months to legalize their status or receive asylum.
https://apnews.com/article/mexico-migrants-us-trump-tapachula-a920fcba8752d1c6f3b1f3eb2c4579aa

Brazil: Opposition lawmakers stay the night in Congress
The opposition was demanding a general and unrestricted amnesty for those convicted of attempting a coup d'état, in addition to De MoraPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

Army sergeant shot 5 soldiers before he was tackled and arrested at Fort Stewart, officials say
A sergeant shot five soldiers Wednesday at one the country’s largest Army bases before he was quickly tackled by other Fort Stewart troops, forcing a brief lockdown, officials said. Few details were immediately available about what led to the gunfire, but officials said the shooter was Sgt. Quornelius Radford, 28, who used a personal handgun, not a military firearm.
https://apnews.com/article/georgia-army-post-lockdown-shooter-0b3b2cda384d1f33d107d988e6088d92

Democrats Rebuked for Backing GOP War on Public Schools, Trump Voucher Expansion
Evidence is mounting across the United States that school vouchers are harming public schools—and numerous studies have shown they largely do not benefit students academically as proponents have long claimed—leaving education advocates to wonder why the issue of so-called "school choice" is a fault line within the Democratic Party.
https://www.commondreams.org/news/public-school-vouchers

Trump administration makes it easier to join ICE
The change illustrates one of the challenges with Trump’s oft-promised goal of deporting 1 million people per year. The White House has enlisted the help of local law enforcement through cooperation agreements, and states such as Florida and Texas have volunteered to help, but any concerted effort will require hiring thousands more agents by an agency that has struggled with retention and retirements in recent years. In addition to lifting the age restrictions, DHS is also offering a signing bonus of up to $50,000, student loan repayment assistance and other benefits to attract recruits, the agency said in a news release.
https://www.politico.com/news/2025/08/06/trump-ice-immigration-00496051
https://archive.ph/5Yrx2

Trump moves to shut down NASA missions that measure carbon dioxide and plant healthPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

957 - Democracy Soon! feat. Osita Nwanevu (8/4/25) (Chapo Trap House)
Osita Nwanevu stops by to discuss his new book The Right of the People: Democracy and the Case for a New American Founding. Osita leads us through his case that American “democracy” as it currently stands isn’t that democratic at all. We discuss the real intentions of the founders, the actual American revolution of the Civil War, and the stalled re-founding of reconstruction. We also look at the potential for economic democracy, the political reforms needed to re-found the country, the problem of the judiciary, and the challenges of a new media environment to democratizing movements. Yes, today the wacky morning DJ actually does say democracy’s a joke.
https://soundgasm.net/u/ClassWarAndPuppies/957-Democracy-Soon-feat-Osita-Nwanevu-08-04-2025

BRICS+: Anti-Imperialist Solidarity in the Global South?
At the 17th BRICS+ summit, held in Brazil on June 6-7, the assembled governments claimed to continue their shift away from the U.S.-dominated world order by “strengthening Global South Cooperation for a more inclusive and sustainable governance.” On the surface, these goals might seem to align with socialist and anti-imperialist positions. Western neoliberal institutions like the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank guarantee the rule of a few big capitalist powers. This leads some socialists, like the Party of Socialism and Liberation (PSL), to see BRICS+ as having “the potential to create openings for this [socialist] project by challenging imbalances among nations in the global economy and diplomacy.” However, BRICS+ is full of internal contradictions. Its aim of democratically reforming the United Nations does not go beyond giving a select few Global South nations a seat at the exploiters’ table. It is a reformist solution which does not address the root of global inequality. The New Development Bank, established by the BRICS states and headquartered in Shanghai, claims to offer “sustainable infrastructure development” in a multilateral spirit, yet its development projects still operate on foreign debt. Patrick Bond, Professor of Sociology at the University of Johannesburg, summarises this as “maintaining policies of economic liberalisation that lower national econPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

TYBNA

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Thanks News Anon!



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How do materialists solve the issue of infinite regression that happens in the materialist worldview?

<Things are made of matter!

>What is matter made of?
<Out of atoms!
>What are atoms made of?
<Subatomic particles!
>What are subatomic particles made of?
<Strings/They are excitations of quantum fields!
>What are strings/quantum fields made of?

Where does it end?
327 posts and 32 image replies omitted.

>>2420970
>Your error is assuming temporality is "innately philosophical" and thus fused to "fundamental nature".
If this helps, I think "now " doesn't have duration in time. The present moment is like a point on a line, it doesn't "last" in time. Otherwise, if it did have duration, it could be further sundivided into different "nows". But that doesn't mean time doesn't exist.
If time is Satanism , Germanic, or a monopolising of knowledge ,how come if I put a frozen pie in the oven for half and hour it comes only thawed, but for an hour hot enough to eat?
>the philosophical "prime mover" can be entirely outside of temporal existence, and may even "keep happening" in our temporal line.
Entirely agree, anon. We're talking about causes,which dont have to be chronological. At this present moment I am typing this on my phone on my bed, the bed is holding me up, causing me not to fall to the floor and giving me a nice warm comfy feeling in my back, which has been sore from overwork lately.

>>2279881
Where coms't the Universe?
>out of God
Whoms't made God?
>Him was forevars
Proof?
>No

>>2421037
It's not a controversial take that time is an entirely relational concept for us. There is no "absolute time", only frames of reference. What is "absolute" is history as a concept. We hold there is a past and present and future. That is determined by causal relationships more than it is any notion of "time moving", as if the universe is pushing events to move towards some goal or activating the simulation to advance the counter. Instead, objects in the universe move of their own accord, and so do their components or whatever "strands" of matter comprise them. They would HAVE to be able to move of their own accord without a "mover" forcing them to move presently that is outside of them. For history to be sensical, and we hold that there is a singular history that describes "the world", we have to reconcile all of these local histories with the record of the whole world. You can see how that invites havoc since you have people making historical events all over the place without any necessary regard for each other, and so too are those who write history writing from their time and place.

I wrote something that can help with deprogramming:
https://eugeneseffortposts.royalwebhosting.net/0009.html

>>2421054
Yes time is black magic mind control invented by the ancient Egyptians but have you read Henri Bergson and Philip K Dick.

>>2421083
Dick sucks. Bergson I'm not familiar with.
Time isn't "mind control". There's just a really bizarre narrative that was pushed aggressively by Fabianism to say you were too stupid to make comparisons. This is all very intuitive and non-controversial if you aren't brainwashed by an insane cult. It's hard when that insane cult produces an absurd quantity of propaganda and Lie and laughs at "making you do it to yourself" by reinforcing that Lie. If you talk to someone who actually asks the question of what causality, time, and relativity mean, they'd tell you what I told you. The "time dilation" faggotry is deliberate controlled insanity, there to insult and mock you. A child can see through it, and it's all a test of who can be Lied to and insulted.



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