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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internet about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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In the case of slavery, we see that in the British Empire, it was abolished through reform. They passed the act to abolish it in 1833. In the case of America it was abolished through Civil War. Both slaves and white people were in the union army and participated in abolition. In the case of Haiti we have revolution. The slaves overthrew their masters. Some say were a few Europeans on the side of the slaves, ironically a Polish diaspora who Dessalines eventually made legally black and protected from the purges that targeted the French.

In the case of serfdom, we see sometimes the organic disappearance of serfdom from society through its obsolescence. Britain never emancipated its serfs through legal acts. Instead the black plague and 1381 peasants revolt weakened the institution without abolishing it, and by 1600 it was largely over with. the 1640s English civil wars, which some call its bourgeois revolution, did not even abolish serfdom, since it was already through by that point. In other cases we see a top down-abolition of serfdom, as in Russia, under the tsar in the 1800s , and in Japan through the Meiji restoration. These were not bourgeois revolutions but top down reforms carried out by rather conservative and autocratic institutions that had resisted change for as long as possible.

The transition between the slavery of late antiquity and the serfdom of the middle ages was likewise a very gradual process, and did not happen through revolution or reform, but through more subtle historical processes taking place over several centuries. There were servile revolts such as the famous one led by Spartacus, but these were failed revolts, not transformative revolutions which changed the mode of production.

These lead me to my questions:

  1. I think it is indisputable that class struggle plays a foundational role in the history of all societies. However, is revolution always inevitable, or is it only what happens when all other options fail?
  2. If other options succeed, is that undesirable for communism, since communists want these changes to happen through revolution?
  3. If the same problem can be tackled in different ways, and history shows that through evidence, then why cling to the thesis that it can only happen one way?
  4. Isn't it a bit teleological to insist that the capitalist mode of production must end in a specific way, i.e. through reform, through re
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>>2838121
>>2838141
i want to clarify that this guy is not OP

>>2838173
Good reply, thank you.

>>2836715
I think Lenin on the Prussian path of agrarian development is relevant here.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1907/agrprogr/ch01s5.htm

I think it is entirely possible that the bourgeoisie may usher in communism for the bourgeoisie and then kill most of the proles. This would be bad.

I think the quickest and least painful path to socialism involves revolutionary struggle. I am opposed to a long and cruel path to socialism.

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>>2838351
>the bourgeoisie may usher in communism for the bourgeoisie and then kill most of the proles. This would be bad.
I've heard this one before and I'm not convinced. It's based on the fantasy that they will just have AI robot slaves that are somehow more energy efficient than humans, who will always do what they're told, always have context sensitivity, never disobey, and are able to do everything from washing dishes to picking crops, to cleaning toilets. I just don't buy it.

>>2838351
>I think the quickest and least painful path to socialism involves revolutionary struggle. I am opposed to a long and cruel path to socialism.
True and yet everyone wants to be the next Lenin and not the next red army conscript bleeding out in a trench



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Jewish people are an ethno-religious group that have largely been ostracized from Christian/muslim society because they were here first. It’s created, beyond just a religion, a form of ethnic identity. This board believes in decolonization, and in the principle that children should not be judged for their identities and the identities of their parents. That should extend fully to Jews as well and it’s far and away the biggest issue I have with this “leftist” group that many of you want to exclude such a large population of historically marginalized people. Some of the best leftists from Marx and Luxembourg to Goldman and Bookchin, Jewish individuals have written much of the theory we practice today.

We can, and should, be antizionist, but antizionism ≠ antisemitism. The most bigoted thing you can do towards a Jew is to assume they are spoken for by a genocidal apartheid regime, and to unionize your fight for antizionism with the rights fight for antisemitism. Don’t get the two confused and don’t be a schmuck.
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>>2836528
Humans

After Hitler's death a new version of Mein Kampf was released with thousands of footnotes calling out his bullshit, and all sales of the book were donated to Jewish families. What nobody talks about tho, is that in the 60s Jewish bankers and politicians ended the deal to incentivize Israelis to continue stealing from Palestinians amid the wave of decolonization and racial equality sweeping the west

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>>2836531
The jewish continuous genealogy stories are myths, and jews are made up of converts from the areas they lived.
Thank you, god bless.

>>2834367
Giga Based

>>2838875
Just like Kars 4 Kids but with Hitler!



 

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>>2837742
He said "white" genocide.

>>2837716
If they are doing for profit, they are only going to amplify what's already popular.

>>2837820
I mean kinda but not really, it's a lot easier to generate shock outrage content than actually thoughtful stuff, it leads to a general degeneration of the mindset of the viewer towards reactionism.

>>2837776
only applies to ruthenians

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>>2838726
I always knew Ukrainians were Black.



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In this thread we list crimes the USA has committed against Cuba to debunk the myth the USA wants to “free” Cuba

>On the 20th of april 1898 the United States intervenes in the Cuban war of independence against Spain supposedly on the Cuban rebel’s side but later betrays them on the 1st of January 1899 replacing Spain as Cuban imperial overlord and installing a military government in Cuba led by U.S. army general John R. Brooke.

>>2837884
Because you touch yourself at night

Huh

The Mob and other American organized crime groups had a huge presence in Cuba before the revolution. Cuba was a massive hub of gambling and drug and human trafficking under gangsters like Meyer Lansky and Lucky Luciano. Said gangsters were heavily involved in US intelligence backed anti-communist terror networks that tried to undermine Cuban socialism.

>>2837810
On on the 20th of May 1902 Cuba gained
Faux “independence” from the United States with a constitution that was accepted by the USA on the condition it was amended to include giving the united states the right to invade Cuba if it felt the Cuban government was jeopardising “freedom”, a limitation of the amount of public debt the Cuban government could have, letting the U.S. keep Guantanamo, Cuba required U.S. permission to entire into relations with other countries.

>>2837810

>>2838682
America used their right to invade Cuba to occupy it for a 2nd time from September 1906 to February 1907, to crush an Afro Cuban uprising in 1912, and to occupy it a 3rd time from August 25th 1917 to February 15th 1922



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  1. How would anarchists respond to the criticism that, over 150 years of organized anarchist thought (from Bakunin and the International in 1866 onward, or even Stirner before that), their analysis of exploitation has remained largely vague and general?
  2. How do anarchists explain the origins and development of exploitation? And how would they account for the evolution of society without relying on concepts like class struggle and the dictatorship of the proletariat as scientific tools?
  3. Are anarchists generally committed to social ownership of the means of production, or do they tend to favor small-scale production and some forms of private ownership? How would they address the claim that anarchism is just bourgeois individualism turned on its head?
  4. How do anarchists propose to organize and educate workers for class struggle while refusing participation in bourgeois political institutions? How would they avoid offering what critics call one‑sided, disconnected fixes, especially when global coordination seems necessary and anarchism’s individualist tendencies may undermine it?
  5. How would anarchists respond to the observation that anarchism lacks a unified doctrine, elementary revolutionary teaching, or basic theory? How do they view the historical fragmentation of the workers’ movement often attributed to anarchist influence, and what can be learned from the short‑lived anarchist “state‑like” experiments?
  6. How would anarchists avoid the charge that rejecting bourgeois politics in practice ends up subordinating the working class to bourgeois politics—all under the guise of being “above” or “outside” traditional political action?
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>>2831936

>It is vague. How does this exploitation occur? What are its characteristics? What makes someone a worker and what makes someone a boss?


A worker is someone who must sell their labor to survive because they don't own productive resources. A boss is someone who owns productive resources and therefore can extract surplus from those who do the work. Exploitation occurs through this structural relationship not through individual bad behavior but through the wage relation itself. It's the same basic analysis as Marx. The anarchist addition is that the state isn't just a tool of this class relation but co produces it. For example, enclosure, legal enforcement of property, suppression of horizontal institutions are all state functions that make capitalism possible.

>What else is anarchism based on if not scientific methods?


Materialist analysis of power structures rather than a teleological stage theory. The disagreement with Marxism isn't about method, it's about whether history has a predetermined destination requiring a transitional state to get there.

>Are anarchists for or against small production, large scale industry?


Social anarchists favor collective ownership and management of large scale industry through worker councils and federations. Not small production as a romantic ideal, not state ownership, but direct worker administration.

Yellow unions? All unions? Every social movement? What is "popular education"?
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I attended the first smack a white boy event, where we disrupted the crimethinc anarchist confrence in our neighborhoods which were facing gentrification, ask me anything.

>>2838506
>Materialist analysis of power structures rather than a teleological stage theory. The disagreement with Marxism isn't about method, it's about whether history has a predetermined destination requiring a transitional state to get there.
Are you the same anon spamming the board about Marxist teleology?


>>2838561
No though I've only posted in the other anarchist thread to show the social anarchist perspective



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I'm not sure I'm going all-in on the tankie kool-aid, but if there's anything I can respect about this man, it's how quickly and decisively he handled business when he found out his brother was snitching on him to the CIA. If everyone in the world had this sort of attitude when it came to American feds, we wouldn't have any problems at all.

Kim is the only man to make Xi stutter and trip on his own shoes

Rumors has it Kim, during his off the record visit to China at the height of 2010s DPRK-China tensions, took Xi to an otherwise empty parking lot in which they had escorted Xi to park his car. When Kim and the Workers Party of Korea went with him back to the parking lot they surprised Xi with the introduction to the DPRK's first working nuclear missile. It was held by a crane 50 meters in the air, centered above Xi's car. Slowly but surely it was lowered, and the closer it got the sheer size of it was demonstrated. "P-Please! Stop! Stop that!" Xi exclaimed, but to no avail. Uninterrupted in its secure descent the nuclear warhead arrived at the roof and effortlessly smushing his car flat, before it stopped. Xi was at a loss of words, before falling to his knees. He uttered "I apologize", in Korean.

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>>2838287
When all the leaders go to pay deference to the Workers Party of Korea they also make the leaders do some labour, which is considerate of them.

>>2838294
screencap this gem



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Where did all the anarchist arsonists go? What happened with the regular revenge killings and assassinations between leftists and rightists? Wasn't there even a story about an artillery unit possibly going rogue, with special forces on standby just in case? Why has all this been memory-holed? Seemed like there was a real possibility of revolution, and it been culled into only radlib circlejerks.

Anyone got any footage and content from 2020?
Any clear timeline of events and the main organizations involved?
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>>2838104
i mentioned it to one of my friends who was living in DC at the time (unbeknownst to me) and he mentioned that they did indeed jam the phones but they weren't disappearing people.

>>by god we'll have our home again


they're hiding because were closing in on them, we're going to show everyone what millions of anarcho-brains look like, and no other leftists will care because you pissed them off anarkiddies!

>>2837839
>2020 was 6 years ago.
I feel ancient, I still remember night gang being based.
Oh and that one anon who created the fake news story that homeless people stole all the food from CHAZ

>>2838105
glowie bait

>>2838105
obvious ai schizo bait
sloppy job langley



 

China isn't "communist" in the old Maoist sense it's the world's most dynamic capitalist market today.
Deng Xiaoping's reforms were pure capitalist genius, decollectivizing agriculture, creating Special Economic Zones, welcoming foreign investment, and letting markets allocate resources where central planning had failed miserably. Hundreds of millions lifted out of poverty in a single generation, the greatest anti-poverty achievement in human history. Dengism proved that pragmatic market incentives, competition, and entrepreneurship work better than ideology. From a true capitalist viewpoint, this was masterful, "It doesn't matter if the cat is black or white, as long as it catches mice."

>>China abides by the raw logic of the free market more purely than the USA. Unfettered competition, massive private sector growth (especially early on), and letting winners win.


>>As Adam Smith observed in the dynamics of commercial society, successful true capitalism naturally concentrates wealth and leads toward more socialized outcomes through its own success exactly what we're seeing as China's development matures into broader shared prosperity under the Party's stewardship. Pure capitalism, refined, evolving towards socialism, as Smith predicted.


>>Compare that with the United States, a corporatist, state capitalist racket. Big monopolies and connected firms get bailed out, subsidized, and protected by regulators. Market manipulators, lobbyists, and too big to fail banks are rewarded with favorable rules, while genuine competition and market demand supply are punished.


>>The revolving door between Washington and Wall Street picks winners and it's cronyism dressed up as "capitalism."


>>China rewards results and scale in the market while America increasingly rewards political connections.

The future belongs to whoever actually practices capitalism without the hypocrisy. Deng understood this better than most modern "free market" advocates.
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>>2838226
It was bullshit even in the 1700s.

"Free" markets and "state" capitalism are both myths. Every economy on Earth is a combination of both private and state control. These are primarily political labels that countries use to smear other countries as part of the soft power propaganda battle. Capitalism is the problem, whether in China, or the USSR, or the USA, or the Moon, or Andromeda, or wherever.

>>2838412
fuck spengler, fuck noske, and fuck "prussian socialism"

North Korea is on the logical path towards anarcho-communism, whereas China is just on the logical path towards beating the enemy at their own game of economic mastery.

No the real answer is that the rate of profit is still high in China so they can afford to do capitalism the efficiency way, while it has collapsed in the West so the West has to do shit like outsourcing, increasingly cost imperialism, monopolies, financial scamming etc.



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What does anarchy look like?
How can anarchy be achieved?
Which current groups best represent the movement?
How can we all fight to destroy authoritarian capitalism in our daily lives?
37 posts and 3 image replies omitted.

>>2833414
Are anarchists for or against private property?

>>2833437
That depends, but I would say leaning towards for

>>2833437
That answer depends on whether or not you accept hobbesian philosophy as fact. We're individuals not clones.

>>2833437
Broadly for, as long as you don’t start defining the means of producing a living as “private property”

>>2830238

>What does anarchy look like?


Federated worker and community councils managing production and distribution directly. The Zapatista autonomous municipalities and the Spanish collectives are the closest historical examples of this actually functioning at scale.

>How can anarchy be achieved?


Building dual power. Unions, cooperatives, mutual aid networks, popular assemblies until these institutions can absorb the functions of the state as it's dismantled.

>Which current groups best represent the movement?


Politically: Black Rose Anarchist Federation in the US, IWA internationally. Both have coherent theory and organizational discipline rather than just vibes. Prefiguratively: Cooperation Jackson and Cooperation Tulsa. They are building actual economic infrastructure like, worker coops, community land trusts, solidarity economy networks.

>How can we all fight to destroy authoritarian capitalism in our daily lives?

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for a more light hearted development, it looks like someone just found a picture of the building that hippel's wine bar was once located (where engels and stirner used to hang out)

on the /r/fullegoism subreddit they posted this image

take me back



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