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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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>Blue Labour is a British campaign group and political faction that seeks to promote blue-collar and culturally conservative values within the British Labour Party – particularly on immigration, crime, EDI and community spirit – while remaining committed to labour rights and left-wing economic policies.
Is this the future of left-wing politics?
22 posts and 1 image reply omitted.

>>2536161
How did it go for the BSW lmao

>>2574084
noooo you stupid ultra chud this is how we win the election! aren't you worried about farage m8?

>>2536161
Imagine being British and using the term 'blue collar'

>>2536161
This must be the most inefficient lobby roup in history

Is China soft on crime? Do they support mass immigration?



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Previous thread: >>2507158

Links:

Previous Thread Archives
Thread 1 https://archive.ph/ROnpO
Thread 2 https://archive.ph/f29Po
Thread 3 https://archive.ph/GZj20
Thread 4 https://archive.ph/ZHfse

Youtube Playlists
Anwar Shaikh - Historical Foundations of Political Economy
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTMFx0t8kDzc72vtNWeTP05x6WYiDgEx7
Anwar Shaikh - Capitalism: Competition, Conflict and Crises
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLB1uqxcCESK6B1juh_wnKoxftZCcqA1go
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SmithAnon, you were responded to in the immigration thread.

>>2572946
i responded 👍
>>2572384
>he openly contradicts himself constantly and posts things that are objectively false and when corrected ignores it.
any examples? 🥱
>>2572884
>I do not believe that Marx thought that value ratios are equal to exchange-value ratios.
whats the difference? 🤔
exchange-value is "value in exchange" (Ax=By)
>>2572406
unfortunately, there are no primary sources i can find from shimomuran himself, but from secondary sources, he's described as a keynesian, so your description makes sense. the mainstream view is that savings represent future spending and so the increase of savings is an increase in future value. this is true, but only so far as it concerns its marginal and total content. the individual saver benefits by saving, yet if everyone saved, the individual would suffer, since the economy would shrink and thus there would be less to save for. in keynesian terms, this often refers to the "paradox of thrift":
<Every such attempt to save more by reducing consumption will so affect incomes that the attempt necessarily defeats itself. 
https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/economics/keynes/general-theory/ch07.htm
we may then see keynes' view on the relationship between saving and investment:
>[i] Income = value of output = consumption + investment. [ii] Saving = income - consumption. [iii] Therefore saving = investment. [quantitatively]
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>>2573131
>>2573131
thank you for your opinion on shimomuran economics.
Also I recommend reading prince of yen, or other works by richard werner. Hes the primary scholar who studies shimomuran economics

>>2573131
>any examples?
just the hundreds in all the previous threads

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>>2573807
>hundreds of examples
pick one.
>>2573578
no prob, bob. 👍



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9th Edition: THE SITE FUCKING CRASHED LMAO edition.

A lot of images and posts of the last general got broken. So I think it's better to make a new one.

Discuss anything on Southeast Asian politics. Coming 2024 Elections, open orgs, People that should be dead for different reasons running in Malaysia's elections or just random shit. There are still dozens of us… hopefully! Starting off this general with massive wave of cult sex camps.
Matrix room: https://matrix.to/#/#!YeYeuZuLSYkegWssey:matrix.org

Last threads:
https://archive.ph/5rqox
https://archive.is/Jlc7A
http://archive.is/0NhJH
http://archive.is/nDq1K
https://archive.vn/cxwty
https://archive.is/ayshz
https://archive.is/2NLO8
https://archive.is/3f5Rf
325 posts and 184 image replies omitted.

>>2573997
>Dude, I'm American. My grandfather was a colonel in WW2 lol.
A colonel for the Americans. My other grandfather was a colonel or something I think but he defected from the Italians and he was rewarded for it.

>>2573997
He was a Neurologist and briefly put in charge of a hospital in Los Angeles at the end of World War II which made him a Colonel Rank.

>>2573997
it's true that american soldiers raped a lot of local women (and sometimes men), in any land they've stepped their foot on. how does being partially a martial rape baby change anything in this case?

>>2574002
My grandpa never went overseas. Although his wife was from Russia. They were both the same religion Seventh Day Adventist. My family kinda escaped the Commies but it's no hard-feelings.

You "Asians" are so funny. My Grandpa's brother worked pro-bono to introduce you all to birth-control.



 

What does leftypol think of animal rights?

Personally I believe proles are valued the same as cattle, and that we should liberate both nature and humanity. I have also been a long-term vegetarian
63 posts and 8 image replies omitted.

I grew up learning how to fish and hunt and I have already killed and eaten more animals than I can count, so I feel like any opinion I could have about animal rights is kind of meaningless at this point. I do think factory farming is pretty gross, but that goes for every kind of industrial mass production, humans taking more than they need from the Earth to make profit instead of just taking what is needed - I think that is what is gross and immoral, not killing an animal for food.

I think that humans and animals are of equal worth.
Im joking but I do support animal rights

>>2545913
>What does leftypol think of animal rights?
Im very much pro-environment and animal rights but this politics always comes second to class struggle.

>>2545913
not a priority, but the animal holocaust is real and irrational and should be dealt with eventually

>>2545913
don't care humanity matters more



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Yanis Varoufakis, the firebrand economist who rose to fame at the height of Greece’s debt drama, was not only egotistical but ultimately more interested in testing out his game theories on the nation than winning its battle to keep afloat.

So writes the former prime minister Alexis Tsipras in his newly released memoir, Ithaki, as the once radical leftwing leader, sparing no punches, seeks, 10 years later, to put the record straight.

“He was, in reality, more of a celebrity and less of an economist,” recalled the 51-year-old, who described handpicking the maverick as his finance minister because of his international reputation and “extremely attractive” skills as a public orator.

“I wanted an honourable agreement within the eurozone,” Tsipras wrote, “but we also didn’t hide the fact that we wanted radical change in Europe, that we wanted to stop the imposition of the economic absurdity of neoliberalism not only in Greece but from one end of the continent to the other.”

“I wanted to send the message of hard negotiation, but I underestimated the human factor. Very quickly, Varoufakis turned from being an asset into a negative protagonist. Not only could our potential allies not stand him, neither could his own colleagues.”

In a chronicle of events that has been quick to send ripples through Greece, Tsipras, who appears bent on staging a political comeback two years after renouncing the leadership of the Syriza party, said it was clear the Greek Australian academic had a personal agenda that included promoting his books.


Negotiations to stave off bankruptcy were “not just a way of achieving a better deal for the country. They were an experiment, an historic opportunity to prove the truth of his economic theories,” Tsipras wrote.

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sir this is a marxist subreddit take your goofy ahh hitlerite drama somewhere else

>>2573128
My main problem is that

I like varkoufis a bit more now

>>2573031
lmao what a slimy fuck. so varoufakis´ biggest sin was, what? being arrogant and annoying? Tsipras RAN on avoiding austerity for Greece. nobody forced him to do that.

>>2573658
>>2573128
>>2573031

ΚΚΕ Πάλη Τιμημένο.

Για χρόνια το κόμμα προειδοποιούσε ότι ο σοσιαλδημοκρατικος οπορτουνισμος στην καινούριες μορφές του δεν θα είχε καλό αποτέλεσμα για το λαό στης συγκεκριμένες συνθήκες της πρόσφατης καπιταλιστήκης κρίσης.



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Guesswork and futurology, write thoughts for what the state of the world may be or look like in 2050.
I will not start with a kick off. Start guessing what will happen, make a bingo or something.
50 posts and 11 image replies omitted.

Xpeng robot girlfriends by 2050 or it's a protracted people's war on the fascist state of China

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>>2569626
https://akarlin.com/short-history-of-3rd-millennium/

>(1) (a) Direct Technosingularity - 25%, if Kurzweil/MIRI/DeepMind are correct, with a probability peak around 2045, and most likely to be implemented via neural networks (Lin & Tegmark, 2016).


>(2) The Age of Em - <1%, since we cannot obtain functional models even of 40 year old microchips from scanning them, to say nothing of biological organisms (Jonas & Kording, 2016)


>(3) (a) Biosingularity to Technosingularity - 50%, since the genomics revolution is just getting started and governments are unlikely to either want to, let alone be successful at, rigorously suppressing it. And if AGI is harder than the optimists say, and will take considerably longer than mid-century to develop, then it's a safe bet that autism score-augmented humans will come to play a critical role in eventually developing it. I would put the probability peak for a technosingularity from a biosingularity at around 2100.


>(3) (b) Direct Biosingularity - 5%, if we decide that proceeding with AGI is too risky, or that consciousness both has cardinal inherent value and is only possible with a biological substrate.


>(4) Eschaton - 10%, of which: (a) Philosophical existential risks - 5%; (b) Malevolent AGI - 1%; (c) Other existential risks, primarily technological ones: 4%.


>(5) The Age of Malthusian Industrialism - 10%, with about even odds on whether we manage to launch the technosingularity the second time round.

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>>2569626
You WILL eat meat from the nonsentient biopig

>>2571451
this looks like a fetish post

>>2573944
what is this eugenicist trash



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Belgium grinds to a halt in three day general strike against austerity
It was the 13th national strike since Prime Minister Bart de Wever’s five-party right-wing coalition took office in February. Transport was brought to a standstill by the industrial action, which was joined today by teachers, healthcare staff and postal workers. A walkout across multiple sectors is planned for tomorrow.
https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/belgium-grinds-halt-three-day-general-strike-against-austerity

Farmers decide to blockade roads, ports
The farmers are protesting high production costs and what they term the collapse in producer prices. They demand minimum guaranteed prices and effective measures against the smallpox that has decimated sheep and goats since August 2024.
https://www.ekathimerini.com/economy/1287680/farmers-decide-to-blockade-roads-ports/

Zuma-Mncube opens criminal case against Zuma-Sambudla, others
Former President Jacob Zuma’s daughter, Nkosazana Bonganini Zuma-Mncube, has opened a criminal case against Duduzile Zuma-Sambudla, Siphokazi Xuma and Blessing Khoza. This relates to 17 South Africans who are trapped in the Ukraine-Russian war.
https://www.sabcnews.com/sabcnews/1084838-2/?hilite=lured+Russia+under

MSF pulls out of Darfur hospital after fatal shooting
The victim, who worked for Sudan's health ministry, was killed outside the Zalingei Hospital on November 18 in an incident in which four others were also wounded, MSF said. The facility is located in central Darfur state, in an area controlled by the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces and removed from the front lines of the conflict with Sudan's army.
https://www.reuters.com/world/africa/msf-pulls-out-darfur-hospital-after-fatal-shooting-2025-11-25/
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Trump administration to retroactively vet refugees already resettled in US
The memo, signed by US Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) Director Joseph Edlow, said that refugees who are found to have failed to meet the standards for resettlement would have their legal status revoked. “Given these concerns, USCIS has determined that a comprehensive review and a re-interview of all refugees admitted from January 20, 2021, to February 20, 2025, is warranted,” the memo stated.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/11/25/trump-administration-to-retroactively-vet-refugees-already-resettled-in-us
https://archive.ph/gHZtp

California is considering cutting power company profits to historic lows, but bills will barely drop
In a proposed decision, the California Public Utilities Commission recommended dropping the “return on equity” by 0.35% each for Pacific Gas & Electric, Southern California Edison and San Diego Gas & Electric. If approved, shareholders of all three companies would see a potential return next year of just under 10%. Such returns for PG&E and Edison haven’t dipped below double digits in at least 20 years.
https://apnews.com/article/pg-e-corp-sempra-california-utilities-taxes-0f985b7ea71e29b04f48eb6589f7c7b2

US Education Department investigates University of California, Berkeley over Turning Point USA protest
The department's Office of Federal Student Aid will investigate whether UC Berkeley violated the Clery Act, which requires higher education institutions that receive federal funding to collect, report, and disseminate crime data to the public, support victims of violence, and publicly outline their policies and systems for improving campus safety.
https://www.reuters.com/legal/government/us-education-department-investigates-university-california-berkelePost too long. Click here to view the full text.

Where does the RCP stand on ‘Your Party’?
In July, Jeremy Corbyn and Zarah Sultana announced the formation of a new political party. That provoked a wave of enthusiasm, with 800,000 people signing up for a left-wing alternative to Starmer’s hated Labour. At that time, the potential for this new party was enormous. It could have given political expression to the pro-Palestine movement and all the strike action erupting across the country. Corbyn and Sultana could also have coordinated opposition to Trump’s state visit to the UK, and to Tommy Robinson’s ‘Unite the Kingdom’ demonstration in September. They could have attacked the rich and the capitalist system as the cause of the crisis in Britain, instead of allowing Farage to dominate with his anti-immigrant rhetoric. They could have raised millions in small donations, like Mamdani in New York, to hold rallies and conferences all over the country. Starting with 800,000 people, if Corbyn and Sultana had connected with the mood that exists in Britain today, they could have been at the head of a movement of millions by now. Unfortunately, we couldn’t be farther from that today.
https://communist.red/where-does-the-rcp-stand-on-your-party/

You Can’t Just Wish Away Jeffrey Epstein’s Israel Ties
It’s not hard to imagine what would happen if the Jeffrey Epstein saga had any other country at its center. If the well-connected billionaire sex trafficker was rumored to have ties to the ruling elite and intelligence agencies of, say, Thailand; if emails showed him repeatedly hosting a Thai intelligence officer at his house; if they showed him doing secret, back-channel work for the Thai government through his friendship with a former Thai prime minister; if in private messages, he claimed that he had been involved in that former prime minister’s return to politics in a recent Thai election, aimed at toppling the country’s sitting leader from power — if any of this happened, it would obviously be a massive scandal that would prompt many more questions about that billionaire’s exact relationship to Thailand and its intelligence agencies, particularly given how close he was with various members of the US elite, including one former president and the one currently in office. It would also no doubt be a major scandal in Thailand itself, iPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

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Thanks News Anon



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Thread dedicated to /leftypol/ original content.
>Post original content you've made, or OC someone else recently made which you want to share.
<Or ITT collaborate on improving content already made.

If your original content is good enough, it would most likely be shared on the /leftypol/ twitter account!
Make sure to follow us and feel free to leave suggestions on this thread~
https://twitter.com/leftypol_org
https://xcancel.com/leftypol_org

previous thread: >>1945100
>>>/leftypol_archive/1945100 (if it gets archived by mods, don't hold your breath)

New Booru:
https://lefty.pictures

MAKE SURE TO UPLOAD YOUR OC TO THE BOORU SO IT DOESNT GET PRUNED FOREVER!!!
96 posts and 58 image replies omitted.

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>>2570007
what were Lassalle's points about cooperatives? I am unfamiliar.

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For the Chinese Civil War lovers

>>2573067
> “The productive associations of workers with state credit are the crucial measure, without which all other social reforms are illusion.”

> “The future belongs to the associations of workers. From them must come the emancipation of labor.”


> “To leave the workers alone with the bourgeoisie and expect that associations will arise by themselves is a childish fantasy.”


> “Only in associations of workers is the iron law of wages broken.”


> “The state is called upon to assist the working class with means through which it can free itself. Among these, the first is the creation of productive associations.”


> “Only where the worker is his own master does true freedom of labor exist.”

>>2573087
this image proves the validity of dialectical materialism



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The biggest rebutal I see in the eyes of the average person to "socialism" and "communism" is that it's utopic, that it relies on bad assumptions, that it doesn't work in reality etc. In essence, that we're advocating for something that can't be and that we have no alternative to capitalism.
And, to that effect, what are we even advocating for ? It appears to me that we have a bunch of different movements with many different goals that don't actually ressemble one another. Yet, despite this, very few of these movements have actual "models", it just seems like they want to reform or do a revolution for the sake of action rather than purpose.
Shouldn't we concentrate on clear objectives and goals before having all this talk about how marxism-leninism-maoism-gonzalo thought is superior to cybernetic-trotskism-councilism in achieving [we run into the problem here]?

>inb4 abolition of private property, abolition of capitalism, abolition of alienation

We can't actually base our objectives around these vagues goals though, or at least not at the current time and at the forefront. Abolition of private property doesn't mean anything if there's no framework to offer an alternative or to replace it. Marx laid us many goals but, given that he didn't specify what or how, shouldn't it be up to us to conceptualize the type of system which we want in accordance with the relevant theories he proposed.

Apart from small intellectuals scattered everywhere (Cockshott, Schweickart etc), there seems to be an evident lack of clear model that actually adresses the critique of marx's ambitions and dismisses its apparent utopianism.

There is none because Marx decisively made sure to never leave a direct manifesto on what to do, it should be noted however he derided labor notes, value hours, and a bunch more stuff, how much of this was just critique or openly disownment is questionable, so you can vaguely estimate what Marx wanted, but he wouldn't care for it either, Marx like Nietzsche was about the process and less about any end goal because end goals are utopian in of themselves.

>>2573875
>mfw we're still fighting over what the bearded guy wanted almost 200 years later
>feelsbad.jpg

I'm not a communist anymore, all I know is that marxism is objectively the best ideology, more than that I don't care about le revolution that will come when I'm dead or too old to give a fuck.



 

This thread is for the discussion of cybercommunism, the planning of the socialist economy by computerized means, including discussions of related topics and creators. Drama belongs in /isg/

Reading
Towards a New Socialism by Paul Cockshott and Allin Cottrell: http://ricardo.ecn.wfu.edu/~cottrell/socialism_book/
Brain of the Firm by Stafford Beer
Cybernetic Revolutionaries by Eden Medina
Cybernetics: Or the Control and Communication in the Animal and the Machine and The Human Use of Human Beings (1st edition) by Norbert Wiener
Economic cybernetics by Nikolay Veduta
People's Republic of Walmart by Leigh Phillips and Michal Rozworski
Red Plenty by Francis Spufford
Economics in kind, Total socialisation and A system of socialisation by Otto Neurath (Incommensurability, Ecology, and Planning: Neurath in the Socialist Calculation Debate by Thomas Uebel provides a summary)

Active writers/creators sorted by last name

>Paul Cockshott

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>>2573818
BИЛЪЯM KOKШOT
is that Safranov in the middle?

>>2573818
>А.В.Сафронов – историк, экономист, кандидат экономических наук, ведущий канала «Простые числа».
so it seems. historian, economist, kandidat (roughly MSc I think), video (though it almost reads like Veduta's) channel prime numbers. and yeah he's on the Prime Numbers channel

>>2573828

Дикбласт must become ДикВласть. Αμήν.

What the hell did he mean by this? Is he /ourguy/ for real?

The so-called TRULY FREE MARKET



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