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When designing HUDs developers need to factor in the reality that most players at most can pay attention to 2-3 things at a time and likewise having too much information on screen is often times bad
Hence why a lot of modern games have minimalistic UIs or even no UIs at all that pop up during gameplay. Battle royales and MMOs on the other hand have failed to pick up on this and are still cluttering the screen with alot of redundant information players don’t need that at times can even hamper on gameplay either by making things feel less cinematic or distracting the player with polyps and hence you get images like these
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This, really. A lot of MMO's and other games like LoL could honestly have a significant chunk of their gameplay outright made redundant by enabling auto-cast macros. Most of them don't seriously go out of their way to make wide-range builds viable either, so a lot of times you pick characters that have, at most, one or two builds, which could just be split up into having a greater number of monobuild characters.
It also tries to be more "exciting" by doing things like displaying numbers of damage flashing/bouncing out of characters - but you could get a more informative UI by giving the average DPS or burst damage or the like…and if you seriously did a lot of these improvements to the UI you'd come out with an MMO that kind of revealed how much a lot of MMO's are basically just very exciting-looking timers and you just have to pick the best method for making a timer run the quickest.


What I find is that with older MMOs like RuneScape and WOW it’s that they actually make the cluttering worse by layering hud elements on top of one another

In wow there’s a player frame, a 3d health and mana/fury box on the avatar and a nameplate that’s shown on the default UI at all times, similarly there’s also a minimap and the location box that tells you where you are all on top of the already established introduction to where you are when you enter a zone

The situation in OSRS is even worse, you can’t really toggle off the minimap without addons, the skill and prayer menu doesn’t come with a keybind system again without using addons, the ingame world map is a complete mess along with sharing the same problem as WOW with an ingame minimap on top of an already existing world map and sometimes the UI can get so cluttered to the point where 2/3rds of the screen can be just UI elements your not paying attention to.

Either way out of any other MMO ESO is shockingly the best example of UI design for games like it done right, it tells you what you need to know when it’s appropriate and most hud elements are moved into a page that’s only activated when it’s relevant unlike pic related which is a screenshot of ff14 without any addons


I'm not gonna hold older games made when this stuff was still mostly being pioneered to the same kind of standards I would a game from 2018 or so. These games were coming out when Windows XP was the new hotness and OSRS was being run on Netscape Navigator. A lot of their code was effectively being done "by hand" and just getting things to work consistently with networking at the time wasn't always the easiest thing in the world. I have more issues with OSRS making bot-farming not only viable, but absolutely dominated issues like mining, where it'd cut out human players consistently than I do with the UI being awkward and intrusive.

Modern times, there's way, way, way more interactive and better tools for game development and the companies making them have the opportunity to split things up a lot more to handle different aspects of a game. It's been 18 years since World of Warcraft and City of Heroes were launched, and 21 years since RuneScape (3) was launched.

There has been a steadfast refusal to seriously learn anything over the last ten years, what were technical shortcuts and shaky innovations are now just lazy fucking programming and sheer carelessness.


Partly due to the fact that classic tab target MMOs beyond the main 4(WoW, RS2, GW2 and SWTOR) titans are legitimately dead
The only MMOs left aren’t even massively multiplayer they’re like games like destiny, war frame and fo76. Games that can handle a lot more complicated stuff because lobby sizes are significantly lower and most of the time single player and co op play is what’s expected in most sessions than shit like 40 man raids or massive wars you see in EVE and new world


proof of how empty their gameplay really was, i suppose.


Anyone played this game?
It's made by some Belorussian dudes, you put a jazz disc/cassette in the player in the morning and you spend the day dispatching policemen and women to problems. But some problems you have to ignore or the mafia kills you and you loose the game. And the heroin or the automatic weapons you come across you can sell trough the mafia, should you share the profits with your crew or keep it all to yourself? It's a decision depending on your day to day performance, you don't want your subordinates to dislike you too much or it's game over. Now the Mayor can ask you to bring the SWAT and shoot live rounds in this crowd of peaceful black protesters, you can sit on your hands and make him go fuck himself but if he doesn't like you enough it's game over.
It's a repetitive game honestly but still fun and its cynicism is delightful. Also the music is good.


I’m amazed knowing games are still being released these days
Like fuck the past decade has seen a visible drop in the quantity of AAA and indie games being released


Fun story but the gameplay is too weak IMO, it's boring by the end


I fucking get it I’m playing hard mode but spamming a million of these fucking cunts in nearly every level with some sections being exclusively these bullet sponge grenade spamming fucks is batshit evil and lazy as fuck level design

Ffs holy it’s even worse with the maniacal bullshit that are the shamblers whom you can’t even dodge their attacks in open spaces. Holy mother of god so fucking annoying
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You can only rarely ever take advantage of that in instances where ogres are placed above a crowd of enemies
I’ve done it once with two ogres standing on pillars throwing nades at a fiend it’s not as useful as you’d think as you have to account for the reality that enemies can also move away from those projectiles if you time your movements wrong along with the fact that well it’s just easier to fire back normally using hit and run type of strategy in nightmare than going all in the ogre strategy that only occasionally works

Unless your a speed runner whom relies on frame perfect inputs than go right ahead and do what you want


Furthermore there’s a better strategy to deal with ogres and that’s getting them to use their nades on nearby enemies so that the ai will attack the ogres distracting them from you. I’ve used this strategy to deal with fiends from a distance and wait until one mob is left, I’ve done it to clear out the zombies since explosives one tap them and keep them dead and I’ve used this strategy on the vore


No, you can take advantage of it in other times - any time there's some kind of hole between you and an ogre they'll just sit there and keep dropping grenades in the hole. It also makes it much easier toget them to commit friendly fire, because the position they'll be shooting from is consistent.


here's an example: ogres unable to hit because they're in a position the grenades just bounce around. if they moved, they'd be more a threat.


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Left wing game - yay or nay?
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It draws heavily from american lolbert stuff.


30% cringe, 70% based


It's not trying to be left or right wing. It's just trying to be cyberpunk and depict a world of corporate conspiracies not unlike our own, hoping to get people to think about things a little more. It's vaguely left wing for those reasons you could argue, but it's certainly not consciously trying to be marxist or anything of the sort.


It's just schizo in general.


Post-liberal game. Great for dispelling illusions about "vote for /ourguy/", and putting the seeds of thinking about politics on a holistic level. But won't bring you left by itself and can still result in "illuminati controls everything" kinda thinking if you're not careful


Reason: anticipation frames
Neglecting the fact that frame 1 attacks exist anticipation frames are important in pvp games because it gives players a chance to understand how their oppenent is about to behave in any given scenario so that they can understand how to react ie
If my opponent is doing a heavy attack like in for honour I back the fuck off because I can’t block without expecting serious damage
My opponent is trying to recovery in a game like smash better attack before they enter their action frame and lose the opportunity to edge guard

What skins do is make these anticipation frames harder to read because multiple frames can exist per player and unless your in a game where the VFX surrounding a specific move are always the same for a specific entity(which is rare and destroys the point of skins) now your in a situation where it can almost become impossible to predict your opponent and hence skins end up hampering on gameplay


That's also the reason why I prefer symmetric character designs in fighting games. Originally it was to cut costs (drawing and data storage), but it also makes learning anticipation easier and that's why some of the polygonal games also do it (e. g. Street Fighter IV).

Skins can also be bad in shooters because of adding all sorts of noise to the actual collision geometry and different colors have different advantages. In Quake III all characters have the same simple collision box, but very different shapes (there is an eyething with legs that is rather small). Quake III also had the solution though: you can just set on your side to see the same model on everyone.

All fighting games should offer the same option. At least the online mode should allow the individual player to always see the default costume (winning screens excepted). For offline matches you need a house rule for default costumes. (It could also be directly integrated into the interface of the fighter select screen that the other player has to approve you choosing an alternative costume, but I think that would be kinda autistic. Just talk to the other person ffs.)


That’s proven by the past 3 AC games if anything

They don’t wanna make another AC 2 or even AC origins but a full on fully developed oblivion and I specify oblivion like RPG considering how much Valhalla reminded me of it. But that makes me question why won’t they just follow through with that want outright with a new IP instead of passing off with far cry and AC?


They really do. Odyssey basically was a mashup if the newer Zeldas and Titan Quest, with stealth made optional if not entirely avoidable safe for a few quests.


I can’t be the only one to notice this and it doesn’t even make sense
Game devs don’t have to code anything they can just reuse assets or libraries built into modules like havoc or if their companies like EA, Ubisoft or valve they can just reuse libraries their devs have already programmed. Was it like a technical limitation imposed due to graphics, was it design choice so gameplay wouldn’t be affected as much by unpredictable physics like what valve did with source, is it just for stability reasons due to the fact that physics in games requires a lot of precise numbers that don’t work well with floating point numbers? If so aren’t their already techniques and fixes just for that?

What gives?
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yeah and it's F2P shit


What about new games like Noita?


Well that's 2d, it's like 1000x less complex than 3d physics, plus it's an indie game so doesn't really have the same issue as AAA empty suits




Not every game should include super realistic physics.
If I want to play a game to go full sanic midair 360° spin quad jumps I don't want to trip on some can dropped on the ground for example.


It’s just not fun for me to play any pvp based games.
It’s not a game design problem for me it’s a community problem.
these days competitive games aren’t like quake or titanfall whom have high skill ceilings which make high ranking matches feel justified in their sweatiness being that you can at least feel like your getting better at those games to be able to compete. So much of the community has instead promoted idk “casual pvp” games with lower skill ceilings that at low ranks feels impossible to climb out of because you can only ever be so good at those games before every match devolves into “who can bait the other guy better” and inevitably matches start getting increasingly annoying and gimmicky, playing against players starts feeling less fun and less of a celebration of what you’ve learned while winning just feels tiring and losing feels awful.

It’s not fun man at all. If this shit was regulated to tactical games like CSGO and r6 that would be fine with me but I’m beginning to see this annoying shit everywhere even in games that shouldn’t be taken seriously at all like fucking fall guys now has sweaty try hards and elo hell in it now
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You guys are bronze retards.
The nerf to bunny hop healing was to make it so that healing actually makes you vulnerable as intended by game design. If you have close to full mobility from healing they might as well just add regenerating shields like Halo since there's no danger anymore. Imagine complaining about something even pro players don't complain about anymore since they know it was the correct update.
Apex has been completely warped by movement abilities which push out all the other legends. The game would be better without abilities period because it is much harder to zipline dance than it is to hit q and e on Octane and fly 90000m away from another squad or to hit a Pathfinder grapple. I can guarantee that you can't even tap strafe or do the actual advanced movement techs because hitting one button on pathfinder is not advanced movement.


>the game would be better without abilities period
Holy not only is he complaining about the game being a movement shooter he’s also complaining about a hero game having hero’s in it ahahahahahahahaha holy fucking shit go play csgo danger zone if your that offended by people using the games mechanics the way they want to


CSGO Danger Zone is an abomination why would I play that over Apex.

All Apex abilities do is make the game easier for those who don't actually know how to play.
Don't have sound on? Play Bloodhound/Seer so you don't have to hear enemies near walls/doors/buildings.
Can't get to a high ground position since you stayed on low ground like an idiot? Play Horizon so you can fly to the top.
Can't keep up with your team since you spend 10 minutes looting? Play Octane and hit the stim.
Can't hold a building by killing the enemy as they try to come in? Play Wattson/Caustic/Rampage and stall for as long as possible.
Don't know when to time your teammate being revived? Play Lifeline or Gibby so you can mindlessly set it up every time.
Don't have any guesses on where the next circle will be? Play a Recon class legend so you don't have to find out.
Too scared of losing a sniper fight? Play Bangalore so you can smoke the enemy's line of sight.
Constantly the first to die? Play wraith so you can hit q and try to make it back to your teammates (although admittedly most Wraiths are just plain bad and don't even bother to use their abilities nowadays).

Every ability in the game is a crutch designed to remove a skill check over the actual moment to moment gameplay that tests how good you actually are.


Well, while not a competitive game, UltraKill is a fun game, has plenty of Quake in it's dna, with speedrunning being one outlet of competition.
Also modded MineCraft might have something to offer: you could set up a cracked server and use mods: firework frenzy, squake, origins if you have the patience for making datapacks for it, ect… That's just a few steps away from saying "begome gamedev :DDD" but still.


I think this is what i realised too.
So i got quite good at Dota and LoL. You rarely get competitive games, and even when you do you are well aware that the moment you make a misstep the whole team is ready to throw. Its extremely stressful. the only way to get out of that is to be just wildly better, to stomp the other team. but when you do manage that its like taking candy from a baby. What fun is it to delete people that dont know any better?

and to even get to that point? grinding out your reactions through countless games of lopsided match ups just to at best get a profoundly boring experience.

I havent really had fun with competitive games for some time. the grind to get good takes so long, the payoff is deeply disappointing.

i miss the slow paced competition of long af WC3 and empire earth diplomacy games. Where even if you got fucked up there was shittalking to be had and alternative win states to be had.


The reason why I state optimization and not feature is because this exists to reduce lag on most MMO games
This is the optimization where the hostile npc will only react to the player if the player attacks first or is directly next to said npc contrasting how in most single player games AI will react to the player further away or even more commonly it will actively search for the player to kill them

The reason why this optimization is game breaking isn’t hard to think about as it means the player never has to risk death when coming into contact with any AI in game and can simply hide and run right in front of any enemy they encounter whenever they feel rather than plan in advance and make a break for it whenever it’s clear that they’re being overwhelmed

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What does everyone think of EVE Online?
Do you think its playercount's downward trend can be reverse or is the game simply too dated in its mechanics? Will there be a game that fills its niche as big spaceman MMO?
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x3 is a lot better :)


dead game, the only hope is to reboot it on a fresh server with all the P2W removed and multiboxing banned, which will never happen, ergo dead game


Pretty sure multiboxing is already banned, in theory


no, they do and have always encouraged multiboxing because it pumps their numbers; why wouldn't they? (apart from it making the game shit, of course)

the only disallowed multiboxing is using free accounts, but if you're paying for 10 subscriptions you're encouraged to fly all 10 in a fleet at once


I see.

I don't think it matters anyways, any game where you can play 10 instances of it at once is for sure garbage

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