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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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How far back did he send American leftist movements? Before him Jimmy Carter was talking about more programs, working with the USSR and socialism lite equivalents. Then Ronald Regan comes in, introduces crack, reignites the red scare and perma fucks all relationships with leftist ideology. To the point where the Democrats regressed hard and socialism would be a dirty word until the 2020s. Even then it’s still only used by the most radical mainstream politics.
20 posts and 2 image replies omitted.

>>2667412
Nixon ruined the american left, reagan just made it worst

>>2667412
>more programs
>socialism lite equivalents
Which isn't Communism but social fascism. Critical support to Reagan.

>>2667412
Well, the first thing I want to say is, "Mandate, my ass!"
Because it seems as though we've been convinced
That 26% of the registered voters–
Not even 26% of the American people
But 26% of the registered voters–
Form a mandate, or a landslide

21% voted for Skippy
And 3, 4% voted for somebody else
Who might have been running

But, oh yeah, I remember
In this year that we have now declared
The year from Shogun to Ray-Gun
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

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>>2667412
I forgot which Democrat I just heard quoting Reagan. It's hilarious that he is probably the most pro-immigrant president ever. Reagan is weird. Obviously a bad dude, but weirdly good in a way.

>>2668078
True


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Trump is about to drive Canada and Europe into China's arms over this greenland shit in which case China will have the majority of trade on every continent even north america outside the US.

This is basically happening as we speak with Canadian PM Mark Carney openly welcoming Chinese auto manufacturing into Canada.

Now that China will have overwhelmingly won the trade war against the USA and will be the primary trade power in south america, north america (minus USA), western europe, eastern europe, the middle east, africa and asia.

Given that, when can we expect China to implement global socialism?
41 posts and 2 image replies omitted.

>>2667450
>There are plenty of metals for which China does not have sufficient domestic deposits to supply its industry.
The metals being discussed in these trade papers are not those metals.

>Food delivery and taxis isn't exactly the most useful area of automation.
This is short-sighted. The real-world mobility problem is *the* present holy grail of robotics. Real-world mobility with the potential to adapt to any environment and sense and target things in the environment immediately is how you become capable of automating things like warehouses, farms, businesses, homes, construction, mining, and anything that specifically isn't an assembly line. Solving this problem is actually the single *largest* leap towards total automation. Elon Musk isn't wrong at all in saying that if he solves real-world mobility with Tesla, he can plug it into Optimus and start making personal robots. He isn't going to be the one to do it, though, because his approach to the solution is a terrible one. If you're a big believer in automation being the future of socialism, I would suggest looking into this topic further to really get a handle on the current state of robotics development and what's still needed to automate humanity's drudgery.


>But prosperous automated socialism in one country is already a bigger step than what has happened so far, which is prosperous socialism nowhere.
Perhaps, but this is a thread about China ushering in *global* socialism. I do not think this js something that they're interested in doing. I'm actually not even certain that they're all that interested in internal socialism either, considering their social classes are quite stratified.

>having a socialist society where truly nobody is poor will deal a massive ideological blow to the global conception of "socialism is when tyranny" or "socialism is when everybody starves equally"
I don't disagree, but again, I don't see any evidence that they're open to moving in this direction. I also think that excusing exploitative global resource extraction because it's going to a socialist state is probably not the best line of thought, especially if the countries doing the extracting don't really see much of a difference selling to China over Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

They don't even have socialism in China, you want them to export it?!

socialism is when dirigsme

>>2660051
None of this understands the fundamental town-country contradiction underlying imperialism. With the development of communications and remote work you can hire an engineer in the imperial periphery for a fraction of the cost. The centralization of mental labor in the town and physical labor in the country is increasingly obsolete. Consequently, China simply cannot centralize mental labor and rely on physical labor abroad. I am unsure how imperialism will evolve as the town-country contradiction sharpens to increasing absurdity in the age of remote work.

>>2660209
Good question


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Why did european socialists surrender their nationalist credentials to a bunch of we wuzing porno addict larpers post 1989?
>In the 40 years of People's Poland, we became an industrialised, urbanised, maritime country. The western and northern lands were reclaimed and developed. Revolutionary reforms and socialist transformations freed society from social injustice, unemployment and illiteracy."
>On 29 July Stalin asked Bolesław Bierut, the head of the Soviet-aligned Polish government, to accept in consideration of the large American concessions. The Polish delegation decided to accept a boundary of the administration zone at "somewhere between the western Neisse and the Kwisa". Later that day the Poles changed their mind: "Bierut, accompanied by Rola-Zymierski, returned to Stalin and argued against any compromise with the Americans. Stalin told his Polish protégés that he would defend their position at the conference."

Because the USSR is no more and you live in the Epstein Cinematic Universe. Things will only get worse. Stay vigilant lads.

>>2688959
because everywhere in the world there are a bunch of yesmen that are perfectly fine living under a slave state,a socialist republic,a bourgeois dictatorship,as long as they can still get lobster from time to time and keep their job.

and they're very good at pretending to be ideologically driven,while actually not giving a single shit,they will obey you until you get invaded,and then they will do a 360 and be collaborators,and you might think "well those guys are worthless" except they're very comfortable for a ruler to have,because unlike someone that actually has passion and interest,they're never going to disagree and challenge you,and you probably killed half of those while the rats gladly take their place

>>2688959
socialist movement in poland specifically never had any nationalist credentials to start with
before war it was a political platform for jewish immigrants from russian empire exclusively, centered around bund
during the war it got thoroughly purged and revitalized with new nkvd approved new blood, mostly jewish immigrants from the soviets
and after thawing supposed nationalist credentials were invalidated by association with soviets via warsaw pact
up to the 60s poles had barely any input into politics in (nominally) their own country
in the 60s gomulka who was a genuine nationalist got outsted for getting too chummy with chinese
in the 70s gierek who tried to create a genuinely polish socialism got outsted for getting too chummy with the free world
in the 80s poland ended up with jaruzel who was no less of an ussr puppet than bierut
and after '89 socialist movement in poland went back to being exclusively a platform for jewish diaspora

>>2689068
True


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spaceflight doesn't seem very popular among leftists recently. what does /leftypol/ think about it? are the moon and mars just playthings for billionaires? will china do anything differently? is socialist thought relevant to future lives beyond earth or is it all just a scifi obsession?
42 posts and 18 image replies omitted.

>>2683320
Yes it is, see the inconsistencies, the flag of China's deformed stars and lacking.

>>2683320
Chuds and other reactionaries love AI.

>>2649084
The western "left" has a poor class foundation similar to the Mensheviks. University professors, intellectuals, petty bourgeois like artists etc. They see no future for their own pathetic small-scale production way of life and so they seek to deny future to everyone. Hence their obsession with degrowth that was created by eugenicist bourgeois and absolute lack of solutions. The best they can do is gesture in Marx's direction but never ever in the direction of historical and current communist practice.

>>2683320
Fuck petite bougie artisans.
>>2683353
AI tech is the most socialist innovation in a century.

>>2683391
No


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>"Soviet Union would achieve the full communism in 1980!"

Was Khruschev delusional, or was he a liar who knew he wouldn't have to answer for his words in 1980 due to being dead from old age?
12 posts omitted.

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>>2679928
>His biggest mistake was de-stalinization imo.
I can't blame him for it

>>2680510
You're right. I probably recall it wrong.

>>2680550
From Felix Chuev's biography of V. Molotov:

>I talked with Mao and then suggested to Stalin that he receive him. He was a clever man, a peasant leader, a kind of Chinese Pugachev. He was far from a Marxist, of course–he confessed to me that he had never read Marx’s Das Kapital. When I was in Mongolia talking with the Chinese ambassador–he was nice to me–I said, “You want to create a metals industry quickly, but the measures you have planned–backyard blast furnaces–are improbable and won’t work.” I criticized the Chinese, and our people reproved me later. But it was such obvious stupidity!…Backyard blast furnaces to produce worthless metals–nonsense.”

<Felix Chuev, “Molotov Remembers: Inside Kremlin Politics” p. 81.

Chinese Communists in general seemingly were uneducated in Marxism & contemporary philosophies. I think Mao wouldn't have passed the Das Kapital test in the CPSU :'>

>>2680545
>killing Soviet Epstein bad

>>2679708
Both


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Reading Lenin's works in order is one of the most depressing things. By 1922 he basically admitted that the Soviet Union's state apparatus is a "bourgeois and tsarist hotch-potch" and he previously described it as a state taken away (not smashed) from tsarism and "slightly anointed with Soviet oil."

<It is said that a united apparatus was needed. Where did that assurance come from? Did it not come from that same Russian apparatus which, as I pointed out in one of the preceding sections of my diary, we took over from tsarism and slightly anointed with Soviet oil?
<There is no doubt that that measure should have been delayed somewhat until we could say that we vouched for our apparatus as our own. But now, we must, in all conscience, admit the contrary; the apparatus we call ours is, in fact, still quite alien to us; it is a bourgeois and tsarist hotch-potch and there has been no possibility of getting rid of it in the course of the past five years without the help of other countries and because we have been "busy" most of the time with military engagements and the fight against famine.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1922/dec/testamnt/autonomy.htm
21 posts and 2 image replies omitted.

>>2673484
>It must be recalled today that this passage is based on a misunderstanding. At that time – thanks to the Bonapartist and liberal falsifiers of history – it was considered as established that the French centralised machine of administration had been introduced by the Great Revolution and in particular that it had been used by the Convention as an indispensable and decisive weapon for defeating the royalist and federalist reaction and the external enemy. It is now, however, a well-known fact that throughout the revolution up to the eighteenth Brumaire c the whole administration of the départements, arrondissements and communes consisted of authorities elected by, the respective constituents themselves, and that these authorities acted with complete freedom within the general state laws; that precisely this provincial and local self-government, similar to the American, became the most powerful lever of the revolution and indeed to such an extent that Napoleon, immediately after his coup d’état of the eighteenth Brumaire, hastened to replace it by the still existing administration by prefects, which, therefore, was a pure instrument of reaction from the beginning. But no more than local and provincial self-government is in contradiction to political, national centralisation, is it necessarily bound up with that narrow-minded cantonal or communal self-seeking which strikes us as so repulsive in Switzerland, and which all the South German federal republicans wanted to make the rule in Germany in 1849.
<– Note by Engels to the 1885 edition.

>"Well, we have lived through a year, the state is in our hands, but has it operated the New Economic Policy in the way we wanted in the past year? No. But we refuse to admit that it did not operate in the way we wanted. How did it operate? The machine refused to obey the hand that guided it. It was like a car that was going not in the direction the driver desired but in the direction someone else desired; as if it were being driven by some mysterious, lawless hand, God knows whose, perhaps of a profiteer, or of a private capitalist, or of both. Be that as it may, the car is not going quite in the direction the man at the wheel imagines, and often it goes in an altogether different direction."
<V. I. Lenin, Eleventh Congress of the Russian Communist Party

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>>2673508
Skill issue

>>2673513
Unlike Deng, Lenin wasn't a liberal. So the triumph of liberalism wasn't what he was going for :\

>>2672258
True and real


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This site is full of Tankies.

remember Stalin killed all the bolchevique leaders that were key to the revolution and photoshopped pictures to remove them.

Lets have a place for serious marxists to talk.
49 posts and 7 image replies omitted.

>>2671660
photoshop wasnt around then i think

Every time an online-left+M-L pretends that the PRC has some >moral right to invade the ROC because of the traditions of dead generations, I laugh aloud. "this land was promised to us 70 years ago"
Taiwan is a strategically useful island. Don't pretend there's some righteous justification, or that you need a righteous justification, beyond "I think this Communist Party is progressive and the ROC is aligned with a capitalist imperial power. I believe invasion is a step forward on the path to a communist society."

>>2671670
This. OP is a fag.

>>2672283
Yum pankoek.
>omg two communists in a vanguard party advocated for a vanguard party
o rly?

The difference has serious broader implications. Look at the PRC. AFAIK most schools of Trotskyism interpret the PRC as a failed revolution which will not be able to establish socialism. Obviously this theory will change how adherents interact with China and issues facing it - while an M-L is more likely to see the PRC as a communist project and support the state less critically.
This doesn't inherently make a Trotskyist in opposition to everything the PRC does; for a similar case, my org did not take a pro-Ukraine stance in the ongoing inter-imperialist proxy war.

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are glowies even trying any more?

>>2671861
What does this mean though?


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The USA is entering similar conditions to those seen from 1968–1972. These include imperial overreach, the normalization of acts of terror domestically, general disdain for the aging ruling class, stagnating wages, and open talk of civil war.
The main difference between the two periods is this: Gen Z has far more worse material conditions than the Boomers ever did, but at the same time far fewer direct casualties from proxy conflicts. American People aren’t dying in Venezuela, and probably won't unless the rest of the Manduro's party mobilizes the country.
Trump knows that if there is ever a draft, or if US troops start dying in large numbers, that would be the final breaking point. This is why he carried out the swift, public kidnapping of Maduro.
He understands that the US is in a crisis of capitalism, and as a result he is using, and has been using foreign threats (including the tariffs ofc), as an outlet for the interal crisis.

He is deverting internal class conflict within the US, outward onto the rest of the globe.

The main question that should be asked is this; since there is not a general organization of labor like the boomers had, will this cause a rise into smaller, but much more revolutionary organizations?
7 posts omitted.

>>2626379
Trump doesn’t know that though. He honestly is that stupid.

>>2626889
That's why I don't blame dictators for supporting him, he's senile and easy to manipulate.

>>2626379
give it a few more years and we'll be entering into pre-new deal guilded age-like conditions due to AI destroying the white collar middle class. I keep saying that communists just need to wait until AI adoption in firms speeds up and for boomers to completely die off and we're basically right back in the 1920s. All the benefactors of the new deal will be dead leaving nothing behind, and AI will take cushy white collar jobs and make everyone but a select few low skill wagies

>>2626379
Zero class consciousness in USA. Only thing you will get is more liberalism or fascism.

>>2626379
Yes it will


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>the rightoids are calling for an increase in violence
>the liberals are calling for more peace, civility, trust in institutions and VOOOting
>nihilists suddenly show up to tell everyone that everything is doomed, nothing is happening and nothing can be done

If all 3 previous conditions are met then there's a 100% chance that things are indeed happening and its now you duty as a communist to take advantage of the momentum in any way you can. Thanks for reading.
206 posts and 22 image replies omitted.

>>2667382
Mods aren’t automatically right just because they say so, are CEOs and cops proletarian?

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>>2667382
this retarded rule is just an overcorrection from when hazoids were spamming this hole and those larpers havent been relevant for months now

>>2667385
amerilards still doing the "we are the 99%!" bullshit in 20 fucking 26 apparently lmao

>>2667385
CEOs is a job not a class. COP is a job not a class.

>>2667323
Yes they are


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The body was too short or empty. The body was too short or empty. The body was too short or empty. The body was too short or empty. The body was too short or empty.

>>2673198
Read books they said

>>2673221
Read they said


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